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tv   Katherine Schweit Stop the Killing  CSPAN  June 28, 2022 9:39pm-10:42pm EDT

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we are providing lower income students access to affordable internet so homework can just be homework. >> those of you that are here now and online, author of stop the killing how to and the mass
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shooting crisis. this event is hosted by the name iscouncil and my chad riley. former president and current member in the chicago council. a board of established professionals whose job it is to be an ambassador to help raise awareness and nationally and issue critical funds. i'm going to try to give a brief overview. a prosecutor and former fbi special agent and senior executive within the bureau and for live nation entertainment what brought about this book is
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that you were tagged by the fbi to create the active shooter program after sandy hook. so s very excited to be speaking with you. one quickbe housekeeping there will be q-and-a so if you have any questions please open for that period. the book is actually fascinating. others anecdotes and a lot of preconceived notions. we will start off can we talk a little bit about your background inre the fbi, creating the progm and what brought you to ultimately write the book. t >> as an agent when i left the office in chicago and joined the fbi as an agent i was working national security matters but then after the sandy hook
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shooting, agents and agents in thes fbi said you are doing this now and i said okay. so iom guess i'm like maybe thee are some peoplee that are listening to this now. i was tagged with having a joint white house team and then vice president biden's team department of education, health and human services, allr the others. my job was to stop the shootings that were going on and truthfully i think what happened quicklyre. what can law enforcement to do to helphe and we were focused as the only justice department and law enforcement agency on the team thinking about law enforcement and so i spent
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nearlyg five years of the fbi t thinking how can the fbi help law enforcement to do a better job when it comes to preventing or responding or recovering from these kind of situations. but what i learned as i got further along is that there are hundreds of millions of people in the unitedd states and a million law enforcement officers are not going to solve this problem so i think as i go to got tothe end of the career i fe answers would need to come from citizens, civilians and they didn't have the information they needed. they wouldn't have the knowledge to know how to stop the killing and that is what compelled me to write the book. i just answer the same questions over and over again.
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somebody would ask me a question and they were all asking the same questions, so i started out with little post-it notes on my office and said what questions do i need to answer that people just continually ask me. >> there are soo many studies ad so much data. you obviously did a lot on your own and still continue to do that. one thing we started that i didn't expect we got a lot of pushback from the education about is there an increase in shootings and so i felt like for us as a law enforcement agency, we needed to show and prove that there was an increase or disprove it and i felt like that fell on the fbi's shoulders to resolve, so i took a
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tremendously talented group of analysts and agents and we asked local law enforcement to provide their actual police reports from hundreds of shootings and we pushed all thatt information together and released a study, a 14 year study that's available hoonline that he said indeed thy are increasing and so that was kind of the beginning of us realizing. when we started i will tell you i have too many numbers in my head but i will tell you this is a horrible number. when we started the first seven years of the study was from 2000 to 2006. there were six incidences by the
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time i averaged and finished the study, there were 1616 incidenc. by the time i left the fbi there was one incident every eight weeks.s. by the time i left live nation there was one incident every four weeks. right now there's one at least every week. every week there's an incident that dissolves for you statisticianss and analytical people in the exact same methodology when we started back in 2002 looking at the numbers. so we have gone exponentially higher. last year the fbi releases the members every year and when i left the fbi and we did our final studies, there were 17 incidences the highest number any year and the last two or three years there's been 30, 30
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and 40 it's going to be about 50% higher.ay this problem isn't going away. we have to find a way to fix it. we can't manage it. we have to find a way to fix it. >> you bring up something interesting about q the trends. you speak to everyone.
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i do a podcast now with my cohost who's in london and the very first question she tracked me down and said i want to do a podcast with you and i took her no because i didn't have time and she hounded meel and i only tell you that because that is how she would describe it. so she said right away you can solve all these problems if we got rid of the guns in the united states. my job is to work on realistic problem-solving. i'm very familiar with the issues that have to do with the second amendment.ow and how they advanced flow. this issue is, even though there there's plenty of people that want to argue guns and politics, this issue is an apolitical issue.
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guns is an apolitical issue when it comes to mass shootings and one of the reasons i would suggest last year and the year before there were 47,000 firearms staff in the united states. two thirds of those were suicides. if 40 of those were incidences like this, the second amendment and guns are not about mass shootings. it makes up a very small amount of the shootings whether they are by suicide or violence they kill our psyche. that is the terrorism aspect of it. they are so damaging to us and make us afraid to go to school. they make us afraid to let our kids go to the movies and that every times something happens, every time you shooting happens, there's a shooting today at a
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middle school in south carolina, greenville south y carolina, a 12-year-old came to school with a gun and killed a 12-year-old. that is not about whether or not you support or oppose gun control or whether you support licensing or registering guns were not. it's about a 12-year-old getting a gun in their own hands. it's about is it properly secured. i raised two wonderful kids. whether yous support the second amendment it's about not just to the guns, the gun aspect whichn of their is the chapter in the book and i was hesitant because i didn't want people to think it
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was all about guns but i did put the chapter because you need to understand the culture about guns in the united states. you need to understand the history of why we have guns. it isn't all about the guns because in the united states wen have a second amendment that allows guns and if my solution is we are going to get rid of the guns, then it's a nonstarter so that's where i come from it there are so many other things that can be done and when you say it's just this or that, you are not looking at the real solutions i think. >> in the same chapter you said it's more multifaceted but if you're going to use guns were
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certain factors. but actually people that don't have guns at a tackle people, can you talk more about that? >> iathe research we did and the initial research at the fbi, it's one of the reasons why i have these things here and hold them up and one of the reasons you talked about that earlier, look at these publications, fbi, american association of threat assessmentfe professionals, thee are not the things that you have and keep with you and that's why i wanted to reference them in the book because the book has all these different things in it that you just can't find online. when it comes to the staff that came out of it, one of the things i found most fascinating because i did co-authored a
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study with the fbi, the initial study of the fbi i hear good guy with a gun and get rid of guns, people have a lot of opinions. they need to have facts behind the opinions. when i wrote the chapters i wrote them thinking what are the facts that we hear that our wrong or gave you the citations. so after the fbi study, there were 160 incidences that we identified as these exact types of shootings, 160 incidences and 21 off those which i am no mathematician, but myu friends that are what to tell you it is about 13%. so in 21 of the 160 incidences, unarmed civilians successfully stopped the shooter.
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so that's a huge percentage. how many people with guns, one. right now the data doesn't onsupport the concept of carryig a gun, run in and shoot somebody. back then when the sandy hook occurred, so there are a lot more risks involved, but the data does not in any version support that it's wise to carry a gun so you can get into a firefight because there are also in many more situations where people havele been killed becaue
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you don't have -- i spent 20 years trained in law enforcement, and you can't imagine the adrenaline that goes through your body as soon as possible that gun from your holster. so for somebody that hasn't been in that m environment and hasn't trained as much as law enforcement or as much as the fbi, they are going to get etunnel vision right away, and e have seen it happen. >> you referenced a study how mass shootings despite all your efforts and all the work that's been done on bus it's still increasing. one thing that's interesting and you've referenced the violent crime at times are decreasing. so how does that happen? why is one going down and one going up? >> i think to explain the trend now and just drawing on my
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knowledge not o just the statistics, but based on working on this foran so many years, the are certain aspects. we have a lotni more guns in the united states. is that is responsible for the trend is going up? know otherwise we would see more crime going up so it's not that we have more guns. h it's not so much that we have people who are -- the question is what is it so let me answer that question. some of the things i think of when i think why are the trend is going up and why can't we seem to grapple and get our hands on this, i think we live in a world where 50 years ago, we read one newspaper and we knew everyone that lived around us and we knew all the kids that we wereit in class with. our community and our world was so much smaller and now it is so much broader and because it is so much bigger and others social media and a 7,000 channels you can watch on cable tv if you don't want to watch one of the streaming services, and because
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we traverse a lot more, but we'veop stopped doing is paying attention to the people right next to us because 80 to 90% of every shooter in this type of shooting category telegraphs their intent to shoot and generally, 90% of the time they are verbally saying to something. so they are saying this is what is going on. and they are saying it to people and people are not hearing it. and they are not hearing it because of a whole bunch of reasons. they are not part of, sometimes they are not hearing it because they don't wantt to hear it. you don't want to hear that your child is maybe going down the deep end of the tunnel or your boss is violent, and people say all the time and i say this as any law enforcement officer will tell you or any prosecutor that's been in court when you work criminal cases people say he's never done anything like
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thatea before. i don't think that he will do that. you hear that all the time while you are interviewing somebody after somebody's been shot. i can't believe he's done that. he's never done that before. no kidding because if he had, he would be in jail. so i think the logic of it but people want to believe the best in everybody and i want to believe the best in my kids and my family and my neighbors. but maybe people would think differently if they recognize that in these most violent situations, two things. one is people who commit targeted violence like this are on a trajectory so they start with the idea that they might commit to this kind of violence and then they start planning and preparing before the violent act occurs and then the planning and preparation stage we know from research the planning and preparation can take days but
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more likely weeks and often years so during that whole time, the people who see them and are around them, those are the people who can stop this. a million law enforcement agents in the united states, officers and agents and sheriff's deputies in the federal, state, local and tribal enforcement agencies, law enforcement is the last one to know. that is who has to get this message. that's why i do the podcast because if you listen to the details we begin to hear we recognize the other factor i want to tell you about in the trajectory towards violence that is somewhere between depending on how far we look at the research, 35 to 40% of these
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ehhave the same characteristics, the same behaviors of people who commit suicide because their intent is to commit suicide. so, when you think about i should maybe talk to the police or i should call the anonymous tip line about my neighbor because i'm not certain, remember that 35 to 40% of these are suicidal, and if i told you that you should call o the polie or neighbors about a tip because 'you thought somebody was going to commit suicide, you would say i will do that. so we have accepted the idea that even if they don't want us to turn them in or make a call, we have accepted that we would do that to save somebody from committing suicide, yet we don't do it for this and 35 to 40% of these people commit suicide. they go out with an intent. same behaviors. >> a sort of cultural shift.
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.. and i remember reading was, the research coming in from oregon to see it when you want to track how. valuable source for you know i can evolve, call it in. that's all we're asking to do. because we don't know.
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in this case, 58% of the people who called in, they're coming in 50% of people calling in something that really had to do with bullying. a small number of people call in about violence. actually in the first year of this research in oregon they had 1000 tips, 58% were of bullying and unkind conduct. that conduct goes saying mean words come into being mean, much of bullying. that kind of conduct we know people who commit this type of mass violence targeted violence that is so horrificne and terrifies our whole neighborhood that have these people havee some kind of bat wing of the criminal charges but it is going to be something like bullying, being bullied because they bully back. people have these ideas of who they think a shooter is and
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they are all wrong. i think that's when things i i try to address in the book. you are lookingng in the wrong direction. >> you really kind of touched on it. the myths of the shooter broke out. the minty question i can manage the book with out, what is a mask shooter? try when the kids you just described is his dad upstairs. it is his dad upstairs watching television entry comes home fromld work. thirty-five years old is the average age of a mask shooter like this. thirty-two years the mean. half of the shootings in current places of business. only a quarter and current educational environments. the places of business are
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places that are not just packing houses and the but day salons and postal offices. all of a these other facilities where people go to work every day to get disgruntled in the industry we call them the grievance collectors. i always say it's like if you were of backpacking option you get mad at somebody. the rock in your backpack. these guys are filling their backpacks out. and i say guys because that is the only demographic that so far the only demographic that works. we look at the demographic the fbi research over 20 years i cannot give you the exact number i don't remember there are so many some shooters for over years, 13 werekn women. we know almost all of these
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are mail. some debt with a spouse. generally there shooting their places of employment for the former places of employment. think about the grievances you have when you talkut about people who are disgruntled employees. when we did w the research might analysts were so not happy with me when i told them what should you divide the business shootings into two there likely businesses we can't sit you can your brilliance. divide them into places the public c circulates think about a grocery store the place of business. public transit for the for a
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law office when we divided those numbers it was like a light came on the look of the research. it was worth me asking them to do that. the value was itho showed us when the shooters, when the shooting occurs most every time it is a person and is an employee or recently was employed in the case of the fbi research there were five people fired that day or the day before. so hr people, how can we stop a shooting if you do not have a policy in place to help a person leave his employment or
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her employment guys picking up the rock and put his backpack and picks up thes rock up with that in his backpack as it is just cara gets a gun it comes back. we have seen that happen many times, too many times. taken off-line they give them help to find another job. give them a couple extra weeks of w pay. the average cost of the worker's comp. in this kind of situation is $500,000 for one shooting situation. per person this is a very expensive costly endeavor front dollar standpoint for businesses. since most of these shootings occurred in businesses and they are incredibly expensive from a business standpoint some instances some estimates
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i have read the third ofhe the employees leave a place of employment after shooting like this. think about it some time and effort intot' it for quick south pointe hr department simply let people go to quick, abrupt, cold. that was my position can and what we continue to see shootings we continue to increase. premise should not have the post of who our neighbors are we look the other way. i was a supervisor see something say some became our mantra nets for a few year
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else will call you are wrong. when you think maybe i will call tomorrow you are wrong. you should call right now and get it off of your shoulders and let the professionals handle it. because we did not have years ago we did not have anonymous to point everywhere and now we h do. we have phone calls, text messages, see something say something is on the east coast, colorado pioneered it after columbine. stopin anything anymore kids can text in the tip and they do. the biggest, largest number of anonymous tips that come in
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are between 4:00 p.m. and midnight when kids are home fromm school. 4:00 p.m. and midnight pre-that's not just about school shootings but when people are really active online. they're seeing pictures they're hearingng set. >> to my segue into the next question. >> it's like a set up for something i didn't i didn't. >> a lot of space in the book to this. something we talked about, why increase in shooting? then last two or three decades there is an increase in media and the way we consume it. online is constant 24/70 cycles per social media texting constantly need information. it has become packaged almost entertainment in some ways. you talk about the contagion effects ready for a stop talking one should answer the question. the cult in your book that sums it up very nicely.
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ithe puts killers in the spotlight and puts promise to those on the edge of committing mass violence. talk a bit about the contagion factor in how that's driving things. >> started during the research not surprisingly it takes a longf time to write a book that's on fact-based lots of studies and research in it. and work on the book i didn't think about the contagion effect. even when i started there so few werere shootings by the time i finish there so many more. digging and some research and found out there's a research project on they decided to look at three and half years
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old. she shootings covered them language. the public could be discovered.
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% earlier this validated. so here media conspiracy. speaking of agent. stop giving, telling the h shooter or find way.
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talk digital response time click. this organization. with media that is exactly that. they don't edit the paper in works for newspaper in the world. that is. one of the unique, we have one test off time. which of the picture of the frontnl page once on the trail. in certain the record with
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these issues. i think you days, documentary features f on shooters legacy income which is what will hopefully be the ones that are talking to others they are aware of this themselves research that is done. i was. in the basement of a the store. therep was mechanistic priests
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with 50s and 60s. leave. which. the same with child. the lease this covers it.
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story. you told shooter, and started collecting some previous chart so we will work.
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$16million will because people who come to call. we want to be part of the starting podcast flooding.
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his part. the right. so people.
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i will. his motion, alaska.
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this is a very basic human something fight or flight 100 eothey think might render the most important things. not a loth of people fight people spent middle school students office
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ways to teach program, he told his shot. you can find almost think
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shooting is for future in the student students, since teachers. passionate.
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work is. people one of those things already. these are things like financial you have mental mental health issues, not mental diagnosis it is not a diagnosis of the radios mental stressors, personal problems problems at work or biggest factors that we do all the time her shooter research they come every person at least
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three of these thrusters they were dealing with on the duties look for people who are people help you be a grievance collector rocks in their backpack legitimate grievances. i am mad at you because you just might spot right i was just parking and didn't know you were looking for that parking spot. the guys putting iraq to get too. you don't get promoted you go home and complain about and have your friends. the other doesn't get gone and comes back in. the people you are around to people around are the ones who are to say things. the listen.
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spend up. the 700. he has? preppie. what is the information for you to cover your 1001.
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listen, school threat assessment team, the way the information. the information. call me. the other piece of the d puzzle. no puzzle pieces, you. even though you want to be. it is okay to call for a law enforcement efforts on the door to rest because; tenant is acting kinky work that way. jonah decreases culture feeling free d and open another breakdown theho barriers. former attorney and survey
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legall technology space let me think about arena. the touch. tran one me think about state privacy laws, federal privacy laws, f hipaa, education, privacy laws ever status privacy laws. to stay this way to protect him to provide information to somebody from pharmacy by privacy rights. the safest way to do that is room for something to employees. along those laws. there is a link from one person based on what they received could be a threat to
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life privacy goes out the window. i'm going to go through door because i was there as an fbi agent have you seen me than estimate by the nurse you killed. school or business really implement an i important system that's incredibly effective and everyone spot in. everything that happens not quite therere yet? >> good question. here is what i would say since columbine there's no question to telling colorado has stepped up under the center of attention how to do that. it's safe to tell its anonymous reporting system. there are anonymous reporting systems all of the y states now the volunteer placement friend of mine runs something they
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something about thisti reporting system that's what i efforts that have been after for instance the whole state of pennsylvania sign off that brings work and study i was reading is because that creates a plane that was h for the validity of it. there are two plans available all of the united states. i'm in chicago another's phone number you can call that i don't have it memorized and that is a phone number you can call parental status under l stateup custom you just have to look them up. i will display this is the backup category every single person can call the bering tickling and talk to the person or fill out something online and get that information i can tell not a perfect system. there are also important.
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but if you tip line because you were in connecticut heard about some things about picture your cousin posted on facebook what number, making some of your very good about something you will. the past informational call local law enforcement all the time. color is a great job with forefront ofhi teaching kids fence and simply not scaring any kids at heart : it is way ahead of them because they have suffered so many shootings in the area and they are in such a concentrated area. tons of questions to talk to for hours giving him ten -- 15 minutes what will the questions from anyone in the room online.
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you have a question online general public advice you give parents comes to discussing this subject with their kids? time of the great question, fix i question have been asked bocanegra my niece who is the count to three kids going to elementary school shooting recently in oxford, michigan detroit town she called me in his lecture legs because the school and talk to the kids? that's a great question parent has to the answer too. the answers are first of all you should know what your school's policies are. and you should ask the kids? you shouldd talk to the kids want you underscore policies are you should not be afraid to ask because with the
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policies are unhealthy and no emergency response. you may have ath planning case is a shooting at the school? what is confidence what your kids might face. then something about him most kids in school i hear people say all the time i talked scary. well, go talk to a fifth grader school shootings. they do. don'tol pretend that i'm dollars in middle school teacher she sent me once my answer this very question she said you tell parents temperature neuroses on i k your kid review are frantic, your kid is not afraid of it. just give them the information that they need. so every teacher is trained to teach at the level of the child's age. i think parents come thorough knowledge shortly do not realize as they raise a child as they raise our own children they know how to talk to them in an age-appropriate way.
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you talked your kids an age-appropriate way just like you teach them not to run downstairs not to run the street. as a potential school should which might never happen in your school more frightening than some of it gets run over because they run into the street? you know how dangerous, right? you teach a child of drugs in the street. but you're afraid afraid of shooting clec talk too your kids about stinky at school. talking to them about stranger danger and hope. you are talking to them about kids you're worried about somebody picking up your kid with her at the bus stop. those are equally frightening subjects but as a parent you do talk to your kids. just like the conversation and hear what they say. that is what i thinkt most often i feel like a parent listens, asks a couple of open ended questions listens to what their kids say you will know how much they know. most schools almost all
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schools are running essentially active shooter drills right nowng for you to not know your kids are doing for an active shooter drunk you are the one who is behind it is not really -- mugginess apparently kids are aware of in colorado i've been in color in the act of shooting to the second graders the kids are very matter-of-fact about. which is great. they'll think of it this is going happen all the time and i'm afraid for the think of it as like a charm drill, fire drill it is just one more thing we have to payay attention to what the teacher goes for the teacher tells him to be quite they have to be quiet. any questions? >> from mine bruce has c a common and then a question for many thoughts on active shooters. treatment fort the individual is one of theha many demographics of people
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concerned about someone who feels they are involuntary development that were there at peopletrike out you have to look up all the details on them. i was bruce thanks for that question, and cells are circulating somebody who could have committed this type of crime. but i do not think we would categorize it by what their motivation was as much as we think about what we can do to prevent it. motivation a lot of times i get tripped up what is motivation and shooting? we will cite is just this kind of person you exclude everybody else. that was about going to think anybody else. it's only a boys blank videogames in his basement, 7% teenagers united states play video games. that is not a good predictor of who is going commit a crime, right?
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someone who might be involved in some other particular group that may be more antisocial or more politically motivated that maybe the motivation for why they do it. there's still going to commit the same planning and preparation that is predictable that we can look for. they're going to make the same leakage by going to hear the same leakage were going to seeti the same planning and preparation. they do things like they stopped taking the medication. they give their possessions away and that is very common they get their away they change their appearance because nobody when their intent is thinking want to be a mess shooter. they are the kid with a nice haircut in the tennis shoe. they said they want to be a mask shooter they have to reinvent themselves you seen pictures of people with a black shirt on holding guns take in the picture holdingdi the gun on the bathroom taking
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a picture of themselves look really cool because i want to make a person out of themselves. look for the behaviors and how someone is changing their behavior to initiate those guns. use the search shooting guns and stockpiling ammunition and a way is atypical for you that is reportable. that is what we are looking for atypical behavior. i get the idea that something might have a political ideology or something like that, that does not politics for your political opinion is not actionable. what you believe about things is the essence of the first amendment. you arelo allowed to do that we were not allowed to plan and prepare and commit violence. that is what we're looking for iss a planning and preparation that is a people can report as p a planning preparation. motivation is much larger problem is people playing
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video games to change the videogame industry. chart 1 tons of research that it's not democrats. there's tons of it against people want to blame something there's just as many of you have anything to violence people are out there playing. >> thank you very much for being here. the book is stop the killing message shooting crisis. thank you for coming thank you for being here. july my pleasure impression the opportunity. john would be up-to-date on the latest in publishing with book tvs podcasts about bugs. with current nonfiction book releases plus bestseller list as well as industry news and trends is about our free mobile were ever your podcast.
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joint "washington journal" for special six parts sears on landmark legislation. large piece of legislation helped shape today's america from who we get around, educate our kids, pay for healthcare, however median and welcome new citizens of the country event will feature stories and experts discussing the bill speaking local 1960. what landmark legislation on "washington journal" line nine eastern sunday morning on c-span or on c-span now our free mobile app. they're little place it political information. only at c-span do you get it straight from the source.
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c-span is america's network unfiltered unbiased word for word it happens here or here, or here, powered by cable. joe and tonight i am very excited to welcome elizabeth williamson celebrating the release of sandy hook an american tragedy in the battle for truth. this is a work of the humane investigation of the tragedies that follow tragedy. in reality do not acknowledge the truth. trying to change in their tiers of that actuallyth occurred in further pain who already experience too much. it also examines misinformation and conspiracy theories the people who promote


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