tv Squawk on the Street CNBC November 12, 2021 9:00am-11:00am EST
hope to you you soon. >> see you soon. thank you. mike, right now we're looking at markets up, dow up by about 126 points a bit of a down week, but not bad, right, guys >> not bad at all. j&j a big boost to the dow number about. scott, mike, thank you both for being here this week folks, we'll see you next week right now it's time for "squawk on the street. good friday morning. welcome to "squawk on the street." i'm here with jim cramer and david faber. futures are up, but the s&p may snap a five-day win streak oil is down today, gasoline futures are at a six-week low. j&j, though, splitting as the company announces plans to spin off the consumer health business >> plus it has been a big week
for evs. shares of arrive jan continue to rally iceland with the new tourism ad you will not want to miss first, j&j splitting up. look, i think this is great. j&j is a pharmaceutical giant, one of the fastest-growing pharmaceutical companies i think you would be amazed how fast the business that will get the highest multiple will grow >> i wonder you bring up multiple let's get to that discussion, how you add value here, because
j&j trades at a higher multiple overall than most pharma companies, because consumer product gets a higher multiple p & g trades at, what, 25 times? >> yes. >> so is what's going to be left a lower multiple >> so there's some people who do breakups who just said that to me, jim, be careful, this is necessarily going to go much higher i think about abbott so abbottspring, abbott has a decent drug business with a very good device business, and if you think about this, this is the great myles white. >> abbott/abbvie separation, to some degree, more than 431 billion today, okay, it was $81 billion when they did the
separation ten years, one of the -- literally may be exhibit a why you do this. i think alex gorsky is a great executive. >> we do know that splits -- we've been talking about and kidding about shrink to grow -- >> laser focused. >> all those words that bankers use, but that's the story in the market it's one week. we've seen two iconic companies choose to go down this road because of focus, because of the customer level, consumer level, in the marketplace itself. they continue to say as well there was a growing divergence between these businesses, even more so as a result of covid there was once when it went to otc and you could see some overlap there. >> what i regard as football brands in the store, meaning that you can have a knockoff
that looks just like them from walgreens that people will buy, because it's cheaper you go to the cornstarch baby powder, i don't know -- >> we're not even mentioning what pfizer has done or what merck has done or raytheon, and more reports about what toshiba may do >> that's interesting. that's under pressure. how by glaxosmithkline under pressure right know -- these guys are tough. >> that's elliott, right >> yeah. >> they're tough one of the things that i -- one of the things that i think is interesting is they have split that company -- i don't know if you can see that the performance has been pretty good versus how if you take a longer-term view they think there's more there they thinks the convergen
business could be worth a lot more >> they have a big team there on the activist front what's your point? why do you bring up glaxo, though >> they were saying people do not see the great growth in our farmo. the only was to draw attention to is the. >> this one is not clear >> you have some excitement in every division. >> true. just like ge, this is going to take time.
>> why do you think -- >> similar to ge it will be two years before -- >> medical devices have been bad because of covid that can snap back let's not forget the talc litigation is with consumer product, that litigation has been horrendous. it's not all done in fair weather, j&j, but they have a great cancer franchise that people don't talk enough about they do a lot of good drugs. >> but then the pure group will be merck, pfizer, all the ones we still talk about it with, but obviously still a pure play, and the consumer products will nestle and p & g colgate? where do you put it? >> colgate is such a long-term winner, and i just think in the end you should try to merge it with one of those companies. >> you do?
speculation of a merge spin of this kind -- that's not i don't think in the cards at this point, but this will be a business again, carl, that can issue stock, that can start to consolidate as well. >> and of course the banks are loving this. ge has spent $7 billion in fees in the past 20 years, more than any other u.s. company. >> goldman is involved with ri rivian. >> there's a lot of those fees, all the things think sold and bought >> when i was growing up, you went to goldman and make a lot of money. >> facebook has a great new york office by the way, the people who applied for facebook, they don't hate mark zuckerberg >> so you don't believe the whole recruitment issue,ing that
that is the stigma to interview there is or going to work there? >> i know enough people to know that the statement is false, that they -- remember, the seven-stage interview? anytime, you can drop out. >> your point is younger people are grapher at a timing towards those names than goals man sax, jpmorgan, really >> yes yes. i got out of school, i didn't have the computer science skills but if you come out with a legal -- or obviously business, and go to goldman, you have a pretty great life now. how many times -- >> you still have to work pretty hard if you're young, 80 to 100 hours a week. >> i used to teach on friday
nights i would give an exam a 11, post the bottom five on month, so everybody could see -- >> pay is also going up at these firms. right out of college, 300 grand a year or more that's a pretty big number. >> for a 23-year-old, you're right. >> when i was at college, there's a line all the way down to harvard square to see credit suisse the same people telling you, you know, united the people at credit suisse would never be poor. >> story on the wires yesterday about how cs is making a huge push to recruit. >> they have to. they lost a lot of people because of the blowup. >> i tried to get a job, and goldman said, if you have another meeting with them -- it
was like big brother and they told me, listen, you've got about 24 hours 12 of them have already been used >> so you did. >> sure did. i was so.ed, i put on my raincoat, and to realized i had a partner's raincoat i had to try to get it back. >> you picked up somebody else's raincoat >> it was a partner and a lot of important stuff was in the pockets. i realized my career was over before it started. at that very moment, there was nothing other than sundial reporting for a good quarter. >> we do have a lot of news. of course, there's rivian, elon musk taunting then on twitter, got a downgrade today of ride. take a look at the futures jim mentioned nvidia, a
jim, you long have said this would come in hot. >> they have no choice all you can says is what's going to happen. i want to know whether ford is going to try to get a release. don't really understand what you have is -- >> that's just stunning, though. >> i know. >> that was one of the best priced -- >> on wednesday, when i told you it was sovereign funds, it was the initial book for the ipo was incredibly solid, to the point
where you weren't going to get flippers these were long-term holders r.j. scaringe oversaw the choices. so, all right. >> look, i think elon -- they're able to achieve high production. true test, and i don't know if they can do either i think they have the. >> just making the point there have been hundreds of startups, and tesla has been ability to produce a lot of cars. and get positive cash flow very hard to do. >> i think ford has a get-musk division.
>> probably everything he said was true sometimes with his tweets you don't know >> it was very commonsensical. now, you can saying it doesn't matter, but -- >> he's going to keep selling. >> i voted in a north korean election -- >> as robert frank and those have pointed out, he's got to sell to pay the taxes on this huge option position that he has. >> i'm sure people out there wealthier saying he almost had nothing left. >> what do you mean? >> because the government confiscated so much. >> even abigail disney said, look, i'll be glad to have the government take that money. >> i like that. >> and it can go towards ev.
>> i need a longer-term vision, and putting it in the ultimate exit. >> to your point about arrive jan, they're seeking a u.s. facility for a battery plant we will look for that directional investment, right? >> batteries to gateway. that's the gated area. that's going to be the hardest >> we have people in our business that doesn't buy anything that's not lithium. >> that enabled them to get that that cash flow positive.
rivian seems to have a good amount of it now. >> musk didn't have the semiconductor problems. >> yeah, more recently >> no, no, i'm saying musk -- look, musk is for real i think the stock price is high, but for real, because he is a part of the absolute we have all these conferences, one going on in singapore, the one in glasgow, what are they about? >> for the foreseeable future? >> i think so. >> you do? >> this is not warby parker. >> nobody said it was. >> the cars are a little more complex. >> yes, absolutely, direct to consumer. we do have more encouraging news from toyota we'll talk about that. we'll get cramer's mad dash and count down to the opening bell, as futures look to end on a good
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while we remain bullish, long we simply find ourselves unable to justify lifting our multiple to pay these prices now, i think if you like this stock all the way, you can do a victory lap. a lot of people felt that i would slight him no, i think that's a good run. he did a good job. >> a lot of this due to excitement, you would argue over the metaverse. >> a.i. >> they don't call it metaverse there. you told us a lot. >> he's your digital twin. a bit of an icelandic spoof of the digital twin later on. here's what i think. this company has more opportunity in many different divisions. you sell it, then try to get back in it, it's just too cute look, you can sell it here, maybe it goes to here, are you
going to get back in here? it's too hard. they'll come on and say the best days are behind it >> right >> i talk about this a lot with my club. that's a game i can't play. >> to your credit, on this name, because you have a lot of heat on others. >> yes, i do. you have been an incredible propontant of this stock -- i hear the music playing to look back five, ten years, that's your point. >> amazing cfo he would be so mad at me he would say do you not know it's my team why do you talk about me he's everything that you want in -- >> yeah he's the opposite of musk and, remember, you can catch
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>> announcer: the opening bell is brought to you by - enhanced, actual reality without silly-looking 4thsets. in our open world experience, everything is real ♪ >> and has been for millions of years. that's a new tourism ad out of iceland it's gone viral around the world, sort of taking a swipe at the metaverse. the whole world is aware of this move. >> absolutely. he's in the water at one point, this fellow, with someone, and he says, oh, you're a person. >> are you a human >> and there's a fantastic scene
in the actual zuckerberg -- i don't know what we call it -- blockbuster -- >> where zuckerberg's video presentation. >> yes, he's with someone else, and i think it's a great scene, but now, i mean, there you go, he's mocking them by talking whether the other person is real the way you should do it, by the way, if you're going to do this is different from mark you have to do it with an avatar -- not a cartoon avatar that you did on adobe's programs, that are very good you have to use what jensen has, you're not able to tell whether it's you -- it's a little frightening. >> the cartoon element is not enough. >> no. if i want my wife to be playing rummikube with me, i don't want
a cartoon. she's gone to live in del rey for a while. >> i don't like the texting. >> you can't touch eve other in the metaverse. >> that's none of your business. [ laughter ] >> that's awfully personal here's the opening bells and at the big board it's robert f. smith, and philanthropist celebrating one stock, one future, a goalsetter to create 1 million black and latinx shareholders worldwide and at the nasdaq. loyalty ventures celebrating its spin-off >> i am so possessed by this j&j breakup. i want it to be the next abbott, but i also want -- the perils are demonstrated by dame
wamsley. if people are suspicious, they don't want that pure play. i think it's amazing everyone assumes they have a great pharma franchise. johnson & johnson does. >> j&j will help lead the s&p this morning there's biogen up there as well. >> another proof of concept. it's alzheimer's drugs, and my problem with the alzheimer's drug is the cost. >> nobody would care about the cost if it really did big things the question is, is that big enough does it really move the -- >> the work i do with various brain foundations needs us to be skeptical about biogen, because you have to start it so much
earlier, and it's not necessarily going to -- the community of doctors who are involved with brains are dedicated to the proposition that there are certain alzheimer's we have to work on, they're or rend out, i don't mean to say we, like i'm a doctor, but i always ask these guys when i do the foundational work, what do you think? and they don't think there's a lot here. >> it's funny. that chart is a perfect reflection of sentiment, which shot up on 9 prospects for this incredible breathrough drug, and then slowly by surely coming down as people saying, maybe it's not as effective, maybe the fda erred here in not listening to their advisers, and the insurance companies will say why are we going to cover it >> the panel that looked into
this all didn't think it worked. the panel is made up of people like the people i work with, and they're -- to go against them is daunting, given how much they no and what they're trying to do, and how tremendously involved they are in the day-to-day saving of people's lives this thing comes occupy and they're like, are you kidding me this isn't what we need. so let's watch. >> speaking of the fda, guys, mrna is up today, but, man, it's been in free fall. they had their conference call, don't know that they took that many questions fourth quarter -- from what i understand this stock was in the mid 400 not very long ago. >> there was the quarter, and then the dispute over patents. a.p. this morning says the
president, according to sources, will pick dr. robert kaylift to lead the fda, but man, would you put this on the worst prints for q3 >> i don't know what to say. this is a company where you have to look at the pipeline, and the cancer pipeline is worth a great deal, but you are up against -- the issue is you look at their market can verse all the others when pfizer was in the 30s, people thought the idea of a booster was phony, and the stock started rolling over then people started talking about the patent cliff and how '23 will be a disaster for pfizer, and the company was saying, you're going to want the
booster. yes, we're all clamoring for the booster, but they took a big stake in a company i like called biohaven, 30 million migraine sufferers, it's tremendous worldwide. pfizer is accumulating a series of positions to take this money and make it so that the patent cliffs are not going to be bad they're a very well-run financial company. >> it's been a good year for pfizer >> it's about time people sayi -- >> moderna did also. >> about i don't know how you value it now, if they don't have -- >> moderna >> i don't know how, because i don't know what they have in the pipe will they they have these personalized cancer vaccines ready? >> and they're not taking a lot of questions on the patent
questions. >> that's disturbing to people look someone 1kd me the other day, is it time to sell moderna? i said, well, obviously you could say -- you could say it was 400, but the answer is you should sell some moderna, because we just don't know whether it's going to have the legs that pfizer has david, how many times did you report the market cap of moderna? >> there was a periody it was approaching that of merck's, and now merck is more than twice the size, and that happened quickly. >> merck has one great drug, obviously, but we do know, carl. that the mrna, that template works. i was listening to a doctor the other night who runs a major cancer hospital in new york, who was saying, look, we now know that mrna is the future.
he's very smart. i feel badly about what happened in the meeting when he comes home with meg -- i think he's good, right >> he's no bourla, but people say, jim, it's biontech. >> we'll give credit wherever it should be. i'm keeping an eye on disney and netflix. no rebound for disney. they're about 4 billion apart. >> every division has lost a little more. and, david, are you going to be
drawn to the $1.99 for one month free for all >> no. i think i'm paying for disney plus, hulu, espn plus, amazon, paying for netflix. >> i don't think we're alone. >> i think i'm paying for paramount plus i needed cbs to watch a football game, it was like $60 a -- i don't even know what i get there. >> do you pay for rabbit ears? >> do you ever watch peacock >> of course. >> goodanswer, carl. >> i mean, look, "jungle cruise" does it save things? i've gotten involved in the 170s, i thought -- this is not a turn, but david, the metaverse i did that for you
gambling. >> you want to listen, you want ceos focused on years out, and he certainly is, in terms of the opportunities they see. >> when i talk to people about disney, they can't believe the stock has fallen this much and they finally want to come in the next quash is going to be hard the next quarter is hard it will not be good. it may be the trough quarter, maybe not. some people are saying, well, chapes is too pie in the sky for metaverse and gambling are you one of those >> no, i'm not >> ire not >> a quick diversion for me into the world of luxury. do you ever go on far fetch, buy your wife a gift or something? you know, these luxury platforms. >> i bought my wife a black & decker saw. >> very romantic very romantic. >> okay. i also got the drill.
>> oh, wow you bought those for her >> yeah, she's very handy. [ laughter ] >> well, if you ever wanted a more romantic gift, you may want to go on the platforms they had a very long call, and confirmed what a lot of people had thought might be the case, they've been talking to far fetch about a deal in terms, from one of meets understanding, they're getting close to the end here in terms of the talks, where far fetch could own as much as 25% of -- what it also would be is creating a neutral industry-wide platform in which far fetch would invest directly as a minority holder, and the political form solutions to support to a hybrid model. far fetch is the biggest beneficiary, but we don't talk
about them too often they own cartier and some other high-end brands. >> richemont is a way to demonstrate your wealth. that's actually someone who is closer -- >> as you well know, these luxury companies rely heavily on the chinese market there's a reason why he was the wealthiest man in the world at lvmh not anymore, musk is -- >> i realized if i went up to him, i might be tackled. arnot, he's a snappy dresser. >> as you would expect he would
be. >> i'm in awe of him. >> you are >> he picked off tiffany for nothing? >> that ended up being a good deal >> that's why i went stanley black & decker. >> what kind of saw did you buy? >> just home depot. >> they're dangerous be careful. >> the luxury has not done poorly a lot of that will be asia, of course, where once again, jim, there's a lot of talk of the china trade is back on, outperforming the russell. we're no longer walk up in talking about crazy headlines. >> maybe we can get some light on that, but even in the wynn conference call, we know mr. bags is leaving. >> yes. >> but they were saying the macau authorities, business as
usual. we know high-end luxury -- it's very interesting when i interviewed the fabulous ceo from estee lauder, the party wants -- wants a -- they like -- skin care. >> they encourage skin care? >> i don't want to be facetious here. >> it's middle class that's not under fire, and middle class buy estee lauder it's the ultra-rich that are under fire the party has not gone after the middle class, which is smart we'll be on the lookout for china, xi/biden headlines, maybe as early as tonight. >> what do you think about that? as we go to break, bonds this morning, interesting week all across the curve that's the biggest surge in about two years.
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environmental issues and ratings and all of that? the mark cap businesses are investable opportunities there isn't a version of this in a lot of companies, not just china. china is obviously a big example of it. investors have to decide whether they want to overweight the company or not even invest in it >> understood. now, we have a huge move in esg. i don't think people understand. he actually tested the kick indiana these situations how can we determine if they're deserving, dpiven what you and i both know they're trying to pretend they're good for the environment? >> in our esg in general we can talk about climate but in esg in general, we're gathering information from all sources about 50% of the data is
directly from customers that report to securities commission of press releases or websites or whatever the other 50% comes from independent sources to understand other aspects of their criteria and then we have a model that is very scientific as to how much we weigh those areas depending on the sector, the industry. and we create a rating on climate itself, riltit's parf esg and an incredible amount of needs for information and data and metrics on climate, especially coming out of com26 in glasgow >> henry, it's david i can understand on governance and university of inclusion. but when it comes to environment, i don't know if i have confidence, eve within the
rigorous process, that you're giving me an accurate reflection as i try to allocate capital and do it effectively. >> that is the fundamental question a lot of tinvesters are blind in terms of understanding the current emissions of companies or any other issuer for that matter and what are the projections of the companies in the next five, ten, 20 years. we have developed metrics to be able to estimate the carbon emissions of about 10,000 publicly listed companies. and 15,000 private companies and on the publicly listed companies, we've been able to estimate the temperature alignment of those companies into the future, depending on the world we live in a two-degree company, five-degree company and the like we have to also understand that there's a lot of data we gather but a lot of these are models
into the future. the claimt change problem is a goal forward problem and therefore, there will be estimations, accuracy in some aspects and lack of it but we cannot necessarily it would be approved of the kurpt plan >> it's just great to have you on ceo of msci. great to see you, sir. >> thank you, jim and david. >> absolutely. i'll see you soon. that man is like larry fink, when it come ts to a lot of stocks he can make or break other companies. we don't want green wash but it's been a magnificent performer. he did do china. he went to china many times to figure out whether the
legitimacy of it very healthy >> and stocks hitting a series of all-time highs. tonight, duo lingo and i want to get the electric transmission company >> we look forward to a busy week for you next week >> and i will be -- thrilled to be with you and check tech because it has been almost two years since i've been out on the koegs and it's where i learn everything and try to figure out if people are turning down facebook to work at a i-company. >> just don't get lost in the metta verse. i have iceland in the end there's always iceland. >> beautiful >> i'll send my digital friend over there i don't want to go >> jim cramer "mad meyon." 6:00 p.m. eastern time
as an independent financial advisor, i stand by these promises: i promise to be a careful steward of the things that matter to you most. i promise to bring you advice that fits your values. i promise our relationship will be one of trust and transparency. as a fiduciary, i promise to put your interests first, always.
with regard to job openings and labor turnover job openings for the month of september are 10,438,000 very close to expectations and it is a bit lower than high-water mark, which was july at a bit over 11 million these things go back to 2000 never seen numbers like this precovid around the 7 million mark and the hard parted is whether you look at the labor force participation rate or the number of people that are not working and not in labor force, it really gets hard to reconcile why we can't match some of the jobs up. with regard to november preliminary? a big, huge miss 66.8 66.8 i only brought 10 years worth of data on michigan i didn't think it would go this low and i don't have a number lower than this.
if we look at what had been the low water mark, that was august at 71.3. this is really a big surprise. if we look at current conditions, 73.2 is about four points less than expected. and if we think all about what lies ahead, expectation as huge drop from our final october read of 67.9 to 62.8. and on the inflation front, hot, hot, hot if we look at what's going on in a one-year inflation rate, ourb high-water mark was 4.8, which takes us back to 2008 and obviously we have to still go back to 2008 to find a higher number and maybe the only good news is the five to ten-year inflation outlook is 2.9, which is steady with the last october final read 3% is the current high water mark and that's a 10-year high carl back to you.
>> wow pretty incredible, rick. thank you. good friday morning, everybody welcome to another hour of "squawk on the street. the mark will digest that number and the jolts fig yrb. for the time being s&p looking for the first losing week after about five weeks of trading up as inflation clearly remains in focus. >> as you heard him say, hot, hot, hot here are three big movers we are watching we're going to start with hpe getting a sell rating at goldman sachs and cutting it, siting a, quote, weakening u.s. ip spend nothing environment. lordstown motors, meantime, sputderring lower after reporting another quarter with no revenue the ev say its plans to release the endurance truck in q3 of next year. stock is down 70% just since the
start of the year. and finally, warby parker revealing its -- and a wider-than-expected loss the shares are up 3% company is saying more people going to stores to buy those i products, verses online as we continue to see it decline out of the pandemic. >> let's turn to j&j the latest giant company to announce its plans to splits up. meg. well, for the longest time, j&j has been this massive conglomerate today they're going to split off the consumer health business into a separately publicly traded company it plans to complete that in the next 18 to 24 months this has iconic brands like
tylenol, bandaids and many others this will become its own separate company j&j ceo joined "squawk box" this morning to talk about the rational behind the deal >> with our pharma and medical device business tends to be more of a business relationship, compared to the consumer business and most importantly, where we see things going to the future, we feel it now is the right time to make this kind of a move. and ultimately allow us to reach more patients, have more innovation and execute in a much more focussed way. >> what this leaves is the $17 billion consumer health and a $77 billion business that will be johnson & johnson still a massive company and the market really responding favorably to this. a lot of folks noting the
consumer health business has been a very popular trend among pharmaceutical companies to pair down things not sort of the pure play medical businesses. we've seen companies spinning off, animal house and other consumer businesses as well. >> appreciate that that's our megtirrell. and oppenheimer health strat jgs. good to see you. thanks for the help today. >> thanks for having me. >> safe to say this has been talked about for a while not a surprise anything regarding the destruction of it that does take you by surprise? >> the only thing i think takes us by surprise is the timing with ceo leaving within the next couple of months to me, is the biggest surprise i think the company even noted they were not quite sure how this was going to go down. 18 to 24 months to figure it out. the timing with the management
changes, i think, to the street, might be the most surprising aspect >> is there any contest in the way in which you would prefer which part of the business to own? >> i think the consumer business is obviously been very, very challenging for a number of reasons. i think the one item most predominant in investor discussions is the issue around the baby powder with the litigation and liabilities associated with it once that is separated, you have this legacy business that i feel like is a little built more ownable and palatable. it's very different in terms of the structure of the company you mention the different businesses alex mentioned the fact that the brand awareness and the way the business operate are very different. i think the legacy, jaunohnson & johnson business is probably one invoesers will gravitate more
towards. >> it's trading higher although modest and there's been a trend, and not just in health care and industrial space as well too, see the conglomerates continue to get smaller, do these spin offs and the whole argument has been that they can execute in a more focussed way, drum up more innovation in the process too. investors have been at war and said customers want to see more of this too. if that's actually the case, where would you expect to see the greatsh amount of inovation or up side for either of these companies once the split happens? you naliled it. the way they operate is so different from medical device pharma so, putting together better direct to consumer campaigns is something i think will be a focus. and the remaining company, the medical device and pharma business can really focus on what it does and that's innovation
i would expect business development efforts to pick up as well. j&j has been quiet but it enables the medical device and pharma businesses to be run potentially, much more efficiently. >> that's what is going to have to be. to morgan's point, that's a pretty modest response to an announcement like this and i wonder if that's not because of the multiple disparity. when they trade at an independent company, it may trade at a lower j&j hassent that been a concern of those that said i'm not sure it's going to create shareholder value? >> it's possible i think the remove of the noise from the base businesses is fairly valuable. they're not going to have to worry as much about the headlines associated with that that's 18 to 24 months out
you still have time and kwlm sure there will be additional headlines during that course of time i think you have a business that, from a multiple standpoint, is going to have to rely on what the company does. there's major loss of exclusivities coming up. an r&d day coming up that will help explain the broader strategy er the value of the stock is going to depend on how the company builds frumt here. >> given the fact we have seen this trend within the sector more broadly m megcertainly touch on it what's next? >> and possibly spinning off the generic business, which most shareholders would want. i think merck is also a potential interesting company to look at with their animal health business once they bulk up that company
more andthey're obviously in the midst of trying to do some mna as we speak and they've been adamant they expect to announce more deals, at least it sounds like spinning off from animal health could be one thing to look forward to >> we're get used to it, at least in the health care business thank you. shares of rivian going high rb for the third straight day. the highest ipo since alibaba. bob. >> yeah, rivian's up and not even in the top 20 of all-time big pops take a look at some of the first day pops for well-known names out there. zoom video up 172% on the first day.
and zscaler, cyber security really big airbnb up more than 100% they all had periods after they went public where they were down and actually up 200% since it started here i think what's impressive about rivian is the size of the money they raised, $12 billion this puts them in the big leagues. alibaba was the biggest and i'm talking u.s.-based ipos, not international. visa 17, facebook 16 r rivian posted 12 what's important to know about the ipos is most of the real money is on the first day of trading. today an example the average first day pop for an ipo is 29% the after market, the after the
first day, they trade down the average one has been down 6 perb why is this happened demand is high, supply is limited and the prices are really high. what would help this is if they lowered the price, you'd probably get better after-market returns. by the way, cathy wood has reportedly said we're not interested in buying rivian because hof the valuation. 10% of her big flagship is tegs luand it's down. she's down on the year down about 5 perb with the s&p up 25% they took a bick hit in february and march when a lot of the dramatic tech stuff all started dropping frankly, they haven't recovered. they've seen out flows in the main flagship fund i'm talking about in terms of shares outstanding
a point about that verses tesla. back to you. >> i mean, you did make good point and i don't know what the list would look like in terms of incremental market cap but you're talking over $50 billion i think. now we're talking over 111 billion right now. that's got to rank up there pretty high. >> yes in terms of market cap on initial day, yes notable numbers in -- right. yes. it's quite remarkable. and of course, a lot of people this week are saying a million dollars in sales with 80 or nienlt, now $100 billion market cap, nobody's ever seen that you're way beyond valuation questions and whether they could have reasonable evaluation you shrug your shoulders and say it's not a strictly valuation
call, it's more of an emotional call >> quite a week for ipos and rivian in general. we'll take a look at the roadmap for the next hour. sending bitcoin and either to more record highs this week. >> disney did have a bad day yesterday. today revealing new titles for its streaming service. and the logistics logjam, as they continue to combat supply chain disruptions with the holidays closing in.
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. let's get to disney. this follows yesterday's significant drop holding a disney plus day this hour, releasing more than a dozen new titles to the streaming service. our next guest says it may not be enough to move the needle for new subscribers. simon gallagher. good to have you back. why not enough to move the needle there's pretty exciting things here come on. quote olaf presents. i mean >> you're going to have a busy viewing weekend, david
>> they won't all be coming out this weekend certainly there's great stuff there. i'm watching the feed come through this morning and certainly shows featuring will smith and chris helmsworth and fantastic live action films. "pinocchio" with tom hanks they've got a goal of 230 to 260 million new subs by the end of 2024 anyone can do the math and work out that they're not on the needed run rate to get to that target >> yeah. all right. they still say they will get there. i don't know how much is seasonal and how much was partially the initial burst, especially given how many people were home and looking for entertainment. high are you doubtful in terms of what they're offering that it's not enough to get them to the level they need be or will
they actually produce enough content in future years that perhaps you'll change your opinion? >> they've certainly got a very strong road map in place i keep going back to the fact they're 118 million subs i'm not sure that the additional -- they've made all the announcements today. but you get into the theme parks half an hour early now there's limited release films dropping with amc over the weekend. what i'd like to see from disney is a much longer list of benefits for disney plus subscribers to really build that community. i believe, when you look at what they're making from the theme parks and cruises, i think they could provide benefits that extended over the entire year. i think that would be muffin m much more valuable and encourage people to retain it over a
12/24-month period and a reason to sign up that goes beyond just disney plus weekend. it's for the entire year you can get into theme parks half an hour early, not just one night of the year. >>iu >> i'm looking through your notes and we don't raise this enough and that's talent they've had this robust pipeline of leadership and talent within the company. the fact bob took over last year and we've seen departures of some of the high-profile names how is that contributing to the conversation >> disney is always going to be able to hire exceptional kpivls. it's a wonderful place to work and there's people whose dream job would be to work for disney. i have respect for kevin meyer, who left and now working with blackstone
they acquired hello sunshine, reece witherspoon's company and acquired a kids company last week and that was a $3 billion acquisition and they're continuing to have other conversations, trying to build a new version of disney, so to speak. so, yes, there's still terrific executives add disney and former executives trying to create a new version of disney as well and talts making for a competitive landscape. >> back to direct to consumer. i know netflix and hastings say our competitors are not direct to consumer platforms. they're just people's time i'm curious to get your thoughts there are lot of direct to consumer platforms out there discovery warner is yet to come. is competition one of the key reasons why perhaps we'll see an
inability to get to those subscriber numbers >> absolutely. we've all got so many different choices. i did my own survey with my kids yesterday, 10 and 11 and i said what is your default service? where do you go to first and it's surprising to me the results. disney was number two and youtube was number one they love going on and searching youtube, finding new content and that's another opportunity i see for disney there's so mitch great talent on youtube, thats perhaps disney could snap up. mark rover and dude perfect. if they had shows on disney plus, i thing they would see new engagement maybe there's opportunity for disney to pull some of those eye balls away from youtube. particularly with the younger demographic. >> good point. youtube's revenues almost identical to that of netflix
you can imagine what that company would be worth >> as we go to break, a look at the big laggards for the week. i think there's also travel-related names as the cruise lines come off a bit. 10-year low has yields backing off. 49 basis points. so, you want evs, you have come to the right place. is that tom brady? yeah. he comes in to recharge, get software updates. you know. let's go! if you wake up thinking about the market and want to make the right moves fast... get decision tech from fidelity. [ cellphone vibrates ] you'll get proactive alerts for market events before they happen... and insights on every buy and sell decision.
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welcome back here is your cnbc news update at this hour. former fda commissioner will be nominated today to return to the job. according to multiple reports this morning, califf briefly served as commissioner at the end of the obama administration and work would google parent company, alphabet. with negotiators still working on a statement as the glasgow summit comes to a close, envoy, kerry says he's confident the richer nations will help poorer countries >> less developed countries desperately need additional help we agree from day one, we've been saying the united states wants to raise the amount for adaptation and we'll move in the right direction, i believe, as we leave here and kyle rittenhouse has strong support from a billionaire investment
says he's watched several hours of testimony and believes rittenhouse is telling the truth and acted in self defense when he shot three people, killing two of them in kenosha, wisconsin and will be acquitted. he criticized coverage of the shooting saying media and political bias are dividing our country and destroying lives that trial resumes monday with closing arguments. thank you and have a great weekend. we're going to turn back to the big story of the day, which is johns johnson & johnson announcing plans to split into two different companies. up the better part of 1% we're joined by cnbc contributor, fred hathen, also chairman -- and you, yourself have experience in what it is to split up a conglomerate. having done so in 2002
i want to get your thoughts on this news today, what it means for j&j and the broader health care sector as we've seen more of these deals struck in the last few years as well >> thank you there's all of the time for things to be put together and there's a time for them to be disassembled we let the agricultural business go and that finally got acquired by buyer for $63 billion in 2018 so, a lot of value can be unlocked by the split at the right time and this case, i really have to give a lot of credit to alex gorsky, the ceo and the new j&j. j&j was more of a device, consumer and drug company. it's now become a strong drug company and device company and consumer is still strong but the drug can stand on its own two feet along with the
device company and the consumer business should be let go, let free, set free to focus and to maximize on its own. and i think the consumer business will do very well on its own. for example, the growth corridor has been maximized by nestle beautifully and this is a great opportunity for the consumer business at j&j to also do the same i think this is going to be value freedom lin directions >> i mean, to your point, alex gorsky was on the air earlier and said this news is coming from a position of strength for the company. you're having a conversation earlier on this show though, about perhaps surprise, at least on wall street among analysts who cover this name, given the fact this is a company in the midst of a ceo transition as well >> i thing this is a good time
to make a transition because it allows the new ceo to focus on what he is very good at, which is the drug and device business. i think it's the perfect time to make the separation and allows the new situation to evauvrl nicely so a new board can be put together and the ceo be properly announced. i really think it's a transformational deal. for a company more than 100 years old. and to make it happen like this shows courage by both people at the top. >> so, the flip side is by having the two businesses together as long as they have been, you had the slower, steadier consumer business and that would offset. i realize the drug and medical device is less predictable in some ways they would smooth or balance each other out. i realize it streamlines
operation and potentially spurs more innovation. but what are the risks >> in the rx bds might go up and down but now days the portfolio managers of the different funds that own these stocks, they are telling the drug companies let us do our own portfolio management you shouldn't do portfolio management you should do maximization of the sector you're in charge of and i think it's a great idea. there was also rational in the past where it was primarily a small molecule business, that for certain drugs like tylenol or claireten too, get extended by taking them to the consumers. because it's been prescribed by doctors in the past. that gives the brand a huge advantage in the marketplace and that's why tylenol, big brands
but that's changed quite a bit now. if you look at the present drug, j&j, it's a bio tech power house and that really, again, goes to the credit of the management team fr the shape of the whole landscape has changed. to me the biggest opportunity is going to be the clarity and accountability of management and the ability to maximize the value and i think the consumer business at $15 billion is underpowered for its own sector, which has an opportunity to become very, very strong as an independent business >> that's interesting. we were talking about where some of the synergies have gone over the years. i wonder if you think we have topped out in health care companies splitting up and if we have, do some of the consumer companies now start to
aggregate within the consumer space? >> that's a good question because they're now getting the incursion from food companies, like nestle and tech is seeing this as a big opportunity for them to grow into this area, especially with the advance of artificial intelligence and online marketing it's really a new landscape. there's a huge opportunity to put companies together and to improve the link with consumers and really reduce the nonsense of too muched averbtizing on television, make it more tarkted and a more personalized experience that consumers can have with the brands it's going to be a totally different picture five years out, ten years out in that space. just like the drug industry has changed dramatically to personalize medicine, we're going to seat -- >> so, given the conversation,
you surprised the stock isn't moving higher? >> it's a very large stock to begin with if you look at the actual dollar value, it's changed a lot. i remember when we split, people didn't see the value until they saw the value. then it really became very big i think as people see the value and the consumer business start to come together separately, i think the value will be unlocked >> fred, great to get your insight on a day like today. thanks for joining us. >> great to be here. as we head to a break, take a look at the top gainers on the nasdaq 100 for the week. it's actually led by a number of the chinese digital names. we'll be right back. stay with us so, you want evs, you have come to the right place. is that tom brady? yeah. he comes in to recharge, get software updates. you know.
in focus, materials are breaking out to fresh highs our traders say there are two stocks you should be buying and they have tas pvedeiltoro it. more "squawk on the street" ahead. uh carl, are there different planning options in here? options? plans we can build on our own, or with help from a financial consultant? like schwab does. uhhh... could we adjust our plan... ...yeah, like if we buy a new house? mmmm... and our son just started working. oh! do you offer a complimentary retirement plan for him? as in free? just like schwab. schwab! look forward to planning with schwab. i'll shoot you an estimate as soon as i get back to the office. hey, i can help you do that right now. high thryv! thryv? yep. i'm the all-in-one management software built for small business. high thryv! help me with scheduling? sure thing. up top. high thryv! payments? high thryv! promotions? high thryv! email marketing? almost there, hold on. wait for it. high thryv! manage my customer list? can do. will do.
high thryv! post on social media? hash-tag high thryv my friend! get a free demo at thryv.com. welcome back to "squawk on the street." crypto is drawing interest after inflation saw the biggest gain since 19 ni90 earlier this week venture partner and open money initiative cofounder good to see you. >> good to be back what a week >> i wonder if you think we're getting resistance, at least on bitcoin in the high 60s and whether that's related to gold making a move or something else. >> i think things have been choppy but obviously continuing to trend higher. and that gap higher that we saw in bitcoin earlier this week, of
course, in line with the inflation print. i don't think anyone really would have expected that to be sustained without seeing some resistance and that's how these things tend to go. there's very volatile assets but there's no doubt it's been a bull run for the last several months here and i think my personal view and based on some of the data that we're seeing, i think that we can expect that to continue here at least for the short to medium term >> then the payment side you have amc, which we talk about a lot, moving ahead with its acceptsance of crypto as a payment mechanism. and you had others this week, ken griffon, at the deal book conference, throwing cold water on the long-turnl view of crypto as a effectival mechanism for payment. why do you think that's so choppy >> i think that ken griffon in a
way is right to point out some of the difficulties of interacting with some of the crypto products out there from a payments perspective and i think that really what that speaks to is the diversity of products that exist within crypto at this stage where the reality is not all of them are suited for payments not all will be suited for defy or more high frequency forms of interaction and trading. not all of them are going to be suited for nfts. i think what we're seeing is different crypto currencies, different web 3 platforms, different layer ones, as they get called, whether it's bitcoin or others developed, they're going to be used in different ways it's fair enough for some onlookers to scratch their heads as they see folks like amc
taking on bitcoin payments because there are certain ways in which bitcoin is not actually that well suited to today, at least, going out and buying popcorn with it. there are other crypto currencies that are better suited to that but i think that sort of sums up the complexity we're starting to get into there in terms of the commentary >> such a key point you make and one we've heard from other crypto enthusiasts and bitcoin in particular, you think of michael sayler on the show not lock ago the idea that, where bitcoin specifically is concerned, it's viewed more of a store of value than payments mechanism. giveen the fact that there's such a broad, in some cases, frothy crypto currency landscape afoot. and the fact you can see more
regulation in the u.s. how does this shake out? >> firstly, i have to acknowledge it's going to be a harry discussion, i would say, over the coming quarters as we start to parse out what is crypto currency good for, both as a whole and for the different subset oz of the products emerging i think it's a healthy sign that we're having this conversation that more and more mainstream players, whether it's corporate through fund managers and so forth are having the conversations and starting to parse all of this out. and as you point out, regulators are starting to have these conversations as well. and while, in many ways, the infrastructure bill and the wording as relates to cryptocurrency brokers i think is the main kind of point that people are debating around as to whether that wording and the
definitions around that should stay the same. while that has been, in my view and i think many of the industry's view, a failure at least in the current passage, i think the fact we're able to have those conversations with washington and starting to parse out what does it mean in krinto currency to be a broker. i think that's a very constructive sign for the spaces as a whole looking, again, over the long term. >> we'll talk more maybe more platforms next time as opposed to the actual ast but fascinating times, jill. have a good weekend. thanks coming up in the next hour, we're going to talk to one analyst down grading nvidia, despite lifting the price target he'll explain.
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mean a big boost for one group of retailers courtney reagan has that story for us courtney. >> hi, david discount retailers tend to attract more shoppers in economic downturns but recent data suggests that many shoppers are hitting the discounters as inflation starts to heat up. so, we'll average hourly earnings were up 5% in october compared to last year when you take the rate of inflation into account, declined more than 1% the just released consumer sentiment number also coming in much worse than expected hitting its lowest level in a decade so, transaction data shows that spending in the discount sector is not only growing compared to the same time prepandemic in 2019, but accelerating up 22.5% in august from 2019 to up 27.5% in october from 2019 with both higher transaction value and more items purchased per check out. in store traffic data shows an uptick in retailers that sell at
lower prices so, traffic in october compared to 2019 up 21% for home goods, 16.5% for target and more than 13.5% for ross stores. 11.5% for burlington and nearly 5.5% for walmart and, of course, those big box players like walmart and target are using their size and scale to navigate the supply chain congestion a little better like chartering their own ships for cargo and that can help keep their prices more in check and more protected from inflation. the off price players are taking advantage of inventory dislocations from the past 18 months and buying up merchandise at attractive prices and giving instore treasure hunters something to salivate over investors are buying into the opportunity and discounters, too. take a look at shares of dollar tree up 17% since the september read on inflation came out in mid october. but even dollar tree can't escape inflation entirely. its prices are moving above $1
five below up 16% and target shares higher by 12% in the last three months morgan, back over to you >> just fascinating context, courtney especially since i know we'll get a deluge of retailers reported earnings next week. >> that's right. you know it. >> it's two weeks out to black friday, as well. supply chain constraints don't seem to be easing any time soon. our next guest is out with a note arguing it goes beyond the ports themselves here to break that down or break down the supply chain is transportation analyst jason sidell i want to get into the ripple effects because it hasn't to your point just been the ports we've seen it affect the rails and trucking operators, as well, on down the list so, what are you seeing in terms of that high frequency data? are we starting tosee any kind of easing to the gridlock and what does it mean to the companies most exposed >> sure. i'm happy to be here
you know, i think it's gotten mildly better but it's almost like you're looking at a really bad golf score you're shooting 150 and you try a little bit harder and you're shooting 120, it's still a bad score. but, you know, if you look right now off the port of l.a. long beach, we're looking at about 78 ships that are anchored, i think l.a. has just about 40 of those. to put that into context, you know, that was far, far less less than well under half that earlier in the year when congestion started rising up when you look at the average days at birth an anchor, we're almost out towards a month's time the ship is just waiting to get unloaded if you look back in the may time frame, that was down in the single digits it's pretty bad right now. that's the bad news. the good news is some things are being done so, it has been recognized as a problem by the administration and people are trying to take
steps to improve it, right what has been done the ports extended some hours of operation and started accelerated cargo program trying to get some of their customers to sign up to get this stuff moved throughout the network they increased the allowance of the height of the containers to get stacked to try to create some more space that is out there right now. they've instituted fines so some logistic players don't sort of drag their feet, if you will, on moving that cargo. and several things, i think, are going to matter as we look forward, right so, i think what matters is seasonality. right now things are bad but seasonally it's going to slow down after thanksgiving for the ports. so, that's going to allow them to clean up. but, the calendar is also going to matter. this year we have an early lunar new year january is not going to give you too many days to help get cleaned up and a lot of shippers
trying to ship before that lunar new year. >> we're almost up against the end of the show. from an investor standpoint which of the stocks you cover potentially benefits from all these dynamics you're talking about? >> i would look at somebody like a hub group, they have a lot of their prices from the railroad partners locked in i think the congestion is going to allow them to price well above that and as we get through '22, you'll see that congestion clear up and help them on the cost side, as well. >> okay. so, in terms of those names, i mean, railroads, the trucking companies, the logistics players, what would you, what would you invest in right now, what would you steer clear of? >> we like some of the trucking names. >> quickly >> yeah, some of the trucking names really sort of missed a terrible thing happening with the vaccine mandate. i look at somebody that could benefit from a new in infrastructure bill as they are
the biggest flat bed carrier biggest exposure in the market >> jason, we appreciate it thanks for joining us. >> thank you well, it's been a heck of a week, hasn't it? with the s&p up 1.3% and rivian shares continuing their advance $111 billion market value. that will do it for us on "squawk on the street. have a great weekend, everybody. "techcheck" starts now. good friday morning. welcome to "techcheck. i'm carl quintanilla today sometimes breaking up is for the best and what other companies in tech, perhaps, could benefit from some space? options trader