tv Tech Check CNBC November 18, 2022 11:00am-12:00pm EST
move up over 440%. almost all the stock was redeemed so you have like maybe half a million shares but then total shares are a lot more than that, but they're not available for trade. wow, that's somewhat extraordinary. we're going to end on that note. that's going to do it for us on "squawk on the street. "techcheck" starts now happy day. welcome to "techcheck. i'm jon fort with deidre bosa. we have earnings from applied material, palo alto network and jd.com what they signal about the current state of the manor. plus, elizabeth holmes awaits sentencing after being convicted on four counts and then the tech layoffs continue and could continue into 2023 amazon and roku trying to rein
in costs as only what elon musk says only hard core employees remain at twitter. >> good morning, jon let's start with amazon. the kmcompany is, quote, making the difficult decision to layoff employees. some layoffs could continue into next year. others receiving buyout offers roku cutting 7% of its staff that impacts about 200 employees. despite the wave of layoffs, jon, we've been talking about them at length morgan stanley has a new note writing these job cuts are not the canary in the coal mine and they reflect the specific issues rather than macro trends they argue, jon, that these john cuts that we're seeing here, especially in silicon valley where i am, won't move the needle in terms of economic data yes, the economic sector accounts for 3 million workers, 1.5% of total payrolls
we know very well in places like san francisco, that has an effect on other businesses around the city in the bay area. we may not see the full effect just yet >> well, you know, d, i think there's a pretty good chance morgan stanley is exactly wrong be that this is not the canary in the coal mine if i remember this metaphor correctly, you have a canary in a coal mine so you know if the air is starting to get bad if the canary, the little canary dies, uh-oh, time to get out of here it's not so much that just these tech sector layoffs are going to have a big mac crow impact, to me it's the fact this is happening based on what's already gone on in 2022. we're not even talking about q4 yet, how the consumer is going to spend or not or what 2023 is looking like when andy jassy is saying these layoffs, we're not going to get them done in q4, let's see what next year looks like
yeah, it's a canary in a coal mine don't think these are done we have to see how the q4, inventory situation, how 2023 looks. >> it speaks to how difficult the macro backdrop is and to parse through. we have layoffs on amazon's corporate side in terms of factory workers, they're still adding for the holiday season there is the divide between white collar and blue collar workers. i was out for dinner in san francisco and it was busy. the restaurant was completely packed it felt like sort of pre-pandemic days. we haven't quite seen that yet >> there's definitely a lot of pent-up demand for getting out of the house these things don't all work at once let's turn to palo alto network. after delivering a beat across the board in fiscal q1 raising guidance for the year ahead, the ceo shared his outlook for the cyber sector in an interview
with "mad money" last night. take a listen. >> cybersecurity is the secular gift that is going to keep on giving we just have to be able to continue to execute in the market and let's hope the customers don't take the eye of the wall and get distracted and say i don't need to prioritize security security needs to continue to be prioritized. >> arora saying they're accelerating cost-cutting measures no signs of a dropoff in cyber spending heading into year end d, i'm though remembering back to some interviews we've done over the past few weeks and one of the things that stuck with me on metrics was how net revenue retention can shift just because of what's happening in the macro. people might still want cybersecurity, but some of these companies that are selling it on a per seat basis or selling it based on consumption, if the overall economy is slowing down,
if these customer companies are not adding employees as quickly as they were, they can be just as committed to the cybersecurity software but not growing their spend on it at the rate that might have been expected >> that's a great point. there is an arr metric the margin impact, he pointed to cybersecurity deals and getting more scrutiny, deeper and longer views of the transformational projects yes, they are transformational maybe we're just starting to see some of those cracks now we know the next few quarters are going to be difficult as well as the fed continues to raise interest rates and say that they need to see a bit more pain for the consumer businesses. >> let's get more not only on palo alto but a look at the entire enterprise software and cybersecurity space bringing in cohesive ceo sanjay putn
i know cohesity dealing in the ransomware backup space, but what do you see happening with deals and what do you make of what i'm trying to figure out on net revenue retention, the idea that those numbers can come down even if your customers are still just as committed because maybe your customers aren't growing head count and consumption as much as they were? >> yeah, i think there's -- as jeff be zoz said this week in palo alto and cisco's earnings i think they're running one of the best companies and there's no compression algorithm for great products i was pleased to see production like expanse, i was an investor in expanse doing really well in the 9-figure deal with d. omp d. cybersecurity as he pointed out is a secular trend
if you are authentic with great products, cisco said they had duo, that's a great product. to your key metric, these are metrics you have to look over the arc of several quarters, whether that's arr, whether that's net revenue retention, whether it's the other aspects of growth and margin and the rule of 40 the palo alto, 25% growth, 20% operating margins. they're scaled, 6, 7 billion they're executing very well. those metrics run themselves out over a multi-quarter period. >> we're also going to get some insights from intel's head of data center and ai a little bit later on in the hour i spoke to her last night. part of that had to do with hyper scaler spending and how perhaps with the macro slowing down they're already starting to rein in some of their spending on infrastructure. that could have an impact in '23. how much of an impact since
we've seen so much power among a few players in cloud infrastructure, how much impact would a slow down in hyper scaler have in software? >> if you looked at the earnings of aws, azure, google, they held quarter over quarter both aws and azure slowed. aws at the mid to high 20s growth had 20 billion revenue in the last quarter that's like producing one adobe in a quarter the so this is huge. i think what's happening to customers, they're throttling back some of their spending. cloud computing is like keeping a light on or off. if they need to use less capacity, they're going to pull it back. maybe big enterprise, they scale back but i still think the trend is inevitable moving that certain at this, the clout,
data, et cetera even as valuations have come down. >> sanjay, these are big numbers and the move to the cloud feels inevitable there's different types of cloud. maybe we're past the first innings for infrastructure how willing are enterprises to spend on the second layer on things like dev ops and cybersecurity? obviously that's remained secure but could we see more secure, even amazon coming down 20% which is a 20% jump down is the market prepared for more? >> yeah. you make a good point. that layer of infrastructure, app and cloud. infrastructure is going to get extremely competitive. that's good for customers as compute storage and marketing get much less differentiated at the platform number, data dog, many of them are partners
aws and azure have some of their own services google plays in that query i'm watching what they do at the sas level. only microsoft has office 365. you know, maybe there's m&a that aws and google consider to bulk up as valuations come down i think there's going to be a lot more layer on the platform horizontally, sort of sectors like we played, security ties across all of those layers, i expect them. microsoft is the only one of those three that's announced a very strong scenario google we're partnering closely with them. >> yeah. a lot of game left to play sanjay, thank you. good to see you. >> happy thanksgiving to you all. >> happy thanksgiving. let's turn to the broader tech sector. our next guest saying patience is key in a bear market. one tech stock he is bullish is taiwan semi. wedgewood partner david rolf
first, let me get you to weigh in on the conversation jon and i were having at the start of the show what about layoffs morgan stanley says it's not a canary in the coal mine. how do you see it? >> maybe it's not a canary in the coal mine for the broad u.s. economy, but i think it's going to be very significant in the greater silicon valley industry. look at how many years we had of 0% financing, free capital, it was open, free running the employment growth at these companies, i think we may be looking at -- in the near future we may be looking at aggregate unemployment figures ex silicon valley i think some of these companies are just getting started and maybe -- again, maybe twitter might be a little bit of a microcosm in that if you can cut back a lot of folks and still, you know, keep the trains
running on time, maybe that's a little bit of an equaling for a lot of companies we know tech stocks that have announced significant layoffs. we're probably in the early innings of that. >> that definitely remains to be seen whether the train is going to be kept running, david. twitter and salesforce, two companies downtown san francisco that we're seeing layoffsat. let's get to your taiwan semipick berkshire hathaway also lakes the company. what do you like about it and how are you viewing that china risk >> well, our thesis on taiwan semi, we call it, you know, a couple of things we think it's one of -- arguably the most important company in the world. we think it's interestingly enough, it's probably one of the most significant companies, much less technology companies, that a lot of people don't own. it's an adr. it's not in any of the s&p 500, it's in none of the benchmarks and in terms of what's going on
with china, word from the company is that they believe it's manageable. there's certain changes that they can make. there's also other demands where they can shift some of that production but we're looking at -- you know, we're in the early innings of this, too and we'll see as the year progresses we're taking the company at its word that, again, it is manageable and there's some demand -- other demands where they can shift production. >> tsmc is well off of its lows when it dipped below 40 a few weeks ago. it's back around, you know, 54, 55 area. how much of what you're looking at where tsmc is concerned, i hope i have that right, how much of what you're looking at has to do with tsmc specifically versus the importance of advance node chip manufacturing how do you play the desire now
for on shoring, for friend shoring of that? how much does it matter the share of u.s. manufacturing that tsmc gets and the amount of traction that intel gets if that plan works out >> well, it's all part of the mix on how we're thinking about, john, advanced technologies here n 7 and n 5 are the big high profit drivers i think also what might be somewhat under appreciated is they're ramping up pretty darn quickly here the next generation three nanometer, 3n. their big competitor is samsung. it looks like samsung it is going to be -- their latest and greatest is going to be used largely in house with their own products taiwan semi, they're going to
have open field. they've already announced price increases of about 22% our view is this is an incredibly capital intensive business, not unlike the railroads in which buffett owns. >> right >> but here's the difference i mean, you don't have a regulator of course market prices, cyclicality. the business is generating cash flow returns on investment on 45% on enormous capital expenditures the likes of, well, intel, apple, qualcomm, their latest and greatest isn't even possible without the size, scale and scope of taiwan semi >> right. >> you're right, the stock has bounced off the lows it's only trading about 13, 14 times next year's earnings >> the chart on the screen shows it above 81 bucks a share.
i was looking at the wrong ticker there yes, directionally, the chart looks there. what tows this mean for enterprise there's mixed signals about the health, i think, of the enterprise overall spending seems to be going well in a lot of different areas. it seems to me enterprise lags consumer at what point do you look and want to see whether weakness in consumer spending ends up translating into weakness in en enterprise area. >> we always ask ourselves, jon, what's in the stock. the stock got ahead of itself, no question about it when you see how low it's gotten at the low it was trading 10 times earnings it was basically pricing in earnings growth basically just flat over calendar 2023. that still may come to pass, but
we think there's a lot of bad news in that, including your thesis that this could plead over, we're probably more at an inflection point the market is goingto digest early 2024 we think most of 2023 is in the price already. >> david, it's always great to get your insights. thank you and have a good weekend. >> thank you, you do the same. carvana announcing it's laying off 1500 employees. that's 8% of the workforce that is the stock that is down 90% year to date the company failed to accurately predict how this would all play out. >> check your canary's, everybody. after the break, ceo of crypto exchange cracken is with us.
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♪ ♪ in the wake of the ftx fallout, crypto balance sheets, or lack of them, are in focus. exchanges have conducted proof of reserve audits to confirm to users and regulators kraken says they have $19 billion in bitcoin and ether this doesn't reveal the full extent of their balance sheet. the same audit firm gave ftx a kl clean bill of health incoming ceo is a partial audit once a year enough to really restore trust in this climate? and for those that are arguing for more transparency like you are. >> yeah, thanks, deidre.
it's a great question. first of all, we really feel for all of the ftx clients and customers out there impacted by this the contagion will likely continue this is not just frankly poor risk management but outright fraud on behalf of ftx and sam bankman-fried. to your question on proof of the reserves, it's one piece of the puzzle we think at kraken it's holistic commitment to security and protecting our client's funds. that's one of our top priorities yes, the proof of reserves is absolutely a piece of that we've implemented that and continued to grow it there's a need for holistic approach and commitment to customer funds we're not exposed to ftx we're not exposed to agaigenesi,
voe yajer. you talk about a holistic approach but your audit is only partial. it only covered 2/3 of your reserve on the platform. if you are committing to transparency, can customers expect to see full balance sheets or audits under your leadership >> absolutely. this is the trajectory we're on for sure we continue to expand the proof of reserves as you noted we continue to expand the coverage across our balance sheet. >> when can they expect it for this year's audit? >> i don't have a specific time line for you unfortunately. >> do we need time lines though? especially in this moment when you guys are trying to build trust. >> yes what's holding back a full audit of your reserves >> again, we've been in this space for a long time, for a
decade now so we've, you know, continued to invest in security all throughout i mean, again, it's an approach that as you noted, the proof of reserves is only one component of investing in clients. we think it's a critical component and we'll invest in over time. >> dave, i'm concerned investors might getting the wrong idea about what proof of reserves tells you. it appears you don't have to have direct exposure to ftx to be badly hurt by ftx gemini is getting hurt because of their exposure to genesis which had limited exposure to ftx. so you can end up without access to your crypto and funds because of a relationship to a relationship to a relationship how do you interpret at that
>> that's a great point. this is how third parties operate. kraken, we've broken the mold. we don't have expose sure to any other counterparties in the cryptocurrency industry. we custody all of our own cryptocurrency i'll just say, how do we untangle all of this i think it's cryptocurrency, ironically this is a moment here that reinforces the face for bitcoin and cryptocurrency in no other point in history is it possible to take digital ownership and self-custody of your own funds. >> i've got to disagree with you. i mean, doesn't this strengthen the case for just having dollars? if you just had some cash in your account, you could put that in cds right now, on a three-month cd get 4%. if you were holding crypto, right, holding bitcoin and lending it out to somebody thinking you were getting 7%, you can't even get your principal back. >> that's a great question
do you remember bare stearns, lehman, do you remember the contagion and the american people had to come in to the tune of trillions of dollars to basically bail out the contagion of the traditional financial services industry. this is what bitcoin was founded on, removing the need for these trusted parties. we see a bright future this is another example of frankly someone, a fraudster that came from traditional financial services, tried to infect the cryptocurrency industry we don't have any place for people like this in the cryptocurrency industry. >> dave, i want to come back to your balance sheet and your business the auditor that you use or the accounting firm to be your partial audit is the same as ftx's unit ftx said a complete absence of trustworthy financial information. that's not exactly an endorsement of any auditor
involved with the company. will you stay with them? >> you know, it's a good question we'll assess we work can multiple auditors and we'll assess the use of this auditor versus others going forward. the truth is there are only so many auditors that have expertise in the cryptocurrency industry that's something we'd like to see kind of continued growth among the audit community to gain this expertise in the cryptocurrency industry and be able to conduct these types of audits. >> last question to you, so can we expect a proof of reserves from kkraken for the end of the career >> i'm not sure. we've been on a six-month clip the next one should be coming in the not too distant future. >> dave, thank you have a great weekend. >> great thanks so much still to come this hour,
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welcome back to "techcheck." i'm deidre bosa with jon fortt we'll take you live outside the courthouse where elizabeth holmes will await her fate let's get a check with contessa brewer. existing home sales fell for a ninth consecutive month. dropped nearly 6% in october which is slightly better than expected number of homes on the market shrank there was barely a three-month supply of homes at the current sales level. that's roughly half the amount considered normal in a balanced market foot locker getting back much of
its gains after posting strong results and raising guidance the stock shot up 18% at the opening bell but now it's up 8%. the company says solid demand, outlook, and good inventory levels helped it weather certain economic conditions. canada says it will sell bonds to help support ukraine. 500 million ukrainian sovereign bonds will be issued this month. canada is the first country to raise money for ukraine with a bond offering. >> contessa, thank you big tech and cost cuts, our next guest asking if google can get out of its own way on head count. joining us now is bernstein's mark schmoolick. these companies hired a lot ledding into this period how does that set the context for the cuts we see now? >> hiring has certainly
ballooned. i think it's clear across tech coming out of the pandemic, everyone believed a lot of the techs were durable, sustainable, hired and planned accordingly. what we've seen from meta and certainly investors have been asking for is trimming, you know, some of those over hires same thing happening with amazon as ambitions kind of get reined in the last one standing, that hasn't gone through big tech on the layoff side is goinogle they hired up to 12.5 thousand new hires this last month. just in terms of the number of new people they brought in. >> my argument, mark, tell me if you think this is right, these cuts are not based on bad times, they're based on times not turning out to be as good as people hoped at the end be of last year. if we are heading into bad
times, there might have to be further cuts and investors should think about that? >> yeah, i think that's absolutely fair. these are growth companies or historically growth companies. they've always hired on the future buildout and inflation and staffed up the cost of capital has gone up, top line growth has kind of disappeared and the other kind of new wrinkle in this environment, nobody's leaving. nowhere else to go attritions have probably record low levels for many of these companies. they're sitting here with head count with a lot of initiatives with a pay back period probably beyond the pay back period both investors and internally these companies are now looking for. >> mark, i'm sure you saw the tci letter to alphabet talking about making a number of changes that you yourself are talking about. in it they talked about waymo and the other bets category. it has not justified the success of the investment and the losses
should be introduced do you believe waymo has not justified the investment >> waymo is an interesting one and certainly one that gets a lot of visibility given the spend on that initiative alone certainly competition in the space like cruz. i think outside of the big bets you could understand why a company like google built on disruption and wants to make sure they continually evolve and disrupt. inside the core business, google fiber, do they need to be in the fiber buildout business that they're certainly putting quite a bit of money to work on. >> what do you think should be on the chopping block? there's obviously this risk if google scales back too much they risk not being in on the next generation technologies. the how do you rank fiber, waymo, stadia? >> one thing we've seen from
google in particular, there are websites dedicated to the google graveyard. there are milestones and be checks and balances when something doesn't hit a particular adoption curve, a return on investment curve, they shut it down like stayed yeah recently what we have seen is as they shut down some of the production they keep the head count and deploy them. in a different environment you have the right to do so. what i would imagine is they look at these initiatives. they're going to shrink or steepen the requirements required to keep investment levels going the tci level, what we've seen with pairs if there was ever a time for them to get a little bit more serious on taking costs out or winding some of the initiatives down, there's probably never been a time for more cover than we have now. >> mark, it seems to me that it's important to note more money isn't be always better for young initiatives, right sometimes you give the team too much money, they sort of spend
it kind of like investors. give them too much money and they deploy it in things they shouldn't. how do you measure across the companies the quality of discipline not saying they should stop investing in self-driving or facebook meta should stop investing in the metaverse, but should you be spending $10 billion a year on it at this point? >> that's the trillion dollar question we've seen hit these companies and their valuations i kind of struggle and i have two minds of this. these were privately-run companies, not out in public purview subject to the whim of changing investor appetites. today it's cost cutting and how would they behave in a private environment. certainly the scale of investments for a lot of these initiatives has certainly run up i think metaverse over at meta has been a big one there's a lot of initiatives buried underneath there.
these companies need to take a long, hard look and where may they see their moat being most at risk and investing in if google needs to say a lot on ai to ep be ensure their moat exists, i'm okay with that >> mark, thank you >> thanks. softbank shares up nearly 12% in tokyo year to date despite losses in the vision fund masa yoshi son could be on the hook for $5 billion. that decision has entangled masa
son's personal funds masa is under no obligation to repay softbank for many years. he has a war chest himself, jon. his net worth stands at $13 billion. for him, remember his 300 year vision he likes to play in the markets. he took a bet on jack ma which has led to his enormous wealth does that 300 year vision mean 300 year pay back? >> good question. >> right yeah wow. we'll see. up next, we'll get a check on the chip sector. applied materials is up on results. also as i mentioned earlier, you'll hear from an evp at intel on the state of data center and hyper scalers in the cloud "techcheck" returns after this
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applied material slashed the forecast for q4 warning about new export regulations but the tone has already changed saying the impact may not be as bad although they warned wafer fab would weaken the record backlog would help it weather the down turn. the second major hurtle could mean losses of $2.5 billion in fiscal 2023 revenue but it could claw back at least a billion dollars of that. the equipment maker group including lam and kla have it rallied back kla up 39%, but micron warning earlier this week that it's slashing memory chips due to weaker demand means the sector isn't out of the woods just jet. jon? >> that's important, chkristina
i spoke to sondra rivera in a deep dive at fort knox we talked about the sapphire rapids data center things are on track for that product and the sequel, emerald rapids in 2023 i also asked whether the economic slowdown has affected demand for chips from the cloud infrastructure zblr even the largest hyper scalers are managing their costs and managing their capacity expansion, and we do see for some of them a pull back not all of them, but most of them are managing very closely their capacity buildouts and i think they've been in their own earnings reports talking about maybe having that buildout be more muted than planned. so i do think this macro economic environment that we're
seeing, whether it's enterprises, whether it's the consumers, services that land on hyper scaler clouds, you know, they scale back their spending, i think everyone is going to be cautious, i would say, in terms of just how big or how fast their expansion plans are implemented but we're still in a high growth market >> still a high growth market. you can watch the entire interview on "techcheck's" linked-in page or on fort knox's youtube channel. d, this is a big question for me as i've been mentioning in q4. how much of whatever the co consumer does starts to have after effects in the enterprise. it seems that intel is expecting that, whether it's positive or negative we'll see. >> certainly we look to the hyper scalers for clues. how much of that spend management she's talking about, jon, will hit intel versus amd i know they're getting their
house in order, but of course it has been losing market share to amd. >> oh, yeah. >> do you think elisa would say the same thing >> everybody can see the share losses intel has been taking the way that intel gains profitable share is by having better product in the market that's why they've got to deliver both sapphire rapids and emerald rapids which i was asking sandra about. >> all that execution. great stuff, jon. after the break, mark zuckerberg says there is a new business we'll tell you about. do not go away even if you got ppp. and all it takes is eight minutes to find out. then we'll work with you to fill out your forms and submit the application. that easy. getrefunds.com has helped businesses like yours claim over $1 billion in payroll tax refunds. but it's only available for a limited time. go to getrefunds.com powered by innovation refunds.
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humana, a more human way to healthcare. juror let's get a check on shares of jd.com stock is under pressure alongside other chinese tech names despite seeing revenue up 11% in the quarter an acceleration where it saw growth at 5% shares of jd.com have been rallying up 50% just this month. more than 90% of analysts have been calling this a buy. it has been a wild month the kweb still up 35% just this month. >> see where it goes next. up next, the sentencing of theranos founder elizabeth holmes taking place in just about an hour. uroure live outside the cothse we are back in 2 come a family tradition? this is financial security.
welcome back as the business world sifts through the wreckage of ftx and what legal consequences will be ahead for founder sam bankman-fried, the sentencing in a high profile fraud case due today. scott cohn is outside the courthouse, has more on what time theranos founder elizabeth holmes might serve >> the maximum is 20 years on each of the four counts she was convicted on back in january for lying to investors about her
blood testing startup theranos it's a day of reckoning for elizabeth holmes who should be here any minute now but also a reckoning in silicon valley where hype and hope can take over substance they want to send her away for 15 years which should be a sentence along the lines of -- because they want to send a message to silicon valley saying a significant custodial sentence will serve not only to deter future startup fraud schemes but it will also serve to rebuild the trust that investors have when investing inivators that's what they say in their presentencing memo elizabeth holmes and her team take a completely different approach they say she's already been punished by a lifetime of scorn over her role of theranos, and they say she should get home confinement, no prison sentence at all or at most 18 months
because they say she still has the capacity to do good, and to back that up 282 pages of letters from 130 of her closest friends and family, they include letters -- a letter from cory booker, the u.s. senator, who says he still considers her a friend, says she still has the capacity to redeem herself and do good work despite that lifetime of scorn. there's also a letter from her partner, billy evans who appears to confirm they're expecting their second child and says her selflessness knows no bounds the defense says that elizabeth holmes should not be judged as the caricature she's made out to be in books and movies but instead look at elizabeth holmes the human being. this will all fall to judge edward an obama appointee seven years on the bench since 20112 and it's really been -- he's
held his close to the vest so we'll be interested to see what he has to say whether he sends her to prison or sends her directly to prison following the sentencing today or lets her remain free on bond pending appeal, and that appeal, guys, is a certainty >> we know you're going to be tracking it all. scott, thank you very much don't forget to follow and subscribe to our podcast, listen anytime, anywhere, where wherever you download podcasts tech check is back in a moment this... is the planning effect. this is how it feels to know you have a wealth plan that covers everything that's important to you. this is what it's like to have a dedicated fidelity advisor looking at your full financial picture. making sure you have the right balance of risk and reward. and helping you plan for future generations. this is "the planning effect" from fidelity.
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one more thing before we go is mark zuckerberg changing his tone on the met averse quote, we talk a lot about very long-term opportunities like the metaverse but the reality is that business messaging is probably going to be the next major pillar of our business the comments come amid a wave of layoffs at the company and the big bet on the metaverse, down more than 60% in a year. i'm guessing you're not going to disagree with this there's
probably more money in messaging and the potential of a super app than a metaverse >> i don't know how much money is in the metaverse, but to me if the metaverse is a long-term bet then as an investor you've got to question the spending wisdom of $10 billion and building it out now. the graphics you're doing now are they going to be good in the long-term? all that work they're doing in 5 or 10 years you're tell me they can't do something better? so can they monetize it in the near-term, and if they can't why are they spending this kind of money on it? boy, if you're on the messaging team building the future of the company but the stalk is being held down but most of the cash is being spent in the metaverse, you don't feel good about it >> the opportunity is in messaging especially on the enterprise side you'd have questions as an employee are we seeing signs he's walking
back those ambitions a little bit, i'm not sure. >> i think the sign will be if he starts spending less on -- and we haven't seen that sign yet, so, you know, don't -- >> the numbers >> it's a controlled company he doesn't have to do anything except stay mark have a great weekend, everybody. let's get to the judge and the half all right, john, thank you very much. welcome everybody to the half time report. i'm scott wapner one firm seeing the biggest in flows to stocks in more than six months, raising hopes for a year end run for your money we'll debate the next move for the markets with the investment committee. joining me right here for the hour today i'll take you to the wall. we're just past 12:00 noon in the east dow is good from 157 33,701 somewhat muted on the s&p and the nasdaq, 381 is where we are on the ten-year note big question, si