tv The Seventies CNN June 15, 2015 6:00pm-7:01pm PDT
it's 9:00. do you know where two fugitive killers are? authorities don't right now. it's been a week and a half since they broke out of prison. their trail -- late word that david and richard were planning to kill prison seemstress joyce mitch e's husband when they got out. the big question was it a bonus for her help, or was it a threat if she refused to help or a red herring to divert attention from their real get-away plan? a tangled web, no doubt about it. one that we'll try to untangle starting with randi kay's reporting. what do you know about this plot? >> this is new information coming to us from a source with direct knowledge of this investigation. this source telling me that the two escapees, richard we knew
she was are a wear of it, though, anderson. also, this psalm source telling me tonight that joyce mitchell did have a sexual relationship. not just a friendship with richard. one of the escapees. he is the escapeee who is a very violent man. he killed and dismembered his neighbor. it's unclear, anderson, how long that sexual relationship is going on or how they were able to carry it out in the prison. all of this is coming from joyce mitchell herself ultimately. the flaw in all this is if she is incorrect whether this may be sort of their plan b as one of our guests in the last hour suggested that maybe there was another plan that these two had and that they just kind of gave her a lot of information that she might end up giving authorities. >> right. there's a lot of questions about were they really relying on her?
were they setting her up? did they want to go as somebody else? would they really have taken her along with them? maybe there was a plan to kill her. they're all trying to figure that out right now. all the investigators are hard at work on that. they're talking to a lot of people as we told you. they're talking to lyle mitchell, her husband, and they're also talking to her son, toby mitchell, anderson. they've questioned him. police have met with him at least once. they wanted to know from him according to the district attorney today telling me that police asked him what he knew about the men's relationship with his mom, joyce mitchell, what had she told them about the men, what had she told them about her plans with the men and what he knew about her relationship with them. >> and what's the latest on the manhunt itself? >> well, the trail is getting cold, so investigators right now are resorting to other means. i have right here -- this is a motion detector, and this is what they're setting up in the woods. they're attaching them to trees. they actually have cameras on them and sensors, so if somebody were to walk by and a sensor
picked up some activity, it could take a picture. that would be one way of know if anything she's guys were still in the area because they just don't know. the blood hounds are out there, but the scent has certainly grown week weaker. still nearly 900 leads, anned son. they have found nothing. they have search and cleared more than 400 homes and still nothing. the governor today, anned anderson, saying they could be in this area or maybe they're in mexico. that is the last thing that searchers here want to hear. >> a lot of ground between here and there. randi, appreciate it. the possibility not only did joyce mitchell not want matt and richard to kill her husband. miguel joins us now as new information from his sources. what have you heard? >> well, this is a state source that is telling cnn that it is possible that -- or that joyce mitchell is saying that the relationship was developed between these two inmates, that as she began to help them, they then turned that relationship on her, telling her that if she didn't continue to help them, that they would turn her in.
>> this is where the plot to kill him may come in. it may be that they basically told her her husband lyle also working in the prison that they would kill him if she didn't continue to cooperate with him. all of this became a very tightly closed loop. all she had to do was go to authorities, but because she got cold feet, she was talked into picking them up that night before all that happened, she couldn't go through with it, and basically backed out of it, but then never told authorities either. >> thank you. here to talk about where the case may lead our legal analyst jeffrey tubin and mark geragos. jeffrey is a former prosecutor, and mark is one of the better criminal defense attorneys around. mark, the new reporting that there was a murder plot against joyce mitchell's husband, i
mean, if she knew about that and it was going along with it, i assume she could face additional charges for that, couldn't she? >> yeah. absolutely. i will tell you, although this is all speculation, this makes infinitely more sense than the previous reports that were coming out last week that they were looking at him and at the same time suggesting there was some kind of a sexual relationship between her and the escapees. this at least rings a little more true. look, she's got -- she's in a world of hurt. she's got virtually nowhere to go at this point. she's talked and talked and talked, and they probably bled although information out of her before she got lawyered up. at this point she's just got to get down and pray every minute of every day that nobody gets hurt in the capture of these two. >> because, as you pointed out, if they hurt somebody, if they killed somebody and they get killed, she's the last person
standing. >> she's the last person standing, and nobody is going to have any sympathy or empathy for her whatsoever. >> yeah. >> and she will be -- some creative prosecutor will charge her with some kind of a death case, and it will -- her life as she knows it will be over, even though it probably is right now. >> jeff, law enforcement officials are also investigating whether these two men in some way threatened heifer to force her to help in the escape. if that is, in fact, the case, would that change the d.a.'s case against her, even if she had helped, if she was under some sort of dur esor threat? >> she could claim that. if, in fact, she gave all these -- all this equipment to them without going to the authorities and reporting them, i think it's very -- it's very difficult. it's going to be very difficult to make any sort of durress defense. another thing worth keeping in mind in all of this is potentially how devious these guys are. it's entirely possible that they told her they were going to run
off with her, and they might have killed her. she is at some -- at some level a sympathetic figure, but no prosecutor, no jury, no judge is going to feel sympathy for her because she allowed herself to get manipulate and she participated in, it seems, in a very, very terrible escape. >> mark, i mean, tlaz cynical way of looking at it too which is it would be very convenient to claim that she was being forced to do this. >> well, and that's what a lot of people are going to say, and i guarantee you that's what some prosecutor is going to say. however, by all accounts, and i hate to prejudge her, but this does not look like the most sophisticated woman in the world. it looks like she was man ip late by a couple of, you know, sociopaths, for lack of a better term, and that she was beguiled by these guys and who knows what they were telling her or what
was involved? it's pathetic. i mean, at a certain level, there is a degree of sympathy or empathy just because she is such a pathetic figure in all of this, and at one level she is a victim, but she's an unwitting conspirator at the same time. >> jeff, the district attorney said wrerl tonight he is not totally confident that joyce mitchell has told them everything she knows. if that's true, could she. i mean, again, is it another potential charge and withholding information? >> i don't think they could charge her with withholding information at this point. she's not obligated to say anything at all. she has one thing to offer that might do her some good, which is to help them find these guys. at this point after all these days, it's hard to imagine that they haven't gotten everything they're going to get from her. the one thing that could do her some good, some judge might pay attention to in stock exchangesing is if she really
did help the authorities catch these guys. look, it's been a long time. they've been speaking to her for a long time, and they haven't found him. i just don't -- i think she's got very few options that are going to do -- >> >> more -- i'm going to talk to him, and later, the strange and totally confusing case of rachel dolezal, the whole unexpected debate it has sparked about race and identity. i take these out... ...to put in dr. scholl's active series insoles. they help reduce wear and tear on my legs, becuase they have triple zone protection. ... and reduce shock by 40%.
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again tonight breaking news officials believe murder may have been part of the escape plan. namely joyce mitchell's husband, lyle. the question was was it a bonus for her, or was it a threat to her, or simply a diverse? more on her legal status, the relationship with the pair of fugitives. i spoke about it earlier this evening with the clinton county district attorney andrew wiley. >> mr. wiley, just this evening we learned there was a murder plot against joyce mitchell's husband, that these men intended to kill him. what, if anything, can you say about that? >> it's been a determination that we will not xhenlt on this part of the investigation. due to the severity of the allegations, we are continuing to work with joyce mitchell if she wants to continue to work with us. >> the fact that joyce mitchell had a sexual relationship with
richard matt, do you have any idea how long that was going on for? >> any allegations of a sexual relationship between the two i'm not going to comment on. >> there's a report that she gave him gloves similar to boxing gloves along with glasses and batteries as far back as october 2013. i'm wondering if you can confirm that, and if so, is there any indication she brought in other contraband between 2013 and the weeks leading up to the escape? >> she brought those in to hem in late 2013. it was then later that she brought in the reading -- or glasses with lights on them and she was told by matt that, excuse me, they're using those to stay up late at night to paint pictures or to read and then she provided batteries for them. i think subsequent to that when, you know, the investigation started picking up as far as our
interviews with her that, you know, she advised us that obviously she was aware of that they were probably using those to down in the tunnels to cut through the walls and the pipes and the tunnels. >> earlier today you told randi kay that investigators found additional notes left by the fugitives. do you have any more information about those notes, where they were found, what they might have said? >> not what they said, but just indications, as my understanding, that they were almost like a road map. you know, they're progressive. daily, you know, search of a way out of the facility. to looking at those notes and helping them mark their way out when they finally made their escape. >> finally, do you think joyce mitchell has given you everything that she knows and at this point given where it is, is she still cooperating? does she now have an attorney? is she still talking? >> she does have an attorney.
she expressed that she wanted to continue to speak with law enforcement officers. she was brought to plattsburg for her court appearance today. at that point in time she continued to speak out relative to her involvement with police officers, with mr. bruno present, and i'm waiting to hear from mr. johnson to see if she wants to continue to speak with us. if she does, we'll talk with her. >> has there been any communication between her and her husband? has her husband visited her? >> it's my understanding that he has not visited her since she's been taken into custody, and they have not had any telephone communication. >> andrew wiley, appreciate your time. thank you. >> thank you, sir. >> that's the background that we know. i want to turn next to former u.s. marshall john cuff who headed up the service's northeast fugitive investigation division. the news, john, that these two may have had some sort of a plot
to kill joyce mitchell's husband, does it make any sense to you? i mean, does it -- we don't know if she was involved with it, if it was the threat used against her, or if some ofs some sort of a red herring, this is just like a plan b? >> it doesn't make sense. on the face of it, going back to when these guys -- before they escaped, they'll exploit someone, they'll see a weakness in someone and use whatever they can to. >> along that way maybe they had a conversation like that, but is it plausible? as soon as they come out of that man hope, they're going to go kill the husband? >> the idea if she had driven a getaway car for them, if she would have stayed with them, that also doesn't seem plausible.
>> i think she -- i think she would be expendable. whenever they got to where they were going to go. >> a liability. >> use her for whatever you need to use her for. >> the fact that there's no evidence yet of any vehicles being stolen, supplies taken, cabin broken into, what does that tell you? >> that indicates one of two things. either she was played all the way, or that she was going to be the get-away driver, and maybe it's plausible that there was a plan b, another get-away. >> it very well may be -- i hope i'm wrong. i'm hoping here still up in that woods and that they are apprehended soon. law enforcement has to go with what you have, right, so what you were given, the hand that you were dealt was this, that they're up there, that she was
supposed to have that getaway car. you got to remember too, there's a future investigation going on. law enforcement is not putting all of their eggs in this one bafshgt. >> a fugitive investigation is a much wider net. >> from day one they would have exploited any information that's in that prison. the visit records, phone records, the associates, the criminal backgrounds to include, let's say, were they visiting a law library? the inmate library. what sites were they accessing? things of that nature. to include their personal property. >> it's a multi-pronged investigation. >> leads will be panned out around the country and around the world if need be. >> appreciate your expertise. thank you very much. for more on this and others, go to cnn.com. just ahead, rachel dolezal stepping done from her post at the naacp. she still hasn't answered the allegation that is prompted her resignation that for years she's lied about her race and she's black when her parents say she and they are white.
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daughter when she was young as well as her own birth certificate. today dolezal short-circuited some of the anger over the revelations. she resigned from her post at the spokane chapter of the naacp. stephanie elam has the latest. >> reporter: while rachel dolezal still didn't answer the burning question about her race -- >> are your parents white? >> reporter: the president of the spokane naacp chapter is stepping down. writing, "i have waited in deference while others expressed their feelings. absent the full story. it is with complete allegiance to the cause of racial and social justice that i step aslide. i will never stop fighting for human rights." that resignation changing tonight's planned protest into a rally for laehealing. >> we're going to make the conscious decision to forgive rachel, forgive although things that have happened. >> reporter: yet, the national conversation continues to brew. with dolezal's adopted brother calling his sister's behavior black-face. here is he on abc.
>> she took me aside and told me to make sure that no one found out where she was actually from and for me not to blow her cover. sdlo this is what we have. we have older white men on our currency wrshz. >> this is giving fuel to some of her critic who's see her actions as deliberate and calculating. >> it's a hurtful thing for me because i believed in somebody that i thought was someone else. >> though she is stepping down, she says she's not backing down from her social activism. a stance some in spokane honor, despite their dramatic turn. >> does it change how we feel about rachel, and it doesn't discredit her work and everything that she has built and accomplished since -- as long as we've all known her. >> stephanie elam joins us from spokane, washington. so you're at a rally outside the offices of the naacp there. what is the latest? >> yeah, let's just show you what it looks like. it's relatively small, anderson, but a small group of people out there saying that they want to
show the world that they can forgive and move forward. at one point one speaker actually going forward and saying that what really needs to happen here is that everyone needs to pray for everyone here for the organization and also pray for rachel as there's this new change taking place here for this chapter of the naacp, anderson. >> stephanie, appreciate it. a lot to talk about. joining me now cnn political contributor and op ed columnist charles blow. also cultural critic and writer mikaela angela davis. you and i talked last week. i'm just wondering your latest thoughts on this, where you are now. did she need to step down? what do you want to hear from her? >> i want to hear why. i think most people -- you know, ironically, a couple of years ago i wrote an essay in an anthology called everything but the burden. what's odd about her is she wants the burden. you know, she takes on the struggle, the hair struggle, the identity struggle which -- >> can she do that?
>> no. in my opinion you cannot achieve blackness. black -- being black is something that you belong to. it is not something that you borrow. you cannot have the history. you can't own the history. you can't own the heritage. you can't own the complexities and what it's like to be particularly a light-skinned black girl and having to defend your identity all the time is a very particular experience. >> constantly being asked what are you, where are you from? >> exactly. this is what this is triggering for a lot of black girls out there and a lot of blal black women. it's a very specific kind of scab that she's picking at with black women who have had to defend their beauty, to defend their natural hair. all of that. >> to one of her siblinging's point saying shoo these wearing black face. i mean, is she wearing some sort of toner on her skin? >> i think she has a very sophisticated expression of -- performance of her blackness. i think she is performing in the leg as where i of a cathleen
clooefr or angela davis. she has studied us. she knows that that foundation is closer to mixed race skin or skin like mine that has yellow undertones and not pink undertone where's, she's doing something very sfis indicated. you've seen her look kind of orange. that famous meme orange is the new black. she has gotten better at her performance at blackness, and it is very sophisticated down to her announcing her twist-out to have hair that performs like mine, that performs like, you know, mixed race people. her deceit is so detailed and her wanting to be inside of this body is so detailed, and it is hurtful, and i feel like there needs to be some prayers for all the black people that she has hurt. >> charles, do you see this as deceitful? >> absolutely. as you explained, it's an elaborate deceit. as some of the people in the piece were saying, it doesn't necessarily take away from your
talents and whatever you may have accomplished, but those accomplishments do not erase the deceit, right? the deceit cannot kind of buttress the accomplishments. those things are operating kind of in separate kind of spheres, and i think we have to kind of keep that in mind. >> it is interesting because the naacp, and in their initial statement they focus on her accomplishments, and said, look, you -- the naacp has many white members, and that's fine. they seem to completely ignore the whole question of a deceit. >> so does she, right? when she -- her letter that she publishes that says she's resigning, is all about the work and none of it is about deceit. none of it is about the interpersonal play that i am performing between myself and the people who trust and love me and the people who have looked up to me. none of it is about that. i think that that's a personal thing. you know, my mom always says if you tell us you've never -- remember what you say. this woman, it seems, is
performing her entire life. she has to remember everything that she says, and she is creating an entire back story of why one video of her today where she was talking about being 4 years old and having to negotiate between the brown crayon and the peach crayon. >> mrooets let's play that video. >> my first portral that i drew of myself i was 4. i was coloring. all my portraits were with the brown crayon. brown crayon, black hair. braids or curls or whatever. the teacher saying taking the brown crayon away and saying you need to use the peach crayon. >> so that probably didn't happen. >> well, if the pictures that her parents have produced are real, you cannot have had the black hair if you had the blonde hair, right? and also the negotiation between the peach crayon and the brown crayon, unless -- if she was
having -- identifying with the adopted brothers and she was picturing herself at 4 years old being black even though the image she saw in the mirror was not black. maybe some of that is happening. we don't know psychologically what's happening. >> i believe those kids were adopted a lot later on. >> you would think that her parents, like, you know, this comparison to trans-gender people, which is -- >> let me bring that up. some people have said if caitlyn jenner can decide she's caitlyn jenner, why can't this woman decide she's black? >> i am so not here for that conversation. it's not true. if she did struggle with those crayons as an early child, her parents would have seen that, just like trans-parents often see this disconnect. >> you talk to people that are trans-gender, and they say this is something they have felt from their earliest memories. >> it involved other people and make them lie where are they're trying to be their authentic self. the opposite of being authentic is deceiving. >> the notion that you can
choose your race, is that -- people say race is a social construct. why can't -- >> it's absolutely a social construct scientifically, but we do have to make a demarcation in this gender-race conversation, right? you can perform gender in a lot of different ways. i can perform gender 25% female and still claim masculinity. in america as we have constructed a race in this country you cannot perform blackness 25% of the time and still claim to be white, right? because we have set up this kind of racist architecture that says one drop of blackness makes you black. the reason that is racist is because the glove cannot be turned inside out. you cannot say that one drop of whiteness in my blood makes -- allows me to be white. it is starting from a privileged position and moving into the sphere of people that have not enjoyed that privilege in the first place. that is i think part of the issue that people are having with this. >> if there was trans-racial,
don't you think some of our ancestors would have chosen to be white and not die and not be hung and not be denied school and not be denied privileges and not be denied the right to vote? if that were a possibility, it doesn't work the other way around? >> i also believe -- i just wanted to say this, you know, race -- like you said, it is socially constructed. however, the expression of blackness, particularly in america, is the culture that developed around that social construction. it is a response to oppression. it is a resilience. if you have not experienced that resilience and that resilience is born in the blood, and it is transferred intergenerationally, and you cannot say i will change my appearance and adopt the resilience that the story my mother told that my grandmother told and all of that that has helped me to survive this existence. it doesn't work that way. >> it's a fascinating conversation. frank lishgs i could talk to you about this for an hour because -- >> it's crazy. >> we'll see.
i would love to talk to her. i know you would as well. >> i would love to talk to her. >> it would be interesting to hear her perspective, where her mind is at. thank you for coming on. >> thank you. >> former governor jeb bush jumped into the presidential race today announcing his candidacy in miami. new details on the family discussion that is led to his decision and whether the famous name will be a blessing or a curse on the campaign trail. ugh! heartburn! did someone say burn? try alka-seltzer heartburn reliefchews. they work fast and don't taste chalky.
so here's what it comes down to. our country is on a very bad course, and the question is what are we going to do about it? the question for me -- the question for me is what am i going to do about it? i have decided i'm a candidate for president of the united states of america. >> probably fair to say very few, if anyone, was surprised by that announcement. it's been quite the build-up. governor bush is the 11th republican to jump into the race, and today he made a point of saying that he will have to win on his own merits, not because of his family name. will it be possible, though, to set himself apart from his family and their deep political roots? our chief political analyst gloria digs deep. >> reporter: what's in a name? plenty. if you are jeb bush and you are running for president. >> we want george bush! >> after years of -- or i guess months of deliberation dad has
decided change his name to jeb bushovski. >> jeb jr. joked about it in an exclusive interview with cnn, but linneage is a serious issue as he attempts to break the usual long-term lease on the white house. >> everybody knows i'm w.'s brother, and i consider that a blessing as well. but i'm also my own person. i've lived my own life. >> on my orders. >> now he has to live with his brother's decisions. with the public that's not exactly clambering for one more bush, it's tricky. >> my brother, who i love more than life. >> the united states -- >> especially since jeb can't quite bring himself to second guess the decision to invade iraq. >> of course, anybody would have made different decisions. there's no denying that. >> knowing what we know now, what would you have done? i would have not engaged. i would not have gone into iraq.
>> george w. and jeb -- >> it's complicated, says his other brother, neil. >> the question is, oh, this is just another member of the bush dynasty. right? and that what do you -- >> mom would kill you for using the dynasty word. go ahead. what's the question? >> what's wrong with the dynasty word? >> i don't have any problem with it. jeb will inherit his mom says or dad says. awful their enemies and half of their friends kind of thing. it's not like it's automatically a benefit to have a famous name. >> happy birthday, mr. president. >> i'm glad my family is all with me here. >> especially when you have to prove you're different. >> i think he would be a great president. >> it can't be about my mom and dad or my brother who i love. i love them all. >> actually, jeb is a bit of a family renegade, trading the yale tradition for u.t. and houston, texas, for miami, florida. a state that made him governor. >> i, jeb bush -- >> and eventually made his brother president. >> he studied latin american
studies in college. he lived and worked in venezuela out of college. >> anna navarro is a dprefriend supporter. >> he is not just bilingual. he is bicultural. i will be able to break into spanish with him and maybe tell him something that only a hispanic would get. this is a guy who in high school went to do an exchange program in mexico. that's where he first met columba. >> the daughter of a mexican farmer whom he married 40 years ago. >> i fell madly in love. it was love at first sight. it was head over heels in love. it was i lose 20 pounds in three weeks in love. i couldn't sleep in love. it was a transformative event in my life. >> my mom still only speaks to me in spanish. unfortunately, i respond in english. when mom moved to this country, she -- her english wasn't that great. you know, she really -- i think she probably met her in-laws the
first time at the wedding chapel. >> wow. that's hard. >> especially hard when your new in-laws are american political royalty. george and barbara bush. >> mom hates politics. she's not a huge fan of it, which probably makes her the only sane person in the family, but she's got a servant's heart. >> thank you very much for being here. >> she was all in as first lady of florida, and, yeah, i know she'll be there to support dad 110%. >> how was this decision made inside the family? >> this past thanksgiving we all got together in mexico. we had a kind of candid conversation. >> what made her change her mind? >> i think just out of love for dad, love for service. you know, she kind of hey famous line, and this is something that came up during thanksgiving. not allowing dad to potentially go and do this is like taking away an instrument from a musician. >> playing to the base has been hard for bush. he is considered too soft on immigration and his plan for a
common set of education standards has conservatives growling about big government and calling him out of touch. >> is he a little bit rusty? >> it's not like jeb has been in a cave maybe fire with sticks for the last eight years. this is a man who is very engaged. he loves technology. he loves technoligical innovation. is he into it, talks about it a lot. >> kind of nerdy? >> he is not nerdy, but he is -- >> is t there anything about yo father that we don't know? >> well, his favorite movie is talladega nights. >> absolutely, man. i would lot of to sign your baby. >> which is terribly embarrassing, but, you know, he is a horrible dresser. the guy has polo shirts that are older than me, probably. he is not focused on his looks, although mom takes care of him on that front trying to dress him up and make sure he looks, i guess, presentable.
you know, he is a total gribder. he loves to work. that's what he does. >> and what he does as a bush is run for president. >> he is going to be running towards his record. he will be running towards his accomplishments and also maybe lessons learned from his failures, but he is going to try to learn -- show people that he is his own man and has his own vision and views of how to move this country forward. >> now, you know, if he does get the nomination, i mean, there are going to be a lot of republicans who he is running against who will say, look, if he gets the nomination, we lose -- republicans lose one of their greatest attacks against hillary clinton, that she's a throwback to the past, that she's just this -- yet another clinton. >> right. he is already dealing with that because republicans are already talking about him as someone of the past and a relic, and his answer to that -- his campaign's answer to that is that he is the most qualified to take on hillary clinton, that she's a very experienced candidate, that he is a governor, as he said
today in his speech, he said, you know, i have had proven success as governor of florida. i have foreign policy experience, and i am my own man, he adds, but he is the only one their campaign says who can take hillary clinton on kind of equal footing. >> jeb bush basically, though, has to win kind of a primary within a primary before he can against other establishment contenders, a chris christie, a -- who else? >> well -- >> rubio. >> rubio. >> before being able to even address some of the other challenges. >> there are a lot of -- there are a lot of people who are positioning themselves right now, and they all have a foot in one camp. i mean, you know, jeb bush would say he can appeal to evangelicals. he is a devout catholic, for example. he converted to catholicism. he would say he can appeal to conservatives because he was a conservative governor, and he is conservative on social issues, and he would also say that he could appeal to moderates because he is a moderate on
fiscal issues and foreign policy. christie might say the same thing and rubio might say the same thing, so i think they're all trying to sort of stake their claim. it isn't going to be like there's going to be one evangelical candidate and one moderate candidate. i think they've all realize thad they have to build a coalition because, after all, they're going to be, like, 16 candidates, and each of them is only going to get a sliver. >> thank you very much. up neck, new details about what happened immediately before and after the shooting of 12-year-old tamir rice. what a new prosecutor's report reveals. there's a more enjoyable way to get your fiber. try phillips' fiber good gummies plus energy support. it's a new fiber supplement that helps support regularity and includes b vitamins to help convert food to energy.
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and small businesses like yours. so you can take the next big step. i am totally blind. and sometimes i struggle to sleep at night, and stay awake during the day. this is called non-24. learn more by calling 844-824-2424. or visit your24info.com. the police officer that will killed tamir rice -- rice, as you know, was playing with a fake gun that looked real. the officer opened fire, killing him. we also know rice was alert and speaking after he was shot. all of this new information coming from a 224 page report on the shooting that came out over
the weekend. martin savidge reports. >> reporter: cleveland cleveland police responding to a 9 # 1 call come under fire from an unknown gunman. nobody is hit, but rumors spread police have killed one triggering protests. >> 137 shots. that's why we call them pigs. >> it's the latest sign of how the police shooting of tamir rice continues to keep the city on edge. >> we are in a climate where people try to find reason to be upset. >> reporter: saturday the county prosecutor released the investigation into rice's death. the report says none of the witnesses interviewed heard police shout commands to rice before shooting him, contradicting police accounts. >> the officers ordered him to stop and to show his hands and he went into his waist band and pulled out the weapon. >> reporter: that weapon turned out to be a pellet gun. >> right here by the youth center. >> reporter: a 911 caller says rice's gun was probably fake but the information was never relead
to the responding officers. when the investigators asked the veteran dispatcher why not, the report says she refused per her attorney to answer. the most compelling information comes from the fbi agent arriving minutes after the shooting. he says the two officers appeared to be shellshocked saying they wanted to do something but didn't know what to do. the officers had no first aid training and no first-aid kit. using only a pair of rur ebb gloves, the fbi agent, also a paramedic desperately worked on rice. i spoke to him and i told him i was a paramedic and here to help him. he says rice actually turned his head and looked at me and acknowledged. minutes later as the 12-year-old's life was slipping away, rice reached for the agent's hand. you are wondering when is this case going to go to some kind of grand jury. the answer is, probably not for a while yet. the prosecutor says there is
still more they need to investigate, more to go over on this report. and the grand jurors when they get the case may have questions that could trigger even more investigation. maybe in a month or two. some say not until fall. anderson. >> martin savidge, appreciate the update. up next, two teens attacked by sharks less than 90 minutes apart on the same north carolina beach. was it the same shark? why wasn't the beach closed after the first attack? we'll talk to an expert next. oud out about plenti, the new rewards program. i did. in fact, i'm earning plenti points right now. but you're not doing anything right now. lily? he's right. sign up, and you could earn plenti points just for being a wireless customer. in the meantime, i just kick back and watch the points roll in. where did you get those noodles? at&t cafeteria. you mean the break room... at&t - the only wireless carrier to be a part of plenti, now when you add a new phone line to your wireless plan you get 5,000 plenti points to use in lots of places. i take these out... ...to put in dr. scholl's active series insoles.
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carolina along the same beach nearly 90 minutes apart have made a lot of people nervous. the victims, two teenagers survived but each lost part of a arm. one of the victims also suffered bites on her leg. local officials believe the same shark attacked both of the teenagers. we've heard that shark attacks are incredibly rare. that's relatively true. what should we make of two attacks so close together. joining me is the curator of the international shark attack file. george, the fact that these attacks took place relatively close together in terms of time and distance. is it possible -- do you think it was the same shark? >> it could very well be one shark. we won't know for sure probably ever. but after examining the wounds we will probably get an idea whether it was about the same
sized shark involved in both. of course getting the species identity is going to be more difficult. >> based on the severity of the injuries, do you have a sense what have kind of shark it could have been? >> well, based on size, and location, and of course the type of injuries, the most likely candidates are bull and tiger sharks, both of which get to larger sizes and are more aggressive. my personal guess would be that a bull shark is most likely. >> the time of the day of the attacks, does that play into it at all? i mean is there a time of day when you see shark attacks more likely? >> generally between dusk and dawn of course are the time when most sharks are most active and feeding. it does seem that late in the afternoon, even before it gets to dusk, are times when some of these larger sharks, particularly bull seem to be most active. >> given the global slaughter of sharks that we have been witnessing over the last many years, i do think it's important
to just reemphasize how rare these kinds of attacks really are. >> that's absolutely true. the ratio between shark killing man and man killing shark is about 10 million to 1 in any given year. so last year there were 3 fatalities worldwide thanks to sharks. >> and as far as i understand -- and correct me if i'm wrong here -- most of the attacks and fatalities that occur, it's not the shark eating somebody whole. it may be more curiosity of the shark, and the way they sort of satisfy that curiosity, they take a bite to get a sense what have the thing is, and then they move off, but person tends to bleed out, not able to get help in time; is that right? >> that's certainly true with animals such as white sharks, which you've dealt with. but for other animals, it's probably simply mistaken identity situations in which they interpret the splash associated with the human foot or a hand in the water as being
the movements of a normal prey item. and then they grab the splash only to find a human in their mouth. used to be completely freaked ott about sharks billion i actually dove with great whites. one of the things an expert in south africa said to me which changed the way i think about interaction with the sharks is that most of us -- tell me if you agree -- most people have had a shark interaction, they just don't know it. most people have been in in an area where there has been a shark. and because most sharks don't attack people, the shark may have seen you but you didn't see the shark. >> that's true. anyone who has been in the water has been within five or six feet of a shark sometime in their life. >> within five or six feet, really? >> yes. >> i hope that doesn't freak people out. i hope that comforts people to know they have been close to a shark and nothing has happened. >> if sharks wanted to attack
humans every time they saw one we would be doing this interview thousands of times. >> george, i'm glad to talk to you, i'm glad we don't talk thousands of times because it is so rare. and i proosh you taking the time. thank you. >> good to be with you. >> well, that does it for us tonight. thoichbs. cnn tonight starts now. this is cnn tonight. i'm don lemon. breaking news tonight. law enforcement admits the trail goes cold ten days after the spectacular prison break they have no idea where two escaped killers are. this as sources tell cnn the prisoners planned to kill the husband of their alleged accomplice. joyce mitchell is facing years behind bars after a court appearance today. and what is it that a lot of women find so attractive about convicts? i'm going to talk to the wife of an inmight. also tonight, the embattled leader of the