tv CNN Newsroom with Alisyn Camerota and Victor Blackwell CNN April 20, 2021 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT
distri deliberation. in chicago, philadelphia, d.c., businesses are already boarded up and the army has approved the call up of 250 guardsmen in d.c. as well. >> and we now know more about that phone call between president biden and the family of george floyd. here's what biden said this afternoon. >> i've come to know george's family. not just in passing. i've spent time with them, spent time with his little daughter. you should see this beautiful child. i can only imagine the pressure and anxiety they're feeling, and so i waited until the jury was sequestered and i called. they're a good family and they're calling for peace and tranquility, no matter what verdict is. i'm praying the verdict is the right verdict, which i think it's overwhelming, in my view.
i wouldn't say that unless the jury was sequestered now. >> joining us now, cnn legal analyst, areva and elie hoenig. elie, the jury has been deliberating in its 11th hour. from your time in a courtroom, can you gather anything from that? >> still too early. i've seen juries come back in a matter of hours and sometimes a couple of weeks. yes, it can happen that way. we haven't seen any notes. sometimes you get questions from the jury around this point but they're silent. there's not much we can read into it. they have to deal with the comments -- they don't know about it, but the president has made these comments. one thing that's important to keep in mind, we have to trust the jury to oe bide by their oaths. they have promised to judge this case by the evidence they hear in the court and nothing else. if they heard something else,
they will raise it with the judge and it will be dealt with at that point. at this point we have to trust the jury and plow ahead with its job. >> the president criticized congressman waters for her comments, saying potentially she gave the defense something on appeal. what's the threshold for that? would the defense have to put jurors on the stand to testify that they heard what the congresswoman said and if that was some influence there? how would that happen if that, indeed s where this leads? >> i think the judge's statement -- i was a little annoyed by the judge being annoyed, frankly. congresswoman maxine waters is a congresswoman from los angeles, california. she has a long history of being an outspoken advocate on civil rights justice issues. she's been at marches whether it's trayvon martin or freddie gray in baltimore. she's been on the front line raising these issues about the social justice issues.
the lawyer brought up this issue of the comments she brought up at a march in minneapolis. he brought it up about some fictional shows where this trial was being mentioned. he didn't provide any evidence to the judge that, one, the jury even heard what maxine waters had to say or it had any influence on them. he could have asked the judge to poll the jurors if he thought it was a serious enough issue if they heard the statements and if it had any influence on them. he didn't do that. i'm not serious how i'm taking his comments about maxine waters. again, the judge calling her out by name, i think, is somewhat problematic. we are in one of the most tense periods in our country where people are in the streets, and literally have been there for months, fighting for a more just and equitable criminal justice system. maxine waters and thousands of others have been opining, including now the president, on the outcome of this case. and this judge knew that this was the climate he finds himself in and these kind of statements
would be made. >> i'm so glad you brought that up, areva, because i have a philosophical question for you about this moment in time. we are living in a time that is the most divided in decades. and there are all sorts of media figures and cable news stragss -- cable stations, i should say, that make being contrarian a sport. do you think it is still possible for 12 people from different backgrounds in a room to ever reach the same decision at this moment in time, given how divided we are? i mean, do you think the landscape has changed the jury process in that way? >> i do still have faith in the jury process, alisyn. maybe i'm old fashioned and i grew up in this system, but i do have faith that the jurors can do what they were sworn to do. the first job of the juror is to render impartial justice. they are carefully vetted and questioned for that. lawyers on both sides have the right to remove people they don't think this can that. i have faith this jury can do
that. there are also procedures in place. the judge instructed the jury and it's refreshing to hear this. you don't hear this in too many areas of our world. you are to keep an open mind, work together, work collaboratively. there are a lot of factors pushing the jury toward a verdict. the level of interest and engagement in this trial we've seen across the country is a remarkable thing. and i'm grateful that thus far we have had a clean trial. we haven't had crazy his treeonics. i think the criminal justice system itself has made a good showing and i do have faith the jury will come through and do its job. >> areva, let me ask you about a moment of correction or clarification, at least, after the closing arguments from the defense. the defense made the case that the state was trying to convince j jurors that the heart disease, the presence of fentanyl had no role in george floyd's death. that's not the threshold, that's not the burden of the state.
it's to suggest the knee on the neck, the subdual was the substantial causal factor. in rebuttal, the state corrected that. the judge corrected that. do you think that carries any weight with this jury that they were misled or there was some misrepresentation from the defense? so. >> oh, absolutely, victor. what you have as a lawyer when you're trying a case, you have your credibility and credibility is everything. the last thing you want to be is -- last place you want to find yourself is being adm admonished by the judge or having the judge have to come behind one of the attorneys and correct something you've said. that lawyer, the defense lawyer in this case, clearly misstated the law as it relates to causation. and you stated it correctedly, victor. all the prosecution has to do is prove that derek chauvin's conduct, his restraint, his knee on the neck for 9:29 was the substantial cause, not the sole cause. they don't have to establish there were other contributing factors but the jurors were
correctly given the law by the judge and it was corrected by the prosecution in rebuttal that if they find that conduct was a substantial charge, then they can reach a verdict on the serious charge of murder as well as the manslaughter charge. i think the lawyer -- the defense attorney, eric nelson, lost some credibility and may pay a price for that during deliberation. >> can you peel back the curtain and explain what's happening in the 11th hour of deliberations. are they trying to figure out if derek chauvin was the cause of floyd fwg's death or are they just meiered in the minutia. after 11 hours with no questions, as we know, to the judge, what are they debating and deliberating? >> alisyn, i think there's two big issues that are at play here. first of all, excessive force. was the amount of force that derek chauvin used against george floyd reasonable within police training, within police policy? i think the evidence at the trial in my opinion was
overwhelming and clear it was excessive force. we had all those compelling witnesses for the prosecution on down. and we had one, brodd that gave unreasonable testimony that when someone is prone, can you restrain them however you want. i think the jury will reject that. and then there's medical causation. this is more complicated. this is scientific. there was an imbalance. there was more evidence, substantially more evidence for the prosecution than the defense and areva correctly stated the legal standard. the jury has to find there was some substantial cause. they have to work through science here. these are lay people. that's what juries are. they are normal human beings like all of us. i think they're probably going to be spending a lot of time on that causation issue. >> okay. elie, areva, thank you for standing by. obviously we'll bring the viewers as soon as we get any indication of what's going on in that deliberation room. thank you both. let's take a closer look at what is going on now in minneapolis.
leslie redmond, former president of the city's naacp and a founder of group called don't complain, activate. great to have you here. thanks so much. give us a sense of what's happening on the streets right now. i know you're no stranger to protests. you've been doing it for years. what does it feel like there? >> you know, this is something different than i've ever experienced before. i actually just went into a grocery store a little while ago and someone stopped me and said, aren't you at the minneapolis naacp? i said, yes. they said, why are all of these military vans and individuals taking over our community? just to the left of me are several military trucks. it's just unfortunate, it's unnecessary. and if we just use the same energy to protect people as we are property, we wouldn't be in this situation right now. >> you founded the group, as alisyn said, don't complain,
activate. what are you suggesting people do with this energy? >> 100% i think that, you know, and this is not just for black people, right? i always tell people, we are the human race. so, i'm encouraging everyone to get activated. recognizing that justice in this case does not only look like chauvin being convicted, but it looks like black people's human dignity being respected and our humanity being valued. i'm urging each and every person to do what they can do. whether it's calling up your councilmember or your mayor or your senator, whether it's going to a local school board meeting and making sure people are being educated about black history because that is american history. no matter what it is, going to a protest, speaking out against injustice when you hear, you know, condemn it and hoping to dismantle white supremacy in whatever way you can. whether you're a mom, dad, artist, entrepreneur, we can all
do something. >> what did you think of congresswoman maxine waters' suggestion that people get more confrontational? let me play it for you and our viewers. >> we have to stay on the street and we've got to get more active. we've got to get more confrontational. we've got to make sure that they know that we mean business. >> what did you think of those comments? >> so, you know, putting something in the context, i've been a protester, i am a pr protester. i've been on the ground. it's a very traumatizing experience from the tear gas to the rubber bullet. someone's whole eye got taken out. i think she's telling people to stay on the street. as a lawyer you're a social engineer -- i believe that congresswoman waters was telling people to be social engineers and to continue to activate, right, and to not go home, not
to make the system comfortable because as i call minnesota, it's been a white waconda for too long. if you go in a house, you're silent, you're unxyou don't mak them uncomfortable. we'll continue to see this. daunte wright was just murdered by the brooklyn center police officers while we're in the middle of chauvin's trial. >> you make such a good point that justice does not look for many people's perspective like just the conviction of derek chauvin. a conviction does not put a big red bow on the problem of systematic racism and injustice. so, to that point we talk a lot, it's a network of news, we talk all day. what is the conversation that we are not having, that we should be? >> oh, that's so deep. you know, chauvin, who is a serial murderer, just so we're clear. he's murdered numerous people in
minneapolis. you know, he's a part of a bigger system. when he is held accountable, he'll be the first white male officer held accountable for murdering a black person in the state of minnesota. >> what do you mean -- sorry to interrupt, but what -- calling him a serial murderer, what do you mean by that? >> i mean that several people's lives have been taken by chauvin. that he kneeled a young black man's neck and killed him as well. if you look into his track record, which is something that's been brought up numerous times by communities united against police brutality, they have the data, they have the statistics of the other people who are victim to chauvin. >> i don't know about that. i know that he has had complaints against him, but i don't know the -- those details. >> no, but, well, it's true. i really encourage you to go fact check it and look it up. i will also encourage you to look into the fact that over -- i'm sorry, i'm getting disconnected.
over 400 people have, you know, lost their lives at the hands of police in the state of minnesota and only one of them -- >> yeah. >> one man is being held accountable. >> leslie, we have not confirmed those details. you suggest we check them. we certainly will. thank you for the work you're doing on the ground. letly redmond for us. thank you so much. >> thank you. next, washington's chief medical examiner now says the officer who died one day after the capitol riots had a series of strokes. what we know about his ruling that his death was from natural causes. top medical adviser says johnson & johnson's vaccine is safe enough to distribute as we still wait a decision from the cdc in the u.s. about whether americans can get it again. at . we didn't stop at storage or cloud. we kept going. working with our customers to enable the kind of technology that can guide an astronaut back to safety. and help make a hospital come to you,
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the death of capitol police officer brian sicknick. washington, d.c.'s chief medical examiner determined sicknick suffered strokes and died of natural causes but he added violence at the hands of the mob during the insurrection did play a role in sicknick's condition. rioters attacked the officer with bear spray and he died the next day. two men are charged with that assault. jessica snyder joins us now. do they think his death was connected to the riot or not? >> well, the medical examiner saying this was a natural cause of death, he suffered strokes.
it assures, pretty much, the justice department will not be able to pursue homicide charges in connection with officer sicknick's death. because after three months we have this finding announcing sicknick's cause of death was natural, specifically he suffered two strokes. this is really significant because over the past 100-plus days since january 6th there's been a lot of speculation about how officer sicknick died. capitol police first announced he died to injuries on duty that day. then officials said they were pursuing a federal murder investigation. then we saw in february the investigation stalled because the exact cause of sicknick's death was undetermined up until yesterday. in the meantime, two men have been charged with assaulting officer sicknick and two other officers with chemical spray. there was that lingering question whether the chemical spray could have been the cause of sicknick's death. but the medical examiner saying there's no evidence that sicknick had an allergic reaction to the chemical spray,
in an interview he did with "the washington post." the m.e. also said that all tra transpired on january 6th it play a role. that leads to looming questions. it's unclear if officer sicknick had pre-existing conditions or what may have caused the strokes that happened the day after the capitol attack. we know that officer sicknick collapsed in an office the night of january 6th. he died at the hospital on january 7th. but now at least one of the medical mysteries has been answered. officer sicknick's death was from natural causes, two strokes, and not directly because of the actions of any of the people who stormed the capitol. capitol police have responded to this and they're now saying they accept the findings, but they do, alisyn and victor, still consider sicknick's death in the line of duty.
even though the medical examiner saying it was the result of strokes. >> still so many questions. jessica schneider for us in washington, thank you. nearly 50 colleges and universities are now requiring students to get covid vaccines before they can come back to school in the fall. it's a growing trend as the country tries to figure out how to get back to a new normal. more than half americans visited friends or family in the last week as more and more people are getting vaccinated. 48% reported going out to a restaurant. cnn's alexander field is tracking where the vaccine rollout stands now. >> reporter: the country on the cusp of another milestone about to 200 million shots since president joe biden took office, ahead of his goal for his first 100 days. a total of 211 million vaccines given, but the reality is this -- >> on the one hand, more people in the united states are being vaccinated every single day at
an accelerated pace. on the other hand, cases and hospitalizations are increasing in some areas of the country. >> reporter: nationwide, new daily cases are up on average 23% from a month ago. hospitalizations up 10% in the same time. even as more vaccination sites open. on friday new york city's iconic museum of natural history joins the list. and even as the average number of shots going into arms tops 3 million daily. >> vaccines are safe. they do save lives. and the only way that we're going to get through this pandemic together is if we effectively distribute as many vaccines as we can, as quickly as possible. >> reporter: a coalition of 60 hospitals now banding together to promote vaccines, part of an all out effort to target half of u.s. adults who still haven't gotten a shot. a new axios/ipsos survey says 1 in 5 americans still don't plan
to get the shot. meaning confidence hasn't grown since january. it also suggests the uz to pause johnson & johnson's one vaccine hasn't eroded confidence further. >> i think it was a very smart decision by the cdc, by the fda to put a pause on the administration of the j&j vaccine. >> reporter: 88% of americans, according to the same survey, tend to agree. new guidance on how or whether to resume use of the j&j shot could come later this week. it was halted following reports of rare and severe blood clots of 6 out of the 7 million people given the vaccine. >> taking a pause, they can get doctors know what to look for, how to approach that and hopefully maintain confidence in the whole vaccine system. >> reporter: even if the delay hasn't increased hesitancy, it could slow down delivery. production of the vaccine at a baltimore plant now paused by the fda. and, while we wait for that new
guidance on the j&j vaccine here in the united states, the company has announced that it's resuming its shipments of shots to europe, after european regulators weighed in saying, they found a possible link between the vaccine and the very rare blood clot. they believe a warning should be added to the product information, but they are stressing they feel the benefits of the vaccine still outweigh the risks. >> thank you very much for that update. so, president biden has ordered flags to be flown at half-staff for former vice president walter fritz mondale. he served as vice president under president jimmy carter before waging his own unsuccessful white house bid. biden called him a dear friend and mentor. mondale was 93 years old. so, as the jury deliberates in one of the most high-profile
cases of the decade, some governors are using this to crack down on protesters. other states have pushed through major police reforms. we discuss all that next. as you. that's great, carl. but we need something better. that's easily adjustable has no penalties or advisory fee. and we can monitor to see that we're on track. like schwab intelligent income. schwab! introducing schwab intelligent income. a simple, modern way to pay yourself from your portfolio. oh, that's cool... i mean, we don't have that. schwab. a modern approach to wealth management.
breaking news. there is now a verdict in the trial of derek chauvin in the killing of george floyd. we learned that -- question will learn the verdict to these three accounts between 4:30 and 5:00 eastern time. >> victor, as you know, we had just been talking about how it had been 11 hours they had been deliberating. they started last night from 5 closs to 9:00 and picked it up this morning at 10:00. we were talking to their legal
experts about what this time meant. there are three charges they were deliberating on. second-degree, unintentional murder, third-degree murder, second-degree manslaughter. we just learned at 4:30 eastern time we will be learning what the jury's verdict is. >> we have areva martin back with us. no wonder they didn't take a break for lunch. we didn't hear much from them because they were trying to close out the work of the day. your reaction to now knowing at 11 hours in, they've reached a verdict? >> yeah, i think i sent your producer some high profile cases and how long it takes a jury to reach a verdict. jason van dyke, former police officer in chicago who was charged with second-degree murder and multiple aggravated assault charges in the murder of an african-american teenager. that jury took eight hours and they came back with guilty verdicts on both the murder
charges and the aggravated assault. so, when you look at a high-profile case and say, is this the record? probably not. this case is so unusual on so many fronts. you have all of that video evidence that was presented. how unusual is that, that the whole incident from the start of mr. floyd in cup foods until he's taken away by ambulance was caught on videotape. you have a police chief and an army of literally of police officers from that police department testifying against that officer. also, when you look at, you know, the evidence that was presented, the overwhelming evidence presented by the prosecution, and i shouldn't -- i'd be remiss without mentioning, you have a diverse jury. you have four african-americans and two individuals that consider themselves mixed race. some circumstances that are not typically seen in these cases. >> areva, just so we understand, is it your feeling -- andanswer that because 12 people have now decided and we'll be hearing their verdict at 4:30 eastern
time, it's been 11 hours, is it your hunch that that means what, what verdict? >> yeah, obviously, no crystal ball, not in the deliberation rooms and not in the business of predicting what people do that i don't have eyewitness to myself, but my experience tells me that we could be looking at a guilty verdict. at least if not all the charges, at least on some of these charges because when you think about the three charges and what it would take to acquit, if that was going to be the decision by this jury, i would have expected more time involved in their deliberations. >> areva martin, stand by for us. let's go to the courthouse. sara sidner is there. sara, you broke the news of this verdict now being reached. what do you know? >> reporter: so, a verdict has been reached. it is the thing that everyone be has been waiting for here in minneapolis and, frankly, for
around the world. i can have -- i can larry myself talking so if we could fix that, it would be great. there are a lot of folks that now know this information. the court has just released the information out to the media and the media is now going to report that to the public. so, everyone in this town and around america and the world will know that a verdict has been reached. the court has now said between 3:30 and 4:30 we'll hear the verdict out of the words of the foreperson in this jury. we are expecting to hear whether or not -- we now know it is not going to be a hung jury. this jury has made a decision. we know that it has taken -- they were four hours they deliberated yesterday. i have to do the math right now because i think they started at 8:00 a.m. local time. so that's five more hours. we're talking about nine hours they have been deliberating before they came to the court -- or told the court that they had
reached a verdict in this case. this is a case, while in the court, it was a case just -- and the judge made this clear, just about the former officer, derek chauvin, and whether or not his actions were second-degree manslaughter, whether or not his actions were second-degree murder or third-degree murder. he made very clear to the jurors that this was not about what was happening in the world. it was not about anything but the facts of this case. but outside of the court, it is a seminole case for many people, whether you are african-american, whether you are a police officer, whether you're black or white, latino. doesn't really matter what your background is. this, everyone realizes, is a big case in this country. it could mean something to a lot of people. a seminole case, if you will. and so the nerves that exist here, there is concern, there is fear, there is anger, there is sorrow. all of the things that you can feel as a human being, we're
feeling right now in spades here in minneapolis, as we understand a jury has decided in this case, and we will hear their decision in the next hour or so. >> sara, you are just breaking the news for us about this, that a verdict has been reached in the derek chauvin murder trial. in less than an hour, we will find out, 4:30 east coast time, we will find out what that verdict is. what is minneapolis preparing? what are they doing during this hour? what is happening? >> reporter: look, there are two groups preparing. one, you have the group of people like the government and businesses who have boarded up, who have put troops on the ground, literally, who have brought in extra police on the ground, who are concerned about whatever the reaction is going to be to the verdict. and then you have the citizens and you have the floyds and you have those who have been protesting, not for days but nearly a year. and the folks that have kept
memorial going in george floyd square. that is where you -- we are unsure of exactly how they have prepared themselves because it will be an emotional reaction. it will be difficult. i called someone down at the square and asked them what they thought of the fact that a jury has made a decision, that this will not be a hung jury. the first word out of this person's mouth was, i'm scared. i don't know what they decided. i am concerned. i don't know what to think. my stomach just dropped. so, i think that reflects what a lot of people are feeling. no one is going to feel that more acutely than the floyd family. philonise floyd is here, his brother terrence floyd is here, rodney floyd. you have a lot of the floyd family members who are here. they have been waiting for this day. they have been begging and asking for justice. they are hoping that the jury has come back with a guilty
verdict. but this is a jury that has its own mind. there are 12 people that have gone through a lot of evidence, have sat for many weeks now, who have been looking at every single possible detail in this case that was brought before the court from the 45 witnesses they heard, 38 of them the prosecution, 7 from the defense. everything from family members like philonise who got on the stand and talked about how much his brother meant to him and the family to us oof force experts and medical experts, many medical experts and use of force experts who took the stand as well. and then you have the witnesses, those people on the ground the day it happened. they are all feeling something extremely strongly right now. we actually -- we were able to talk to one of those witnesses, and he told us that no matter what happens, he believes justice will be served in some way, shape or form.
he said he would not be surprised if this jury came back and said not guilty. i asked him why. and he said, donald williams, who was on the stand, who was there that day when george floyd took his last breath, he said, you know, it's what we have come to expect as black people from this country's justice system. and so said he is trying to take care of his own heart, his own family, as this happens, but this is a huge moment, a huge moment for america, it's a huge moment for black folks. it's a big moment for police and policing in this country. there's no other way to say it. and the emotions couldn't be higher. the feeling here couldn't be stronger. can i just take this call. it's philonise floyd. give me one minute. >> yes. let's bring in areva martin. i want to pick up on that point that sara just made because you and i have discussed here many times that the charging of a law
enforcement official is care. the conviction of a law enforcement official is even more rare. and when you consider the context in which this verdict comes, after what we watched, the killing of george floyd, that video, and then what the conversation became globally. not just here in the u.s., about systematic racism and discrimination. your expectations of the consequences, the ramifications of what we're going to hear in about an hour? >> yeah, victor, you're so right. we've been having this conversation not just this year but this year about policing in this country and what it means to be an african-american who faces a fear. we hear african-american men in particular and even women talking about the fear that they experience doing everyday things, driving a car, going to the grocery store, being in a park, barbecuing with their family and friends. now we have a case that was witnessed, where the assault on
george floyd was witnessed by millions and millions of people. and there were moments during this trial where people felt it was more, quote/unquote, of the same. it would be very difficult to get a conviction of derek chauvin. i actually heard the district attorney from baltimore who prosecuted the officers in the freddie gray case talk about for her, she was on excited to see the chief of police testify in this case because in the case against the officers who were charged for killing freddie gray, the training officers for that police department actually testified on behalf of the defense, not the prosecution. what a big step it was in terms of having this blue line of silence being broken by this case. so, this case represents so much, i think, in the struggle for civil rights and in the struggle to address the inequities in our criminal justice system. we have not seen a case like this where you have a chief of police come forward, where you
have a training officer come forward, where you have so many police officers say this conduct was wrong, that this conduct was illegal and that this officer should be held accountable. >> areva, i want to dive into what we might hear when the jury comes into the courtroom in terms of their verdict. it's so interesting, victor and i have been on here for an hour and a half and it felt like the deliberations were just going slowly, molasses, and then suddenly. here are the possibility. second-degree unintentional murder carries a 40-year sentence. third-degree murder carries a 25-year sentence. second-degree manslaughter carries a 10-year sentence. so, what can the jury do? i mean, can there be a combination of these things we hear in less than an hour? >> absolutely, alisyn. they have to give us a verdict on each of those counts. and the judge will ask him --
one of the things we'll learn, who is the foreperson of the jury. when i was on earlier, we were talking to the jury expert about the nurse on this jury who has a lot of medical background and experience with cases involving, you know, people who lose oxygen, people who have cardiac issues. one question is, did she become the foreperson? so, we heard some profiles of the different jurors, so we'll learn, who did they select in the jurors themselves make the decision themselves about who that foreperson will be. as the ask asks that foreperson to read the verdict out loud, put it on the record, you know, the record in this case means in open court. >> we want to bring back sara sidner who just got off the phone with philonise floyd, george floyd's brother. tell us about that conversation. >> reporter: he didn't know. he didn't know that there was a
verdict. i told him there was a verdict. philonise floyd took a deep breath. he said, i think i know what they have decided. i asked him what they thought he decided and i'm not going to say it on the jury because i need the jury and i need this to be very clear that this is the jury's decision. whatever the jury says is what is going to stand. so, i won't share that part of the conversation. i will share this, he said for the rest of the country, this will be an historic decision in this case. but for the family, this is a personal, a personal issue. an issue that is deeply, deeply, deeply personal for every single member of the floyd family. and he said, for us, this is our heart that is being, you know, affected in ways that no one can imagine. but for the rest of the country, he does believe this case is a seminole case, it is an historic
case, no matter what happens with this jury, that it will be historic. he also said something else about the fact that this case even came into the court, was even charged in the first place. he said, this is what should be happening and should have been happening in cases like theirs, with other situations between police and particularly police and african-americans in this country. he said, you know, in his mind, when the police do something incorrect, when the police take a life, when they -- it is not self-defense, when their lives were not at stake, in his mind, then they should be treated like everyone else in this country, every other citizen. so, that is the sentiment from philonise floyd, george floyd's brother. he was unaware that a verdict had been reached. i told him that a verdict had been reached. and he reacted with calm. he said -- he was telling me, it's going to be all right. i mean -- >> yeah, he's an incredible
person. i totally agree. having gotten -- as we've gotten to know him since this, you know, this tragedy happened to his family in may, he is an incredible man. >> forced into a position no one should be in. we'll bring in laura coates and elie honig. laura, the idea this is now happening, it's about to happen. we're going to hear from the jury. it's been 11 hours. what do you make of it? >> this to me is way too short of a time. you can never make full predictions but the idea of grappling with a holdout, the idea of someone going through the nuances and having to be convinced, it's a short amount of time for full consideration of all the elements and there to be a holdout on one of the charges. what i mean by that, of course,
i think there play have been consensus on all three charges. we haven't seen one single jury note, not indicating in any way, shape or form that there was any confusion about the language in these charges, confusion about what it mebts to have a depraved heart, confusion about culpably negative, not confused about a nonintentional murder charge where you still have to have the intent to commit the act and not the intent to kill. this was a complicated, nuanced set of laws here and the jury within 11 hours was able to reconcile each of it, process the information and they must come back unanimous on every single charge for them to have this quick resolution. >> elie? >> first thing's first, juries are inherently unpredictable. anyone who tries to predict what a jury is going to do ahead of time is setting themselves up for failure. the conventional wisdom is a convict verdict like this, a clean verdict, we didn't get a
single note s generally seen as a good thing for the prosecution. that's the rule of thumb. rules of thumb are meant to be broken. that's conventional thinking in prosecutors' offices. the one thing we know for certain is this. there is not a hung jury. one of the fears any prosecutor ever has is one juror can hang a jury. we now know if this is a verdict on all three counts, and that's what it sounds like from the official word from the minnesota courts, if it's a verdict on all three counts, it's not a hung jury. if i'm the prosecutor, that's a big sigh of relief. >> we are joined by commissioner charles ramsey. you've been with us every day of this, the whole trial, every hour of every day. what are your thoughts as we await word now from the jury on their verdict? >> well, listen, if it is a conviction, you'll hear a collective sigh of relief from police chiefs and sheriffs across the country. i have spoken to a lot of them
and believe me, everyone is holding their breath on this one because you know what would happen should there be an acquittal or even if there's, you know, one out of the three counts a conviction. but the police have to be vigilant all night because regardless of what the outcome is, they're going to have to be vigilant because you've seen even celebrations turn bad. and so they're going to have to be out there and be alert. but there's going to be a sigh of relief if this is a conviction, no question about it. >> again, we are expecting that verdict will be read between 4:30 and 5:30 eastern, so that window opens in about 45 minutes from now. laura, what's happening over the next 45 minutes as we prepare to hear the jury's decision? >> remember, the jurors were not deliberating on site or on location. we were told they were staying at a hotel. they were being sequestered. there's a transportation factor. we know if there is a note handed over to the judge, they could do this by zoom where
defense, derek chauvin and the prosecution team won't have to compile and come to the courthouse, which is normally what's done in every trial. have you to be there to hear the jury note read by the judge and reconcile here. here you're gathering the different parties together. you're ensuring people have access to the court who should be there and providing for security. as you've seen across this nation. this is, again, not because they know the outcome of the verdict, but because they are anticipating a wide spectrum of responses depending upon the verdict. considering what the security measures will have to be for the judge, the attorneys, the defendant, if he is acquitted, he will be able to be free, which means he would be able to leave the courthouse. if he is convicted, he could be what's called step back, which means he is taken into custody yet again. he's been on release the duration of this summer and the fall and the winter. and, of course, the security of the jurors who up until now, of course, their identity has not been known by people and that's a good thing for the sanctity of juries in america. right now, all the different
logistics are happening right now. >> and elie, i know that it is a fool's errand to try to predict the timing of a jury, but i think you were thinking it wouldn't be this fast. >> correct, alisyn. i said in our prior segment earlier of the show, i said, i have faith in the jury. i said, i believe they will get to a verdict. i don't think they're going to hang. there's a lot of processes in place that push a jury towards reaching a consensus. it's hard to get 12 human beings to agree on anything. viewers might rightly wonder, in a case that was this hard-fought, that's this controversial, how can they ever get to a is consensus? the judge gave the instructions to the jury yesterday. you are to work together, keep an open mind, consider all viewpoints and it's your job, if humanly possible, to reach a verdict. in is quick. this is quicker than i expected. like i said, the general thinking, you cannot preach dikt a jury, but the general thinking is that's a good thing for the prosecution. again, if you're the prosecutor, you know this jury has not hung.
that is a huge piece of good news if you're the prosecutor here. >> chief, we spoke with sara before we learned that there was a verdict that had come in. she told us about some of the preps there in minneapolis. we showed some of the boarded up if you're chief again back in d.c., the metropolitan police department or commissioner in philadelphia, what are you doing for the next 45 minutes to an hour? >> mobilizing all my civil disturbance platoons, making sure that they are deployed properly in different parts of the city. unfortunately, because of past incidents you kind of know the points or the places where you really need to pay attention, and so right now they are making sure everybody is there. they are already on 12-hour shifts. days off have been cancelled, so now you're just mobilizing and making sure that people are in the right place whenever this verdict is read and we can deal with whatever comes up. >> commissioner, just to follow up on what you told us a few minutes ago. when you said that there's a
collective sigh of relief from police chiefs around the country, you've spoken to many of them. you don't -- i assume that you mean because there -- >> because of a conviction. >> if there's a conviction and because that means to you that there would be less rioting. >> well, i mean, listen, that's a part of it, but it's just the right thing. i mean, what derek chauvin did was so far out of training, out of policy. i mean, he brought discredit upon an entire profession, everybody, in this profession were impacted by this, and that's why if there is a conviction, people will be relieved, and not just chiefs. i'm talking about the men and women out there every day trying to do the job properly, engaged in constitutional policing. now, i realize we've got some people that don't do that, but this sends a strong message that that kind of activity, that kind of behavior just will not be tolerated, and thank god it won't be because we need to make
sure that we can put in place the kind of changes that need to be put in place for policing in order to survive in the 21st century. status quo cannot continue. >> control room, can i go back to sara sidner. is she standing by? sara, let me come back to you. philonise floyd has been in that courtroom. you would know that, i don't, many days if not every day. i expect he'll be back there for the reading of the verdict. is that correct? >> reporter: i do not know the answer to that because he didn't know that the verdict had come forward. i do think that at least one member of the family from the floyd family and from chauvin's family or someone who -- there are two seats there, so they have got one set aside for anyone that chauvin would want in the rom and one seat set aside for anyone from the floyd family who wants to be in the room. you know, i have to admit that it jarred mow a little that he hadn't heard yet, and i do
realize that we got some of this information literally ten minutes before the court put the information out. i heard it from, you know, a couple of federal employees and a couple of local officials as well, and so to have spoken with him and to have heard him take that sigh and then tell me it was going to be all right and then to have heard him say that he -- he believes he knows what the -- what the jury has decided. he trusts that the jury has in his words put it, you know, done the right thing in his words, and he has faith. he also talked very much about the fact that he knows that this is an historic moment, and he feels very strongly a deep personal pain, but he believes that he is going to see justice. >> sara, stand by for us if you would. we really appreciate you breaking the news for us here that the verdict is in and the jury is getting ready to read it. let's go to omar jimenez when is
on the street. he's been reporting there as well. omar, what are you seeing and feeling on the street there? >> alisyn, we're at ground zero for what happened to george floyd. this, of course, behind us is the intersection now known as george floyd square since this happened last may. as we've been talking to people throughout here, there has been a combination of moments. some tenseness and some nervousness and some even fearful of what the verdict might bring, but at the end of the day one woman we spoke to said that no matter what happens, they are still going to be in the streets. they are still going to remain in solidarity with each other because they believe that this moment is not just about george floyd. it was sparked by him, but it means so much more, and it has the potential to send reverberations for generations to come. when you look at many so of the messages and the faces that are here at george floyd square, of course, pinned down in the middle by the fists raised in
the air, orlando castillo, aashwari, breonna taylor and tamir rice, people who have come and visited over the course of the day feels that the verdict comes on the shoulder of these black bodies that are now no longer here with us, and, of course, george floyd's as the most recent one as part of that, at least the most relevant one for his final resting place in many ways. some of his last breaths were taken just across this intersection here, and so this moment means so much to the people here, and we can only imagine that once that comes down, no matter what it is, people are going to be in the streets either in solidarity or in ander because as one activist put it the to me earlier, when you keep getting pushed and you keep getting pushed, eventually you push back. they are hoping that at least for just a little bit they don't have to push anymore. >> omar jimenez for us there, 38th and chicago. thank you so much. listen, some of the faces that he showed didn't get verdicts because there were no charges.
>> yeah. >> let's go to van jones now. van, the special prosecutor said that this is about what derek chauvin did, not who he is, but for so many in this country the verdict here correlates to a concern over policing across the country. your first thoughts and the context of what we're about to hear? >> i've been in communication with a lot of people on the ground in minnesota. they feel like the humanity of a generation is on trial. people keep saying the system is on trial. it's not just the system. they feel their humanity is on trial. can this system ever truly respect black life? to have this -- this videotaped lynching is around the world. people want to know. you know, does my life matter? it's not just a slogan. it's not just a political talking point. does my life matter as a young person trying to make it in this country? and, you know, a lot of people who have been organizing, they
are exhausted. i cannot tell you the level of just pure fatigue in that community, because this is not the first -- remember, you are castillo and so many other cases. this is the one that finally we hope will get some justice but what you're hearing is fatigue, exhaustion and people afraid to hope. they are excited because it came back early. maybe that's a good thing but even with that, even with all the evidence, and even with all the police testifying against the officer and even with the speedy verdict and even with chief ellison coming in and saving the day as the state's attorney general, even with all that have people are literally afraid to hope. they are holding their breath and preparing for another body blow. you have young people watching right now. 40 years from now they will remember today, 50 years from now they will remember today. this is how important this is to a whole generation of young americans. >> and van, what if it's not a guilty verdict? >> i think it sends a very, very devastating -- i mean
devastating -- people are hanging on by the tendrils of a piece of dental floss right now, just barely holding on. the level of fatigue, the level of frustration, seeing the defense come out yesterday and spend two hours just saying what seemed to be just complete nonsense. never dealing with the fact that this man was on this man's back for nine minutes. he's never a joysed. he's never acknowledged anything, this officer, and so people are barely hanging on. the so if it comes back negative, if it comes back the message to a generation be you don't matter. your life doesn't matter. your pain doesn't matter. your protests don't matter. your voting didn't matter. putting this man in office, keith ellison, a great state attorney general, even that didn't matter, so i can't tell you. i wish i could say something different. now, i hope whatever the verdict is people handle themselves responsibly, but i have to be very honest. people will -- will feel that
their humanity has been flushed down the toilet and that anything can be done to us now. the if a police officer can do this, what can't they do to us? what can't they do to our children? so that is what's at stake here, and every minute now is just agony. people waiting to see how this thing comes down. >> you talked about this in the broader scope in the last 30 or 40 scopes that we have now. i want you to narrow it and talk to me about your thoughts and feelings about philonise floyd, the floyd family, as they are waiting for this verdict. >> listen, i mean, everybody is holding this family in prayer and in their hearts. you know, they had to see this over and over again. can you imagine this being shown -- somebody you love. this is not a name. it's not just george floyd a name. this is a human being who they knew and loved, and to see this -- and to see him being tortured to death over and over and over again and look at the dignity. look at the dignity. let's stop taking black dignity for granted.
let's stop taking black strength for granted. nobody should have to go through this, and this -- this family is a treasure to this country. >> van, we really appreciate getting your perspective on all of this as we all wait and hold our breath for what's about to happen. again, the breaking news. the verdict is in in the derek chauvin and cnn's special coverage against with jake tapper, don lemon and anderson cooper right now. welcome to "the lead." i'm jake tapper, and we begin with the breaking news. the jury in the trial of derek chauvin has reached a verdict. after about ten hours of dlib ray, the jurors have come to a unanimous conclusion on the three charges against the former minneapolis police officer for the death of george floyd. the verdict will be announced