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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  January 29, 2021 5:00pm-6:00pm PST

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you can send liz cheney home. >> the fact is congressman gaetz you are trying to cancel liz cheney and that's out of bounds. we are learning from jamie, the george w. bush plans to call dick cheney tomorrow and one reason is to thank him for his daughter's service. thank you for joining us. "ac 360" starts now. and good evening. barely a day after the top republican lawmaker in the house made his pilgrimage to kiss the ring of the man is video of the attack. it is in many ways the an in this case -- an nick dote and serves as a reminder many won't forget no matter how hard this republican leader and many try the change the subject. we want to warn you the footage from a police body camera is graphic and difficult to watch. it's important because it's precisely what so many are
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trying to push down the memory hole. evidence in proceedings against a man named michael foye a marine from michigan. it shows a man attacking a police officer and dragging him away to be beaten. foye is seen on the tape with a hockey stick. he's one of 21 military veterans arrested. we'll have more on the story and that aspect later on the program and dig deeper into the troubling fact so many service members took part in the insurrection. we start with covid, consisting of measures of hope and a lot of measures of dread. the hope, new data showing a third vaccine, this one from johnson & johnson is also very effective. according to the numbers from a global phase three study, the single shot vaccine was 66% effective in preventing moderate and severe disease and was 85%
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effective at preventing hospitalization and death. now, it's effectiveness against moderate and severe disease varied from 57% in south africa where that new strain is and 72% in the united states. it's lower, you might realize, the figure for two doses of the moderna and pfizer vaccine, something dr. anthony fauci today said was less of a real world concern than you might imagine. >> now, the important issue because the first thing people do is compare a 72% effectiveness with the previously reported in other trials of 94 to 95%. that is true, but when one looks at the potential impact on a very important aspect of what we look at carefully is namely severe disease that overall in the united states in south africa and in brazil, the overall effectiveness was 85%.
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in the study including in the south african isolate, there were essentially no hospitalizations or deaths in the vaccine group whereas in the placebo group, there were. >> so johnson & johnson is expected to apply for emergency use authorization next week and because it's one shot, you just need one shot with this vaccine, that doesn't require extreme refigu refrigeration, it means more people protected sooner and guard members given out shots. a draft agreement between the pentagon and fema calling for the military to provide 10,000 troops to vaccinate 450,000 people a day. states that are leading the way in getting shots in arms got a shoutout from the president's covid team. >> i want to call out seven states that have already provided first vaccinations to more than 10% of their adult population. alaska, west virginia, new
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mexico, connecticut, north dakota, oklahoma and south da dakota. well done. >> it's worth noting that five of those seven states are so-called red states. it's also hard not to contrast this between this administration's deep politicized approach when compared to the last administration's politically charged messaging. >> as soon as april, the vaccine will be available to the entire general population with the exception of places like new york state where for political reasons, the governor decided to say and, you know, i don't think it's good politically. it's bad from a health standpoint but he wants to take his time with the vaccine. >> the current president toured a vaccination site in a gym at the walter reed military medical center where he met with staff and wounded service members but as we said a moment ago, any
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hope on that or the fact new infections finally started dropping is offset by the prospect darker days could be just ahead. according to the university of washington's institute for health metmetrics, the death to could reach 654,000 people by may 1st in this country. it's called a worst case scenario are assumes wide spread very ariant and some states wil simply not reimpose essential distancing measures when daily deaths are high. i want to talk to the director in the second live hour tonight. we're on for two hours. in a moment, a live report on the president's f 's effort to the covid relief bill through congress, even if it means 51 democratic votes. >> i support passing covid relief with support from republicans, if we can get it. but covid relief has to pass. no ifs, ands or buts.
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>> starting tonight, sanjay gupta and health commissioner for the city of ballot march. sanjay, can you break down the johnson & johnson number and explain the trial results? >> yeah, so let me just put the numbers up. we can put those up on the screen. what you're seeing, effective t moderate and severe disease and on the right side of the screen severe disease. what the left side of the screen is telling you, there is clearly some difference based on where these trials were conducted, and that's really reflecting the effectiveness against some of these vvariants. the right side of the screen is important. what is the purpose of the vaccine, to prevent severe illness and prevent people from going to the hospital, hospitals becoming overwhelmed and to prevent death and that's where it's most effective and interestingly, most effective
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across the board meaning it didn't seem to have a lowering of effectiveness based on the particular variants or where the trial was conducted. the right side of the screen is important. 85% protected against serious disease everywhere including variants. >> and sanjay, as dr. fauci said, a lot of people compare the johnson & johnson to pfizer and moderna. is it a straight comparison? >> no, i think it's not. this is a little kpoint, the hed of rnd about johnson & johnson. i'll explain a little bit about what he's talking about here. take a listen. how does this vaccine stack up to what is already been authorized in the united states, the moderna and pfizer vaccines? >> the honest answer is they can't become compared head-to-h because the vaccine programs with mrna were recruited in
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accrued cases in a different time where the incidents was much lower so less pressure on the vaccine to protect and there were no, none of these problematic variants people are talking now. >> so what he's saying ba basically, it's not just what the vaccine is showing with effectiveness but also where the trial was conducted. a way to think about this, this johnson & johnson trial, the vaccine was actually being trailed against a sicker population. there was more virus out there. there was more pressure from the virus on the vaccines but more very ariants we're talking abou. how would pfizer and moderna do now if it were trailed now like johnson & johnson? maybe it would be the same. maybe it would not. it's hard to compare apples to apples because the trials were
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done at different times. >> doctor, i understand you were a participant in the johnson & johnson vaccine trial and you'll receive a second dose. if this is a one dose vaccine, why are you receiving a second dose? >> so i decided to participate in the johnson and johnson clinical trial because that was available to me at the time. i would have had no issues in participating in any of the other trials. by the time i enrolled in the trial, the only arm -- there are two arms, one is the one dose and one is the two dose. unlike fiezer and moderna, the johnson & johnson was studied as a one dose but researchers thought with a second shot you might get more protection or longer lasting production than one dose alone. so the second shot is given 60 days after the first. i would say that i agree with sanjay. i think these results today are promising because if you told us back in october that we might get a single dose vaccine that
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can be stored at refrag igerate temperatures for months so regular doctors offices can give this out, if you're telling us this vaccine can prevent severe disease and all cases of hospitalizations and deaths, that's really remarkable. i'm personally excited as a participant in the trial, too. >> so the second dose, that's part of the study, as well? >> that's right. so the initial group, that's the group that they just released the studies from, that's the group that were enrolled in the one dose trial. then there are other people, tens of thousands of other people including me enroll in a separate trial looking at the two-dose version. >> okay. so not like you got one dose and then you're like okay, i don't have confidence of this so i'll on the side get a dose. this is part of the study. it's legit. i mentioned johnson & johnson is expected to apply for emergency authorization next week. is there any reason to think the fda wouldn't grant it and how
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would it affect the roll joutd? >> there isn't any reason. we followed, obviously, the process of the emergency use authorization from moderna and pfizer. we'll follow committee meetings on this carefully. i don't think there is any reason. we talked about the effectiveness and safety data was promising. they collected two months of safety data like you saw with moderna and pfizer. as far azs the rollout. it's interesting. big company. the doctor you saw, he said they will make a billion doses potentially of this particular vaccine in 2021. obviously, most of that going around the world. 100 million of those doses have been purchased here in the united states and they have been manufacturing at risk, meaning they will have a lot of vaccine available to go. he told me they would start shipping the next day after a potential emergency use authorization is given and then they will roll it out. i mean, the expectation is at least 100 million doses by june
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could go faster than that and they could provide more to the united states if, you know, the united states requests and purchases more. >> dr. nguyen mentioned this, it doesn't require special refrigeration, right? i guess, it requires refrigeration, just not the deep special kind the other one does, is that right? >> right. normal refrigeration and it can stay for months. i mean, i think the official thing is three months but potentially even longer than that so it's got a long shelf life at normal temperatures. >> that's really amazing because that means it could be at regular doctors' offices. sanjay, dr. nguyen, thank you, as always. have a good weekend. up next, a live update where things stand on the massive covid relief bill. senator bernie sanders joins me live to talk about it and more on the new up close scenes from the insurrection and a closer
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look at one disturbing aspect of it, how many of the insurrectionists served in the military. if your dry eye symptoms keep coming back, inflammation in your eye might be to blame. looks like a great day for achy, burning eyes over-the-counter eye drops typically work by lubricating your eyes and may provide temporary relief. ha! these drops probably won't touch me. xiidra works differently, targeting inflammation that can cause dry eye disease. what is that? xiidra, noooo! it can provide lasting relief. xiidra is the only fda approved treatment specifically for the signs and symptoms of dry eye disease. one drop in each eye, twice a day. don't use if you're allergic to xiidra. common side effects include eye irritation, discomfort or blurred vision when applied to the eye, and unusual taste sensation.
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thank you to all involved in our clinical trials. some breaking news for people facing eviction. late today extended a pandemic order. the measure, which was set to expire this month covers people earning $99,000 a year or less and cannot make payment because of lost income or extraordinary medical cost. the measure is not comprehensive
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and law which brings us to the president's effort to pass a covid relief bill. the republican opposition and what could be resistance from two democratic senators. phil mattingly joins us with more. how and when does the president think he might get a deal on this stimulus money? >> reporter: anderson, speed is of the essence. they know the march deadline for evictions at the end of march and the expanded unemployment insurance is real and will bite before mid march when the deadline exists. they want something done quickly. how they will get it done. the reality on the ground both the white house want to get on board. they have slim majorities in the house and senate. they can pass things on a partisan basis and while president biden made clear he's going to continue out reach to republican members of congress, things now look like democrats will move on their own to get the speed and the scale of the proposal they want in place.
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>> and what is vice president harris' role in this? >> if democrats move on their own, they will need everybody they got in the united states senate. if it's 50/50 split with vice president kamala harris to break the tie, they can't afford to lose a single democrat and that's why you saw the vice president doing local tv and newspaper interviews in the state of arizona and west virginia yesterday. west virginia home to joe mansion and arizona home to christian cinema. both moderate democrats and expressed wariness about the $1.9 million price tag. keep an eye on her work on what's kind of being referred to as the outside game, talking to outside groups to rally support, not just with the public but also with crucial groups that can be a voice to the public. they believe at the white house they can win the public battle about this bill particularly republicans are opposed the vice president will play a key role rallying support as they try to push that to move forward and
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get this through congress. >> phil mattingly, appreciate it. joining us is bernie sanders of vermont vocal with republicans in december putting larger stimulus checks into american pockets. thanks for being with us. the question of direct payments, dell cat and republican are lobbying the bind administration saying the current plan gives too much money to wealthy americans and the threshold should be lowered. vice president himself said he's open to that, are you? >> all that we're talking about here is trimming off some of the spillover money for wealthy people. right now small sums of money will go to family earning more than 150,000. i have no problem with doing away with that. bottom line, we got to get checks of $1400 on top of the $600 that we already allocated out to every working class family in this country and to their kids, as well.
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people are struggling to put food on the table, to avoid eviction, to go to the doctor. they need help now and we need the total $2,000 package. >> you've been vocal that covid relief has to happen fast and if that means passing the bill through reckon sillation, so be it. can you express why that should be an option? >> from a political point of view, the most important point is that it only requires a majority vote. the past significant legislation in the senate you need 60 votes and frankly, we do not have 60 votes from republicans to address the catastrophes that are impacting working families today. so the only way that we are going to deal effectively with the pandemic and get vaccines into the arms of people, increase vaccine production, the only way we're going to raise the minimum wage to a living
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wage so people are not working for starvation wages, the only way to open up our schools in a way that is safe, the only way that we're going to put people back to work in restaurants and protect small businesses, the only way we're going to do that is reconciliation and we expect that we will have a budget bill on the floor as soon as monday or tuesday. >> covid in areas where democrats may get republicans in some cases on board. if president biden, democrats do go at it alone without republican support, the counter argument it could burn bridges with republican colleagues. does that concern you or at this point injustify the means? >> let's not look at it quite that dramatically. the way you look at it is should the congress respond to the pain that tens of millions of families are hurting? should we be effective and aggressive in trying to crush
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this pandemic? should we make sure that our kids can get back to school? should we make sure that workers are earning a living wage? so the crisis we face are unprecedented. we have got to act and act decisively. now, this is the reconciliation one package. there will be another package coming along and it's possible that we can get more republicans for that one. that one will deal with more of the long term streuctural problems facing this country in terms of a crumbling infrastructure and in terms of transforming the energy system to deal with climate change. when we do that, we can create millions of good paying jobs. there may well be republicans that want to work with us on that. right now, this is an emergency bill. it's the pandemic. it's the economic crisis. it's the health crisis. we have got to act and act dee
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s -- decisively and as soon as possible. >> when republicans want money for military increases or whatever it might be, that hasn't been a problem for republicans but when democrats start talking about, you know, money for schools or in this case covid re leaf, all of a sudden, there is deficit concerns. is this another example of that? >> it absolutely is and hypocrisy is really quite extraordinary. you will remember it was just a few years ago when trump and my republican colleagues voted for almost $2 trillion in tax breaks for the wealthiest people in this country and the largest corporations. anderson, i didn't hear a lot of worry about the deficit then. we're talking about hundreds of billions of dollars going into all kinds of corporate welfare. we're talking about a military budget with a pentagon that has never been independently audited, massive amounts of waste and fraud within the
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pentagon but not a b problem. somehow or another, when it comes to feeding children who are hungry, when it comes to making sure that people who are sick in the middle of a pandemic get the health care they need, when it comes to reopening our schools in a safe way and spending the child tax credit to deal with child poverty in this country, when it comes to those things suddenly my republican colleagues become very fervent about the deficit. >> vice president harris was doing local television interviews, west virginia, arizona around the covid bill putting pressure on democrats, joe mansion. how confident are you that you have even enough votes within the democratic caucus to get the bill through? >> i'm very confident. at the end of the day you have 50 members of the democratic caucus and we all disagree on something. i have disagreements with this 1
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$ .9 trillion dollar covid bill. at the end of the day, i believe every democrat will go into his or her heart and understand in america today, this is so much offering and pain, there is so much fear about the pandemic that now is the time to act. we disagree on this issue and that. it doesn't matter. this is a life and death proposal and its must be passed immediately. we are in the majority now. barely. it's a 50/50 tie plus the vice president. we're in the majority. those candidates promised their constituents in georgia and became a national election. the president was there. chuck schumer was there. we said to the american people, you vote for us and we're going
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to start responding to the long over due crisis facing working families. yes, you're going to get $2,000 yourself and your kid. yes, you're going to get extended unemployment. yes, you're going to get the kinds of housing help you need so you don't get evicted. those are the promises that we made. and it would be unthinkable to me that any democrat wouldn't want to make good on those promises we made, not just to the people of georgia but people of america. >> i want to talk about security in the capitol after the insurrections. speaker pelosi said, the demons. are you worried about safety from within? >> look, we are seeing , you know, we saw it on that horrible day on the 6th with the rioting and the insurrection effort in the capitol and there was no question but that there are
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right wing extremists who are prepared to use violence. so i think we have got to do and i want to thank the capitol police and national guard and fbi and everybody else doid a great job they did during biden's inauguration. we have to be very, very vigilant and make it clear we can have different points of view and disagree with each other, that's called democracy but you do not have the right to threaten violence and certainly don't have the right to commit violence and i hope and expect that the congress and the biden administration will be very, very strong in making that clear. >> senator sanders, appreciate your time. thank you. >> thank you. there is new security camera video of the man authorities say is a suspect of the planting of the pipe bombs on capitol hill and disturbing video that came to light during the attack. details next,
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xfinity makes moving easy. go online to transfer your services in about a minute. get started today. it's been more than three weeks since the insurrection on capitol hill. "the washington post" obtained the security camera video of the
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man the fbi says is a suspect in the planting of the two pipe bombs walking the capitol hill neighborhood. cnn jessica schneider joins us with more on that investigation and video we showed you of the violence at the capitol. a body cam and warning, the images are potentially disturbing. >> reporter: chaos and violence captured on police body cam. video is exposing how police officers came under extreme attack. police moved forward with body shields trying to keep back rioters welding a stick, a hockey stick and even a crutch lunging at police. while the frenzy unfolds on the west side capitol steps, one man can be heard yelling out she's dead. he's talking about 34-year-old roseanne who was crushed by the mob and later pronounced dead at the hospital according to the "new york times." the madness doesn't subside.
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a rioter is seen repeatedly striking police, another kicking officers. eventually one rioter seems to rip an officer's baton away pulling at the officer. all the while, the rioters rejoice at all of the violence they're inflecting. this is the first time we're seeing the riot from a police officer's perspective and prosecutors are using it and other video to lay the groundwork for cases against the more than 160 people they have charged federally so far. but still a major mystery, who planted the two pipe bombs blocks away from the capitol near the republican and democratic national committee offices. "the washington post" obtaining surveillance video from an ally nearby believed to show the suspect on the way to plant the devices the night of january 5th. >> this was preplanned and intentional and deliberate. >> reporter: the fbi upped the reward for information on this suspect three times. it now stands at $100,000. the bombs were each eight inches long filled with an explosive powder and rigged to egg timers
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according to a law enforcement official. they were functional and didn't go off but they could have been diversion devices to take attention off the capitol as rioters were arriving. >> jessica schneider joins us, how difficult is the manhunt going to be for the fbi? >> reporter: very difficult. it's been more than three weeks now and the searching for this suspect. they need the public's help. they upped the reward to $100,000 and releasing details what the suspect was wearing in the video. a light gray sweatshirt and nike air max turf shoes. the problem you can see there is that suspect's face is completely obscured making any positive id of him difficult. >> jessica schneider, appreciate it. former president george w. bush is signaling support for the highest ranking republican
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to vote impeachment for trump. liz cheney is facing a coordinated effort by mr. trump and house allies to defeat her in the 2022 elections. mr. bush's office says the 43rd president will call dick cheney to wish him a happy 80th birthday and thank him for his daughter's service. concerns are growing on the hill about lawmakers sympathetic to extremist threats. some representatives are fearful for their colleagues and asking to use congressional funds for personal security. one name that keeps resurfacing is marjorie taylor greene of georgia. conspiracy theorists who chases down school shooting survivors or who has and facebook postings expressed support in 2018 and 2019 for executing prominent democrats before running for congress. the speaker took the step of removing corey bush's office away from greene's upon the
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request of the missouri democrat following a heated exchange this month where bush confronted greene about not wearing a mask. many democrats called for greene's removal from office. they offered no more. i'll turn to a capitol insider with concerns of his own, james mcel mcgovern. appreciate your time. you tweeted how the gop handled comments and views that surfaced about marjorie taylor greene and write quote this is sick, what the hell is wrong with you gop leader mccarthy and won't condemn extremists in your conference who advocated for the execution of a member of congress. what a disgrace, both of you should resign. why do you think mccarthy isn't doing anything about her? we had mike shields on last night who was saying that mccarthy spoke to her privately and she privately disavowed
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qanon. she hasn't seemed to do that publicly and all this other stuff. what is going on? >> look, i think kevin mccarthy and i say this with great sadness is a coward. he's afraid to take on people like marjorie taylor greene and the most extreme elements of his party, the people that buy into these crazy conspiracy theories, these qanon theories and i think he thinks that that's where the energy and the excitement in the republican party is right now. and it really is sad because the party of lincoln is the party of conspiracy theortheories. >> and now, i mean, marjorie taylor greene i think donated money to the republican cause, which apparently i assume gives her more influence. >> look, what she's said and the way she's ahabehaved is appalli. she's not alone in that. she's embraced conspiracy theories questioning the authenticity of the school
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shootings in sandy hook and parkland. i met with the parents of both the shootings and it was heartbreaking and to have someone like her question this terrible tragedy is offensive. it is sick. and, you know, she's embraced posts that have threatened my colleagues including the speaker of the house. she has dishonored her office and the institution and should resign and the republican leadership should urge her to resign. certainly, they shouldn't be putting her on the edge committee, a woman who stocks gun -- school shooting survivors should not be in the education committee. the bottom line is they're afraid to stand up. kevin mccarthy needs to grow a spine for the good of the republican party and good of the country. >> i mean, on that, there has been talk from your colleagues about trying to remove her from
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committee assignments as chair of the rules committee, can you walk us through how that might work and is it possible without kevin mccarthy on board? >> republicans pick republicans who they want in committees. we can break precedent and go around that. i said many times, people -- >> i'm afraid we lost the link there. apologize for that. looking what can be done without republican support to this congresswoman. we'll continue the conversation next with a story how the qanon conspiracy theory infiltrated other avenues of power on the local level. story of a majoyor outside a sml
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. a bizarre qanon conspiracy theory is not constraining into political figures. in one town outside seattle washington it the haymayor that
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supports these theories. the maryor himself had startlin and dumb founded thoughts. >> i want to welcome the mayor to the program. >> thank you, good morning. >> reporter: the small community of washington has a big question for the mayor. >> why do you publicly support qanon? >> reporter: question after question, qanon and the mayor are the talk of the town. >> mr. mayor, excuse me. we -- you owe it to the citizens. >> reporter: residents fear, squim population 7,000 may be the first to have a qanon constptir -- conspiraciests in power. >> you still believe it? >> i am not saying that i believe that. >> reporter: that is kqanon. allude chris conspiracy satin worshipping pedophiles are part of a deep state plotting against
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donald trump and operating a sex trafficking scheme. insurrections were seen wearing q symbols inside the capitol and in the crowd outside. most people think of qanon of something that is so far off the spectrum it will never come to their town. >> that's what we thought. >> reporter: i don't know, yeah. >> i mean, this has been shocking. >> reporter: yeah. it began last august. few in this quiet community two hours from seattle expected the mayor's monthly radio broadcast to include a message like this. >> qanon is a truth movement. it encourages you to think for yourself. i would encourage you to search for joe m on youtube and watch his videos starting with q, the plan to save the world. >> reporter: that ominous video. >> every president after reagan was a deep state criminal. >> reporter: full of absurd lies
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ends by promoting trump as the savior. the mayor has spread disinformation online. he shared this qanon rallying cry on his personal facebook page short for where we go one, we go all. posting that nearly 20 times in one month. >> go ahead and have these theories. it doesn't matter. don't let somebody with those theories get put in a position. >> i never said i believe that. i believe there are unfort unfortunately -- >> reporter: you called it a truth movement. >> what i call is the opportunity as a patriot and as an american citizen to seek truth. >> reporter: as far as that video he encouraged residents to watch, do you believe what the video suggeign suggestions. >> i'm not committing to that. there are resources to influence our thought pattern. again, i encourage people to z seek truth. >> reporter: he went again and again to his idea of truth. you won't categorize what qanon
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is in. >> i'm not in a position to do that. >> reporter: despite what we saw at the u.s. capitol. >> i watched different videos that showed many different what appeared to be scenarios versus what has continued to run. i have no way of confirming that is one group versus another. >> reporter: there is a difference between fact and fiction. >> again, back to the authenticity of the information that we're seeing. just because one angle of the camera showed this view, they may not have seen the other angle that shows a totally different scenario. >> reporter: i'm confused about, you don't think q was involved in what happened? >> i have no way of validating that. >> reporter: some say his words aren't enough. they are petitioning to replace him. this isn't just a conspiracy theory this is serious. >> and kyung law joins us. how is the mayor entertaining qanon and frankly, he's kind of playing coy with it but clearly, believes in this and is promoting this.
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how has it impacted the town beyond alarming people or has it? >> reporter: well, yeah, there is some vacancies, unusual vacancies on the city counsel and city manager suddenly left. there are some vacancies among the city counsel for a variety of different reasons they have puck publicly said they fear it may be connected to the mayor and what he's said about qanon, and the reason why this particular community anderson is so sensitive to it, this politically is a bellwether county. this is dating back to 1980, this county has picked the u.s. -- voted with the u.s. president who ultimately won. so this is a bellwether county, very moderate. extremes here are just really rare. >> kyung law, appreciate it. for perspective a new cnn contributor, kathleen author of "bring the war home." kathleen, thanks for being with
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us. you've done extensive research on qanon. does any of what you heard surprise you? >> i should clarify, actually, i think not anybody has done extensive research on qanon specifically, but what we're seeing is qanon is sort of a new version of something that's much older and much more familiar to people who studied the history of extremism. as long as we have had conspiracy theories about the endangerment of white women and children by wicked elites, we've seen these crop up over and over and over again in different parts of the militant right back to something like the elders of zion and 20th century if not before and it's cohaerent with things like white power movement and conspiracy theory in the 1980s and 1990s. we're seeing in someways, very new and different in the speed of radicalization and in
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someways, it is a through line that gives us a way to understand what we're looking at. >> it's so -- i mean, it's so fascinating, you know, this really is just this theory is a hodgepodge of every conspiracy as you say these go back, you know, ages. these are age-old conspiracy theories that are anti-semitic, there were a lot of anti-catholic tropes in the aurally part of the century in the united states. i mean going back to in the middle ages during the plague there were conspiracy theories that jews were responsible for poisoning the water with, you know, toads and lizards and things. >> yeah. and bringing up the plague is no accident. i think that the coronavirus is an enormous stressor, and it's a historical factor pushing people towards radicalization. so are things like economic
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instability, racial justice protests, masking laws. there are a whole bunch of factors moving people toward radical political action. so one big question we should have is qanon really set a lot of importance on january 6th as a date of action and on january 20th as afore told date of change. some people are feeling intense disappointment and are leaving the movement and trying to go through their own sort of de-radicalization process. but others are deepening their involvement in this idea, they are sort of available right now for recruitment by a group of people who has had a longer trajectory in our recent past, the white power movement. now that movement which has included klansman, neo-nazis, whites and others in recent years brings with it a whole different infrastructure that should be very alarming to people watching this including paramilitary training camps,
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military grade weapons and material and a set of strategies that we've only seen the beginning of. i think that january 6th is the beginning of a lot more disturbing and problematic events to come. >> you know, what's so kind of ridiculous about that mayor portraying qanon as though it's some sort of rational clear-eyed way of looking at things, that it's actually kind of stripping away the artifice and revealing the truth of what's really happening, it's so ludicrous when you look at the history of qanon, the promises that, you know, this shadowy figure posted about what would happen. pretty much every prediction that qanon has made about what's going to happen, hillary clinton was going to be arrested or there are these high level arrests going to be made of this cabal of elites who were drinking the blood of satan and attacking children. none of it happened, and yet they -- they just change the
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focus, and they just -- they come up with another explanation for why those things didn't happen. >> yes. and i think that it might be useful to think about how the extreme fringe here can tell us something about the political rifts that are present in even more mainstream forms of our politics. because i think that the version of january 6th told by qanon is, of course, very, very extreme. but it's not completely distinct from a version of that event that has been taken up in much more mainstream outlets that deposits it was not an insurrection, not a riot, not any of these things but actually was a patriotic action. i think it's telling that the gentleman in that story referred to himself as a patriot. now, that's a word that has really different meaning for people on different sides of our political spectrum, and it's one that's been taken up by other parts of white power activism
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over quite a long time. and i think it's telling that people are thinking about patriotism in 1776 and other ways that action at the capitol to some people was not conceptualized as an illegal action. now, i think it's really clear from a historical and legal standpoint that was an insurrection, that it's part of what many people in this movement have been trying to wage as a race war for decades now, and that it was an anti-government moment. but that rift is sitting at the heart of our political discourse, and i think it will continue to cause problems until we confront it. >> it also -- what's interesting about qanon is that they use this fig leaf of protecting children as kind of a smoke screen and a way kind of an entry, a reach out to a lot of people probably on the face of it wouldn't have said, oh, yeah, i'm going to get involved in an organization or belief system which claims there are lizard people who are posing as human beings drinking the blood of
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children, worshipping satan, et cetera, et cetera. but the end point is of course i care about children being sex trafficked which is legitimate problem globally, and there are legitimate organizations working on that. that's an entry point that a lot of people would want to get involved with. >> absolutely. i think that processes of radicalization and how people get pulled into this movement is of the utmost pressing concern to all of us. >> kathleen blue, i really appreciate your time, and i'm so happy we're going to see more of you on cnn. a quick programming note. tomorrow night at 9:00 p.m. eastern we've got a special report. inside the qanon conspiracy. it explores the origins of this truly bizarre theory and how it became a movement that includes now members of congress. again, that's tomorrow night 9:00 p.m. eastern. we've been working on that. i hope you like it. up next more on the johnson & johnson vaccine. a former medical advisor to president biden and the director
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good evening. chris is off tonight. in our second hour of 360 the faces of the capitol insurrection and how many of them belong to ex-service members. new up close video. first though the uncertain moment we're all now in when it comes to covid. today johnson & johnson said it would apply next week for emergency use authorization for its one shot vaccine. also released phase three study data showing it'd be 66% effective in preventing moderate and severe disease and was 85% effective at preventing hospitalization and death. >> i want to point out that this