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tv   Legal View With Ashleigh Banfield  CNN  May 26, 2014 9:00am-10:01am PDT

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stomach. >> america's defense secretary reacts to the insufferable delays in treating sick and dying veterans, as the nation honors all those who fought for their country on this memorial day. hello, everyone, i'm pamela brown, in for ashleigh banfield. it is monday, may 26th. thank you for being with us on this memorial day. you're watching "legal view." it was one man's twisted world it and now dozens of people, innocent victims and their families are tangleled in it. elliott rodger was set on hurting as many people as possible in his day of recei retribution. a shooting spree in the college town of isla vista, california. he detailed his plans in a chilling manifesto and on a youtube video. this hour, we'll take a look at his mental state. what drove him to commit this
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gruesome act. but, first, here's a look into his disturbing mind through his own words. >> tomorrow, is the day of retribution. the day in which i will have my revenge against humanity, against all of you. >> this chilling video shows elliott rodger, the 22-year-old santa barbara college student who police say killed six and injured 13 in friday's mass shooting and stabbing spree. this day of receipt trip brup b retributi retribution. rodger wrote, all of those beautiful girls i've desired so much in my life but can never have because they despise and loathe me i will destroy. a family friend, simon, says he sent his diatribe to a couple dozen people, including his mother and father, not long before terrorizing the uc santa
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barbara campus. he wrote, i will kill them all and make them suffer, just as they have made me suffer. rodger's mother discovered the terrifying threat in her e-mail at 9:17 that evening. she then discovered her son's last youtube video titled retribution. >> and i will slaughter every single spoiled, stuckup blonde [ bleep ] i see inside there. >> reporter: she called rodgers father and 911. frantically racing to santa barbara. both parents en route when they heard the news. >> shots fired. >> reporter: that they were too late. >> witness it was a dark colored bmw, white occupant, a male, wearing a white shirt. >> reporter: on sunday, the atf and county sheriff's office searched the mother's home. estair says rodgers parents feel a pivotal moment was missed last month. six police officers conducted a well being check on rodger in
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april after his mother discovered other videos he posted online. documenting his, quote, loneliness and misery. but the officers say they found nothing alarming during their check. and in his manifesto, rodger discusses his devastating fear police discover his plan. i would have been thrown in jail, denied the chance to exact revenge on my enemies. i can't imagine a hell darker than that, he wrotes. estair says rodger has been visiting therapists on and off since he was 8 and in high school practically daily. right before his killing spree, rodger was seeing two therapists. estair describing him as reserved to a daunting degree. but estair also says the 22-year-old didn't appear to have violent tendencies and never expressed any fascination in guns. >> so could this all have been prevented if certain warning signs were looked at in a different way? for more on that, i'm joined by cnn legal analyst paul callan in new york and james allen fox, a
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professor of criminology, at northwestern university. also the author of "extreme killing, understanding serial and mass murders." thank you for being with us. paul, want to start with you. we've talked about this over the phone and, you know, police went to elliott rodger's house, they checked in on him in april. they wrote about it, if they searched his home and found his guns, his plans might have been spoiled. what are police allowed to do on welfare checks? could they have done more when that flag was raised a month ago? >> it's hard to say based on what we know now. here's the bottom line on it. the law is the same in most states. if there's evidence to believe you're a threat to yourself or others, you can be brought to a psychiatric facility for an inpatient evaluation. the question is, did he meet that standard. to answer that, we have to know what did the police know when they went to his apartment. now, they're saying they didn't know a whole lot and he acted in
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a totally normal way. so they wouldn't have the right to search his apartment. but what it suggests to me is we need our police officers doing social media checks, particularly on young people, when they go on these visits, because that's where they're posting the revealing items about their personal life and particularly if they're disturbed in some way. i'm just wondering if that had been done here whether we'd have a different outcome in california. >> part of what made this probably so difficult for police, james, is that elliott rodger was able to fool them when they checked on him. he was able to convince them he was okay. in a case like this, when someone is so good at masking their mental health issues, how can police and health professionals see through that? because there are other people out there just like elliott rodger. what signs should these officials look for? >> well, the problem is, there's no telltale warning signs. we talk about red flags, but there are really only yellow flags that turn red only after
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the blood is spilled. we have the benefit of hindsight, 20/20 hindsight is perfect, and at this point, we're looking for all the people who perhaps missed an opportunity, who didn't do what they should have done. this is a common scapegoating effort. but it's -- it's misinformed. there's no way that they could have anticipated what he was about to do. >> pam, can i just jump in on this? >> sure. >> the complexity of this is much greater than is even being reported. you know, one of the things i do, i represent psychiatrists when they get sued. you know what they get sued for? they get sued for admitting people to psychiatric facilities without adequate grounds. and they get sued for not admitting people. so you have to be very careful when you're going to lock somebody up in a psychiatric facility. it's easy, now, to look back and say he should have been locked up, but it's a more complex question than it appeared.
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>> absolutely, it is. and what does it tell you, in light of that, paul that apparently it was the therapist who ended up contacting this mental health hot line, who then contacted police, how common is it for a therapist to get involved to that extent? i would think it means it's pretty serious. >> yes, and i know from representing psychiatrists, they take the patient privilege very, very seriously. i mean, after all, psychiatric patients think their therapist is going to be calling the police based on something said in a session, they lose the confidence that they have in the therapist. so therapist will only do this when they think there's a serious threat. so we've got to find out what that therapist knew when he made the call. >> and when he made the call -- >> and all these -- >> let's keep in mind -- >> go ahead. >> -- his therapist did not think he was violent. this is a consistent situation. we've looked back at adam lanza,
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sandy hook shooting, his therapist didn't think he was violent. we'd like to believe we can collect all the data and be able to identify mass murderers before they act and we simply can't do it. the only consolation here is this is a rare event. that makes it more difficult to predict. there are thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of people, who look very much and act very much and sound very much like this shooter. yet they don't go on a rampage. there's absolutely -- it's like needles in haystacks. very big haystack. >> and you have to be so careful and not stigmatize people with mental health issues. it's really a fine line for police as well. paul callan, james alan fox, so much to discuss, and we'll talk with you again soon. coming up right here on "legal view," what drove him to go on a stabbing and shooting spree before taking his own life? was there anything that could have been done to stop the killer before he cracked? the father of a victim speaks
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out. >> have we learned nothing? these things are going to continue until somebody does something. so where the hell is the leadership? ugh. heartburn. did someone say burn? try alka seltzer reliefchews. they work just as fast and are proven to taste better than tums smoothies assorted fruit. mmm. amazing. yeah, i get that a lot. alka seltzer heartburn reliefchews. enjoy the relief.
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welcome back. i'm pamela brown, here in los angeles. today, a california community is coming together in the wake of a senseless tragedy to try to cope. while many are stunned and disgusted by the suspect, people in isla vista are focusing on the victims. ahead of the deadly shooting, elliott rodger stabbed three men to death in his apartment, two were his roommates.
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the third, 20-year-old huang, was visiting. the the two sorority girls, she was studying archaeology at uc santa barbara, according to facebook, and 19-year-old veronica weiss. her father told the "l.a. times" she played four sports in high school and loved math. and 20-year-old christopher martinez was killed at a deli in isla vista. his father called for stricter gun control and this emotional message. >> i can't tell you how angry i am. it's just awful, and no parent should have to go through this. no parent. to have a kid die because in this kind of a situation, what has changed? have we learned nothing? these things are going to continue until somebody does something. so where the hell is the leadership? >> mm.
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martinez went on to say lawmakers should have taken action after sandy hook, bub they didn't, and now his child is lost too. i'm joined once again by cnn legal analyst paul callan and criminologist james alan fox. paul, a connecticut lawmaker is renewing his call for tougher gun laws after the shooting spree. we know elliott rodger bought his guns legally. we also know he has a long history of mental health issues. he'd been seeing a therapist since he was 8. if someone like him who had never been admitted to a psych ward but was disturbed, plotting this spree for quite some time, apparently, if someone like him can get a gun what hope is there to prevent someone mentally disturbed from buying guns? >> sit frightening. with his prior history, you would think there's no way he would qualify for a gun, but in truth, the gun laws are very, very clear, that you have to be a demonstratably mentally defective person. that's the wording that's used in some of the statutes.
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or you have to have been admitted for inpatient treatment psychiatrically. simply having some sort of sporadic mental health problem is not enough to prohibit you from getting a gun. i think you also have to remember, three of these killings were done with knives as well. so i'm not even sure the carnage would have been entirely prevented by gun control legislation. >> there's a downside, if you start expanding and saying that anyone with mental health problems can't get a gun. what you'll do is you'll discourage people from seeking treatment. because that would disqualify them from their right to getting a gun. mental health here, it's great in the aftermath we talk about access to mental health. what reason are we doing it? because we're concerned about the well being of mentally ill individuals or concerned about the well being of those people they might shoot? i think we're doing the good thing, but not for the right reason. we're sigma tizing the whole class of mentally ill in the process.
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>> let me ask you, james, because i admittedly have been torn covering this story. obviously, something like this happens, it garners a lot of media attention. on one hand, you have this horrific event that demands coverage. at the same time, you want to be careful not to give these killers too much attention and the platform they want, because in many cases, it seems, james, that's what these shooters are looking for. clearly elliott was looking for attention. do you think it could encourage other people out there like elliott to do the same? >> well, there is copycatting. we do know that. we saw that in the 1990s with a whole string of school shootings where kids wanted to become famous like their predecessors. so we do have to be careful. what we should focus on is the crime and the victims. the more we talk about every my newer sha, about the perpetrator, we sometimes turn a monster into a celebrity. we humanize someone who doesn't deserve it. so we need to draw that important line. yeah, also understand that most
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mass murderers don't -- most mass murderers don't -- we need to shed light on their crimes but not a spotlight on the killers. most mass murderers kill for revenge. they're not out for the publicity. that's just a fringe benefit. >> let me just ask you this quickly, james, why is it that in all these recent shootings it seems like the majority of the killers are men acting alone? >> well, most murders are committed by men, 90% of murders are committed by men. mass murders, it's over 95%. acting alone, they tend to be isolated individuals who don't have strong support systems in their lives. and that's part of the reason they go on rampage, is because they don't have support. plus they don't have other people around them who know them well enough to see what's going on in their lives. yes, there are warning signs. but they're just not easy to identify. >> but so often, it's men and not women in the majority of these shootings. and it's just, you know, it's
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horrific and -- james alan fox, paul callan -- were you going to say something quickly, paul? >> yes, with men doing these crimes, all violent crimes, it's mostly men. it's tests at the roen, violent games, and i think historically it's because men come out of a history of violence. it's very, very different than female upbringing and culture. so it doesn't surprise me men are the killers. >> let's not blame games here. >> 98% -- >> there's so much more to this conversation, guys, and i would love to carry on, but, you know, clearly this discussion will continue. something needs to be done here. thank you so much, james alan fox, paul callan, appreciate you coming on today. >> nice being with you, pam. coming up this memorial day, we're keeping an eye on the veterans health care scandal. lawmakers now calling for a criminal investigation. plus, we'll tell you what the defense secretary is saying about the whole situation.
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it is memorial day. for many americans, the unofficial kickoff to summer. much more importantly here, a time for all of us to honor those soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines who died in service to our country. like so many commanders in chief before him, president obama placed a wreath last hour at the tomb of the unknowns at
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arlington national cemetery. he said america can never forget its debt to military families. >> we rededicate ourselves to our sacred obligations to all who wear america's uniform and to the families who stand by them always, that our troops will have the resources they need to do their job, that our nation will never stop searching for those who have gone missing or are held as prisoners of war, that, as we've been reminded in recent days, we must do more to keep faith with our veterans and families and ensure they get the care and benefits and opportunities that they've earned and that they deserve. >> mr. obama just returned this morning from a quick trip to afghanistan. his first there in two years. aides say the visit had nothing to do with the growing scandal over wait times and cover-ups at government hospitals. the president never brought it
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up. the secretary chuck hagel has some thoughts on that subject and he shared them with my cnn colleague jake tapper in washington. hi there, jake, good to see you. what did hagel tell you? >> we talked about a lot of topics, syria, rescuing the girls in nigeria. the focus of the interview in many ways was of course memorial day. he of course comes to the va story from a very interesting perspective. he is a vietnam veteran, secretary chuck hagel, and, also, he worked for the va during the reagan administration and resigned in protest. so i thought he might have a specific reaction, so i asked him about it. are you appalled when you see these stories? >> it makes me sick to my stomach. because it is clear responsibility we have as a country, as a people, to take care of these men and women and their families who sacrificed so much. i know systems are imperfect, i
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get that. but when you've got what we do know, and you're right, we need to get the facts, let's see exactly what happened, why it happened, how it happened, then we've got to fix it, then we have to fix it. >> pamela, secretary hagel did not, of course, call for the resignation of the veterans administration secretary-general shinseki, but he did repeat what president obama said, which is they need to find out what went wrong, and not only fix it, but only then will there be some accountability. >> really looking forward to seeing your interview with secretary hagel, jake, thank you so much. you can catch the interview today at 4:00 p.m. on "the lead." i'm joined now from raleigh, north carolina, by jesse jane duf, a retired marine gunnery sergeant who now served on the organized committee of concerned veterans for america. so glad to have you with us. we appreciate you coming on, this memorial day. >> thank you so much for
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inviting me. >> absolutely. i want to start here just by asking you what or whom do you blame for veterans waiting months for medical care? is it the system, the leaders, both? what do you think? >> well, essentially we've seen this is extensive va mismanagement. it's been going on for years. the scandal in phoenix is one that basically broke the ice open with whistleblowers. we've seen deaths in medical facilities. five men waiting to get in for colon os cappies who died because the wait times were so long. 700 veterans were sick with legionnaires disease in ohio and there's a lawsuit pending now for one who died who went in for surgery and ended up getting ill and dying. the executives who have hidden their wait times for long periods of times. we hope that secretary shinseki resolves this problem. >> do you think, because obviously a lot of blame has been put on shinseki. some people calling for him to be fired.
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do you think that would solve things? >> well, essentially, my organization did ask for his resignation. but we're at a point now where the president has made it clear he wants to see the results of these investigations. so this is where we're at now. let's get this fixed. let's hold the executives accountable. we've got veterans waiting four months with gang green, heart disease, brain tumors. in albuquerque, new mexico, 19 different facilities have been shown to have these scandals with wait times. the va policy is you have to have 14 days to get signed up for an appointment. the executives are hiding their wait lists are four months. we've got to get these executives, to be able to fire them, because they're breaking the policies of the va. >> and of course this investigation is still under way. and of course we're waiting to find out the results of that. this a story that has garnered national attention. you point out that only 1% of americans serve in the military, jesse. do you feel the country understands the full scope of the crisis facing its returning
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service members? >> well, absolutely not, because most people are only aware of the 40 veterans that died in phoenix waiting to be seen. less than 1%, as you said, in this country have served their nation. not only do we want to remember on this memorial day those who died with the ultimate sacrifice for their country, we want to remember veterans who still need our care, because they're dying now by the hands of the va. let me explain one last thing, is that we had 53 veterans die a day in 2011 by the va's own records just waiting for their benefits to get into the system. so these deaths have been going on for an extended period of time. >> and of course on this memorial day, there's a lot of thought going into this, and we just want to thank all of our veterans for your service and the sacrifices you've made for our country and also for all of those service members who are still serving our country. retired marine gunnery sergeant jesse jane guf, thank you so much. let's turn back to our lead
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story this hour, the stabbings and shootings in california. the killer seemed obsessed with wealth and women. how this self-proclaimed vergen went on a killing spree to take revenge on, quote, mankind. are you ready grandma? just a second, sweetie. [ female announcer ] we eased your back pain, you turned up the fun. tylenol® provides strong pain relief while being gentle on your stomach. but for everything we do, we know you do so much more. tylenol®.
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welcome back to "legal view." i'm pamela brown in for ashleigh
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banfield. today, students and neighbors, the university of california, santa barbara, and the santa barbara city college, are trying to cope with it all. multiple crime scenes with three people shot and three others stabbed to death before the troubled killer, elliott rodger, took his own life. the president of the united states has been getting briefings. and the white house spokesman issued a statement saying the president and first lady's thoughts and prayers go out to the families and friends who lost a loved one. alison kosic is right outside the santa barbara sheriff's office. are we getting a better idea of how others perceived elliott rodger? >> we are, because, you know, up until now we've really only had that manifesto to get an idea of what was going through elliott rodger's mind, and now we're hearing from one of his neighbors. rodger lived at an apartment building at isla vista and this neighbor is saying what rodger wound up doing was closing himself off to others.
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in this interview, you're only going to see the back of him. he didn't want to be identified. he did speak with my colleague and in this interview you can see how despite rodger saying in his manifesto saying that he was rejected by girls, this neighbor says that he made many attempts to invite rodgers to parties and that when he finally got him to go to one of these parties, all rodger did was sit and stare at everybody. this neighbor saying that rodger was like a ghost. listen to this. >> he didn't talk. he just -- he didn't talk. i mean, when i talked with him for like the three hours, i pretty much -- i would have to say, like, i would talk for five minutes to try to, like, get some sort of reaction, and then he would say, i don't know, one sentence. and then i'd have to talk to him for another five minutes and then one sentence would come out. i had absolutely no idea. i didn't even know what college he went to. like, i talked to him for that long, and i'm like what do you
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want to do, like, what's your major, what do you want to do with your life? never came out. he didn't say a single thing. >> this neighbor, pamela, also said that the night that the three men were stabbed inside elliott rodger's apartment, that he didn't hear anything, but he also did say that one of his friends who parked his car near rodger's parking spot did see r rodger that night inside his car, parked, on his laptop, right before he was headed out. >> i've been there in santa bra, i know over the weekend there is a vigil. what else is happening with the community? >> well, tomorrow is being declared a day of mourning. so classes at university of california, santa barbara, they're going to be closed tomorrow, and that memorial service will be held. later today, there's also going to be a march in isla vista. what it's going to do, it's going to start at the sorority house where two girls were shot and killed. it's going to go ahead and stop
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at every place where each of the six victims were killed, to honor those whose lives were lost. pamela. >> alison kosic, thank you for your reporting there at the santa barbara sheriff's office. we appreciate it. up next, malaysia is finally releasing that satellite data used to pinpoint the search area for flight 370. so why have the families had to wait 80 days? and will it give them any of the answers they want. we'll be right back. those little things still get you.
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that corporate trial by fire when every slacker gets his due. and yet, there's someone around the office who hasn't had a performance review in a while. someone whose poor performance is slowing down the entire organization. i'm looking at you phone company dsl. check your speed. see how fast your internet can be. switch now and add voice and tv for $34.90. comcast business built for business. the underwater search for malaysia airlines flight 370 is about to go on hold for at least two months. but not before the world learns why the search is focused off western australia in the first place. the head of australia's transport safety bureau says the bluefin droen will wrap up its
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final mission on wednesday, and then australia will seek bids from private contractors for gear like this, able to scan much larger areas and transmit data in real time, making those deals, deciding who will pay and getting more assets in place will likely take until august at the soonest. tomorrow, however, malaysia is set to release the satellite data that provided the only real evidence of flight 370's whereabouts once it fell off the malaysia military radar. joining me is former aviation accident investigator david soucie. david, we've been talking a lot about this data. what will it consist of? >> well, it's going to be interesting to see, because it's been reviewed over the last few days and kind of dissected again by the malaysian government and by the aaib. it will be interesting to see what they put out. it's intended to put out the raw
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data, every single piece of information that has to do with inmar sat. it's going to be a little confusing, again, though, even to the trained observer, because it's only going to include inmarsat, and there's a bunch of systems here, the system on the airplane that honeywell makes, and it's going to have data. i'm worried that when it comes out, even these experts are not going to be able to come up with anything different than the results malaysia had in the first place. >> officials had this data for quite some time. why do you think it's taken so long for malaysia to release it? >> that's a real good question. i've been asking that myself. some of the answers, they're kind of an interesting situation. they're in a no win position. if they release all the data, people will interpret it in a thousand different ways. if they just sent the raw data out with no explanation. they're telling us they're spending time now coming up with explanations and reasons and i think basically justifications
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for why they had the confidence that they did to continue the search in the area to the south. so i'm hoping that that is a good explanation, because if it isn't, we're going to be right back where we started. >> hard to imagine. of course, this is something that the families have been calling for, the malaysian government to release. i want to turn now to the under water search that's been going on. one of the big questions that i still haven't really heard a good answer to is why weren't bigger and more capable assets brought in long ago? or more bluefins? is it a money question? >> i don't think it's money. i think it was a matter of their confidence that they had that they would find the airplane. they had the bluefin. they were promised the bluefin would be capable to search in these areas. they didn't know if the bluefin was going to be able to go that deep. i think what happened here is they had overconfidence in the fact the ping data and the inmarsat data had put them right in the perfect location, and
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that they'd be able to go right out there and find the airplane with the bluefin-21, which of course has proven not to be the case, so now they've got to regroup and get that equipment out which takes, as you said, months. >> yeah, so discouraging. here we are, david, around 80 days since the plane went missing. do you think it's ever going to be found? >> i do think it's going to be found. last week, i met with the malaysian -- or excuse me, with the international civil aviation organization president and he emphasized the need it really needs to be found because without that, the confidence in air travel could be in trouble. people will need to know what happened to that airplane to really feel safe. he doesn't think it will stop. i think we need to keep looking until we find it. >> yeah, there are a lot of boeing 777s out there flying today. and also just for the family's sake, it shouldn't stop. david soucie, thank you very much. we'll talk more tomorrow when that data is expected to be released. coming up right here on
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... many okinawans stay so ractive as they age... (elder man speaks in japanese) (elder man then laughs) (elder woman speaks in japanese) but okinawans know one reason... elder couple laughs) ...they eat well to be well... life has isoflavone, a key ingredient to the... ... okinawa diet. a secret of ... ( elder couple laugh) ... vitality from people ... ... who really know how to live. (female scientists yells) hey! (elder couple laugh) okinawa life! a few stories making headlines at this hour. in western colorado, the search is on for three people missing after a huge mudslide there. an area land four miles long,
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two miles wide and 250 feet deep gave way after a day of heavy rain. roadblocks are up to keep people away from what police call a very unstable area. and armed gunmen kept most people in donestk and other parts of ukraine from voting in the presidential election there. billionaire petro poroshenko is promising to bring peace to the country but today there is fighting between separatists at the airport in donetsk. a critical part of the pistorius trial begins today but not in the courtroom. the olympian, known as the blade runner is accused of murdering his girlfriend in a valentine's day shooting last year. right now, he's in a high security psychiatric hospital. >> reporter: pistorius has begun that 30-day period of observation where he'll biblized
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by an expert panel at a maximum security psychiatric hospital. now, controversially, he's being treated as an outpatient. this is very unusual. but the judge had ruled that she didn't want pistorius or his team to think he was being punished twice. that's why he's not being forced to be an inpatient at the facility. at stake, the question, is he criminally responsible for his actions the night he shot and killed his girlfriend. can he tell right from wrong and act in accordance with that. a report has to be given to the judge in more than 30 days. and this is very important. this whole process. on what his mental state was at the time of the shooting. because not only could it have some impact on the actual verdict, but even if he's convicted, it could have an impact on sentencing. back to you, pamela. >> all right, robyn curnow, thank you so much. the results of this evaluation could have a significant impact
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on the eventual verdict or sentencing. so now let's bring in our cnn legal analyst paul callan. paul, great to see you again. you're joining us from new york. i want you to play defense attorney for us. how much is at stake for oscar pistorius here? >> well, everything is at stake. really. because from the standpoint of the defense, the judge is going to be heavily influenceped by this. i mean, i was amazed by it. in an american courtroom, you would have to plead insanity in advance trial in order to offer some kind of a variation of the insanity defense. now, here, it's been dropped in the middle of the trial. i will tell you, frequently, there are conversations when you would be found incapable of standing trial. incapacitated to stand trial. but, and i judge will send you off to be evaluated. here, the judge is saying he's been acting so strangely, he's got to be evaluated.
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i think it could have a big impact on her because ultimately if she goes with a lower offense, culpable homicide, she could give him probation for the murder. and she may say, based on the doctor reports, he is so distraught that he couldn't have planned this murder, it must be an emotional reaction to the situation. so interesting development. >> as you pointed out, paul, was sort of dropped in the middle of it, pistorius saying he suffered from generalized personality disorder and has since childhood. do you think that could render him incapacitated during the shooting? >> i've been watching very, very closely. i mean, this guy has been crying for half the trial. i mean, he gets on the witness stand, and they even put a pail next to the witness stand because he was vomiting and retching. he wasn't making up the vomiting and retching. i was a little skeptical, being the skeptic, that he was making this up. that's what led the judge to
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say, you know something, this activity is so bizarre, he's got to be evaluated. so i think in the end, this could be something that could help the defense tremendously, because, you know, the prosecutor was saying, hey, he's making this up, he's acting, this is not real. if the psychiatrists come back and say he has a mental defect and problem that could have caused this, you know, the judge might find in his favor. here's the danger, he could also be admitted for psychiatric treatment inpatient permanently if they find he's a danger to himself or society. it's always dangerous when you go the insanity defense. >> one finding out of all this could be diminished responsibility at the time he killed steenkamp. how do you think that finding could play into this trial? >> well, to me, that's the most probable outcome of this trial, and, you know, the evidence that was offered by the prosecutor to prove that he premeditated this
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murder, a lot of it was very, very strong. but what you can't deny in the end is he fired into a closed bathroom door, killing his girlfriend. now, who would do that? somebody who did not act reasonably i think under the circumstances, and i think that's the diminished capacity, finding -- it will be a finding culpable homicide if the judge believes that. she could give him probation. she seems to be leaning over backwards for him. i've never heard of a judge in a murder case say, we're not going to punish you twice by making you have an inpatient examination, we'll let you commute from your house. that's pretty lenient attitude from a judge in a murder case. >> yeah, that's an interesting point. paul callan, thank you so much. great to see you. >> okay, thank you, pam. coming up right here on "legal view," mary jane, marijuana, pot, whatever you call it, the explosive side
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effect. we're going to tell you what that is up next. the was a truly amazing day. without angie's list, i don't know if we could have found all the services we needed for our riley. for over 18 years we've helped people take care of the things that matter most. join today at
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marijuana, reefer, pot, whatever you call it, it's creating a conversation across the nation. today, it can be used recreationally in washington and colorado, plus, medical marijuana is now legal in 20 states from coast to coast, and in colorado, it is legal to buy and sell hash oil products. hash oil has extremely high thc content, it's cheap and easy to make. the result is a very volatile situation, literally exploding across the country. >> my hands, my face, my whole body. the worst pain in my entire
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life. >> what was going through your mind? >> oh, my god, what did i do? what did i do? >> reporter: wayne is lucky to be alive. an explosion in his kitchen burned his hands down to the bone. >> it was just hell, all in one second, an immediate instant. >> reporter: he was making hash oil, also known as wax, shatter and dabs. >> they say a dab will do you. >> reporter: a product flying off the shelves of colorado marijuana disspendries. many consider it the most pure form of thc. >> thc content possibly equal to the amount of what you might get in one joint or two. or a few. >> reporter: it's made using butane to ex-stand thc from the can business plant. you're left with an oily or waxy substance. there are dozens of videos on youtube that show how easy it is to make, but also how risky it is. hash oil explosions and fires
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are become a concern around the country, from washington, to hawaii, to new york and california. then happening in homes, apartments, even hotel rooms. in southern california, authorities are cracking down. there, the product is outlawed. >> we've identified how separate butane hash oil extraction labs of which 20 have resulted in fires and explosions. >> just seeing this pattern and trends, we can't ignore it. >> reporter: the burn trauma icu has treated at least ten victims of hash oil explosions since january. that's ten timings the number treated in all of 2012 and on track to far surpass last year's numbers. >> we had one woman, she came in with a 90% burn, so she was with us for two months. >> reporter: it's now been more than a year since winkler left the hospital. he considers himself healed. but the scars on his hands are constant reminders of the day he almost died. >> while i was doing this
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interview, if i i can stop someone else from being burned, maybe stop them from doing it, that's what i'm doing this for. >> and thank you to anna. thank you to all our veterans and service members on this memorial day. brianna keilar takes it from here. right now, we're learning more about the 22-year-old who went on a murder spree friday night in california. elliott rodger left behind youtube videos, a manifesto and long history of contact with mental health professionals. also right now, pope francis is about to leave israel after getting palestinian and israeli leaders to agree to come to the vatican to pray for peace. can this pope also play the role of peace maker? and right now, thousands of people are gathered at the vietnam veterans memorial in washington to mark memorial day. earlier, president obama laid a wreath at


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