tv Dateline London BBC News February 10, 2018 11:30am-12:00pm GMT
for the guardian newspaper. welcome to you all. the eu is having some problems understanding the uk's position. the chief negotiator barnier didn't pull his punches on friday at the end of a week of technical discussions in brussels. he said a transition period once britain leaves the eu next year isn't a given, and that the uk decision to quit the customs union and single market means irish border checks are unavoidable. the british cabinet minister in charge of talks, david davis, said he was "surprised" by such comments after all the work that's gone on. iain, what is happening? in the‘s attempted to leave the european union, and the brits have a lwa ys european union, and the brits have always been really good at comedy and forests. viewers will be familiar with monty python. the
cabinet is split. it doesn't yet have an agreed negotiating position in terms of what it wants to ask the european union for in march when the next round of talks begin. which is obviously troubling the european union. the european union has its own problems as well, there are a lot of moving parts in this. it's turning almost into a crisis. but it is happening. it almost one year to go until brexit. i suspect there will be some deal at some point. britain is not doing its reputation for diplomatic skill any good at the moment, and it seems bizarre that this close to brexit the cabinet and prime minister, who is of course under a lot of pressure, and under pressure from some conservatives to 90, pressure from some conservatives to go, don't yet know that they what sort of relationship they want with the european union have to words. and you think that is still the
genuine case inside the cabinet? or they don't want to reveal their hand to the public or anyone in brussels. despite the fact we have this cabinet meeting where some of these things were thrashed out recently, they just can't things were thrashed out recently, theyjust can't reach agreement? we have to be careful of exaggerating that, because the cabinet has moved a long way since the brexit referendum in 20 months ago, so the eye agreed that the uk is leaving the european union and single market, it has to leave the customs union, because that is in the european treaty. there is an argument about what nature of free trade agreement they should try and seek with the eu and if the eu will allow uk to have such a deal. the primary sticking point is customs arrangements and whether the uk signs a replacement for existing customs union, something like turkey has, because turkey is a member of the different customs union with the
eu, or whether the uk tries to do it all with a free trade agreement. you would expect by now there are to be a clear position on that, but as i said, they have moved a long way. the uk is leaving for probably a much harder brexit than might have been the case a year or a year and a half ago, so it has having a more pure brexit. on that final sticking point, the customs union, that could be where there is a lot of parliamentary fireworks over the course of the next six months. that might be where mps, because remember that theresa may does not have a majority at, or only a majority with the help of the minority party, that might be where rebellion of mps brings the whole thing clashing down. agnes, seems some in the eu are considering changes to the brexit schedule?
it is nice to hear you who are in favour of brexit. yes, very much. i wish you were doing the negotiation, actually. we could put him forward. you were talking about a comedic forests, and i will try not to laugh, because i keep getting e—mails from people saying," stop laughing whenever brexit is mentioned." be laughing whenever brexit is mentioned. " be pragmatic laughing whenever brexit is mentioned." be pragmatic and likeable brexiteers but i know... on the other hand, you can understand we re the other hand, you can understand were at the british government is doing and some brexiteers like jacob rees mogg do so badly for the image of britain because friends of britain make me on the continent don't understand what is going on,
really. one day we are burmese to, another day we are laughing our heads off, and then we are in despair. —— bemused. ithinkjeremy corbyn would do such a betterjob than theresa may in terms of negotiating brexit, the cops he is a eurosceptic and a brexiteer. he long—stay party that is pro—european, but he would do such a betterjob. i pro—european, but he would do such a better job. i admire pro—european, but he would do such a betterjob. i admire michel barnier in brussels because they are keeping their cool. if we look back at december, brussels helped theresa may saved face. they said ok, this is fine, eu citizens will retain their rates during the transition period, we all move on to start negotiating trade deals in march."
which is again if we don't belong to the customs union, then you need a ha rd the customs union, then you need a hard border. brussels, ironically, jean—claude juncker did intervene to rescue theresa may and the british position, but it is worth asking why that happened ? position, but it is worth asking why that happened? a lot of that was to do with pressure from german industry. a lot of that was to do with pressure from jean—claude juncker, who is of course a former prime minister of luxembourg, which is essentially an offshoot of the city of london. there are other things happening in european politics. germany doesn't have a government. and is... michel barnier and john called younger, i'd be keeping their cool or idea deliberately so trying to remind people that time is running out? michel barnier and jean—claude
juncker, i they keeping their cool orare juncker, i they keeping their cool or are they deliberately trying to remind people that time is running out? the japanese trade senior executives who went to downing street this week, for them to put their heads above the parapet the way japanese businessmen work, their heads above the parapet the wayjapanese businessmen work, to interfere unhappy because they produce because that britain makes and half of those get exported to europe and if this goes to a non—european union arrangement, those are a temper sent out at least and some of these points move across the channel three times before the end up in the car and you can see how unbelievably difficult it is. gary younge said the brexiteers i like the dog that chased the car and finally caught it. they don't really know what to do. they cannot drive it. i feel that all this wrangling when you're facing an entity when 27
countries each can veto what ever they come up with. even if german manufacturing wants elizabeth morton leeway, now they can get that. i just don't see this working out. it's a michael shisha. one of the main thing is that the european union wants and needs to have because its budget runs up to 2020 and the uk as the second—largest contributor pays £10 billion a year. 10 billion... it is a significant amount. you try at skiing german electors at the moment to stump up an extra £20 billion because the uk doesn't get canadian. i think it will happen, i am acknowledging that the brits are making a mess of it. the british system is like a school.
when you know the headteacher has lost control and has no authority, there is complete medal and chaos amongst pupils. that is why advocated street after she lost her majority that the uk needed a new prime minister, someone to set a clear direction. i think there will bea clear direction. i think there will be a deal, but it is a mess. that is enough brexit for now. plenty more to come in future weeks, thank you very much. much to many people's surprise, jacob zuma is still president of south africa. he has refused to resign, and hand over to cyril ramaphosa, despite repeated requests from senior anc officials — the parliament took the highly unusual step this week of postponing the annual state of the union address, worried about protests and disruption. jacob zuma has always denied the numerous charges of corruption against him. nesrine, you watch these things closely, how much
longer can he cling on? iam i am surprised he has been challenged, because it looked like until recently, he wasn't going to go away, because he had so much invested historical legitimacy of the anc. he has been at it for decades and there were not other figures i could match his historical status. people feel that he shouldn't just status. people feel that he shouldn'tjust go, he should be held accountable for crimes and corruption. there is another school that thinks we don't want to have 999 that thinks we don't want to have egg on the face of the anc. this is a man who thinks that the entire anti—apartheid regime was invested and should be allowed to go in
dignity. he was caught in between and does not want to be tainted by him, but also does not want to look like he completely cutting links with the history of the anc. it is less about him and more about history of post—apartheid black led politics in south africa and how people don't want it to be sullied asa people don't want it to be sullied as a failed experiment of corruption and how other people want it to be, you know, a bat on should be passed sea mlessly you know, a bat on should be passed seamlessly and effort but play. jacob zuma knows all of this and he is sitting tight hoping that he can negotiate the best deal, his salary and pension and not give up any of the perks and benefits. what ultimately happens to him depends on which one of these factions wins and which one of these factions wins and which cyril ramaphosa believes is best for his leadership going
forward. there have been so many allegations of corruption for so many years. where are the voices saying, "this is tarnishing the brand?" they are there and they feel that for the anc to be able to break with this tarnished past there needs to be accountability, but, like i said earlier, there is also another defensive group, which i kind of understand, that thinks, "it's corruption, but it is our cerru ptien. but it. is ear = and ssrrs ptisn. last it. is ssh” = and we need to make it corruption, and we need to make it go away quietly and not give other people the chance to weaponised jacob zuma's corruption against the anc." jacob zuma's corruption against the anc.“ 1's jacob zuma's corruption against the anc. " 1's corruption jacob zuma's corruption against the anc." 1's corruption set into institutions like this, he is not the only one taking money and usually there are genes and it's certainly very top. assuming he doesn't get into power, there are
institutions fighting corruption and it isa institutions fighting corruption and it is a complicated country. they are all trying to make it clean, but i think it is quinn to be very difficult after the long history of corruption for the next person, not just for historic reasons, but because argued with their hands out. think that is what cyril ramaphosa's problem is now, because he doesn't wa nt to problem is now, because he doesn't want to make it look like he is sanctioning this system, which doesn't begin and end with jacob zuma, but at the same time, he doesn't want to rattle the infrastructure of corruption which exists. he doesn't want to make it look like... it reminds me of the transition in angola when he left his position and handed off to other people and meacher that this network of patronage and corruption... it is a system of patronage and made sure
it existed so he could still maintain his interests. this network exists in business, economy, it is one of the reasons why south african economy is in such dire straits and has been presented long time is because there is this cabal of business interests. also be trade unions. the most troubling aspect of this is the economic component. just look at the numbers, unemployment above 25%, looking at the living standards that have gone backwards. if you get this tainted it happens, then we all have to hope it makes some kind of difference. he is still going to be a former trade unionist and businessman himself, he is still going to be a creature of those interests. trade unions are extremely powerful. the communist party of south africa is a very powerful communist of that coalition holding it all together. south
africa needs radical economic reform, market—driven reforms that encourage foreign investment, it needs reform of its political system so needs reform of its political system so that you have stability and the rule of law and corruption is driven out. the may well get office, but good luck to him in terms of changing that. does that benefit the people, the politicians? —— the population. what will it take when you look at those economic numbers and corruption and the cronies and those built into the economy. what will it take for voters to try something different? one of the lessons of global politics in the la st lessons of global politics in the last few years is people when tested, strings things can happen and new forces can emerge and ijust wonder if south africa is one of those places where they might. the problem with the anc is it is sort
of like the muslim brotherhood in the arab world, they have spent so much time in opposition that once the establishment was overthrown there is nothing else. there aren't many people that associate of the anc with anti—apartheid opposition. it will take a long time for another party to develop. it is a long history of apartheid and who was in opposition at the time. history of apartheid and who was in opposition at the timelj history of apartheid and who was in opposition at the time. i don't see jacob zuma ever going to jail because of that because he is such a smith operator. the next election as next year and the heartbeat is really for cyril ramaphosa and he is going to negotiate something. they are outsmarting each other, but in the end... thank you. stadium in pyeongchang, as athletes from north there were huge cheers from the crowd in the olympic
stadium in pyeongchang, as athletes from north and south korea arrived under one flag during the opening ceremony of the winter games. now, as the sporting competition is under way, the north's kimjong un has invited the south korean president moon jae—in for talks in pyongyang — it would be the first meeting of korean leaders in more than ten years. jef, how should we read this invitation? why not? it is pretty interesting. for the nord, it is a no—brainer. they have their nuclear weapons, the hydrogen bomb, the nuclear vessels that continue to fly, why not appear to be magnanimous? why not make it harderfor to be magnanimous? why not make it harder for a to be magnanimous? why not make it harderfor a donald to be magnanimous? why not make it harder for a donald trump to to be magnanimous? why not make it harderfor a donald trump to do to be magnanimous? why not make it harder for a donald trump to do the bloody nose attack that washington keep stocking about? why not divide south korea from washington and japan? it is a skilful thing and doesn't cost anything. trump might try to take credit in his way. i have been rattling my sabre and know
something is happening, let's see what happens. that is the deal—maker of donald trump, and in fact there is no solution to the north korea problem, they have the weapons, they are not giving them up. there are a lot of voices in washington that understand this, but i think that makes as much harderfor him to understand this, but i think that makes as much harder for him to try anything radical. even if mike pens is saying it is an evil regime and we have to fight, fight, fight. mike pence looked particularly uncomfortable during that opening ceremony, didn't he? uncomfortable during that opening ceremony, didn't he ?|j uncomfortable during that opening ceremony, didn't he? i have to say, lam ceremony, didn't he? i have to say, i am always very sceptical when the olympics and the ioc get involved in a political story. it's one of the most political and questionable... is the ioc anything to do with this? north korea will not listen to donald trump, but they will listen
to the ioc. laughter if you look at the political rhetoric at the opening, they even had john lennon's imagine at the opening ceremony, i am weary of it having a little impact. i think it is ultimately about the sport and i am nota is ultimately about the sport and i am not a great fan of winter sports, but like what people, you do get sucked into watching this extraordinary display of people you have never heard of watching these amazing sports. it is somehow captivating, but i do think there is a legitimate claim that donald trump can make about the fact that he has ke pt can make about the fact that he has kept the north koreans guessing. it does seem to have created some sort of movement. it that it has encouraged the north koreans to do do something, as you suggest, to do something to their advantage. its movement that hasn't been made
before. the senate has been making movement, bring this to our nation. this man was elected partly on a platform of trying to engage a little more. —— the cap back says. we think of them as very different, but they are not as completely alienate it from each other as people think. there are families split across the two countries. it's not what you would expect. people assume that the south korean population is threatened and annoyed by this north korean neighbour, but it is sort of scene... if they are threatened and annoyed by the north korean regime, if you look at the numberof korean regime, if you look at the number of people at risk of a north korean attack, that is what really drives people there, the idea of having a lunatic dictatorjust north of them with mclear weapons. there
is fraternal gangsta between the countries that people underestimate. i think maybe donald trump can claim thatis i think maybe donald trump can claim that is something that he did. —— fraternal thanks thanks. maybe it is global people hating donald trump and getting together. a perverse motivation for all the little people to get together. the one thing everyone can agree on is that they hate donald trump. one thing everyone can agree on is that they hate donald trumplj one thing everyone can agree on is that they hate donald trump. i am not sure that is true for the japanese. one of the main is trying to do is to help the japanese, who are understandably incredibly concerned. he's worried about chinese expansion. he wants to reassure the japanese that he has
their back and the real dividing line and the american fear is that the south koreans would be prepared to do the south koreans would be prepared todoa the south koreans would be prepared to do a deal with north korea that didn't have a nuclear question addressed within it, because nuclear weapons are in the north korean...|j weapons are in the north korean...” don't think that we are talking about kim yong, but for all the docs that he is a madman added lunatic, i think that was really clever. —— talking about kim yong —— talking about kim yong un. the same week you have them parading missiles in the country and then he sends his sister to south korea and they are having kimchi together and apparently it's a sign that
everything is going to be well. i think we shouldn't underestimate north korea and every little helps. like you, i am not a great fan of the ioc or winter sports. it is soft power. the region and japan, they don't know what to do any more, all those missiles flying over their heads. wait and see, but i think it's a clever move. soft power can be beneficial. it can be... a sporting event doesn't have to be a fig leaf, it can oils on wheels. the difficulty is, is an end to game possible with the north korean regime the way it is? will be be willing to make any significant concessions. they have gotten closer
before, you can see ways that it might be possible and south korea would like to make some kind of the deal, but the nuclear weapons are probably off the table, because the north koreans are not going to give them up. that is their protection against donald trump and anybody else who wants to do something about it. that means an international deal is not feasible. in the long run, it is not feasible. in the long run, it is like iran. in 20 years, the hope is like iran. in 20 years, the hope is that the regime collapses of its own weight. the north korean regime isa regime own weight. the north korean regime is a regime like nothing else. i am old fashioned, i am on the side of the democracies. we all are. right now, we have to draw it to a close, because we are all keen to watch the bobsleigh and the ice—skating. i
have two let you leave to consider your enthusiastic viewing of the winter olympics. that is offer this week. we do hope you canjoin as next week at the same time. thank you for being with us. hello. changeable weather this weekend. rain today for most of us as it's less cold than yesterday but much colder tomorrow, so snow showers are back on the cards. here is the weekend of weather set out in detail. weather system at the moment with outbreaks of rain for england and wales, clearing for a time for scotland and northern ireland, tomorrow a colder day. yes, there will be some sunshine but also some snow showers. here's how it's looking going into the afternoon.
some outbreaks of rain becoming confined later to parts of east anglia, south—east england. then dry for a time elsewhere but more rain coming back to northern ireland before the afternoon is done. a snapshot of the uk at apm, we will see some clearer weather in scotland which means there will be some sunshine at times, a scattering of showers out to the west but after some sunny spells but after sunny spells in northern ireland, it clouds over again and outbreaks of rain come back. some showers but a dryer picture for northern england, wales, western england and into east anglia. the south east has the thickest cloud after some early sunshine today. it's been a cold start across eastern areas, there will be a slow recovery today, elsewhere some into double figures maybe as high as 12 degrees in south—west england. more rugby today, sunshine on the ground is just a tease. cloudy and damp at dublin and twickenham. this evening, it will get stronger and gales in places, this isn'tjust rain, some snow especially
in the southern scotland and northern england, notjust on hills, even relatively low levels. some accumulation especially in the hills, and snow showers in the north—west, you will notice as temperatures dip close to freezing, that means a risk of ice going into the morning. tomorrow, a much colder day, changing the wind direction north—westerly. you see the land, there will be good spells sunshine with showers coming in from the north—west, going further south—east in the day, and it will cold enough for sleet and snow or hail, away from windward coasts, and the temperatures down compared to today. it is going to feel much colder. further opportunities for rain and snow as we go through the week, the next snow could be monday night into tuesday morning. we will keep you updated on that. this is bbc news, the headlines at midday.
a review into oxfam is ordered by the department for international development — the charity denies covering up a sex scandal involving aid workers in haiti. israel says one of its fighterjets has crashed after coming under syrian anti—aircraft fire. the pilots escaped. triple world champion short—track speed skater, elise christie, sets an olympic record in her opening heat in the 500 metre event.