5:00 p.m. eastern. i'm poppy harlow in new york. so glad you're with us. happening right now, cities across the united states bracing for what could be the fourth straight night of anti-trump protests. we've already seen major demonstrations this afternoon in both new york and los angeles. thousands of people marching through the streets of both

cities chanting that donald trump is not their president. it is 5:00 p.m. here in new york. it is 2:00 p.m. out in los angeles. and now the question is, will these protests get bigger as the night goes on? our reporters are live across the country. brynn gingras is live in new york with thousands of protesters. kyung lah is live in los angeles. brynn, how big has it gotten? >> reporter: poppy, it's only gotten bigger as we've gone into these nighttime hours. for two hours, protesters started at 14th street, have made their way two miles to practically the doorstep of trump tower. i'm thinking at least 10,000 people have been out here really delivering a message to donald trump. and that is that they will not tolerate a campaign that he ran on, a campaign they say fueled by hate. but you can see just how large this crowd is. i mean, there are people on the street, police officers included, who have told me they

have not seen a protest this large in some time. speaking of police, you can see them all lined up here in front of the stores on fifth avenue. protesters can only go so far to across the street of trump tower. we're being told by our colleagues inside trump tower that tourists are allowed to go inside trump tower, but the people that are in there can only stay in there. if they leave, they're not allowed back in and no one new is allowed inside trump tower because of these demonstrations that are happening outside his doorstep. we also know from police that they are warning protesters if they jump barricades, they will be arrested. we've seen a few people being taken away and led to a bus, because of not following their orders. last night, ten people arrested for disorderly conduct. unclear how many if any -- how many arrests, rather, are going to happen tonight.

certainly this is only getting bigger and louder, poppy. >> brynn, thank you very much, live in front of trump tower where these protests are ginormous. kyung lah is live for us in l.a. kyung, earlier it had died down, now you say it's getting tense. >> reporter: we're at the area where this protest began. i want to explain the group i'm surrounded by right now is very different than the group we saw marching peacefully through downtown los angeles. that was a thousand strong, groups of families, a very diverse crowd. i want to take you through and have you look at this crowd, it's a younger crowd, a hard core group of protesters. they're blocking a major intersection near macarthur park in los angeles, wilshire and alvarado. the message from the police department certainly is that they want to try to clear the streets. walk with me this way, and as you walk through this crowd, we'll walk you straight down a street here in los angeles.

you can hear music, there are a lot of people here. then as you look over this way, what you see are police officers. now, what the police department has been doing every single day -- sorry -- is trying to get these protesters coraled and trying to tell them that they have to disperse. what we've seen from law enforcement here is that they're pushing towards this intersection. they have made sure that the protesters aren't going to run onto any highways. there's no freeway right here in area, so that's not a concern. but they want this roadway cleared. you can see another police car here. they're trying to make sure that traffic goes through. we've seen these two officers try to talk to some of the head protesters, trying to convince them to get off the streets. as of right now, as you spin this way, it certainly does not look like they have any intention of trying to get off this street and listen to the police department, poppy. >> kyung lah for us in l.a., thank you, keep us posted.

president-elect donald trump has not addressed these protests specifically today. he did tweet this a little earlier, he said "this will prove to be a great time in the lives of all americans. we will unite and we will win, win, win." let's bring in our panel to discuss, an historian and professor of paris ton. jack kingston, senior adviser to donald trump. and a journalist and editor in chief, a muslim-american who did not support donald trump. congressman, what we just heard from our reporters is these protesters are saying they will not tolerate a presidency that continues on the path of some of the rhetoric heard during the campaign. things like questioning the ability of a judge with hispanic heritage, judge curiel, to do his job because of his heritage, something even paul ryan called the textbook definition of racism. some of the misogynistic things he said about women.

do you hear them on that? >> they're the ones that don't want to let go of that. if their message is love, they're not getting that through, not based on those images of love that we just saw. donald trump 4:00 a.m., wednesday morning, made a magnificent day. the next day, hillary clinton did. the next day he met with president obama in a very, very dignified way. we have seen nothing about a high tone coming out of mr. trump. we've seen it really -- >> congressman, let me just stop you there. not nothing. because he did tweet late thursday night, "professional protesters are incited by the media. they are protesting. very unfair." >> let me say this. it's just remarkable to me as a conservative, because we just don't have the instant riot apparatus that the left seems to have. it's just as remarkable that you could have such organic spontaneous riots and demonstrations. but let me say this. >> what do you mean? you tweeted that these

protesters are whining. isn't expressing one's opinions and protesting exercising their first amendment right, sort of fundamental to democracy, when it's done peacefully? >> when it's done peacefully. that's not what we have seen in portland, it's not what we saw in los angeles. >> there have been violence, and vandalism, and some police officers have been hurt. and that is unacceptable. but the mayor of l.a. just told me earlier today that the large majority of them are peaceful. >> the large majority of the people always are peaceful. and the large majority of trump people were too. but hillary clinton still called them deplorable. what about that image of young children hitting a pinata of the president-elect of the united states of america? i never saw anything like that on the conservative -- it is repulsive to me to see a child with a stick hit an effigy of the president-elect.

i think it's disturbing for left and right. again, what's going on inside the white house with president clinton -- excuse me, president-elect trump and president obama is very dignified. it's setting a great tone. >> i think you make an important point because a message of unity has come from president obama who has said that, hillary clinton has said that. i think we have the image we can pull up for viewers, that was surprising for me to see that. as a muslim american who did not support donald trump, who is very disturbed about some of the things he said on the campaign trail, what is your response to seeing something like this, do you agree with the congressman, and what would you like to see president-elect donald trump come out and do? should he come meet with these protesters? >> well, i think that it's really disturbing, poppy, that so many trump supporters and so many trump surrogates are so disturbed by the protests against president-elect trump but are not disturbed by the fact that he was endorsed by the

kkk, that the kkk has announced a massive rally on december 3rd. that's -- >> he didn't ask that. >> an endorsement that he did denounce. i should say the republican party of that state has denounced that rally. however, donald trump has not addressed it personally. >> exactly. i think that -- exactly. i think that as the president-elect, it is his responsibility to unite all of us. he ran on a very divisive campaign which ran on not only a muslim ban, it was anti-immigration, it was anti-woman. he stipulated that women who get abortions should be punished. you know, a tweet is not enough. he needs to come out, as a clinton supporter i have accepted that he is our president, it's really important for trump to come out and say don't commit these violent hate crimes in my name, i recognize all americans, i accept all americans. i really hope that's what we hear from him. this is america. people have their right to protest. i don't think that it's correct

or justified for trump to call these protesters, these americans, paid protesters, professional protesters. >> let me just state for our viewers, the next morning, as you all know, he tweeted, "love the fact that a small group of protesters last night have passion for our great country, we will all come together and be proud," so a very different message. julian, you say these protests are more than one party losing to another. you are the historian. what does this mean to you, what are we seeing? >> this isn't simply partisanship, meaning one party lost and some people from the other party are unhappy. this is a natural response to one of the most divisive campaigns that we have seen in american history. many americans feel that that campaign was hurtful, it was hateful, and it alienated many people. and they are expressing their opinion. these are not riots. and i don't think that's the way to characterize them. these are protests. and i think the most effective

thing for donald trump to do would be, rather than target the protesters, to try to speak to them. let's see if donald trump can actually address some of the concerns they're talking about. >> julian, congressman, i'm out of time. i appreciate you all being with you. thank you very much. ahead this hour, we're getting a glimpse into what a donald trump white house might look like. details on who is topping the list for some of those key positions surrounding him in the white house. also trump versus the media. why his actions this week may already be setting a precedent, a precedent, a tough precedent. we'll dig into that. also later, a cnn exclusive with warren buffett. what the billionaire investor has to say about the embattled, scandal-ridden bank willsing for. you're live in the cnn newsroom. nothing stops us from doing right by our customers. who's with me? i'm in. i'm in. i'm in. i'm in. ♪ ♪

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we will soon know who president-elect donald trump will choose to be his chief of staff. trump campaign manager kellyanne conway telling cnn moments ago that announcement is imminent. our sunlen certificaserfaty is more. >> many questions are surrounding who will be chosen as chief of staff. she indicates and our reporting backs up that that decision will come sometime soon, next week. we emphasized, she said it is mr. trump's decision ultimately. we always know that he likes to kind of poll people, get everyone's opinion, and of course he is the decider in the end. as of now, it does seem that donald trump is tempted by the possibility of steve bannon, but

it really does, according to sources, all signs point to that he is really considering most actively reince priebus, rn krchc chair. the trump family is behind reince priebus, paul ryan is pushing for him. why? because he's a known commodity, seen as a safe choice and knows how to operate in washington. we expect that decision to come at some point soon. >> sunlen, thank you very much for the reporting, we appreciate it. when we come back, donald trump's relationship with the media is about to be put to the test as he becomes the president. will he follow through with vows to make it easier to sue the media, open up libel laws, as he says? we'll debate, live in the cnn newsroom. ♪

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president-elect donald trump has a long history of contentious relations with the media. now there are new signals pointing to how trump as president might interact with the press once he moves into the white house. our brian todd has the details tonight. hi, brian. >> reporter: poppy, in a new interview, president-elect trump suggested the acid-laced rhetoric he used during the campaign which many believed helped get him elected could be

toned down. mr. trump said things are different now, striking considering the relentless attacks he made on the media for the past year and a half. after months of openly sparring with the media during the campaign -- >> a bunch of phony low-lives. they're disgraceful. bad people. bad people. >> reporter: his supporters joined that fight. [ crowd chants "cnn sucks" ] >> reporter: trump ditched his pool of reporters covering him when he came to meet with president obama. the head of the white house correspondents' association complained. >> to be there in case something happens, it is important for us to be able to fulfill our responsibilities as journalists and to tell the story of what's going on and to inform the public. >> reporter: on 9/11, if reporters weren't traveling with president bush, the public may not have known certain details

of where the president was. there could have been worrisome information gaps on the day president reagan was shot. during the campaign, trump blocked the media from traveling with him. he blacklisted journalists who had been critical of him. he threatened to sue "the new york times" for reporting on his taxes, threatened to sue nbc for the "access hollywood" tape release but didn't follow through. still, the media is not blameless. >> i think there were a lot of mistakes along the way by the media. i think the media failed to treat donald trump seriously even as they covered him intensely and gaye him an extraordinary amount of airtime during the primaries. >> reporter: analysts say trump's disdain for reporters may have held him at the polls. he told "the wall street journal" he'll change his overall tone. quote, it's different now." >> the campaign is a daily clash. governing is different. governing is leading. governing is showing an example.

governing is giving people a leadership role that makes people say to congress, do what the president said. >> reporter: media watchers say it's an open question whether donald trump will be more receptive to the media and allow them more access to the president. a trump spokesperson tells cnn they expect to operate a traditional pool for reporters and they're asking for patience as they navigate the transition process, poppy. >> brian todd, thank you for the reporting, we appreciate it. when we come back, our panel debates just how the press will be treated in a trump administration. you are live in the cnn newsroom. boost it's about moving forward not back. it's looking up not down. it's feeling up thinking up living up. it's being in motion... in body in spirit in the now. boost. it's not just nutrition, it's intelligent nutrition. with 26 vitamins and minerals and 10 grams of protein. all in 3 delicious flavors. it's choosing to go in one direction... up.

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we are watching antitrump protests in several cities across the united states. you're looking at live pictures from here in new york city. also indianapolis and los angeles. we'll keep an eye on all of them for you of course. let's talk about what kind of relationship a president-elect trump will have when he's president trump with

the white house press corps and the rest of the media. brian stelter, laura coates. trump's transition team said that he will have a traditional press pool and this will be sort of operated as normal. then they ditched the press when he went to the white house this week. our wolf blitzer called him out on it, said it's not acceptable. hope hicks, his spokesperson, said give us time, be patient while we figure out this transition. the white house correspondents association said this decision could leave americans blind about the whereabouts and wellbeing in the event of a national crisis. what's your take? >> donald trump did not expect to win this election. so he had not put in place the necessary plans for the days after the election. one of those plans would be a press pool. it could be simply lack of

preparedness, it was not a situation where the journalists were able to travel with him on thursday. we can chalk it up to just very early trouble. however, it's a bad sign. it's a bad start to the relationship between trump and the media. there are some more positive signs, though. he's on "60 minutes" this weekend, he's spoken with "the wall street journal." so he is providing some access, answering some questions. we'll see if his actions ultimately line up with his words. >> laura coates, you say donald trump used the first amendment as a sword and a shield. in february he said if he becomes president he will change libel laws in this country to make it easier to sue news organizations. he is now president-elect. legally, how would he do that? >> that promise will be pretty hollow, poppy, because of course there's no federal libel law. there is a supreme court decision that has precedent for all of the lower courts in our nation that essentially has said, look, we have the same standard of actual malice. we want to know that we're not going to hold the press accountable for have them try to

kind of delete their words unless they knew a story was false. it's pretty much a long shot for donald trump but it's not improbable. remember, he has appointments for the lower costs who are going to oversee these cases. >> but he would have to turn over proof that they were acting with malice like his tax returns, for example. and i don't know that he wants to do that. >> that's the key. >> brian, in a conference call with top donors on friday, clinton's campaign chairman, john podesta, said, and this is a quote, he said, a hostile press corps is part of what contributed to her defeat. it's clinton in part blaming the media and trump in part blaming the media. >> absolutely. certainly the media not popular among anybody right now. with regards to the clinton complaints, there's a couple of pieces. number one, the idea of false balance, that clinton was held to a higher standard than donald trump.

the campaign was concerned about that throughout this election. number two, they believe that the comey letter and the coverage of the comey letter ultimately sunk the campaign. it's going to be up to scholars, researchers to figure out how much of an impact that had. i think there's a little bit of truth to the idea that the clinton campaign was held to a higher standard than the trump campaign. >> than a traditional politician. >> right. i would ask viewers at home, how much are they aware of trump's policy plans? the information was available, it was covered on tv, but oftentimes it was overwhelmed by the spectacle of the trump campaign. >> laura, does it sitting u.s. president have any different legal responsibility to the press than an individual citizen? >> i think we think he has a stronger presence he needs to have. legally he does not. he has to adhere to the constitutional principles, the first amendment guarantees access to the person who

controls our legislation and laws. the idea that he would be close-mouthed about that to the press would be fundamentally at odds with what he's said. but the way he's used the media has been spectacular. i would assume he would use the media to his advantage to convey information about his policies and to maybe strong arm or convince people of what his policies should be. >> if i can make one more point, i'm more concerned -- not more concerned. i'm as concerned about trump's fringe supporters as i am about trump himself. we're seeing hate from fringe supporters who do not represent the majority of trump voters. we're seeing hundreds of cases of swastikas, of racist language, in some cases assaults and bullying across this country. some of this needs to be verified but we're seeing it all over social media, some of it directed towards journalists. that's something we need to keep our eyes wide open about. >> brian, that's a great point.

you have to understand, hate crimes and hate speech is not the kind that we protect under the first amendment. your rights stop when my begin. hate speech is fundamentally at odds with what we believe the constitution should uphold. >> important points, thank you both, i appreciate it. coming up next, switching gears, the man who owns the largest stake in embattled bank wells fargo weighs in on the scandal for the first time. hear why warren buffett calls wells fargo a great bank that made a terrible mistake. our exclusive interview, next. whether you're wearing lbeads,.. stripes... or cheese. if you bleed blue... black and yellow, purple or various shades of red... this is your beer.

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legendary investor warren buffett's berkshire hathaway is the biggest shareholder of embattled bank wells fargo, whose reputation was tarnished since news broke earlier this year of a scandal in which at least 2 million fake customer accounts were created over years at the bank, with customers unknowingly charged for them. it cost the ceo his job and 5300 other employees were fired as a result. what does warren buffett make of all of it? here is our conversation on that. let's jump into wells fargo. you have yet to speak publicly about wells fargo until today. wells fargo has admitted to creating some 2 million fake accounts over at least five

years. this is a scandal that cost the ceo his job. it cost 5300 hourly employees, workers, their livelihood and their jobs. berkshire is the largest shareholder in wells fargo, owning 10% of the bank. you personally own 2 million shares. you have been such a supporter of this bank, warren, that back in 2009 you said, if i had to put all of my net worth in a stock, that would be the stock. how do you feel about wells fargo? >> that might well be the case today. it depends on the price of the stock versus other stocks. it's interesting, i don't think anybody has actually picked up on this, but we own 500 million shares of berkshire hathaway. you can't go over 10% of the shares of a bank without becoming a bank holding company, unless you agree to be totally passive and the federal reserve

board has to pass on that. >> which you've applied for. >> what happens of course -- we didn't buy over 10%. wells repurchased shares, which threw us over 10%. we don't want to be a bank holding company. and we filed in june to declare our intent, which we have always had, to be passive. and they still have to rule on that. and it may be a few more months. because we are passive. that means passive. it means -- it was reported i talked directly to the board. i can't talk directly to the board. that is not being passive. the federal reserve would say at that point, you are going to be a bank holding company. we do not want to be a bank holding company. >> so i'm clear, have you personally or berkshire sold any of your stake in wells fargo since the scandal? >> no. >> none? >> no. i didn't want to. >> why? >> it's a great bank that made a

terrible mistake. and every great institution makes -- if you employ 360,000 people like we do or 280,000 like they do -- but they made a particularly egregious mistake. >> this was part of the culture. it was pervasive. and it lasted for years. >> it was a dumb incentive system which when they found out it was dumb, they didn't do anything about it. if you put in incentives, incentives have terrific power to do good things and bad things. everybody uses incentives, people use them with their children. but if you find out incentives are producing perverse behavior to what you intended, you have to change it. it's not unknown to misgauge the effect of incentives. wells fargo designed a system that produced bad behavior. when you find that out, you've got to do something about it. the big mistake was they didn't

do something about it. >> and behavior that has really hurt the bank's reputation. >> it hurt the bank's reputation. >> 1991, salomon brothers scandal, you testified before congress, you said lose money for the firm, i will be understanding, lose reputation, and i will be ruthless. you're sticking with them. why? >> i'm a passive investor in wells fargo. i will guarantee, we've got i don't know how many, 30 companies we own stock in. i'll guarantee there's something going wrong at almost every one of them. it's not my job to run those companies. >> but -- >> it is my job to determine when something goes wrong whether it's going to be permanent. but i was on the board of directors of solomon. >> sure. to those who have said, why didn't you come out and speak publicly sooner, in the midst of the scandal. >> it couldn't be done. at that point i would have violated what i told the federal reserve. we said we would be a passive

investor. >> so you couldn't have said anything? >> i'm not saying i would have said something. but absolutely. we had told the federal reserve in june that we would be a passive investor. >> the ceo, john stumpf, someone you've known well for years. >> a very decent man. >> do you feel misled by him? >> i don't feel misled. i feel he made a hell of a mistake and didn't correct it. it's somewhat similar, i don't want to make it too parallel, john goodfriend didn't commit the act at solomon that caused the problem, but he sucked his thumb when he learned about it. and then it mushroomed, as problems do, out of control. and then, being behind the curve, he didn't know what to do exactly. i don't know what happened precisely at wells fargo at all. but the problem was not doing something about it. we have a hotline at berkshire. and thousands of things come in. the guy next to me has bad

breath or something like that. it goes to the internal auditor. i want to know anything that sounds like it has real validity about something significant. i'm sure that there were signals way back. >> there were whistle-blowers. cnnmoney has reported they reported it and nothing happened. >> that's the problem. i have this formula. get it right, get it out, get it over. you've got to get it right first. and you've got to do it fast. >> did you speak with the ceo, john simptumpf, once the scanda broke? >> i talked to him on a -- the announcement was on a thursday. and i have no idea what the date was. but -- and then i watched him on jim cramer on cnbc. and i thought he didn't get the

gravity. the next morning i called him and basically said, i don't think you've gotten the gravity of the situation. i've seen that before. john goodfriend thought what happened at solomon, he said this was a traffic ticket. >> did you tell john stumpf you thought he had to go? >> no. i just said i think -- i don't know the exact words, but i said i don't think you understand the gravity of this. and i said, i watched cramer the day before. >> when did you become aware -- >> it would not be up to me to say he should go, being a passive investor. >> when did you first become aware of the fake account scandal? >> when i read it. >> when the public became aware. how would you rate wells fargo's initial response? >> slow. >> senator elizabeth warren called it gutless leadership. some have said they put the blame for a too much on lower

level employees. did they? >> i mean, who knows all the statements they made. the important thing, when you have a problem is, get it right, get it out, get it over. >> so -- >> and it's the responsibility of the ceo. >> so tim sloan is now the ceo, a 29-year veteran of the bank. is he the person to do that or does wells need outside leadership? >> i think tim sloan is exactly right. i've met him, shortly after he took over, he came to omaha at his initiative, totally at his initiative. we had lunch. >> obviously he asked your advice. how do you right the ship. >> he told me what was going on. >> how do you get their reputation back? what would your advice be on that front? >> you start from where you are and you work forward. you've got trust to rebuild. you've got an incredible institution. i mean, in terms of the impact on business, it's minor.

they weren't making any money off the program. they were losing money. it isn't like something they were doing that was hugely profitable or anything of the sort. but in terms of the people that are there, in terms of the outside public, it takes time to restore trust. >> wells fargo's new account openings have plunged. the stock price has fallen to a 2 1/2 year low. the sec is investigating, the department of justice, some states attorneys general. do you have faith in wells fargo, the institution? >> oh, sure. sure. we do loads of business with wells fargo. they have billions of dollars. i don't know anything about it, but if i had to guess as to whether the deposits would be up a year from now, i would guess they would be up. >> culture is so important to you. >> it's huge. >> it's at the core of why you buy businesses, the culture of the business from the top down.

was there a flawed culture within the blank? -- bank? >> well, the very act of not correcting the problem affected the culture. my guess is the culture -- everything i know about it, and i don't claim intimate knowledge, the culture was pretty good. and the incentive system corrupted people. if you leave the petty cash of a large number right near the door, you are going to -- some people are going to succumb to that that otherwise would behave pretty well. when other people see people succumbing to it, they will do it. cultures shift. you can affect that culture. you can't affect it in a hurry, but you can turn it for the better or for the worse by your own actions. that's why they put in cash registers. that's how john paterson sold cash registers. he said if you've got a cash

drawer as opposed to my national cash register, you're going to make people behave worse than they would if you had the proper safeguards. >> let's talk about the amount of money that john stumpf has left with. he left wells with a $130 million package. he did have $41 million of that compensation clawed back. is that right? >> you can judge whether anybody runs a business, whether it's right, the amount they get voted. but the shareholders and the directors put a proxy statement that thick, and he's earned it, it's probably part of a contract that describes the conditions under which, you know -- >> sure. outside of the contract, because before, in the past, you've talked about what some would deem as excessive compensation packages. you have said, if i were the american shareholder, i would get irritated with these goodbye

kisses, your words. >> i still am. that's not in any way related to john stumpf. >> but 5300 people -- >> american ceos have taken very good care of themselves. >> 5300 employees don't have a job at wells fargo anymore. for them to see john stumpf leaving with that amount of money is hard to stomach. >> i mean, that's been repeated time after time after time in american business. you look at thousands of banks, at least hundreds of banks that have failed, did they have claw backs on any of those? >> what was the lesson learned when you came in to help right the ship at solomon back in '91, what's going to be the lesson learned here? >> the lesson is, any time you get any indication that any policy is leading to bad behavior, get on it quickly. and just any problem, you know. attack it early.

my partner charlie says, an ounce of prevention isn't worth a pound of cure, it's worth a ton of cure. and, you know, you do -- you'll make mistakes. the question is, you know, do those mistakes fester and become a cancer on the organization or anything of the sort. but you better learn to deal with mistakes in business, because you're going to make them. i made a lot of 'em. that's part of the job, is not just taking the kudos. part of your job is dealing with mistakes. frequently they can be mistakes that people under you made, but they are under you. when you find out about them, you've got to do something about it. >> my thanks to warren buffett for that. you can see our full interview also as cnnmoney.com/buffett. voting is under way for cnn hero of the year. we want you to meet georgie smith. >> my name is georgie smith. i started an organization in los

angeles called a sense of home. we create homes for foster kids who age out of the system. kids who haven't got any family to help them with their first ever permanent living space, we come in with donated items and volunteers who completely furnish their home and serve as the family for any youth first setting up their first home. they say it takes a village to raise a child. i needed to do something for these children. >> this is crazy. >> oh my goodness. it's so pretty. >> you know, everyone needs home. the ache for home lives inside all of us. it's so true. and coming to create someone else's home is fulfilling a void in all of us. >> it means the world to me. thanks, everyone. thank you. [ applause ]

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