tv Bloomberg Technology Bloomberg October 6, 2021 11:00pm-12:00am EDT
realize the situation, but he agrees that regulation is needed. amazon's videogame streaming platform has been hacked, exposing how much money creators are making. the hackers motive, to spark competition in game streaming. we have details. when jeff bezos bought 100,000 vehicles it was a defining moment. why bezos was in treat and the fascinating way he learned about the company. first, i want to take a look at the market. heavy trading as republicans poised to offer democrats a way to end the debt limit impasse. ed ludlow joins us with today's move. >> we were down more than 1% at one point in equity markets. we ended in the green. s&p 500 up .4%. nasdaq 100 up by more than .6%. there has been concern about this mega cap high-growth tech stocks.
apple, amazon, microsoft. the parse index up by .8%. semiconductors, which had been down until the end, ending in green. we have been discussing concerns about whether we get a correction in tech stocks. if you look at the nyse index committed is trading at -- versus 20 times estimated earnings of the s&p 500 the narrowest preview. we bumped down tech stocks and had a huge rally that set into motion several consecutive record highs. the narrative around markets has changed. i want to talk about crypto. frankly, we are on the march. bloomberg crypto index up 30% over a five day period. five consecutive days of gains. the best run since may. bitcoin a big driver. we crossed $55,000 wednesday. growing bullishness that this is a climb higher that should be sustained for cryptocurrency.
two movers to touch on, the first being electronic arts, down by 7.4%. their biggest drop since november. reddit forums, users pointing out the beta version of battlefield 2042 has bugs. the power of reddit. astonishing. modernity down 9%. sweden and denmark putting the moderna vaccine on hold due to concerns about side effects in younger people. emily: thanks. the idea that facebook puts profit over safety is just not true, says mark zuckerberg, in a lengthy facebook post defending the company hours after whistleblower frances haugen testified before congress. it's awkward amines about the future of facebook with daphne keller, platform regulation director at the stanford cyber
policy center. thank you for joining us. i want to read a little of mark zuckerberg's statement. at the heart, the idea they profit -- prioritize profit over safety. he says it's not true. he adds the reality is that young people use technology. rather than ignoring this committee should meet their needs while keeping them safe. the problem is that facebook has lost public trust. i am curious what your reaction is to zuckerberg finally responding to frances haugen. daphne: i would start by saying facebook is full of people like frances haugen. full of people who care very deeply about potential harms of the platform and are working hard to correct them. in zuckerberg's message, he got one thing right. those people need to have the freedom internally to do
research and make mistakes, and right their findings internally without fear it would be journalistic bombshell. i am worried in the way that will disempower people. , but those people also exist along executives, who according to the wall street journal, have done disturbing things. the executive in india who overruled the trust and safety team to leave posts that incited violence because they were from politically connected people. those impulses, the desire to do the right thing and make the platform safe, and the impulse to seek profit and be politically accommodating are always going to coexist the question is how to strike the
right balance. i's's am not sure zuckerberg met -- i am not sure his statement has reassured employees. emily: let's listen to one moment from the testimony yesterday where frances haugen outlined facebook's problems, then describes the company as being trapped. >> facebook is stuck in a feedback loop they cannot get out of. they have been hiding information because they feel trapped. they would have come forward if they had solutions. they need to admit they did something wrong and they need help to solve problems. emily: i'm curious what you think of this idea that facebook may be filled with well-intentioned people who may be in over their heads. maybe facebook's problems are just too big for any group to solve. daphne: journalists -- called this the banality of hubris. that we are seeing in this report, problems that any who want -- anyone who was paying attention new was going on in some form all along.
now we have documentation of details. i do not think facebook alone can solve them. with better transparency and better input from civil society organizations, experts, members of marginalized communities who have been reporting harms like this for years, we can arrive at better solutions. having a whistleblower force that probably was not the optimal way to do it, but we need that transparency and now we have a better idea of what is going on and better opportunity for more input. emily: would you say facebook is too big to govern? obviously it is bigger than the biggest countries in the world combined. daphne: it is not too big to govern. it is subject to privacy regulations in europe. it is subject to obligations to
take down certain types of content in every country in the world, including the united states. what it might not be able to do is perfectly regulate all of the online speech so that the good things stay up and the bad things come down. that is partly because none of us can agree on what that would mean. it is also because no government in history has undertaken to police people's daily speech in the way we are asking facebook to do. emily: let's start with the u.s. should the u.s. government do that? how? one of the most remarkable moments yesterday was senators from both sides agreeing they have differences but those differences are minor compared to the issues that facebook, they believe, is causing. daphne: i do not think there are a lot of great options from congress saying what speech should be allowed on facebook or how facebook should amplify that. this is because so much of the dangerous speech is protected by the first amendment.
we might find it morally abhorrent, but congress does not have the power to regulate it unless the supreme court changes its interpretation of the first amendment. what congress does have power to do is pass laws grounded in competition or privacy. there are ways to get at these content issues by giving users more control over how their data is used, and more knobs to adjust what they are seeing in their feed. or, you could try introducing competition in the provision of content moderation on top of facebook. this is something my colleague france asset -- has called middleware. enabling users to have -- that prioritize what they want prioritized. or a version of youtube curated by black lives matter groups. there are things we use to avoid top-down speech regulation from congress.
emily: it also reveals a disconnect between facebook's devotion of resources to the u.s., and to fighting disinformation and hate in english, and resources it devotes to the rest of the world. frances haugen points out that facebook's technology is particularly bad when it comes to identifying some of these language -- some of these issues in languages that are not english. daphne: it is a huge problem. it is something that does not get enough recognition from the u.s. congress, unsurprisingly, but is no surprise at all to civil society activists from around the world, or ordinary users around the world. people in myanmar or sri lanka
or because asked on -- because asked on -- is getting a facebook that is worse. that is because of insufficient support from people who speak the language of the country and the difficulties in updating the algorithm to have the greater safety measures that facebook has implemented for english, spanish, major languages. emily: where do you think facebook is headed if no regulation is put in place? daphne: that is not going to happen. even if congress is paralyzed in the u.s., the eu is passing a major new law that will definitely come into effect and reshape content moderation practices. it will require facebook to do annual risk assessments and independent audits. changes coming to matter what. this is one of the reasons facebook is running ads saying,
please regulate us. their best case scenario of the future is if the u.s. requires them to do the same thing that europe was going to require them to do anyway, and something smaller competitors can't do. emily: do you think the doomsday scenario, people on both sides, are they overreacting to what we have heard? daphne: i do not think they are overreacting. if you have not been tracking these issues and all of the things that francis revealed, it is appropriate to say this is a big deal and we should do something about it. in terms of what our options going forward for wise regulation, they are about the same we had before. there are always limits from the first amendment on one side to
what congress can do, but also the operation analogy of the platform. operation analogy of the platform. there is not a magic wand we can wave to make facebook behave in a way that makes all of us happy. emily: daphne keller, stanford cyber technology center. we appreciate having you. the grassroots site -- has exploded in popularity thanks to fix books -- facebook's global outage. this is bloomberg. ♪
emily: snapchat was the biggest winner when facebook had its worst outage in years. monday, they saw 23% those don time spent on android apps compared to the week before. telegram and signal also recorded a big surge. the first site to detect the global average was downdetector. the site has become a go to hub for outage reports across the west from facebook to hulu. downdetector reports real-time updates on whether a site is functioning properly. for more, cardi k -- this was the biggest outage downdetector ever detected. what does it look like from their end?
>> they first were notified by their own consumers. individuals who consume the page reported earlier in the morning that something was wrong with facebook, in's -- instagram and whatsapp. very swiftly they stumbled upon this critical mass where they saw 100,000 complaints coming in quickly and that triggered an automation in their system that sent out treats and messages saying clearly something there was wrong with facebook. instagram and whatsapp.
within minutes, the world knew there was something very wall -- very wrong. emily: facebook has underscored this was not anything nefarious, though there are conspiracy theories floating out there. what have we learned from this? >> what we learned did not come from downdetector, but there was an internal snafu at facebook. there is a protocol called dns, which allows a user to type the name into a url, and dns converts that into an ip address. that is what loads the website we look at. that system was not working because another protocol, border gateway protocol, which is basically like the postal service of the internet, had also stopped working. the paths the system might take to load the site didn't exist. every time we were loading the page, we were running into it dead end.
what we don't know yet is exactly why those gateway protocol systems were not working, why they had been withdrawn by facebook. was it because of the dns issue, or broader network problems? we are waiting for an explanation of exactly why these critical systems were not working. emily: how is downdetector viewing this mean for the future? >> this is a big outage they had stumbled upon. what is interesting, speaking with them yesterday, while facebook was down and users were reporting facebook was down, other pieces of the internet went down temporarily. they saw temporary disruptions at twitter, google and t-mobile. what was going on was users were seeing facebook wasn't working so they were going to other platforms to see if this was a
facebook problem or a broader issue related to their device connectivity. ironically, one of the other systems that would down was speed test, which is another product by the same company that owns downdetector. people were going to speed test to see what was going on and that knocked them out for a couple of minutes. emily: an astounding turn of events. kartikay mehrotra, thank you for joining us. twitch has been hacked. the hacker claims to have exposed sensitive source codes and details on payouts to content creators. they said they will provide updates when they have more information. for more, match day. what more do we know about what
happened, and of the motive of these hackers? >> we will take them at their word, they wanted to open more competition to videogame streaming. twitch is the biggest streaming service in the u.s. and they said it is a cesspool. that jibes with the kind of data we have seen. unlike personal information and credit cards, this is the inner workings of twitch itself. the crown jewels. emily: crown jewels. what has amazon said? >> amazon has been mom. -- typically when amazon gets breached, we hear a statement from them before the day is out. maybe tomorrow. and then maybe a week down the line we get a former, here's what went wrong. the anonymous speaker suggested there might be a second part of
it. this cash might have more coming. dumpy surprise if there's another dump down the line. emily: what would more competition in streaming look like? matt: it is hard to say. this is twitch possible market. google is throwing a ton of money at creators, microsoft got into that business, but then got out of it, this is twitch possible to lose. we haven't seen a lot of competition out there. emily: what details did we learn about the content creators especially whose information was exposed the echo matt: we knew it was lucrative -- exposed? matt: we knew it was lucrative for some. $10 million a year to some of the top accounts. we knew you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars, but that is the upper crust. certainly a lucrative business for those who have a following on the platform. emily: we will stay tuned. thanks for the update. andy jassy says videogames in
the meantime could end up being the company's largest entertainment business. this is a bold announcement for a company that has had almost a decade of failures in gaming until now. amazon's new hit is a game called new worlds which now has several million active players every day. coming up, bringing what -- how alphabet is experimenting with drone delivery in australia. this is bloomberg. ♪
subsidiary experimenting with launching its aircraft from the roof of an australian mall. so far, wings has been working with businesses selling sushi, juice and drinks. a pharmacy has started to sell medicine and other items. the boom in e-commerce sales has made a unicorn out of a utah started. saturn helps people manage. the firm says it has raised $225 million at valuation of about $2 billion. they started selling refrigerator magnets on amazon. activist investor jana partners calling for macy's to spin off its e-commerce business. the chain could follow the lead of saks fifth avenue in separating the e-commerce unit. similar valuation, macy's business could be worth $14 billion. as a whole, macy's current valuation is half that. coming up, getting paid to play games.
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emily: welcome back. the play to earn revolution is here. the blockchain videogame company behind -- infinity just raised $152 million. how is crypto changing the way we play and earn money? that's talk about it with arianna simpson. there are other options today to make money over the summer, not just mowing lawns. talk to us about how you see crypto changing the way we play games and how we earn money. >> i think the key thing to keep in mind with axie infinity is that it is not just the fastest
growing crypto game, but it has created a movement. it is bringing millions of people into crypto and crypto games. what is powerful about what is happening is the game is allowing people to earn. it is disrupting what we have seen in traditional games where players are producing value, allowing platforms to grow and generate revenue, but they are not actually participating in the upside. axie infinity has turned that on its head. emily: talk to us about this company in particular and why you're so excited about it? >> axie infinity is an incredible testament to the power of entrepreneurs running through -- working through
different cycles and having a strong vision of what they want to bring to market. what is happening here is historically crypto has been a tough thing to get into. it has a fairly high barrier to entry. often it appeals to mainly technical audiences. what is happening with axie is you have these -- this fun game with these little things that look like pokemon, and people can come in and play. there are different battle games and things you can do in the universe. but, there is a whole group of people now actually earning a living. that is an incredibly unique thing we have seen here. that is what is happening at the core of the movement, folks are being onboard it into crypto for the first time, they are earning money. we have seen incredible growth across south east asia, but globally, people are starting to play the game in lieu of their
traditional forms of employment. this kicked off during the pandemic, during lockdowns when many were put out of work. in reality, it is continuing even now and it is giving people opportunities economically they never had before. that is what this is about. emily: you recently led around for the indian crypto unicorn coin switch, how big is the reach of axie and this play to earn model? >> we think all of these projects and companies, axie infinity, coin switch, are global in nature. crypto is starting to touch all corners of the planet. we are seeing incredible growth across sectors. emily: as the world moves toward web 3.0, how does that change the nature of investing?
>> the way we think about it is eventually crypto will become a part of the technology staff that touches everything. in the same way there used to be web companies, and now all businesses use the internet, whether or not they are what we would traditionally consider internet companies. we think the components of the crypto stack are going to become part of all companies. it will be a core piece of the technology future across sectors. emily: as blockchain gains ground, there are calls for regulation. we still don't have regulation -- we still don't know what
regulation for crypto will look like. what do you think it will look like? >> we encourage regulators to think about the policy. we have built out a policy of regulatory teams to address these issues. we want to make sure is happening is that the rules of the road are clearly spelled out so entrepreneurs can follow them and so that policy makes sense. all of crypto are not identical compass of the rules should make sense for the parts of the sector they are meant to identify rather than being blanketed and not particularly tailored. emily: sam altman -- you have
backed his idea to swap crypto for an eyeball scan. >> we can't comment on rumors. it is up to entrepreneurs to tell their stories when they are ready. we can say we are excited about the future of crypto and technology in general. we as a firm are particularly excited to back big ideas. this certainly sounds like a big idea. emily: arianna simpson. we appreciate you taking the time to join us in painting the picture of this brave new world. all right. coming up, some new eco-friendly -- information on energy-efficient appliances, google is working to make your everyday routine green. we speak with kate brandt coming up next. this is bloomberg. ♪
emily: the next time you look up directions on google maps, 8 -- will pop up showing you the most fuel-efficient route. or, you you might get served the most energy efficient option. these are part of the series introduced by google to steer people towards environmentally friendly choices. joining us for a closer look is kate brandt, google's chief sustainability officer. talk to us about the significance of these new
initiatives and what impact you hope they will have. >> interest in sustainable action is at an all-time high. we know people are looking to make more sustainable choices. last year, as part of our third decade of climate action at google, we committed to help one billion people make new sustainable choices by 2022. he found one of the biggest obstacles was that people don't have the information or tools necessary. this is where we feel like our products can come in. today, we announced new features across search, maps and travel, we are hoping we get people aware of more fuel-efficient
routes or appliances, and making it easier to score clean energy from home. the best way for us to be helpful is to make the sustainable choice the easiest choice. >> how will you identify the most fuel-efficient dryer? is google doing its own research? >> when it comes to google shopping, we are showing people, when they are going to make a large purses -- purchase like a furnace or a water heater, we are giving them the helpful information on ways they can find solutions that are more cost-effective and sustainable. those suggestions will appear in the search function, then people can click to learn more. emily: you have maps, waze, how do you determine the most fuel-efficient route? one of the other features launched is eco-friendly routing. often times find the fastest route is also the most fuel-efficient. when it is not, we will now show you have a more efficient route is available at help you
understand the impact so you can choose if an eco-friendly option works for you. making this change can save an equivalent amount of carbon to taking 200,000 cars off the road every year. emily: talk about how you're going to quantify this, how will you measure success? >> for us, this is all about making the sustainable choice the easier choice. we want to ensure we are reaching people, but we want to quantify the impact. i mentioned with eco-routes, we are looking at equivalent reaction to taking 200,000 cars off the road. we also have the -- learning service which has saved eight billion kilowatts of energy, and that's before the announcement today of our new feature that is going to help people automatically switch heating and cooling to times of day when energy is cleaner.
emily: i am curious if at some point you might disclose -- i don't believe you share that number, and how it impacts the power grid. >> no news today, but certainly it has been a darling of our sustainability product line for a long time. i think it is a powerful way to show both impact and to give people opportunities to save energy and to save money on utility bills. it has been a great product for a long time, but for the new future we are excited about an energy shift and we are also excited about premium which lets people match their use with credits from the same projects in google's portfolio for $10 a month. emily: the fcc's laser ring in on greenwashing. what does google want to see the
sec do there? you've got companies out there claiming these green initiatives that may be are not as green or as helpful as they appear to be. >> we think it is critical to drive positive impact and choice. everything we have announced today is all about giving people helpful information and making it easier and really putting those useful features in our products in ways that provide that option. whether it is fuel-efficient, we think it is useful to have useful information. emily: we've got top 26 coming up, every year, google seems to be trying to move the ball forward. where do you hope google will be by 2030 when it comes to all of
these initiatives you are putting into place? >> -- 26 is an important moment on the calendar. we were proud today for our ceo to join 28 other ceos in the business for glasgow letter showing support for businesses. at google, we are laser focused, with our goal to reach carbon free energy for our operations by 2030, and the nearer term goal to enable sustainable actions by 2022. today's announcements are just the beginning. emily: kate brandt, google's chief sustainability officer. thanks for joining us. kathy would -- shifting to florida. arck is moving to st. petersburg. it has prompted companies to rethink expensive business hubs like new york and san francisco.
emily: general motors plans to double revenue as is expands electric vehicles. and push it into subscription based services in its cars. david westin caught up with mary barra. >> it is measured by selling more electric vehicles in the united states than anyone else. the way we will do that is with a full portfolio of products built off our platform. starting with the hummer, the lyric, the silverado e and more trucks to follow, and also
affordable entries that allow everyone at different price points and needing different features to buy a general motors electric vehicle. david you have emphasized affordability. can you do that and make the margins you have in mind for general motors? >> with the scale that general motors has, we get the -- we leverage the science ticket the cost of the battery cells down. yes. we have a plan. that is why we are confident that as we move forward through the end the decade we are going to see margin growth. >> i want to skip over the silverado, everyone has been waiting for this and we have seen pictures. you're going to have a formal unveiling at the beginning in a year.
why it glass roof? >> because we can. you see the entire silverado-e, you're going to see what doing a truck off an all electric platform, not trying to retrofit, opens up new functionality. i think the silverado-e will be a very strong performing truck. it is can i bring new buyers into the market, into general motors' portfolio. >> i am here in washington because of what is going on on capitol hill. give me a sense of general motors needs from the government. the budget proposal being kicked around includes serious money for charging stations. do you need that for general motors to be a true leader in electric vehicles? >> we are investing in infrastructure but we think the federal government is gonna play an important part. we need to make sure that someone who only owns one
vehicle, who may live somewhere where they do not have designated parking, to have access to reliable charging. that is going to enable them to buy an electric vehicle. we think it is a partnership between business and government to make sure we provide that infrastructure across the country. in addition, we want to make sure we see the revisions to the tax credit. currently, it penalizes first movers in the way it was originally constructed. >> so you do need help from the government? >> we think that is can accelerate ev adoption. we think that is an important part of accomplishing the president's goals from a climate change perspective and that will expedite the adoption of ev's. when we have a full portfolio with many entries at different
price points, we are well-positioned. >> one thing we talked about before, we think of general motors as a car company, but you see it as a platform company. some of your announcements go to the software that can be put in this platform. talk about ultra cruise. >> if i start with looking at what our platform gives us, this platform can do not only a full range of electric vehicles, but other markets, other transportation type vehicles. on top of that, the vehicle intelligence platform allows for over the air updates to almost any part of the vehicle. now we are launching -- which gives us a platform we can offer services and subscriptions like super cruise. it is not just the vehicle, but it can be a thing you use on demand with a subscription. we are excited about the business we are unlocking. we feel general motors has moved from being an automaker to being a platform innovator. the vehicle itself has become a software defined vehicle that is going to -- revenue at different margins and serves the customer. emily: david westin with gm ceo
mary barra. jeff bezos just skipped ahead for an electric vehicle. meridian shifted its focus in the past month away from its own consumer cars to prioritize building delivery vans for amazon. according to sources, the e-commerce giant is a priority. a big part of its valuation is based on the e-commerce giant's investments. ed ludlow is here with this coup. a lot of people want to know when they can get one. nobody wants to sit on a multiyear long waiting list. what is going on? ed: they are running this three
ring circus where it has its own pickup and suv and the amazon man trying to happen at the same time. now it is kind of running at a steady rate. sources tell us rivian's shifting resources to amazon because frankly amazon is one of its biggest investors. this is an important order amazon has made. we understand 300 will be delivered this year and the rest of the 100,000 in the next decade. there is a lot of pressure and they can't do it all at once. we are hearing now that amazon is the priority. emily: tell us about how amazon and jeff bezos got into them because it made a difference to the company's future prospects. ed: in 2018, rivian was in stealth mode. they hired a production company to film some video. pete berg contracted with blackhawk aviation, owned by lauren sanchez and they shot this material that was designed to be shown at the l.a. auto show that no member when rivian
would have its big reveal. this kind of happened organically. you had the film production crew doing a lot of work with rivian, bezos and his girlfriend, just organically through these people he knew, it got back to him that he had to check out this startup. in due course, amazon did its diligence. bezos flew to rivian's facility and was sold on this vision. the rest is history. emily: where does rivian now sit in amazon's plans? ed: when bezos made this announcement in 2019 about how amazon was going to move forward reducing emissions, rivian was the centerpiece. 100,000 delivery vans.
but the agreement between the two is amazon's exclusive rights to all the trucks they billed for four years. it has the right of first refusal for six years. it stacks in amazon's favor, but amazon buys gas vans from ford and mercedes. it will be interesting to see if they stick with rivian. in any event, rivian is the poster child of what amazon wants to do. -- amazon wants to do. emily: rivian's event -- valuation, does that stand up? ed: $80 billion for a pre-revenue company was -- anyway, but it is all about amazon's investment. emily: great in-depth piece on rivian and their relationship with amazon. that doesn't this edition of bloomberg technology.
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