tv Don Lemon Tonight CNN June 15, 2022 11:00pm-12:00am PDT
the news continues. let's turn things over to don and "don lemon tonight." don? >> we're hours away from the next public hearing of the january 6 committee investigation on the attack on the capitol. the testimony tomorrow will be former president. former president trump's campaign on vice president
pence. the white house council said pence did not have any authority to throw out the results. trump's pressure on pence, and i quote, directly contributed to the violent insurrection. let's take a look at this photo. it's obtained by abc news, showing pence and his family inside hiding, as the building was being ransacked by rioters. pence's daughter on the left side of the photo, his wife on the right, pulling the curtains closed for extra safety. and pence had good reasons to be hiding. some of the rioters brought gallows to the capitol while calling for pence to be hanged. >> hang mike pence. hang mike pence. hang mike pence. hang mike pence. >> pence's former chief of staff will not testify in person. but clips from his video deposition are expected to be played. tonight, in a short, telling
wolf blitzer, who he believes is ultimately responsible for the january 6th violence. >> well, to be clear, do you blame those surrounding the president for giving him bad advice? or do you blame the then-president himself? >> i think ultimately the buck stops with the president. he has the ability to listen to advice or discard advice. there were people around the president that served him very poorly and i think gave poor advice. >> re >> he is not the only former trump white house aide that thought the president was listening to the wrong people. bill steppian said he was on team normal and not rudy giuliani's team that was pushing the election lie. and eric hershman gave to john eastman the day after january 6th. >> i only want to hear two words coming out of your mouth from now on -- orderly transition.
i don't want to hear any other words coming out of your mouth, no matter what, other than orderly transition. repeat those words to me. eventually, you said orderly transition. good, john. now, i'm going to give you the best free legal advice you're ever getting in your life, get a great criminal defense lawyer. you're going to need it. >> pence's form er counsel and retired judge and adviser to pence. both men had vised the former vice president he had no authority to overturn the election results. i want to turn, now, straight away the political analyst alex burns and john martin, both correspondents for "the new york times." they're the co-authors of the book "this will not pass." thank you for coming on. good evening to you. we have new photos obtained by abc news, showing pence hiding
on january 6th. he's across from his daughter. his wife closing the curtains while the attack was under way. this comes as the committee was making the case that trump's actions led to the attack. what are we going to hear? >> i think we'll get a lot of detail on just how much pressure mike pence was under to do the wrong thing on january 6th. and i will probably look at what we had up to this point, exactly what the mechanics were that landed with him doing the right thing. we know everybody from the president on down, who was determined to continue to challenge the election was placing everything around mike pence. it's our reporting on the book and at the time for the paper. we never thought mike pence was tempted to go ahead and try to sabotage american democracy and create a constitutional crisis the kind that president trump was pursuing. we never had an american vice
president having his arm twisted by his boss, the dominant figure of the republican party, sitting commander of the united states, to do something this wrong and to stand up to him, the way pence did. >> the committee is going to focus on the threat to the v.p. throughout the attack, including the gallows. the idea that someone had to buy the wood and the rope to build them, right? that could be an indication of premeditation there. they're going to want to know who came up with this. >> sure. there's a kind of violence symbolism throughout american political history of being hanged in effigy or tarred and feathered in effigy. it doesn't rise to the level of an assassination plot, the purd of the committee to make the case, if they so choose. but even before you get the notion of whether people really, really, truly had a plan to hang
the sitting vice president of the united states, you have a very good picture including the photos from john karl today, that fleshes out just how much immediate danger mike pence was in. >> jonathan, we've seen presidents hung in effigy and world leaders hung in effigy. this is a real gallows that was constructed on the mall. that's quite a different thing. >> yeah. i was in the capitol on january 6th. we have a lot of reporting in the book about just precisely what was happening in and around the building that day. and i don't think it's an exaggeration to say we were seconds away -- not minutes away, but seconds away, from a lot more bloodshed that day. potentially an exchange of fire within the other parts of the capitol, beyond just outside the house chamber.
look, for example, if members of congress aren't evacuated in a timely manner, like they were, they can come into contact with a lot of the rioters and you could have an extraordinary mass assassination attempt. pence himself -- you showed the picture of pence and his family. if rioters get to that location inside the capitol, who knows what could have happened to pence and his family. the day was tragic, serious, and it's a black mark on american history. >> and jonathan pence's former chief of staff, mark short, was on with wolf, i showed a little of it in the beginning of the show. he said the buck stops with the president. he felt that those around the president was giving him bad advice. how much of the plot came from the president, versus the people around him? >> i think he was pushed by a
handful of people, who knew they could retain their access to trump, they could stay in the room in those crucial days, if they told trump what he wanted to hear because, don, trump was surrounding himself, in that period, only with people who were reaffirming what he wanted to hear. we have reporting in the book of trump effectively breaking ties with chris christie because christie tells trump in november, basically, concede. and trump says to him, chris, i'm not going to do it. what else do you got for me? trump at this point only has folks that are trying to egg him on and are putting this in his ear, that, yes, you can overturn the results in the election. and the more responsible actors are no longer in the room. >> here's more from mark short why he warned the secret service that the vice president might be in danger. >> just want to be specific. you were concerned about the vice president's security because of what the president was saying? >> because it was about to
become a much more public occasion. i knew that the president was about to express that in a more public manner. i'm not sure that the consequence was thought by people around the president with thousands of people coming to washington. >> saying that the president put pence's life in danger? >> well, the president clearly did put pence's life in danger. that's a statement of observable fact at this point. the thing that's so striking about marc short's interview today and some of the information we have about the run-up to january 6th, is how many people at senior levels of government of the white house and the congress, had a clear premonition that violence was imminent. he said -- marc short said, perhaps the president not thought through the implications of what happened, when he goes out and says these things, when the mall is full of these angry people who believe the election was stolen. we have reporting in our book that republican members of
congress meeting on the night before january 6th, repeatedly raised the question with kevin mccarthy, you know, you have these thousands of people coming to town, who actually think we're going to overturn the election. and what is going to happen when we don't? and you know what happened when they didn't. >> alex, jonathan, thank you, gentlemen. see you soon. >> thanks, don. >> the book again, "this will not pass." i want to bring in a former u.s. attorney. thank you for joining us. good to see you. michael letig, the conservative judge that advised pence that he couldn't overturn the election, he is testifying tomorrow. he had been approached by pence's personal lawyer and on january 5th, provided reasoning why penlsce had to certify the election. what do you think we're going to hear from him? >> i think we're going to hear from somebody that is a
conservative injurist, left the bench but was on the bench for a long time. who has been a supporter of republicans, appointed by republicans, and was on the short list to be on the supreme court himself, under republican administrations. and the fact that he will opine, about the way he opined before, that the eastman memo and other memos and pieces of advice that were given to mike pence, were ludicrous. and without foundation and without merit. i think at least with respect to the conservative community, he carries a lot of weight. there's discussion that people on the right, and supporters of trump, are listening to the hearings. someone with his credentials and his background, and his track record, saying it' 's a legal matter, it's significant. >> the january 6th committee has e-mailed correspondents between john eastman and ginni thomas, a
conservative activist and wife of clarence thomas. it's not clear what the content of the e-mails are. how important do you think this is? >> it depends on what is in the e-mails. we don't know the content but it's probably not recipes. we know ginni thomas' activism with respect to the big law before. we know about john eastman and his writing of memos that he will say it is ludicrous and nonsense. we have two other confrontations between john eastman and institutional lawyers under trump. there's one occasion when john eastman has an altercation with the chief counsel to mike pence, on june 6th, when eastman says this violence is because mike pence not doing his duty. and you have the clip that you showed earlier in the program, between the lawyer and the white
house dcounsel's office and joh eastman, who says the day after the insurrection -- after the violence was seen by the entire country, john eastman is pushing the idea of taking some action in georgia. and that lawyer said you need to get a great criminal lawyer. the story with respect to john eastman and ginni thomas and the e-mails is just part of the story. john eastman is everywhere in this. >> the committee released surveillance lo loudermilk giving a tour. and one of the members was screaming threats. >> there's no escape, pelosi. schumer. nadler. we're coming for you. we're coming in like white on
rice. pelosi, nadler, schumer, even you, aoc. we're coming to take you out. pull you out by your hairs. how about that, pelosi? >> i mean, these people are just whack-a-doos. loudermilk refuses to speak to the committee. what do you think of his involvement in all of this? >> part of the problem with loudermilk he is giving confusing and contradictory statements about what he did. i think initially, he denied giving anyone a tour. he had, you know, minimized what he did. now, you have documentary evidence, not just only what you showed. i don't know if loudermilk heard those comments. but you have a tour he gave, where it showed people taking pictures in the office complex where members of the house of representatives work and their staffs work, taking pictures of things like stairwells and
hallways. not usually the things that cons y conscientious and legitimate tourists take pictures of. it's weird behavior. you have evidence that people did things they shouldn't have done. all this together paints a terrible picture. >> yeah. it is -- look, i don't know what is going to happen with the video, with loudermilk. looking at the video, it's suspicious. and it needs to be investigated. preet, thank you. appreciate it. >> thanks, don. trump's election lie is spreading across the country. new mexico's secretary of state, suing a republican-led county commission for refusing to certify primary election results. she joins me next. eratio n, the subaru forester has been a leader in crash safety, working to undo the impact a crash can have on your life. which has led the forester to even be able to detect danger and stop itself.
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hey! what? it's true! and that's all thanks to chase first banking. freedom for kids. control for parents. one bank with tools for both, all with no monthly service fee. chase. make more of what's yours. the big lie is alive and well all across the country. in new mexico, a republican-led commission in otero county, refused to certify election results because of baseless claims about voting machines. so, the secretary of state sued. and she joins me now. thanks so much for joining us. i appreciate that. how are you doing? >> i'm doing okay in these strange times. thank you for having me, don. >> that's very, very well-put. listen. trump's election lie is not just about the 2020 election. it's now menacing your 2022
primary. the new mexico supreme court has now ordered the commission to certify the results. the deadline to certify it is this friday. are you confident the votes will get certified? >> i mean, let's be honest. we're in unchartered territory here. we never had a situation like this happen. our county commissions act as our board of canvas in the counties to basically just review and approve the canvas report and make sure the results are accurate and if there's questions to ask those. and they have a narrow set of processes they can follow but they haven't. again, we're in this era of what is going to happen next? so, i would like to think that the individuals who have sworn an oath to the constitution and laws of the state, once ordered by the supreme court, will do the right thing. and just follow the law, simply. but at this point, to be quite honest, we don't really know where this goes from here. >> so, problems for the general
election. what problems could this present? >> i do think this is a canary in the coal mine situation. we're extremely well aware of the lies and disinformation that have been spread since 2020. i think now what we're seeing is individuals and, again, regardless of the fact they're sworn to uphold an oath, or whatever else binds them to follow the rule of law, that they are ignoring that. they are flouting it. they are saying i don't have to do that because i feel a different way about the election process. and i am concerned that not only could this activity spread to other counties in my state but that other entities in other states could undertake the same activities. so, i hope the message we're sending here in new mexico is that the law has to be followed. there's pathways to relief. pathways to get questions answered that are legal. but this is not it. >> i would like to say,
secretary, we have reached out to members of the otero county commission. we haven't heard back from them. but you say the criminal prosecution, the removal from office are on the table against these commissioners, correct? >> absolutely. we alerted the attorney general. the attorney general was looking into it. when you violate the law in new mexico, particularly the actions that been taken by this group of county commissioners, they violated on their face, multiple state statues with regard to the election process. these are fourth-degree felonies. the attorney general could have the purview to undertake removal from office or prosecution. >> dominion machines have been in the middle of trump conspiracies. this is how his attorney general talked about it in his tape testimony for the january 6th committee. watch this.
>> the claims of fraud for bullshit. he was indignant about that. they wasted a month on the claims on the voting machines. they were idiotic claims. i specifically raised the dominion voting machines, that i found to be the most disturbing alle allegations. disturbing that i saw zero basis for the allegations. they were made in such a sensational way, they were obviously influencing a lot of people, members of the public, there was a systemic corruption in the system and their votes didn't count and these machines controlled by somebody else was determining it, which is complete nonsense. it was being laid out there. i told them it was crazy stuff. and they were wasting their time
on that. it was doing a grave disservice to the country. >> the whole thing that barr is saying about the lies is that it's b.s. and that the voting machine claims idiotic. to see this still playing out, can you put the genie back in the bottle? >> unfortunately, i don't think you can. i think there's a number of people -- we would count this group of county commissioners among them, who have completely ascribed to the false climbs. it's confirmation bias. if you tend to believe the misinformation and the lies, you're going to accept that information and going to reject factual information. the facts are, don, as you know, we never put a voting machine out into public use by the voters without testing it first to make sure it's counting accurately. we never connected to the internet. we do post-election canvases and audits in new mexico, and many
other states, to make sure that the machines are counting acc accurately. the machines are a tool. they're not the end-all, be-all. but the claims are completely farcical. and to say you have feelings about them, you don't trust them, or whatever, is not a reason to violate state law. >> your machines are not connected to the internet to venezuela? i'm being sarcastic. >> no. especially not to venezuela but not anywhere else, as well. >> thank you. i appreciate you joining us. a little sense of humor. this is serious stuff but we can all use it. thank you, i appreciate it. credit cards, mortgages, car loans, all about to get a lot more expensive. that is next.
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u.s. stocks finishing higher today, this after the federal reserve announced its largest rate hike since 1994, raising interest rates by 0.75 points. the historic move comes as the fed tries to gain control of record-high inflation, that's left americans paying more for things like groceries and gas. a lot to talk about with kai. you're tough to get. we're glad you're here. >> great. i'm glad i'm here, too. >> the fed is trying to breaking the glass to contain inflation, after a disastrous report showing prices surging across the entire economy. do you think this move is enough to get this under control?
>> well, no. and powell said that today. we're going to raise interest rates until we have it under control. inflation can't go down until it flattens out. let me back you up to the report that came out on friday. 8.6% inflation, year an year, that scared the heck out of everybody. what scared the fed is people are starting to think that infl inflation is going to be higher for longer. when that happens, when inflation expectations become unmoored, people start buying now, they are worried it will be more expensive tomorrow. and that keeps driving inflation up. powell wants inflation expectations to be under control. >> speaking of, the former treasury secretary, larry summers, told me that this high level of inflation could last for at least the next year. what do you think? >> i think that's not unreasonable.
they expect inflation to be 5.2%. that's optimistic. i don't think former secretary summers is wrong. that could last for the next year. >> he said it may ease off a bit but it will lost for a while. americans are feeling the pinch. and this rate will mean mortgages, credit cards, car loans, et cetera. times will get tougher for americans. most americans. >> yeah. keep the eye on the ball here. what powell is trying to do as he makes life more difficult in the short term is bring stability to prices. without stability on prices we can't have a functioning and normal labor market. we can't have a normal economy or economic growth. what powell is betting on here and i asked him this when i talked to him a month ago. are you ready to have people lose their jobs in the name of fixing a bigger problem. we don't want anybody to lose their jobs. we have to understand that
without price and stability, without inflation under control, we cannot have a normal economy. and that's what he is trying to do. >> you saw last night. i asked summers about the possibility of a recession. listen to what he said and we will talk. >> okay. >> we are likely to have a recession. i think we have overheat ed the economy and gotten bad luck. when the pund lum swings too far one way, it will tend to swing back the other way. we'll have arecession in the net two years. >> he says we shouldn't avoid recession because that can make things worse. >> number one, recessions are normal. they happen, we survive them, we get through them. what summers is saying when he says we shouldn't try to avoid it is if we let inflation stay high, that's worse, right? that's bad for everybody.
if we have a recession, a mild or moderate recession, people will lose their jobs. unplace of employment will go up a bit. that affects a percentage point of the population. unemployment goes from 3.6% to 4%. that's a bad thing for people to lose their jobs. i get that. everybody dealing with inflation is the entire population. >> you remember, a couple months ago, do we have the right metrics to measure the economy, especially after covid? it will affect the small percentage of the population. we have low unemployment but high inflation. what the heck is happening here? >> look, first of all, the american economy is at $23 trillion beast. and the idea we try to measure it to a granule degree is crazy. we have really, really low
unemployment. the labor market, as powell said today, is healthy. it's too healthy because it's too many job openings and letting workers get higher wages. that's good for them but bad economically. in terms of the gross domestic product, you measure what you can and see what you get. that's a flip answer but that's the truth. >> what do we do about gas prices? can the government, so to speak, meaning the white house and the leaders in washington, lawmakers, anything we can do about gas prices? >> the short answer is no. the president understands what peril he is in. but the fact of the matter is, the presidents, whoever they are, republicans or democrats, can only in affect things on the margins. they can't influence what is going on in the details of this economy. higher gas prices. consumer demand. those things.
that's hard. >> you break it down in everyday man's language. thank you for appearing, sir. >> good to talk to you. a senior white house official telling cnn that president biden standing up to maga laws, that bully kids, right? we're going to tell you what they're talking about, that's next. [soft cymbal crash]
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it is pride month. and president biden is commemorating it with actions of a sweeping executive order to shore up equality for lgbtq americans. >> right now, there's people sitting in their bedroom, doors closed, silent, scrolling through social media, staring at the ceiling, wondering if they will ever be loved. ever married. ever have a family and be accepted by their own family sometimes. no one knows better than the
people in this room. we have a lot more work to do. a lot more work to do. i don't have to tell you about the ultramaga agenda, attacking families and freedoms. all of you in this room know better than anyone these attacks are real and consequential for real families. real families. >> the executive order coming in response to anti-lgbtq legislation being introduced and passed by republican-led state legislatures around the country. let's discuss this now, with ana navarro and alice stuart here. i'm going to start with you. lgbtq advocates are applauding this executive order. this is what it's supposed to do, protect children from conversion therapy, safeguard preventive youth suicide programs. initiative to protect foster
youth. >> there's been a manufactured culture war by many americans targeting lgbtq americans. it's don't say gay in florida. all about drag shows. what angle to the lgbtq thing can we pick? targeting people who talk about it as pedophiles, as you're grooming kids. it's so ignorant. it's so wrong. i think this is effective in sending the different message. we love you. we see you. we embrace you. we respect you. you're entitled to equality and to respect. yes, it matters. >> let's talk about some of the state bills this is meant to counter. ana mentioned some of it. the most famous comes out of florida, the don't say gay bill. which other states are adopting now. in texas, the attorney general there says gender-affirming health care for transkids is
child abuse. tennessee is banning discussion or instructional materials on lgbt issues public schools. oklahoma is banning books from school libraries. these are just a few of the laws going into effect. alice stuart, why is this a priority for these gop-led state legislatures? >> don, if i can start off with saying i applaud president biden for taking steps to support the lgbtq community and providing protections and doing away with any type of discrimination that we can do. the important thing to keep in mind, i support the provisions in there, to provide counseling for suicide prevention for youth. in terms of the laws you're referring to, kids bully kids. these laws are meant to allow parents to protect their kids from life-altering decisions that will be better made when they are not minors. and a lot of the states that you mentioned, whether we're talking
about hormone blockers or talking about gender reassignment surgeries, legislators in many of the states want to make sure these decisions are made after the child is a minor. when they are older and better to make such important life-altering decision. >> the kids need the consent of their parents anyway. it seems like they're making laws for no reason. >> alice, i know you. i know you're a decent person. this is indefensible. we just saw this week, where 31 white supremacists were arrested in idaho, wanting to go attack and riot at a pride parade. why a pride parade? because republicans have been preying and using this issue, the anti-lgbtq issue, to spread fearmongering. to promote this idea that gays
want to prey on children and turn them into transgender. it's ridiculous. don lemon can tell you. he was groomed to be straight his entire life. nobody grooms anybody to be gay or to be straight. it comes from nature. it is repulsive to me that republicans are using and manufacturing a culture war in order to drive people to the polls through fear now, they are coming for your children. nobody is coming for your children. >> let myrrh her respond. >> clearly what happened with the gay pride parade in idaho is reprehensible. it should not happen. >> why did it happen, alice? >> people that are filled with hate and specifically against members of the gay community and it's reprehensible. i don't know how much more plainly i can say that. that should not have happened. they need to be held
accountable. >> all of them have been going on this hammering, this anti-lgbtq message now for months. they've been using this. and we've seen this before, alice. we are both republicans. we saw it during the bush campaign in 2004, where it was used as an effective wedge issue to drive people to the polls through fears. it is the exact same playbook. that's why white supremacists are going to a pride parade. we're feeding this into their brains. it has to stop. >> it's wrong to paint the republican party and the republicans in general with the same brush. these people are out-liers and are filled with hate. they are not, quote, maga legislators that are acting indiscriminately and passing the laws. they are representing the parents of their state that have been vocal and clear that the parents want to have a say in
how their children are raised and if their children want to have these surgeries, they can do so -- >> you're bringing up issues that is not mentioned in the things that i discussed. you're focusing on trans issues. we're talking about the lgbtq community as a whole. you're taking a subset and focusing on the laws. parents should have say over what happens to their children. but they have that say anyways. they don't need laws put into place to ensure they have a say. they have. they're the parents of the kids. and the kids can't do it unless the parents say so. these laws are superflous. >> this is being done.
minor children are -- >> what does banning books have to do with it? what does don't say gay bill have to do with trans issues? what is discussing -- not discussing materials of lgbtq issues in public schools. what does that have to do with it? you're talking about something that is extreme and again, is a small part of the lgbtq issues. trans people make up a small part of our population. the laws that would affect small parts of the population. bisexuals, gays, make up more of the population than trans. and these laws are put in place to prohibit a group of people. you come on and focus on a small group of people this is affecting. and parents who have a say in what their kids -- what can and cannot happen to their children. >> don, i'm addressing the laws
that you asked me about. when we're talking about the don't say gay measure in florida, this is something that makes sure that this type of education, this type of literature, this type of curriculum is age-appropriate. i don't think it's appropriate for kindergartners through third graders to be exposed to this type of education. >> they're not, alice. it's not part of the ccurriculu. >> i don't think anyone thinks that. >> i'm from florida. i live in miami. i know lgbtq teachers and are terrified for anyone to find out their identity because they're af afraid of being fired. i know families who are afraid that their children will be marginalized. this is targeting a group for political gain and using them as political pawns. this is not a real problem. it is again another manufactured
culture war for political purposes. and if you are getting your medical advice from ted cruz or ron desantis orand your pediatrician. >> allison? >> i think it is really important to understand, these legislatures aren't making these laws, and imposing this legislation, because they are representing the will of the people. the legislators in florida have heard from the parents across the state, and a lot of times, what we are hearing is that parents are speaking out, they are requesting laws to be changed in their states, and these republican legislators are doing just that. this is what makes this country great, is when we have laws that are passed at the state level, closer to the people, are more representative -- >> come on, alice, targeting a
specific group does not make this right and of these legislators are not responding to their constituents, they are doing this for political gain and they are ignorant. my state legislator in florida went on the floor and said that they could turn -- that being could be a temporary thing but that is the epitome of ignorance. >> we will be right back. i've got to go. only from discover. if you have age-related macular degeneration, there's only so much time before it can lead to blindness. but the areds 2 clinical study showed that a specific nutrient formula can help reduce the risk of dry amd progression. ask your doctor now about an areds 2 supplement.
it's started. somewhere between a cuddle and a struggle, it's...the side hug. tween milestones like this may start at age 9. hpv vaccination - a type of cancer prevention against certain hpv-related cancers, can start then too. for most, hpv clears on its own. but for others, it can cause certain cancers later in life.
and infectious diseases and has been the leading voice inviting the pandemic over the last two years. in a statement, the institute says that fauci, 81 years old, has mild symptoms and has been boosted twice, and he is being treated with the antiviral medication paxlovid. dr. fauci is president biden's chief medical adviser, and we are told that he has not had any close contact with the president, or other senior officials. we will keep you updated on that. the generous extremity released a video showing a man threatened lawmakers one day after congressman gave him the tool a tour of the capital. george, and doug jones are here after this.