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tv   Power Lunch  CNBC  April 19, 2013 1:00pm-2:00pm EDT

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>> welcome back. we are joining unprecedented coverage of the manhunt in the boston bombings. let's go to bertha with what we know. >> the manhunt continues and continues to intensify for
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19-year-old dzhokhar tsarnaev. that chase ended in gunfire in watertown, which has been under lock down since before dawn today. the search of the neighborhood would take time and a few minutes a go in an update they said they have made some progress. >> we are progressing through this neighborhood, going door to door, street to street. we're well over 60 or 70% of what we want to cover up there. we don't have any development to tell you in terms of the search. there has been no apprehension at this point. >> there has been no
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apprehension but the watertown police commissioner also saying that even if and when that scene is cleared, it is an active crime scene. they are sifting through evidence there as well. they are also looking at the home of the two young suspects they have been carefully. they worry that the apartment may be boobie trapped. we are also learning now that the two are of chechenchechen o but they are naturalized citizens. they traveled to russia between january and july of this year. his 19-year-old brother, by all
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accounts friends who knew him said he was an all american kid and on the wrestling team. that campus has also been cleared. at this point, no leads. this morning they said that this was going to take a long time. former new york mayor rudy giuliani said that it's like searching for a needle in a hay stack. 1 million people being told to stay near their homes. greater area of boston. >> let's go to the straight of the heart of what bertha was talking about. scott is live on the ground there. we heard earlier, scott.
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>> that's right. it is difficult to tell exactly what they are doing all morning long. they are searching by air. they are searching on the ground. they have entered homes there is a lot of evidence as well. to take you back to yesterday afternoon, the release of the photos of the two brothers that were taken from cameras at the finish of the marathon, it seems to be, at least if you follow the progression of events that that's what flushed them out. i could hear the sirens as people raced to the scene here. that's when you know it was not just an incident.
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the authorities say they are, as you said, 60% or so done with searching the area. i guess now in the next half hour or so. interesting to note that in that last briefing. they quickly have a lot of their hands.
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>> amtrak has suspended service. i would imagine there is some chaos? >> reporter: i wouldn't call it chaos but there is a lot of people stranded, trying to troubleshoot. vans and cars are hard to rent. we actually talked to one teacher here with a delegation of about ten students. they have to get back to new hampshire and they have no idea what to do. they don't have a hotel for another night and they are having trouble getting a car or a van. so you have a group of people many penn station where they do have stepped up. i would say.
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amtrak train stopped and had originated in boston. they searched it and let it go. >> and our next guest has experience in the hunt with the olympic bomber and with the columbine tragedy. talk with us about the challenges the officers and military face right now as they try and apprehend this man. >> well, i would say that
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logistically, it's a difficult thing to manage, but i would also add that these guys train for this full-time. they know how to protect the public. he is only one and doesn't care about anyone else. law enforcement has an extremely difficult challenge but they are up to it. >> we are showing video of officers going house to house in watertown. can you tell us what's happening as we go into the home, what they're doing and how they're questioning people. >> oh, sure. experience leads them to fully verbalize what they're doing, to assess the people that they're talking to. they're trying to read body signs and body language, i guess it could be that the homeowner doesn't know that the person is in their house or basement or
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shed. so they have about 15, 20, 30 things to think about while they're doing this. it's something that they're used to. >> difficult choices, i would think, given the fact that if indeed you have a homeowner that doesn't know they have a fugitive in their house, i cannot imagine the pressure that these officers and these military people are under when they have to make that choice. and what if this guy has explosives strapped to him. what do they do? how do they make those decisions? >> those choices are ones that they have to consider. the bad guy doesn't have to consider anybody. he is just considering himself and hurting everyone. it is an extremely stressful
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situation. they will keep themselves hydrated. they will keep themselves alert. they rely on each other. so they have got an extreme advantage in terms of numbers. >> it seems there is an extraordinary number of officers in that vicinity. does that make it more difficult to coordinate or not? how is that broken down so that you don't have confusion when, indeed, and if, indeed, they find this guy? >> they train together as different groups consistently, i'm sure. groups train together. there is all sorts of tactics that different teams learn in
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order to protect themselves. but it's a cog aan awareness th drains on them. they need to keep intensity up but they know how to switch out. and that's an advantage against the bad guy as well. they're going to use that endurance advantage to their advantage. >> there is that point, isn't there? of intense mental pressure. >> all right. thank you very much. and kevin, thank you very much for your expertise and your insight. we greatly appreciate it. >> much more of the special
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coverage for the remaining suspect. we will continue first as we go. the uncle of the suspect who lives in maryland speaking to dozens of reporters sending a message to the suspect still at large. >> i say dzhokhar, if you're alive, turn yourself in and ask for forgiveness from the victims of the injuries and for those who left. he put a shame on our family. he put a shame on the entire chechen ethnicity. no they don't. hey son. have fun tonight. ♪ ♪ back against the wall ♪ ain't nothin to me ♪ ain't nothin to me
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>> all right. if you are just joining cnbc, we are continuing our live coverage of the manhunt in watertown, massachusetts. there was a press briefing just a short while ago. officials have canvassed about 60 to 70% of the homes in that area but they are not done. therefore, residents are being asked to shelter in place. the town is on lock down. amtrak has suspended all service between boston and new york city. we will continue to monitor the situation and show you the live briefings. we don't have an exact time but they have promised us another
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press briefing. >> and the story extends all the way to washington. we are live with more on the high-tech part of the manhunt. >> one of the things that we're learning as we watch the fbi release that video last night of the two suspects in the marathon bombing, the amazing advances here that have occurred since the last time we saw one of these major manhunts and particularly in terms of video intelligence. let me talk to you about the facial recognition is identify the shape of the face and all of those features. they can confirm matches. what they do is they scan through large data bases like facebook and youtube. they can go from billions of potential suspects out there in
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the world, billions of potential pictures out there in the world to just a list of thousands of possible matches and that makes it manageable then to take a look at those thousands. this is a very fast growing
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industry. astonishing in this era where so much is taken on video and so many still pictures are out there. we have seen that within the past few hours that with these partial images as we saw the fbi releasing where people have caps on their heads and sunglasses blocking their face they can get a fee parameters. it's quite remarkable, actually, what happened over the past couple years, guys. >> thank you very much. let's bring in our next guest.
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>> the fbi is currently not using automated facial recognition on any type of a large scale. now they do have manually assisted facial recognition methods. they published those methods online. the fbi does this work with the operational technology division. but there is in general, no large scale face recognition search capability available to the fbi or the british government agency to help. >> why is that? why is that? >> a couple of things. performance has not been adequate for the task. it is true that the u.s. government does on a regular basis test the systems.
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the national institute of standards and technology regularly publishes test results on facial recognition technology. those test results are on their website. you can see how well the algorithms do in a variety of situations. a second reason is particularly right now there is no money for research or implementation. >> in this case, the quality of the images may have been an issue. the humans recognized the suspects but maybe there is not enough definition for the algorithms to pick it up? >> you're exactly right. speaker and fingerprint recognition and the like. the standard says you have to
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have 90 pixels of resolution between the two eyes. the pictures that i have been shown have had in the order of 12 pixels or 20 pixels between the eyes. far too little resolution for the algorithms to do any good. >> thank you for joining us, wayne. >> thank you very much. >> simon, before we go to the break, this is a very chilling picture. it was taken just moments before the bombing on monday and you can see 8-year-old martin richard, the boy who has become very much part of the face of this terror event, he is right behind him, you can see circled in red one of the two suspects. martin is circled in blue. right behind him, one of the suspects. chilling picture indeed. we're back in a moment. transit fares! as in the 37 billion transit fares we help collect each year.
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>> we want to show you suspect number two, dzhokhar tsarnaev. it's basically the equivalent of facebook in russia. it's not a facebook product. no connection to facebook here in the united states. just like any other 19-year-old, he was connected with friends on the social media site. you can see his provile picture
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there. he lists his world view is islam. it doesn't seem that he had a lot of activity on his page. the unidentified individual's face is blurred. the new phenomenon is the individuals involved, sue, deeply connected often times, on social media, giving us a window into them. >> they all were so surprised that this guy was the suspect. he also had link s s.
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>> it lists his three language. english and chechan. definitely makes this connection to chechnya, although he was not born there. we are getting more and more social media photos from both the brothers. we will bring them to you as we ca can. we will be right back. mine was earned in djibouti, africa, 2004.
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>> you're watching special live coverage. i'm scott kohn live in watertown, massachusetts. it is concentrated here as
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authorities continue to search this suburb of boston, methodically going house to house, trying to find one of the bombers that did so much damage, caused so much carnage at the boston marathon. and then with his brother, his accomplice, the other bomber, led police on a chase, a shootout, m.i.t. campus police officer killed. another injured. and it culminated here in watertown. and now they are looking for zoe carr tsarnaev, 19 years old, suspect number two, the guy in the white baseball cap caught on video placing a bag that contained a bomb at the boston marathon on monday.
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we know there has been activity entering houses and searching activity. no arrests. we're awaiting yet another news briefing that could happen at any time now at a mall on the other side of the neighborhood that has been the focus of so much of the search here. what they have asked everyone to do, not just in watertown but throughout the area, is to shelter in place, stay indoors. don't open the door for anybody unless you're sure it is a police officer. that is helping the police with their search but they still have not achieved their goal. >> as you can see, we have a lot of moving parts in the.
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>> police have cast a massive dragnet. they say the teenager wanted for the marathon bombing first robbed a convenience store sometime after 10:00. then they were confronted by an m.i.t. police officer, whom they fatally shot. they carjacked an suv a few blocks away and led police on a chase that led to the town of watertown. we're talking about an area of about seven miles altogether. 26-year-old tamarlan tsarnaev opened fire and he was fatally wounded. the state police say they have searched 60 to 70% of that
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watertown area literally going door to door, house by house, and they are pursuing new leads in the suspect's neighborhood in cambridge, where the suspects lived. this afternoon they are expecting to detonate some explosives here. >> at this point, we are going to continue following up in that neighborhood. we have got several other new leads that just developed and we're working on that. >> he said he would have another update this afternoon. we have not yet heard whether that detonation has taken place. but in the meantime you have an entire city on lock down. if you were in new york during 9/11, you know what that was like. you have an entire region on edge. >> absolutely. thank you for the tick by tick there. on the phone, the executive director of the detroit crime commission. former special agent in charge of the fbi's division.
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i understand that you were in charge or very involved in the investigation of the underwear bomber. correct? >> can you tell us what you think is happening in the investigation now? how they are proceeding and what they're trying to do here? >> number one, i got the manhunt. they believe they have him cornered in a situation. the second thing is they are going back and interviewing friends, family, aacquaintances. i'm sure they're looking at online activity. facebook, twitter, chat rooms. what they looked at. what they downloaded, to give them a clearer picture. what caused these guys to act like this. what other connection do they
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have here. >> what does your opinion tell you about this? do you think they acted alone. given the fact that the older brother went to russia for six months. do you think that perhaps there is a broader group involved in this? >> you have got to look at where they're from. you know, chechen rebels did train in the afghan camps, the al qaeda camps, for a number of years. but, you know, they have also flocked against the government. you have got that. what we see over the last years is you don't have to go to a training camp.
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i'm torn on this. until we see the two guys who became disenfranchised, or is there some other bigger thing pushing this? >> simon? you want in on the conversation. >> some young lunatic who wants to make a name of yourself. waiting for the controlled explosion of the house they used to inhabit. is that for sure an indication that they found explosives there or is that being precautionary? >> i think you have got to be very -- you can't jump to conclusions. this may be nothing more than two knuckle heads who became disillusioned with the world. that is the 800 pound elephant in the room. you have to look at that. with respect to the controlled explosions, i would suspect they found something in the houses and they're methodically going to eliminate that threat.
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>> can you tell us when you were vol fed with the fbi what level of cooperation did you get from the russians. >> well, you know, policymakers in this country for a number of years treated that as, you know, like these guys were freedom fighters. the russians have been telling us for years that these guys are radical extremists. i think what you would see is a great deal of cooperation from the russians saying we told you so. >> we have talked to other people who say obviously this is what all of these officers, both military and police officers train for. but given the extraordinary
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amount of firearms that are on the ground now with those people, it seems as though it's an extremely tense situation, obviously. but what is going to happen next? and how do they execute next? >> i think it's a dangerous situation. what is on their mind is personal safety but what is foremost is the safety of civilians. that's what we're trained to do as law enforcement officers and you have to put your life on the line. we all want a quick resolution to this but you have got to do it safety. >> can you walk us through that? just give us an example of the step by step that you do as an individual when you're going into a house? >> they are using tactical teams for most of these, i'm sure.
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you don't just walk up and knock the door open or walk through the front door. there is tactical movements in how you move. they have body bunkers in place. i'm not sure. but it's methodical. slow moving. and you have got to protect yourself and any innocent civilians. >> thank you very much. we appreciate your perspective. a member of the congressional homeland security committee. after a quick break we will get his take on how the investigation is going as cnbc's live and continuing coverage of the hos toj situation continues right here on cnbc. we're live in watertown, massachusetts. it's as simple as this. at bny mellon, our business is investments. managing them, moving them, making them work. we oversee 20% of the world's financial assets. and that gives us scale and insight no one else has. investment management combined with investment servicing.
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>> they continue the search for a suspect in the boston marathon bombings. we know now that roughly 60 to 70% of the town of watertown has
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been searched. it is a door to door search. for some reason they believe that the individual may be there. second, a large chunk of boston remains on lock down at this point, telling people not to go out. most of the schools are closed. additionally, amtrak service from boston to new york has been suspended as part of the investigation. sue? >> so how successful are the various agencies in working together to catch the suspects? >> congressman, welcome. thank you very much for joining us. weigh in on the first. >> there were -- partly because of the on again off again nature of the news conferences, etc. now it seems as though obviously
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things have gelled. >> i think the agencies are working well together. significantly the last 24 hours with the determination to make available specific identities of the two suspects and then you have begun to see the quick activities that have taken place since then. >> you're a former prosecutor? >> that is correct. >> how are they keeping you. >> when you're involved in these things --
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>> it indicates that they continue to develop new information and new responsibilities and activities. there is also a need to be specific about what it is about this day and age, that suspect. >> that's a good point. >> do you think we are realizing the world has changed to the extent that we need to reassess where the resources are put? do we need so many nuclear weapons or aircraft carriers when actually the focus of the nation ends up being on the boston marathon? on the action basically of two
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young men? >> i think you're talking two different kinds of issues. this is also a transformation is here. there is still every bit as dangerous as you can see how it has locked down not just a city but captivated an entire nation. >> go ahead. >> i was going to say. do we know that this is loan wolf? do we know of any connection to chechnya at all? >> no home grown radicalization
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and somebody who is inspired by some kind of jihadist message to carry out an act on behalf of others. >> have we let our guard down along those lines? are we vigilant enough? they succeeded. >> well, how do you begin to measure the right balance of respect for personal privacy? i think the fact that we have been since september 11, 2001, before we have had an incident like this, indicates there has been a remarkable amount of success. no matter what they do, we will never be able to 100% guarantee
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that people can't act out like this in a free osociety. >> so to return to the question that i asked you, should we be spending hundreds of billions of dollars on our defense industries as they are? >> do we need to re-assign those hundreds of billions of dollars .
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>> and we're not going to be able to stop that with a boston police force. >> point taken. >> thank you very much for joining us. we continue our live coverage. we are watching watertown, massachusetts, and of course the situation is very fluid. we hope to have a news briefing shortly. but, of course, that can be pushed back as they continue the hunt for the second suspect in the boston marathon bombing. we'll be right back. with fidelity's guaranteed one-second trade execution,
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>> we know who he is and what he
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looks like because of surveillance cameras. >> and now preparing for the next big race of its kind, the london marathon. >> simon, that's right. boston is already front page news here in london. this is a copy of today's paper, calling it bomb brothers. the race will go on. by the race i'm referring to the marathon here on sunday. it will take place and expected to draw some 37,000 participants. it's going to finish at buckingham palace. understandably, officials are increasing precautionary measures that they are taking.
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as you said, an important part of the effort is the cctv system. london has one of the biggest surveillance systems of any city in the world. britain, generally speaking, there is one camera for every 32 people. both on the number of cameras and cost. and cost is an important factor when it comes to the question of whether cities pick up systems like that. the cctv system did help obtain some of the suspects. whether it's worth the cost is an enormous question. what we can tell you is that what happened in boston has not deterred people here from going to the event.
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we have been speaking to people who say they are still planning to show up on sunday to watch the finish. you can expect to see more guard dogs. >> a lot of the cameras in london are traffic cameras because of the zealousness. do you feel that america is at a point where there might be a change in which we view cctv cameras here? >> remember, january of last year, the supreme court struck down police's ability to put a gps device on anybody's car without obtaining a warrant here. in the decision, five of the justices noted that they were uncomfortable with some of the tracking techniques that police have been using like automatic toll tag collectors and closed
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circuit cameras. so the supreme court has been on this issue. i know there has been a lot of push back about the big brotherish nature of video surveillance here as well. but i think we can all agree that this may be a time that if it helps capture this man, it will be, then, lauded as a technology. >> it would certainly push the issue forward. >> ultimately there will be a large discussion that this is an enormous country. to put cameras everywhere to stop an event at a soft target is going to be insurmountable financially. it can't nearly be done. at what point is the trade-off not worth it? the cost and whether or not there is ultimate prevention that occurs from it? >> exactly. if i could jump in here.
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>> while he raised the same concerns about the logistics of putting something like this into place. but he also said that he is surprised and was surprised visiting new york city in the wake of the 2001 attacks as to how little physical security there was. for example, he said in london, for years during the ira campaign you would have to get your bags scanned when you walked into a department store. there has never been anything like that in the u.s. >> let me point out one thing that we learned this morning. the police were able to intercept a car and know where it dropped off a suspect as a result of finding out the gps location of the cell phone we are carrying. >> we check in at locations. our phone tracks it. we're doing it to ourselves anyway. >> we are a country that is far more aware of the trade off of
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security and privacy and the fear of police using these for other things in the future. we have got to take a break. kelly, thank you so much ahead of the london marathon that will happen this weekend. we will be right back here on cnbc.
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