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tv   CNN Tonight With Don Lemon  CNN  November 20, 2019 7:00pm-8:01pm PST

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indication that he won't be. maybe he'll choose not to be. maybe he won't have that post? who knows? >> i think she said at the end there, maybe he won't have that post anymore. who knows? well, you know who knows. the president. remember, this president values fealty, not loyalty. the difference? he doesn't care of you. he just expects you to take care of him. and if you don't, be on the lookout. thanks for watching. "cnn tonight" with d. lemon with a packed show right now. >> she offered every single answer that you could give. well, he's still on the job but maybe he won't be. maybe he'll choose not to or maybe he'll lose the post. >> that covers it. >> that covers everything. listen, today was explosive. i know, you know, we say that, and every day we find out something new. this was not a good day for the administration. key figures including the president, the chief of staff, the secretary of state, all of them, not a good day for them. and the vice president. >> good day for the truth.
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>> yeah. >> bad day for the state of division because now that the truth is this obvious, the division becomes even more odious. >> it does, and i have to say at this point if you're continuing to say that there was no, as they say, quid pro quo or the president didn't ask or whatever, whether or not it's impeachable, that is again not up for me to decide, not up for you to decide. that's up for the senate to decide and the american people. but to deny that the president did not do something wrong at this point, it is -- >> plolitical. >> it's mental. that's what it is. if you can look at the mountain of evidence and say nothing's wrong. the president didn't do anything wrong. he's just rooting out corruption, you got a problem. >> yeah. >> because that is not what happened. >> the problem is you're a partisan. >> the problem is you. >> they say that he's not represented, don. i have never seen a man better
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represented. you could have someone coming after you in the middle of your christmas dinner at your family's house. you wouldn't be as well represented as he was. everybody in that room was only trying to find ways on the republican side to get him out of this. >> and not addressing the substance at all. so when you can't address the substance, what does that mean? you bring up old conspiracy hen- theories. >> it means you're not doing your job. if they were all attorneys, that's fine. until they quit and join the legal team, their job is oversight. they were overlooking things, not doing oversight. >> i've got a packed show. got to run. see you soon, chris cuomo, in washington. but this is time for "cnn tonight" with me, don lemon. we had one bombshell after another as the impeachment hearings that began at 9:00 a.m. stretched well into the night. i was actually worried. it was like, well, i don't know. maybe i won't even go on tv if this continues the way it is. i thought it was going to stretch well into the 10:00, maybe 11:00 hour. it went on for a long time into the evening. we're going to bring you all the
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big moments that you might have missed, so stay tuned for that. but tonight, top pentagon official laura cooper -- that's her name -- shooting holes in the gop defense that there couldn't be a shakedown if ukraine didn't know that military aid was being withheld. well, it turns out they did know. they knew on the very day of the president's infamous phone call with the president of ukraine. >> my staff showed me two unclassified emails that they received from the state department. one was received on july 25th at 2:31 p.m. that email said that the ukrainian embassy and house foreign affairs committee are asking about security assistance. the second email was received on july 25th at 4:25 p.m. that email said that the hill knows about the fmf situation to an extent, and so does the ukrainian embassy. >> let me tell you, here's why that is so important.
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we started the day with the republicans arguing that there was no quid pro quo, no shakedown. well, gordon sondland demolishing that defense with his testimony that the shakedown was directed by the president and rudy giuliani. >> mr. giuliani's requests were a quid pro quo for arranging a white house visit for president zelensky. mr. giuliani demanded that ukraine make a public statement announcing the investigations of the 2016 election dnc server and burisma. mr. giuliani was expressing the desires of the president of the united states, and we knew these investigations were important to the president. >> there you go. then there is the second republican argument that there couldn't be a quid pro quo if ukraine didn't know about it.
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well, laura cooper's testimony tonight blows that one right out of the water. and then there is the third republican argument. ukraine got the aid, so no harm, no foul. except here's the fact. the fact is that ukraine only got the aid because the president and his men got caught. and in the face of all of this, all of this damning evidence of a shakedown by the president, the republicans are spouting lies, and they're spouting nonsense, conspiracy theories with no basis in fact. >> the democrats have zeroed in on an anonymous whistle-blower complaint that was cooked up in cooperation with the democrats on this very committee. when journalists report on ukraine election meddling and hunter biden's position on the board of corrupt ukrainian companies, the democrats label them conspiracy theorists. >> i was wondering what hearing was he at. that is rich. what he said was rich because
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the fact is -- remember, facts first. devin nunes is just throwing out one conspiracy theory after another after another. it is shameful, shameful that he's trying to distract you with garbage. it's garbage. it's trash. this is a time to be serious. this is a time to follow the facts wherever they lead, to look at the substance. republicans, knock it off with the debunked conspiracy theories. you look really stupid and dumb. be serious. do your job. you took an oath to support and defend the constitution of the united states of america, the basis, the basis of our democracy. defend the president on the facts of this case. if you can't do that without resorting to lies and nonsense, well, maybe that should probably tell you something. yet one after another, those republicans are using their time in the impeachment hearings not
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to follow the facts, not to talk about the substance of this, but to perform for an audience of one. and here is the tell. here's how you know all of this had nothing to do with corruption in ukraine. it was actually all about corruption in this administration. >> he had to announce the investigations. he didn't actually have to do them as i understood it. >> busted. all he wanted was a public announcement. hmm, why is that? a public announcement and not really investigations? what does that tell you? maybe one scenario is when the election is going on, well, joe biden is under investigation. who does that help? that helps the president, who's running for re-election. who does it hurt? his political opponent.
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duh. whatever happened to draining the swamp? this is the swamp. the president claiming today that he doesn't know sondland very well, the man who told him on that cell phone call in the middle of the kiev restaurant that president zelensky, his words, loves your ass. just listen to what sondland has to say about that. >> that sounds like something i would say. that's how president trump and i communicate, a lot of four-letter words, in this case three-letter. >> does that sound like someone the president doesn't really know? while sondland is testifying, the president gets out in front of the cameras, reading his talking points. there they are, written in big letters in sharpie no less, because apparently he needs that to remember this statement.
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>> i want nothing. i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. tell zelensky to do the right thing. then he says, this is the final word from the president of the united states. i want nothing. >> i want nothing. that's what i said. actually sondland said he was paraphrasing. he said the president said something to the effect. it wasn't a quote. so he had to read back. so actually what he's reading back is a paraphrase of what someone said he said. it's just like, you know, the memo of the call. it's not verbatim. this is a mess. come on, people. really? but that scribbled out in sharpie, it did the job. every republican saw it. every republican saw it. they got the message. as michael cohen told us, the president doesn't give orders.
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he speaks, and you get the message. >> he doesn't give you questions. he doesn't give you orders. he speaks in a code, and i understand the code because i've been around him for a decade. >> it doesn't take a genius. the president's message comes through. i mean, listen, no shade to michael cohen. that's just an expression. it doesn't take a genius. anybody can see what the president is doing. that message, the president's message, comes through loud and clear. >> on september 9th and most importantly reading from your deposition, you called president trump to ask him, what do you want from ukraine? he responded, i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. i want zelensky to do the right thing. >> i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. i want zelensky to do the right thing. i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. i want this new guy, brand-new guy in politics, his party just took over, i want zelensky to do
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the right thing. >> no quid pro quo. i want nothing. i want nothing. i want president zelensky to do the right thing. >> i want nothing. there is no quid pro quo. let me repeat. president trump said, i want nothing. there is no quid pro quo. >> it is so obvious. desperation. they even had signs made up. wow, this actually happened. but the thing is this is not really about ukraine. this is about the president and his administration, and what we learned today is that more and more the president's men are getting caught in the scandal, starting with the president himself. take a look at your screen. there it is. sondland's testimony today makes that clear, and there is more to
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come tomorrow. fiona hill, the president's former top russia adviser, testifies tomorrow along with diplomat david holmes, who overheard that explosive cell phone call in the middle of a crowded ukraine restaurant with the president asking whether ukraine's president was going to, quote, do the investigations. as i have said, buckle up. more to come. that gets under way 9:00 a.m. bombshell testimony. surprise revelations. we'll go through all of it, and i'm wondering with all the new evidence coming up in these hearings, are democrats -- are they rushing things? let's discuss. jim sciutto, john dean, carl bernstein. but we'll do it after the break. ♪
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if it's not a shark, it's just a robot. hi honey, we got in early. yeah, and we brought steve and mark. ♪ experience the power of sanctuary at the lincoln wish list sales event. sign and drive off in a new lincoln with zero down, zero due at signing, and a complimentary first month's payment. well you remember what happened last year. you can't bring a backup thanksgiving to my sister's house. it's not like we're going to walk in with it. we'll bring it in as we need it. ...phase it in. phase it in? yeah, phase it in. so welcome back. >> reporter: in his impeachment testimony, ambassador gordon
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sondland flat out said the scheme to investigate president trump's political opponents came at the express direction of the president. and later a pentagon official testified that ukraine officials knew as early the day of the president's ukraine call that military aid was frozen. let's bring in mr. jim sciutto, sir john dean, and mr. carl bernstein. gentlemen, thank you. a momentous day, i'm sure you all will agree. jim, i'm going to start with you. ambassador sondland and laura cooper both gave testimony today that demolished key republican arguments or talking points. >> so big picture, right? sondland says there was a delay in the aid. there was a quid pro quo. it came from the direction of the president, and others were aware of it. you know, himself, pompeo, pence, et cetera. what he didn't say was that he heard those words directly from the president. the president did not say to him, do this, you know, and i
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will stand in the way of that. the question, though, remains why did they then do it, right? you know, why did all these senior officials in the trump administration then violate what was stated u.s. policy towards ukraine, which was to give the aid to help fight the invasion against russia. so you, you know, basically the test for republicans and democrats is did they do that of their own free will? did they violate the policy based on their own imagination of what the president wanted? i mean that's basically the gut check here is, you know, if he did not hear those words or is not willing to testify to those words, then why did they pursue a policy that violated what the stated u.s. policy was towards ukraine. that's the real test, and the question is does that provide enough of an opening for republican lawmakers to say, okay. questionable, but we don't have the proof there to vote to
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impeach the president. >> mm-hmm. john dean, you say ambassador sondland put the truth over party and the president today, but did he stop short of telling the whole truth today? >> i think he did. when i saw it was trending on twitter today that he was having a full john dean moment, i thought about it, and another watergate term came to mind, that this was a modified limited hangout. i don't know if you remember that, don, but that was a phrase of a little ambiguous testimony where you pointed the finger. you protected yourself, but you did name everybody but the president really and really didn't draw him in. >> i was going to say to you, john, he did a good job of throwing everybody under the bus and covering his -- and cya. you know what that term means. >> limited modified hangout. modified limited hangout.
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anyway, his statement, his written statement was the strongest part of his testimony. >> right. >> he was not real good on really soft cross-examination and gave up, like, oh, i'm presuming this or i don't know this for a fact or i didn't have this conversation. so i had hoped for more during his cross-examination. when i did my own written statement, i raised things that i knew a lot about and was prepared to really turn the fire hose on if they asked me about it. that wasn't the case today. >> carl bernstein, during watergate, nixon famously went on tv and said, i am not a crook. november 17th, almost exactly 46 years ago. is president trump a crook? >> he's a corrupt president, and today's testimony made clear just how corrupt he is. but let's go back to the big picture that jim started with because what we saw today is the wheels have now come off the
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cover-up, and the stunning dimensions of the underlying conspiracy are really apparent after sondland's testimony. when he said that everyone is in the loop, that really is apparent now. so we have a roadmap. we have a chronology. was he the perfect witness? no. he's flawed. he was not as great a witness as dean because he wasn't privy to as much as john dean was. but this takes us into new territory, and tomorrow we have fiona hill, who i suspect we're going to learn an awful lot from about all kinds of things and views that happened at the national security council, including some of john bolton's views and actions. i've said all along none of us knows where this is going to go. we don't know the outcome, and i think that's even more true after today. and it's a grave situation. >> jim, give us the final word because carl took us forward to tomorrow. i said earlier at this point, if
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you look at the evidence and you don't think that the president has done something wrong, perhaps there's something wrong with you. again, that doesn't mean yhe should be removed from office or impeachment. but just from the facts, from the transcript, from the phone call, from the overheard phone call, the evidence is damning. >> it is. but you know what i worry here is that obstruction works in the end, right? you know, the president, the white house has banned the witnesses that would then make the explicit connection between the president and this order. john bolton, secretary pompeo, all the folks who someone like sondland says were also in on this, and the documens, the emails. i mean sondland said that in his opening statement. i can't back up all of my statements because i can't go back to reference the emails, communications, text messages, et cetera, that might jog my memory. and the worrisome fact here is does the white house strategy,
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in effect, work in that you prevent the witnesses and the documents from backing up that explicit connection to the president. we saw this to some degree during the mueller investigation. do we see it again? does it work? you know, it may end up in an article of impeachment, but does it work in turning the minds of republican lawmakers? it may be true. >> i think that's a very good point, and no matter what evidence comes out, there's always a more ridiculous excuse for the president's behavior that comes from the republicans. thank you very much. i appreciate all of you. huge revelations at today's hearings ripping apart the arguments by the president and his defenders. john kasich is next. he's going to weigh in. ng behin♪ ♪ turn around ♪ look at me ♪ there is someone
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today's testimony in the ukraine shakedown demolishing the talking points of the president and his allies, but will it change any minds on impeachment? former republican governor of ohio john kasich joins me now. hello, john. i like checking in with you after these big developments. your reaction to today's testimony? >> well, i'm going to show you. i just made my own artwork. these are my own talking points, okay? i think this will explain, don. let's just assume you have a congressman that has not totally made up their mind and they're not going to change no matter what. so you have three things at play. you have the political party which puts pressure on the members of the party to stay in line. but then you have the public. and i think after today's testimony, it's likely we're not going to know it within the next 12 hours, but we will know it over time, whether the testimony today moved the public because if the public is moved, then the
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party matters less. and then of course at the bottom of the triangle is a very important thing, and it's called conscience. so for those who are whispering to one another about what this testimony means, right now the party is ascendant. the public is kind of -- you kow, consistent with the party if you're in a republican district. but if the public starts to move, it will make the party -- it will not be as powerful as it was, and then what every congressman has to do -- congressman and woman -- is they have to think about their conscience because at the end of the day -- and i signed this, don, personally for you by the way. at the end of the day when you go home, there's only one person that matters, and that's the person that you see in the mirror. so all you've been about is your party, you know, i think this explains the push and the pull. i think the testimony today, because i watched 11 minutes of one national news segment tonight -- i think the public's going to pay more attention.
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i can't predict where they're going to move, but i think they're going to have -- they're going to put more pressure on for the person to be responsible, maybe a little less effect of the party. does that make sense to new. >> you know we're a big, legit organization. we have a graphics department. we could have made that up for you. i appreciate the effort. >> this is very extremely valuable, extremely valuable. >> hold on. >> everybody has their notes today. >> the president called, and he wants his sharpie back. listen, it's serious business here. what about over in the senate, okay? what do you think some of the more moderate senators are thinking when they -- >> see, the senate, that's develop interesting. look, in the house, because of redistricting, there aren't many marginal seats anymore, okay? it just didn't exist. so there are not that many people that are sitting over there worrying, okay, what's the public think because the public mostly is republican and agree with them if you're republican, democrat if you're a democrat. so the party still has great influence, and the public's kind
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of with you. at the end, you still have conscience you have to deal with. but in the united states senate, don, there are states where it can be extremely close, extremely close. that's why the development -- >> go on. >> -- is going to matter because it might put great pressure on some of these -- >> sorry for debt lalay. we have a little cross talk of that. the ranking member devin nunes didn't talk about substance at all. it's got to be part of the strategy to create these moments that can be used to spread these conspiracy theories on fox news, on conservative media, and on social media. that's got to be it because what he said didn't -- had nothing to do with what was happening in the hearings. >> to me, don, the question is going to be the regular media and social media, and i saw a lot of attention being given to sondland today. how does that penetrate?
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how do people feel about it? and as the public, you know, wakes up, and if they move, they put tremendous pressure on members of the united states senate, who are in vulnerable seats. >> that's my question. let's stick to the question. >> yeah. it doesn't matter what he did. it doesn't matter. media dismiss that. i mean i don't -- >> you don't think the people at home or the people who are watching conservative media or listening to conservative media and getting those talking points, they're not hearing substance at all. they're hearing debunked conspiracy theories and process. >> yeah, but, don, i think we can talk about the conservative media, okay? but if we look at the numbers for all cable, you know, and you look at an evening newscast that puts 11 of the first 15 minutes on all about this. >> right. >> it drowns out. the numbers are much bigger. and we'll see what the headlines are tomorrow, and we'll see what they're going to talk about tomorrow morning on these early morning shows that people are listening while they're getting the kids ready for school.
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that's what we have to keep our eye on. where is the public because the public will mitigate party, and may force some people to think about their conscience. >> okay. >> and being true to it. >> conscience. >> one way or the other. >> party, public, in a triangle. thank you, john kasich. >> okay. it could go in a political science book. it could be brilliant, like the theory of relativity. all right, don. thank you. >> he needs an art class. gordon sondland implicating some major trump administration players in the ukraine scandal. we'll be right back. er shop. when you shop small you help support your community - from after school programs to the arts! so become a regular, more regularly. because for every dollar you spend at a small business, an average of 67 cents stays in the community. join me and american express on small business saturday, november 30th,
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download the xfi app today. ambassador gordon sondland testified, and i quote, we followed the president's orders. that's big, so big, right? it is the banner headline at the top of tomorrow's "new york times." he says the president's senior officials knew about the
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ukrainian shakedown scheme. >> everyone was in the loop. it was no secret. >> and then there is the vice president, mike pence. sondland claims that he told pence early in september, before the v.p. was to meet ukraine's president, that he was concerned aid to ukraine was tied to the investigations. well, tonight pence tells a wisconsin tv reporter that he has no recollection of any discussion. now, note that he used the word "discussion." sondland testified that when he expressed his concerns to mike pence, the v.p. didn't say anything, just nodded his head. and then there is the secretary of state, mike pompeo here. well, mike pompeo, sondland says, emailed him with concerns about linking the money to the investigations and in emails sondland gave the committee, pompeo appeared to approve of
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sondland's work in ukraine. but tonight pompeo's spokesperson says sondland never told the secretary that he believed the president was linking aid to investigations of political opponents and that any suggestions to the contrary are false. there's also the outgoing energy secretary, rick perry. sondland says that perry worked with rudy giuliani to press for the investigations. but perry denies knowledge of the quid pro quo, and he is refusing to cooperate with the impeachment investigation. there's also rudy giuliani at the top there. sondland testified the quid pro quo came from him at the express direction of president trump. but after sondland's testimony today, giuliani claimed he never discussed the issue of military aid with sondland. as for mick mulvaney, well, sondland claims that he emailed the acting white house chief of staff before the infamous july 25th phone call, making clear the scheme was in play. mulvaney admitted to the quid pro quo at a press briefing in october. but then he later denied that he
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publicly admitted to it. and then there is the former national security adviser john bolton, who was in the july 10th meeting with ukrainian officials where sondland brought up the shakedown scheme. bolton immediately shut the meeting down, but in an interesting side note, sondland says bolton's office requested giuliani's contact information before a visit to kiev. did bolton call giuliani? what did they say? so many questions. james clapper is here, and we're going to get to all of that next. ♪ a wealth of information. a wealth of perspective. ♪ a wealth of opportunities. that's the clarity you get from fidelity wealth management. straightforward advice, tailored recommendations, tax-efficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth. fidelity wealth management.
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let's discuss. james clapper, the former director of national intelligence, is here. thank you, sir. we have a short time, and i want to get a lot in. i appreciate you joining us. listen, sondland implicated so many people close to the president in his testimony today. we're looking at some of them now. he says that they were all in the loop, and it was on behalf of the president. go. what do you think? >> well, it was very damning and very compelling, and i thought his statement, which is in writing, pretty strong, and of course this really thickens the plot. so i thought it was hugely damaging and not a good day for the white house. >> he testified, meaning sondland, that some of the most senior members of the administration, meaning pompeo, mulvaney, bolton -- they all knew about this shakedown scheme. but as it stands right now, we're not going to hear from any of them. we know the democrats' strategy is to wrap this up quickly, but
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don't you think we need to hear from them? >> well, obviously i couldn't help but think about when the republicans were complaining about the witnesses who were reporting secondhand observations. well, the people who have firsthand observation won't or aren't permitted to testify. so one would think that exculpatory information that would help the president, they would be in the witness chair, but obviously they're not. i would guess we probably won't see them. >> another person who testified today is laura cooper. she's a deputy assistant secretary of defense. she updated her testimony today -- tonight actually and revealed that the ukrainians reached out to defense and state, meaning the defense and state departments about the status of the aid on the very same day of the trump/zelensky call. does that reveal they knew what was going on? >> yes, it certainly substantiates it, and i suspect
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they actually knew about it before that. but clearly the effort to rationalize that no harm, no foul because the ukrainians never knew about the hold, well, i'm sure they did. as important as this was to them and the long delay that i'm sure the ukrainians understood what was going on. >> listen, if you can answer this for me. minority leader devin nunes continuing to use the hearings today to spread unfounded conspiracy theories. one is that ukraine interfered in the 2016 election. there's absolutely no evidence that is true. it's like he's living in an alternate universe. >> well, yeah. there was absolutely no intelligence, certainly contemporaneously whatever of the ukrainians attempting to interfere in the election. i don't know what motivation they would have to do that. but let's just assume for the sake of discussion that what congressman nunes said was right.
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well, that dwarves exponenti exponentially -- what the russians did dwarves exponentially even the allegations, which there's no basis for, about the alleged ukrainian interference, so it's just ridiculous. it's just a distraction. >> yeah. intelligence is the key word in that. thank you. thank you very much, director. i appreciate it. >> thanks, don. as the testimony gets more and more damning for the president, he's even writin down his favorite talking points. no quid pro quo. how the white house is reacting to all of this, next. did you get a whole thanksgiving? well you remember what happened last year. you can't bring a backup thanksgiving to my sister's house. it's not like we're going to walk in with it. we'll bring it in as we need it.
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gordon sondland testifying the ukraine shakedown scheme came at the express direction of the president. the president disagrees. here to discuss, susan glasser, michael d. antonio. good evening to both. this was the president on the white house lawn today. watch. >> i say to the ambassador in response, i want nothing, i want nothing, i want no quid pro quo. tell zelenski, president zelenski, to do the right thing. so, here's my answer, i want nothing. i want nothing. i want no quid pro quo. tell zelenski to do the right thing. then he says, this is the final
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word from the president of the united states, i want nothing. thank you folks. have a good time. >> i mean, come on. michael, he read from his pad, his talking points were written in black sharpie. you can clearly read i want nothing, i want nothing, i want no quid pro quo, tells zelenski which is, by the way, misspelled, to do the right thing. this is the final word from the president of the united states. is he going to need more than a few talking points. >> i think he might need to go back to walter reed for psychiatric exam because this was crazy town. watching the president standing on the driveway there bellowing at the cameras, i want nothing, i want nothing is absurd. you know, this is a kind of unreal approach to this profound
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crisis that the president is dragging the country through because of his behavior, because of his corruption. and we're seeing the man fall apart. now, the one thing i'll give him is that he's consistent. he's behaved this way for much of his adult life. he's not going to give in. he's not going to acknowledge reality. and so we're going to have to force him to see it. the congress is going to have to force him to see it and the american people will have to require it. >> trust me, right now someone is writing the broadway musical "no quid pro quo" or maybe it's "i want nothing i want nothing" underlined no quid pro quo in small letters. listen, susan, the president, here he is describing his hand-picked ambassador who not only donated a million dollars to his inauguration but served as a fund-raiser for his campaign. watch. >> i don't know him very well. i have not spoken to him very much. this is not a man i know well. >> he does that -- i mean he
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barely knew him? where have we heard that before, susan? >> we've heard it a few times before. donald trump has a breathtaking cycling through of aides and advisers in and out of his white house, in and out of his company. and guess what, you can be pretty sure when the door hits you on the way out that donald trump has no idea who you are, you hardly met each other, you never talked. gordon sondland testified under oath that he interacted and talked with the president approximately 20 times. i was really struck yesterday when tim morrison, no fan of his at the national security council, they were very suspicious of gordon sondland. that was he was bragging about having access to the president. tim morrison said every time i checked out whether he had a phone call with the president, he did. i think that was the power of the testimony today was this was a guy who had interacted
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directly with the president. he takes you back in time to the oval office in may when the president of the united states said talk to rudy, he's the guy. you have to deal with him on this. and that's putting it in the president's own words and then you watch it unfolding over the next few months. >> michael, the president really took offense at being characterized as not in a good mood on that phone call, saying that he's always in a good mood. really? >> i think gordon sondland is absolutely right. the president was in a bad mood whenever i saw him in the mornings back when i was interviewing him for my book. and, you know, i think this idea that he doesn't know someone like gordon sondland, he knew him well enough to take his $1 million, and he knew him well enough a month ago -- october 8th -- he said that gordon sondland is a very good guy and that he's a great american. so, which is it, president trump? great american or i don't really know him? >> he was just a coffee boy.
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we've heard that one before, remember? susan, ohio republican jim jordan has been given a prominent role in this. no jacket, loud voice, lots of yelling. that may appeal to the gop base. he's playing to a party of one, right? >> i will say that my 14-year-old son who hadn't been watching the hearings came in in the evening session today and jordon was on the tv. he had no idea who it was, what party he was, he was like mom, can you turn off that yelling man. i think he speaks for all of us. it's an interesting tactic. it seems to be just yell and undermine the witnesses. it's not just the audience of one is trump though. it's also that they're getting their documents from trump. i felt like the republicans this morning were stunned and didn't know how to deal with sondland and it was only when they sort of rallied later in the day and trump essentially gave them marching orders that they seemed
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to snap to and mount a much more vociferous attack on the witness. >> an interesting day and interesting tomorrow. it starts at 9:00 a.m. our live coverage is going to continue now with anderson cooper. >> good evening. thanks for joining us. coming up on 11:00 p.m. here in new york. two big stories, damaging testimony about the president and the debate in the race to be his democratic opponent. debate in the closing moments, we'll be talking to candidates getting a sense of how they did and getting a sense of questions that weren't asked on the stand today. it's a two david night. a quick note about the -- well debate coming up.out the next - what stood out to you about the debate tonight? >> i thought generally aside from the end of the debate they were pretty civil to each other.
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i think that pete buttigieg is a terrific baiter and he is somebody who really needed to tell people and try to this evening and i think with some success that even though he's young and only been a mayor, et cetera, et cetera, that he has what he calls the right kind of experience to lead him to become president of the united states. and he also tried to compare his experiences as a gay american to african-americans when he talked about when he was asked about his inability so far to appeal to black voters and said, you know, i know what it's like to live in a country that sometimes you don't recognize as your own. i butte buttigieg had a good night. >> you heard kamala try to take it to him, in a gentle way. i don't think it was the fireworks she reserved for tulsi gabbard. she can bring the obama coalition to bear in 2020 in

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