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tv   Inside Story 2020 Ep 142  Al Jazeera  May 22, 2020 2:32pm-3:01pm +03

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raw concerns corona virus could spread inside emergency shelters in bangladesh people have been unable to return to their villages after someone left on the water a storm surges flooded low lying areas food parcels of being given to those left homeless ran supreme leader has called for a continuation of the fight to liberate palestine in the t.v. address on could soldier. described israel as a cancerous tumor in the middle east and he said the occupation of palestine is a crime against humanity forces loyal to the u.n. recognize government have seized control of another town in western libya fighters allied towards the were killed before the surrender of the last sabah towns on an important supply route for half the stroop. headlines it's inside story now stay with us.
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what's going to happen to higher education in the middle of a pandemic universities are scrambling to get their lectures online coronavirus lockdowns lock out students but what will that do to the quality of education this is inside story. hello welcome to the program. but coronavirus pandemic is disrupting higher education worldwide lockdowns of closed university and college campuses classes
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have moved online one of the world's most prestigious universities cambridge in england is making all actors on while until next year but can virtual classes provide the same learning experience and should students continue to pay higher tuition fees so they can set their exams are still reports cambered university has experienced plagues wars and social upheavals over the past 800 years the coronavirus is the latest challenge social distancing rules mean students and teachers haven't been on campus since the start of the pandemic so university staff are making tough choices all mass lectures so really big lectures involving a lot of students will not happen face to face will be put online this could continue until the end of the 2021 academic year but small group tutorials can still be held as long as students and teachers follow social
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distancing measures staff say they'll try to offer a full learning experience with as little disruption as possible no it's not going to feel like an online course because there will be all this other education around it and frankly when we are in a lucky position in terms of what education. a lot of that education is based on small group teaching and i and the small groups are really small i mean sometimes it's one on one or groups of 2 or 3 we can manage that. but while lectures can go online relatively easily students studying degree such as in science and medicine are missing out on practical class time and students don't have the opportunity to socialize it's a radical change to the campus experience i think is it better to keep everyone safe next year will be like you have your 4 experience than having to worry about
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getting like a distance from other people so i think you'll be better in the long run universities are also losing a huge source of revenue foreign students who often pay much higher tuition fees than locals the global tertiary education sector is estimated to be worth $2.00 trillion dollars but travel restrictions mean many international students can't fly back to class institutions in the u.k. and australia are asking their governments for billions of dollars to fill the funding gap the pandemic is forcing universities to learn a tough lesson in survival due on the silver for inside story. let's bring in our guests in the u.s. city of boston we have jeffrey seglins a senior lecturer in public policy at harvard kennedy school is also the author of the right thing conscience profit and personal responsibility in today's business in india's capital new delhi we have an earwig student at lady shriram college at
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the university of delhi and part of its students' union she started a petition to have a reevaluation of exam papers at college from portland oregon in the united states ryan carson an online learning specialist and founder of the online tech school treehouse welcome to you all jeffrey i'll begin with you if i may if you were offered a place to start the university this year would you go for it in the current circumstances . it depends i mean it depends on what how the said it would be obviously we couldn't right now with what we know we couldn't have classes like we had them last year in prison and they're too close to $200.00 to too much proximity to one another so the conditions would have to change. but i wouldn't necessarily refuse to return but would that make you nervous you'd want to be part of a class is wouldn't you that's the problem you would face a totally different experience at the university this time around well we went for
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the 2nd half of the space mystery went totally out of line and it wasn't optimal to do that but it was a safe experience and the students received a quality education by going online it was the way that we were able to provide the same education ideally would i rather be back on campus certainly but i'd rather the primary goal should be that we keep students and faculty in steps age you've already started your university education but if you were a new student beginning looking to stop in september october would you take up the offer or try and put it trying to further it. i would definitely try. that with online education or lack of good or bad the question of accessibility and to provide the best allies as well beyond me and the fact that you can blind down but i have to listen to that have gotten beyond that people that go with it if they have a place of just you know i'm probably online and look at it but i would definitely
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that with ryan even you benefited from a university education some years ago perhaps but would you go this time around in the current circumstances. i would strongly recommend that students defer for a year and focus on affordable online learning schools that were really good at teaching online and had a lot of experience doing that what why would you make them defer what's what would put you off from going this time round. so i started to ask because i got a computer science degree and i realize that jobs weren't necessarily connected to the curriculum that i was taught and the price was very high so we've been doing this for 10 years who taught 650000 people and what we've learned is that online learning is not the same as in person so you need a school that is online learning 1st and it's very very different and it's very hard to do jeffrey that's the problem isn't it universities are not set up to do
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effective online learning it's been a bit of a scramble to go online save what wobbly video connections lectures at the other end it's not engaging is it well it's that he's absolutely right there is a big difference between teaching in person teaching online and to teach online well you really need to think the course differently just can't pick up the course and do it it's not so much because of the connections it's more that good online courses and you can speak to this more more than i could good online courses aren't just a matter of taking what you did in the classroom and putting that on the screen it's thinking of what you can do is synchronously how you can help students connect online so the possibility is there to do it well on line but it does take planning and at least many universities in the united states have been trying to plan for that for the fall to have the option of either going online or in person so there's no there's no world in which it anybody thinks that it's just
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a simple matter of translating and a new person version to an online version it does take a lot of work to do it well and we did scramble to do it quickly because the pandemic you know came upon us so we basically had a week to play and had it had to transform our in person classes to an online experience and after a few hiccups it went pretty well i knew what were the challenges you a faced with when suddenly faced with a lockdown in delhi one of the main problems he's hot. so that a lot of girls are since all of us come from body that was back on the site difficult for you know us if you're the one that everybody has a saying kind of this and just in the next connected with they all be the weight of the day of the so i say that i'm just a can do things and by mike i mean especially when people who have special needs it's very difficult for them to have or get access to online classes and the fact that we assume that all the fuss says living in houses that you can signal when
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events asas but that's not the case and just the fact that getting access to these nonces and also having like a city with a thing on like that from the things that happened you need a stick was not on up with i suppose i'll also you know i need to take online stuff the stuff we run as a really important. point from anya isn't it doesn't increase the got between the haves and the have nots between those who have a spare room between those who have a good wife connection and those that don't going online is going to increase these despises isn't it. it is that's a very real concern however if we have if we can reduce the barrier on the cost level we actually increase access quite a bit so online learning is more affordable because it's more affordable to deliver and so that's something the east that is increasing that accessibility but she's absolutely right what about folks that are hearing impaired they need closed
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captioning on all those videos that's very important we've been focusing on that for a long time i think what schools need to understand is to do all my learning effect of the you have to use a flipped classroom model and you have to use competency based learning and you have to deliver that flip flip path classrooms through 5 to 7 minute videos that are interspersed with engaging in activities for the students to move forward you have to change the way projects are graded you have to add chat rooms and support it's a completely different model it took us 10 years to figure this out. i just think believing that you can get same education because your university is suddenly going online unfortunately is not true and i'm not anti college college and universities are important but students should get what they're paying for and just for those of us news to the idea of online learning what is a flipped classroom loves understand well what that is. flip classroom is where you're doing most of the instruction by video that you watch alone you can rewind
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it you can fast forward it you can posit and then being gauge meant and and the instruction from real folks happens over video so you're learning through short videos by yourself and then you're doing chatting with other students in a chat room in your teacher's verses sitting in a classroom where your teacher is teaching live it really needs to be flipped to video that you can possibly wind and fast forward and then turn in your assignments and engage with your students that way. jeffrey ryan mentioned that it took them 10 years to try and refine the way they taught and in that gap the haves and the have nots the gap between the haves and the have nots will widen wonted there are those who just don't have the space to study as well as those who have got a spare room those have a good internet connection that sort of thing there's a big problem that has none. that is a real problem that is the real issue i think the the the the the pressure is there to make sure the people have access both through a laptop and have a steady connection i think one of the things with the flipped classroom is exactly
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right and even in person colleges been doing that we've been experimenting with that for many years as well where we have students doing the work on the outside of the class so we actually do the discussion inside the bus so there is that that's a really good model to use i think one of the things though that ends up happening . the had the access to connectivity is really important one of the things that potentially does happen is i know that when we did this and i don't know that this is possible for everybody to do but the the ability for students to connect with their professors actually increased we were a lot down as well at our at our houses and wherever we were and we increased our office hours so there were the abilities to have one on ones with the professors more extensively than there might have been in person and where there are there are fewer meetings to go to there of we're actually there and we realize that the dedication to the student becomes more important so i know that my access to students was increased during the 2nd half of the spring semester. and it's just
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easy to connect and i think ryan can probably speak to that i don't know how they do it a tree house but since a lot of it is asynchronous the way they're designing it which makes sense the connectivity to the professor real time becomes real important then we try to increase that incredibly spending to particular for the students who are the have nots and students were connecting not just by computer they're connected with their i phones with their droids so whatever connection worked works for them and we try to make that we try to sort of. decrease those gaps as much as possible some of that is just infrastructure or students have to have there has to be access to life by connections in their houses i mean we also have seen in our stories about professors are also trying to teach in houses where there are kids in the background and they have lives and challenges as well so it is it is an ongoing pressure for all sides anya the university of delhi have you'll have you been able to get better access to professors as a consequence of this if they manage to in 2 to work around the lockdown what's
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happened. i mean we've always had but he would act that the only thing is that you would want to act the one you have and out and would only have if you have active duty though there's a lot of anecdote on. the boom or the but a need one have access to and not always then when you don't have that on the we'll be doing house of course you don't have time to connect to get the best and also be that you know although i do understand that both of them they were delighted and they were always active it although that was some kind of pressure on the always be on call to always be on that or the one that whatever whatever those who meet up that is being you. reckon that more of a gap between up and. if this online on anything they'll call one and not all of that easy not so useful has it been that you don't want to them or do you even have a go by how the one how delving or having that all of them down to the input easing
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to then but neither has in the have no is the bit of nation people who have more modern than that ryan you mention this 10 year period it took fee to refine what you do major academic institutions are going to have to move a hell of a lot quicker than that one of the main mistakes they make when they try and go online what have you learnt. we've learned it's very important to record your video lessons and 5 to 10 minute sections and completely flip the classroom we've learned that you need to use tools like slack for chatting to engage with your students and become available you can also then leverage students to help other students a lot of the support that happens at tree houses student to student in slack where they're actually helping each other which scales the support it means people get responses faster you really you really need to transition from a $1.00 to $1.00 model to a one to many that's asynchronous that that's flipped classroom that's based on
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competency based learning we've spent $60000000.00 building our platform and it's hard and i think we're in a tight spot where universities are struggling and it's not their fault this was created by the pandemic but students need to evaluate the value they're getting for their education which is why i said to for right now just learn online while we go through this and then pick things back up when your university is back in person jeffery academic institutions in europe the united states australia modeled heavily reliant on foreign students particularly also as their own demographic numbers drop they created a problem for themselves they're going to going to have how are they going to adjust to the fact the foreign students might not turn up next year. you know there is some talk there is the talk about various models that going out right now not everybody has decided what they're doing nobody really knows what it's going to look like in the fall of those some universities are really made
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a decision so there's it is there's a possibility of being in person in the fall there's a possibility of being online in the fall and then there is the distinct possibility that because of that challenge of of pieces and travel that there will be some sort of hybrid. where we will actually be trying to teach people both online and in person at the same time which is pretty it presents a whole new set of challenges which are not insurmountable but as ryan points out this is not easy so i think it may very well be that we have some students who are in person in the fall and some who are still online and we're figuring out a way to do a hybrid model which is doable i mean ideally everybody would be back and everybody would say be safe and that would be fine but but we're trying to prepare for all options as they come about and that happened actually a little bit as we were shifting after spring break this year which was about in march where the i did have one class where at about 9 students on the screen and
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the rest of the class in the room and it does you know it presents an interesting challenge of being tethered to a keyboard when you're in the classroom but it's doable and in delhi is a very prestigious institution can you sense than in perhaps that many indian students might be less tempted to scramble to go abroad to the u.s. to to your up to australia and prefer it's a fine education at home. so i i mean everybody's basically i was i'm also probably lost a student and i'm most even going to flag because that's when with on so doing you see that i don't want to be sick i can choose the anyway like oh if you mention that you should see so students who come in to love though if my child on the things that i know cause so a lot of fuss and a definite i don't we're going to get speed is killing me or i'll be going to joining. because like i say online know anything of
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a distant concept and then it is quite an explosion in any of a concept but i was ready to have equal access any to think that the high miles of me and if you think that i solutions want always thought of the city and is just you going thing that is as effective as in boston education so i think most of us and as far as i know the students of already saw that deafening that english and seems seems like a good it's on so if anything and if i'm to make people one be going outside i can connect. run the was a lot of tool 10 years or more ago excitement at the prospect of online education revolutionizing education but it never really took off or did it or has the kick it needs you think from this far. sadly this is what i think we all needed to realize how affordable and effective online learning can be if it's done online native so we've never taught in person we've always been online for
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a decade and i think that's why we've gotten good at it so i think we're going to see an explosion of online 1st schools where that is the model and it is more effective and more accessible if it's done that way i'm excited about that i think more people are going to get access to high paying jobs they're going to have less student debt they're going to learn faster these are all actually good things and it's sad and brutal that we've had to go through a pandemic to realize that but i think actually we're going to come out of this with less student debt more education more access ability more jobs. jeffrey ryan sees a positive future that from from online learning but at the moment you've got students who've paid thousands and thousands of dollars for a particular type of education for one on one access the campus facilities that are not going to get any of that what do you say to them how do you compensate them with the campus facilities obviously if they're physically not here they're not to get there but the one on one i think it's in i would sort of urge on you tube and
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other students to remember that that's what they pay us for that one on one access so when students contact me and they were reaching out to me in the 2nd half of the semester i did this when in person as well but it it's our job this is this is our job is that is to do that one on one teaching and to do all that we that can be facilitated online the in person use of the libraries or use of the social events obviously if they're not on campus they can do that one of the things that's been interesting for me at least is that. moving over to use a variety of different technological tools to to sort of bridge the class and figuring out how to do that and how to break apart restructure the classroom reach tunes and then teach reach the course objectives and use that as the primary goal some of that has actually been fun and so it is something i find myself saying which is unfortunate is that if it weren't for the pandemic this would actually be
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a fun there that is enjoyable to try to teach in a different way and to to help people learn in a different way and reach the same course objectives but the access to the professors really shouldn't change and the technology. because many of us who are doing it a good portion of our classes in real time still not as much as we would have if we were in physical place that that access to professors shooting increase rather than decrease because the technology shouldn't make that hard to do i think it's just a matter of getting that message across to students clear and some of that is sort of could be a cultural difference or a sense of it's not my right to contact the professor they should just remove that from any thinking because that's our job our job is to provide a strong education to our students interest the course objectives and any student who wants access to their professor should be able to get it and you will sort of challenge is how the lockdown had on your education do you think how have you felt affected by it by what's happened. so i think that is the connector will in
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all of them mention has so that so much on so if anything about what's going to happen even what if i missed some activist becky that neither of us even invited on the gang of of i though and often have on that exams all whether that's going to be some of them with a mocking which again on line exams that exchange exclusion of the nation in nature especially for students across the that you know wussy because we come from a guy with background and the fact that that's what my confessional you would do you know that offended me going of and wished they expected i guess anguish expected as i finally found any just it's a good omen mix between everything and you know even have things in the house will go and then one thing that i do agree with although is that if you wish unseaworthy cademy he should send me that because the fact that they accessible and most of them i think the thing that just says i don't mean that person you can't say to swimming pool a library should not be the focus you don't have access to that anymore and
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especially if a student if it's anybody disagrees with papers he seems to lead the access and all of that but the act of this is a bit of a faceless something that they have and access and i just i think it's just the old of being communing with who supports suspending you supposed to find you going to if you're supposed to see that they know it's going to last a mosque and all of that you're supposed to do it all in this environment so you know i don't miss that thing out and having one to one conversations or walking down you know what if i'd been seeing thing in a morning sitting in front of us. in front of the screen fans i've become a little both now. or ok well unfortunately folks who are out of time but thank you very much for your insights thanks to geoffrey settle in on your wig to ryan carson and thank you too for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website al-jazeera dot com for further discussion go to our facebook page
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facebook dot com forward slash a.j. inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter we are out a.j. inside story and i'm up to his ear from a bonus right on the whole scene here by. coveted beyond well. taken without hesitation. and died for. our defines our we should not have to trade our culture for oil and
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pound put in place no way to put all these people there only to be choose to children that would like to get back stories this place has become a complete crap you have to hear all of them and to treat them with something within respects. follow their piece it'll be here in doha your top stories from al-jazeera a passenger plane has crashed in a residential area near kharaj while coming into land at the city's international airport there were almost 100 people on board. the latest from islam about. what flying from the city of law it was on it by a liberal show karachi airport we are toward that it had radioed to be a part of. some technical issue however we cannot.


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