Skip to main content

tv   The Lead With Jake Tapper  CNN  September 29, 2021 2:00pm-3:00pm PDT

2:00 pm
plan. i'd never tip off any enemy to any kind of surprise thing that we were going to do. that's a different context than that conversation. >> reporter: general mark milley insisting that administration officials knew about the calls before and after. milley says the purpose of the calls was stability between two nuclear powers. >> these are two great powers and i am doing my best to transmit the president's intent. president trump's intent to ensure the american people pror tected from an incident that could escalate. >> i understand your intent. >> reporter: republicans have prois seized on the calls as bypassing the commander in chief and the chain of command. >> i think it's worthy of your resignation. >> reporter: calling for the ouster of the joint chiefs over the calls. >> off talking to phil rutger. >> those comments were in the press because that's where you put them. you didn't tell the intelligence committee or armed services comm committee. >> with respect to the intelligence, i have it right here. i'll be happy to share it with
2:01 pm
you. >> great. >> i guarantee that that intelligence was disseminated to -- in the president's pdb, the vice president, the dni, the director of the cia, the secretary of defense. assistant to the president for national security affairs and others. that was significant and there was a lot of it. >> reporter: the photo from last summer at lafayette square thrust milley into the political limelight where he remains whether he likes it or not. >> what happens when a military general becomes a political figure? >> you would agree that's dangerous? >> i think it's dangerous and i've done my best to remain personally ly apolitical. i made a point of that from the time i became the chairman and especially beginning last summer. >> reporter: milley acknowledged he spoke to a number of authors who wrote about the final months of the administration. >> general milley, did you talk to bob woodward or robert costa for their book "peril"?
2:02 pm
>> woodward, yes, costa, no. >> did you talk to carol and phil rutger for their book? >> yes. >> he said he does not regret those conversations. >> i believe that part of my job is to communicate to the media what we do as a government, what we do as a military to explain to the people. >> reporter: one of the more striking concerns about what afghanistan looks like and what could happen there in the coming months, general milley also said it's possible that al qaeda could reconstitute itself within as little as six months. asked whether prlt joe biden still has confidence in the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff who was brought in under president donald trump, jen psaki said yes and also noted they worked together over the course of the past few months and the relationship between biden and milley is probably different than that between trump and milley. >> probably a safe bet. let's bring in retired lieutenant general hurtling.
2:03 pm
given what you just heard in oren's piece, do you get the sense that milley is trying to rehabilitate his reputation since the lafayette square incident in the summer? >> that's a great question. jake, no, i don't think he's trying to rehabilitate. i just know that he knows he made a mistake in the lafayette square. but all of the things he talked about today and yesterday, and i watched most of the hearings, were things that all general officers do. and in fact, if some of the congressmen asking about him or suggesting he was committing treason today because he talked to foreign dignitaries, there's going to be a whole lot of us, my former colleagues, that are going to be very surprised about that because there is constant communication with your allies, your partners and even your foes. as general milley said, it is part of your job. but what he's talking about is not the lafayette square incident. he's talking about what is often called engagement exercises or
2:04 pm
engagement reports that you do with your counterparts in other countries. >> general milley said today that he's done his best to remain apolitical, especially since the events of summer 2020 we just talked about. one of the questions i have is how difficult is it for the i military general, especially joint chiefs of staff chairman to remain apolitical? how much of a challenge is that? >> yeah, it's a tough challenge, first of all. secondly, i wouldn't use the word apolitical. the folks that study civil military relations say it's more an issue of being nonpartisan because war is politics by other means. if you are a military officer, you are conducting an extension of the political desires of your civilian leaders. so, you know, i think general milley has made it clear that he doesn't want partisan politics within the military. and we are taught that from the first day we enter the basic course as a brand-new second
2:05 pm
lieutenants and it gets rigorous as we go on and especially rigorous when we get to the point of general officer. you never want to support openly a political party. you want to faine your allegiance to those in charge because they are your civilian fasters but you also, as he has said so many times, support and defend the constitution rather than an individual. and that's what i think got general milley in trouble a little bit during the president trump regime because the president wanted him to feign allegiance to him as an individual, as opposed to understanding that his requirement was to pledge allegiance to the constitution of the united states. >> so a lot of the lawmakers echoed a lot of what we've heard in maga media. the idea that milley was committing treason by talking to his chinese counterpart, which milley has explained he did because he wanted to make sure they didn't overreact given the turbulence of the last few months of the trump presidency.
2:06 pm
not to mention his asking the command structure to keep him in the loop if there's any major orders coming down having to do with nuclear weapons. republican congresswoman liz cheney of wyoming called out her fellow republicans today for attacking milley as treasonous or unpatriotic. take a listen. >> for any member of this committee, for any american to question your loyalty to our nation, to question your understanding of our constitution, your loyalty to our constitution, your recognition and understanding of the civilian chain of command is despicable. i want to apologize for those members of this committee who have done so. >> some lawmakers continue to call on milley to resign, though. do you think that he still has respect, milley, within the ranks or has his credibility taken a hit? >> i think he has respect or -- let me restate that.
2:07 pm
i know he has respect from individuals who understand our oath of allegiance to the constitution, jake. he may have, you know, there may be some within the ranks who are feeling that he's treasonous because he talked to the chinese. and it's those who would believe that in the ranks, don't understand what it's like to be a general officer and what you have to do as part of your j-o-b. you know, there are those on the right calling him a traitor. those on the left who are calling him a hero because of what he did. what i would say and what i did say in a cnn editorial is, he was just doing his job. and for those who don't understand that, especially on a house armed services committee oversight hearing, you know, they've got a lot more to learn about the way the military does things. i listen to some of the congressmen today, and i was shocked by some of them and the things they said when they are sitting on the armed services committee. they should know better.
2:08 pm
they should have a better understanding of what the military is required to do and what general officers specifically have to do to contribute to the diplomacy and the security of the united states. >> all right, general. thank you. good to see you again. democratic negotiations at a standstill just hours before the critical vote on the bipartisan infrastructure plan. will president biden's agenda make it across the finish line? plus, a hearing under way that could change the life of pop star britney spears. stay with us. tv - i'm an actual neuroscientist. and i love the science behind neuriva plus. unlike ordinary memory supplements, neuriva plus fuels six key indicators of brain performance. more brain performance? yes, please! neuriva. think bigger.
2:09 pm
2:10 pm
2:11 pm
2:12 pm
did you know that your fabrics trap more than just odors? they also trap bacteria. better get new febreze fabric antimicrobial. its water-based formula penetrates fabrics to kill 99.9% of bacteria and it eliminates odors. spray it on your furniture, your rugs, your clothes - wherever bacteria and odors hide. you can even sanitize your car seats! for a deeper clean and a freshness you'll love... try new febreze fabric antimicrobial. topping our politics lead, nobody wants to blink. negotiations at a near standstill among democrats over the president's massive $3.5
2:13 pm
trillion spending plan on the social safety net programs which moderates say is too big and progressives want passed before tomorrow's scheduled vote on the bipartisan infrastructure bill. one source involved in negotiations tells cnn everyone thinks the other side is about to blink and neither is right. cnn's manu raju joins us live from capitol hill. you just got a brand-new update from one of the key players. moderate democratic senator joe manchin on where things stand. what does he have to say? >> he's made clear he's not there, not ready to sign off on the larger bill to expand the social safety net. democrats have said that manchin needs to sign on to that larger plan, some legislative text or framework or outline of some sort before that other key vote that's happening on thursday to move forward and give a final passage vote to the $1.2 trillion bipartisan infrastructure plan. manchin says in this statement that much more negotiation is needed. he raises concerns about the
2:14 pm
expansion of social programs. essentially saying what the democrats are proposing is not needed given the economic state we're in. there needs to be more means testing and raises concerns about spending trillions of dollars in new money. says he cannot and will not support trillions in spending or an all or nothing approach that ignores the brutal fiscal reality our nation faces. this is why this is important, jake. in a 50-50 senate, every vote matters. one democrat like joe manchin could tank the whole thing. nancy pelosi made clear that she'll not move forward in the house on that larger plan unless the senate, all 50 democrats, sign off on that same approach and i asked her about that. and she explained. >> do manchin and sinema need to sign off on this legislative language for this infrastructure bill to move forward? >> what i have also said is we're not proceeding with anything that doesn't have agreement between the house and the senate. and that's where we're working. we could pass a bill any time. we can pass a little any time. but if it doesn't have the
2:15 pm
support of the senate, then where are we? >> so now the big question is, what happens with that thursday vote because right now progressives saying they have the numbers to scuttle that because they want to use that as leverage to force that larger plan through, to get moderates like joe manchin to agree to an approach to move forward. manchin said it's going to take weeks for him to get behind anything and there need to be much more talks. he and kyrsten sinema have been at the center of these talks for some time. at the moment nancy pelosi and chuk schumer are at the white house trying to figure out their way ahead. will they move ahead tomorrow? will they be punt? the votes don't appear to be there on the infrastructure bill as of yet. >> manu raju, thank you. let's discuss. kasie, what is the end game here for senator sinema? this is familiar territory for joe manchin who represents a very red state. but arizona is purplish/red and
2:16 pm
her fellow arizonan mark kelly is not doing this. what is she trying to do? >> he's not. he's the one facing election again, re-election in a short period of time. certainly the democrats i've talked to have been pretty frustrated with sinema and frankly moderates and prifgs and her fellow senators because i think they think she seems to want to step into the spotlight and isn't willing to be clear on what she wants. until there's a little more clarity, it's, i don't think, going to become clear. she wants to be a player. manchin, i talked to him about this and he's clearly seems personally frustrated. but this statement is newsy in that it lays down the line and says to speaker pelosi, hey, the ball is in your court. i'm not going to give you the agreement you asked for before tomorrow when you say you'll have a vote. you have to decide, are you going to lay out that gauntlet or pull back?
2:17 pm
>> there's also growing iritition with president biden for not being more engaged, although he has been in the last day or so. is this what biden expected, this kind of stalemate over his own ogenda? >> definitely not. he did not expect infighting in -- with democrats. progressives, moderates. when he was campaigning in 2020, he basically tried to straddle the line. i'm a moderate. i'm not going to go for medicare for all but he made this unity pledge with bernie sanders and progressives and brought them in and made prifg ideals a big part of his agenda. and now he's trying to figure out how to get those two sides of the wings, both of those wings of his party and get them together. and it doesn't appear there's a sense of urgency when it comes to pushing this bill. there are a number of different deadlines they have that the democrats need to get.
2:18 pm
they need to pass a bill to keep the government open but not that same level of urgency with manchin and sinema. they aren't saying this needs to happen right away. this can happen over the course of many weeks. >> that's what congressman spokane said yesterday. the votes are not there for infrastructure. obviously this is bringing out some very strong, raw passions and frustrations that democrats and it's not just progressives that are frustrated. >> basically everyone that's not sinema. here's one of the more progressive newcomers. corey bush talking about sinema. >> come to my district. have kyrsten sinema come to my district and meet with my folks in st. louis. have her come and meet with those that sleep on the streets. she has her own story that i feel like she's forgotten. >> a couple of points there. she's referring to the fact senator sinema famously grew up
2:19 pm
in poverty. a famous part of her back story. but one of the points that congressman bush is trying to make is with the exception of jim clyburn, the majority whip who is african-american, all of this debating is going on among wealthy white people and she's concerned that that is going to hurt people of color. >> well, i think sometimes she's right in that we get lost in the politics of it and behind it are real people who will be affected by this policy that biden is trying to push forward. it's important to put a human face on what the consequences are of inaction. there seems to be a lack of urgency among some on getting this done. i don't think we can wait weeks or months. democrats have to act now. moderates, progressives, everybody, my bosses have been saying this. like get together and figure it out. obviously, 3.5 is the number that everybody wants. we're not getting it.
2:20 pm
figure ot what your number is. get in a room and figure it out and pass both of these. >> october 18th is the deadline janet yellen set for the debt ceiling. they're trying to force democrats to put the debt ceiling in this reconciliation package. that's in about two weeks. if they can't come to an agreement by then, their hand will be forced. >> brendan, as a former republican aide, i have to ask you, do you think that there is the hatred of the $3.5 trillion spending bill that, among independents, that could help a republican win an election in a democratic district that there was, for example, in terms of the passion against obamacare? i don't see it, but i don't know. >> i don't see it either. that's one of the interesting political dynamics at large. go back to the obama era and you had the tea party movement. there were rallies in the street. it led to republicans taking back the house.
2:21 pm
the resistance in the first couple of years of donald trump led to democrats taking back the house. it doesn't feel like the energy is there. republicans clearly have other plans, other issues, cultural issues they think are going to fire up voters. they made a bet that playing populist nativist politics is the solution. they don't need to focus on the policy. i wish there was more focus on the policy because there's plenty of things to talk about. we're a post-policy party right now. i don't think there's a lot of interest in getting into the weeds. they'd rather have the cultural fights. or that's the bet they've made. >> then you wonder, is sinema, gottheimer, murphy, manchin, are they -- do they really face a voter revolt if they support the $3.5 trillion bill? i mean, obviously, people don't always do things for political reasons. they may have philosophical differences on this. but is there a political cost?
2:22 pm
i don't know that there is. >> i think the thing is that republicans in their messaging are turning this into a cultural issue. they are adding the word woke on the end and trying to use it to scare their voters that everything in their life is going to change if they let democrats do this and $3.5 trillion is a big number. and democrats frankly and i've talked to several privately, who have been frustrated with the messaging around this because it really has been and -- the conversation we're having about top line number is being driven by the fact that's what they are talking about behind the scenes, arguing about how much to spend. but they haven't been talking about what is in it for people? what are you, the person at home who is struggling, who is trying to figure out how to get child care so you can go to work while your child is not getting covid. that's not the focus. it's been a real struggle for them to get it across. >> i don't think republicans need to insert themselves in
2:23 pm
this. all that's happening is democrats are fighting. even if you've been following this, it's hard to figure out what's been going on, what this is even about. >> i've covered congress for 15 years and it's hard to talk about. >> what are we even talking about? it's all getting lost. republicans can sit back right now and as long as they are shooting at each other, no reason to get in the middle. >> democrats said all we need to do is something. >> something. >> people need to see us do something and they're currently not. >> i still think, like i said, time is of the essence, but there is time to get this done and regardless of what that number is going to be, it's going to be a huge improvement in everybody's lives. and i agree the messaging has not been great but the messaging is also being driven by those of us sitting around this table, people in this town talking about this. when i talk to folks in states they are focused at the local level of saying in this particular district this bill is going to do this for your family. it may not be bubbling up to here but where people live, they are trying to get that message.
2:24 pm
>> there are tax increases in the bill and those could be hurtful, politically, for some of these democrats. >> there is a major difference in the democratic party about how far to go on tax increases. how far on some of thieves benefits. joe manchin wants to think about means testing. not giving hundreds of dollars to every person who may not need it or may not want it. democrats are saying we need to make a lot of these programs universal and not having that argument hashed out before this vote happens is going to make it very difficult for them to get anything done. >> kasie, toluse, brenda, good to see all of you. coming up, police officers convicted of heinous crimes, yet still eligible for millions of dollars in taxpayer-supported payments. stay with us. subway has so much new i ran out of time in the last ad... so i'll take it from here. sorry steph. spokesperson refresh! refresh wait, what? subway® just upped their bread game with the help of some world-class bakers. lookin' at you nance.
2:25 pm
gotta refresh to be fresh. how many people are in this ad? that means freshly baked new artisan italian and hearty multigrain. hmm, that would go good with... seriously? i didn't even get to finish. ugh, see you next commerc...
2:26 pm
2:27 pm
2:28 pm
it's moving day. and while her friends are doing the heavy lifting, jess is busy moving her xfinity internet and tv services. it only takes about a minute. wait, a minute? but what have you been doing for the last two hours? ...delegating? oh, good one. move your xfinity services without breaking a sweat. xfinity makes moving easy. go online to transfer your services in about a minute. get started today.
2:29 pm
in our buried lead, stories that are not getting enough attention, a cnn investigation. even though he's in prison for the murder of george floyd, former minneapolis police officer derek chauvin remains eligible for roughly $1.5 million in pension benefits once he reaches retirement age and chauvin is not alone. as cnn's chief investigative correspondent drew griffin uncovered, hundreds of officers convicted of crimes like murder and rape stand to cash in on high-dollar retirement benefits. >> reporter: across the country, police officers convicted of crimes violating the very laws they were sworn to uphold, are raking in millions in retirement payments. in california, this former sheriff is collecting a whopping
2:30 pm
$265,000 a year out of a poncion that could be worth 10 million after being convicted. in new york a university police officer found guilty of manslaughter for strangling his girlfriend and setting her body on fire is eligible for a $500,000 pension. and in minnesota, fired minneapolis police officer derek chauvin convicted of killing george floyd sentenced it more than 22 years in prison is eligible for a retirement pension worth more than a million dollars. they're hardly alone. a cnn investigation finds hundreds of police officers convicted of violent and sexual felonies and on-the-job corruption are still eligible for hundreds of millions of dollars in taxpayer-supported pensions. >> the taxpayers should not be on the hook for someone that did not end their career the way they started it, which is with honor and with respect for the rule of law. >> reporter: in washington state, retired officer carl
2:31 pm
thompson is still getting paid out of a pension that could be worth more than $600,000. it was back in 2006 thompson responded to a 911 call from two teenagers who thought 36-year-old janitor otto zem looked suspicious. zem suffered from schizophrenia. he'd come to this convenience store to buy a pepsi after work. he had done nothing wrong but officer thompson stormed into the store and heading straight for an unsuspected zem. and without a single word spoken, without a warning, thompson beat otto zem to the ground just out of view of surveillance cameras. backup officers tased zen, sat on him, hogtied him as horrified customers heard zem's final words. all i wanted was a snickers. zem who committed no crime lingered for two days in a hospital and died. >> we didn't just watch somebody arrest somebody.
2:32 pm
we watched a police officer murder someone in front of us. >> reporter: but no police officer would be charged with murder. for years, spokane police said the beating was justified in what the department of justice calls an extensive cover-up. it took a federal civil rights prosecution nearly six years later to finally uncover the trulth. thompson was convicted of violating zem's civil rights by using unreasonable force and attempting to conceal evidence. >> this case in part was to bring justice to him and to his family. carl thompson was 65 when he went to prison and kept collecting his $24,000 a year retirement pension behind bars. sandy and dale zim, atto zem's cousins, find it all appalling. >> to have a taxpayer pension go on for years and years and years or the rest of your life, time after you have been convicted of a crime like that, no. i disagree. >> reporter: while some states
2:33 pm
have passed laws stripping pensions from convicted cops, in more than 30 states, police officers would keep their pensions even if found guilty of murder or rape while on the job. they believe the threat of losing a pension can be a powerful deterrent. >> pensions are something that are really important to people and so we need to make sure they have skin in the game and when officers do the wrong thing in certain circumstances, they absolutely should be taken away. police advocates say that can be unfair to the police officers and their families. >> why build on a tragedy when the officer's life is over. they are potentially in prison. they're civilly sued. so i would be in favor of not punishing the family that has been along the side of this officer. >> reporter: former spokane officer carl thompson is out of prison, is retired and has already received more than $150,000 of his pension and
2:34 pm
could eventually rake in four times of that. he's refused to speak to cnn. >> is mr. thompson in? >> may i ask who you are? >> drew griffin with cnn. >> cnn, the television station? >> no, you, no. >> otto zehm's family believes justice was not served. >> do you think this officer paid enough of the price? >> he's out but i don't think he's paid enough for it, yeah. yeah, i don't think he paid enough for it. >> the discrepancies in how governments handle it. social security payments are halted if you go behind bars. police pensions are not. proponents of taking away police pensions point not just to the fairness of victims' families but to one study that shows the threat of losing pensions actually leads to better police behavior by officers. jake? >> drew griffin, thank you so much. eye-opening report.
2:35 pm
could north korea's new missile reach washington, d.c., in just a couple of hours? that's the fear. what we know about the latest test. that's next. (woman) you have? (burke) sure, this is the part where all is lost and the hero searches for hope. then, a mysterious figure reminds her that she has the farmers home policy perk, guaranteed replacement cost. and that her home will be rebuilt, regardless of her limits or if the cost of materials has gone up. (woman) that's really something. (burke) get a whole lot of something with farmers policy perks. wait, i didn't ruin the ending, did i? (woman) yeah, y-you did. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪ constipated? set yourself free with fleet. gentle constipation relief in minutes. little fleet. big relief. try it. feel it. feel that fleet feeling. since suzie's got goals, she'll want a plan to reach them. so she'll get some help from fidelity, and she'll feel so good about her plan,
2:36 pm
she can focus on living it. that's the planning effect, from fidelity. i'm not getting through the pandemic just to end up with the flu. i asked for fluzone high-dose quadrivalent. it's the #1-used flu vaccine for people 65 and older. fluzone high-dose quadrivalent is the only vaccine approved by the fda for superior flu protection in adults 65+. i'm not letting my guard down. fluzone high-dose quadrivalent isn't for people who've had a severe allergic reaction to any flu vaccine or vaccine component, including eggs or egg products. tell your health care professional if you've ever experienced severe muscle weakness after receiving a flu shot. people with weakened immune systems including those receiving therapies that suppress the immune system, may experience lower immune responses. vaccination may not protect everyone. side effects include pain, redness, and/or swelling where you got the shot, muscle ache, headache, and general discomfort. other side effects may occur. all flu shots are not the same.
2:37 pm
i raised my game with fluzone high-dose quadrivalent. ask your doctor or pharmacist for fluzone high-dose quadrivalent. who pays more for prescription drugs than anyone else in the world? americans do. and whose tax dollars does big pharma use to develop those same drugs? that's right. our tax dollars. it's a big pharma scam. they get rich and we get ripped off. and it's why pharma is spending millions on lies and scare tactics to stop a plan that lets medicare negotiate lower prices. congress, stop the big pharma scam. let medicare negotiate lower prices. watch. serena williams... wonder woman... serena... wonder woman... serena... ace. get your tv together with the best of live and on demand. introducing directv stream, with no annual contract. - [announcer] at southern new hampshire university, we never stop celebrating our students. from day one to graduation to your dream job,
2:38 pm
that's why we're keeping your tuition low for the 10th year in a row. - [student] the affordability and the quality of education, it can be enough to change your life. - [announcer] as a nonprofit university, we believe in making college more affordable for everyone. - southern new hampshire university, it was just amazing experience. - [announcer] find your degree at ♪ ♪ i know the best coffee spot in town. i can make a rustic cabin feel modern. i am a guidebook for guests. i can make an indoorsy person, outdoorsy. i give families a home, not just a place to stay. i am a vrbo host. ♪ ♪
2:39 pm
in our world lead, north korea is claiming that they've tested a hypersonic missile which, if true, experts say could profoundly change the military equation given these missiles can go thousands of times faster than the speed of sound. and no existing weapons system can shoot them down. as cnn's will ripley reports, this poses a serious possible threat to the united states and to close allies. >> reporter: if what north korea says is true, this may be their most dangerous weapon yet, a hypersonic missile. analysts say it could change the military equation. in east asia and beyond. kim jong-un's arsenal has exploded during his first decade
2:40 pm
in power. analysts say the wasong-8 could be unlike any other missile he's tested before. exact specifications unknown. hypersonic missiles can fly more than five times the speed of sound, roughly 4,000 miles an hour or about a mile every second. at that speed, a missile could fly from pyongyang to washington in less than two hours. some hypersonic weapons can theoretically fly four times faster, up to 20 times the speed of sound. many ballistic missiles already fly at hypersonic speeds. but they follow a set trajectory from point a to point b. north korea says this new missile has a hypersonic vehicle making it highly maneuverable, descending on a target from a maneuverable altitude. almost impossible to shoot down. t. would mean our ground base interceptors in alaska and california would not work against north korea's missiles.
2:41 pm
that means north korea would be able to intimidate the united states. >> reporter: south korea says the north's newly tested hypersonic missile is likely in the early stages of development and can still be detected and intercepted by south korean and u.s. missile defense systems. at least for now. >> we don't know yet about the full capacity of these hypersonic missiles, but when you connect these new missile capabilities, new launch ca capabilities and the miniaturization of nuclear weapons it leads to the conclusion that north korea will possibly or likely have an increased strike capability and that's going to increase the threat that north korea poses to countries around the world. >> reporter: right now just two nations have deployed hypersonic missiles -- russia and china. the u.s. is actively testing and developing hypersonic missile technology. three world powers and now possibly north korea, a new global arms race escalating at hypersonic speed.
2:42 pm
at his party congress in january, kim jong-un said he wants an icbm with a range of more than 9,000 miles. military reconnaissance satellites and tactical nuclear weapons all added to his arsenal as soon as possible. but at the same time, jake, he's signaling a possible return to communication with south korea just minutes ago, kim was quoted in north korean state media denouncing the u.s. and south korea expansion of arms. just this week south korea put a submarine in the water capable of launching ballistic missiles. kim is willing to reopen a communication line with the south in the coming days but he is blasting the biden administration saying that the biden administration's methods are more sly in his words than the trump administration. more hostile, even though president biden's team has been calling for dialogue and negotiations without preconditions. kim says he believes that is a trick. >> will ripley, thank you. a hearing is under way that could decide the future of the
2:43 pm
britney spears' conservatorship. stay with us. the sun is shining and the grass is green ♪ ♪ i'm way ahead of schedule with my trusty team ♪ ♪ there's heather on the hedges ♪ ♪ and kenny on the koi ♪ ♪ and your truck's been demolished by the peterson boy ♪ ♪ yes -- ♪ wait, what was that? timber... [ sighs heavily ] when owning a small business gets real, progressive helps protect what you've built with affordable coverage.
2:44 pm
2:45 pm
you have the best pizza in town and the worst wait times. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit tackling tough messes can take more time than you have, but mr. clean clean freak delivers the power of a deep clean in minutes unlike bleach sprays, clean freak starts deep cleaning on contact with three times the cleaning power to break down tough messes in seconds it quickly cleans your home's toughest messes so, for a deep clean in minutes, get mr. clean clean freak available in easy to switch refills and now get the cleaning power of mr. clean in a wipe to kill
2:46 pm
99.9% of bacteria and viruses.
2:47 pm
our pop culture lead now. a long-awaited hearing is under way for britney spears. three months after the pop superstar first spoke out publicly about her unusual conservatorship calling the arrangement abusive and expl exploitative. now a los angeles judge may decide whether or father should be suspended as her caretaker or whether the arrangement should be scrapped altogether. let's go to stephanie elam live outside the courthouse for us. britney spears, who is one of
2:48 pm
the biggest stars in the world, we should note, has been in this conservatorship for more than 13 years. what's at stake today? >> that's right. this has been going on for a long time, jake. the idea that she has been silent and not in control of her own life really coming to a head over the last year or so and then hearing britney in her own words in court, in june, called up in july where she said she thought her father should be charged with conservatorship abuse. she wants this to end. then we see steps moving in that direction. now we know that earlier in september her father, jamie spears, agreed to say that the conservatorship should be dissolved. that he no longer needed to be the co-conservator. that is what is at stake here today. there are a few things that could happen. we would see that the judge could come out and say, i need more time. let's set up another meeting. that's not going to happen. that's the least likely of options. she could say let's get rid of
2:49 pm
the conservatorship but put in guard rails for how her finances and person will be handled. that's one option. she could also say let's go ahead with what britney's lawyer wants, matthew rosengard and suspend jamie spears as the conservator of this estate. and then say let's put the cpa in to take over the estate. jamie spears for his part is saying that's unnecessary because what really needs to happen is that this conservatorship goes away. so these are some of the options we're looking at. britney's loical fans are a hug reason why we're here. we wait for word on what britney's future will be. there could be at least a path moving forward for britney to regain control of her life. we're just waiting for word so much. let's discuss this with erin lee
2:50 pm
carr, directing of a brand-new doc called britney v. spears which debuted on netflix last night and shot to number one. congratulations. you have been working on this documentary for the past 2 1/2 years. you're a self-described britney fan. what do you want to hear from today's hearing? >> you know, i think that britney for the first time, these last couple months, was able to actually get her own lawyer. it had been a court approved lawyer, which was sam ingram, previously, so the fact she has matthew rosenguard, who is trying to figure out and seek what is best for britney, and today, it's about jamie wants the conservatorship to end but is there a reason for that? and i think that we're waiting on accounting, we're waiting on, you know, when and where will be the transfer of papers about what happened inside the conservatorship. so there's a lot going on in terms of judge brenda penny deciding if the conservatorship is going to be removed today.
2:51 pm
>> your documentary is really interesting. i wonder about a decision, an editorial decision you seem to have made. you made a deliberate choice, it seems, to not show the pictures of britney spears at the height of what people think was a mental breakdown. the 2008 photos where she shaved her head, was put in an ambulance. tell me about that decision. >> yeah, so those images that you just mentioned, they have been seen millions of times. you just think of britney spears and those images are conjured in your mind. so trying to think at it from an empathic yet journalistic angle, we don't need to see those images again to understand the story. i think in the documentary, britney v. spears, you're going to see the ambulance as she heads to the hospital with the paparazzi chasing her, but you're never going to see her face in that ambulance because we don't need to. and so i think that we really
2:52 pm
tried to, you know, think about that every step of the way. >> it was in empathy for people with mental struggles, am i hearing you correctly? >> it was in empathy for people with mental struggles, but it also was that i wanted to move the story forward. i think when i approach netflix with this story, it wasn't about the parade of images and videos we have previously seen, but what is going on inside the conservatorship and me, two and a half years ago, maybe i can help crack one of the most mysterious legal mysteries of our time. it was incredibly naive, but if i was going do it, i was going to do it in a forward facing way. >> you got a lot of documents leaked to you. what do you think was behind that? i mean, i would love to know who you think the source was. but do you think it was someone inside the conservatorship trying to free britney as it
2:53 pm
were? >> oh, you know i can't talk about my source, jake. you know, i think that in -- there's a sort of underworld as it relates to the britney spears microverse, multiverse. so it really was people knew that we were working on this, and so we made contacts inside the space, and you know, people came to us saying, i really want to help and show what was going on inside the conservatorship, so when i initially got a report that was from 2013. it said britney lacks capacity in all matters, you know, to retain counsel, to do anything like that, i mean, this is, you know, this was years after she had done multiple tours. so really starting out with those documents from 2013, saying the word incapable over and over and over again made me need to know more.
2:54 pm
>> you also in the documentary interviewed a controversial person from her life, sam lufti, and there are critics who say they don't think you should have interviewed him. what do you say to them? >> you know, i think documentaries are really tough because especially when you're sort of making them while the news is evolving, but sam lutfi was one of the pivotal figures in hr life during that period of duress. he saw things, and it was really important to me to go and meet with and interview the people that were actually there. now, you'll see in the film that it's not about, you know, lending sam lutfi credibility because you see in a deposition that had not been seen before, it really said, britney said he was somebody that would go get her groceries. and you know, sam is saying i'm her manager. i'm calling the shots. so really showing the viewer that there were these really separate narratives.
2:55 pm
>> yeah. erin, thank you so much. congratulations on the documentary. we will be right back.
2:56 pm
2:57 pm
ready to turn your dreams into plans and your actions into achievements? explore over 75 programs and four-week classes at national university.
2:58 pm
your future starts today at
2:59 pm
states and around the world --. >> in our earth matters series today, the last laugh for woody woodpicker. it's a tragic story, really, because from now on you have to watch that cartoon on television to catch a glimpse of the actual ivory billed woodpecker. they're declaring it along with 22 other species of birds, fish, and other wildlife extinct. this move comes as scientists
3:00 pm
say climate change and habitat destruction are accelerating the rate of extingtion worldwide and warn as many as 1 million species are threatened with being lost forever. you can follow me on facebook, instagram, tiktok, and twitter. tweet the show at the lead cnn, or you can always capture the show wherever you get your podcast if you miss an episode. our coverage continues with wolf blitzer right next door in "the situation room." >> happening now, breaking news. top democrats nancy pelosi and chuck schumer rush to the white house to meet face-to-face with president biden. signaling new urgency about party in fighting just hours before a planned vote that could derail their agenda. i'll ask the number two senate democrat, dick durbin, if his party can avert political and economic disasters. >> also tonight, the nation's top general undergoes another grilling up on capitol hill. once again, contradicting president biden on afghanistan