tv Bloomberg Daybreak Australia Bloomberg May 1, 2022 6:00pm-7:00pm EDT
haidi: very good morning, welcome to "bloomberg daybreak australia." i'm haidi stroud-watts in sydney. we are counting down to asia's world market open. >> good evening. i'm kathleen hays. a big leap for central-bank, the feds expected to push 50 basis point rate hikes. haidi: china's latest covid-19
outbreak leads to lockdowns and a decrease in economic activity. kathleen: warren buffett goes on his biggest stock buying spree in at least a decade undeterred by geopolitical turmoil. let's take a look at wall street. it was a bad day. it was a bad week. it was a bad month. stocks nosedived across the board. let's take a look. s&p 500 index, now you are looking at the futures could close down about 3.5%. after that kind of a loss, you see a bit of a rebound. the nasdaq also moving up after losing more than 4% on friday, amazon down 14%. that's its worst quarterly loss in years. it had a negative or not so positive outlook. that's what got investors going on nasdaq, apple, intel, and more. as for the 10-year note, it's about 6.5 basis points, 2.8 9%,
after the biggest increase in wages and benefits at the employment cost index on record. we are continuing to see losses. the close on friday about 2.93. nymex crude actually fell friday dragged down by a 20% drop in u.s. oil contract. for the month up, 4.5% in april. the fifth monthly jump, the longest since january 2018. look at the stock market indexes. what we are seeing here is redefining ugly. for the s&p 500, the turquoise bar, down 8.8% in april, the worst in -- since march 2020. that's the worst start for the s&p 500 since 1939, the beginning of world war ii. the nasdaq, down more than 13% in april. the worst month since the
beginning of the pandemic. the dow down a mere 5% on the month, but april is usually a good month. people usually pick up from the first quarter and start buying. not happening this time. haidi: it may be just as well that we have most asian markets closed for holidays. take a look at the markets. we are seeing kiwi stocks up by 4/10 of 1%. futures in sydney showing quite a bit cut down. early decline of 1.3% is what we are seeing after we saw the big fall in u.s. stocks, particularly when it comes to the slump in tech shares. we continue to see the aussie dollar coin back, some of the losses in the last few days as we enter our be. we have most of the market and the majority of economists banking on the first hike since 2010. 13 out of 21 economists see the 15 basis point move to about one
quarter of a percent. the aussie 10 year yield is holding steady, but also watching for dollar-yen. a big week when it comes to trading for the yen into the wednesday fed decision which could, if we see the strength in the greenback, see further weakness beyond that level. it will be a holiday thinned trading session. the may 1 labor day holiday affects a number of markets including china. we had that disappointing weekend. we continue to talk about the covid zero strategy in china and how that is impacting the economic situation, economic outlook and inflation situation. not just supply chain issues affecting the rest of the world but also the issue of domestic demand. the other thing that's interesting is the role that
they yuan one place in the emerging markets basket. typically we see that contagion effect, not just the demand for emerging markets but also the affects when it comes to emerging market currencies. kathleen: it's interesting. so far, the china pmn -- pmi can get over the services collapsing. i don't think anyone expects it to slow down the fed. china's economy is weakening. the fed is expecting to hike the key rate of 50 basis points wednesday. our colleague craig torres has been watching the federal reserve as long as i have and he said what we may get from powell on wednesday after the press conference is a sense that if anything, they will speed things up. larry myers was a former fed governor and he was around in the 90's. he points out once you get started fighting high inflation, you cannot pause. you don't start slowing you down.
we have the employment cost index. for that number, that is high, the highest on record. the day before the personal consumption expenditures, consumer spending looked strong. the fed's key gauge up to 6.6% year-over-year. the things we will look at this week and the fed meeting tuesday. haidi:haidi: let's get more on what to expect from the fed. we have bloomberg's chief correspondent. big implications, particularly when you look out dollar-yen at the moment. what are you watching out for in the main trade that will be affected? >> currency is very much a major part of the picture. as long as the fed is being aggressive as it is seen as being, you are going to get continued vulnerability for pretty much every major currency
and minor currency out there. part of what the fed is doing is saying effectively, especially because it will raise rates, it will raise the cost of dollars, the holding dollars. it is also going to -- announce quantitative tightening which will dry out some of the supply of dollars effectively. the law of supply and demand here. supply shock as it was for the currency complex, that address currencies up, drives yields up, and to full circle as we come around to equities that are well above normal level, also above valuations. even if we start to get back to historical valuations for equities, that might not be the end of declines because after
all, we are not in a good state when it comes to inflation's being generated by the pandemic era supply shops and the were in ukraine and slower growth being generated by the were in ukraine and what is going on in china. equities, it is hard to argue the idea that equities are vulnerable to major decline. it feeds back into everything else, especially in an environment where we were just talking about the fed likely to be very aggressive, because once it starts wanting to fight inflation, it will hike and hike and hike again. haidi: our chief correspondent for rates, garfield reynolds flagging the risks headed into this week. a lot of risk in australia as well with policymakers deciding whether to raise rates in the middle of a highly charged election campaign. let's bring out our economic correspondent. highly unusual, but the rba is
stuck in a hard place. can they afford to wait? swati? >> hi, good morning. can you replete -- repeat the question please? haidi: so it's pretty unusual to get a rate hike cycle to begin, particularly at the beginning of a major election campaign. but if you look at what the markets are pricing in, can the field afford to wait? >> the case for rates have increased and it happened very suddenly after last week's inflation that showed a big rise. analysts were anyway expecting a big increase, but the inflation reports had the path of expectations and that led markets and economists to change their view on when the bank will begin the rate tightening cycle. tomorrow is expecting a live meeting and rba is expected to
start with baby steps. 15 basis points. not expecting a supersized jumbo hike like other parts of the world. it will be the start of the tightening cycle for the first time since 2010. kathleen: certainly something the markets will take note of. that's our economic reporter in sydney. now time to move on to china's economic look in sydney. covid-19 restrictions hitting harder beijing pushing ahead, especially over the holiday weekend. bloomberg's managing editor for global business joins us. bloomberg intelligence people point out that the numbers, as bad as they are, don't include the impact of the shanghai lockdowns even the dates of the surveys. >> we are really just about the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the impact of the lockdowns.
of course we had the much shorter but still locked down in shenzhen before shanghai. we have beijing teetering on the rink. we saw more restrictions on the weekend and they are holding off on a lockdown. definitely this is the theme this year when it comes to china's economy, how and where the lockdowns are increasingly -- and increasingly restrictive measures held in china. haidi: emma o'brien, bloomberg's managing editor for asia global business. we take a look at how that plays out at the start of trading here in sydney. let's get the first word headlines now. u.s. house speaker nancy pelosi met ukraine's president volodymyr zelenskyy on saturday in an unannounced visit to kyiv. lucy said this sends a message to the world that america -- pelosi said this sends a message to the world that america stands
with ukraine. zelenskyy says moscow is stepping up attacks in the east of the country. >> we are visiting you to say thank you for your fight for freedom, and that your fight is a fight for every person, and so our commitment is to be there for you until the fight is done. haidi: german chancellor olaf scholz plans to invite the indian prime minister narendra modi as a special guest to the g7 meeting next month.new delhi is yet to join with the allies and sanctioning moscow over the war in ukraine. olaf scholz is posting modi in berlin monday. they are also said to be preparing invites to south africa and indonesia. macau's gaming slump deepened with revenue plunging, the lowest in about 18 months. the world's biggest gambling hub is suffering from droughts.
chinese holidays have traditionally been a peak season for the enclave. the five-day labor day holiday is set to be a washout with virus restrictions and shanghai, beijing, and elsewhere. warren buffett's berkshire hathaway is on its biggest bank street -- buying spree since 2008. they also included boosting its stake in chevron and revealing it holds a 9% stake in activision blizzard. buffett gave no indication he will setback back anytime soon as berkshire held their first in person meeting since 2019. those are your first word headlines. kathleen: still ahead, tribeca's estimates say inflation levels require more rate hikes, but over tightening is a risk. jun bei liu joins us next. this is bloomberg. ♪
kathleen: it's going to be a huge week for monetary policy. let's take a look at the main events in the next few days. investors keeping a close watch on the fed with economists expecting jerome powell and company to pull the trigger on a 50 basis point rate hike. they are also expected to announce the $9 trillion balance sheet. just beyond, the u.s. jobs report friday forecast to show a robust gain of about 400,000 last month. in the u.k., the bank may opt for a fourth back to back hike so bloomberg economics expects a more cautious central bank after that. haidi: the rba may preempt all of that with their own rate hike tuesday, the first since 2010. most economists, 13 out of 21 money markets expecting the increase. there is a small minority seeing the 40 basis point move. this could jolt election campaigning with less than three weeks to go until the federal elections.
those are your major events in the week ahead. kathleen: let's bring out our next guest. haidi: she said the fed could make a policy mistake and over tighten. joining us is jun bei liu, portfolio manager at tribeca investment partners. there's a risk that inflation could be persistent and they will need to have a longer tightening cycle. >> absolutely. and we have seen what the inflation numbers have's been in the last six months as well as the broadening out of the inflation stance across all the categories. that is a problem really for those central banks so they need to do it fast and soon. we do expect that to take place around the world, whether australia or globally. haidi: how are you never getting the risk skewed to the outside at the moment? >> for the equity market, the current environment, there is
high volatility in the like, but really just returning to a normal volatility. at the same time, underlying corporate earnings, not too bad for some economies like australia. and we are still looking at taking out the resources limited single-digit corporate earnings growth, which is not too bad. i think the equity market at this point is yet to really price in recession risks yet. we are really still into the cyclical earnings and the companies that will benefit from the rising rates. kathleen: ok. i will jump in now. it seems to me that this is so much priced in. i feel like some of the big investment banks are having a race to predict the most aggressive fed tightening. deutsche bank thinking the rates will go up to 5% or 6%. i'm sure they don't mean in the next couple years, but over time. what is aggressive now compared
to people saying we can get to 75 races point baked -- base hikes in a row, which i've not heard any professional fed watcher predict? >> it always seems to be a race when we start the tightening circle, a race for everyone to have the highest expectations. if you look at the short-term or near term, the inflation risk is quite real. as we talked to inflations across many categories, we need to keep that down. central banks need to move fast. it is very real they will get the interest rate to a more neutralized level, which is closer to 2%. beyond that, it really depends on what does that do to inflation and whether that slows down the activity. there's a lot of uncertainty as we head toward this. meanwhile, we are certainly going to see aggressive moves. kathleen: how aggressive do you think the rba will get?
heidi just mentioned, 40 basis point hike, it seems like an outlier, but how far and fast will this go? it is still a lot lower than anything you see in the united states, for example. >> absolutely. first addressing inflation, australian inflation is below others partly because the labor forces are structurally different from the likes of the u.s. labor force were two thirds are under words that would take longer to come through. secondly, the economy is still going through reopening given the lockdown rules. it will take longer, however rba has seen what the other central banks are dealing with and they have a roadmap to follow. whether they will raise the rates this month, a bit of a coin toss. it is very close to the elections. but we do feel in the coming
months, they will be aggressive to get that ahead. haidi: china. the impact of the lockdown is becoming increasingly clear if you look at the pmi numbers. how does that potentially impact risk aversion and the sentiment? >> it does present quite significant risk at this point. actually, potentially a real risk. at the moment when you talk to the equity markets, equity markets still feel reasonably confident that the global voice is still reasonably intact and we will not see recession in the next 12 months, but if china will slow down significantly, that theory will be tested. we do believe however this is a smaller chance. we do think the policy support is coming through. we've seen in the last few weeks some of the commentary. we think hopefully by at some
point, we will see that lockdown get lifted. kathleen: the covid virus at self will -- itself will determine the speed of a lot of that. jun bei liu, thank you for joining us, tribeca investment's portfolio manager. you can look at our interactive function tv . you can dive into the securities or functions we talk about on the shows and become part of the conversation. you can send us instant messages during the shows as well. this is for bloomberg subscribers only, so check it out at tv . this is bloomberg. ♪
haidi: after complaining for years that high valuations were thwarting his stock buying efforts, warren buffett's berkshire hathaway is back buying company shares. this is the first in person meeting we've had in quite some time. what did we hear? >> buffett held his first in person meeting from 2019. thousands of shareholders flocked to omaha this weekend to hear him speak. they spoke for hours. one of the most surprising things is he was really back in action. we got confirmation with first-quarter earnings. he was the biggest net buyer of stock we have seen in years.
honestly in data going back to 2008. kathleen: he really loaded up on chevron, which he already held, activision with the microsoft acquisition. what is the message here? aren't we seeing this classic warren buffett as we did in the great financial crisis when nobody was buying, things are beaten up and he jumped in and bought? that is classic, right? do you think it sends a signal to investors who all they want to do now is exit? >> it is definitely classic buffet. i think he needed it. stock valuations are high and he's looking for misplaced opportunity so he needs that volatility to shake it out in the market and he got that this past quarter. he loaded up on chevron, that's now 25.9 billion. the activision bet which is now 9.5% of the company is a
arbitrage play he outlined on saturday. it's really interesting because i do think it shows that yes, he has a lot of money to work with and he hasn't been putting it work buying stock and other companies for a little bit now. now he's really back and i think it shows we might be getting the shakeout that helps value investors. haidi: our finance reporter there. we do have breaking news out of qantas at the moment. project sunrise is back on, targeting the end of 2025 for the first directed new york to sydney flights. these direct flights from australia into the u.s. and u.k. had been put on hiatus during the pandemic. they are also announcing a major aircraft purchase from airbus for these direct new york flights as well as a number of domestic fleet renewals with smaller aircraft being planned. 94 purchase orders spread out
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kathleen: you were watching "bloomberg daybreak: australia." uss speaker nancy pelosi met ukraine president volodymyr zelenskyy on saturday during an unannounced visit to kyiv. it sent a message to the world that america stands firmly with the green. you get the highest official to travel to the country since the reservation. zelenskyy says moscow is stepping up attack to the east of the country. -- attacks in the east of the country. >> we say thank you.
[indiscernible] our commitment to be there for you into the fighting is done. kathleen: german chancellor olaf scholz plans to invite indian prime minister modi is a special guest in a push to isolate russia. new delhi as you get to join western allies in sanctioning moscow over his war in ukraine. olaf scholz is hosting prime minister modi on monday. germany is also said to be repairing it abides for south africa and indonesia. china's economic activity contracted sharply in april as covid-19 restrictions hit hard. factory appointed the lowest level in more than two years. official pmi figure following -- falling to 49.5 in march, anything below 50 signals contraction. the first set of data reflects
impacted consumer spending. shanghai is keeping strict virus measures in place despite falling cases. aging found 59 new cases on saturday, up from 54 the previous day and has activated a makeshift hospital. the universal studios theme park in the capital as been closed temporarily. the company's revenue plunged into the low whistle in 18 months, the biggest gambling hub is suffering from a tourist route -- drought. the five day labor day holiday look said to be a washout with a virus restrictions in shanghai, beijing, and elsewhere. global news 24 hours a day, on air and on quicktake by bloomberg, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in over 120 countries. haidi: intel says it will raise its key technical milestone
earlier than planned that will help the chipmaker gain attention -- gain its edge. >> near-term markdowns, we are starting to see the port opening up, we are getting positive news in china, which is challenging for apple. overall, the big story is around building up semi conductor capacity, and we felt like 2023 we would start to see equilibrium. in no small part because of equipment shortages, the equipment that goes into what we are building, we are seeing leadtimes which are substantially, and as a result we expect the overall semi conductor shortage to not be resolved until 2024 as capacities come online. that said, we feel like we are better positioned than most, the combination of our internal capacity as well as our leverage of foundries, we are better
positioned, and that is part of the structural advantage that intel has. we are working very closely with equipment vendors to make sure all of these major new factories are smart capital, we build the shelves and fill them with capacity as demand signals emergent that we are on track, and we feel like we will do better than the rest of the industry in supply requirements. >> i know you are bullish on the pc market and i'm curious what makes you think it will remain strong as we come out of the pandemic, given that we are facing inflation and ongoing war, rising gas prices and more pressure on consumers that we have seen in a long time. >> the range of the pc market outlooks was wide, and now it is quite narrow, all of the nss -- analysts and oem's confirm this, it is a structurally larger markets.
refresh rates, essential role that it plays, we see the pc market as a larger market, and as i emphasized we are way overdue on a commercial refresh, windows 11, and i would say about one million pcs a day, everyone is in a tight range around that. haidi: that is pat gelsinger speaking with emily chang. take a look at the commodities plate at the moment to start out this week, we continue to have the demand as well as supply side pressures playing. we are seeing pullback when it comes to wheat contracts both for winter and spring. expectations of grain, that is seeing a little more recent spite -- respite. corn unchanged at the moment,
for july touching the highest level since august 2012. it did also pull back on gains in the chicago trading session. we have seen this huge rally in corn along with oil seed prices risking raising further food cost that have already had a global record and feeding so much into that inflation story globally as well. robert bates saying corn is entering rarefied demand, and they lifted the outlook for average prices in the second quarter. watching soybeans, soy oil as been an interesting story of dropping to another all-time high. take a look at new york crude, new to trading in this session, there is still some confusion as to the impact of sanctions there. at the moment we are seeing a calm picture when it comes to crude prices. kathleen: let's get right to a
mining and commodities analyst at commonwealth bank. it has been such a beginning of the year for oil. fifth month in a row for gains in the month of april. it just keeps moving and moving and moving. is this as high as oil goes? with china's lockdown driven or intensified slow down, is that further chip away at the demand for oil? this will be as high as it gets. >> sure, it is a great question in terms of where we are in the market. we saw all of the geopolitics and discretion -- disruption lead to the russia-ukraine conflict. when we talk about what happened more recently with china anti-lockdown's, we are talking 1%, 1.5% of global oil demand
effectively being cut up because of china covid lockdowns. when we are talking about supply disruptions it is key to look at what is happening with russia oil supply. in april itself that is down 1% of the markets too. we have seen relative balancing between supply and demand shocks. when we talk about what is going to happen through the year, we are going to see the physical market likely tighten as more and more rich in supply gets curtailed. the real caveat to this is can we see india and china come in and buy more russian crude? europe will move away from crude throughout 2022. the physical market story is not over yet. we have come to a point where supply and demand disruptions have downside for now, but when we talk about what is going to happen through the year, watch physical markets, russian supply
and it was a good risk markets tighten. kathleen: in a recent note you said you thought on brent crude, i believe you are referring to crude that the top would be $110 in the second quarter and weaker in the fourth quarter. have you changed your mind at all as the war drags on? how that goes? i'm asking if you thought we were near the top because of brent crude tops out at $110 and we are at $109 we are near the top. >> in terms of the picture that is involved, i think the key changed our outlook was just how quickly we would see the eu come in and look to reduce their imports from russia, because that is the key caveat in terms of how markets will look in the next few months. if we see in europe look aggressively away from russian oil and they have to collect oil
elsewhere, we could see the benchmark outside of russia tighten considerably, and that is something that was not in the forecast for q2 and q3. that is the risk in the market right now. in terms of market price is off by the end of this year, i would say it is looking at eight u.s. oil story, can we see u.s. oil supply,, can we see enough demand disruption for markets to rebound by the end of the year? when we talk about the next few months, i am keeping a very close eye on this german report that by the end of summer they may be ok without russian oil imports. that is a very aggressive move for the next few months. haidi: the weakening demand pays as china, looking at this chart that shows deepening contracted we are seeing but the manufacturing as well as nonmanufacturing. pmi numbers came in dire,
manufacturing and nonmanufacturing gains falling to two year lows. the fact that the covid 19 zero strategy but also of these lockdowns were not really part of the peace either when it comes to expectations were china, aldous that play into the demand side of the story? -- how does that play into the demand side of the story? >> it is critical when you talk about base metals and about commodities, eagerly iron ore. these lockdowns have hurt demand sentiment. the redeeming picture and one the markets are looking for to is i will china achieve its targets via infrastructure spending and trying to provide relief to the property sector? both of been mentioned in quarterly meetings from friday onward. we certainly have some color
that we are going to see demand rebound. the question is that only really happen once these lockdowns and. for us, that is a second half story, but that will be a key story in terms of that price increase of the second half of this year. haidi: it is interesting, because copper, aluminum, we saw the initial reaction to the pledge to boost economic stimulus and activity, right? but the gains did not hold. what i markets looking for when it comes to conviction? >> so you want to see action, and right now we are seeing a big announcement of infrastructure, but you can only get that activity on the ground happening once we see disruptions to mobility, is covid-19 lockdowns, and you saw that in the pmi, if you saw the
nonconstruction component of pmi, that drop sharply last month, and that tells you it is important to get infrastructure projects delivered. our view is that shanghai will probably see the worst of it, and coming into beijing at what we see coming forward, could we see these covid-19 restrictions ease? could this be, is april going to be the worst, and i think it will get better from here. if that is the outlook, the second half is going to be a positive period for chinese commodity consumption. kathleen: the chinese leadership is going to decide if they suffer this up. the dollar is climbing steadily, it stalled out ahead of the fed reserve meeting. how do you factor the dollar's path into your outlook for commodities? >> sure, so when it comes to
financially linked commodities, base metals and oil, the rising u.s. dollar is a negative force. what we have seen play out is there are other factors, whether that is the russia supply issue what is going to happen in china, that is provided a more dominant force on commodity prices then say what is happening with the u.s. dollar. whether it is primary, secondary, tertiary, right now it is looking to be more in the background could we talk about key commodities right now. kathleen: so, if you were going to invest -- if i were going to invest -- if i want to make commodities -- money on commodities right now, how do i do it? warren buffett just took a decent chevron stake. what is a play here for people who think that this is going to
last and they want to invest in it? >> sure, it really depends on horizons if you aren't looking at what is going to happen in the next 10 years and this transition that we are talking about, we are really going to see it investment in base metals. hopper, for instance -- copper, for instance, until 2030 we are talking a 25% increase in copper supply. if we have to hit 1.5 degree targets by 2030 we need to see copper supply go up by 40%. how well-positioned is the market to supply extra copper given that these ambitions are increasing? copper and nickel are the larger markets. lithium has shown its part in terms of how much is needed. prices fairly indicate that.
when you look at fossil fuels, if your outlook is over the next four years, four years, natural gas, those markets look underinvested in if you think how europe is going to cut itself away from russia. gas markets look to be very tight for the foreseeable future , and lng prices are likely going to be elevated relative to what they are years ago. fossil fuels offer opportunity in the near term, but if you are talking long-term certainly based metals. haidi: great to have you with us, vivek dhar. we have lots more to come here on "bloomberg daybreak: australia." this is bloomberg. ♪
is a very important event in the world, people call it the fight for freedom and democracy, etc. in terms of where it is now, we are going into the fourth month, the u.s. is looking at a $33 billion package. how does it fit into the big picture specifically when it comes to the markets? >> what we have to recall about this is it does send a very powerful signal to putin and the wider world and the u.s. audience here, because she is the highest ranked american official to go to ukraine since the invasion. it does play into the rhetoric about biden trying to get that $33 billion in aid to ukraine.
biden is also trying to get congress to sign off on the ability to seize more property from some of putin's allies. a very high-profile visit to ukraine at such a sensitive time, it does send a reasonable message, and it shows that the biden administration is serious when it comes to being on ukraine's side. we are still waiting for any concrete developments from it. there are a lot of punchy words spoken, but investors, if you want to drill down to what the visit means, it means are we a step closer to biden getting authority for this mammoth package from congress? haidi: we are also seeing germany make mimetic efforts to try to bring india into the fold. is the invitation for prime
minister modi, is that effort likely to succeed? where are we at when it comes to the international alliance? >> that is right, scholz and modi are in talks in berlin on monday, and we fully expect that there will be an official invitation for modi to join the g7 meeting in june. it is all part of a broader plan by the anti-putin alliance to isolate russia further. you have to recall india or modi has not been especially forthcoming and it comes to condemning the invasion of ukraine. modi has always been one for supporting calls for a cease-fire, calling for a diplomatic solution.
even india actually, they abstained at the u.n. on a vote condemned the invasion. scholz is leading the push at the moment to try to get modi on that. a couple of weeks ago we had johnson in india, so everyone wants to get modi on side of this aspect. haidi: james ludden with the latest on the geo-political situation with the russian invasion of ukraine. take a look at the bond markets trading regionally, big week when it comes to not just treasuries but regional bonds as well. we have the highly anticipated fed decision, will they sit beside her move and what impact is that likely to across other central banks that are also looking at making tightening cycle decisions, including the rba interview.
21 economists surveyed expecting a 15 basis point move to .25 of 1%. even if you bets that we will see a supersized move. we are seeing stability in bond markets this morning, but that 10 year bond yield has been coming under upside pressure, the high since 2014. plenty more ahead on "daybreak." this is bloomberg. ♪
haidi: qantas has robbed its plans to provide nonstop flights from the east coast and london to sydney. someone actually went on that test flight, it was 19.5 hours from sydney to new york. he said it was hard to not sleep for the first half because it was a lot of exercising and lots of monitoring of your heart rate trying to find a way to be a pure jetlagged issue. would you rather do this flight or break it up? kathleen: i would much rather do the 20 hours for sure. does it make you feel like pandemic is going away? it was better than expected travel. i love what alan joyce said, it
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