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tv   CNN Newsroom With Carol Costello  CNN  June 24, 2015 7:00am-8:01am PDT

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family and that he and his brother when they look at ellie, they realize how fortunate they are to do what they do. there are things as much as they love her and as amazing that she is there are things she can't do that they can do. so they appreciate every day they can do those things and they also realize that if they lose a golf tournament, it's not the end of the world. he's taking that attitude. >> rachel nichols, many thanks to you. the next hour of "cnn newsroom" starts right now. smuggling contraband to killer convicts inside hamburger meat allegedly manipulating guards with baked treats? >> ms. mitchell was just as manipulative as these two inmates were. >> a new look at the inner workings of the prison when two killers broke free as hundreds of officers chased their trail. >> my gut is if they're here, we're going to find them. also a growing chorus to take down the confederate flag.
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but not everyone's on board. >> get back to summerville. four years after his wife congresswoman gabby giffords was shot in a mass shooting mark kelly is speaking out about charleston. let's talk, live in the "cnn newsroom." good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you so much for joining me. bribed with baked goods? we begin with stunning new details about joyce mitchell the prison worker who helped two convicted killers break free. a law enforcement official telling cnn mitchell traded sweet treats with guards in exchange for favors for inmates richard matt and david sweat. also new this morning, we now know mitchell brought frozen beef laced with hacksaw blades into the main gate of the prison, according to the prosecutor.
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she then stored the contraband in the freezer of the tailor shop where she worked. the attorney for the fellow guard who delivered the package says his client is also a victim of manipulation. >> she has conned many individuals inside of the prison. she would curry favors amongst the prisoners, bring them baked goods. she was very good at what she did. >> and 19 days into the manhunt, major questions about whether more could have been done to prevent a breakaway. hours from now, a group of prison guards who claim budget cuts are to blame will gather at that manhole where those inmates broke free. boris sanchez is on the ground in katyville, new york where police have set up a makeshift command. good morning. >> reporter: good morning. we've seen a big law enforcement presence at this command post all morning. helicopters with armed troops coming in and out just about all
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morning, this as law enforcement gets ready for a press briefing at noon. we're learning more about how exactly joyce mitchell got the tools to these men into their cells. she hid hacksaws and drill bits into a piece of frozen hamburger meat that she kept in a freezer in the tailor shop. she convinced gene palmer to take the meat to matt and sweat. she convinced them to take it to them without going through a metal detector. palmer's attorney says his biggest mistake was trusting joyce mitchell. she was apparently trying to convince her colleagues to do favors for these men in exchange for baked goods and even pushed to have david sweat's cell moved to richard matt's and we're also learning a law enforcement source telling cnn she also provided the men with glasses that had lights on them something that likely aided them in their escape. there's a press briefing that will be held at about noon. we'll bring it to you live.
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>> boris sanchez reporting live this morning, thanks so much. the district attorney, andrew wiley, says authorities are now certain that gene palmer the guard who delivered the meat did not know he was delivering contraband as well to the inmates. palmer's attorney says his client was duped by joyce mitchell and argues if his client is guilty of anything it was trusting mitchell when he shouldn't have. >> he had no knowledge beforehand that there were any kind of tools inside. the only mistake he made was trusting joyce mitchell. he could have run it through a metal detector. that was his mistake. he didn't run it through the metal detector. he feels extremely guilty about that. he's regretful. he apologizes for that. but ms. mitchell was just as manipulative as these two inmates were. he trusted her. >> let's talk about this. let's bring in former senior fbi profiler and former fbi special agent, mary ellen o'toole.
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i'm joined on the phone by jeff dumas. jeff i have to start with you, baked goods to bribe fellow employees to smuggle in contraband in frozen meat? what goes through your mind? >> yeah i don't believe it's an actual bribe. it's just a fellow employee asking for somebody to do something. i can totally see officer palmer trusting joyce mitchell. nobody would ever think that she would take sides with a convicted murderer. that just doesn't happen. >> why else, jeff would she -- why else would this prison guard not put this frozen meat through the metal detector? why would he trust joyce mitchell that far? >> right.
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well the policies that are in place allow for the inmates to cook and to do all that. so it's not out of the norm for one of those convicts or a lot of the convicts to be able to cook bacon, be able to cook all that stuff. so for her to say, hey we left this meat behind in the freezer, whatever the case may be you wouldn't think any big deal about a chunk of frozen hamburger and bring it over there. the metal detector is in a certain area. but there's other ways for officers to go through the facility that are shorter. so in the course of his day, if he just went by he could have dropped it off, no big deal, and gone back to his duties. she really -- that was just a big manipulation on her part. >> okay. so why didn't anyone notice
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jeff that joyce mitchell was bringing in baked goods and giving some of the baked goods to the prisoners? that's not allowed, is it? >> no. that should not be allowed at all. but a lot of these civilian people will bring in food, stuff like that. it's usually shared amongst the workers. and by that i mean civilian workers. and then every now and then they may have given them whatever's left over. hey, nobody's eating this, whatever. but i just don't see that she did that a lot. if she did that a lot, then somebody missed it. >> so jeff, you worked in that prison. what is going on there? >> it's just -- it's been over time. i said it before. the liberal policies that they keep instituting to keep the inmates appeased has just come
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back to kind of bite them in the rear end. it shouldn't be happening. the convicts should be treated like convicts. they're murderers, rapists, child molesters, they should be treated like that. but they give them civilian clothing inside. they let them cook. it's crazy. hopefully it goes back to being a prison. >> i think many are with you there. mary ellen, do you know why these policies were instituted? >> i wouldn't know specific to this institution where these policies came from. but i can say that when you analyze joyce's behavior you say, is this a one or a two-time infraction of the rules or was this ongoing behavior so that here's a person who could lower
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the suspicions of the officers there or other people because she had done it in the past and had done it repeatedly and just doesn't seem to be the kind of person at least in their eyes, who would be coordinating this on behalf of a very violent offender. and so she was very manipulative. and as she gained more and more power within the institution and within those lax laws and policies she probably was actually making decisions on her own how to get around the system and not necessarily even at the request of either richard matt or david sweat. >> and i guess i would suppose maybe it's easy to manipulate a fellow employee to do something to skirt the rules, right, because it happens in many businesses across the country? >> yeah, absolutely. >> go on, jeff. >> yeah the -- when you walk
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inside that place, you're talking about dealing with 3,000 violent inmates. so there is a camaraderie between security staffs and the civilian staff. we look out for them and make sure they're safe throughout the day. so there is a huge trust factor that comes about through the years of working with somebody. and you don't ever think that somebody's going to betray that trust and take the side of these inmates. >> mary ellen, are you with that? >> i can see that dynamic happening. and if that did occur where it went over time and people's attitudes became too soft, too trusting certainly i can see that happening. and then you have someone who comes in and is able to really exploit that by asking them meat to come in and bringing them sweet goods.
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joyce manipulated a system that had a culture of being too lax, too trusting which is probably the last thing that you want in a facility like that. >> a maximum security prison, you're right. mary ellen o'toole, jeff dumas, thanks to you both. i appreciate it. did the u.s. spy on one of its closest allies? that's what france wants to know. a french official says president obama will be calling french president francois hollande today. the french are furious over allegations the nsa spied on mr. hollande and two of his predecessors. let's get more from sunlen serfaty now. good morning, sunlen. >> reporter: good morning, carol. this all stems from wikileaks publishing these reports they say are from the nsa alleging basically that the u.s. was eavesdropping on the last three french presidents as recently at 2012. so of course there's a lot of anger coming from the french on this. as you said summoning their
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ambassador back for meetings on this today, calling these allegations unacceptable saying it's not something they will tolerate due to the protection of their safety and their own interests. of course france is a longtime ally of the united states, key in international diplomacy and most notably, very key in the nuclear talks going on right now with iran which are very delicate in reaching that deadline. as you said the president of france's national assembly they report that president obama will speak on the phone with the french president today. carol? >> sunlen serfaty reporting live from the white house, thanks so much. still to come in the "newsroom," now they're speaking out, republicans taking a stand on the confederate flag. but many are asking what took them so long?
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the anti-confederate bandwagon is getting awfully crowded. not only are there calls to remove confederate flags from statehouses, but uprooting statues of confederate buildings. listen to senator mitch mcconnell. >> we have have statue of jefferson davis in the capitol in frankfort. davis' sole connection to kentucky was he was born there. he subsequently moved to mississippi and kentucky did not secede from the union. so i think it's appropriate certainly in kentucky to be talking about the appropriateness of continuing to have jefferson davis' statue in a very prominent place in our state capitol. >> mcconnell joinings his voice with those of lawmakers in several southern states some of whom also want the confederate flag taken off specialty license plates. in the meantime retailers are
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removing the confederate symbol from their shelves, k-mart joining ebay sears, walmart and amazon and banning merchandise with the flag even autotrader is careful not to show the confederate battle flag on the general lee from the "dukes of hazard." with me now, republican strategist ana navarro and democratic strategist paul begala. welcome to both of you. ana, i have heard some say this is a watershed moment on race in the united states. seriously? will it really change anything? >> i guess we could take the cynical approach to it or take the optimistic approach. i hope that it does. i actually think carol, that that image of the governor of south carolina nikki haley standing there calling for the lowering of that flag and having her being flanked by jim clyburn
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and tim scott, we saw colors of all political stripes standing together calling for this. so yes, it is a watershed moment. when was the last time you saw such unity and bipartisanship on an issue like this? i think we should build on that. >> we should build on it but it seems largely symbolic to me at this moment. paul let me put it to you this way. republicans are taking most of the heat on this topic. but the unemployment rate among african-americans has been persistently high throughout president obama's tenure. there has been talk of democrats taking the black vote for granted. so could 2016 be a year when more african-americans cross party lines? will democrats try harder? what do you suppose will happen after this moment in our history? >> well democrats will have to earn those votes. that's absolutely critical to the democrats' political success but it's critical to america's success. i would like to see republicans
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do more to compete for these votes. i'm glad they have come to oppose the symbolism of the confederate flag. i don't want to criticize them for being too late. the next step is more important. we should be optimistic. hillary clinton yesterday went to florissant missouri a few miles from where the riots were in ferguson. she went to an african-american church. she had a roundtable discussion there. one of the people in the discussion was a professor from washington university a social worker he told about a study he had done a ten-mile distance in st. louis area st. louis county between a largely white zip code and a largely black zip code ten miles was 18 years difference in life expectancy. so it's not just a symbol that we should start with the symbolism, fine. but there is a reality here in america, we've got to do better by voting rights where the republicans, especially jeb bush have terrible records, he purged voters in florida.
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we have to do more about jobs growing the economic, educational opportunities. it will make life better for all of us. >> i was going to bring up voter id laws. republican states have enacted tough voter id laws when there are very few cases of voter fraud in our nation. to critics it seems they are trying to suppress the black vote. so should candidates focus on things like jobs and education rather than confederate flags and statues of jefferson davis? >> frankly, they're all important. symbols are just as important as policy is. and because i think it lends itself to creating a culture where we can all have better race relations. but i want to respond to paul when he says what took republicans so long. i support a guy, jeb bush who took down the confederate flag from florida 14 years ago. did it not under the national glare or as the aftermath of a horrific tragedy. he did it because it was the right thing to do. he respected the heritage by
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putting it in a museum. but we can ask the same question of democrats. what's taken democrats so long on this? people like bill clinton, governors of arkansas terry mcauliffe has been governor of virginia for over a year and it's just now that he's calling for the repeal of the license plate with the confederate flag. i think we can either point fingers at each other or say, we're here, it is a watershed moment. let's build on it and make something good out of it. >> jeb did. he needs to be congratulated for this. he took the confederate flag down. "the washington post" revealed some of his e-mails during that time where he took a lot of static and personally responded to people who were angry with him. i admire that. nothing can take away from that. he did the right thing at the right time and while he was governor he did some things of substance that were terrible for african-american. he ended affirmative action, he purged voters from the roles. that had a hugely
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disproportionate impact on african-americans. it made the state close enough so that it could be stolen from al gore. >> i don't know, paul. he did not -- he replaced affirmative action when it came to college quotas with a specific plan to be able to allow the top 20% of all florida students which included a lot of black students to go to college and it has improved the graduation rates of hispanics, of african-americans in florida. look at the statistics. i'm proud to stand by that record. >> i think it's only improved the statistics among hispanics. i don't think it's improved it among african-americans. >> it has. >> it has? we'll have to look that up and get -- i'd love to have this conversation again with both of you. thank you both so much. i'll be right back. many wrinkle creams come with high hopes, but hope... doesn't work on wrinkles. clinically proven neutrogena® rapid wrinkle repair with the fastest retinol formula available,
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checking top stories for you at 27 minutes past the hour an inspector's report found the collapsed balcony in berkeley, california was, quote, extensively rotted where it broke away from the wall and that moisture may be to blame. six people died when that fourth floor balcony collapsed earlier this month. the county's district attorney is looking into the incident. a judge has declared a mistrial in the vanderbilt rape case after it was revealed the jury foreman was a victim of statutory rape. the defense believed that that affected his judgment. a cnn affiliate reports both sides will meet today to discuss next steps in the case. the two former vanderbilt football players were found guilty of rape and sexual battery back in january. happening now in a boston courtroom, speculation swirling over whether or not convicted boston bomber dzhokhar tsarnaev will speak at his sentencing. right now he's hearing from the
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victims' families who impacted their lives forever. one victim's mother said quote, nine life is hard but the choices you made were despicable i think the jury did the right thing. deborah feyerick is live at the courthouse in boston to tell us more. good morning, deborah. can you hear me? i don't think her microphone is on. deborah can't hear me obviously. we'll try to get back to boston. but dzhokhar tsarnaev sitting in front of that judge and that judge will surely pass down the death sentence as 30 families read impact statements in front of dzhokhar tsarnaev. let's go back to boston and deborah feyerick. deborah, can you hear me now? >> reporter: yeah, i can hear you, carol. and i can tell you, inside that courtroom, it is so emotional. there is so much pain and grief and even tension as dzhokhar tsarnaev looks at some of the
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people who he injured as they talk to him, in some cases directly the mother of krystle campbell saying life is hard but the choices you made are despicable and that she would never understand what it is he did but she said the jury did the right thing. and then a friend of krystle campbell said there are many men who are trying to join terrorist groups. show remorse, she pleaded with dzhokhar tsarnaev who didn't show any reaction when she said that. it is so almost heavy in that court, carol, as these people come up and talk to dzhokhar tsarnaev. this is the moment they can make their statements hoping the judge will formally sentence him to death row and also consecutive life counts on the other charges. but we can tell you, the father
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and mother of the youngest victim 8-year-old martin richard, basically said he chose to accompany his brother, he chose hate he chose destruction, he chose death, this is all on him. we choose love. and that's really the feeling you're getting inside the court, a couple of the people have, in fact, broken into tears. so it's going on right now, about 25 people to speak before he is formally sentenced. carol? >> deborah feyerick reporting live from boston this morning, thank you. turning now to the church massacre in charleston, president obama brought up the issue of gun control in its wake. but some argued that that wasn't the time for that. so when is a good time if not after a tragedy like this? listen to one south carolina lawmaker who raised eyebrows by not only invoking gun rights but seemingly blaming the victims for not being armed. >> these people sat in there,
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waited their turn to be shot. that's sad. somebody in there with a means of self-defense could have stopped this and we've had less funerals than we're having. >> you're turning this into a gun debate. >> you said guns. why didn't somebody do something? you've got one skinny person shooting a gun. we need to do what we can. >> i want to make sure i understand what you're telling me. are you asking that these people should have tackled him, these women should have fought him -- >> i don't know what the answer was. but i know it's really horrible for nine people to be shot. and i understand that he reloaded his gun during the process. that's upsetting. >> with me now is mark kelly, retired astronaut and the husband of former congresswoman gabby giffords.
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gabby giffords was terribly wounded after a gunman wounded her, both of them founded americans for responsible solutions, a non-profit that supports gun control. good morning, mark. thank you for being with me this morning. i appreciate it. >> good morning, carol. >> i was just so upset after hearing representative chumley blame the victims. what goes through your mind when you hear that? >> the representative like so many others out there think they're clint eastwood in a movie. and this isn't a movie. i've been shot at in combat over 30 times. it's not what people expect. the solution to this problem is not for everybody to be carrying a weapon. we know that doesn't work. but what we know does work is to make it more difficult for criminals and the dangerously mentally ill to get access to firearms. that will bring down gun violence. >> why do we always hear that when we talk about -- when we
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debate gun control, if only everyone were armed, we'd all be much safer. >> i think it's the opposite. i think if everybody's armed, we're less safe. as a gun owner, i understand there are certain circumstances where people would want to carry a gun, if they feel there's imminent threat to their life. but it's very difficult for law enforcement and any kind of police engagement when they show up to discern who's the good guy with the gun, who's the bad guy? and the concept of a good guy with a gun, often i think turns out to be the moron with the gun. so these things are not as black and white as they seem. it's not like what would unfold on tv. it is chaotic. that's been my experience the experience -- both my parents were police officers. and they know that the solution is not for everybody to be carrying a gun. but what the solution is is for our elected leaders to take positive steps to keep guns out of the hands of the most dangerous people felons domestic abusers, drug abuser
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and then to try to do something about gun trafficking in this country. >> right after the charleston shooting went down i heard a lot of people talk about dylann roof the shooter, as mentally ill. but there was no evidence he was mentally ill. he bought the gun legally. he was 21 years old. he bought it in south carolina. why do you think people immediately go to that oh we have to do something about the mentally ill in this country, it's not the guns themselves that are at issue? >> well i think often when you see mass shootings, in a lot of them certainly what happened to gabby in tucson aurora sandy hook, there seems to be a pattern that the shooter is mentally ill or has some mental illness issues. i agree it doesn't seem that way in this case. so i think people normally turn to that. and we do need to do something about mental illness. one of the first steps we can take is to make sure everybody gets a background before buying a gun. we have gun shows where 40% of guns are sold either at a gun show or through a private sale
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without background checks. and that certainly just does not make sense. >> the other thing, president obama brought up gun control right after the charleston shootings went down. and a lot of people said it was just so insensitive and it's not the time and why do these issues always come up when tragedy happens. can you respond to that? >> i used to say that same thing, too. after aurora i think i said on cnn on anderson cooper one day, now is not the time, the community needs to heal. after sandy hook, i changed my mind. if when 20 first-graders and kindergarteners die in their classroom, if that's not the time when is? or in this case the shooting in the charleston church, when is the time? i've completely done a 180 on that. when these things happen, it's the time to start talking about it. it's why you invited me to come on this show.
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>> absolutely. it is interesting what has happened in the aftermath of that shooting inside that church people are taking down confederate flags and talking about taking down taking down statues of confederate war figures. but they're not talking about gun control, not at all. >> well, i think they are. we are, right? a reporter was there at the state capitol talking to rep. chumley about it. i think often our elected leaders in state capitols and even in washington, d.c. very frequently want to avoid the issue because there's a powerful lobby out there that has a lot of influence in washington, d.c. and they don't want our laws changed. but the reality is we have 15 to 20 times the death rate from gun violence than any other industrialized country and we can do something about it. our organization we've been very successful in many states getting some sensible and commonsense gun laws passed
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things like background checks laws on domestic violence. but ultimately it's up to washington, d.c. to take the step to enact strong federal laws. >> mark kelly, thank you for being with me this morning. i appreciate it. still to come in the "newsroom," the manhunt for two killers focuses on an area west of the prison they escaped from. a look at just how difficult that search is. you probably know xerox as the company that's all about printing. but did you know we also support hospitals using electronic health records for more than 30 million patients? or that our software helps over 20 million smartphone users remotely configure e-mail every month? or how about processing nearly $5 billion in electronic toll payments a year? in fact, today's xerox is working in surprising ways to help companies simplify the way work gets done and life gets lived. with xerox, you're ready for real business. it's part adrenaline and part adventure.
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you can save up to $423. for a free quote today,call liberty mutual insurance at see car insurance in a whole new light. liberty mutual insurance. let's turn to the hunt for those two escaped killers. searchers got their first big break when dna testing showed the two men recently took refuge in a backwoods cabin. they left behind several personal item including a pair of boots.
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could one of the fugitives be on the run barefoot? >> reporter: we are hearing that from a law enforcement source who was briefed on the investigation. he told that to cnn's deborah feyerick. could one of them be on the run without any shoes on? i posed that question to the sheriff here in franklin county yesterday. he told me, it is very thick terrain out there. he couldn't imagine someone surviving very long in their bare feet. so we went out into the woods to take a look and see for ourselves. take a look, carol. i'm walking through an area that's about five miles away from the cabin where one of those escaped inmates was spotted. this is very thick terrain here. there's debris everywhere. i'm walking about 20 feet away from the camera. i'm not exactly sure where it is right now. and i'm walking with my hands up covering my face because i want to keep all this debris from
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poking me in the eye, which has already happened once. not only is it thick terrain, though, it's also damp and wet. it rained here yesterday. it's rained many of the last 19 days that these men have been on the run. in addition to that there are a lot of bugs. any part of your skin that's exposed gets attacked by the bugs. this is really no easy walk in the woods. this is very difficult to navigate. the search crews have been walking down paths like this one, also down old railroad beds hiking trails biking trails looking for clues, footprints anything that might give them an idea that these men might have been here. you can imagine if you really don't have boots on you're going to stick to a trail like this one if you're walking through this area. you're not going to venture into these woods. now, in that you can hear that
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there's a helicopter flying overhead. it's still a very active search scene out here. it's been a few days since the last big break which was the finding of dna evidence that matched those two escaped killers inside a cabin nearby that had been burglarized. and that hasn't stopped them from searching this area. the sheriff told me yesterday, we are literally every time someone's dog barks, we are chasing down and making sure that we have dotted our is and crossed our ts and followed up on every single lead. we've seen many times over the last 24 48 hours, we've seen that in action with our own eyes. they searched an area near a ski resort where there was an unsubstantiated sighting. yesterday afternoon, we watched as searchers went through an area that's not too far from the cabin and then just a few minutes ago, again in the town of malone, which is about ten miles away from here they were
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following up on a lead which the sheriff now says turned out to be unsubstantiated. carol? >> just unbelievable. day 19 now. sara ganim reporting live from upstate new york. still to come in the "newsroom," a veteran story of survival. his time as a p.o.w. in vietnam. across america, people are taking charge of their type 2 diabetes... ...with non-insulin victoza. for a while, i took a pill to lower my blood sugar but it didn't get me to my goal. so i asked my doctor about victoza. he said victoza works differently than pills and comes in a pen. victoza is proven to lower blood sugar and a1c. it's taken once a day, any time. and the needle is thin. victoza is not for weight loss but it may help you lose some weight. victoza is an injectable prescription medicine that may improve blood sugar in adults with type 2 diabetes when used with diet and exercise.
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tomorrow night on the 70s the vietnam war in its final chaotic moments when vietnamese
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were scrambling to escape. >> the carriers were waiting in the south china sea. there was no room so the navy men ordered the pilots to ditch the helicopters in the ocean. >> we were living in a period of what the greeks call hubris. how were they going to defeat us? >> once it became a reality and seeing the pictures on television about not only a retreat but a disorderly retreat, we were saying this is not who we thought we were. >> to see what was in store for the south vietnamese people, to see the visions of the helicopters and people struggling to get out and the terrible triage and choices that had to be made was clearly one of the lows in my life. >> turbulent time. i want to bring in charlie plum
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a former navy fighter pilot. on his 75th mission on may 19th 1976 he was shot down captured and imprisoned as a p.o.w. for six years. thank you, sir, for joining us. we really appreciate it. >> thanks, carol. nice to be with you. >> when you see those pictures from our documentary, what goes through your mind? >> a bit of sadness that we had to get out of there with our tail between our legs we didn't accomplish the mission that we set out to. >> i can still see the pain in your eyes today when you say that that. >> well there's a lot of ways to look at that war obviously. and there's good news and bad news. but with any war, it's hell. and i hate war probably more than anyone. but i also see a reason for it. >> and you certainly went through hell. you spent more than 2,000 days in an 8 x 8-foot cell.
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what kept you going? >> carol, in a word, it was faith. i have faith in my god, in the leadership of this country and faith in myself. >> when you came home how was your reception? >> it was really good. it was much better than the soldiers that came back during the war. it was sort of a closure, a final chapter in this very difficult, painful war. so we were met with parades and gifts. it was a great transition obviously in my life. but it was a thing of beauty as well. >> what do you think we learned from vietnam if anything? >> i'm not sure we learned much because we're repeating some of the same challenge that we faced there. it's difficult, i think, for a nation as grandiose as ours to
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go into a small country and try to impose our value system our way of life upon them. the poor people of vietnam, all they wanted was a couple of bowls of rice a day and to be left alone. and we wanted to make entrepreneurs out of them and set up their leadership. it's just not the right thing to do. >> do you see parallels in what the united states is currently doing in iraq? >> absolutely. we march in there, the most powerful nation in the world, and try to impose our system on them without really dealing with who they are and what they want and where they want to go with their lives. >> why do you think our leaders haven't learned that lesson when vietnam was so very painful for america? >> well i have a bit of a negative approach to leadership all over the world. and part of it is to sort of churn the pot. i think our leadership wants us
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to be in peril so that they can rush in and save the world. so i think it's really -- they feel it's to their advantage actually to start little wars like this. >> charlie plumb, thank you so much for joining us and thank you for your insight. i sure appreciate it. remember you can watch the cnn original series "the 70s" tomorrow night, 9:00 p.m. eastern. i'll be right back. ya know, viagra helps guys with erectile dysfunction get and keep an erection. talk to your doctor about viagra. ask your doctor if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take viagra if you take nitrates for chest pain; it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. side effects include headache, flushing, upset stomach and abnormal vision. to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than four hours. stop taking viagra and call your doctor right away if you experience a sudden decrease or loss in vision or hearing. ask your doctor about viagra. wow. sweet new subaru, huh mitch? yep. you're selling the mitchmobile!? man, we had a lot of good times in this baby. what's your dad want for it?
7:56 am a hundred and fifty grand, two hundred if they want that tape deck. you're not going to tell your dad about the time my hamster had babies in the backseat, are you?! that's just normal wear and tear, dude. (vo) subaru has the highest resale value of any brand... ...according to kelley blue book ...and mitch. love. it's what makes a subaru a subaru. introducing a whole new way to enhance your eyes. it's 1-day acuvue® define™ brand contact lenses. the eye enhancement lenses that comfortably accentuate your eyes' natural beauty. ask your doctor today about 1-day acuvue® define™ brand. ♪ building aircraft, the likes of which the world has never seen. this is what we do. ♪
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♪ every auto insurance policy has a number. but not every insurance company understands the life behind it. ♪ those who have served our nation have earned the very best service in return. ♪ usaa. we know what it means to serve. get an auto insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life. it may be considered taboo to ask your friends how much they make but what about your
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spouse? according to a new study, 43% of people don't know how much their husband or wife make. really? some guesses were as far off as $25,000. and the knowledge gap is getting worse. more people incorrectly guessed their spouse's salary now compared to two years ago. just a little food for thought after all that. thank you so much for joining me today. i'm carol costello. "at this hour" starts right now. pastries for prison favors. law enforcement hopes it's closing in on the escaped inmates. stunning details what joyce mitchell did for the men behind bars. a former inmate who saw the relationship develop joins us live. any moment the boston bomber could break his silence. his official sentencing in court right now. like diving in shallow water, that's how the leaked


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