Skip to main content

We will keep fighting for all libraries - stand with us!

tv   The Listening Post  Al Jazeera  May 11, 2022 8:30am-9:01am AST

8:30 am
you referred to the importance of having a on biased coverage, the balanced coverage of what is going on in the region. and it is clearly as everybody understands, a very, very complex situation. is there anything that the palestinian authorities are able to do to try to give some sort of protection to journalists who are attempting to do exactly what you want, which is to provide that unbiased coverage. busy or is there an extent to which journalists are have to be left on their own? what do you expect the police didn't need to, journalist and prevent them from doing their job. defense is not in charge. the parents didn't put it is not in charge of union area. when the israeli army, practically the authority is like it has no authority whatsoever. it's really not going through any area because you can see this is 2002 when the shuttle and
8:31 am
the embedded, all the areas that were under the authority. so i think you submitted on the site and i believe, excuse me, for doing that again. i, i do believe that also on the maybe you can have some a little bit more. i'm not really not active is constantly trying to put layer on the inside in this case number. so it has not responsible if the responsibility is on the army, which what, why was really, i mean they didn't jeanine, which is why i mean, you can continue to look at people constantly why they should be. and i was given this to us by the army. why is allowed to be impunity and above national. why is very comfortable to national the these i my opinion,
8:32 am
the question that has to be asked and one have to see the point to the understanding of people for their liberty, the read on the completion of me, i guess on the resume which is quote is a must have about 30 seconds general of the palestinian national initiative where you thank you for being with us or on our 0. for those of you who are just joining us, we are getting reports from the palestinian health ministry. but the journalist for the odyssey of the network has been killed by gunfire early wednesday in the occupied. westbank shooting. oxley is said to have been short on the face and subsequently died. another palestinian journalist working for the jerusalem based all codes newspaper has also been wounded. he is said to be in a stable condition that shooting upon the happened during an israeli army, raised in jeanine in the northern west bank. when john, by john was trying the managing director for odyssey the english charles was only
8:33 am
a year or so ago. but i'll just here a saw it's buildings in gaza being bombed by the israeli military. now we have this incident tell us what the reaction is likely to be from august 0. first of all, we are shocked and saddened. i mean it's, it's, it's so shocking to lose a journalist, one of our own sri was a fantastic journalist covering this region for so many years. so there isn't always an initial shock. as you said it's, it's almost a year to the day may the 15th last year when high rise building and garza was bombed, which housed out of their offices as well as the offices of other media organizations . and that was building was bombed by these ready air force. so we have had a history throughout the world, but typically in this region where we have had tragedies and were shocked,
8:34 am
were shocked and saddened. we, in these things, sorts of times we have to call we, we need an investigation, we need to know what has happened. but i have to say we, as journalists, we carry on with our mission is always to carry on. we will not be silenced, despite attempts to silence us, our mission is thought to carry on to inform the world what's happening and that's more important ever. we're getting some agency lines that are coming out of the moment to cut our foreign ministry official is being quoted saying in response to the killing of shooting that it is quote, state sponsored is really terrorism, and it must stop that a tweet that's been reported by reuters, they are the network itself, has put out a statement saying that it was killed. the journalist was killed by israeli forces in cold blood in a horrifying crime that breaches international norms as the managing director of a channel like this does this gave you,
8:35 am
is it necessary for you to to stop and consider the circumstances under which journalists who are covering concepts like this and work to a way to try to improve them to make them safer. is that really very much you can do when the circumstances are as we see them in these, in this particular region, we do as much as we possibly can. the safety, the health and safety of our journalists is of paramount importance to us. we have all the necessary protocols for providing the equipment, providing security, providing procedures, safety procedures. we do everything we can to protect our journalists, but we have to recognize that is a dangerous world out there. and there are some states players as well as other players who do target journalists and increasingly, unfortunately in this world today, the media is increasingly coming on the file in all sorts of different ways, whether it be physical attack or online attack,
8:36 am
or any all sorts of other attacks and intimidation and threats, and as well as al jazeera, another. what, along with other media, we have to face this, this reality, this depressing reality. but we cannot allow it to sign up for us to stop us from doing what we do because the world needs to know what's happening more than ever in this world. i think in now past history, it's 25 years of of algebra history, something like 11. i think it's 11 of our journalists have been killed. this will now obviously increase that number. we have had a tough experience of the sort of thing, but we have to carry on. i say to all my colleagues that we do a great job. we are, we've one great awards. we don't do this to win awards. we do this because we believe that we are doing something that is important to do. but our journalism is recognized and it's important that we carry on doing that because the world needs to know what is happening. is there any,
8:37 am
anything that you know as an organization can do with regard to representations to the israeli military, to be israeli government or indeed to the palestinian authority in the, in the event of something like this? yes, we, we, we will make the necessary communications and with, with all those that we can to try and find out what has happened. i'm sure there will be lots of calls from around the world. we get a lot of support from human rights organizations, governments who will be looking at what happened here, and why a journalist has been shot that journalists killing journalists shooting the messenger is equivalent to a war crime. so we need to know what has happened, the world needs to know what, how difficult does this make your job as the head of an organization like those when you are ultimately responsible for sending people into situations which can be life threatening. it's and it's, it's, it's incredibly difficult. we, we, you know,
8:38 am
recently we've been sending jonathan to ukraine and it's always very difficult. you have to weigh off a lot of a lot of decisions. you have to ensure that as much as possible, you're putting in the right protocols, the right procedures. but always at the back your mind there is, there is the knowledge that people are going into dangerous situations, whether they're going in them or whether they live there. and they're reporting in their own backyard, which is a dangerous situation. so it's, there's a lot of things to weigh up, especially in areas of high risk. charles, thank you very much indeed. jose trend, all the mentioned director of odyssey the thank you for being with us. we can go back to mooney nessa, but he's a human rights lawyer and he's a professor of international at al codes university. he's joining us from occupied east of islam. he's been with us for the last hour or so. not for the viewers who are just joining us. let's talk about the procedure that will happen from this
8:39 am
point onwards in terms of possible investigations, possible efforts to hold somebody accountable for this. just remind our viewers what your view is about the effectiveness of that kind of investigation. yes and unfortunately over the past the kids we have noticed that that is a really out of me and this and i really and occupation authorities and janet and i do not the investigation seriously. and every time that there are complaints about specific and incidence where they're not at it, what kinds of crimes against humanity or simply violations of international law happening in local by 30 and that is really automate doesn't really take a investigation seriously at the bit salem organization. and human rights organization has
8:40 am
a very long time decided to stop interacting with those that are really just the system on such are types of of complaints because simply that system. i mean, it's called the justice system, but unfortunately it does not surfing and saving this or is there is them ignoring. and you know that the effort of the human rights organizations to hold those responsible, accountable for impunity. and as i don't on impunity that we have been seeing over the past decades, and unfortunately, we do not expect that is that i will make the right decisions on who are being those responsible accountability. if we're going to compare this incident with previous incidents that are similar incidents. now, what we need is an international list intervention and been a national event at national criminal court. for example, has
8:41 am
a distinction in palestine and it is responsible for investigating what crimes and crimes against humanity taking place in the up to 5 minutes to infinity. ok. and we expect them to, to we are not to act in this way. or we are still waiting. we know that the international criminal good has investigated in the earth as found that the art of war crimes and crimes against humanity be commitment. but until now we are still waiting for or for more action, and it's still not happening. so this is, this is the situation usually invalid then and, and just as, as are thinking less good dimension is happening. and then life goes on as usual. and this is, you know, this is very sad, an illness about stay with me for the 2nd. i just want to bring our viewers up to date with what we're covering here on the al jazeera shooting,
8:42 am
blackly. a journalist with al jazeera veteran correspondent who's been working in the middle east for, for many years, is, has been a shot in the face and subsequently died of her wounds according to the palestinian health ministry. it apparently happened during an israeli army read. in the janine in jeanine in the north northern west bank al jazeera is the network for which he was working. all jazeera has issued a statement saying that the killing was done in cold blood in quote, a horrifying crime that breeches, international norms. a cut our foreign ministry official says in response to the killing. ah, that state sponsored is really terrorism. must, must stop. and you were referring money to the fact that and a. ringback international oh support should be brought in in order to put pressure on this. i'm on that basis. forgive me just for pause and we've just,
8:43 am
we're just getting a queen fraud. excuse me, a tweet from an unofficial and cut us foreign ministry. seeing the israeli occupation, the kill al jazeera journalist, it should be in a black lab. my shooting in the face were wearing the press vest and a helmet. she was covering that attack engineer, refugee camp of this state. sponsored is really terrorism. must stop and unconditional support to israel must end. and the reason i wanted to mention that was because you are armenia, have been talking about the international pressure that has to be brought on israel to try to end this kind of situation. what is the likelihood that that international pressure is actually going to make a difference based on evidence that we may or may not have seen in the past? unfortunately, based on the evidence that we, we, we have seen in the past, we know that, that the national community doesn't do that. i just action that the national community hasn't so far, even recognized in, i mean,
8:44 am
in its entirety as it took nice that there isn't one type that is gene and functioning and working in between the, you know, in palestine is cited in general. and then we have been waiting and working on getting more intervention, but unfortunately, i, as sam mentioned by your previous guess that about who the ad there is that with standards, you see how that action with ukraine is very quickly. we found that many countries around the world decided to come back sanctions and that you know, and sanction, you know, to support its invasion of ukraine. israel has been driving the city and people from exercising their back to set the simulation for more than 70 years. and until now we can see that
8:45 am
a nation of community hasn't done the correct and the dimensions other than the nations when, when i would say incidents happen and, and, and mentioning that, it's really measures on floyd, then all of this is not enough where we expect transactions, we expect a prosecution of criminals by the international criminal court by prosecutors of companies that have a universe than sort of fiction. and, you know, and the like, and we expect that the united nations wouldn't have a clear in prevention that goes beyond and contamination. that's certainly the case, but in, in the case that as we know they, they're not, that nation is not going to do that because of that. a limited support, especially from the united states, but also from other countries. then we expect individual states to take action and
8:46 am
this is, you know, this is possible. each individual state has the right to do limits. it's a relationship with a certain state, if that states made it national law. and this is exactly what we need to be, etc. right, unfortunately when you look at the out of work, you will see that there is more normalization. at the midst of, of all of these crimes that are going on on the databases. you'll find that there are companies that are now creating relationships and which is very, you know, it's not understandable or how this can serve any, any, any good purpose. and then when, you know, suppose the human rights law and he's professor of international law at all codes university. so for now, thank you very much indeed for your time. i want to go to our correspondence, stephanie decker, who is in west jerusalem, and she's joining us on the phone at stephan. it's been covering this region 4,
8:47 am
but 16 years or so that has been working particularly in this, in this area for certainly the last few weeks. steph, just talk us through what kind of impact this news is having. obviously not just on the teams from al jazeera, but also of course, and on journalists who are working in that area anyway. wow, yeah everyone, everyone is shocked in disbelief. you know, al jazeera is, it is a well, no network, it's an extremely well known network. everyone watches they cover everything extensively. you know, things that don't make the international news are covered by al jazeera, are back, you know, whether it's, you know, the constant on going home definitions. whether it's these raid international, like you heard your gas talk about, you know, the occupation has become a somewhat normalized, if you will, within the national community. i wish there are, but certainly, you know,
8:48 am
is constantly reminding people of the details of this story. so this news is, is shocking. i mean, you can see it on twitter. what's that group's every everyone saying, oh my god, i company that you're hearing this reaction across the board because everybody who works here. certainly sharina is a very well known journalist, very well liked, very well respected. so it simply it simply disbelieve that this, that, that, that this is happened. so, so yeah, i mean, everyone is devastated and shocked. we're just seeing some pictures of screens work as you, as you've been talking to. stephanie, reminded me of a company and we had a conversation about 3 quarters of an hour ago. you raised a very interesting point about the, the distinction if you like, that the perceived distinction that there is between palestinian journalists, who are covering this, the situation. journalists who are moved in to the area to cover the,
8:49 am
the situation and talk us through what kind of dynamic you see when you're working in that well, you know, it depends on what we cover. you know how you cover it, whether we're in the west bank, whether we're in the weather where it, you know, it's true and there's, you know, home demolition, flashes and areas choose them. everything has their own dynamic certainly. and their own language, if you will, but, but what is i suppose a threat across the board? is that yes, journalist you get targeted by israel for days despite being clearly marked as pressed. and you know, very often actively target is because being class because you're in a place and yes, of course there is more impunity. i think if you will, when it comes to publishing and you've heard, you know, my, my colleagues need,
8:50 am
i tell you, and i've seen it like there is, you know, how would you say there is less that they're treated cheap? all journalists, when it comes to 10 situations on the ground, got to do with the same, let's say lack of, you know, lack of respect. tar activity. targets is the policy in general special. i mean, they're, they're facing this all the time. every time they will tell you that there is no accountability that there is impunity. and that there is simply, again, it comes down to the should milk, no accountability, these things can be done. and today what you're seeing today is an elevated tragedy is an elevated consequence of something that is, that's been going on constantly. i mean, just as a small example, if you do have protests or if you do have confrontation, at some point is really forces want it to be over. they will, you know, what the target, where the talk is with tear gas was done grenades just to make sure that everyone
8:51 am
is just the sports. it's just a method that they use. so again, like we don't know the circumstances of day, but be heard from our dear here while you got you saying that there wasn't, that doesn't seem to been an exchange of fire at the time that should be and another palestinian journalists were short. so i'm the guy like the bigger picture that you've been hearing from the frustration of your gas than the journalist. this is something that happens again and again, and it's up to the unnecessary tragedy of what has happened today. as a journalist who's worked there for, for many years, for something like this happens, does this cause you and the teams to take a pause and try and think about whether or not you want to continue doing this? no, i think it probably has the opposite effect in the sense that you know,
8:52 am
you simply cannot don't, we can't stop doing our job. the job is to bear witness and bear witness to difficult things and it's too difficult places and be the decision maker is a journalist. this is a decision maker the team and you discuss and you'll be like ok, we can't be here because just too dangerous. you know, we'll, we'll place ourselves in this location, but, you know, as you were discussing earlier, sometimes the dynamics, the ground change very quickly. and it's sometimes very difficult to get out of a situation like anything, you know, in a conflict, whether it's an exchange fire, whether whatever the got amex are, everything is fine and it's not, i always say that, you know, you can, you can plan as well as you plan and all of a sudden, you know, these things happen and these are risks that we are aware of any the risk that we take. i think this tragic incident today highlights again just you know, how, how dangerous our job can be, particularly, you know, should be and, and the team would have gone this morning. these res happen. you know,
8:53 am
this is not new. they have been happening on and off. and it ended and like, whoa thing, how necessary and how tragic there was no need for this. so the dynamics is how exactly it happened. again, we still don't know, but it's certainly not going to, i don't think it's going to stop anyone from doing our job. but of course it puts an element of like the question of like why our journalists being actively targeted charge. i mean, yes, we really military thing. they're looking at reports of government, but you couldn't hear from all of your guess skepticism of that is that this is not, it's true policy and, and there simply isn't, isn't the experience that we have that they should policy and journalists, because the journalist on the ground are telling the narrative that you know that the basic things ready army is rating the camp. it doesn't, there's no logic sense of it being an active target. whether there is
8:54 am
a crossfire or these questions, again, i'm not in a position to answer, but the bigger picture is, yes, you know, journalist, i have seen it myself and experience myself. there is impunity get actively targeted. and there is never really any, any accountability, if you haven't said all that. i don't think any journalist will be stopping the way they operate. here. we've just been watching video of the hospital. you mean with our colleagues and i mean it's chaos and they're absolutely devastation people screaming around it's still, it's still to see what i think for anyone to comprehend what has happened. but certainly i think i can tell you for certain i don't think any journalist here is going to stop doing their job or, or not taking those risks because you know, they want, they will feel the need to keep telling the story even more. so stephanie, thank you very much of the stephanie decker, talking to us from western use them for viewers who are just joining us. we're bringing the news that the palestinian health ministry is saying
8:55 am
a journalist working for all disease and network has been killed by gunfire. anyway, stay in the occupied westbank shooting blocks. i was shot in the face. she has died soon afterwards. according to the ministry, another palestinian journalist working for the jews when based on the codes newspaper is also said to have been wounded. he is to be in a stable condition. misusing happens during an israeli army raid in jeanine and northern west by we can go back to me and say, but he's a human rights lawyer and professor of international law, all coach university. he's joining us now from occupied easter luisel. and i'm interested to know what legal action that can be taken against the israeli military that is fund if it is established that the israeli military is responsible for this and what the process a's in the event that that happens.
8:56 am
unfortunately i think we so we've lost our sound from from our newsome lanier. they're all we can now return to him and please to say we have been able to get the sign back. yeah. money or i'm glad i think you can, you can hear us now. we have the sound like i was asking, what the, the, the legal process is in the event that, that says somebody is found by an investigation to be accountable for this. what the legal process is for bringing some sort of prosecution. yes, i mean, and within that is that identical assistant and it is a process that good in theory lead to the prosecution and to the you know, to help the whole being and it criminal accountability within beds and i. e, patient, out of me. and however, we have seen that in the past this hasn't really worked. i'm usually there isn't a alia sanchez, or commit to what crimes,
8:57 am
as well as the commanders and, but it can lead a bit of use for crimes have been and you know, enjoying impunity. unfortunately, and then, you know, have not been an ad seriously prosecuted or punished for the crimes that they have conducted as lady ottoman has predicted it, it soldiers from and shielded from accountability within a system. and this is why am we cannot really whole from the israeli system to do much according to our, for my experience and what we hope nonetheless, and i think that that is an important aspect here is the international criminal court. and in january, at the end of 212021, that the national criminal court confirm that it has jurisdiction over 3 of
8:58 am
the state of palestine. which includes though occupied west bank, including east jerusalem and gaza. and this means that the international criminal court now has to investigate and what crimes and crimes against humanity and, and has to start holding individuals accountable for their crimes. obviously they will have to go and choose the individual as they cannot go on living as of soldiers and commanders. but at the same time, it is very important that we start seeing and individuals who are in charge of war crimes and crimes against humanity being killed account. this will provide a certain level of difference that is needed and the israeli. and that the coms are
8:59 am
ongoing so much because they know that there is nothing you can do. you can commit it what crime today, and then go into the beach here or abroad and enjoy your very nice holiday and come back after the holiday and continue and doing what you've been doing before continue your business. and, and this is what, you know, and this is the obstacle to just impunity. it's one of the main obstacle and the international community. and here that i am really hoping that the national community because it has been this jurisdiction and know that it has jurisdiction and so that the prosecutor should move, i've been, you should take action and this is something that is expected and that unfortunately we've been seeing that the international community file has been so much when it decides we remember that donald trump, i decided sanctions on the international criminal court,
9:00 am
specifically because of its investigations in regarding by the state as well as i understand, you know, the us crimes in the flat is down and so i hope that this will not better. and this is just the system. i know that the scores from continuing on kind of stuff. many in this about thank you very much indeed for joining us. many and most of us human rights laura and the professor of international law at all codes university. while the media organization, reporters with our borders is palestinian journalist experienced major difficulties doing their jobs. while israeli media enjoy real freedoms and says that have been several searches of violence against palestinian journalists in recent years. that includes israel's military offensive and the gaza strip and may last year. others have been targeted during tensions linked to the month of ramadan.


info Stream Only

Uploaded by TV Archive on