our podcast on our free c-span now app. [inaudible conversations] order >> in a nation divided a rare moment of unity, this fall c-span presents cease fire. the shouting stops in the conversation begins in that time of partisan fighting prevails one table, two leaders, one goal to find common ground. this fall, cease fire at the network that does not take sides. only on c-span. ♪ >> next, education secretary linda mcmahon testifies before the house education committee on her department's priorities, topics and close returning education to the states.

grants for workforce programs, what is considered gei in education and anti-semitism on college campuses. [background noises] >> the committee will please come to order. quorum is present. pursuant to notice the interment recess the committee at any point. before we would move any further i would like to give a warm welcome to representative. i hope i have pronounced that accurately. welcome to the committee. ranking member scott, you are recognized to welcome the representative at this time. >> can we check that pronunciation saying question.

>> thank you. >> we welcome her to the committee. she is replacing. she brings diverse perspective to our work her leadership as a vice and mayor of phoenix and freshman class president in this congress is a tremendous asset to this committee i look forward to working with her and a welcoming her to the committee. thank you, mr. chairman i yield back. >> i think the gentleman paid without objection representative will be added to the subcommittee on higher education and workforce development and that subcommittee on early childhood elementary and secondary education. i would like to recognize for one minute to make a brief statement as you embark on this fabulous committee. >> thank you so much chair wahlberg and ranking member scott it's an honor to be

appointed to this committee especially as a freshman member i know i have very cute shoes to fill. what's a titan for strong public schools and labor protections. our home state of arizona has been ranked as one of the worst schools for public education for years that the direct result of extreme cuts been resulting in some of the lowest teacher pay and the entire united states. we are also a right to work a state the legislature has continuously gone after workers rights and reacted from seat safety rules and the hottest estate in the country. i am so grateful arizona will continue to have representation on this committee i am really proud to fill that role. i look forward to work with each of you to make a public school stronger and at workplace is safer. thank you. >> thank you and again welcome to this committee. now it will turn to the oversight hearing portion of today's meeting. good morning, it's a pleasure to

welcome secretary linda mcmahon. for the first to the committee on education and workforce, we do not want to be your last necessarily. madam secretary thank you for being here present your sworn in on march 3, he admitted her mission to address the glaring problems you inherited from your predecessor and begin to the process of rightsizing the department of education so we can return education to the states. i want to address each of these core parts of your mission intern. first the glaring problem at k-12 level. less than one third of eighth-graders in america can't read or do math at grade level. to put that into perspective with the nation's report card for an actual report card, one 100% improvement on the next iteration of the test would still leave us with a failing grade. unfortunately too many and our education system are more

invested in protecting their monopoly power over kids futures or indoctrinating students into left-wing ideology then teaching them basic skills, developing their critical thinking and expanding their educational choices. at the post secondary level at your predecessor usability of taxpayer for funds to pursue a legal student loan schemes meant to shift responsibilities for student loan debt from the individuals who took it on, to taxpayers who paid off their debt or never went to college in the first place. in addition, the biden/harris administration ignored the congressional mandate for student loan repayments to resume. brick and student loans assistant creating chaos for borrowers. all the while democrats have but let secondary education industry continue bilking students, their families while in many cases delivering a product that leaves students worse off than if they

had never attended college at all. at all levels your predecessor recognized the office for civil rights to inflict dangerous and radical ideologies on students and their families by simultaneously taking a hands off approach to the exploding crisis of anti-semitism internation schools and colleges. i've been heartened to see your aggressive actions to protect that dignity, safety and academic and athletic opportunities of women and girls from a radical gender ideology that ignores basic biology. i've also been heartened by your desire to bring to light discriminatory gei practices in our schools that dehumanize people. i've been especially happy to see your department's response to the indifference to many education leaders. continue to show in the face of ongoing threats to jewish

students. second, i applaud you for embracing the final mission for the department of education i imagine will have a vigorous debate about this today because republican democrat parties have competing visions of education in this country. and that is how it is. if there is that you, madam secretary was fine, really the implication is the status quo is more than fine. the minority wants us to believe the department of education is overseeing an education system in which students are thriving and employers have access to a workforce prepared to succeed. neither of these are true. as i mentioned earlier k-12 education performance is abysmal. postsecondary level with national six-year graduation rate is just over 60%. in other words our colleges and universities would get an f on their primary responsibility.

the college for all mentality driven by the previous administration student loan schemes have only made the problem worse. our education system has failed to prepare a workforce with the skills employers need. again, this is what democrats are defending. republicans believe there's a better way could we believe in reducing bureaucracy, trusting our educators. trusting her state and local leaders and trusting the innovators who are pushing against the barriers thrown up by the bureaucracy. and above all we trust her parents. this is our vision and thankfully we finally have it administration in place that shares this vision. the trump administration is eliminating bureaucracy or it is not needed. it is also implementing federal guardrails when needed like enforcing title ix to protect the rights of women and girls

protecting access to education for students disabilities, holding colleges and universities accountable for tolerating mass harassment of jewish students while preventing efforts to exclude parents from their children's education. in these ways the trump administration is streamlining bureaucracy so that the federal government can better deliver on the responsibilities it has. madam secretary, again thank you for being here. i look forward to hearing more about your plans to continue cleaning up the mess you have inherited and your vision for an education system that puts students, not bureaucrats first. i will now yield to the ranking member representative scott for his opening statement. >> thank you mr. german and good morning. i want to thank secretary mcmahon for joining us today to discuss the priorities and the effect the budget will have on teachers and families.

secretary mcmahon, the secretary of education took an oath to oversee formal education uphold the constitution. one of the missions of the department of education is to quote strengthen the federal commitment to ensuring access to equal education opportunities for every individual. i take no pleasure in pointing out in the month since his administration's taken office human sworn in as the department secretary. the actions taken by you, the unaccountable doge and this administration generally have contradicted this mission. some of the things that have happened nearly 50% of the departments workforce have been proposed to be fired in eliminating key holes that keep our nation running in her students safe. universities have been stripped of necessary grant funding undermine the integrity of higher education, support for student loan borrowers has been reduced rate key consumer

protections have been threatened department of education is being dismantled for the elimination of programs and officers without congressional approval. thankfully on may 22 a federal judge issued literary injunction order the department to reinstate previously terminated employees. during today's hearing i expect you to share with us specifically what steps you are taking to comply with a court order. relatedly we understand the department has repeatedly delayed and denied the department office of inspector general access requested documents and information. the staff to conduct a review related to the departments recent workforce program and operational changes. yesterday i sent you a letter urging her to cooperate with the oig in accordance with the law. is my hope because you spoken to numerous news organizations about your plans to dismantle the department you will feel comfortable sharing your plans

with congress and the omg. for millions of americans we are struggling to understand how the actions you have taken at the department to address learning gaps and improve learning outcomes for the nation's children. simply put if all of these these positions are being vacated, resources are being cut for the sake of efficiency then who is doing the work to ensure the mission of the department to strengthen the federal commitment to ensuring access to equal educational opportunities for every individual is being met? for example another mission in the department is to promote improvements in the quality and usefulness of education through federally research, evaluation and sharing of information. this administration the institute of educational sciences from funding and that organization supports research and collects data on education across the country to improve

academic outcome. congress uses this research to determine how it can save money and ensure resources are allocated only to effective programs. you altered research in the middle of their projects, much of their work is now useless to congress. that's the very definition of creating waste. also the departments advocate its responsibility to ensure all students are afforded safe quality and equitable education regardless of their race, gender, immigration status. and disability status. the office of civil rights is a radical reinterpretation of her civil rights laws that abandons the long-standing duties to investigate, monitor and provide resources to victims of potential civil rights violations. as a result students and parents with open civil rights cases are

now left with no recourse and no insight as to the status of their cases. we receive valuable programs such as teacher quality partnerships, reporting effective educator development. mental health grants which are supported through the bipartisan safer communities act. cancel with no notice to the states in the nation's public schools but furthermore states are being denied reimbursement for cocoa19 related expenditures the department of education has promised to pay. if this is in addition to the proposals for the department fiscal year 2026 budget to eliminate programs gear up and trio which provide support for low income students and students with disabilities to obtain high school diplomas and prepare them for post secondary education. there's also the matter of many red states calling for education block grants. a progressive and illegal proposal that make it virtually

impossible for the federal government to hold states accountable for providing all students with high quality education free from discrimination. and yet the department budget proposal request congress grant legal authority to block grants several programs a clear acknowledgment that you currently elect this authority. we expect to hear from you today that you will denied the state's request to block grant without direct congressional authority. more importantly, who want to hear how you hold states accountable withholding student civil rights. i would be remiss if i did not note the year 2026 budget proposal would make it more difficult for students to enroll in and afford a college education by proposing reductions in funding to meet those grants. this is achieved by removing staff to oversee student aid

administration and oversight forcing borrowers to unaffordable replacement plans and garnishing wages of low income borrowers. additionally the budget proposals reducing workforce development programs by 33%. some between the cuts to higher education the budget proposal rather than competing in the global economy suits with low income families and students with disabilities english learners, international students and students of color will face more hurdles in eliminating those burdens is the very mission of the department of education.

was vital educational based programs. the officers of the department as a means of attack a programs promoting equity occlusion the success will come only if you adhere to the mission execute the laws and uphold your oath to the constitution. regrettably does not signal a path of success for america students and families. call on the other side of the aisle to critically review the proposal and reject it. democrats will not sit idly by while students are under attack we will fight any and all attempts to dismantle the department but will continue to stand up for students, parents and families who are struggling. madam secretary thank you for appearing today we hope to get concrete and substantive answers

for you. with that mr. chairman i yield back the balance of my time. correct i think the gentleman pursuant to 8c which to insert written statement into the record may do so by submitting them and microsoft word format by 5:00 p.m. 14 days after this hearing without objection the hearing record will remain open for 14 days to allow such statements and other extraneous material noted during the hearing to be submitted for the official hearing record. i'll not turn to the introduction of today's witness the honorable linda mcmahon secretary of the u.s. department of education. madam secretary we thank you for being here today. as you are aware it is your responsibility to provide accurate information to the committee pursuant to committee rule i would ask that you submit your oral presentation to a five minute summary of your written

statement. madam secretary you are recognize her testimony, welcome. cooks make sure the microphone is on. >> that helps you hear me, right? good morning chairman wahlberg, ranking member scott, and distinguished members of the committee. thank you for having me today to represent the goal i share with my boss, president trump, to responsibly limit federal bureaucracy and give education back to states, parents and educators with your partnership fiscal year 26 budget will take a significant step towards that goal. we shrink federal bureaucracy to save taxpayer money and empower states who best know their local needs to manage their education in this country. we have reviewed our programs identified as spending that does not fulfill the mandate of trust

the american people have placed in president trump. we have cut old contracts that were enriching private parties at taxpayer expense. suspended grants for illegal dei programs, and now putting forward a responsible budget request that reduces department funding by more than 15%. at the same time we work to make education great again and our conversation with governors, teachers and parents across the country we hear calls for accountability and more local control. that is our goal. give parents access to quality education the kids deserve to fix that higher education industry that's a missed lead students into degrees that do not pay off and to create safe learning environment. we are holding institutions to an account they discriminatory or hostile environments on campus. the level playing field with limitless opportunity i think is

the vision we can all share. our budget reflects this vision. it cuts reflected the bureaucracy that's getting out of the way in its continuation and increase represent smart spending that will help improve student achievement. not serve bureaucratic interests. our goal is clear. make education better, fairer and more accountable by ending federal overreach and empowering families, schools and states who best know the needs of their students. i am eager to partner with you to make this vision of the future a reality and ensure that every child is part of it. thank you and i look forward to your questions. >> thank you madam secretary. under committee rule nine, at willwithout question secretary mcmahon under the five minute rule i will recognize myself for five minutes.

last month, madam secretary of e house passed hr-1, the one big beautiful bill that will promote extent president trump's text, provide relief for hard-working families and jumpstart our economy. importantly as a result of the hard work of this committee the bill also represents the largest reform to how we fund higher education in decades. with this bill now in the senate, what does the administration see as the three most important higher education policies included in this legislation? >> well, i think one of the things that we really need to look at under hr-1 is i don't think-it's out of the question that we should it expects our colleges and universities to have a little skin in the game

relative to the loans that are made. when these colleges and universities set their fees of attendance and et cetera the students applying for those loans are expecting to get a return on that investment and the parents backing them. now if the degrees these the studentsget or they drop oul or of the performance is not is as expected these loans are unpaid they become the burden of all taxpayers. it is not the loans are forgiven or they go away, they are just shouldered by others. i believe for colleges and universities have a little skin in the game and pay part of that loan or they'll take a look at what their costs are as looking at education across the board. i think we also ought to look at or simplification of the student loan program system to discourage institutions from raising tuition costs. just because they know the federal government will make the loan.

i think that's a little bit to what i said in the first part of having some skin in the game. and then we had bold performs that will allow students to access pell grants to pursue high quality short-term training. as you mentioned in your opening remarks mr. chairman, we talked about our workforce shortage. with 8 million openings and we are not training our skilled workforce to fulfill these openings. >> key points of our bill. secretary mcmahon, since the attack on israel october 7, anti-semitism has raised its horrific head all across this country. especially on many of our prestigious college campuses. they continue, sadly to this very day. the past administration had a lot of resolutions put forward but toothless efforts to inhibit

those types of things taking place under the guise of the first amendment liberties and free speech, which they orange. thankfully your approach is been completely different since you took office. can you talk about your department strategy for holding colleges accountable for their unwillingness to tackle anti-semitism on campuses? >> one of president trump's campaign promises was he was not going to tolerate anti-semitism attacks on college campuses and universities. he is clearly fulfilling that promise. he first took a look at columbia university because they have been covered very thoroughly by the media. when you see students and barricaded and a library or other students on the outside pounding on glass walls yelling death to israel, death to usa, we know that's not a safe environment for students. i've spoken to jewish students who have attended some elite

universities that do allow anti-semitic attacks who i have been told they are afraid we cannot allow students is on campuses so we've held back funding from columbia we've also done the same thing with harvard. but these are title vi violations. these are not first amendment violations. we have gone under this for title vi of withheld funding and ask as columbia has done, to come to the table for negotiations. we've also asked harvard their answer was a lawsuit. so we are approaching and investigating probably about 60 other universities for civil rights violations. >> thank you. a few seconds remaining what excites you most about returning education power and authority to the states? >> i believe the best education is that closest to the child. as is the president for those in the ground working with children every day, our governors, superintendents, teachers, those the ones who can make the best

decision for education for our children. >> thank you i yield back i know it recognize the gentleman from connecticut mr. courtney pickwick thank you, mr. chairman. secretary mcmahon, and your in r opening remarks you focused on that need forgiving parents and families the choice in terms of their children's education. and sure enough in your skinny budget, the line item for charter schools was lost up. which is consistent with those remarks. however we zeroed out magnet schools in the skinny budget. we both come from connecticut. u.s. news & world report at their annual ranking of high schools in the state of connecticut number one high school in the state of connecticut is out magnet school at east hartford. the number three high school in terms of quality in the state of connecticut is the marine

science magnet school in connecticut which of the honor of representing. there is not a charter school in the top 50. and again, my question is not really about whether charter schools performer don't perform. but what your budget does it undercuts parental choice because magnet schools are choice driven programs. i can say that personally because my daughter attended a magnet school. it was an excellent educational experience. she zeroed out that account which is completely undercuts and contradicts the hype in your opening statement about supporting parental choice. why wouldn't shoot support magnet schools? >> i do support magnet schools. as we both know, in connecticut i'll speak to magnet schools. but also in connecticut there is been the lowest growth in charter schools i think were like fifth from the bottom in the country for allowing more

charter schools >> white zero out magnet's question. >> and magnet schools are as charter schools are public schools. so the public schools funding i think as the states have more control over their state budget they can allocate those dollars to magnet schools. i think of magnet schools are great and a lot of them do focus on particular pickwick site wish to reclaim my time. >> talk is cheap budget is what counts for this budget does not save magnet schools are great. i have another question for boxy references skinny about budget but we know the full budget she might take another look at that. exit says zero. >> in a way i want to move on to the perkins program which again is very important in the state of connecticut. i was in a graduation ceremony on wednesday and brought 170 high schoolers were given job offers by shipyard because of perkins grant funded programs both in text schools encumbrance of high schools in welding, metal trades.

the hype again from this administration's are going to support trade schools. but looking at your budget it's a zero increase in the perkins line item. which i guess could have been worse. you could have cut it in terms of the program. in terms of meeting job openings that you mention your opening mr opening remarks we have huge job openings in southeastern connecticut for this budget does not match the rhetoric in terms of trade schools or the trades. what i want to ask you, we are trying to figure out which one interaction between job training programs with the department of labor and perkins grant programs. you tell me again whether or not it is your intention to use move the office of technical and adult education to the department of labor? >> thank you for that question. representative, i can tell you one of the executive orders from the president was that the

commerce department, the department of labor and department of education should coordinate and look at workforce programs. there were over 43 different workforce develop programs across all the agencies. it certainly inefficient in operation i've had many discussions with commerce. i've had many discussions with the secretary of labor and i do think there are opportunities to move some of those programs. >> in your discussions i hope you would notice in the statute offices in the department of education. perkins was enacted after the department of education was created. in the department of education going to be watching very closely in terms of whether or not there's a move made that violates that law. i would also note enclosing the adult education line item was zeroed out. it is just stunning. this is a program that allows adult learners to get a second chance in life because some people who do not complete high school on time. and also immigrants who again went to skip the literacy skills

so they can get naturalized as citizens are speaking as an adult i was invited to speak with an adult graduation ceremony in vernon friday night. again it's pretty sad to be able to bring news from washington the secretary of education does not support adult education. with that i yield back perk i think they just when i recognize the chairman emeritus the gentle lady from north carolina. >> thank you very much mr. chairman. thank you madam secretary for being here and being willing to take on the challenges that you are taking on with the department. madam secretary they are created by commerce in 1980 to help middle and upper income families access additional funds they might need to make tuition payments for their undergraduate children it was never intended to be the predominant source of funding for college. since the limits on how much tobe borrowed were a limited and the early 19 '90s it's the

funding of first resort for too many american families including those who have no ability to repay large loan amounts the government makes available indeed the former president ceo the marshall college fund call them a ticking time bomb. politico called it the government predatory lending program in the georgetown law center of poverty and equality said the program imposes serious risk including crushing unrepairable debt. two black families in particular. plus loans too often have the ability to be debilitating and noted by senior vice president of the united negro college fund. recognizing this the students with taxpayer protection plan was included in the one big beautiful bill and is awaiting action in the senate, establish the lifetime cap of $50000 to protect families from over borrowing under the parent plus program pay they couple this with additional borrowing

flexibility through lower interest stafford loans but what is a ministrations view of the need to put limits on how much parents can borrow under the federal loan programs like parent plus? >> we do support the limitations because what we have seen, i mean you know better than anyone, congresswoman $1.7 trillion in student loan debt is unacceptable and unsustainable in our country. on colleges and universities absolutely set the limit on loans of attendance the government will loan that amount. that is just leading to more and more debt. we have to put some caps. we have to put things in place and i applaud the many efforts you'd have undertaken to reduce the cost of college. >> thank you very much. madam secretary, each of the federal government provides over 100 billion in grants and loans

to the federal financial aid program without it any accountability as to whether these dollars leave students better off. these studies show one third of students are enrolled in programs have a negative return on investment those students leave financially worse off than if they had never enrolled in college of the first place. in your view, is it necessary congress address the lack of accountability and post secondary education? >> yes you know, i do think it as i mentioned a little earlier, i do think that colleges and universities should have some skin in the game for programs they are offering that cannot possibly be repaid. but one thing that i think is very important if i may come as i think there should be more education for parents and students in advance of borrowing. one of the things we are undertaking is it's not in place yet. we are looking at it is in that

fast for application of having information that says you are borrowing this much money you want to attend ex- university xs is the amount of money you could earn with having this degree. take a look at universities across the country with the mean amount is to take that it's that university want to go to is you go to another one? because now you can see exactly what kind of jeopardy if you will or what kind of debt you are going to owe and be able to repay and i think that's really important to pray. >> i agree completely with you. madam secretary, one more question part universities are increasingly concerned with gridand cultures of inclusion ad belonging. in recent years we've seen these institutions turn the other way when jewish students are excluded or subjected to tests about israel. in your opinion what message does it send to jewish and israeli students and faculty on

college campuses and universities entertain calls boycott to divest from israel what's the department of education doing to rein in the damage it causes in higher education? we have certainly taken universities to task alright oft for the programs with columbia that you have seen of stopping their funding for in a billion dollars. right now, other departments or agencies we have cut harvard by two-point to billion dollars in additional foreign and 50 million i think is the correct number. we are putting teeth behind the title vi violations. before i think representatives scott is his talk is cheap we put teeth in these efforts. >> thank you madam secretary think it mr. chairman could i yield back to going to think that gently announced record the gentle lady from new orleans.

>> thank you secretary mcmahon, family 13 during her confirmation hearing senator murray asked you if confirmed if you commit to getting every dollar invested in our students in out to them? you replied the appropriated dollars and those monies that are passed by congress, yes. senator also brooks asked if you would support any directive from the president to freeze funds are provided by congress you responded if inappropriate by congress those funds should be disseminated. yet you stood by as elon musk department of efficiency it froze or terminated within a billion dollars in and congressionally directed federal grants to the department of education. you've made no attempts to reinstate those funds. secretary mcmahon, viewed not being truthful when you testified in the senate? and if you were being truthful what's your plan to immediately reinstate these? >> thank you for that question and i would like to maybe go a

little for that with exactly which grant you're talking about. >> the $1 billion and congressionally directed federal grants that have been cut for. >> as i said, i like to work with you to understand exactly which grant you are talking about. i can also part of the testimony. >> madam section reclaiming my time because the question is congressionally directed funds have been cut what are you doing to reinstate those funds? >> also said in that testimony we would abide by the lot that's exactly what it will do regrettably to reinstate the funds. and i know you have this so-called simplified funding program that consolidates programs including title for a wish i knew the probation letter for. overall the consolidation leads to $4.5 billion cut. that makes your statement on truth if you're not doing anything to restore that. can you name one of the major categories entitled for a work

cuts will lead to a well-rounded education a world-class education? >> let me respond to one other thing asked before. wechat about the cuts of $4.5 billion, along with that cut goes a great reduction in the cost of a regulatory compliance too. >> madam secretary to reclaim my family to answer the question about which category will lead to world-class education programs are only going to answer your question but it's also important for this committee for taxpayers who understand we cut red tape for orregulation provokes i understd madam secretary reclaim my time in answering my question for him trying to answer your question. >> secretary of education at yourjob is to faithfully execute law. if you cannot do that you should not be in this job. i have another question for you but since you been in office if i later stage or intention to violate several major federal laws that have been enacted by congress. one of them i want to talk about its education science reform act. that is what i will focus on

congressman acted more than 20 years ago created the institute of education sciences. it provides evidence-based data to improve student outcomes and support teachers. the trump administration unilaterally canceled more than $900 billion in ief grant funding and reduced ief staff from 175 to fewer than 20 employees the reduction of about 90%. so secretary mcmahon what statute authorizes you to unilaterally dismantle an office that congress created? >> what we have done to the benefit of those grants is to first of all, let me say there's a lot of contracts that are done. none of those contracted services have been affected. and also, the part of the funding you are talking about in the nay program is already in place for the next five years. however we didn't really negotiate that contract five under $40 billion. >> you fewer than 20 employees

is what you're saying question. >> we are doing it because we are able to continue doing what we do because the contracted services which are still in place have not been affected because it's hard to believe you can meet the statutory obligations without money or adequate staff what did the show's scores show? >> a bigger part in question. >> what did the scores show when it's aggravated by income? >> i don't understand. >> usually look at the score is. what they say it, you and the charm a lot of members of this committee talk about education is doing. but we really need to look at is low income students. >> are to my performance and achievement gaps i get it now. the score is continually show what we all know to be true. i've looked at it with my state, connecticut is when the first things that got me into government. i look at the achievement gap that's what i wanted to make sure we were servicing. >> of my time expires madam secretary with the show is we need to have investments held by

low income students exceed your cutting those investments. iran for congress because i wanted to make public education better. but not just for a few not just those worthy of private dollars and not just those involving neighborhoods but every single student as secretary of education i hope you have the same goal for. >> i do in thank you. coincidentally time has expired i now recognize the gentleman from south carolina. >> thank you very much for your great leadership on behalf of the american people. and thank you madam secretary for your vision encourage to promote local school control of education for students, with teachers and washington is not all wise the local elected school boards should be where power is exhibited and where people know better about the local communities it should be devolved to them. additionally i want to thank you and president trump.

you are at successfully empowering american citizens, not the government. you are actually doing the exact opposite of any dictatorship in the power is being returned to the people of the local elected school boards that so well reflect the citizens and who have elected them. i believe you are the right person for the job. additionally i believe to it so clear at the state issue. it should remain as a state issue. it should not be a federal issue. and with that in mind i recently led letter along 27 of my colleagues to call for an increase in funding for the federal schools program, csp across the country the charter school community is committed to providing families with high quality public education options voluntarily choice of the parents. i am grateful to see president trump's measure creates a

charter school program by 14%. furthermore drake national charter schools week you announce additional $60 million and funding for that csp to help meet the needs of families across the country. for the american people particularly for that media if you will explain what the success is of the voluntary school and how is this money going to be spent around the country? bucks thank you very much congressman wilson for your kind words about me. but also i've visited many schools many charter schools throughout the country already. but i have seen with those charter schools is the innovation they are allowed to use you don't see in a lot of her public schools. i'm very pleased to see it's also reporting school choice. the best education is that

closest to the child. whether that is homeschooling comic charter schools, public schools religious schools he wants to make every opportunity available to all the children in the country. so i am pleased we did increase the budget request for charter schools. >> i too have visited the schools. i visit all of the schools that i can and the district i represent every type you just identified. i hope that media will go by and visit a charter school and see how positive they are and find out how the students are doing so well they are voluntary it's not for everyone. the media it will be nice for them to doing investigative reporting to look into truly, not just the viewpoint of the teachers union but what's really happening in america along with that secretary mcmahon we have

hooted we have the chinese communist party of the dictatorship in tehran they are targeting our universities and colleges. what can we do again to stop their inroads? it's already been successful at removing confucius institutes the regrets of the communist party the chinese communist party. what more can be done to promote freedom and democracy instead of totalitarianism? >> i think we have certainly seen in fact one of the requirements we had one of the questions we had was how are they venting their students that come internationally because my car they venting their teachers the professors that come in? did they have ideological backgrounds that are contrary to the united states government? we also, her this morning on the news there was a student from china i think it was discovered in july that had fungus spores

in a backpack from china that he brought to the university of michigan. now we have to make sure we stop back. this can be an attack on our food supply. an attack on our total population. these are incredibly important things in the state department is looking at visas, canceling them. making sure the students who are here, are here in the best interests of the united states. >> thank you for promoting free speech and international students who want to come and learn and be positive. but also understand there may be agents of foreign country coming to our country. i yield back. >> i think the gentleman i reckon is a gentleman and a teacher from california. >> think it was her chair and pray thanks for being here madam secretary is good to see you again. let's get right to it. madam secretary, do you believe the federal government is legally or constitutionally permitted to a private entity for having a different viewpoint

than the administration? >> what you mean by that? >> well, it does the government have the power legal or constitutional for you, the secretary, to punish a private entity for having a different viewpoint than the administration? >> i do not know what you mean by punish could you be more specific? >> let's move on. i don't want to get into this back and forth on this. the poster here you gave an interview on cnbc on may 28. in discussing the cancellation of harvard university federal funding grants and contracts you said and i quote, universities should continue to be able to do research along as they are abiding by the laws and sink i think with the administration but i think the administration is trying to accomplish. so you are saying harvard can have its funding and its international students back if and when it teaches with a trump

administration demands. these demands are included in april 11 letter signed by the department of education and other agencies and include a requirement that the government must be able to quote unquote audits the viewpoints of its student body. the faculty and staff to make sure quote unquote viewpoints diversity. i ask unanimous consent to submit this for the record progress objection it will be submitted. >> on a quote in the letter at harvard must abolish all criteria, preferences and practices through its admissions and hiring practice that function as ideological litmus test." madam secretary, what are the limits of this viewpoint diversity that the administration is trying to enforce? under these demands for example with the harvard government department be compelled to hire faculty that believe a 2020 election was stolen? >> i believe there are rights to

freedom of speech. and on campuses and universities of colleges and universities across the country, freedom of speech should be allowed. this should be open debate. >> are not asking about speech here. i'm asking you about the limits of viewpoint diversity cited in this letter. you demand we should be compelled to hire faculty. you are at saint there has to be the viewpoint of diversity i'm asking with harvard, with the government department be compelled to hire faculty who believe the 2020 election stolen? >> example of viewpoint diversity. >> however, one of the things harvard crimson and by its-you don't have an answer going to move on. >> i would like to ask a question would you point to diversity being for example. [inaudible] per. >> if you want to know the answer, do you want my response

question. >> i'm reclaiming my time madam secretary. with the harvard medical school was looking to hire an immunologist with that person need to adhere to hhs secretary kennedy's view on the efficacy of vaccines? >> listen, we all know that we should have art universities look at what all of the programs are with the ideologues. >> you are trying to put forth is a false narrative the funding is a privilege. just refusing to hire a holocaust is a false narrative the funding is a privilege. just refusing to hire a holocaust denier as a member of harvard's faculty count as an ideological litmus test question. >> i believe this should be diversity of viewpoints relative to teachings and opinions on campuses. >> what about the situation of harvard's history department and looking for another department member?

would being a holocaust denier count? >> i do know harvard did replace studies even before we looked at it because they believe they needed to make it already. >> can you explain to me how cutting funding to improve to cancer research which may save the lives of children will help jewish students on campus? >> we had to put some teeth in the anti-semitism study so it did not come from the department of education it came from hhs. therefore harvard had indicated it would take from its endowment which is $53 billion, some funds to continue that research. i think that might've been a really good use for some of those funds too. >> i think it's pretty clear you have not thought through this whole viewpoint pickwick she would not low because you've not allow me too answer the questions. cooks well, i think you're showing you could not answer the question for the general time is

expired. >> i would yield 'i think the gentleman i reckon is a gentleman from wisconsin. >> was about like to comment on the statement made by a member here in wisconsin i felt one of the things we did to improve education is stand up to the teachers union and allow some of the worst teachers to be let go. i think it is disappointing we have people who think the key to improving education is unionizing the schools and unionize the schools inevitably means you cannot get rid of the worst teachers. a little bit of my personal experience in wisconsin. the second thing is people mention the ged. at least in wisconsin we were not allowed even as a state legislator. but some release it to me anywhere as breaking the law. and i was shocked at how easy those tests were. it's almost comical.

i will ask you what you do what you can to at least for some states out of as a nation wide thing or state-by-state thing, release some of these ged exams even if they are for five years old so the public can see what they mean? >> thank you for your question paren not sure that's under my jurisdiction. but i would like to look into adding a back to you on that. >> okay. , i know workforce pell sound good. at least in wisconsin, when i talked to trucking firm's, i torta manufacturer last week who was paying for the textile degrees for its employees even before the people were >> same thing with construction firms, paying for the education. so i kind of felt a little bit that we're driving in and paying for stuff, the private sectors. i just ask you to look into that. now, as far as bias and the

anti-semitism in universities, to me it's part and partial to a larger problem. anybody that's been involved in republican politics for a while has met students who have to lie routinely on tests to feel like they have to get a good score. and it's because you have this monolithic left wing that's got almost all, in some disciplines, of the teaching jobs. and to me, this anti-semitism is increasingly part of the left wing -- it's everywhere in the universities. global warming greatly exaggerated amount of bias at the universities, that sort of thing. what do you think we can do about the overwhelming left wing bias in so many disciplines at the universities? >> well, i think that's one of

the things that i've been talking about is doing some vetting on how the courses are being taught. and to make sure that we have equal and diverse viewpoints. when harvard will through its own harvard crimson say that only 3% of the faculty are conservative, i don't think we have diversity of viewpoints in that case. even in hiring, we're looking at harvard -- well, harvard had the standard case. it's students versus harvard. harvard not hiring through merit. and it's decreasing those populations of students from -- all of those things have to be taken into consideration. >> i agree with you that we have a shortage of people going into skills-based learning

programs, be they tech schools, be they trade schools what have you. i think part of the answer is to disseminate the statistics showing how much better a plumber or an electrician or a welder does than people with a communication arts degree or a business marketing degree. and it's a very difficult thing to know what to do because under our constitution, education is not something we think of as a federal thing. but i think you could disseminate that. would you try to do what you could during your term to educate the public as to how much better financially people do with a skill as opposed to a general education degree? >> i certainly would like to make sure that everyone does understand that -- >> will you publicize it, i guess that's what i'm a lotting for. >> i think those stats are available. all you have to do is have a plumber come to your house. i might be in the wrong business sometimes. >> i hope you use your

position. my final question is, one of my colleagues here talked about so-called difference by income level. i don't think that's where they should be looking. i think they should be looking at family background. will you collect data on the family background of students. by that, i mean family structure, and see how that effects educational test scores. would you do that for us? >> i'd really like to get back to you and understand a little bit more of what you would like us to look into, but i will get back to you on that. >> gentleman's time is expired. i now recognize the gentle lady from north carolina, ms. adams, for her five minutes. >> thank you, mr. chairman and thank you secretary mcmahon for being here today. i hope that i will have an opportunity to meet with you. i've made requests and we weren't able to do that, hopefully you'll reconsider.

let me raise a concern i heard from one of my constituents who serves in the department of grants management, policy division. their entire unit received a notice in march. and this office, from what i understand, held key oversight -- and compliance, insuring that taxpayer dollars were used effectively and legally -- and that the department's obligations and federal statutes were met. i know you spoke on the importance of streamlining and efficiency and i respect that. i know it's difficult sometimes. let me ask if you can speak to the department's plan for transitioning this critical compliance work moving forward and how you are insuring that core responsibilities around federal grant oversight training and legal compliance are still being fulfilled. >> thank you very much for your question. just let me give you the assurance that even with the

streamlining we've done so far, we've not missed any of our statutory requirements and that's what we'll continue to do. >> so you are going to meet those, is that what you're saying? >> yes. >> so let me ask you, as you already know, title 3 part b provides mandatory funding to hbcu's and i appreciate your statement on hbcu's. i'm a 40 year professor at an hbcu, graduate twice of one. can you speak to how the department is tracking long term impacts of outcomes like academic performance, research competitiveness and infrastructure modernization at our hbcu's that are approximately almost 200 years old. beyond that, how do you plan to scale what's working? how can we make sure these best practices are reaching others? >> thank you very much for

asking. i've met with president vincent from howard university and i understand from him a lot of the great programs they have in place. so we recognize the great value of hbcu's. and i believe, and i can get back to you to make sure that this is a correct statement, but i believe the president has a special office in the administration for hbcu's. >> yes, ma'am, he does. and of course he did have an executive order on hbcu's. and of course you know that the hbcu's partners -- requires agencies to report each year to congress on how they're supporting hbcu's and how that aligns with the goals of the executive order and the white house initiative of which you just spoke about. let's say that there's a grant

that gets cancelled. that cancellation doesn't line up with the executive order or the intent of the hbcu's partners act. would you be willing to work with the white house initiative and your inner agency partners to take another look at those decisions and potentially reinstate grants that were inconsistent with that guidance. >> certainly, i would always look into those things. but we have not cancelled any grants. >> yes, ma'am, okay. we're gonna make sure that we'll follow up on that. >> we'll follow up if that's not the case. >> all right. are there ways that you could look to incentivize required state matches to hbcu's as the executive order states. because currently, that's not being done. >> i'm not sure that it's not being done, but i would like to look into it further. and if it is not being done, i'd like to talk to you about it. >> yes, ma'am, i want to talk to you about it because i can assure you that it is not being done. let me just say, chairman i do

want to ask for unanimous consent to enter into the record a 2024 report from the century foundation that outlines studies that show that hbcu's provide an incredible return on investment. >> without objection, it will be submitted. >> thank you. madam secretary, thank you very much. i'm almost slightly over my time, but i'm looking forward to this year's hbcu week. i saw the website has been updated and i certainly appreciate the effort to keep that momentum going. i look forward to, as i said in my opening comments, to having that one-on-one with you. i would certainly appreciate if you would honor that request. thank you very much for being here. mr. chair, i yield back. >> thank you. i'll certainly do that. >> gentle lady yields right on time. thank you. i recognize gentle lady from new york. >> thank you, mr. chairman. secretary mcmahon, thank you for being here today. i want to follow up on my

colleague across the aisle's back and forth where you didn't have the opportunity to answer the question. i've been very engaged in leading this effort in terms of holding harvard accountable. we saw the scourge of anti-semitism after the hamas attacks on october 7th. and harvard failed in every respect to enforce the rules to protect jewish students. and over the course of our investigation, it was revealed that there was anti-semitism deep in the office of dei at harvard and it highlighted this issue of a failure of ideological diversity. i wanted to add some more details to what you pointed out. less than 3% of the harvard faculty are conservative. and this is a challenge in education at large. according to the harvard crimson, as of 1989, the ratio was 2-1 liberal to conservative. by 2017, it was 5-1. and then as of 2023 it's 26-1.

so when we talk about ideological diversity, it is a crisis at harvard. can you further elaborate on that? >> well, just agreeing with what you said. by their own statistics, it is clear that they don't have diversity viewpoint. and i believe, and as i mentioned a little bit earlier, the fact that harvard had already replaced -- or is looking to replace its head of middle east studies, recognizing that they already had an issue. i actually think that we spurred them on. >> absolutely. >> when we started putting teeth in what we were doing they finally said okay, we're gonna make some changes and they did do that shortly after we started our investigation. >> you're spot on, secretary mcmahon. harvard has failed to save itself. they're responding to the exceptional work of this committee and the accountability

measures that this administration put into place. i want to thank you for your strong leadership. i want to thank president trump for his strong leadership. i care deeply about this as an alum na of harvard. we want to make sure these institutions are excellent for generations to come. my follow up, which is on a different subject, this has come up in virtually every meeting that i've had, whether it's with university presidents, professors or students is the challenge of ai and academic integrity in the classroom. can you talk about the department's approach in how to harness the benefits of this technology but also make sure that we are learning the basics in the classroom and have academic integrity. >> i think ai is so overwhelming with the abilities that it can bring, but it also has a downside in dangers. we want to make sure ai is not

leading to faults -- false essays or papers. when i've seen some of the tutorial benefits, i think it brings so much to the table that we can offer students who are accomplishing more in the classroom or who aren't accomplishing as much. i think we need to harness and capture those opportunities from ai. but at the same time, making sure that we understand -- and i don't think we even have this much of a handle on it yet of what the dangers of ai can be. i think it's incumbent upon us to look across the board at all of that. >> well, thank you for that. my last question, and this is primarily for k-12. i think about this both as a policymaker but as a mom as my young 3-year-old who is finishing pre-k 3, but screen time for our kids and the dangers of huge amounts of

screen time. i want to credit my colleague kevin kylie who's hosting a hearing on this next week. can you discuss the administration and the department's approach to tackling this very concerning issue that has had huge impacts on the mental health and also the focus of our kids. >> i think this is really at state level. there are governors who are promoting policies or superintendents who are putting policies in their local areas that say -- in schools, no devices. i think parents at home need to look at the amount of screen time that -- this is a great deal of parental responsibility as well. >> we've looked at different aspects, i've seen reports of more and more screen time which then reduces your ability to focus and have attention for your subjects.

i think less can be more. >> thank you secretary mcmahon for the tremendous work you're doing across the country. yield back. >> i thank the gentle lady and i recognize the gentle lady from georgia. >> secretary mcmahon, thank you very much for being here with us today. as secretary, you have a direct authority over the cancellation of ransom contracts at the department of education. you cancelled the charting my path for student success program that served over 1600 disabled students and their families across 52 schools in 11 states, including my home state of georgia. this year round program provided support services and frequent small group sessions to insure

that physically disabled students or students with dyslexia, autism and other disabilities as well as their families can meet their goals of transitioning to and succeeding in adulthood, which is really what every parent wishes for their child. all too often, it's unfortunately a sink or swim situation for disabled students after high school and programs like this can be the difference between a lifetime on disability insurance versus a good job that they can raise a family on. on this poster right here, you can see the exact e-mail that was sent out to parents in georgia because of your decision, which i would like to submit digitally for the record. it says, the federal funding provided by the department of education for this initiative has been discontinued immediately and that your child will no longer receive transition support. i would like to also submit for

the record an article from npr about a young man named logan and his mother jesse who were really benefitting from this program before it was abruptly cancelled. secretary, this is just simply a yes or no answer, do you stand by your decision to cancel this program in the middle of the school year without any warning to the hundreds of students, teachers and families that were participating? >> well, i would like to explore that more. >> this is a yes or no answer. >> no, it's not a yes or no answer. >> yes, it is. the american people deserve a full answer from you yes or no. i'm not gonna let you circumvent, i'm not gonna let you ignore it. yes or no, it's a simple question. >> i've had to de-fund different programs and i can't speak to individual grant programs without looking into them exactly. there are a lot of grant programs out there, so i'd like to get back to you. >> note for the record that the

secretary is unwilling to answer my question. is it clear or do you believe that you are misleading the public regarding the actions that you and president trump have taken to cut or cancel programs and services for disabled children and their families? you've said multiple times that disabled students will not be negatively impacted by your decisions, but they already are. time and time again, this administration asked the american people to listen to everything that they say but you ignore what they're actually doing. given the limited time, i plan to submit written questions to you and for the record to learn more about your decision and get some direct answers from these parents as to why the kids can't meet with their teachers anymore. secretary, yes or no?

simple answer, just a direct answer. do you believe that gun violence, the leading cause of death for children in this country, is a public health crisis? >> i believe that gun violence, we should take steps to make sure that gun violence does not happen in our schools. >> is it a public health crisis to you? the american people and families want to know if you believe that our children sitting in our classrooms should be in fear of unnecessary gun violence. most of america believes this is a public scourge. do you think that gun violence poses a threat to our children while they're sitting in our classrooms? >> gun violence should not be allowed anywhere and gun violence especially should not be in our schools. >> as a mother who lost her son to unnecessary gun violence in the prime of his teenage years,

your response or basically your lack of response is completely out of touch. every parent, whether they send their kids to public or private school worries about their child being killed at school. and there's a lot of data to prove that. it is an unfortunate reality that this happens every single day, yet this is the reality. there's something very wrong when the highest ranking government officials responsible for the safety and education of our kids cannot claim that the leading cause of death among children is not a crisis. every american should be deeply concerned while you remain secretary of education. and i hope that i'm able to get some answers in writing from you and i yield back. >> i thank the gentle lady and i recognize the gentleman from utah. >> thank you. madam secretary, good seeing you again. first of all, i'd like to thank you for bringing your expertise to an industry that has long

forgotten what a good investment is when it comes down to teaching our kids. there's nothing more important to the survival of our american culture than what you've been tasked to do. on behalf of those who love the role of educators because they love the children they teach, i want to thank you for that passion. as you know, the house passed a resolution, a reconciliation bill. it includes a version -- which will provide billions in tax credit scholarships for school choice. i have long advocated for school choice. why do you think it's such a huge win for parents who are desperate for educational options. >> thank you very much, congressman for that question. school choice, i believe, is one of the top things we can do to make sure that every child has

equal access to an excellent education. and president trump certainly believes, and i've said this many times even this morning, he truly believes the best education is that which is closest to the child. when we think about teachers who are with our children every single day, school superintendents and parents, we should have rights over the say of the curriculum that's being taught to their children. these are all things that are part of the school choice program. the president does not believe that any child -- i'm really pleased to see that he's wanted limits or that the budget has increased in our charter schools. he wants to make sure that our public schools we have the best teachers, the best funding. he wants to make sure that all

private schools, religious schools and even those that are teaching children at home with home schooling have all the best tools available. he was embarrassed by where education levels were in our country and he was angry. when he's talked to me about it he said we absolutely need to make changes so that our students can have the best education in the world and that their performance scores will indicate that.

would you talk more about why dei is an important civil rights issue for all students? >> unfortunately, many of the programs of dei -- the title was diversity, equity and inclusion. and it did more, i think, to separate and to provide more segregation ideas. because it pitted an oppressor versus oppressed ideology. many students were taught that if you're white, you're privileged. if you're not, you should not bring that privileged group as part of what you're doing. that is exactly contrary to everything we've been trying to accomplish in our country over the years so that everyone really has equal access and equal opportunity under the law. >> yesterday you had a hearing with the senator out of rhode

island who said you're surrendering by giving the power back to the parents. i just want to remind everybody that we in 2025 have -- in 2017, black skids in the state of california, 75% could not read, write and think. i think it's kind of arrogant for bureaucrats and politicians -- i want to thank you and this department and this administration for understanding that the power belongs to the parents and we're gonna start producing the smartest, wisest and most hopeful students in the history of man kind. thank you for that and i appreciate it. i yield back. >> thank you, sir. >> i thank the gentleman, i recognize gentle lady from pennsylvania, ms. lee. >> thank you, mr. chairman.

i think that in very many ways we've been talking around a lot of the issues with this administration. to be honest and to be very clear, i want to say that this administration has undoubtedly revived the culture of racism we haven't seen since the jim crow era. it's made it clear that attacks on marginalized communities is not just tolerated, but it's encouraged. the call for removing equity and inclusion from schools in favor of "traditional american values" is indistinguishable -- to central truth about slavery or as they disappear students -- it's reminiscent of the depression of abolitionist newspapers. this department's financial aid policies harken back to a time when higher education was reserved for affluent, well connected and predominantly white students. i have questions about why this department is taking its lead from jim crow. secretary mcmahon, you've claimed you want to drastically

reduce the already very small federal role in education, also that you will not cut title 1a funding. that is still your position, correct? >> correct. >> i'd like a yes or no answer, do you believe your april 3rd attempt to revoke title 1a funding from states, unless a signed certification of compliance with your political viewpoint was consistent with giving states more control over education? >> there's been no reduction in funding -- >> as of now. there has not been yet. >> it is not going forward in the budget. >> was funding actually secure for every school district and state that currently receives it or is your goal to make title 1a conditional on states refusing to provide students of color, lgbtq+ students, students with disabilities or other marginalized students to participate in diverse, inclusive and equitable learning

environments. >> no, 1a funding is intact. >> let's talk about so-called illegal dei -- that your illegal dei guidance is unconstitutional and unenforceable. secretary mcmahon, during your confirmation hearing, you were asked by senator chris murphy -- you said you'd like to look into it. have you been able to look into it? >> i do not think that african studies or middle east studies or chinese studies are a part of dei if they're taught as part of the total history package. if you're giving the facts on both sides, of course they're not dei. >> i don't know what both sides of african american history would be. >> african american history -- >> what we recognize throughout education is that a course is

only one year or one semester. it would be potential to teach african history and european history at the same time. -- one wouldn't learn about baroque music and african courses at the same time. >> you do agree that they should not be eliminated from courses, particularly ap african american history. >> i have a few other examples that i'd like your thoughts on, simple yes or no. would you say it would be illegal dei for a lesson plan on the tulsa race massacre? >> i'd have to get back to you on that. >> do you know what the tulsa

race massacre is? >> i'd like to look into it more and get back to you. >> how about the book "through my eyes" by ruby bridges, for instance. >> i haven't read that. >> have you learned about ruby bridges? >> if you have specific examples, i'd be very happy -- >> that was an incredibly specific example. >> what about a school having a voluntary celebration for pride month? >> well, i think that -- >> voluntary. >> this is yes or no? >> no, it's not. >> how about social studies standards that teach that president biden won the 2020 election? >> i think our studies should all be taught accurately. >> yes or no? >> do you believe that social studies -- i think we should teach accurately. >> you have not answered the

question. i don't understand why you're incapable of answering -- >> i'm just not giving you the answer you want. >> i want the answer, whatever your answer is. >> i just gave you the answer. >> no, the answer is yes or no. >> gentle lady, time is -- >> i yield back. >> expired. i now recognize the gentle lady from michigan, ms. mcclain. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and thank you madam secretary for being here and thank you so much for your leadership in our joint efforts to downsize the department of education. like you and the president, i believe education policy is best determined by state and local communities along with parents. obviously, the closer you are to the student, the more interactive and the more hands on experience you really have. we have this to deliver the best outcomes for the students. i think our goal is to make sure we're delivering the best

outcomes to the students. to that aim, we've seen state teacher's unions and others bulldoze parents rights in a pursuit of indoctrination over education. i think that's what you were alluding to earlier. we'll teach any subject as long as we can correct the truth with the other half of the truth and we can teach both sides, which seems -- we used to teach children how to think as opposed to what to think. would that be an accurate assessment? >> i think we do need to get back to teaching children more how to think. >> amen. so as we return power to local communities, how can the federal government fulfill it role in protecting students and the parent's rights. how do you see the federal government and how can we help

and insure that we're protecting students and the people who get lost sometimes, the parents. how do we do that? >> certainly returning education back to the states, local control. but really what that means and what the president has said to me is he'd like to take the bureaucracy out of education. the department of education does not establish curriculum in the state. it does not say what books to buy, it doesn't do any of those things. it is a great path through of funding that is appropriated by congress. there are competitive grants that have been reviewed by the department of education. and so those competitive grants do go to states. what we want to do is to make more money available to go directly to the states. when you consider the fact that

every dollar that goes to a state, a teacher is spending about 47 cents of that dollar in regulatory compliance. but if we can get rid of a lot of the red tape that goes along with those grants and those requirements, there's more money for the states to put forth the programs that they would like to put forth. and that's clearly one of the president's goals. >> i don't want to put words in your mouth, but i want to make sure that i understand you correctly. what you're saying is if we took that dollar that right now is earmarked, and 47 cents of that dollar is going for compliance issues, regulatory issues. you're saying we would actualy have more of that dollar to give to the student? what a concept. who could not be for that? if our goal is to truly educate the students, who would not be for giving more money to the

students? >> not only giving more money to the students, but making sure parental rights are protected. that parents have more say so in the curriculum their students are being taught. that they understand what is going on in the classroom. and i urge parents to take a more active role in their student's education. i think that teaching is one of the most noble professions in our country. but they do need support. they need support at home and i think parents can and many parents are so involved. but i urge parents to become more involved in school board elections and just attending those meetings that impact their children. >> i think it's a good thing when parents show up at school board meetings. and it's really a good thing when parents are involved. they're not terrorists or whatnot, that's a good thing. we actually want parents involved in the student's education. >> absolutely. >> to that end, i know parents have the right to opt out of

specific lesson plans for their child if it goes against their specific religious beliefs or whatnot. i believe at times it's difficult for the parents to get that done. what do you see moving forward to make it easier for parents to opt their child out of something that they don't want them involved in. how do you see that happening? >> well, there again, that's really part of the local education system. the department of education has no control of that. i would encourage parents to approach their school boards, their individual schools, the teachers and the superintendents to make their voices heard. >> with that, my time has expired. thank you for all your work to get more dollars to where it should go. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i'd like to ask unanimous consent to enter into the record

a statement from the national disability rights network discussing how the department of education's proposed budget cuts would eliminate critical programs that provide advocacy service to individuals with disabilities. >> without objection. >> thank you, mr. chairman. madam secretary, thank you for being here today. i'm particularly interested in your comments and your background as a person who comes from a private sector business about how you create efficiencies. to one person's bureaucracy, the other is a good valued employee whether it's public or private sector. i want to read a quote from a federal judge who stopped the department of education lay offs. "it will likely cripple the department. the idea that the defendant's actions are merely a reorganization is plainly not true." she goes on to say "a department

without enough employees to perform statutory mandated functions is not a department at all. this court cannot be asked to cover its eyes while a department's employees are continuously fired and units are transferred out until a department becomes a shell of itself." so this is in the context of you're eliminating staff, bureaucrats to your words. the judge clearly disagreed with you. in the context of special education, where we've seen students, a number of special education students in the last 10 years double. i don't know if you've ever sat down with a parent or a special ed educator and tried to work with them to see what they have to go through to get the services they're statutorily allowed to do, signed by president gerald ford, the idea program. have you ever met with special ed kids and their parents? >> yes, i have.

i was very involved in special olympics and started that program -- i was astounded of all of the programs we need for those students. very heart rendering the stories of those parents. >> when president ford signed that, the bipartisan bill, the federal government promised in 1974 that we would pay 40% of i.d. e. a. do you know what that number is now? >> i believe congress has appropriated 18% at this particular point for that program. >> it's more like 10-12%. >> i think in 2025 it was about 10.7%. >> help me understand, we're gonna cut thousands of people who help provide these services but don't get paid enough and there are not enough of them and we'll give more control to local government, but how do they have control when they never got the resources they needed? i've had superintendents tell me we've put more money into

schools in california over the years, they could take all of that money and put it in a special education and it still wouldn't be enough to make up from the lack of investment from the federal government based on a bill that was signed by a republican president. >> that's not on the department of education, that's the appropriation coming from congress. i think that's up to you, sir. >> where does that money go for in the department of education is a key part of giving them the best practices so they can understand how to serve the people at the local level. it's fine to say we're gonna give it back to local control, which i completely agree with. it's fine to say it's gonna go back to the states, but they have to have the resources under a federal statute to perform the requirements under the federal statute, which i assume given your background and working with special ed kids, you want them to get that. we know we all benefit from having special ed kids get the support. and specifically, does the department intend on eliminating -- you talked about

parent involvement. the congressionally mandated parent training and information centers, are you gonna continue to support those? who's going to support those? >> sir, as i said, the i.d. e. a. funding is level funded. there have been no cuts in that. it's going directly as it has before without changes from us. >> having run businesses, i think we're just having a communication problem. how can you say your level of funding but you're cutting staff and sending it back to local government without the funding. seems like a contradiction to me. >> i don't know what you mean by i'm cutting staff relative to states and how they're handling ida funding and how they're taking those dollars into their schools. the staff that we've cut at department of education, let me just reiterate what i said before, we are totally in compliance with all of our

statutory obligations. >> i'm told i have extra time because they messed up the clock. i'm sure it's a plot, mr. chairman. i would love to continue this conversation. we clearly don't understand one another. maybe i'm responsible for part of that. i don't understand, as a former business owner, how you can eliminate the department of education or attempt to, the judge says you're not. are you going to comply with what the judge has ordered? >> i will. but let me remind you that i.d. e. a. started in 1965 and was distributed to the states. and i think it would continue to be distributed if there was no department of education. >> i would respectfully disagree. you have to have people with expertise in order to implement the law. and i know i've spent a lot of time with special ed kids and their families. they rely on the best practices supplied at a national level so they can perform at a local level. >> well they came from somewhere before the department of education, so those people --

>> ma'am, that's the reason we started the program is because they were suffering and failing. >> i think now the gentleman's time is finally expired. we've got it back on track. >> thank you. >> thanks, gentleman. i yield to the gentleman from georgia? mr. allen. >> thank you, madam secretary for your work on behalf of all the parents and children of this country. i've been very impressed with your work. during my time in congress, i've been a staunch advocate for school choice. every child and every family is unique in their own way. when it comes to learning, it's no different. in fact, in every public school, my children have attended, my wife and i have gotten very involved in that process and it makes a difference with the

parents getting involved. we've seen an explosion in interest in school choice. even in the last few months, tennessee, south carolina, idaho, wyoming, texas are considering implementing school choice legislation. however, all these success stories, many states refuse to even consider school choice. many states seem insistent on trapping kids in failing schools. in a country where school choice has already been implemented in many areas with great success, including the 12th district of georgia, why do so many states refuse to even consider choice? >> well, i think you'd have to ask the governors and the superintendents of education in those particular states. >> that's an important question, isn't it? >> very important question. >> i can tell you what we're starting to see and why you see

more states now looking at school choice options is because our education system right now is failing our students. >> we're spending the most money and getting -- 30th in the world? >> i think governors who were being innovative on their own are looking at different programs in their states and they're seeing the success rates returning to classical education in some states, where the science of reading has been so incredibly successful like the miracle of mississippi that we looked at. the recent scores for the state of louisiana, we've seen that they've had the greatest improvement in their psychologicals relative to others. now there's a competitive factor going on among the states. and those who are recognizing what's worked are starting to look at it and adopt and say maybe we ought to take another look at this. >> if you're gonna compete in economic development and business growth and job growth in this country, you've got to have a work force, an educated

work force. and it's more important than ever. the work force today is very technical and has to have a degree of education to deal with the digital aspects of production and everything else. having built a small business, i have experienced firsthand how hard it is to find skilled and qualified workers. we've got to bridge that gap and i was proud to vote for the one big beautiful bill, which included two big pay off policies. can you talk more about why this

administration supports short term -- and what such a program would do for our work force? >> not everyone can afford even a two year community college. short term fail grants which are 8-15 weeks provide those opportunities to learn and gain a skill and get into the work force much faster. it's good for employees, it's good for employers to get them into the economy faster. so the short term work force pell grant i'm a strong supporter of. >> great. what changes, if any, do you believe need to be made to perkins reauthorization to improve outcomes for students? >> well, i just think that we have to have better alignment with the perkins programs, with what our work force innovation

programs are. i think we can close that gap because it's very worthwhile. >> i'm all with you on the competition among states. states compete for economic development and states are paying closer attention to work force development because it's critical as far as economic development. thank you for your service to this country. >> thank you, sir. >> i yield back. >> thank the gentleman. i now recognize a new member of the committee for her first round of questioning on this committee. >> thank you so much for being here, secretary mcmahon. i agree that for many students in america, our education system is absolutely failing them. this is especially true for low income families and for folks in rural communities. but that's not because of too much federal oversight or the dei policies like your administration claims. it's because in many states, like the state i represent in arizona, we've woefully

underfunded our public education system. now your administration wants to dismantle the department of education. i'm wondering if you can respond briefly, do you believe there is a constitutional or operational path to eliminating the department of education? if so, what is the timeline and process? >> certainly. in fact, when president trump issued his executive order, his executive order indicated for me to start dismantling the department of education lawfully. we both know that the department of education cannot be dismantled without the approval of congress. and so that would be the path we would have to take. and i said in my confirmation hearing that i wanted to work with congress so that we could arrive at a good plan to show what the department of education is doing and how it could be handled with other agencies and how we can see improvements for education throughout the country. >> what risks did you weigh for public schools and universities

if federal education funding is gutted or it's evolved to the states. >> federal education wouldn't necessarily be gutted. i believe there would be more money to go to the states without the bureaucracy of the department of education. when you think about how many people there are at the department and some of those services can be handled by other agencies, there would be less money taken out of the overall budget, more money to be available to go to the state. >> so here's the thing, madam secretary, and why i strongly believe that you're wrong. one big risk i see right off the bat is that some states, again the state i represent, arizona, have an abysmal track record of managing education. last year, arizona was dead last on the list of the best states for public education. we have some of the lowest teacher salaries, low test scores and the highest student to teacher ratio in the country. after years of cutting funding for public education, republicans in arizona have tried to fix our education

system with universal school vouchers. secretary mcmahon, do you support expanding school choice vouchers? >> one thing i'd like to bring to you -- >> this is a yes or no. >> the federal government only provides about 8-10% of the total education budget to states. >> do you support expanding -- it's a yes or no question. >> no, it isn't. these are policies that are established by the states. >> secretary, thank you. >> when it comes to vouchers would you say that you support taxpayers subsidizing wealthy student's tuition at expensive private schools? >> i think that, again, these are issues within the states to look at. >> it's a yes or no. >> there are issues within states that they should look at. >> okay, that sounds like a yes. do you support those vouchers being used for things like

expensive ski trips, $1,000 lego sets or pianos for individual families? >> of course not. >> i heard my colleague from the other side of the aisle just previously talking about how wonderful vouchers are. and i just want to share a couple articles that i'm sure you all can't see from here. these are all from the last couple of years in arizona. parents of private voucher students spent over $1 million of public money buying lego sets. another one, arizona empowerment scholarships, $304 million. ranges from tuition to trampoline parks. a lot of waste, fraud and abuse happening. more than half of esa students come from high income zip codes. so in arizona, secretary, this is exactly what's happening. 77% of those vouchers have gone to students in the wealthiest zip codes to fund their expensive private schools and luxury items, all while de-funding public schools that the rest of our students attend.

does it sound to you like arizona's voucher program is improving our education system? >> sounds like you've got an issue in arizona that you should address with your governor. >> no, it's actually our state legislature. in arizona, the issue has been a disaster and this is exactly why a federal department of education is so vital. school vouchers have decimated our budget by $1 billion. again, republican-controlled state legislature for 60 some years. costing taxpayers way more than simply raising school funding would have. so you have a clear test case in arizona, which has failed miserably. i'm not sure why we would want to subject the rest of the country to the same problems. >> the gentle lady's time has expired. yields back and i recognize the gentlewoman from illinois, ms. miller. >> good morning, secretary mcmahon. thank you for the great work

that you and president trump are doing to reform the department of education. the last four years under the biden administration have been a disaster for the public education system, for parental rights and for student safety. and the most racist thing that's been going on in our country has been the unanimous support of the democrats and the teacher's union to force inner city children, black and brown children, into failing schools while denying their parents the opportunity to seek alternative options. children as young as kindergarten have been subjected to drag queen story hours and pro lgbtq+ curriculums. shockingly, the department of education had the audacity to call parents domestic terrorists and proceeded to investigate and intimidate them into submission.

scott smith was arrested at a loudoun county school board meeting over voicing his outrage that his 15-year-old daughter was raped by a boy dressed as a girl in a public school bathroom and then the school sought to cover it up. now after being soundly defeated last november, democrats in states like maine, california and my home state of illinois continue to defy federal law by forcing our girls to compete against biological men and change with them in locker rooms. thankfully, president trump and yourself are taking action to stop this madness and are striding toward the ultimate goal of returning education to the states and to the parents where it belongs. so madam secretary, thank you for your recent response to my letters addressing title 9 violations in deer born and

naper vil, illinois. can you please elaborate on what the department of education is doing to investigate similar violations in other school districts and whether their federal funding will be rescinded for failing to comply with federal law. >> thank you very much. we are, indeed, investigating the many cases that come up under title 9. i was informed yesterday that in colorado, it's part of the public school system on school trips that there were boys sleep ing -- boys who were identifying as girls sleeping in the same bed with girls on these class trips and parents were not even notified. i just think that that's incredibly wrong. that is a title 9 violation that we'll be investigating.

there is in wyoming a college that had boys joining girl's sororities. again, title 9 violations. we're going to investigate them and we will look at whatever option should we have available, whether it is de-funding some of those programs. so, yes. >> thank you. and thank you for fighting hard for school choice. home schooling is very near and dear to me. i'm a teacher and i ended up home educating my seven children, most of them have chosen to do the same. as parents saw the filth being taught to their children during the covid-19 lock downs, many of them began home schooling. democrat run states like illinois are seeking to limit -- what can the department of education do to insure that this fundamental right is protected? >> well, that's clearly one of the things that president trump has talked about and what i've

addressed earlier in my testimony today and that is that the president absolutely does believe that all children should have a right to an excellent education. they should have that choice. and that that choice should be supported whether it is home schooling, private schools, public schools, charter schools, all of those should receive their funding and that states should look at the choice options. >> thank you. competition makes everything better. as i mentioned earlier, the biden administration launched an assault on parental rights in education. aside from curriculums, according to parents defending education, at least 20,000 schools in 1100 districts have policies that prevent faculty and staff from disclosing a student's gender identity to his parents without the student's permission. what is the department of education doing to hold these schools accountable? >> if i'm not incorrect, that

falls under sherpa, which clearly is a statute that says that parents have the right to the information that is contained in their children's records. and i absolutely believe that to be true. >> thank you, i yield back. >> thank you, gentle lady. >> mr. chair, can i ask unanimous consent to enter three articles into the record? >> without objection. >> first, parents of private voucher students spent over $1 million of public money buying lego sets. and three, analysis, more than half of esa students come from high income zip codes. thank you. >> without objection, they're submitted. i now recognize the gentleman from new york. >> thank you, mr. chair and thank you secretary mcmahon. today's hearing -- since the start of the administration, students, families and educators across the country have been

incredibly concerned about the direction that you and the president are attempting to take both in k-12 and higher education and your attempts to weaken or close the department of education are acts of recklessness and have already done significant damage. there's a lot i'd like to ask about. but in your fiscal year 26 budget request, i want to discuss programs serving students with disabilities. your budget recommends consolidating 7 programs under the idea into a single block grant to states. so you're specifically talking about eliminating special education programs for pre-schools, teacher preparation, parent information

under this consolidated grant. but structure matters these programs work it independently for a very good reason to ensure proper oversight to serve different populations. and to meet the full range of needs for students with disabilities. madam secretary, how can you assure us states will maintain sufficient support for all of these critical areas like preschool special education and parental assistance of the federal government no longer requires them to do so under separate targeted programs? >> i think funding under the grants to state program would continue to be allocated to the states and leh in accordance with section 611. so that will remain. what we found is that we have so many diverse programs there. i think there six of them in total that would come under a block grant states would have greater flexibility in terms of

making sure that funding is where it should be. i'm sure you know probably better than anyone or as well as anyone that the process of writing grants, the people you have to hire. the strings that are attached with individual grants do come in, it's really burdensome and expensive for the hope is in the goal is one granted bucket if you both there are less strings attached and affords greater flexibility for states to put that money where it is needed. quick to the school district does not follow the proper mechanism for administering the grant for receive the individual's services they need are there any accountability measures that come out of the department of education or any other federal government agency?

>> there is always the opportunity of defunding. we do not want to take any tools off the table. if there is a specific question i would always want to look into that i do find out exactly just like we always investigate. but there is reports of this is not being spent we always investigate. courts has been a lot of discussion and questions regarding parental access and parental input. i was in a classroom for almost 30 years. over the course about 30 years what i saw was implementation of e-mails, grades being able to be accessed by parents. shared decision-making committees and increase of the number of parent/teacher conferences and meet the teachers nights. the ability for students to audiotape or videotape lessons and teachers themselves providing curriculum online and posting their lessons sometimes

a video recording of their lessons online. so it your opinion over those 30 years parents have less access to information about the student education? or exclude it you've made the case for innovative teaching. that is what we should, through our regulation allows teachers to do and that is teach let's take the handcuffs and red tapes of compliance with the regulation off them and let them do what they want to do. we will see better results with children. >> thank you. should a parent have the ability to opt their child out of a unit on evolution? >> yes. >> should a school district be able to eliminate evolution from a biology curriculum? >> the parents should have under parental rights, i think parents look at curriculum in terms of maybe their own ideals may be their own religious backgrounds and have the opportunity to opt out of a particular course because thinking madam secretary. thank you mr. chair.

>> i think the gentleman i recognize the subcommittee chairman early childhood secondary education the gentleman for mr. california. mcmahon it was just five months ago at a secretary of education who is enthusiastic supporters shutting down schools during covid, who is an enthusiastic supporter of forcing two -year-olds to work masks who actually encourage school districts k -- 12 schools to adopt covid vaccine mandates. we had an administration that investigated parents as domestic terrorists were showing up at school board meetings. that attacked charter schools. that refused to condemn universities for caving to the demands of anti-semites that set out to destroy girls sports and saw $200 billion added to education spending while student performance plummeted then several different now aren't they? >> i certainly. >> in my state of california they are the same are actually worse than they've ever been.

you've already taken a number of steps to try to help out students in california. i want to highlight a couple of other areas where the problems in our state's may fall within your jurisdiction in upholding the civil rights law. first when it comes of charter schools and know your huge supporter of charters you support the bill we've introduced the high quality charter schools act. in college where the governor and legislature have declared war on charter schools for their trying to stop new charters from starting or trying to shut down high-performance short charters and egregious examples in santa clara the office of education told were the highest performing public schools of this date that unless you engage in outright racial discrimination we are going to nonrenewal your charter unless you have fewer asian students were not going to renew your charter something similar happened in open unified or charter school actually was not renewed for similar reasons. that's a charter schools.

the second is ethnic studies the state has seen fit to adopt a new ethics studies graduation requirement for high school. some districts have gone above and beyond and are offering what's called a liberated ethnic studies. both the model curriculum and the ethics studies have been condemned as being overtly anti-semitic. we saw an example of this in the last congress and the superintet barkley unified testified here she saw the slide showing students expression from the river to the sea is a valid perspective she saw no problem with that. i know you made at 12, in a investigations that may or may not be under consideration you see these as areas in which you might be able help us out either one of them? >> allow that doesn't fall from the local or state jurisdictions for schools in terms of universities you've already seen how the department of education will come in for title vi in violation so we continue to do

that. >> thank you very much. i didn't want to say a word about the situation and universities as well i have zero sympathy for harvard they were rated as having the very worst protections for free speech of any university in the country actually any university in history of the survey. and then when it came to anti-semitism it's actually underappreciated the horrors that happen on that campus we heard from jewish students that university here who have testified they were afraid to leave the dorms if they did they were harassed, their physically assaulted you at pro- hamas thugs would follow them to class and monitor their movements. all the while universities failed to protect them catering to the demands of the tormentors. i have very little sympathy for the university treat when they say we have change some things and redid a task force, clearly inadequate. what happened on that campus

reviving the most perhaps a retrograde in ancient prejudice and world history and a hotbed for it on their campus. that reflects a fundamental sickness that requires a fundamental reform. i think with the administration is doing is absently necessary. the one point i would raise is i wonder a little bit what the endgame is here. our universities have had a lot of problems in recent years and decades they cost too much they deliver too little value to students that incubate a lot of the problems we have more broadly as a country. throughout our history they made huge national assets. it's a great thing for our country we vent universities leave the world and then contribute to our country. the word of caution i might add is that what comes the ultimate goal i hope the goal is not to reduce these institutions to a shadow of their former selves. but rather to revive the ideals used to guide universities and

restore them to bank national assets again rather than the liabilities they have become. i be very happy to help in anyway i can. >> thank you very much i would like to work with you on that >> thanks very much i yield back. think the gentleman and recognize a general lady from connecticut ms. hayes. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and a secretary, welcome to our committee. it is interesting, i took a lot of notes i had prepared questions but i think i'm going in a very different direction. we have heard other colleagues talk about scores i've heard the president angered and embarrassed by these and i think we all should be. when you disaggregate those scores that show low income score lower than their white income peers that's most important to ongoing disparities in educational assets and quality which makes it much of what i'm hearing today that much more relevant prevention connecticut would both come from

the state of connecticut. connecticut relies on property taxes to fund education. we have one of the largest income gaps in the nation. which means by design or default low income students face multiple challenges including limited access to resources and opportunities outside of schools. which is why i do not understand many of the decisions made in this budget. one of my colleagues asked about collecting data on family composition and background for the department of education office of civil rights as mandated by law to do that. i was pleased to hear you say the department of education does not control curriculum and instruction, instructional materials the teachers that are hired which makes sure words contradictory every argument you have is to put local control back into the state. but states already have local control as anyone who has any knowledge for background of education would already know the

role of the department of education will be the civil rights enforcement of local controls which again the irony of this in budget zeroing out american history civic education program when you cannot answer a question about ruby bridges or the election of president biden which are as basic as it gets. so i really, really don't understand it. but you are making the argument for me because when you respond to questions or my colleagues by saying that sounds like an issue for state legislature, that's why the office of civil rights is necessary because state legislatures made the decision that ruby bridges did not have the right to a free and appropriate high quality public education. to you, madam secretary, are making the argument for the role of the department not to dictate local curriculum instruction or instructional material but comment to make sure those things are carried out by the

department states follow the law that they are doing those things. so 49 million children in this country receive public education services. about 3 million children are in charter schools are not enough charter schools left. my questions mainly focus on what about the other 46 million children? it is mind blowing i hear you talk about keeping students safe on school campuses. but, not a word about the 390,000 students have been affected by gun violence. i was in the classroom on the date sandy cook happen the federal government came in with almost $2 million to rebuild that community and provide programs for the surrounding communities. her opening i heard you mention student athletes lgbt cute students twice. not one or even my colic asking thousand public health crisis you cannot answer questions that affect the majority of students.

so i am not really sure. i am an educator by nature. i tried to be supportive at the department of education does because i need for you to succeed for my students to succeed. when you come in and say your final mission is to eliminate the department it says to me the 46 million children do not matter. i rent out most of my time. but this bill defines literacy programs, limits 21st century community learning centers. elements preschool grants for children with disabilities. reduces funding for career and technical education. like all of these things. i'm going to ask you to really quick questions. you think holocaust education and our schools as a di program? that's no it's yes or no. >> holocaust education is a de out you can have a press conference was a whatever you want i need a quick answer. it is because this is my time.

it is holocaust education a di program? >> no. >> is african-american studies a di program? the answer that provokes him asking again. just yes or no pay. >> we should be able to teach. >> my point is they are di programs both of them because students need diversity, equity and inclusion to understand their environment. both holocaust education and the teaching of african american history are important which is why the state of connecticut requires it in her social studies curriculum. you are talking out of both sides of your mouth you cannot support one without supporting the other. and looking at what happened in the schools and actually deferring to teachers, parents who are on curriculum committee's local boards of education and say to actually do the hard work. excellent generally time is expired. >> listened to what they say would be incredibly helpful. it is time to move on. >> i yield back >> a wreck it as a gentleman from ohio. >> thank you, mr. chairman and

thank you madam secretary for coming today we really appreciate your time. i spent eight years of my life on the school board three years as a school board president. i know the subject fairly well. i was ohio senate for six years. and vice chair of education. we all know our school systems in this country have a severe problem but we look at school systems like cleveland, youngstown, canton, detroit and buffalo lift school districts taking 30 that's $35000 per year to educate a child think it's a high school diploma with a fourth grade reading level. there's a major problem in our school districts. some of the small school districts like my school district we were able to educate our kids are eight or $9000 year end produce 11th or 12th grade reading level. there is a problem and of the opposition party loves the concept of throwing more money at it so let's do that. because that's what president trump just did president trump on k-12 simplified funding program gave an extra $2 billion

to all the public school districts throughout the country it gets better than that the biden/harris administration spent more than a million dollars on pei grants throughout the country. if i am doing my math right that's three nap billion dollars we could take from the federal government which will never have a trickle-down effect on the local school board because i was on for eight years. so whenever you hang out the treasury of local school board they are petrified to see was going on with the federal funding. where's it going? it opposition party thanks it's so romantic that money say years in washington instead of ever going to the grass roots act in ohio we love hole rule and excited to see these extra billions of dollars coming back to the local school district somatic secretary, my question would be now that president trump is giving back funding to the states what results do you expect the american students could produce in the next four years of the trump administration?

>> it is certainly my hope that as we look at states being more focused and having the authority, more choice in education we are going to see our scores go up. we have to have dedicated teachers which i believe we do. we need to take the handcuffs off of our teachers so they have the ability to be innovative in their classrooms. if we look at some of the programs have been successful in other states as i mentioned earlier, returned to the science of reading. look at how phonics has made such a difference of getting back to have. i have seen at work in schools. i visited schools where they are doing that more classical education. so what i would like to see i hope we will see and i think we will see our state departments of education adopting more of those kinds of programs to make sure we get literacy in place.

that we also have the ability to have school choice and estates totally take this abiding that's coming to them and see the areas of where they need to focus more of their dollars and directed that spending into those areas. >> i love those words in particular in the state of ohio speaker of the house of matt hoffman and i did a lot of ed choice programs in the state. this is coming from a guy a graduate of public school eight years of a public school. we create a voucher program help servant kids more than anything else but we have a cleveland city school that's falling to pieces you have to give urban moms and dads the opportunity with the voucher program to put your child forever it could be but with at that at this competition within the school district. you have open enrollment, all of its different obstacles of the school board members it's up to them to have a scholastics program have a good athletic program be inviting to people.

my old public school they started eight trades program within the schools who may be a four year degree at $1000 in debt is not what you're supposed to be maybe a welder have to have different paths to get outside of the box that's exciting time to be madam secretary at this point. can we incorporate all of the voucher program and have better public schools? all they can come together am i wrong? >> i really think we need-you're not wrong but we to make sure there are cultural viewpoints is not always that you have to have a four year degree. there are other ways to have a great fulfillment of a career and provide for your families with skill -based training plumbers, electricians, hvac bentley that the technology we are seeing. we have to start that a middle

schools, high schools, reading into the career programs that is one of the things our workforce development programs show success for doing. >> thank you so much madam secretary without a go my time back >> thank you jim i recognize now that gentle lady from michigan. >> thank you mr. chair. madam secretary, i realize you're in the cabinet with the president and you're the first cabinet secretary i have been able to speak with this term. if you could appease please pass along to the present 55 tariff announcements and 100 days are killing us in michigan. i know the president came to michigan to celebrate his first 100 days in office. i know this is outside the purview of your administration. we see hiring on hold but we see suppliers, small businesses are telling me today that operations are going to shut down certainly we then get the question of

unemployment and job training and apprenticeship programs. now, the department of education was passed into law in a close vote in 1979. four years prior to that, the house of representatives signed into law investing in disabilities education act. we want to see special education fully funded and the united states of america. and michigan just as of 2023 missed out on $700 million in ida funding. i have worked so closely with my school districts, all across my state frankly on the missing pieces of their budget from special education funding gaps. could you speak to some of the changes going on and the in theadministration or your vey agency right now and if there's an opportunity for michigan to access more special education

dollars? >> oh well, as i've testified to earlier the ida funding is going to continue. that level funding going into the different states. now there is six programs that are going to be consolidated into a single stream funding that i think you could apply for in the states helped get the governor or the superintendent of education to direct more of those funds. >> well i don't agree with the reckless language of shutting down the department of education and the dismantling and the job loss i know some these individuals in michigan who lost department of education will gladly take every special education dollars that you can give us. and then, grant's hope that help low income first-generation college veterans and disabled students who we hear about so

much applying successfully complete college. several schools in michigan is trio branch to support students. so why did the administration decided to eliminate the trio branch program at what's happening to that money? >> brett for the funding that's in place now are continuing for the balance of this fiscal year. the not been zeroed out in the next budget will we found that with trio and i have heard testimony i heard a couple senators yesterday say they know people who benefited from trio and i'm sure there are many people who haven't. there are other programs in place that would also help students who are now being benefited by trio. we also find out the trio programs pavement been put through the lot of heavy lobby the department of education really does not have the ability to go in and assess

accountability and that's how it's written. >> if that's the case we can look at expanding which many of us we need to get the pell grants expanded. we always went to continue to that discussion with you and on the record. but, with my remaining time andn estuary cabinet secretary for the second time in a row in the administration of president donald j trump please just note we are competing with china. we are competing on a world stage and a place that i am so privileged to call home is right in the middle of that competition. we need these engineering jobs we need these apprenticeship programs. we certainly want to see our government function to the best of its ability and deliver the standards and dare i say the efficiencies are taxpayers pay into. but we seek tax bills cutting investments in manufacturing, new manufacturing 40 new plants

in michigan. when we are fighting for all the technology talent we can get, we need you to double down on this. we need your partnership it would like to show this to you first hand i do a program called manufacturing monday. i visit hundreds of small businesses over and over again. i have a real relationships with these people the students who are in first robotics in michigan has a first robotics team which we would also love to showcase to you and your office. but ma'am, please, tell this president slowed down on what he's doing to her manufacturing and consumer costs. thank you yelled back >> like the gentle lady i reckon is a gentleman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you very much for your testimony. i like to bring your attention to the territory. like guam we offer unique challenges.

we have smaller economics and we have geographical isolation. it takes me 20 hours door to door. plus you change the date line i think it's like 2:30 a.m. tomorrow. so we are way out there. we have devastating natural disasters we went through a super typhoon is like a gigantic tornado happening at some of the states. but it covers over the entire island. plus we have the military buildup. my question is how does the administration plan to invest in american students in the outlying areas where the roles and responsibilities of the federal government are much different than that in the states? >> i would like to do if i may come outside of the hearing, their specific areas that we could talk about and what my position as education maybe it

would be helpful for you. i would welcome the opportunity to have a more thorough discussion with you. >> i appreciate that. that would be great. going onto another question, again specifically on guam often fail to recruit and retain special education specialist but understand that's nationwide. making it burdensome for special needs students to attend a publc and even charter schools. how can this administration support guam and addressing these gaps? >> again that is really more local use of funding and not controlled by the department of education. >> will we get to our meeting we will also discuss how often we face financial hardships on the out overcomes infrastructure improvements and academic competitiveness. how does this admit his ration plan to invest and uplift student another concert of mine for the islands and many other territories. >> again i look forward to our meeting to discuss this.

>> okay just a finally another one for the topics of discussion. with the needed infrastructure upgrades, our storms in our and ourcosts of getting materiae island is tremendous mesh with their public schools it's very y costly how does the administration plan to address critical issues like these ensuring we can make your educational institution and the outlying areas world-class like all american institutions should be? >> they really do look forward to our meeting. i think it address things better by sitting down having a better understanding of your issues. >> likewise we get our meeting will talk about shortages of medical physicians and nurses we note nationwide but even more stressful for the territories. in addition how the skinny budget has affected her special education funding.

likewise of course skilled trade workers and high skilled degrees and medical professions, how we can better that for our territories. pretty much looking forward to a long discussion with you as soon as possible madam secretary. >> wonderful get your trip to guam. thank you. correct think the gentleman i recognize the gentleman from texas. >> secretary mcmahon, thank you for joining us here today. right now, the administration that you are a part of it is pushing for a massive tax break for billionaires paid for by massive cuts to health care and food assistance for everyday americans including to the children that you are charged with educating. you your self, your family your billionaire family three-point to billion dollars can you share

it with us? do you know how much you and your family will receive in tax and benefit of this republican tax proposal gets pushed through? >> you know i have not sent down to work with my accountants. >> a general sense? >> i've paid more. >> and so you think under this proposal you will not, like the other bill leaders get millions or tens of millions of dollars in tax benefits question or. >> this is a ridiculous line of questioning >> does not ridiculous but here's what is important. this bill being pushed by your administration your average extremely wealthy person we give about a 4 million-dollar benefit. families worth about three-point to billion dollars. i imagine you get millions of dollars and benefit from this tax bill does that make sense? check it out. >> a half to let you know. >> chairman might question, i will first to that secretary.

so look, their families watching home for my district that could lose their healthcare. they want to know why their healthcare would get taken away at once a pain course overwhelmingly tax cuts for the people in the country. so, what would you spend $4 million on that you would get a benefit? >> your educational line of questioning. that's on this committee. >> that what with those of families who lose their healthcare watching but would you spend the $4 million on its worth more than their healthcare? >> i am not going to address the questions relative to meet person here's a secretary of education. >> is a secretary of education, as secretary of education do you think, yes or no, that kids will be better off in school if they have healthcare and their food needs met yes or no?

>> we all do better children will do better in school if their health needs are met. i will agree with that. >> and so i guess for those kids with theirs when be hundreds of thousands or millions of kids that lose their healthcare, how is it okay that they are going to lose their healthcare so that billionaires and billionaire families, i'm not just thinking of you but billionaire families like your own can get a tax break. you don't even know how meet millions of dollars you get how is that worth it? i'm not going to respond to your question. >> i think the answers because it's not worth it. it is not. if you have three-point to billion or 5 billion. >> is not the premise that it'so be healthcare in this country for the chill i don't think that's the correct premise. >> every single organization it's looked at this bill knows millions of people will lose their healthcare the latest estimate is at least 11 11 milln doll people and families.

you did not get the enormous savings that the republican majority on this committee is looking for unless you kick those months people off of their healthcare. so how can we educate our kids if they don't have a roof over their heads? if they can't see a doctor or have food assistance? i will ask you, do you think it's right for kids to not have food to eat at home before they go to class? in order to make sure a billionaire who does eve know how many were millions of dollars can get a few million more? >> i'm going to make sure is a secretary of the department of education that the president's plan to make school choice available to every student in our country as we follow. >> the president's plan specifically takes money away from those kids specifically takes food away from those

families specifically takes her money and send the two big contractors big companies and tens of millions of dollars to billionaires like you who do not even know how many extra millions of dollars are going to get paid before is a member of congress help run after school, program at a high school many of the kids written driven to school in the same car they slept in at night. they did not have food many could not see a doctor. they struggled in class we should be passing a bill to make sure they have a decent decent classroom experience food and health care not a bill that just vinyls but who knows in your opinion how many millions of dollars to billionaires like those in president trump are going to dinner with times expired out recognize a gentleman from missouri. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and thank you secretary mcmahon so much for taking the time to come and testify before us today. first of all i would like to apologize for the contemptible weight my democrat colleague treated you.

i just to say parenthetically that absolutely i'm a physician who is taking care of medicaid insured parents for patients over 30 years and zero children will lose their healthcare under the big beautiful reconciliation bill. but, i like to discuss with you some the damage done by the by demonstration to education policy in the united states. one of the worst of policies with the department of education treatment of title ix regulation. of course radically reinterpreted sex to be gender identity and sexual orientation which resulted in men infiltrating women sports. much of the detriment of fairness and safety in an area where women have made enormous progress over the years. thankfully a federal court vacated that regulation earlier this year heard there is another aspect of items title ix regulation that was also

damaging but did not receive as much attention and that is the erosion of due process during title ix adjudication of misconduct on campus. the biden administration uniformly lowered the evidence standard required for student to be convicted of misconduct in such adjudication. this is serious federal courts have found some sins are wrongfully disciplined or expelled in that process. the trump administration has worked to improve the situation, preserving the integrity of the process for sexual misconduct victims. at the same time discouraging false accusations because false accusations are tolerated that weakens a voice of actual victims. i believe we need a permanent legislative solution to protect victims of misconduct and those accused as opposed to ping-pong a back-and-forth with changes in

administration. i'm forging the biden administration is not alone and disrespecting the title ix due process rights over the years but after title ix adjudication that occurred. after oberlin college changes schools or procedure the sixth circuit of the u.s. court of appeals strongly reprimanded the college, noting that in this country we determine guilt or innocence individually rather than collectively based on one's identification with some demographic group and concluded the institution's expulsion of a student was arguably inexplicable. a similar case out of purdue university where that university refused to allow the accused to see the evidence against him. secretary mcmahon could you talk about the efforts of the department to ensure education and the educational institutions know their obligations under title ix to protect the due process rights of their students

as well as the victims of misconduct? >> certainly this administration has shown that it is absolute committed to protecting title ix. not only keeping men out of women sports and women are put at a disadvantage when men are allowed to compete. they can miss scholastic opportunities for their own personal safety. i absolutely believe we are their presence issued an executive order to that effect as well as well as the fact i do believe it's coming under title ix. and the due process apportioned at our university is very important we continue to look at that to make sure as you said victims and those are protected under due process.

>> i think that is correct. i think too many times these title ix adjudications are run by folks of the di vent. many times you could be guilty until proven innocent assumption and a lack of due process. i think you and the trump administration for your commitment to restoring title ix to its original purpose as opposed to being a weaponize for ideological political ads. thank you so much for being the force here today at madam secretary. i yield back. i think the gentleman i recognize a gentle lady from minnesota. >> thank you chairman thank you madam secretary for being here with us. is it fair to assume you are aware that when a student loan borrower is defrauded by a school there is a provision, yes

i am. >> it is a straightforward concept the student should not be forced to repay loans to schools that lie to them. we know that millions of federal grants and loans go out the door while students are left with education it's not worthy. i was actually surprised a few weeks ago in your department $37 million fine that was placed against grand canyon university can explain why that happened? >> let me see for a second period let me review my notes on that. there were a couple of things i wanted to make sure i covered with you. >> we really found the accusations against grand canyon, which is a faith-based organization we looked at all

the facts of the case for. >> i am familiar. my question is, how are those students going to be made whole if you are not allowing that university to pay the fine? what's the plan? >> i am not sure that's the right analysis of it but i will look into it further and get back to you. you should get back yes i will. >> because we know that president in whom you serve had a fraudulent university cultural university he himself settled three lawsuits before becoming president. we know there are roughly 1.4 million borrowers who have been approved for borrowers defense discharge are still waiting for that. how are you clearing up the backlog? >> in terms of the borrowed defense funds? there are lists i will be happy to back to you with those numbers. >> okay while those students

awaits, can you give us a commitment you are not going to collect that debt? >> i'll have to get back to you on that or agency of the situation is picks i don't understand why that's not question to say yes to their being defrauded. they're waiting for relief. while they wait for their relief they should not have to pay back the debt. >> if they have been defrauded it's been adjudicated they been defrauded that i will get back to you as to what the timeframe is why there's old there is i'm not sure is a city right now. >> wonderful. i know that you have been question a lot on idea and its funding. i will not relitigate those questions i've too particular questions to address. we know the ida that you have gotten rid of the legal team

that guides the states and implementation. how are you going to rectify that? >> i don't know what you've gotten rid of the legalzoom question we've had reduction in force. >> the firing of the entire legal team. >> we have other lawyers in place at the department of education. >> the entire team that was for ida has been fired. how are you addressing that? >> because we have other lawyers in place that can handle those things. and as i mentioned before we have not missed any of our statutory requirements. >> i do believe that firing hurts the implementation. we also note you have got to the office of civil rights one there is already investigation backlog. how are you going to fix the

discrimination claim cases that are out there? >> excuse me there are cases that we are looking into. and again we have not missed any of our statutory requirements. we also have the task force. there's a backlog. there are a lot of kids in our schools that are waiting for relief to get rid of the people that are supposed to carry out those investigations. how are you to assure those kids will not continue to be harmed? we are talking about so many situations where kids are being discriminated against. you got rid of the people who investigated those investigations. so those kids can protect themselves from discrimination. >> we still have a very strong and capable staff and ocr for. >> that you would not have the backlog up that's the case there's a curtain backlog i would love for you to stop saying words and to actually do

the work you are charged by statue and i yield back because i think the gentle lady i now recognize now the gentleman from pennsylvania mr. thompson. >> think it mr. chairman thank you at secretary mcmahon for being here today for your continued public service to our country. as you likely know i cochaired the bipartisan caucus for more than a decade. i am proud to be the champion for cte here on the hill alongside my good friend. madam secretary, during her yourconfirmation hearing as glao hear about your commitment the author of technical education of the 21st century act signed into law by president trump 2018 thrilled to see the growth and success of these programs. typically when i visit these

programs that i see waiting list. i see schools investing in bricks and mortar to expand their footprint eight more secondary and postsecondary students, really working to restore opportunity for so many today nearly 12 and half million students nationwide, a number that's continued to grow since 2018 certain career and technical education programs. at the secondary level students graduate pathways have an amazing 96% rate. far higher than the national average. high school ct concentrators are also more likely to be employed full-time and have higher earnings eight years post- graduation than their counterparts. a great pathway to success in life. madam secretary would you agree ct programs help incentivize a workforce and skills development?

>> yes, i do. >> the reason we obviously know this information and contract the ct success and made positive reforms in 2018 was because of the data. without good data it's hard to make good decisions as members of congress. i have written about this issue to you before but i'm still concerned about the department's decision to cancel national evaluation of career and technical education under perkins. this five year evaluation was mandated by law and perkins five. it was set to be completed this year's congress begins work to reauthorize the time to do perkins or the reauthorization time. when you reauthorize you and to refine, you want to improve, you want to maximize opportunities. we need data to do that. it's better to legislate based on data not emotion. so, madam secretary how does the department plan to make sure

there's still a level of infrastructure in place to support evidence-based policymaking cte without losing the nearly five years worth of data that's already been collected? >> we are going to continue to collect the data that we need to collect were going to make sure the perkins program as a congress wheat want to provide to you the best data possible. we have made changes in some of the educational data collecting. i'm not sure if that's really pertinent to the perkins data so much as it was the scoring and other educational policies i would like to get back to after clarify that very. >> that would be great look forward to working with you. it would cause me concern when you're collecting the data that we use a different methodology.

we need consistency in terms of data. consistency is important in the statistical collection of data. so quite frankly i look forward to working with you because we need to go back and finish the process that we legislate in the way we did the first five years. i think that set it up nicely for doing a great perkins six reauthorization. additionally f.2826 budget proposed reprioritizing cte grants of the only support middle and high school students at the district level. however, under current law states are explicitly granted to best split their ct resources from a secondary post secondary systems is the post secondary ct programs continue to provide valuable pathways for learners of all ages. these are incredible programs that he take every opportunity to visit those to see the fruits as i do with president trump under trump 45.

what that modernizing education between first century but would you explain why the administration is seeking to limit ct funds kate -- 12 despite perkins explicitly supporting student transitions beyond high school including into apprenticeship and other postsecondary pathways? another area i look forward to working with you personally on precooked think you're look for to that as well. no the president and the budget supports the directive the president's executive order and preparing americans for high paying skilled jobs. that's one of the things we like to focus on as well. >> that would be great for the action by the department was contrary to that. >> a gentlest time is expired. i think the gentleman. i now recognize the gentleman from north carolina mr. harris. correct thank you, mr. chairman and thank you madam secretary been a lot said about the

closing of the department of education and the activities that are being ensued. but madam secretary want to ask you is education mentioned in our constitution? >> i don't believe it is in terms of directives or agencies. >> correct. our tenth amendment says the powers not delegated to the federal government by the constitution are reserved to who exactly? >> states, states and the people my wife teaches eighth grade u.s. history. even her eighth graders can piece together that if it is not mentioned in the constitution at that must've fall to the states into the people. sadly some of our federal judges need to go back to the eighth grade and have that kind of class. let me ask you this you think a single district judge should be able to stop the constitutional actions of a president?

>> i certainly think that is a question that is now before the courts i think it will be properly adjudicated. >> well, unfortunately that is exactly what happened prejudge one in boston issued up luminary injunction to stop several president trump's education related executive orders including the one directing you to take steps to close the department. so, i want to take a moment to set the record straight from the nation and ask you, president trump's executive order in march about closing the department ever tell you to ignore the law? >> no in fact it says specifically in the executive order to do it lawfully. >> exactly. very clearly says limit quota for the record, the secretary of education shall, to the maximum extent appropriate and permitted by law take all necessary steps to facilitate the closure of the department of education return

authority over education to the states and local communities while ensuring the effective and uninterrupted delivery of services, programs and benefits on which americans rely. it seems that congress is the one out of line with the constitution and establishing a department of education in the first place. and i for one to happen to agree one 100% with you and president trump that we must send education back to our states. that process does not mean ignoring the laws on the books. so, what steps have you taken a follow the constitution and carry out president trump's lawful order to move the department of education towards closure? >> what i have said from the beginning, in fact to my confirmation hearing when i was asked specifically i said i would like to work with congress as we look at the plans for shutting down the department of education which of those agencies can carry out the

obligations that are currently now funneling through the department of education so it was always my goal and will continue to be my goal as i know it will take congressional action to close the department of education to work with congress to do that. >> are there any specific needs from congress that you have that you would ask us to help in accomplishing your task? >> i think they will come as we want to sit down as we lay out more of the plan and the timeline for where we think different agencies could accommodate the rule right now with the department of education. >> okay. >> on another subject madam secretary do you agree that it's a privilege for foreign students to attend american universities and not a right? what said you think it's a privilege >> do you agree it's a privilege for universities to enroll foreign students, not a right? >> i think the right is the education here in our country it

is a privilege for those foreign students to come and attend our universities. >> do you agree the safety of american students should be a top priority especially when considering who to let on campus? >> yes, i do >> recently the department of state and as a temporary pause in interviews for student pieces with plans to update the policies on his screening even social media for applicants. this comes after we have seen an incredible rise in the violence and anti-semitic protest on college campuses across the nation. i want to ask in the closing is your department knows a connection between the schools that fail to follow the law and report foreign donations and the prevalence of anti-semitism on campuses? >> one of things we have asked this is exactly where the issues that came up with harvard. so we are looking at all universities investigate to make sure that under section 117 they are as they are required to report the amounts and sources

of those donations to the university. >> thank you. excellent prey thank you so much for the work you are doing mr. chairman without a go back my time. thank the gentleman i recognize the ranking member from virginia at mr. scott. >> thank you, thank you madam secretary being with us today. i have a lot of questions and help them get some quick answers and traits to raise them in a way then get some quick answers. do you intend to comply with the may 22 court order? >> may 22 and which were joint in this particular aspect can you be more specific question of course a court order issued may 22 requiring you, it prevented you from dismantling the department. >> oh yes we will always comply with the law. >> you indicate proposals for

the department of education going forward can we count on receiving those proposals as they are made to with the best of that information? >> certainly would like to comply with congress and provide you with those. >> can we get a commitment from you that you will cooperate with the office of inspector general and the department of education as a law requires? >> yes is the law requires we will. on the budget of the 2026 budget, workforce development programs have combined the dust settles do we understand will be but a 33% cut in workforce development programs? >> we aren't looking at workforce development and wanting to make sure that it is treated fairly. right now the united states government, taxpayers are footing the bill for about 75% of that.

and we want to reverse that. we want the businesses or that universities to pay the 75% and taxpayers pay the 25%. i think that's a better proposal for workforce development pickwick so under sent to be a yes it's about a 33% cut? >> i will get back to you if it's different than that. >> pending reconciliation bill, that is the one that is tax breaks for the wealthy and cuts to health care and medicaid cbo says at least 13 million people will lose their insurance it's probably going to be more than that because changes are made in the bill. snap benefit cuts in access to college with cuts in student loans and pell grants for 2026 budget cut work-study on top of those cuts? >> i would really appreciate the opportunity to respond to those if they were written questions i think we can explain them better and i can work with you on that.

>> title one you said was level funding i assume that means it was protected. i assume it means its level funding without an adjustment for inflation. >> 1a. >> and no adjustment for inflation? >> notes level funded. >> the trio you sent publicly there were problems with evaluating the program so the department of education now evaluates the trio programs for effectiveness. >> we would like to be able to look at them and have full accountability for those programs but we are precluded from doing that by the way trio is structured. f us believe the department has evaluations right there in the department of education. do you deny they exist? sec. mcmahon: there are some evaluations but in terms of the longer effective trio, there are

specific language that prevents us from doing it. i would like to have the ability the ability of treo is reappropriated we would be able to change that language and to get the possibility of the program >> student loans, would you commit to working with us, about 2 million student loan bar your borrowers who have an income driven repayment program caught up in a backlog, can we count on you to work with us to make sure they're not disadvantaged? >> we are working relative to all those loans in the fall with several programs for repayment and we urge students who have borrowed money and are in default now to test if ... >> there in a backlog so will you work with us to make sure they're not caught up in the

backlog. i had a title vi question which is is it true the office of civil rights investigates allegations of violations of title 6? >> the office of civil rights , yes we do that. >> and on title vi are you aware of the process that requires you to in case according to the wall in case of any action terminating or refusing to grant continued assistance failure to comply with a requirement with an agency must notify the committees of the house and senate having jurisdiction over the program involved a full written report on the circumstances and grounds for such action, no such action shall become effective until 30 days after the filing of such report, do you know if the department of education has filed a report with this committee and any action you've taken? >> i will have to get back ito

you to assure you my answer is correct. >> the gentlemen's time is .xpired >> just one more quick question that is his lack of viewpoint diversity a violation of title 6? >> the gentlemen's time is expired and i will ask the secretary to respond later. i now turn and recognize the long-suffering, ever patient gentleman from florida mr. fine. >> thank you mr. chairman, you can see my fidgeting, i guess it's new guy i was having to listen to these questions, it's a privilege to ask you questions, i want to say to you one follow-up from the meeting and also meet with your accountant, the tax benefit will be zero because we are not lowering any rates so that you will continue to paywhat you haven't paid , i tdon't know

why people continue to lie about that but i want to ask you something different . in the world we live in today jews are scared and i skied not speak not just as congressman the father of two jewish boys, 17 and 13 years old and i speak as an alumni of harvard and i've gotta go back and check the date in the 90s, one in three professors or conservatives because i didn't see them anywhere when i was there i will tell you as a jewish conservative at harvard in the 90s despite lithe fact they tried to kick me out twice i never felt unsafe . as a jewish student, never once, sometimes felt persecuted because of my political views but not once in six years because i went there twice did i feel unsafe but students do now and i am aware this key by now, it's a new habit of mine at my son's request because of all the students who don't feel safe

wearing fares and with my 17-year-old when he was born actually 17 years ago i had a dream he would follow me to where i went to school and now we are in the next few weeks where it's time for him to start thinking about where you will apply to college and i don't weknow that i would go to college at all in the days we live in so my question is this, given jews are scared there are things we can do on our college campuses and thank you for what you are doing but i believe a lot of this problem is coming from foreign influence, our universities are taking money from countries that do not share our values and do not like our politics and do not like our people and those dollars come at a price, what they do, they don't just give a donation they say we're going to endow the school, and our yoprofessorship, we want you to take our students from other countries and what are things we can do to work together so countries like china or qatar which are clearly not looking out for the interests of americans that we can get that under control in our higher

education system? >> thank you for that and i'm glad you felt safe because there are clearly so many students doubt that do not feel safe and i've talked to them and they told me no child going to college at any school today should feel unsafe in the environment of their education so i regret that but what we are doing is we've reaffirmed the section 117 compliance from universities, they must tell us, they are already required to report this and they're not so we are requiring them to report amounts because we want to make sure there's not foreign influence with that . that the act is for a purpose. that's really what we are supporting. >> i'd like to work with you because even if you look at

places like columbia it's generally not the physics department where we see the problems, is not generally in what i will call real degrees, it's in this creation of what i will call free starbucks employment degrees like gender start studies in these other silly things where you can't get a job which are nothing more than factories to greet people to go protest where we have these things so i'd like to work with you on that and i also want to ask you this, we subsidize these degrees, the idea these schools walk around and say their private is false because they couldn't operate without the beneficiary of the united states government so does it make sense for us to look at the idea as a if you want to get a studentloan to go to college you got to get a degree in something where you might be able to do something useful when you're done with it . >> i think that's one of the things i was discussing before that i would like to see universities have more ar skin in the game because if they have more skin in the game they will make sure that subsidies and degrees they are offering are going to provide diplomas and pathways to employment which those

students will be able to pay their loans because if there on the hook for part of that money they're not going to want to have to pay if that student is not successful. >> i want to close by thanking you and ocpres. trump for what you're doing because you are fighting the fight, one of the backlogs i didn't hear the democrats ask about was the end anti-semitism on college campuses worked which weren't worked on, thank you for dealing withthat backlog but i am prepared to work with you on any of these issues whenever you need it and thank you . >> i think the gentlemen and recognize the gentleman from indiana for the last word and questioning . >> thank you mr.chairman and thank you secretary for being here . secretary we've heard all kinds of scaremongering from th the left where congress are

blatantly violating the law when it comes to fraud waste and abuse which you eliminated, ithink that's ridiculous and you can you reaffirm once liagain your department is following the law and will continue to execute all laws passed by congress. >> yes sir we will . >> also how ndwill the department balance the needs of localities serving flexible delivery to ckrespond to local workforce needs while ensuring programs are not hijacked by woke ideology . >> we are continuing the funding for cpe and i couldn't be more strongly supportive of our career technical education programs. and i want to see them started earlier in schools, middle schools, high schools, community colleges, there are many pathways to opportunities for success for uniform employment and i think we have to make sure we are continuing to focus on developing those. whether it's public-private partnerships there are a lot of companies that work with

community colleges to put funds into those community colleges to help develop curriculum, for instance i know in west virginia there's a program toyota has come in and they built a toyota center at one of the community colleges and the students who were a there trained at the plant and take part in courses at the toyota center and its workforce building. >> my workforce as well. >> those are the things we want to see continuing to o happen . >> we need to maintain dilocal flexibility because the workforce needs are very diverse so thank you . awesome, the state of indiana has been a leader in school choice and leading the charge in trade and creating a comprehensive agenda for k-12. ensuring families have the best access for their choices, what steps are the department planning for returning policy decisions to the state and local level to ensure states like indiana

editor-in-chief their pro student educationpolicy ? >> we want to make sure we are offering the opportunity i think for choice, freedom of choice in the schools so by increasing the charter school budget, one of the things the president would like to see are the potential for more charter schools to get started and often when charter schools and i haven't talked about this today, there often started in low economic areas to provide education for the students that are being left behind and aren't performing at levels other students are so we have this twice, and competitive factors in our states, we are seeing the levels across all schools, the rising tide lifts all boats and it does give opportunities when we have the choice that the state

would like to see. >> we seen the highest utilization of the charter schools in low income minority areas . thank you. >> not indiana but i have visited some of those charter schools and seeing the results because it's often there is economic students there so overlooked and say there is no need to waste any money there because that's where we need to spend money to make sure they have equal opportunity as well. >> i appreciate your support and yield back my time . >> i think the gentlemen and want to thank the committee for your attention to this hearing today. i want to thank the secretary for your diligence in being here, your patience, pit's been a long hearing and we appreciate you being here. if there are no further questions i recognize the ranking member for his closing remarks. >> thank you mr. chairman and thank the secretary for being with us today, we are here to

consider the effect of the president's 2026 budget on programs within the jurisdiction of the career and education workforce to begin that consideration while legislation passed by the house and pending in the senate showers tax breaks on the wealthy and cuts medicaid and funding for programs that give access to college while adding trillions of dollars of additional debt. on top of the cuts in that bill the 2026 proposal further cuts pell grants, reduces work-study, eliminates europe carryover programs and as we consider the budget we also consider the federal court orders that have ordered the administration to start dismantling the department of education without congressional authority. we have heard problems of test scores but no plan to do anything about it, handcuffs

on teachers when whatever handcuffs there may be our locally imposed not on federal government. you've heard there's no federal role in curriculum , teacher quality or anything like that and it's been emphasized what the department of education responsibility is is basically civil rights to make sure all children have access to a quality education. so we've heard support for those rs but we know programs have not been shown to improve education but have been shown to increase racial segregation and finally mr. chairman you rescued the secretary when i asked whether or notviewpoint diversity is a violation of title vi . i guess we will get that as an answer later. but i cited the statutory requirement that if you're going to take any action on

anti-semitism or any violation of title vi you have to give notice to the committees of jurisdiction . mr. chairman as she indicated she may have given notice and if so you haven't shared that information with the t democrats on the committee and i'd like to see that because it requires before any action can be taken you have to provide a complete report, one that the situation and wait atleast 30 days before any action has been taken . we will just see what the answer to that is and i will look for an answer from you but we have a lot of work to do, we're trying to improve education and from a federal level the cuts in education,

no increase, inflationary increase on title 1, that's a major investment we make in k-12, cuts in pell grants and student loans, that our major and access to college, and ithink we're going in the wrong direction . hopefully when legislation is considered by the house we can make the appropriate ap adjustments . thank you mr. chairman, i yield back. >> i think the gentleman as well and we look forward to working and discussing with you what's going on and s we've been pretty busy doing that effort in the one big beautiful bill, the reconciliation. as you know we've been extremely busy on that with the purpose of making things better for the taxpayers. and for the students, universities, community colleges, trade schools, workforce, all the rest, for quite some time now and we look forward to more fully involving ourselves

with the budget posed by the president and even as we started today i would also state two years while the democrats had the full majority including white house, the house and senate. the opportunities to improve education multiple ways, even as being expressed by some of my democraticcolleagues now , it didn't happen . being a student of mhistory's to some degree myself looking back and seeing the impact of education in a country that produced such revelations as agricultural revolution, communications revolution, space age, all the rest came to four with the department of education. with more local control. with k-12 systems under control of the states and local communities, school

boards, parents. right now we are attempting to go that direction . it was disconcerting to hear some of my colleagues talk about doing away with healthcare. lunch programs. exceptions for students when in fact that's not the case and our president stood very strong in saying that medicaid, medicare, school lunches were not to be cut from deserving individuals. waste fraud and abuse, yes, my colleagues voted for waste fraud and abuse to be continued but today we're looking at what we can do to get to a place where the department of education is at its right spot at the gentleman, colleague from north carolina so eloquently

pointed out in our u.s. constitution we don't have responsibility for education accept what we have taken outside of the constitution so it would be hard constantly to experience the efforts of an administration emitted following the constitution relative to states rights and responsibility for education and it would be con founding to some that enter service can come from a smaller more efficient bureaucracy. certain states are taking education improvement into their own hands and succeeding . and others will have to decide to compete as well if they will follow. joyce, true choice in education will handle so much diversity. bias will generally failunder its own weight . having light on the extent of the ingrown one-sided liberal bias on our public campuses will bethreatening . but change i believe will result from that. the congressional budget

office relative to the tax cut and jobs act was off by 180b0. they cost about $1.5 trillion shortfall that would result from the tax cut and jobs act, it was just the opposite, $1.5 trillion to the good and i believe what we've just done reconciliation and the one big beautiful bill will be a facilitator for a lot of growth and opportunity. again, students, parents and teachers, if we get those three component parts right in education we will succeed. and that allows local district control as well so i appreciate the passionate debate that went on today, the questioning, the answers and sometimes answers that couldn't be given because it was based on bastions without fact . thank you again for

being with us, no further business before the committee i call it adjourned. >> american history tv exploring the people and events that tell the american story, this weekend at 7 pm eastern diane geisel a retired new york supreme court judge and author of the book when charlie met john talked about legendary actor charlie chaplin's legal trials and the implications for american law celebrity culture and cold war politics . then at 9:30 p.m. eastern on the presidency jerry: if you spoke life after power addresses the question how does the former head of the free world spend his

retirement? he looks at seven presidents, thomas jefferson, john seattle, grover cleveland, william howard taft, jimmy carter and george w. bush for the answer and at 10:30 p.m. eastern a look at the allied invasion of normandy 81 years later with the us army film detailing the summaries of the airborne invasion on d-day then author garrett graff on his oral history of the invasion and the us army film details logistics of treating wounded soldiers in the field and english hospitals during the invasion . exploring the american story: watch american history tv saturdays on c-span 2 or watch online anytime cspan.org/history. >> if you miss any of

c-span's coverage find it anytime online at cspan.org. videos of key hearings debates and other events feature markers that guide you to newsworthy highlights. these points of interest markers appear on the right-hand side of your screen when you hit play on select videos. this timeline makes it easy to get an idea of what was debated and decided in washington . scroll through and spend a few minutes on points of interest. >>