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tv   Inside Story  Al Jazeera  June 11, 2022 3:30am-4:01am AST

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you know, what's going on in medina? he not us. medina, is that but we're important but in synagogue i, i but for those who move here from the united states, it's a spiritual quest with its own talented joy fess on is from atlanta. she came here with her children, you know the language barrier, and they were worried about making friends missing some of the fluids from home, getting used to the food here. but now they love it. they love the freedom. oh, there's no doubt the stu. fees are a social and political force where religion also plays a central role in people's lives. and although in other countries, religious influence may be considered a negative aspect. here it's seen as a positive, even a sentra. i said big algebra medina by synagogue. ah.
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hello, are you watching al jazeera? these are the stories we're following. the sam 20 countries at the summit of the americas have announced the los angeles declaration on migration. it creates incentives for nations to taking the migrants. several countries in the region have been experiencing a record levels of migration in recent months. 20 countries coming together to launch the los angeles declaration on migration and protection. with this declaration, we're transforming our approach to managing migration in the americas. each of us, each of us is signing up to commitments. it recognizes the challenges we all share, and the responsibility the impacts on all of our nations. the u. k. high court has approved a controversial government plan to send asylum seekers to wander. the human rights groups are repealing the ruling. the 1st flight with 30 migrant these,
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scheduled to leave on monday. inflation in the united states is he to 40 year high consumer prices jumped 8.6 percent in may compared to the same time. last game that's being blamed on soaring energy and food prices. ukrainian officials have made another play for heavy weapons from the west as the eastern city of to be done, the ants continues to come under russian fire. it's the focus of moscow's advance, and one of the bloodiest flashpoints in the war with up to $200.00 ukrainian soldiers been killed each day. meanwhile, their warnings the color outbreak in the southern city of mary a powerful time, thousands of lives corpses left to rot on the straits and broken sanitation systems . a being blamed for the rank, the cities man is edging international agencies to establish humanitarian cargoes to allow remaining citizens to leave protest as in india, pakistan and bangladesh showed demanding the arrest of the former folks women of the governing b. j. pate knew poor sharma was offended on sunday. after making comments about the
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prophet mohammed in a tv database that many found offensive. and south africa as president says g process must be followed after the light has delegate actions of corruption and bribery. cyril, rema poser, is accused of trying to cover up a robbery at his game farm involving millions of dollars. he says the funds were private and not public money. those are the headlines state you now fit inside story me. ah no, no, no,
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no no, no. no, no, no, i don't need to be with you the mac, and i'm just gonna put them to me. i just need to need a new home and ya today. and we're going to be what we said as well. they didn't put me in. i'm a lot of fun at the book if you're the one i know. i mean, i mean me
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shooting off and neglected conflict. strange ties between algeria and spain. trade and diplomatic links have been cancer because of a dispute about the western sahara region. but what's behind this recent escalation and can be resolved? this is insight story ah that are welcome to the program. i'm nick clark. a contested region in north western africa, is straining ties between algeria and spain. the algerian government has suspended a friendship agreement and halted all trade except for natural gas. for now, the dispute centers around the status of western sahara. the region was its spanish
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colony until 975 morocco then took control, then it moved. that's not being recognized. internationally algebra supports fighters who've been calling for independence and western sahara and march spain, prime minister, anchored algeria, when he endorsed morocco's plan to give some autonomy to the region. that his spirits highlights a difficult balancing act for spain, madrid once more energy supplies from algeria, while at the same time putting pressure on morocco to stop the flow of migrants into spanish territories in north africa is that martinez does momentos. and at the moment, we are looking into the scope and practical consequences of this measure, both at the national and the european level. so as to give a correct response in a calm and constructive yet a firm way to defend his spain's interests. and those of its businesses that always since our has been the subject of a long running territorial dispute between morocco and the indigenous sarai. people
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led by the polar, sorry, of front movement, says the region is its homeland and has pusher independence for decades. but marco says it belongs to it, but a street lead to a 16 year conflict before the 2 sides agree to a you and back sees far in 1991. today, more than 2 thirds of the region is controlled by morocco. and last month, the netherlands joined the united states and other countries supporting morocco's plan to grant some autonomy. algeria is the main supporter of the policy area front, and many refugees from the region live there. ah, are i, let's bring in, i guess now in new york we have ambassador fioma. he's the port authority of front representative of the united nations in casablanca. yes. mean has now north africa affairs specialist than in lisbon. we have record of her bonnie, a project director for north africa at the international crisis group. a warm welcome to each one of you. thanks for joining us here today at ricardo had viani
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from the national crisis group. if i could start with you, how serious do you think this development is algeria suspending trading and breaking off this friendship agreement? i think it's pretty serious, particularly considering that this is only one episode in a long series of let's say, retaliatory measures that are jerry has been taking against against spain over the past weeks. i think a shows very clearly that the, a junior leadership is very much banks on the idea that they wants to put maximum pressure as much pressure as possible really on spain, to, to push mother ids to change position on this issue or otherwise they are ready to make spain pay a heavy price for its diplomatic shifts. and obviously this, i would say, obviously dangerous and warring for spain, particularly from
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a bilateral diplomatic perspective, considering the energy ties and migratory the migration issues that's tied to countries. but it's also obviously. busy wiring for europe and the other european governments that can now see that's taking the specific stance on this issue on this conflict without considering the point of view of other parts as in bolt. this dispute right can actually bring it very heavy, bryce, you mention energy. there, at the moment, algeria, a supply of gas to spain is still flowing. might that come into question? to what degree could algeria, you know, weaponized? it is gossip life you will. i don't think culture is really ready to weaponized. it's got supplies to spain simply because they know very well the general leadership knows very well. that right now, given the situation in the ukraine and with russia, weaponized in gas would be seen as an unacceptable move by the european governments
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who are just looking for reliable suppliers at this stage. but there are other things that while you can do to try and put pressure on spain using gas, and one could be, for example, the re negotiations of gas prices are with spain. so that would not be a fool out, a full blown. let's say we need to wait on possession of gas, but it would be a way of using gas to put pressure on spain and to signal very clearly that a gera is displeased with the position, muttered as taken on this issue. or he has mean as now it, how do you think this will happen? this will affect what happens in the region. now algeria breaking tides off in this way with spain. well, 1st of all, it's important to recall the view where, you know, just a little bit very briefly about the beginning of the cell, the stem sions, 8 states. basically it's, it's a little bit, this tension is solely between morocco and algeria says there reintegration of
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morocco in southern provinces. in 1975, you know, algeria a claim to move to its 2nd president to wearable again and decided to, you know, to counter morocco. it's legitimate that historical claim to the western sahara. it is important also to highlight that are jerry as decision to severe ties with either morocco's pain or any other country, but he's now aligned with morocco as your previous speaker stated in. it's historically, jim is the, regarding martin, american western sahara comes as a response to that, a diplomatic successes achieved by morocco in the recent years. now i think that algeria will continue whenever it see a country that is aligned with morocco or is aligned specifically with the u. n. a resolution that falls for a political solutions and the plan of autonomy. and i think that at all, jerry, i will keep on severe in ties with whichever country they've decided to, to, to align to, to, to, to be aligned with rockwell and best. and it doesn't serve the country, doesn't serve the world, especially now with their, with the conflict,
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what is out with, with russia and ukraine. so i think that sound fair and i mean i think that at ma'am and were recently we have seen countries like also germany that is aligned with morocco. there are we're going to come on to a lot of that in a 2nd. yes, we were going to come up as a broker and goes on. yes, but it rockers legitimate claim to the western so hard to western sahara. i mean that in itself is in dispute, isn't it? it's a mess, isn't it? and ultimately, it demonstrates the need for morocco to step forward and sort this out without your absolutely, i mean the 2 and the 2 are the 2 opposing countries. it's a regional conflict. it's not even a conflict between entity, it's a conflict between morocco and algeria, and i think that's all dia, 34 resolutions are called for a political solutions called for. i'll jerry, i'm morocco's best, or the police are ann marie tanius, specifically algeria to step up to the plate and participate in the air geneva round table. that's that was started by
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a hearst caller. and now as if and in the store is calling for this, sir. for, for the stocks algeria fused to take part in the stocks and what is the prize in his match? it's, it's the exec, it's really been in that a political process by the mere inside with any country that, that is aligned or next these bad, the real a solution, either political solution that is aligned or whatever remarkable the plan of autonomy. so i think that i think the 2 countries it is original conflict, i think that algeria needs to step up and think with morocco and thought with 40 or as 7 edgar and make their toys. you've made that point. let's, let's bring ambassador cbm also impeding progress. algeria is impeding progress. what do you think of this? the search for the shift to from spain, towards the moroccan position and let me start, why are certain the record straight? the question of crystals are i was the colonization issue. it's an international conflict between the front to police value and the kingdom of morocco as recognized
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by the united nations relevant resolutions. so apparently one of your guys seemed to be out of date in terms of the week political league, a major or the she was as a horror. oh, actually of the ha call this issued out. are we talking about in the grew intention or our region is to be explained by one main fact there's and the regime that has been to suing and expansion and policy says, it's a great city. i'm going to run a come on to that. in the 3rd world, can i to so just please on to the questions. what do you think of the shift from spain towards the moral composition? because that, that ultimately is what, what effects, what's gonna happen regionally, and will come on to the other, your other points. but please answer that question 1st. when we want to make this move, make a lot. yes, we cannot understand what is happening now in the region and the relations that you're talking about without putting it even briefly into its historical context. i
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know what would make it can replace it and move on that. exactly. we're talking about morag with that and try to invade out jerry and start at $900.00. 60 more off of that, you compile possible how to publish more awkward how to clean the motor jania for many years and 2 kids. and i used to recognize morocco which tried to keep high spanish iceland in july 2002. this is a regime that has been seeing expansion is an added to record if i can come to you ricardo far beyond from the national crisis group. so what's your view about this as far as that's concerned, because the shift from spain is, is quite a distinct move, isn't it? and it was always likely to produce a response from algeria, wasn't it? so, i mean, we are talking about the country that colonized the western sahara for several decades, and most importantly that from a legal perspective is still considered as the colonial power of this territory
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since it lasted in 75. so in theory, this is a country has a special responsibility, both historical, political and diplomatic, towards western sahara and towards a final settlement of this conflict. and the fact that this country has now moved from a relatively neutral stance to disposition of recognizing madame merle can solution the more can proposal as the best solution for the conflict is extremely meaningful . also considering the significance how we diaspora is presence in this contradiction exists signal, right? this is the most important thing. this is a signal that spain, along with other european countries such as germany, to netherlands, et cetera, are sending that they have stopped believing in a solution to this conflict. that is not the moral can preferred option. of course, this is happening without really coordination among european governments and we don't really waiting for the un envoy to actually come up with his own proposal. it
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is on the plan. and i think this obviously problematic because it means that it's unclear really what do you have him position here here as if there is a unified position of the that are actually several european positions. and they are not that that are not negotiated or planned in advance of coordinated with the un, which remains that main framework within which this conflict is supposed to be a settles city. i'm often upon assario front it. the fact is that international support is, is moving firmly in the direction of the moroccan position is a growing number of nations voicing that support for the autonomy proposal. the fact remains that these, your personal sahara isn't nicolai's as nice you on the agenda of the nation. so what do you think about 5 to what, what do you think the fact that the international view it is moving away from your point of view? this is a lot true we speaking about a position a few countries, that's what it is, but i'm talking. busy few miles from vienna,
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nations a quarter where the use used on the agenda, the a full committee as decomposition issue. it is treated by this current council, where france that you've mentioned in the united states of america are sitting and the position is one of calling for a solution that provide us with a thought to termination of the people of ha, ha, ha ha. it could simply, you cannot imagine, and a united nations advocating and getting its blessing to an act, illegal occupation. this is what is her taken care something i nation's as fully positions these few countries. we not hurt them, but we have to dig deeper to know what made span changes position. it's black, main pressure by these expansion of spreadsheet that i said even tried to comply some part of the spain. so the fact remains what's inside as if you cannot eyes,
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it's an issue and that will not be changed by a position by spain or any other country. because we live in a rules based international order that goes against illegal occupation of territories by force and shrines. the rights of peoples to self determination. and this is, or what is the case and this is not as a whole lot of people are being fighting for and they would continue to fight for their rights. no matter how the select country expresses preferences for an illegal proposal that has no basis. what sarah, do you think this could now escalates into conflicts, edema, acidity, the physician taken by spain and other governance would only add to the instability, the entire region. because we are, they are encouraging an expansionist regime to go off with its attempt to force and impose reality on the ground. we are in the world, as i said,
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based the rules based rule that goes against occupation. and that's why the, the legal patient by morocco has never been recognized by the nations the united nations has never recognized the legal occupation of pop ups our public, which is a food and fighting member of the african union. so indeed, unfortunately, these countries are just giving more ammunitions to the compiler states of morocco, to nottingham seriously into the peace process, which should be your personal avoid. mister franklin stewart has trial to revive after morocco breach to see fire in november and 2020. okay. jasmine, morocco's claim to western sar her to her is not recognized by the united nations. oh, the western sahara construct is 1st of all only and solely under the security council . now we have seen are those countries like the united states, france as spain should the former colonizer and at that actually recognize
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the plan of autonomy, which is, which is under the moroccan sovereignty, which is which claims that morocco to have the western sahara. and there it's 8 suburbs each. so for me, i think that a big problem is solved within it will be so they solved within, within their, secure it within the security council and no other body, not even the african union, is responsible of this search to solve this issue. only the security council we have seen more than $34.00 is solution that will for a political solution. the referendum is that by dine a river and then which, which we don't with for it for 18 years, it's a dead, it arrives little. and alex, good. okay, brother years we were wise the referendum that we're at what happened to it was pro way back um you know it is we have a wider that's not a penny b because it's not credible. and because of the legit to me a legitimacy of the american, a moroccan history of the western sahara that actually the country decided to endorse morocco. i think than the countries. no,
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i'm not waiting for the moroccan her from her up or to to dictate them. and like her, you know, what sir, what, what he said, i think it's not, it's not a black male, a spain, as the spanish prime minister for their essential has clearly stated that the current position of spain as a former colonizer to the moroccan at western sahara. should have been ban or should have been there. this colonizer should have been sold and done 47 years ago and you will see other countries in the european union that. ringback follow suit a spain in this air in this claim. i think that the problem now is within algeria, it's all, jerry, i bet, actually indeed, in the year at the peace process, it's algeria that needs to recognize the circle implications to the impediment a, to this artificial conflict. algeria needs to step to the plate and but, okay, generally bounty moran geneva, if sally bruiser, my body shop is long, i just got that 30 seconds more next, this era of, of, of,
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of the cold war. so i think that the, the, the, the, the algerian citizens need need war, the algerian regime to solve the internal economics and across the missouri. instead of mingling in sierra, at war with the morocco, that won't leave any record of her be on a we can see, we could see the difficult to take out morocco regards this area as the southern provinces of morocco, algeria regards it is under occupation since 1975 u n says it doesn't belong to anybody. what about the people who actually lived there ricardo is, is it clear what they want? i don't think we can say with certainty given that the referendum or any sort of popular survey has never been conducted. we cannot really say with certainty, walter lation wants right also because we're talking about a very complicated picture here. there are so highways who are based in the refugee camps intended for julia. ross had always who live in america controlled the
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western sahara. and there are obviously there's also a growing population of, let's say, moroccans who have moved to western sahara. so really identifying with certain who we clarity who once watts has become, i would say, a very complicated matter. which is, you know, why, of course, we call, we keep talking, we keep going back to the issue of the un framework and the fact that there needs to be some sort of compromise a solution. and most importantly, support for the you and framework at this moment, given that unilateral moves you not to be measured by individual international actor will not help settle this issue for a good city. if i can come to you, how does what is going on, affect the lives of the people living in the region, the communities and so forth, give us a painted picture forth of what's going on in the day. what. busy people are leaving out of the, in the you could pipe a how public is a poem,
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and that's happening. and without the scrutiny of the international community. because morocco, previous, anybody to go to the united nations. specialized monies are not allowed to go to the commodities on the public where people are facing all sorts, all crimes against humanity. so should appearances and all that you can imagine unspeakable accrued being practiced against them and for the simple reason for demanding there. naval right assaulted in relation and venice to be respected as in any part of the world we're speaking about racy. that's as i said, bills and expansion isn't aeration, that has been a pressing its own people who are rising, but nobody knows about that. as we're speaking about regime that recalls these 2 florida regimes as a middle ages, and it's really
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a ha error sometimes difficult to understand that stealing the whoa who her 21st century world. people do not know the real nature of the regime ruling in morocco, which is one of the most and less qualified regions in the world to speak about human rights. and that really is part of this tragedy, were jesus, once more people are fighting for principal and fundamental rights, the as man of the same child, even as really good about yoga, severe mother talk. your brother writes a peaceful people fighting for their rights. well, i mean if their own rights, whatever they believe in, but i believe that it's important to a to, to have to remind a viewer about the reality of the west american western hardest region. there are 80 percent of the salary population leaving the moroccan western sahara and will participate fully and freely in the public policies of this, of this region as well as at the national and, and, and local elections. now at the level of teen do their tindles and one has to know
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that the only count in the words that we're not sensed. and because of algeria is not allowed the unit, she are to fence this a, b, b, 's population. how can we know the number of this population they leave in dire positions happening at bed bed? now the dire condition and the are vulnerable to the recruitment of, of the, of terrorists that come from this ahead. so i think because of the not i think and, and in this conflict because of this artificial conflict, these area is bol mirabelle. this area is the pro and terrorist recruitment in, in that, specifically in, in the teens that region. and there is a growing threats to the security of the high region, and the name is ariana, and bases again. i'm going to go back then media. i'm gonna jump in there. i'm so sorry, i'm sorry, before you go back i, i just have to jump them to coming towards the end of the program and i want to get one final question to record of her viani. let's come back full circle to spain's position, which isn't cut and dried because there's
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a lot of opposition to it in the political hierarchy in spain. isn't that? yes, absolutely. i mean, this is a country that, as i mentioned before, has longstanding ties with both morocco and the way this how we population and with how we diaspora is present on its own national territory. so it's only natural debts. this position taken by the government has been and it's still, i would say, contested by a significant section of the population. we know, for example, that the junior partner of the ruling coalition for them, us has already denounced this shift saying that he doesn't really represents the opinion of the majority of the spanish population surveys point. exactly, that's the fact that the majority of spaniards don't seem to back the decision of this government. and it has been, there's been criticism even coming from the rights that particularly regarding what spain has or has not to really obtain a returned for this. for this move,
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so i would say that even within spain, the debate is still very lively and there are still a significant questions regarding the let's say, the logic of this move and the benefits of this shift. well, trying to tackle a 50 it is 1520 minutes to serve as a real challenge, but we do thank you for joining us here today to try and take it on at fioma. yasmine has now and ricardo have you on a thanks a lot. and thank you for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting a website out dessert dot com. and for further discussion just gets off book page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter. i'll handle is a j inside story for me to call. can the entire team here and go off goodbye for not a ah,
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no, not a from with a yeah. a .


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