tv Key Capitol Hill Hearings CSPAN August 28, 2014 2:00pm-4:01pm EDT
but that said, and one could say the same thing in europe, that said, unless you address conditions and unless the country's policy looks better for some youth, you're not giving them a reason not to be radicalized. and i think that that's also part of it. if there's a sense that u.s. policy isn't -- is actually part of the problem, etc., then you've got a situation for, you know, for some to just feel that they must act. i wouldn't exaggerate. we definitely have to be concerned about terrorism in america. but i would be more concerned with terrorists coming in, you know, than actually our domestic population. it's not that some of our population won't go out and there will be some in our population that will do something but if you actually take a look at, you know, most polls and if you're out there in communities, the vast majority of american muslims, the one thing we have is that
they are so fully integrated economically, etc. so you don't have youth who feel that they are alienated, marginalized, don't have a job, etc., in the way you can have it in areas of europe which can concede disaffection. >> the last question on the issue of isis competitors. >> i'll just say that one of the -- sometimes there are really bad ideas in policy debates. i think one of them, and it really takes your breath away, is this notion suggested by some even in the administration that if we kind of take a step back and let isis and other extremists fight it out with the assad regime and hezbollah and the you'reian backers that both sides would end up weakened and i remember when i first heard this and said ok, but can't imagine anything that's turned out more long. the opposite is true and both were strengthened tremendously. this was their training ground fighting each other and became much better fighters over the course of that.
and this is sort of the sarah palin position, let it all sort it outside. steven walt wrote a piece which is essentially let them bleed and he's still writing it now which i can't understand. but the obama administration policy explicitly agreed with some of those assumptions and it doesn't work that way. >> thank you so much for coming. i'd like to say that twitter is calling this a real powerhouse hamad and sposito, dunne. thank you for coming. this was a really special event. [applause] aptioning n-ed by national
captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp.2014] >> the adefenda is adopted in concurrence to rule 37 of the council's rules of procedure, i invite the representative of ukraine to participate in this meeting. >> >> it is so decided. >> in accordance with rule 39 of the council's provision of rules of procedure, i invite mr. jeffrey feldman undersecretary-general of political affairs to participate in this meeting. it is so decided. the security council will now begin its consideration of item 2 of the agenda. i give the floor to mr. jeffrey felton. >> mr. president and distinguished members of the council, once more, we meet today emits reports of a dangerous escalation of a crisis in ukraine. august 26 official meeting between president putin and
president porshanko as well as a round of multilateral shots have been escalated bience fight finding in southeastern ukraine. this morning, ukrainian president asked the world to, quote, pay attention to the sharply worsening situation in ukraine, end quote. we are here because we are paying attention. but we also must find a constructive way to urgently address the crisis. the implications go far beyond u crane and the region. illegal arm groups operating in the donesk region have reportedly intensified their activities in the last few days, spreading violence in ukraine's southern coast in the direction of the strategic port of maripold. and it's reported several small towns andvilleages are now in the midst of heavy fighting. and one town has been ceased by
armed groups. the southward spread of fighting along the border with the russian federation in the seas has marked a dangerous escalation in the conflict. the battle for lohans continues and hostilitying in several key strategic areas has been spreading. we cannot ignore the deeply alarming reports of russian military involvement in this new wave of escalation. if confirmed, it would constitute a direct contravention of international law and of the u.n. charter. the united nations has no independent means of verifying this information and the russian federation has staunchly rejected these reports. today we have been in touch with ambassador aprikan the head of the special monitoring position and informed us here's currently no s.&m presence in maripold though the
osce is in the process of deploying a team to these areas. this will be critical as we seek factual information to what is precisely unfolding on the ground. mr. president and ladies and gentlemen, the situation on and around the border between ukraine and the russian confederation is of particular concern and remains a key obstacle to the deescalation of e situation on the ground as arms and heavy weaponry continues to flow unawaited from russia. there's an urgent need to secure a border within the two country with international verification as discussed in the talks. if this regard, we take note of the recent statement made by president pora shmbings anko that the first bilateral confrontations between the border guards of ukraine and the russian federation are scheduled for august 30.
it is himself critical the elections announced october 26 can take place throughout ukraine and become a unifying and recollect on kill tore mechanism that will ensure people throughout the country feel represented in kiev. ladies and gentlemen, let me quote the second general's statement of earlier today. i quote, the international community cannot allow the situation to escalate further, nor can we allow a continuation of the violence and destruction that this conflict has wrought in eastern ukraine. the secretary-general notes the recent multilateral talks in minsk on august 26 as well as the first official meeting of the president of ukraine and russia. he calls for continuity of ese talks with a view of forging a peaceful way out of the conflict based on the president's peace plan. all must do their part to
contribute to the peaceful resolution of this conflict in a manner upholding ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity. we have to double our efforts to very solve the conflict in ukraine. lives have to be saved. peace in ukraine means now and beyond. the secretary-general remains committed to use his good office to resolve the crisis and we'll keep the council informed of the collective efforts of this organization to help the ukrainian people and last week the secretary general sent me to kiev to consult with officials on the way forward and undersecretary-general valerie amos whose visit overlapped with mine discussed how to bolster humanitarian efforts. in her field visit to eastern ukraine, she reported on impressive efforts by the ukrainian authorities to
restore normalcy in areas regained by the government from the armed groups. currently assistant secretary-general for human rights, is in ukraine and the u.s. country team remains engaged in working with ukrainian counterparts on humanitarian and development issues. and we continue to coordinate with other international partners, including the osce and the netherlands on the aftermath of the downing of m-817. but the immediate focus must be to find ways to reverse the dangerous escalation of fighting that's occurred over the past 48 hours and move quickly away from armed conflict and towards political solutions and dialogue. thank you, mr. president and distinguished members of the council. >> i thank mr. feltman for his briefing and i now give the floor to members of the
security council and i give the floor to the representative of lithuania. >> mr. president, thank you for conducting this urgent meeting. lithuania condemns in the strongest terms of the invasion of the ukraine territory by the armed forces of the russian federation as a open violation of ukraine's independent sovereignty and integrity and a serious blow to peace, security and stability across the entire region and well beyond. for most we have watched countless violations of ukraine's territorial integrity and a war initiated by russia and fringe separatist groups in ukraine and provocative man igslations with humanitarian trucks and soldiers lost on the other side of the border and forces on ukraine's sovereign territory. as the last day, reported troops from russian 98th guard airborne division have taken over ukraine cities. previously safe areas of ukraine have been affected, expanding the zone of conflict. i quote, there are active
soldiers fighting among us who prefer to spend their vacation not on the beach but with us, among their brothers who are fighting for their freedoms, says one man. a rebel commander in the south proclaimed minister of nonexistent donesk people's republic bolstering an interview on the russian television adding there were some 3,000 to 4,000 russians among the separatist strength. a member of the advisory council of the human rights said on thursday she believed russia was carrying out an invasion of ukraine. i quote, when masses of people under commander's orders on tanks and with use of heavy weapons are in a territory of another country across the border, i consider this an invasion, end of quote. such actions by the russian federation are a gross violation of u.n. charter in particular paragraph 4 of article 2 and other fundamental principles as we have said at this council many times before and international law including the helsinki act, the 1997 treaty of friendship,
cooperation and partnership between russia and ukraine and a 1984 budapest memorandum whereby ukraine denounced its nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees, specifically budapest memorandums articles 1 and 2 propose clear cut obligations on russia to respect their political independence and the territorial integrity of ukraine within the borders of 1994 and not to threaten it or use force by any means. mr. president, by now this council has held close to 30 meetings on ukraine and heard numerous assurances by russia here and elsewhere regarding its desire for a solution in for the crisis in ukraine. all this time instead of seeking the solution, russia has been escalating the situation as a flow of weapons, equipment, mercenaries and now troops continue across russia's borders in the territory of ukraine. let us be clear, weapons don't fall in the hands of rebels out of the blue skies. had not been for russia's continuous active support the illegal separatists, a clear minority in the region they
claim to represent would have long ago run out of team and weaponry. eastern ukraine would have been coming back on its feet and i.d.p. flows would have stop and reversed and normal lives have been lost. this conflict has claimed too many lives. even modern estimates show there are over 2,000 killed since april. all this speaks about over 200,000 i.d.p.'s and around 3.9 million people affected by the conflict. as of august 156789 people are dying in ukraine because of the criminal acts by the illegal separatists and the russian supporters. soldiers, citizens of russia are also now losing their lives in this criminal war against the state of ukraine. as reported by various sources. the mothers of russian soldiers are seeking answers regarding their children. at least 400 dead. journalists who are trying to investigate and report on the soldiers have been threatened and harassed. how many more lives need to be lost and maimed for russia to realize its follow i why of aggression against ue contain.
ukraine doesn't need more humanitarian convoys, ukraine does not need more russian tanks or separatist bans. what ukraine needs is a most urgent return by russia to the internationally accepted norms of behavior in compliance with international law and with respect to the law which russia bears a special responsibility. lithuania calls in the strongest of terms on russia to come back to its senses and to comply with the principles and purposes of the u.n. charter to immediately withdraw its military forces, weaponry and equipment from the sovereign territory of ukraine, to secure its borders, cease shelling of ukraine from the russian territory and urgently end all support to the illegal armed separatist groups in the east of ukraine. president poroshenko's peace plan must be implemented. as for russia's statement whose statement is so often lamented by russia, that statement as well as any cease-fire must be implemented by all sides including the illegal separatists and including russia itself.
anything less than that equals to a cynical demand for ukraine's unconditional surrounder. like any sovereign member of the united nations, ukraine has a right to defend itself as per article 51 of the u.n. charter. that right cannot be taken by anyone. mr. president, for too long now we have watched russia's creeping attack against ukraine sovereignty and integrity and because it was happening one step at a time, our response has been like that of the proceed verbal boiling frog, once international laws get so brazenly broken as they are of the ukraine, it would be naive to think such disregard for international norms of behavior will stop at that and not creep even further. are we willing to take such risks? i thank you, mr. president. >> i thank the representative of lithuania for her statement and now give the floor to the representative of france. >>
[speaking in french] >> the information we have coming from the ground is quite disturbing, the actions carried out by the separatists and the intensification of fighting in the urban areas has led to serious humanitarian consequences. today we are calling upon all parties for restraint to protect the civilian population and to respect international humanitarian law, bearing in mind the hundreds of thousands of terrorized and displaced persons. mr. president, the support of russia for the separatists in violation of the territorial integrity of the ukraine is inadmissible. the presence of russian soldiers on ukrainian territory and their direct participation alongside separatists in the taking of lives cannot be tolerated. as recalled by the president of the french republic this morning, russia must respect the sovereignty of ukraine and must stop its support for the separatists and it must call upon them to accept a bilateral
cease-fire. it is in this framework that we must seek a lasting political settlement but moscow must agree to de-escalate. that presupposes in the immediate future the halting and arrival of military material d. e to the separatist controlled along the russian and ukrainian borders and on this issues are respecting russia to engage in a serious and beneficial political dialogue, beneficial for all. the worsening and prolongation of the conflict is not in the interest of ukraine or russia or the international community. mr. president, the holding of the august 26 in minsk could be of a meeting between mr. boroshenko and mr. putin though it did not lead to results was a positive step in that it led to direct contact between the two presidents following the meeting on june 6.
the ukrainian crisis is one of the worst crisis in europe since the end of the cold war. our objective is to arrive finally at a lasting political solution to this crisis which has lasted far too long but while russia pursues escalation, it will not if a an opportunity to resume political dialogue and we will keep the pressure on. it is for that reason the european union adopted on july 29 a substantial package of economic and sec tearal sanctions against russia and these sanctions will be maintained and increased if the escalation were to be pursued. we hope we would not get to that point and it's not in the interest of russia or anyone. thank you. >> i thank the representative of france for his statement and give the floor to the representative of jordan. [speaking in foreign language] >> thank you, mr. president. we'd like to extend our thanks to mr. feltman for his briefing on the situation in ukraine. jordan expresses its concern,
its deep concern in the escalation of the crisis in kraine and the situation there . and jordan reaffirms respect for -- need to respect for the sovereignty of ukraine and the territory and integrity and to not commit any provocative action that would threaten its security and peace. this behavior will only complicate matters in the east of ukraine and impact negatively peace. we call upon all parties to not -- not to resort to military means and to cooperate to reach a peaceful solution based on the charter of the united nations and the rules of international law and all attempts made during the past months, including agreements signed between the two parties. ere's an urgent need to make assistance reach those who need it by the isic and other
organizations for humanitarian relief. this assistance must not be politicized. it must remain a humanitarian task to help those who need them. we also reiterate the need to translate the outcome of the belarus summit to lead to progress in peace talks and release all hot continuals. in this respect, we call upon both parties, the russian and the ukrainian parties, to ontinue talking and consulting and hopefully lead to peace between the two parties. we also hope that they can link peace to political and economic interests for the good of the people of both parties. this escalation would increase risk that would threaten the security of russia and ukraine and all of the region. jordan calls upon the united nations and all other parties to take steps in the direction
dialogue of russia and ukraine and build on the efforts made to protect the security of ukraine including mechanisms that would protect civilians and make sure that assistance would reach those who need it. jordan believes that a peace between the two parties would require a political will by all parties and goodwill and a realization that provocation with the ministry or otherwise would not lead to peace but more escalation and more worsening of the situation. thank you, sir. >> i thank the representative of jordan for her statement and i now give the floor to the representative of luxembourg. [speaking in foreign language] >> thank you, mr. president. i would also like to thank jeffrey feltman for his briefing. we are quite concerned by the serious deterioration of the
situation in the areas controlled by separatists in the donesk region as a result of increased fighting in these regions. we are also quite concerned by reports of a resumption of fighting in the southeast of raine near the city of maripold where separatists have taken control of the city. for several days there are reports of incushions -- incursions of russian troops on ukrainian territory in increased numbers. we are particularly concerned by reports of bombings of ukrainian territory from russia and violations of ukrainian airspace, any unilateral military action by the russian federation in ukraine regardless of the pretext would be humanitarian
a violation of the law. we cannot allow the sovereignty and territory of ukraine to be violated. the presence of russian combatants among separatists, including among their leaders is quite unacceptable and must be condemned in the strongest terms. it has been mentioned primarily in the various reports for the high commissioner of human rights for the situation in ue contain, -- in ukraine, it's been recognized by the leader of the separatists in donetsk who explained in a russian television interview the most recent successes of the separatists would not have been possible without the assistance of russian servicemen. today we are witnessing a new, dangerous stage in the escalation of violence in ukraine despite official russian proclamations calling for dialogue and deescalation. we urge the russian federation to put an immediate end to all
forms of hostile activity along the border, in particular the inflow of weapons, military advisors and army staff in the conflict zone and to withdraw its forces from the border. mr. president, as we see the ongoing deterioration on the ground, we need to find a lasting political solution to this crisis and it's evermore urgent. we therefore welcome the efforts undertaken by the secretary-general to promote dialogue between ukraine and the russian federation, in particular thanks to the missions of jeffrey feldman to the region. dialogue between ukraine and russia must be pursued in order to restore the sovereignty and the territorial integrity of ukraine. we welcome the meeting held the day before yesterday in minsk between the russian federation and ukraine, particularly in the presence of the european
union. we hope that they -- that those talks will lead to concrete results and in particular to the establishment of a roadmap based on president poroshenko's peace plan. we are hoping the consultations between russia and ukraine will ensure better control of the borders and will be held soon as the parties will lead to the release of -- discussions will lead to the release of prisoners we obtained -- detained by illegal armed groups. the try lateral talks initiated by the incumbent chair of the o.s.c. are key to this regard as is it deployment of the observers of the o.s.c., the two border posts along the russian ukrainian border and hope the mandate of the mission will be broadened so it can contribute to a comprehensive and bilateral control of the russian-ukrainian border. securing the border is key for the restoration of peace because it will put an end if he the flow of weapons and
weaponry to the separatists. mr. president, the solution to the ukrainian crisis can only be political, the russian federation must be an integral part of this effort in order to find a political solution rather than to continue to fuel this crisis which dates from another era. thank you. >> we thank the representative from luxembourg for his statement and now give the floor to the representative of chile. [speaking in a foreign language] >> thank you much, mr. president. we'd like to thank the undersecretary general jeffrey feldman for his report and would like to express our appreciation for the efforts the secretary-general has continued to make in order to put an end to the situation that ukraine is experiencing. chile would like to express our deep concern about the serious escalation of the crisis in particular of the regions of donetsk and luhansk.
it's essential to reverse the escalation in order to ensure that these regions return to peace and security because the situation there is already very dangerous and unpredictable. for all these reasons, we'd like to make an appeal to the parties to exercise maximum restraint and moderation and to cease all combat immediately. our country would like to repeat once again, as we've done systematically since the start of the crisis in ukraine, there's an obligation to respect the sovereignty, independent and territorial integrity of ukraine in conformity with the united nations and international law, as well as to observe the principle of nonintervention and noninterference in the internal affairs of another state and has been enshrined in the helsinki act that established the o.s.c.e. in which ukraine and russian are signatories as well as the budapest agreement that fully complied to russia and ukraine and other states. by virtue of what i've said,
we'd also like to state that the parties involved should refrain from carrying out activities that are incompassible with the charter of the united nations and international law. with this in mind, chile would like to make an appeal to the withdrawal of all foreign troops on ukrainian territory unless they've been expressly authorized by the legitimate authorities of the country. we are very worried by the humanitarian situation in the south and eastern parts of ukraine, especially with the regret of the growing number of i.d.p.'s and minorities. we're also worried about the increase in violations of human rights that have been recorded in this area. this makes it essential to immediately restore a rule of law in these regions and from this point, we'd like to note that humanitarian assistance initiative should be implemented with respect for the sovereignty of the ukraine and in conformity with the principles of the charter and international law and hope the mission in close cooperation with the special monitoring mission of the osce continue to play a constructive role in the
process of mitigating the tensions on the ground. as we have said previously, we'd like to repeat that accountability should be guaranteed with regret to all violations and loss of human lives and make sure those responsible, whoever they are, are brought to justice. we'd like to make once again an appeal to the parties to find a peaceful solution to this crisis through direct political dialogue, to refrain from adopting unilateral measures and to support international mediation initiatives in compliance with resolution 68-262. with this in mind, we welcome the meeting that was held between the presidents of ukraine and russia in minsk on august 26 and we encourage to continue these contacts and intensify in order to achieve a peaceful and rapid solution to the crisis in ukraine. also, we'd like to highlight the various initiatives of the secretary-general of the united nations and overall, of the whole u.n. system. they've tried since the beginning of the crisis to find
a peaceful solution to it. . chile says the time has come for an inclusive process that guaranteed the rules of law and respect for human rights as well as the sovereignty and independence and territorial integrity of the ukraine. in order to ensure conditions to ensure the people of ukraine. pretty. -- sovereignty. ongoing you for your efforts of the secretary-general that you are making on the process. evidence that a russianant numbers of o troops have moved into ukrainian
territory. edible reports that they are equipped with sophisticated weaponry are operating inside the crate. weaponses of advanced have been transferred to forces in ukraine. paratroopers have been captured in ukraine, and there are reports -- some were reports of hundreds of tanks traveling. hours,past 48 suffragists have conducted operations to save a coastal town, and several villages. reports that regular armed forces are involved are concerning. the development indicate a new dangers escalation of the crisis, which appears to be moving to a wider area of
ukraine and the southern land route to crimea. all this points to the use of force by russia. this would be a flagrant breach of ukraine sovereignty and a violation of the charter. these elements come against a back up of the other incidents, including the killing of the on august 22,sole the parading of soldiers on the 24th, and the contravention of the prohibition on humiliating treatment of prisoners of war and the geneva conventions. russian helicopter attack on a border in -- on the 25th of august in which -- were killed. of noninvolvement by russia, we have the public statement by a separate leader
-- claiming that up to 4000 russians -- since the conflict began. we are concerned the foreign said a second convoy would be sent to ukraine this week despite this proceeded without the participation of the icrc. it was described on the 24th as one in which russia showed flagrant disregard for international law. he further said convoys must be sent with the green mint of the ukrainian -- with the agreement of the ukrainian government. it had the potential for finding a romantic way to the crisis, but russia -- further escalation was happening. russia must immediately withdraw its personnel from ukrainian territory.
russia should withdraw all support from suppressed -- separatists. russia must control its border, since it is the only effect away from preventing troops entering ukraine and a key to a cease-fire. efforts must be made to engage in political dialogue. this depends on russia. while the focus of the discussion has been on the development in the last 48 hours, we must not lose sight of the resolution. significant progress has been made to the netherlands in identifying remains of victims and repatriating them. it also states the independent investigation to the cause of the crash is ongoing. the letter states it remains fully committed to ensuring accountability.
australia is working closely within the lower loans -- the netherlands. it is imperative all states fully implement the provisions of resolution 2166. thank you. >> i think the representative of australia for its statement. [speaking in french] make a presentation on the urgent situation in ukraine. would like to express its concern with regard to the rapid deterioration of the system in ukraine and in the donetsk region. of meaning of tuesday, 26 august, mr. putin is a step
towards the escalation of tension, but only two days later, reports indicate intensification of combat in the donetsk region in the presence of 1000 russian volunteers who supposedly are fighting alongside the russian separatists. this new escalation is a serious cause of concern for chad. mr. president, as we have repeated many times, the solution to the crisis in ukraine has to be political, must be found through an inclusive dialogue and the base of full respect for the territorial sovereignty of ukraine. thank you very much. >> i think the representative of chad. from thehat comments representative from the united states. you.ank mr. president, representatives on this council, this is our 24th session to try to rein in
russia's aggressive acts in ukraine. every single one of those sessions has sent a straightforward, unified message -- russia, stop this conflict. russia is not listening. we said it when russia flagrantly violated international law in occupying crimea. we said it after the shocking downing of the malaysian airlines flight 17, which took the lives of innocent people from 11 countries, and we say it soldiers,ussia's tanks, air defense, and artillery support and fight theyside separatists, as open a new front in a crisis manufactured in and fueled by russia. listening.is not instead of listening to him instead of heeding the demands
of the international community and the rules of international order, at every step russia has come before this council to save everything except the truth. manipulated, it has obfuscated, it has out right lied. we have learned to measure russia by its actions and not by its words and in the last 48 's actions have spoken bonds. this past tuesday, after meeting with president per shantou, president putin spoke of the need to and bloodshed as soon as possible. the same day, satellite imagery showed russian combat units southeast of donetsk in eastern ukraine. hansk,ame day in lu ukraine detained russian personnel from the night regrade. russia said the soldiers had
wandered into ukrainian territory by mistake did this conflicty in a time of along one of the most carefully watch borders number. the day after the talks, russia fired rockets from inside russia inside ukrainian positions, and then contact with two columns of russian armored vehicles and tanks. russian armored vehicles and multiple rocket launchers our position on the outskirts of that town as we speak. russia's force along the border it is the largest since it began redeploying forces in late may and include significant numbers of combat aircraft and helicopters. russian unmanned aircraft routinely cross into ukrainian airspace. other russian deployment into ukrainian territory including advanced fertility and air defense systems, not found in
ukrainian inventory. these artillery systems have shelled ukrainian positions sk, in conjunction with a counter offensive spirit one of the separatist heaters that russia has armed and backed said openly that three or 4000 russian soldiers have joined their cause. he was quick to clarify that the soldiers were on vacation. but a russian soldier who chooses to fight in ukraine on his summer break is still a russian soldier. and the armored russian military vehicle he drives there is not his personal car. meanwhile, in russia, family members of russian soldiers are holding funerals for their loved ones who have been killed in the fighting in the ukraine. they are demanding answers for how they were killed. journalists who tried to cover these funerals are caressed and threatened by armed men. yet still according to the russian government, the soldiers were never there.
they were never in crimea either until russia announced that thosesojourn -- that soldiers were in crimea. 8 established a pattern. ukraine has repeatedly sought a path to de-escalation. andite this pattern, artist roshenkodent po decided to meet up with president putin. serious negotiations are needed urgently, but russia has to stop lying and has to stop fueling this conflict. the mask is coming off. russia'sacts, we see actions for what they are, a
deliberate effort to support and now fight alongside illegal separatists in another sovereign country. russia has claimed that ukraine is not interested in a everyfire, that we have interest in a cease-fire, as do the koreans as long as it is a real one. russian separatists not only have no interest in achieving a cease-fire, that they cynically use the time to rearm and wait for additional soldiers and supply to flow across the border from russia. in the face of these deeply alarming actions, the most important question for us now is not what we should say to russia, the most important question is what we should do to make russia listen. the united states has throughout this crisis and in coordination with european partners exerted targeted effective pressures so this message is heard, so that russia begins to de-escalate rather than escalate, so that the reasonable use plan put forward by the ukrainian president is adopted.
in the face of russia's continued aggression and disregard for the u.n. charter, the helsinki final act, we will work closely with our european partners to ratchet up the consequences on russia. i understand that there are real costs fell by citizens of countries when their governments take these actions. thats cost for businesses, trade with russia, and sell to russian markets. those costs are considerable, and nobody should take them lightly. but let's be clear. if unchecked, the damage that russia's blatant disregard for international order poses is much, much greater. these rules and principles that have taken generations to build with unparalleled investment, countless lives have been lost to establish and defend these printable scum and every single one of us has a stake in defending them. a threat to the order, the international order, is a threat to all of our peace and
security. these are the roles that russia is -- rules that russia is flouting when it seizes territory and fight alongside illegal groups in neighboring countries. of roughly ae dozen countries that share a border with russia. let me close with a couple questions. how can we tell those countries that border russia that their piece and sovereignty is guaranteed if we do not make their message heard on ukraine? why should they believe it will be different if tomorrow president putin decides to start supporting armed separatists and allowing soldiers on vacation to fight in their countries? what message are we sending to other countries with similarly alarming ambitions around the world and we let russia violate these rules without sufficient consequences? in the face of this threat, the cost of inaction is unacceptable. thank you. i think the representative
from the united states for her statement. i now give the floor to the representative from the republic of korea. >> thank you, mr. president. i would like to thank the undersecretary general or his wisdom. we take this opportunity to reiterate our full support for the secretary-general's good offices, including this are felt man's recent visit. republic of korea is closing monitoring the events of eastern ukraine, and we are deeply concerned over the continuing escalation of tensions. we hoped that the minsk meeting between the two presidents might be a turning point towards finding a political solution to this crisis. but to the contrary, the situation on the ground has further deteriorated. in particular, we are alarmed that the separatist armed
groups have pushed their way into a southern city, opening a dangerous new front in the ongoing crisis. we also are seriously concerned over reports that indicate the environment of russian troops in the latest round of fighting inside ukraine. true.e this is not explanation iss true, that there are no russian troops inside retrain. other side -- otherwise, this would constitute a gross violation of ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity and would bring the crisis into a new dimension. we strongly oppose any outside military intervention in the situation in ukraine. in light of this volatile situation, we stress that a genuine solution to this crisis can only be found with only
immediate the cessation of hostilities, through dialogue through concerned parties. in this regard, we hope that oroshenko's roadmap will form a sound basis for de-escalation of tensions. the stability and prosperity of ukraine are critical not only to the peace in europe. we once again reaffirm our full 'spport for ukraine sovereignty, independence, and territorial integrity. thank you. representative from the republic of korea for his statement. i now give the floor to the representative from argentina. thank you very much, mr. president. i would like to thank you for the briefing on the situation in ukraine. argentina reiterates its concern
that the worsening of security conditions in the south and east of ukraine and an increase in violence. partiessential for all to fully comply with international law and the principles of the u.n. charter. we recall the obligation of all ,tate to resolve their disputes international disputes peacefully, so they do not endanger international peace and security and in full compliance .ith the u.n. charter you the only possible solution is through dialogue and negotiations. we have said this and repeated it. we must avoid any confrontational rhetoric or any
arelvement in affairs which under the internal jurisdiction of states. we welcome the meeting that took face on the 26th of august in minsk. we hope you that there will be their meetings so that dispute can be resolved politically. similarly, we upheld the appeal of the secretary-general to continue with these discussions in order to find a way out of the conflict. the intensive efforts and good offices of the secretary-general. thequalities must guess parties must strictly observe humanitarian law and they must guarantee accountability when it comes to violations and abuses of human rights and international humanitarian law, which have been committed. saidnclusion, we have
argentina underscores the primary responsibility of the security council to ensure the maintenance of peace and security in accordance with the roles trusted by the charter. the spike the numerous times we have met in order to deal with the situation in ukraine, this council has not been capable of overcoming divisions and playing a positive role, helping the parties to find common points so that they can forge a diplomatic and political solution. he must further our efforts to create conditions so that dialogue which is so urgent can so that solutions can be found to the differences. in particular, the actors were the greatest influence are those should use constructive diplomacy. we reaffirm the fact that the international community must redouble its efforts and bring the parties to a constructive dialogue to find a peaceful
solution to the situation, strictly german human rights, international military and law, respecting the rights of all minorities, and strictly following the framework for international law and the united nations charter. thank you. >> i think the representative from argentina for her statement. i now can't afford to the representative of nigeria. >> thank you very much, mr. president, and i want to thank the spokesman for his briefing. mr. president, the situation in eastern ukraine is tantamount to a dangerous escalation of the conflict between separatists and government forces. new front have been opened in the conflict, and it is now spreading over a wider geographic area. , this furthery
complicates what was already a difficult and delicate situation. with an ever-increasing array of actors. andrts of russian troops military equipment moving into ukrainian territory are a concern to all of us. the russian representative to the osce has emphatically denied reports. we therefore urge both ukraine and russia to resolve their differences peacefully and through genuine dialogue and negotiation. -- such aslatively the friendship between the two countries and the -- statement are valid points of departure towards reconciliation. indeed, president putin and
shenko mustoro maintain their dialogue and build on it like a scaffold. it is the only valid path to a mutually acceptable the dramatic solution to the crisis. a military solution in our view is not a viable one. a cease-fire should be urgently thetiated and agreed as first necessary step in ending the conflict, which has left more than 3000d, wounded, and tens of thousands of displaced from their homes. on this part the government of ukraine must continue to accommodate the legitimate citizenry and all protect their interests. we are confident that strident
efforts towards greater inclusiveness will foster the necessary cohesion. this has the potential of reducing hostilities and establish the foundations for building a peaceful, prosperous, and united nation. mr. president, throughout our engagement on this issue, we have consistently stressed the --d to uphold universally agreed principles and the sanctity of international law. these begin with respect for the principles embodied in the charter of the united nations. and that is respect for the sovereignty, the independence, and the territorial integrity of all states. these are the principles that guide nigeria's position and have informed our stance.
we believe that only a diplomatic solution achievable by direct dialogue between the parties can resolve the current conflict. influence on with the warring parties to exact influence and to bring their influence to bear on the of theon in the interest wider international peace and security. thank you. >> i think the rivers and it of from nigeria for her statement. i now give the floor to the representative from china. >> thank you, mr. president. feltman for his briefing. china is deeply concerned and worried about the continued aggravation of the armed conflict in eastern ukraine, which has caused great loss of life and property. situation, all the parties concerned must exercise restraint so as not to
further escalate the situation. stated on many occasions its principled position on the question in ukraine economist occasion, i will refrain from repeating it. i wish to emphasize the following -- the crisis in ukraine can only -- thelved by political priority now is for all the parties concerned to achieve a prompt cease-fire and efforts to promote a political resolution of the crisis in ukraine, fully accommodating legitimate rights, interests, and aspirations of all regions and ethnic groups of ukraine, taking into consideration all parties. parties concerned to make good
use of various methods of dialogue, increased indications come and acting in a manner that ducive to mutual trust. all efforts to resolve the crisis and promoting a political solution. thank you, mr. president. the representative of china for his statement. i now could afford to the representative of -- >> vista president, thank you for calling this emergency meeting of the security council to address the situation in ukraine. i think the secretary general. we recognize the good offices of the secretary-general and mr. feltamman. rwanda is alarmed of the situation in eastern you could.
on the 26th of august, the meeting in minsk where the presidents met for the first time since the election of the former in may of this year raised hope for a cease-fire and eight automatic solution to this conflict. unfortunately, the last few days was marred by a new fighting in eastern ukraine, particularly in has fallenere a town s who are now threatening to take over the port city of -- in this regard we were troubled by the information provided by one of the leaders of the armed parties that up to 4000 russian nationals have joined, and we are concerned that border crossings. ofis clear that the rise
tensions between ukraine and the russian federation if not properly addressed will lead to a full-blown conflict between the two countries, thus further threatening the international peace and security and worsening a very dire humanitarian situation in eastern ukraine. mr. president, the situation in ukraine has been on the agenda of the security council since the end of february of this year. we have been constantly meeting on this crisis. as you have informed us, but unfortunately we were not able to take any meaningful decision except the resolution 2166 adopted in july after the downing of the malaysian flight 17. in any case, given the division and his counsel it is unlikely a solution will come from new york. only general dialogue between the parties with support of the
united nations and regional organizations can provide a sustainable solution. he believed that president poroshenko's peace plan can be a viable beginning. armed groups must cease hostilities, lay down their arms in order to de-escalate the situation, and give a chance for the peace. we urge all original stakeholders to use their influence and work toward peace and stability in the region. i thank you. >> i think the representative from rwanda for his statement. i now give the floor to the representative from the russian federation. in the southeast of the ukraine is in direct consequence of the reckless policy of kiev,
which is conducting war against its own people. the support and under the influence of a number of the state, kiev has torpedoed all agreements. the declaration of 17 april and the berlin declaration of july 2, not to mention the agreement of 21st february by the -- they cancel this agreement with open a real operation of agreement for the prices. propose was only a step in further escalation, because the peace was predicated by insurgents. this is against the backdrop of any political process or negotiations with representatives of the reason. where is the inclusive national dialogue promised by kiev, constitutional reform, a special status for the russian language?
the only thing we're seeing is the fight against the fence where political parties are banned and the media does not toe the line. enko has often made peaceful stay in the street yesterday this was his comment over the outcome of the high-level meeting in minsk. the main goal of kiev is peace. we demand decisive action that could bring peace to ukraine. he also spoke of some new urgent peace plan. where is this plan? is this another maneuver to distract attention while in fact trying to solve the situation i force? authoritiest kiev the not lose opportunities of the minsk meeting. we think the ukrainian armed forces have trampled on all standards of humanitarian law, and we have been shelling
civilian quarters, using a artillery, munitions with phosphorus and other weapons. there are 4 million people living, hundreds of thousand people sitting in basements without water, electricity, food, or any kind of medicine. the overall number of those killed is over 2000, and their number is increasing geometrically. the number of displaced people, including refugees from ukraine to russia, is already over 814,000 people. on media you hear about the terrible losses of the ukrainian army. this is confirmed by the mass protests on ukraine against mobilization. hundreds the cranium soldiers for different reasons find themselves in the territory of russia. we give them food and drink. we send back ukraine. expect the same kind of humane attitude of the kiev authorities
toward russian airborne troops that are in the subject much speculation. it was said they were stopped while they had their documents, and their weapons were not armed. it does not look like an armed group ticking part in a conflict that knows there are russian volunteers in eastern parts of ukraine. no one is hiding that. we would like to see similar transparence shown by other countries. for example, maybe our american colleagues can tell us about what the tens of american advisers and the building of the cream security consular are doing -- of the ukrainian consular are doing them and the mercenaries are waging war thousands of kilometers away from their land. where did the security forces get their latest weapons? the american ambassador says what kind of message can we send to russia's neighbors?
i would suggest we send a message to washington -- stop interfering in the internal affairs of a sovereign state. stop trying to undermine a regime that you do not like. restrain your geopolitical aspirations. neighbors buta's many other countries would breathe a sign of relief. furthermore, stop taking advantage of the topic of the malaysian airliner that was shot on. only russia has made a significant contribution to investigating this tragedy. all the others are only - we hear speculation and do not get any information. for example, why haven't the ukrainian authorities provided records of their air traffic controllers? there is some reason. we do not know why. recently, in spite of
significant resistance of certain members of the security council, the first humanitarian sk.voy was delivered to luhank today we are preparing for the second convoy, and an agreement was confirmed today in a telephone call between the prime minister lavrov and death foreign minister of u.k.. we have to remember that the council is not there to disseminate guesswork or speculation horse red accusations, but to find solutions to crises. today we suggest adopting the following statement for the press. i'm asking the secretary to ,isseminate the english text which i will read in russian. the members of the security council expressed serious concern about the deteriorating situation in the southeast of anaine and call for
immediate and unconditional cease-fire. members of the security council called on the inclusive political dialogue in ukraine based on the geneva declaration 2014.april in this context, we know that the role of the contact group and strongly urged on the immediate resumption of the process of the framework of the contact group. ebbers of the security council called on the international community to step up their efforts to provide assistance to the population of the donetsk and lugansk region. of text. we suggest putting on this a bit now today at this table. thank you very much. representative of the russian federation for his statement. i shall now make a statement in my capacity as the representative of the united kingdom. man for his felt
briefing. the united kingdom is alarmed for the russian intervention in ukraine over the past 72 ashford formed units of the armed forces of the russian federation are and eric the engaged in fighting inside ukraine against the armed forces of ukraine. these units consist of well over 1000 regular russian troops equipped with armored feeler goals, artillery, and air defense systems. this is a violation of sovereignty training territory by the russian federation. it is a clear breach of international law and a contravention of the charter of the united nations. realitydenials of this fit into the pattern of russia's dishonest reproach to ukraine from the beginning of this crisis. we already do that russia denied that it had any extra military personnel on the ground in crimea writeup until it's illegal annexation with military
force. russia has denied providing military support to the separatists. in fact, russia has been transferring significant oddities of advanced weapons, including tanks, armored personnel carriers, and artillery to separatist groups for several months. as of today the separatist arsenal includes up to 100 main battle tanks, 80 armored personnel carriers, 100 man -- five hundred antitank weapons, and they have got 100 artillery pieces. almost all of these have been directly supplied i russia since the conflict -- by russia since the config started. in the past three weeks this support has increased she mckinley, no doubt in response thekraine's success in braiding territory. on the seventh of august, 50 equals, including tanks, armored personal carriers, and mb21
rocket launchers cross from russia into ukraine at a border crossing. on 15 august, mike conboy of 23 armored personnel carriers rust close to where the humanitarian convoy was waiting customs clearance. the later day, vehicles crossed the border. the evidence is overwhelming. and plenty of it comes from the russian military itself. the 13th of july, armored vehicles flying russian flags were photographed by a russian servicemen crossing ukrainian in donetsk rate on the 31st of july, and research soldier posted photographs of himself operating military hardware inside ukraine. his photographs including images of himself inside and sa11 missile launch system, the same weapon that appears to have shot down 17.
russia has denied it has shelled territory in the five days since the 14th and the 19th of us, ukrainian armed forces were fired upon from positions inside russian territory on 21 separate occasions with weapons systems ranging from heavy mortars to rockets. now we see irrefutable evidence of regular russian forces operating inside ukraine. for some months, russia has deployed small groups of special forces operating under the command of the main intelligence directorate of the russian armed forces in support of the separatists. these forces have been responsible for corn mating attacks and facilitating communications, equipment transfers, and personnel. their presence is clear from their communications. -houra single 24 -- our
period, there were instances of transmission from inside ukrainian territory. today made a really satellite imagery taken on the 21st and russianaugust of self-propelled artillery units inside ukraine in the vicinity of -- in lugansk. on monday russian paratroopers were captured near the village kilometers inside ukrainian territory. we have satellite imagery confirming the department of russian armored vehicles supported by artillery south of donetsk in the close to this location. today another russian soldier, serving with the ninth motor rifle brigade, was captured in lugansk. is not credible for rushing and its proxies to keep claiming
that the serving members of the russian armed forces are in ukraine by accident or on holiday. nor is incredible for russia to continue claiming to the whole world, including to the russian people, that russian soldiers are not present on ukrainian territory. increasing number of russian casualties and captured soldiers gives the lie to that. usha can no longer pretend it is not in direct party to this conflict. indeed, this conflict would no longer exist without direct russian military involvement in support of the separatists. president putin has said russia is willing to find a peaceful solution to the conflict. these words have little value against these clear patterns of escalating russian military involvement in eastern ukraine. five leading international law and the u.n. charter in such a brazen manner is not compatible as russia's responsibilities as a permanent member of the
security council. we again call on russia to immediately withdraw its military forces from ukraine, stop it's full of weapons to the separatists, and instead help to secure a political solution to this crisis. asow resume my function president of the council. i give the floor to the representative of ukraine. thank you, mr. president. i also would like to thank mr. feltman. onis already half a year ago 28 february that this council first took up the issue of the russian aggression against ukraine. throughession started military occupation and annexation of a huge part of crimea.s territory, then it went on by raising a hybrid war against ukraine through sponsoring terrorist and
mercenaries to illegal armed groups in the east of our state. shellings intensively from the russian territory and regular violation of ukrainian airspace by military aircraft, helicopters, and twdrones. it was followed by downing terrorist groups with missile systems over civilian -- of a civilian aircraft, killing all passengers and crew on board. the next redline was the illegal crossing of the ukrainian state bordered by so-called humanitarian convoy dispatch by russia without authorization from the ukrainian government and in violation of international agreements and procedures. russia has been pulling its troops along the border with ukraine. as of now, over 45,000 military, tanks, battle
vehicles, 390 artillery systems, 150 ground systems, 192 military 100 helicopters are deployed in the facility to our border. now the situation has been dramatically changing. russia has launched a wrecked military invasion of the military of ukraine by its regular armed forces. last night two convoys crossed the ukraine state border and moved in the direction of the village of -- with seven tanks, alsos with soldiers, and to a town with five tanks, two mb22 trucks with soldiers. after shelling on the position
of ukrainian forces from the territory of russia, and from the district of -- the russian troops seized -- civilians have0 been held hostage by russian invaders. the citizens of ukraine are asserting psychological pressure. here.s of violence are mr. president, on august 20 4, battalion tactical groups of airborne forces of the crossed thed forces state border of ukraine near a village in the donetsk region, just 500 meters from the ukrainian state border. reportedly, all russian military equipment was without license plates. some combat vehicles were painted with two white vehicles,
like ukrainian vehicles in counterterrorist operations. the troops wear russian uniform with no insignia. combat units have pocketed several villages in the donetsk region. they are constructing fortified strongholds. on august 25, ukrainian armed town of --o the [indiscernible] of the armed forces of the russian federation to all their identities were revealed. we have serious doubts the russian troops could have lost their way penetrating 25 kilometers into territory of
ukraine. we possess numerous evidence, video, of nowos, detained russian soldiers as well as russian vehicles and tanks with documentation proving they belong to russian military forces. aere is no doubt about russian direct invasion into ukraine. mr. president, we see the russian federation fully amongsible for every -- ukrainian civilians and military, as well as the humanitarian breakdown. we demand the russian federation to immediately recall all of its troops on ukrainian territory to save lives of ukrainians and russians. we demand russia to establish effective control of ukrainian -russian border under the control of the osce, which would exclude legal supplies a military achievements, and
shipments to ukraine. to release all hostages. women open to all diplomatic initiatives and have participated in every negotiation. the president of ukraine, over his peace plan, which russia deliberately undermined. while demonstrating the full readiness for peace negotiations with russia during the meeting in minutes, the president made it clear that sovereignty and territorial integrity and ukraine as well as the european aspirations of ukrainian people are not negotiable. in view of the open russian military aggression, ukraine reserves its right to act in accordance with article 51 of the u.n. charter, which empowers every you and never state -- u.n. member states with the in herent right of
self-defense. we call upon the international community to provide effective assistance to ukraine to resist russian aggression. will the international community aep witnessing silently as fundamental principles of international law are a grossly disrespected? the entire democratic world has been challenged him and any actual world order is being distorted. well it finally speak with one voice and act? the choice is fundamental. ignoring universal principles and -- how many more red lines are to be crossed before the this is addressed? we call upon this council to fulfill its charter responsibility and take the urgent measures to stop the aggression against a sovereign u.n. member state.
>> i think the representative of ukraine for his statement. the representative of the for wayne has asked to make a further statement. you, mr. president. we note the request by the russian federation, and i am also very well aware of certain labels that my delegation has, and in spite of that fact, these labels have been repeated on things ofcasions -- that time. we appreciate the drafting of this statement. however, we think that we would like to have a little bit more time to look into the text. seriously, some of the aspects are not reflected in this text, in her opinion. well aware ofe the information that separatists have been preventing a provision
of humanitarian assistance to the population. that call to the separatists not prevent humanitarian delivery is something that we should like to see in the text, but also some other amendments that we might come up. i thank you. ofi think the representative lithuania for her statement. there are no more names inscribed -- i give the four to the representative of the russian federation. i would like to just say couple of words, i dressed to our ukrainian colleagues. just as the u.s. representative nting at the malaysian five, could you please tell us,
ukraine, why have you not publish the recordings of the discussion between air traffic controllers? can you at least tell us if you provided them to the dutch authorities? can you tell us? secondly, a more substantial comment, i understand that perhaps in washington or in brussels maybe they could not know about this because for them it is not matter whether it is ukraine or some country in latin america or africa. i'm trying to understand, theyicians in kiev, when oroshenko peacep plan, did not understand what consequences this could lead to. i do not understand this. we know our region. we know how close are ties are. this was obvious steps toward escalation and disaster. that is what we are seeing. that you understand
insurgents could not just lay down their weapons? i mean they give up and leave for russian and ukrainian tanks enter lugansk? i do not understand. they were something trying to provoke, the lead the stabilizing situation in ukraine and make life difficult for sure. if you could provide an excavation for this, i would be very grateful. thank you. >> i think the russian federation representative for his statement. i give the for to the representative of ukraine. thank you for your question. faruld like to say that as as your first question, i can tell you definitely that ukraine is taking an active participation in the work of the intergovernmental commission that is investigating this
isident, and my government cooperating in good faith with our international foreign partners. i think that in the near future the report of the work of this commission will be published in a circulated, and we will see the findings of this inquiry. now, as for your second question, i would like to say the following -- clearly,dent said including at the meeting with your president in minsk, he spoke of our readiness for resolvingalogue in the situation in the east of ukraine. it was clearly stated that we are ready to engage in
negotiations on a whole range of issues. the only topic that cannot be discussed is the sovereignty, territorial integrity of ukraine, and our european integration, which is desired by our people. which is determined by our people. thank you very much. >> i think the representative of ukraine for his further statement. no more names inscribed. the security counsel has concluded its meeting and it is injured. in newsecurity council york meeting today on the situation in ukraine. the chair of the u.s. house armed services committee putting out a statement this our regarding the nato reports of russian troops operating inside ukraine, saying --
the statement goes on to say the president needs to definitively state whether or not russia has invaded ukraine and immediately condemn this over escalation of an already serious conflict. mckeon today.k the president was to meet this afternoon with his national security team to discuss the situation in iraq and syria in efforts to counter the threat posed by isis. the state department chiming in saying the secretary of state will be attending that meeting by way of video conference. this is set to get underway later this afternoon. josh earnest is scheduled to briefing about a half hour from now. we will have live coverage of that preaching on c-span. tonight on c-span, we will take it looked at current election
law across the country and how they may impact voters in the upcoming elections. topics will include florida's attempts to purge voter rolls. also early voting, as well as how well democrats and republicans differ in the words that voters should face. here's a look. this in context of why people can come to different conclusions on the same topic. republicans generally have a view of the purpose of an certainty.hich is the purpose of holding an election is we know who won and that we are clear as to who won an confident as to who won and there's no question as to who won. so anything that any a sense cleaned up the electoral process, that gives us that certainty, is a burden worth paying, because that is the purpose of an election. democrats generally believed that legitimacy involves artistic vision, that anything
that limits participation of all that could vote from voting undermines the legitimacy of the outcome, even if that means results may be messy on the edges. these are both legitimate decisions to take. this is a perspective towards the purpose of the election of voting. but each perspective focuses us on a different answer to the question of, what is a legitimate burden for the state to impose upon voters in the voting underneath this is that not so secret dirty little secret that of course each side takes a position that is very comfortable with outcomes that will help them. the broader the electorate, the better it is for democrats. that is not that they are doing it for that reason. it is oh is easier to do the right thing if the end result is the one you want. >> watch this entire discussion on election laws hosted by st.
thomas university law soul -- law school tonight. we understand the president now will be delivering a statement in the white house reefing room at 4:00 eastern time, 30 minutes from now. we will bring that to you live on c-span. in the meantime, a discussion on what is next in the u.s. response to isis. >> joining us from new york is clinton watts. he serves as a senior fellow and previously with the fbi special agent with the task force unit from 2002-2 thousand three. thank you for being with us. we want to talk about isis. a couple of headlines this morning. on the using expertise ground. we're getting more and more reports on americans joining
isis. how many americans do you think have linked up with this terrorist organization? isis. i saw a report this morning that there was a confirmation i think from mpr there had been 140 americans that had joined up in the fight in syria. those tend to be spread based on what time they joined. so there have been americans joining up in syria over the past two to three years. a year ago i think the numbers were around 70, and you might see an even split between al-qaeda's main arm, and the islamic state of iraq. today, most of the fighters going in are joining up with isis. they're very motivated about what's going on in iraq. they see isis as the leader of global jihad and want to join that movement. and the other part of it is the social media function has attracted most of the foreign fighters into syria. i would say out of the 140 or so you probably are seeing 90% or more actually in isis camp now.
the remaining 10% might be spread throughout a variety of different units inside syria. host: you served in the army, worked at the fbi, what motivates these americans to turn on their country? >> i think what you see is a mix of dynamics. there is no one solution or one sort of understanding of what creates these foreign fighters and why they want to join up. it's a mix or compings. what was thought during the post 9/11 era that it was about ideology, so i think that was true to a certain extent. you have some of these individuals, americans that join that are doing it for very ideological reasons. when you look back in their history, i think you also see a lot of social dynamics and a lot of psychological dynamics going on. if you look at the group from minnesota in 2007 there was a lot of foreign fighters that went to fight in somalia. we see there is about 15 more from that same community in
minneapolis that are going to syria, you see it's a real social and ethnic sort of dynamic that goes on there, where groups of guys go together. the other element to it is the one offs, or really the sort of odd americans that join up. they largely come into contact with this militant form of islam through the internet and through social media they essentially paved their way to get to these conflicts. a lot of that is ideological but a lot of it is psychological. when you look back at the history of the individuals there tends to be very strange psychological patterns going on, and this oftentimes goes completely undetected by family and friends that are in that network, suggesting that they're extremely isolated and they're only really way of mobile lighting is through the internet. so it's a unique dynamic that has come on in the past few years. host: i would like to take that one step further.
there is a break down, i want to share with you four of the elements. the main sources of funding for the islamic state extortion in crime networks, hostages collecting ransoms in exchange for releasing the hostages, selling oil from fields under its control, and then finally donations receiving funds from private citizens, and islamic charities, in the mideast or europe. can you break that down a little further? >> yeah. i think it's really important for people to understand the al-qaeda model we've been talking about and the new isis model. when you have donations, you can sort of plot and plan and you don't have to be confined to a
geographic area, which was one of the strengths and later one of the weaknesses of al-qaeda. al-qaeda had the sort of distributed network where they could pull in resources they could fund and recruitment one of them being to build an islamic state. they couldn't follow through on that. if you look at isis one of the main things motivating people to join is that they have pursued deliberately a plan to create an islamic state and changed their name to islamic state, essentially i. circumstances. they started off more building their own networks, building their own criminal opera puts and building illegitimate networks or black markets for all sorts of enterprises which they could use to fund themselves. by doing that they actually created success, by creating a state in syria and iraq, and with that now are receiving a lot of the donations and international support. they've been able to pull that
support away from al-qaeda. so it's an interesting dynamic. isis is sort of pursued the reverse because they actually occupy a territory. and they're also using members that they have physical relationships with, that core sort of next discuss which brings isis together is those foreign fighters. continuing on into 2007 and eight, those members of al-qaeda and iraq at the time they fought together, they built their own networks, they integrated in the sunni areas, and they built out their illegitimate systems to fund themselves. that is what is propelling them today. they know how to work the criminal networks and are very experienced at it. host: we welcome your questions and comments. our phone lines are open. you can send us an e-mail, email@example.com.
clinton watts is joining us from new york. he's formerly with the fbi, the joint terrorism task force. a name we're using more of is the isis leader. what can you tell us about him? >> it goes to speak to all of the experience that's been gained in iraq over the past ten years, what propels isis are these leaders that survived. the leader of isis, he was captured and imprisoned at one time and released. he fought against the united states. he's been operating in those areas for quite some time. i think you probably saw one of the articles this morning talking about how many of saddam's former military officers are being used and sort of integrated into the ranks of isis. you see a lot of military experience. they know how to command units. they are well resourced and well equipped. these leaders have created what is a deliberate plan that is separate, very much separate from what al-qaeda was wanting
or trying to drive towards. and with baghdad when you see how he created this islamic state, the deliberate steps he has taken, he's following what is, you know, very similar or sort of laid out in a book called the management of savagey, translated by william mccanz, written by a guy named nabi, a name to probably cover the real identity. it lays out in very specific detail how to build an islamic state. what you see the leaders doing is following that blueprint in iraq. what is interesting about him, he comes from the legions. they are much more men of action. what you see with the old al-qaeda leadersers they are more tv leaders. they are eye deej logical, but not the ones fighting on the front lines.
these guys with isis are inspiring, because they're out there on the front lines. when you watch social media, you'll see reports from actual foreign fighters in isis saying i saw baghdad today, you know, he's out here in iraq or syria, or in western iraq and that's very inspirational and motivating. and it's set them apart in terms of their leadership. host: there is this question from monte. is a war against isis winnable? >> i would say this. i don't -- i just wrote an article yesterday called, you know, why does the u.s. want to be isis for our enemy? there is some sort of belief here in the united taits that isis is really about taking on the united states. and i think this is very different from al-qaeda. al-qaeda specifically said that in order to topple an enemy, you know, corrupt
dictators throughout the middle east and north africa you have to go after the united states. isis model is very different. they're going after very different objectives. they want to build an islamic state. that is their number one goal. they are also attacking the shite and bringing in the next generation of conflict. there is very different dynamics there. what's been interesting in the past two weeks is this push especially what i've seen in the news, that the u.s. needs to step in and deal with isis. and to that i would say we need to very clearly define what our interests are there. in a certain sense isis has been attacking the assad regime. we are empowering as sad, who is a corrupt dictator, has been oppressing his people.
of the region and eliminating the isis threat? threat to as much a the stability of the iraqi government to iran in terms of just being a real pain on their border. and in saudi arabia, a lot of these countries, saudi arabia being the largest, should feel very nervous about the risk of foreign fighters. host: clinton wants, let me ask you. a 26-year-old, now the third american known to be kidnapped by the american group. who iss this video pleading for her son's release, the story is inside the new york times. he vanished ince syria, he asked news organizations to abide by a
complete blackout. that changed with the beheading of james foley. i want to share a portion of this mother's plea for her son's freedom. >> my son is in your hands. to the middle east to cover the suffering at the hand of tyrants. -- a loyalal touch and generous son and grandson. we have not seen stephen for over a year and we miss him very much. we want to see him safe and sound and hug him. since his capture, i learned a lot about islam. islam teaches no individual should be held responsible for
the sins of others. stephen has no control over the actions of the u.s. government. he is an innocent journalist. i also learned you can grant amnesty. please release my child. , yourclinton watts reaction and comments. >> it is extremely sad, the situation there. to u.s. policy will continue be to not negotiate with terrorist groups for the release of hostages. while i feel for the mother and i do understand that it is a terrible situation, it has been demonstrated time and time again, most recently by an article that described how these groups essentially look to extort by capturing hostages from western countries in order to finance themselves.
in this case, i'm not sure what the situation turn out to be. i imagine isis and baghdad is trying to evaluate the reaction that came from the beheading of james foley last week, and what tools or levels -- levers they can use in terms of propaganda with the united states. i am sure they know, any sort of mores likely to bring pressure on them. we have seen that in the last two weeks by our media. in terms of negotiation, the u.s. government is in a tough spot. they have tried to go on the rescue mission, it sounds like last year at some point. there were reports of how they deployed special forces in what must've been one of the most complex and dangerous missions the u.s. military has ever conducted to try to rescue those hostages. sad situation but also admirable that the negotiating
come against their very own policy, it seemed to take great efforts during the release of these passages. i hope that continues in the future. >> homecoming for one and plea for another. globe reporting abroad all alone, the perils abound for freelancers and global hotspots. let's get to your phone calls. david from manassas, virginia, caroline for democrats. good morning, david. caller: i would like to bring up a point i noticed. we all know that young, black -- theyve an inordinate end up with an inordinate number of children grow into adults, system,into the police
and a majority of them, or some of them, many of them, and up in prison. prison has always been a fertile islam,for the spread of all the way back to malcolm x. the young man that was killed in syria had been in prison nine times. this andou think about the effects of this red of islam through the prison system? >> thank you. we will get a response. >> i think prison radicalization, especially in the context of serious and foreign fighter mobilization is a very small influence on the situation. the number one influence right now is social media.
facebook, twitter, a lot of the social media, what is introducing the concept to them. in terms of prison radicalization, it has been investigated steadily. homeland security policy institute of george washington has done a lot of research. there is some concern about that, but most of it pales in comparison to what we have seen today. out of the 140 that have gone to syria, 100-110 of those are mostly recruited to social media with some six -- some facilitation. syria, i do not think that is coming through prison radicalization. prison radicalization is more an issue for domestic extremists and, even in the case of al qaeda, it is staying in the united states to conduct an attack. i do not see foreign
fighters in the area. >> the second american killed in the fight that broke out, as a member of isis. he joins douglas macarthur mccain, also killed. two americans. what can you tell us, from your perspective, what happened? >> as long as the conflict goes on in syria, as long as there isis is the success achieving, they will attract more recruits. it is a basic numbers game. as isis continues to have success, you will have exponential growth. that is globally. in this case of -- in the case of the united states, let's say the number is 140, that is probably double what it was a year ago. it will continue to increase.
the greater the growth. these foreign fighters, especially in the case of mont., in syria frommber florida, these fighters transit back and forth. there seems to be a believe that once they go over to syria, maybe they stay there. we have seen several instances where foreign fighters travel from the united states to syria. ey have actually come back and may be returned to the middle east. that is a great concern. many of the plots we see in the united states are by people of low capacity of our -- or low ability. they're on their own. so their ability to actually
pull the attack off is very limited. what i am more concerned about is these foreign fighters, what if 10 of them come back to the united states? they are now trained and capable and could be directed by al qaeda. greatest fear because they have a capacity to pull off an attack in the united states. >> coming up shortly here on c-span, we will take you to the white house. meet with thewill national security council followed by a briefing by spokesman josh earnest. the white house with president obama is just a few minutes from now here on c-span. until then, more from today's "washington journal."
>> i am probably going to switch parties because i did like romney. i am not a wealthy man but i do think he stood for something. >> thank you for the call. let me take his point and ask about the president's response to all of this. how has the white house handled it? ,> i like what they have done which is to not go all in. iere are several dynamics hope the american people understand, which is, we have two competing interests also going on. one is we would then be helping out assad regime in syria in a two-year civil war. by clamping down on isis too hard, we could actually be an assad or helping out his regime.
on the other side, the maliki government in iraq, which is really turned to iran for support as isis has grown. by helping out in terms of pushing down on isis, we are empowering iran, which is one of our known adversaries we have been battling with in terms of nuclear negotiations. iran by all measures was really hurting us inside iraq over the past decade. one is to protect the people. they stood by the united states multiple times here it they have been one of the bright spots in the transition time. the other one is going after the dam and trying to secure that from isis.
it gives isis the ability to unleash a huge disaster on all folks that are self on the river. what you see in terms of our measure so far have been very limited and very smart in terms of protecting our interests. the question is, where do we go from here? we antagonized isis to a certain extent. we saw the jason foley beheading video. this is a response to u.s. airstrikes. how limited can we be to antagonize isis where they are doing retaliatory attacks against the u.s. homeland, and at the same point, not empower other -- that we have in the region. host: senator rand paul, from kentucky, has a lengthy piece from the middle east. to seafood to act against next with little regard to and consequences.
next, south carolina, with clinton watts. caller: originally, the iraq war, to overtake saddam hussein? host: clinton watts, did you want to respond? guest: i believe 2003, most of what was told to me and thought the war was just -- -- justified. i am disappointed with the realities that have come out. yes in the beginning. i am disappointed in the scenario that turned out now. host: should the president have kept troops in iraq? guest: no, i do not think the president should have for an extended period. host: sorry for keeping you waiting. caller: good morning. thanks to c-span.
what i wanted to contribute this morning -- what going to iraq has cost the whole world. this is the beginning of the whole trouble of going to every country, every citizen, now the whole war fighting each other. going to iraq to fight the war. thank you. guest: if i understood the question correctly, what should the u.s. response be after being in iraq.
the situation we are seeing is the u.s. needs to realize it is not the center of the universe. much of what is going on in the middle east has very little to do with the united states. and triggering point was the 2000 invasion of iraq but since the u.s. left, all the stakeholders in the region are now trying to seek out their own interest. some of them are state actors. a lot of them are nonstate actors. the u.s. needs to very narrowly decide what -- the region. -- what its interests are in the region and then support those. it has been almost 11 years now since the initial invasion of iraq. i am not entirely sure, as probably most american people are, what we want to achieve moving forward. i do not think there is real consensus on that in washington. our policy will continue to drift to whatever the near-term crisis is or trying to contain whatever the problem is and externalities, rather than pursuing our objectives. i do not think there is consensus around what those are. host: joseph is next from orlando, florida. good morning.
caller: i would just like to state i think it is a given that we should not get too involved in the sunni shia religious war. we should have learned our lesson not getting involved. it is like a family feud that goes back more than 500,000 years. where do we go from here? to three weeks ago, i saw him interviewed and he stated his objectives for visiting the united states was to try to get american support for the aspirations of the kurdish people for independence. i do not think there is too much coverage. it is an interesting concept. we would then have a very
reliable ally in the area, perhaps we should support the kurds and their aspirations for independence. the turks seem to be going that way also. we would then have a very reliable ally in the area, rational people not involved in the sunni shia conflict. in return, we could possibly monitor the situation from curtis dan and be able to react an and be able to react quickly in the event american interest are in danger. host: thank you for the call. what about that scenario? guest: i am actually very supportive of that scenario. kurdistan has been functioning. it works in terms of its own governance. they are prepared militarily to defend themselves and they can maintain their own security.
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