tv Best of Bloomberg Technology Bloomberg November 23, 2019 4:00am-5:00am EST
taylor: i am taylor riggs in for emily chang and this is the "best of bloomberg technology." coming up, cook facetime. president trump tors the austin factory at a time when the white house considers whether to exempt apple goods from the tariffs. we will have the latest. holly says a josh big spinning tall tales.
towants facebook and google stop tracking user data. and later, bill gates on how tech rmd is being seriously hampered. his comments from the bloomberg new economy forum. but we begin this hour with apple. the company made news on two fronts this week. the first, president trump's visit to the austin texas factory. macst to discuss keeping and iphones free from tariffs. the other news involved the way apple tests software changing after a series of bugs marred the last system. we kicked off the conversation thursday. >> basically, apple's ios software has been bugging the past few years. this particular release cycle,
it has been especially buggy. they are going to make it so that engineers earlier in the process can determine what is working in order to hopefully come up with a much more stable operating system when they ship each september. taylor: tom, i know that you cover the fundamentals of the business. in your opinion when you analyze the company, at what point do you have to start to take a look at these software glitches and incorporate them into your analysis? tom: to the point it has a dampening impact on unit sales for the company, when you think about apple, they have had some snafus over time with their technology. it is not unusual for them to have issues with their software. but the challenge here is if you think about both new iphone users and then old iphone users who upgrade to the latest software, it is really part of that feel for the consumer of having the latest and greatest apple technology. so it is definitely something they need to improve.
but when it has an impact on unit sales that is when i get real concerned about it. taylor: mark, i am curious, in your opinion, you have seen apple come out with these glitches and have to quickly issue new updates. is it better to do that, to get out to the customer first, or would you prefer to see them roll it out right the first time? mark: they really don't have an option. they have to introduce it every june and release it every september. to tom's point, selling new devices is the most important thing. the way these new devices are developed is they are built concurrently with software updates. it would be impossible to ship the iphone 11 without ios 13. so they really have no choice. it is not a matter if they should or should not, there is really no option here besides adding fewer features, which of course they are not going to do because the features are what drives sales.
taylor: tom, i want to switch gears and talk about tim cook's visit with trump yesterday at apple's new factory in austin, texas. if you look at apple and tim cook's relationship with trump, are tim cook and apple doing the right thing by getting in front of the president, getting the president's ear, showing off these factories, even if it is small in apple's terms. tom: the answer is absolutely yes. i would argue that no publicly traded ceo has done a better job managing the relationship with the president then tim cook has travel -- four apple. -- for apple. you see that in the recent tariffs to the extent they adjust to the timing of it, which essentially gave apple an opportunity to sell its new iphones one more time without the full impact of tariffs. i think tim cook has done an amazing job. it is interesting to do a compare and contrast with jeff bezos of amazon. most recently, you look at the
jedi contract amazon lost, tim cook is doing a much better job. apple is doing a great job managing its relationship with the president and tim cook is leading that charge. taylor: mark, react to that. is tim cook doing the best of all the big tech ceo's? mark: i would agree that he is doing what he needs to do from a bottom-line perspective, from a financials perspective. like tom said, he did get tariffs on the iphone delayed and we will see if this dog and pony show yesterday gets apple a further delay on smartphone products. the end of the day, what they showed yesterday was not new in any way. they framed it as some sort of big launch. it is important to note, everything that we saw yesterday, everything you see on the screen right now has been in place since 2013. so this is not new by any means. this is a seven-year-old existing infrastructure basically portrayed as a new thing. and they are going ahead and thanking the trump administration for this.
on top of that, this is not the iphone, the ipad, the apple watch. this is apple's lowest volume product they sell. the impact this would have had on apple's bottom line if this was a tariff product they produced in china would have been so slim anyway. so it is unclear what apple is winning by doing this other than getting in this pr situation with the trump administration to prevent tariffs on other products like iphones moving forward, which of course is a smart business decision but a bad pr move in the interim. taylor: tom, within the pr machine that is apple, is the political savviness of tim cook an undervalued asset? is that not being reflected in the share price? tom: with the rebound and shares -- in shares, it is hard to indicate what is not in the share price. so i do think the company, again, tim cook at the charge, has done an amazing job as the smartphone market has matured, and starting to diversify his revenue base.
you think about what they are doing with all their other hardware devices, including wearables, the watches. when we look at in particular is proprietary content or things they are doing in financial services like apple pay and apple card, and also health care. so i do think it is reflected in shares, and it is warranted. they have done an amazing job managing the current administration, and it should be positively reflected in price. taylor: what is your best case scenario when it comes to tariffs? tom: great question. i will give a quick example of sonos, another company i covered. they indicated they are moving all of their production into malaysia and out of china. i think the base case is you are going to see more companies that will move their manufacturing operations out of china. in the case of apple, apple may never be able to move its smartphone manufacturing out of china, but it may be able to have more parts manufacturers move their own supply chains out of china, which could help it avoid some of the tariffs in addition to tim cook's efforts
to manage the administration there. taylor: mark, i want to switch gears a little bit as well. we saw some technical glitches when disney had to keep up with passport thieves and hackers. we have had apple tv plus have some glitches when it comes to the rollout of their films. one of which they had to pull back. is apple tv plus prepared to be a media company? mark: yes. i think apple's infrastructure for video streaming, the application development it has had for a number of years has been there. so, i think apple, their cloud infrastructure on the consumer side is not normally great, but there have really been no glitches. it has been problem-free in terms of rollouts of new shows. i have seen it myself on apple products, every time a new episode hits on friday at midnight, you get a buzz on your phone it is available and ready to stream.
their experience in the app store and itunes movie rentals has really prepared them for this. password management has been a big focus for apple for the last two years. apple tv plus is tied directly into family sharing. you can use tv plus on that subscription either free or for five dollars a month with four other family members. from a technology perspective, tv plus has been problem-free. taylor: that was mark gurman and tom forte. coming up, senator josh holly is making his mark by taking on tech. we hear from the senator on how he plans to make sure companies like facebook and google respect your privacy. and if you like bloomberg news, check us out on the radio. you can listen on the bloomberg app and in the u.s. on sirius xm. this is bloomberg. ♪
taylor: google is severely limiting how political advertisers can target people online, a decision made after weeks of debate. the tech company said on wednesday it will stop allowing election ads to be targeted ace on political affiliation. banning misleading information. however, targeting based on age, gender, and location is still allowed. josh holly may be a junior senator from missouri but he is making a name for himself by being one of the most outspoken critics on tictac. tech.big he has tried to ensure u.s. consumer data is not spent and stored in countries deemed a national security threat.
we spoke with senator josh holly wednesday but taking on big tech starting with the letter he sent to facebook demanding they explain their inflation data tracking policies. sen. hawley: facebook has said they can turn off location tracking, but it turns out, you can't. scan allcontinues to of the wi-fi in your area. it continues to use your cellular location and transmit that information to facebook. so this is another misrepresentation and i would like to know why it is that facebook is telling its users they can stop tracking when in fact they cannot. google does the same thing and it is one more instance of these companies not being honest about the data they are collecting. sen. hawley: so you think they are purposefully misleading users? taylor: i don't know how to read it any other way.
read the posts facebook put up for all of its users, saying you can stop facebook from learning your precise location. a lawyerly phrase, turns out. the consumer would never imagine that if they want to turn off services facebook is still tracking them. tracking wi-fi, using cellular data. i think it is very misleading. taylor: what would you like to hear in response from facebook? sen. hawley: i would like to hear the facts. i want their excavation for the difference -- explanation for the difference between what they have told consumers and what they are doing. i would like to hear them explain in their own words. the honest and set out the facts. honest and set out the facts. this gets to why congress needs to pass legislation to give every american the right to opt out of being tracked. workaround,, no
every american should say i don't want to be tracked. sen. hawley: are you also planning on writing a letter to apple and google? taylor: google is already well aware of my concerns. they have a similar problem. they testified to me, under oath, that users can turn off location services that is not true. the android phone constantly scans for wi-fi and monitors your cellular network, even if location services are off and transmits that information to google. as i say about the companies are all doing the same thing, misrepresenting their position will collecting information. taylor: to be fair, we have heard a lot about data privacy and seen a few existing legislation come out. why does yours have a chance to go somewhere? sen. hawley: for one, it has
bipartisan support. track" billo not which would give every american the right to say they do not want to be tracked. don't want anybody to scoop up information about me. it would give every american the right to that. it is sponsored by senator feinstein from california and warren from virginia so we have got bipartisan support. it's something consumers deserve . taylor: i wants to fold in your concerns about data privacy to big tech. the doj has hinted those two things are the same issue. is this a concern about data privacy? sen. hawley: one reason concerns are so pressing is because these companies are monopolies sized. if we had a viable alternative that was not scooping up data, i would be less concerned.
but the truth is there are not viable competitors and that's a big problem. so i am concerned about their conduct. i'm concerned it is making the issues worse. criticsley: -- taylor: would say the competitors are in china. if we break up u.s. tech, how do we take on china? sen. hawley: i don't understand how promoting more competition and innovation would hurt our standing. but listen, i have introduced legislation that would stop chinese companies from entering the market if they are going to abuse our data collection. i have a bill that would stop companies like tictoc from collecting data and sharing it with the government. that is also a major privacy concern. we can address the threat from china in the background threat, which is beijing, while also asking american companies to
compete, innovate, and be honest with consumers. taylor: senator, i'm going to take the bait let's talk about tiktok and apple. can't keep china -- apple out of china and can't keep tiktok out of the u.s.. sen. hawley: tiktok is a simple solution. tictoc -- tiktok from transferring any data of americans at the china. we should just make that legal. -- illegal. at any time a chinese company wants to acquire an american data company, the state department should sign off beforehand. when it comes to apple or any company like apple, they should not be storing data in china in encryption keys in china. should be tiktok
under review. sen. hawley: it already is but it should have been done on the front-end. my bill would change that. requiring it to be signed off before a company, any three of concern when it comes to security none of those companies in those countries should be able to buy an american company without preclearance. taylor: what does a realistic tech bill look like? sen. hawley: i think we could track."th "do not it has huge protection, broad bipartisan support, and is pro-competition. it goes to the very business model of google and facebook and twitter, for that matter. i would start there. i have said i don't think the goal of comprehensive five is the legislation, we ought not to let that stand in the way. notuld start with "do
track" and protection for children. big tech should not be able to advertise or track kids and every parent should have the right have that data needed. -- deleted. taylor: europe and the european union has been much more strict than the u.s.. why have they been able to pass legislation and we haven't? sen. hawley: big tech has purchased a lot of friends here in the capital. they have expanded their netflix -- network of influence for years. they know how to play the game. but consumers are impatient, parents are impatient and fed up with their kids being exploited and tracked online. consumers are fed up with being tracked and not having anything to say or opt out. i think the american people will demand action by congress. taylor: senator, i want to
address another bill about ending support for internet censorship which is intended to address claims of anti-conservative bias. the heritage foundation said that if enacted, the bill regulates online content what eroding -- but risks eroding free speech. howdy respond? -- how do you respond? sen. hawley: we need more free speech, not less. less regulation. my concern is because facebook and google are monopoly-sized, when they decide they are going to discriminate the basis of political views -- on the basis of political views, that means those folks are effectively shut out of the digital marketplace. all of these companies say that they don't make decisions on the basis of clinical viewpoints.
my legislation just told them to that. -- holds them to that. if it's not accurate, they should not be able to keep special protections. taylor: that was senator josh h awley of missouri. still ahead, the santander chairman says legislation should be a level playing field across sectors. us later, bill gates joins from the bloomberg new economy forum in beijing. hear his thoughts on artificial intelligence. this is bloomberg. ♪
tuesday for an expose of interview to discuss her views on regulating and partnering with tech companies. >> what is a bank? what is a bank? does a bank just take deposits and make loans? of course, but we do payments we , since i arrived, is to be a responsible bank and grow loyal customers. loyal customers if i asked you who is your bank you will have one bank in your head even though you might have five accounts. >> that's true. >> you are like 99% of americans and most people around the planet. for that to be the case, i need to know you and that is based on data. my question to you is, why should data be regular -- regulated in a different way? you, as a customer, should be
able to share my data but also .rom other players is not just about banks and payment, it is about transport companies. this is the issue we need to sort out. >> some of the big u.s. banks have started forming partnerships with tech companies to provide financial services. will you do that to? -- too? >> we are in favor of innovation and have many partners. we want to take these services and pass them on. the point.ctly we need everybody else to be open. my question to you, what is a
critical infrastructure in the digital age? we used to say telcos were critical infrastructure. isn't a device critical infrastructure? >> you could make that are. -- argument. >> a digital wallet. do you know how many people have a digital while? -- wallet? 2 billion. who should be part of that arrangement? should be whoever is issuing the cards? these other things we need to make sure we have clarity on. taylor: that was the santander chairman ana botin. on chilly bill gates u.s.-china ties and what that means for collaboration, especially when it comes to artificial intelligence. his comments from the bluebird new economy forum -- bloomberg
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♪ back to "best of bloomberg technology." r&d is the focus of the conversation with delegates. he spoke to john mickelthwait from the bloomberg new economy forum in beijing to discuss carbong energy uses and tax. bill: there is no doubt that solar and wind will be a huge part of that. because those are intermittent forces, the need for 24 like
nuclear or unbelievable miracle -- and it is very high. you can look at a country like japan, tokyo. you have seven days with no wind or sun power at all so you say if you will not have people freeze to death, what is the source of energy during that seven-day period? have timesest, we when the cold front sits on in the wind does not blow. it will either be a storage miracle or a bit of nuclear. the electric source will be almost three times as big because it will be taking over parts of transport and industrial and heating that historically went to hydrocarbon usage. people building models of that future grid, different
universities, different people picking their choices, that will be the sign that not only do we by 2050,al to be there but we are debating the paths and concrete plans. when you see things like a 15% , youl tax, the willingness can question whether it is there because the pre-writer problem has never been worse than it is in climate, especially for middle income countries that argue that the historical missions for the risch -- rich countries mean they have to wait per person. john: a carbon tax is the way to secure that? you pointed to the political difficulties of that, but that is the fairest way to do it? bill: that is a way to do it. if you look at the u.s. in particular, i don't think it is likely to happen. we have tax credits on
renewables, renewable portfolio standards. you can get there in a way that is less neutral. there is a variety of regulations to help nascent sectors. in the industrial sector, people have gotten excited about the low hanging fruit. the electric part is the easy part. you still have to do the grid. various things including industrial are very difficult. nuclear, you get a million times the energy per reaction than by burning carbon, so it is advantaged if you do the design right, cannot say it would succeed but it would be good in this innovation portfolio. we have to have a lot of bets knowing some of them won't succeed. john: you think you have come up with a new design which would run more efficient.
bill: in the computer, our design is amazing and that is perfect because you can simulate earthquakes, volcanoes, planes crashing into it, none of the things with the nuclear plant, you could do any of that. the safety is strong. we need to build a demo plant and we plan to do that in china. the u.s. government decided we shouldn't do that, so now the backup plan as we will try and build that in the united states. endeavor, butasy none of the paths to climate success are risk-free. john: how frustrating was that for you? you put all this money into setting up this technology with the chinese on board to test it, and the trump administration stopped it. ,ill: i had gone for a decade
meeting with every secretary of energy who urged the u.s. government to create an agreement because you need explicit permission to do this kind of collaboration. it was a surprise when that was withdrawn and meant that a lot of things we had done, it was a setback and in the best case it was a five-year delay. in the worst case, it would completely collapse. the: the big theme -- john: big theme as china and america. if we are in the foothills of a cold war, you are passionate about engagement with china, how do you view the situation? bill: even more passionate about the value of engagement than ever. the last few years have seen voices arguing against that, even for so-called decoupling. it is a benefit that there is interdependence.
the fact that we have tourists from japan, china, students from china, companies that do research in china. apple is the tech company, the only tech company that sells products in china. that interdependence can lead to more dialogue come up more mutual understanding, so to have people arguing against that is a serious concern. taylor: that was bill gates, microsoft cofounder, from beijing. forum wasonomy organized by bloomberg media group, a division of bloomberg lp. the new economy forum gave us the opportunity to hear from leaders in the tech sector on topics of the day, like the u.s.-china trade issue. -- caught us up on what
challenges the chipmaker faces. ay: i am here in beijing and this is a developing story. i don't have anything specific to share. you had conversations with wilbur ross? how do you describe the conversations you are having with u.s. officials? large: we are a very global company and always engaging in conversation with governments around the world. the u.s. administration on an ongoing basis over the year, and certainly in recent times as well because our business in china is certainly important. >> would you say the conversations are constructive? absolutely. >> reading more about what is going on in china, the state has put in about $29 billion to
getting this country self-sufficient. is that a bigger threat than the interim trade war, self-sufficiency for technology supremacy as number one on the agenda? memory -- that macron made, these are extremely important. -- in thisok at the backdrop, the products we bring to the customer in china, we are a valued partner. micron has a history of 40 years, tremendous amount of innovation from the country does company. --are use to competition used to competition around the globe. we will keep bringing new technologies and products for the benefit of customers around the globe, including china. >> there are challenges therein
from april and point of view. -- from the point of view of the trade war. it -- have you done that or do you anticipate doing that next year? manufacturing of our leading-edge products around the globe. in the u.s., we have manufacturing. we have not taken any out of the u.s. our fabrication area is in manassas, virginia, the center of excellence for automotive products were micron has a number one global share -- global market share. our supply chain is very adaptive and agile. in these recent times where there certainly have been some challenges on the global trade front, we have shown in terms of
addressing the challenges and moving on, continuing to bring value to our customers around the globe. taylor: that was the micron ceo from beijing. economy forum was organized by bloomberg economy a division of bloomberg lp. qualcomm has been front and center in the development of 5g networks, including its strong partnership with apple and china telecom firms. discussing views on apple and how china is doing in the 5g race. >> we have a very strong business in china, a lot of partners including huawei we sell to. it continues to be a big opportunity and business for us, and in some ways, actually isolated or insulated from the trade discussions. there is a lot of expansion
happening worldwide with 5g in china. qualcomm is a big part of that and it is a classic story that if you have technology that people want or need, or if you are the strongest partner, you can figure out how to win. theline: you don't feel business has been curtailed? steve: we have had a change in the structure of the chinese handsets the huawei business has retrenched into china. what people have done and reaction is said, i will accelerate my 5g plans and not spend so much time on 4g. what has happened, this has accelerated the intensity of the 5g rollout, and not just at the hyatt and. it has -- high end. it has come several tiers below the premium tier. caroline: is china ahead of the
u.s.? steve: not from the technology perspective, and the behind scenes look is we are all working together. if china and the u.s. to not work together, you miss an opportunity worldwide, and you are not seeing that. people are cooperating. atyou look at the deployment which base stations are rolling out, china is going quite fast. there will be 130,000 base stations next year and one million in china next year alone . those are huge numbers in comparison to the united states. that does not mean the united states is not going quickly as well. and theseeing china united states launching in the same calendar year. they used to be separated by two or five years but now everyone is trying to get to 5g quickly. taylor: that was the qualcomm
taylor: more on the rays to advance 5g networks. networks. advance 5g many ways to make 5g accessible but the government and ftc are trying to figure out the best way to make that happen. she spoke to david westin. we will move to 5g, need new airwaves to power that, and some of those airwaves are mid band airways. band you are talking about is right there. twoftc allocated that
satellite services and they could return some now and make them available for wireless, and that is at issue, what is the best way to make that happen? for a while, the ftc was exploring a private sale, but increasingly it has started to look legally complicated, hard to do, and capitol hill has suggested that we do this through a public auction. the ftc chairman announced he would prefer a public auction, and we will work with folks on capitol hill to see if we can do that. david: one other dispute that came up, the six gigahertz dispute which appears to be wi-fi, companies like broadcom, versus utilities who need that spectrum for emergency communications. jessica: airwaves are getting complicated and when you have an existing use and you propose new
uses, there tends to be some friction. wi-fi isd spectrum or an important part of this economy so we are looking for places to grow wi-fi, and the six gigahertz band is one that we would like to do it because it is adjacent to online spectrum use for wi-fi. there are utilities that rely on that band so we will have to figure out how to do more unlicensed wi-fi along with protect utility activities from interference. proceeding --d a fcc started a proceeding but it is a heated one. we are looking at other places thewi-fi to go, including 5.9 gigawatt band. david: give us an extent to which parlett -- partisan politics enters into this. president trump has said it is a
priority for the country to go to 5g. how much is it republicans and democrats and how much is it republicans and democrats united on the goal? jessica: we are united on the goal. we want the united states to lead the next generation of technology, but when it comes to tactics, we might differ. i am the senior democrat at the industry and the administration does not have a plan for 5g service. there is no leadership from the senate. the national security advisor, we need a map when it comes to 5g. fighting withcc congress and the department of transportation over airwaves, and the president tweeting out that he has asked for assistance with 5g. other economies around the world are making strides and we do not want to fall behind. sixth: coming up, the
still waiting for driverless vehicles to still hit the road, but the ceo of waymo thinks one part of the market get rolling first. he told reporters that before we see things like true robo taxis, it is more likely to see driverless trucks like those waymo has been testing out in california and the southwestern united states. officerf products joined us from half and bay in
california. : i think we are excited about the long haul opportunity. it is really a foundation for the economy. we have been working on this since 2017 and we have already done a pilot with google, shipping some of their data center parts in atlanta. taylor: how has the general roll up been going in cities like phoenix when you are looking at robo taxis and true driverless vehicles? dan: the rollout has been going really well. i am excited about the progress. we started in 2017 launching an early writer program -- rider program. nowadays we have thousands of riders taking rides and we have trulyulling out
driverless rides so riders in phoenix can haley ride and have aride -- hail a ride and have ride show up without a driver. taylor: when would we see a bigger rollout nationwide as opposed to select cities? dan: we definitely have global ambitions, and our mission is to make every single mile safer. we think the rollout will be city by city, incremental, so we will continue to expand in metro phoenix and go on from there. we have already driven in 25 cities and testing in new ones. we have started testing in miami and los angeles. taylor: have you ridden in one? what is it like? dan: i definitely have. an important part of our culture at waymo as far as to try our own products.
it is an incredible experience. we think it brings a bit of independence, privacy, time to yourself. i believe it is a whole new product. way chiefat was product officer dan chu. formula e is happening in saudi allia, where the slickest electric vehicles battle outside every aunt, all powered by lucent. ed ludlow -- lucid. ed ludlow has the details. seconds,to 60 in 2.8 and all from an electric motor, this is formula e. the all electric cousin of formula one. started in racing 2014, cars could not complete
the race on a single charge, but since last season that has changed. thanks to this battery pack, built by a california company called lucid. >> we use our proprietary expertise, particularly modeling and thermal control, and structural analyses and packaging. we are manufacturing here in this very building at our headquarters in silicon valley. was the firste time lucid provide battery packs for formula e, but their involvement was kept controversial and they were labored -- labeled as a battery partner. this year, lucid is taking the spotlight and will continue to do so until their contract expires after season eight in 2021, so what can formula e fans expect? we got a look under the hood of
lucid's latest battery designs. the shape and software will help the team go the distance. for lucid, the formula e deal is a small part of a bigger plan. modernist -- modest revenue, really a token. we are doing this to demonstrate world-class technology that will find a way into our road car. ed: it is designed to compete against tesla and porsche. engineers are building prototypes in small batches at the new factory. the focus has been on making the battery packs is lightweight and efficient as possible, using proprietary robotics. has 20%battery pack more density than the nearest
consumer ev. >> they are incredibly light and increased the energy density beyond what is commercially available at the moment, so lucid can transfer its technology to commercial vehicles and give them an advantage. there is says potential to sell the battery pack to other automakers or form partnerships. they hope formula e will perform in pole position to capture the market in 2020. ed ludlow, california. taylor: that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." we will bring you the latest in tech throughout the week. to knit in at 5:00 p.m. -- tune in at 5:00 p.m. new york, 2:00 p.m. san francisco. be sure to follow our global breaking news network at tictoc
jonathan: from new york city for our audience worldwide, i'm jonathan ferro. "bloomberg real yield" starts right now. ♪ jonathan: coming up, rinse and repeat. president trump says the trade deal is close. enthusiasm fading. the flatten or returning to the treasury market with high years spreads does high yield spreads widening, ccc junk credit rolling over. let's begin with the big issue. overlooking year-end risk. >> everything is awesome right now. >> hope is a wonderful thing. >> you have got low and contained inflation. >> the potential for a true bottoming of the economy in 2020