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tv   The Bottom Line  Al Jazeera  June 6, 2022 9:00am-9:31am AST

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demented and under attack, this is europe. on al jazeera, a top is filmy, returns home to the village act. 20. yeah. only to discover that matches once on smoking and now hotly contested the right to education. divorce an independent, causing a generational rate. an intimate study but traditional pan grappling with changing times with trouble at home and now to sierra ah . ready to hello, i'm darren jordan tow. hi. with a quick reminder of the top stories here on al jazeera india's governing parties facing international condemnation of the 2 senior members made insulting remarks
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about the prophet muhammad. one of them was the b. j. peace. national spokeswoman was now been suspended. collins during a tv debate triggered protests by muslims across india. probably mattel, as more from new delhi. critics point out that the actions of the party that is suspending one of the politicians and expelling the other. ah, yeah, these actions are too little too late for us to fall. it's worth noting that these comments were not made this weekend. they were made a while ago. one comment was made on a national use television network, which has millions of viewers almost a fortnight ago. and the other comment was made on social media a week ago. all of this has come to a head because of the international backlash, especially in the gulf countries. there are a threats and cause to boycott, indian products, you know, on boys and ambassadors have been summoned in various countries. you know, these are nations that the indian government has spent a lot of time and energy building, close strategic ties with officials and nigeria,
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se dozens of people are feared dead off the government. open fire detonated explosives at a church. it happened as worship, as governed for sunday, mass in the southwestern town of oh, under state firefighters in bangladesh had been working for 2nd day to put out a huge blaze that swept through a shipping container port, killing at least 49 people. many of the injured on critical condition, the fire spots several explosions caused by chemicals stored in some of the containers. south korea's president says the north weapons program has reached a point where poses a threat to world peace. so when washington have $58.00 missiles towards the sea, a day after similar launch, but young rob mcbride has more from sol. this was a direct response from south korea and its u. s. allies to sundays launch the joint military command here in south korea. as a total of 8, missiles were fired, that they were fired from the east coast in gang one province. this is the province
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the borders with north korea along the dmc. the missiles were fired into the c, a c that separate the korean peninsula from japan. the south koreans in the us said that this was to demonstrate the capability. it says of precision strikes it. origins of provocations, clearly indicating those career they're saying, condemning sundays launch by north korea, of again, exactly the same number of ballistic missiles. a missiles being fired by north korea saying that the south of the us will take corresponding reactions, each time to what they call these publications that has been reinforced by you, by you. and so all the conservative president of south korean newly inaugurated here he has been speaking at the memorial day event. it's a public holiday here in south career, he's made a speech at the country's national cemetery saying that he will respond sternly and firmly. he says to any future launches by north korea. thing that said, the continued nuclear and missile programs by north korea pose
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a threat to peace and stability, not only in the korean peninsula, but he says, the whole world. ukrainian president vladimir zalinski has visited 2 towns near battle lines with the russian army in the eastern don bass region. he says he met with troops and lashes chunk and presented some with awards. the city is close to a scenario, donnette sk where one of the was biggest battles is taking place. russia's foreign minister has been forced to cancel a trip to serbia of the neighboring countries, close their space to his plane. so the love was due to arrive in belgrade on monday, but bo guerria, north, macedonia, and montenegro all refused to allow his plane to pass through the skies. australia's prime minister is in indonesia to shore up ties with his country's closest neighbor as me of uneasy and indonesian president, yoko with dodo, are expected to discuss climate trade and security. is visits being seen as an attempt to account at china's growing influence among asia pacific nations and
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britons, queen elizabeth has wrapped up celebrations, marking her 70 years on the throne. 96 year old monarch appeared on the buckingham palace balcony after my village apartments. forced to pull out of other events. those were the headlines that he's continues here now jazeera after the bottom line, stayed with them to watch him either. oh hi, i'm steve clements and i have a question. even after a racist massacre and a school shooting. why can't the united states do anything about its gun culture? let's get to the bottom line. ah, gun violence is a fact of life just about everywhere in the world, but mostly in small incidence. that the united states has an epidemic of mass shootings and is the world leader in that terrible category. in may alone,
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a white man stance, accused of killing 10 black people in a supermarket in new york. he was broadcasting himself live over social media. and in texas, another teenager bought 2 military style rifles and killed 19 children. the oldest was 11 years old and to teachers as well. inside an elementary school. in america, there are more guns than people. and after mass shootings in the past, there's always a debate about gun laws, but nothing seems to change. the issue is tied up in politics with conservatives, arguing that gun ownership is a right guaranteed by the constitution period. but president joe biden says he wants common sense gun reforms, but can that happen? can americans agree on what to do about gun violence? and can they reach a compromise to prevent more bloodshed? today we'll be talking with a journalist and author who has been tracking mass shootings in the united states. but 1st we turned to the former deputy police commissioner baltimore. anthony barksdale,
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for mr. barksdale. i can't thank you enough because i know the world is trying to talk to you in the wake of this horrible tragedy. but let me just be honest. we have horrible tragedies almost every day somewhere. i had no idea that the number of mass killings in this country had reached the level it had. so i want to be talking to anthony barksdale on a day were not just chasing a crisis. how does this country get it right? because we're chasing you right now, because 19 children and 2 school teachers are dead. how do we talk about the future when we're not chasing an event we get in front of it? that's a big question. and these last shootings have gone on in the u. s. for far too long, too many victims and we have no tragedy after tragedy. but when you start to throw when salt white balls being used on little children, innocent shoppers at a supermarket in a black community. and it's really captured everyone's attention now.
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and, and it's, it's long overdue, so there's a lot of work to be done. some, it's at the political level, some, it's at the local level in the state. well. busy i mean, we really need to rethink the gun laws, weapons are finding their way into the hands of the wrong people. ready over and over again. i mean, the u. s. does believe you know the 2nd amendment rights, but at what point do we say to many times people are the wrong people, excuse me, and winding up in possession of our deadly weapons in taking lives. and this includes children, women, men, across the us. so we, we've really come to the point where we've got to figure this out. is become a kind of tragic routine. ah, and i know so many cases, whether it was in
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a movie theater or a church, or a parking lot of a grocery store, a las vegas hotel and a concert outside. we see some of these horrific cases where the individual involved, in most cases, wanted to do this, wanted to go out, maybe become famous for that who, who knows what, but a lot of people are just calling this mental illness. i'm wondering, is there something else going on, or society where we're celebrities in murderers and just creating incentives, whether it's tied into a white supremacist nationalist move in somewhere. i just like that kind of deconstruct some of the toxicity it's leading to. so these, some of these people to do what they're doing, you have experience being on the front line with thousands of officers reporting to you. what is your feeling about what's beyond the gun issue about what's driving these behaviors? one of the things that i noticed during my career is that those intending to do
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harm have usually shown you before they do it. they are, there are some maya angelou send that i firmly believe in when a person shows you the, your believe them and your point me, i mean they're, they're going on social media saying, hey, i want to hurt somebody. i mean, i, i'm going to shoot up a, a school there, sanders, stop to stress me to be recognized to, to be popular. and this is the method that you want to go. this is the route that you want to take to do it. it's quite disturbing. we have red flag laws here, but we see that a red flag laws aren't covering oh, background checks extensively enough for when you have an individual who, who says, yeah, i'm going to shoot somebody and they still what? 18 you're. you're 18 years old. can still go and buying a or 15 by a ton of ammunition and gun gown,
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a bunch of innocent people. it's just instead of boy, it's just it's so far are gone. now we as a country, have to get this together. before today's show, our commissioner barksdale. i looked at the photos of the children and the teachers and at rob elementary school, looked at the photos of those people that were killed in buffalo. new york looked at photos of others, and it's just, ah, heartbreaking that you know, these were victims, innocent victims of these, of these cases. i guess my question is a lot of other people have lost trust in i'd say this with all due respect. they've lost trust in our system to protect them. they've lost, as we've seen her new vol day, a controversy about police. what are our blind spots we have to fix on the policing front big you've all day
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failure is just it's just horrible. you talk about those kids, you talk about the people in buffalo, it's okay, so i'm sorry, police failed in you've all day. we need to acknowledge that the fix. we've learned our lessons and columbine about the need to get officers into a location if there's an active shooter and engage and engage until that shooter is no longer threat. obviously it, it completely fail to your and we cannot think mailed it. we can abandon what we know it's true and it is wholly saw. officers must be willing to sacrifice themselves to save the lives of others. preservation of life
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is critical. it is the priority it's, it's beyond critical which it's all there is. when you have an active shooter or an employee, fail complete failure. and it's so important to hear your voice in perspective in this and i just can't thank you enough for sharing it. i want to thank anthony barksdale former deputy and acting police commissioner baltimore. really appreciate your expertise and insights straight from the heart. thank you. thank you. now we turned to mark fulman, who has been tracking mass shootings in the united states for more than a decade. he's the national editor at mother jones magazine, and it's just come out with the new book trigger points inside the mission to stop mass shootings in america. mark, thank you for joining us. ok, look, this is a tragic subject subject again. and you've been someone who's been saying these tragedies are repeating and repeating and repeating because we're not understanding the right frame of what's going on in the mind of the perpetrator. can you share
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with our audience what we're getting so wrong in derailing these episodes? that, that just continued to horrify us. sure, well, the focus of my book trigger points is on out of violence prevention method called threat assessment. and this method looks at the behaviors and the circumstances that lead up to these attacks. these are planned acts of violence. we learned that in more detail after they occur, but at the same time we also see these big myths recycled over and over by politicians and in the news media about mass shootings. treating this issue as if it comes out of nowhere as if the people who commit match shootings are crazy. detached for reality are people who just snap as if this is some kind of impulsive attack or impulsive crime. and it's just not that's simply wrong. all of these attacks are preceded by a period of time in which a person is developing
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a violent idea planning for it, preparing for it, often acquiring firearms, surveilling a target, and also signaling that they're going to do it through various forms of threatening communications and other behaviors and the fuel of threat assessment has understood this for a long time. now through research, and i argue that there's a lot more we can be doing to prevent these attacks from occurring. so much of our response to them is exactly that. it's reaction. we have active shooter drills and target hardening and fortifying schools and, and office buildings arming more people, more police everywhere. but none of that is preventing this from happening. and in fact, it's growing worse. we're having more of these events now. oh, texas governor abbot has said that the killer in ovalo bay in rob elementary school that killed 19 young children, 2 teachers. the others have said the killer that killed black targeted black individuals in buffalo, new york at a grocery store. that these are cases of unstable people who had mental health
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problems. can you define for us the difference of what you shared and the mental health explanation? sure, this is a crucial point, steve. and i talk about at length in the book that the way we talk about mental health with respect to mass shootings is also beholden to some big myths. and frankly, as is, i think, exploited by a lot of political leaders. blaming this off monday, mentally on mental illness is just wrong. there of course mental health issues the figure into the behaviors and circumstances of of mass shooters. i mean no person who commit to mass shooting of mentally healthy. but when we blame it all on mental illness, again, that implies these are people who are totally insane as if they're detached from reality entirely and just snapping and going crazy. and that's not the case at all . there's often a very rational planning process and thought process that goes into these attacks over a period of time. so while these are often people who are in deep crisis who need
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help in various ways with rage, with despair, with suicidal thinking in many of these cases, there are other ways that we can address this, that don't dismiss it as just craziness. and i think frankly, that's used by political leaders who are interested in maintaining the status quo on gun politics that want to blame something else and, and continue to turn away from and distract from what we also know. the majority of the american public wants, which is tighter, gun regulations and more investment in dealing with this problem. you know, i unfortunately can begin to recite some of the mass shootings that we've had, whether it's in sandy hook or the pulse knife club in orlando or the other were a theater at a batman movie. and those are the, those are the high profile cases in addition to the ones we're talking about now. and i'm just wondering if, if we in america going back to columbine and perhaps more our celebrities using
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these murderers. and you write about that you write about the celebrity culture, the desire, you know, of some of these perpetrators to be famous. and is it something in our own dna and our society of our obsessive fascination with killers that somehow breeding more killers? yeah, this is another area of importance and it has been of great interest to me for years now the, you know, their big cultural questions we have about violence and people often want to know, why are we such a violent society and why does this happen? so much and the media has a role in that, but it's a very challenging issue because we have to report on these events, they are traumatic and profound and have a big impact. and so there, it's very much in the public interest to understand what happens with these attacks, not just the immediate effects of the but as i've been discussing, what leads up to them in terms of trying to solve this problem. at the same time, historically, we've had a lot of sensationalism, of math shootings and
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a lot of focus on the perpetrators, i think, to excess. and the reason this is problematic in part is because we know through kate's evidence that a lot of them are seeking that attention. they want infamy and notoriety. and so the media historically has fueled that in some ways that are, i think, are helpful. i argue for an approach that i call strategic diminishment, which really refers to having a real careful balancing act here. we need to report on who the people are that do these crimes. we can't have a media blackout go. there's a sort of compelling, i think, moral and emotional argument for that. it's not realistic. we need to understand these crimes. but we also need to do that in a way that doesn't feed into the kind of sensationalism that many of them are seeking. and that also, i think in a certain sense validates the cycle of violence. something that goes hand in hand with that too. steve, is this the theme that we have a resignation and i've been writing about this more recently. the idea that this is
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a hopeless problem that we can never really do anything about it or that it's, it's never going to end. i think that's also unhelpful. because people who are seeking to do this, they're also looking for justification for their violent ideas and planning, and that in a sense of firms that for them. no, there's more we can do to stop this and i think it begins with getting rid of some of these big myths and themes that were stuck in a political stalemate and resignation and sensationalism. who is getting it right on this front so that other ah, states and municipalities and communities can learn from them? sure, well, there are different examples of it. there is some working done at the federal level, the f b. i has a team at the behavioral analysis unit that has grown in recent years and has done more outreach to communities around the country who seek help. the secret service has been doing more outreach to educate the public about its research and provide resources. but it's really at the local level where this work is done at community
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based and in trigger point, i write it extensively about one program that i think of the leading model for this in a school system in salem, oregon, the salem kaiser school district was one of the 1st to implement this approach after columbine 2 decades ago. and they built a really robust program there where they've held many cases of worrisome behavior among students is a large public school system about 42000 students. you know, most cases are, are garden variety disruptive behavior that all school deal with bullying or other kinds of conflict are acting out among students and, and those are handled in the, in the ways that you would expect. but there are a few cases each year that become more serious in terms of the risk of this kind of targeted violence. and i was able to go inside their work and see how they step in and really evaluate robustly what's going on with the concerning individual and then step into intervene using the resources of the school,
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extending counseling using individual education planning, trying to work with families whenever possible, it's not always possible, but the emphasis is really on constructive measures. it's not meant to be punitive because we've learned over the years the that doesn't work. 0 tolerance, kicking kids out of school having more contact with the criminal justice system. putting kids in jail is really not a way to solve this problem. him mack wrote a book about the rise and fall of the national rifle association, the n r a n r. a still held his annual convention. president trump went to both women philosophy children and to do a little dance at the end of his speech. and so when you sit there and you look at the question of what gun culture is, we often use the n r a is a place holder to describe it and blame the n r re for all bad things in guns. i don't think that's where you're at. so tell me about gun culture, m e n r a. and is there a gap?
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would it would it matter if the energy disappeared tomorrow? would we still be struggling with these problems? well look, i think there's a lot of truth to all of that. you know the n r ray and the gun lobby historically has been very powerful in stopping and violence, research in promoting the sale of firearms in ways that are feeding into i think, you know, bad constructs, culturally, you know, the speaking to masculinity and try to encourage young men to be tough and masculine, by getting heavy power, high powered firearms and so forth. but it's much broader than that. i think, you know, what really led me to write this book was realizing that we have to meet the reality of this problem where it is, it's complicated and it sprawling. and it requires a response of that kind to, in my view, how do you get that balance right? of being intrusive, just enough that you forestall some of what we have without creating, you know, such a nanny situation that,
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that you have really up ended people's rights. i. because people's rights are a lot of the issue about what's driving the rights obsession with guns, which is has a constitutional place. that's right. and i think that really is driving the politics of this a lot. and then also you have people making that argument who will then say, well, let's just keep the guns away from mentally ill. people are people who are dangerous. well, the question that is, how do you do that? and if you're asking a really important fundamental question about this, this work, it has to be done with careful deliberation and with respect for civil liberties and privacy. but look at the flip side of it. we have these case after case where you have individuals who are signaling very strongly that they're going to do this and then they do it. so if the question becomes, what more can we do? and will we do it? then i think the answer is yes. and so this is not a matter of profiling or prediction that's really important to understand here.
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this is a matter of seeing behaviors and circumstances a process. it's really profiling a behavioral process, not people. it's not done with broad based surveillance. you may look at someone's online activity if they're becoming concerning in a, in a whole other set of ways. but you're not doing broad based social media surveillance to, to do this threat assessment work. so i think it's important to make clear that this is prevention work and it's intended to be constructive and not punitive. there are cases where you may need to use punitive measures if someone committed a crime or to prevent imminent danger. but a good way to think about this too is this relatively new policy. we have called red flag laws, which is a mechanism where a judge can decide based on evidence to remove a firearm from a concerning individual who is thought to be turning dangerous. that is one to we can use that isn't locking someone up, but it's saying hey, this is a person who shouldn't have a firearm because of the way that they're behaving and going through
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a court process to do that. there are more ways that we can approach this. i think that way with oversight and accountability that still respect our rights as americans. but that also addressed this problem more proactively. you're active in social media and right after this incident in taxes, real tragedy horrible. someone aggregated many of the tweets from leading senators congressman governors in the g o p, and all of them said our thoughts and prayers. they call that the republican roll out of the thoughts and prayers. strategy, very dismissive, ah, people said hey, the republicans are giving us nothing in this case. so some folks went to joe biden, who said, give us something, do something. and president biden said, we will. what can he do? that's real, that has tangible in this climate. well, i think it's somewhat limited, as we've seen historically with executive power in our president can only do so
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much in terms of the federal picture with laws that being said, you know, the biden administration did talk about doing a lot more funding of broad based violence prevention work at the outset of the biden administration, and i think that could go a long way to better educating the public and building broader based resources for dealing with that set a community level through training thread assessment through other efforts at the local level to you know, make places more secure in ways that are reasonable. and, you know, i don't think we want to turn our schools into fortresses or our workplaces in the fortresses. but there's a balance here against, you know, across a range of measures. i think we need to do more to deal with political extremism, frankly. i mean, we've seen oral surgeon that in recent years, and that is driving this problem too. as we just saw, again in buffalo. and you know that this is a growing factor in mass shootings, violent ideology and extremism. so, you know, to lead in
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a way that that confronts these things head on and doesn't just stay stuck in the same political debate and be resigned to that over and over again. because we see where that gets us will look. this is a very tragic, difficult subject. i'm glad you're thinking it through for so many of us and that there are no easy knee jerk responses journalists, mark fulman, author of trigger points inside the mission to stop mass shootings in america. thanks so much for sharing your candid views with us today. thanks steve. it's good to talk with you. so what's the bottom line? mass murders are unfortunately, a daily part of life in the united states. some of these are huge and they make national headlines like the killing of children on the last day of school or the targeted killing of black people in a supermarket or a church. but every day there's a mass shooting somewhere in the united states. just in the last 5 months, there been more than 223 incidents. but if you ask americans what to do, they're still as divided as ever. radical gun advocates went 0 restrictions on the
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purchase of any kind of weapon. they'd rather talk about mental health problems instead. the majority of americans though aren't opposed to weapons sales, but they want a better safety system that would raise red flags and block some people from owning guns. but even the murder of tiny boys and girls in texas has not moved the nation into a grand consensus about changing it's gone. policies and the gun lobby is justice. wrong, as ever, every republican politician knows that it's not smart to oppose gun rights if she or he wants to win elections. so like, or not, the odds are that this sad story is going to keep coming back in the future. and that's the genuine tragedy. and sadly, that's the bottom line ah, to chris, the welsh young actually since organizes around the me, i do the work. i heard in the
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1st to producing 2 people in new york, seafood, different tooth, and me to fight institutional racism. and police brutality is indeed a nation wide problem that will wires a systemic solution. generally, he chains on alex's hand, ah, allow government lounges era where ever you want to show, oh no, i hello, i'm down on into the quick reminder the top story 0 down to 0. indians governing parties facing international condemnation of the 2 senior members made insulting remarks about the proper.


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