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tv   Conflict Zone  Deutsche Welle  April 15, 2022 1:30am-2:01am CEST

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all the story that matter to you, a policeman, a dealer here we are here, is actually on fire made for mines fresh allegations with russian forces murder, ukrainian, civilians outside k, f, have rapidly found their way to the un general assembly. 93 countries voted to suspend russia from the un human rights council. a humiliating move of moscow immediately condemned as illegitimate and politically motivated. but as russia really care what the world thinks about its invasion, my guess this week from moscow was a former deputy foreign minister on very few other of,
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as russia finally acknowledges significant military losses. that mister putin realize he forgetting to lose his role. this is the position of food and that you should understand that this person i know looking for maybe it will not step back. you will continue feel you will reach the goal. we don't have a real to what is going on. and this will be, it may be a mistake in our information from a, as russia focus is, it's a tax on the south and east of ukraine, western government, so tightening sanctions on moscow. but will they change the kremlin, might? and house by the me put in just ripped up the nuclear doctrine. that's kept the peace between the super powers for 60 years. all that and more on complex the i
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and a few other a welcome to come pick zone. thank you. you're a former deputy foreign minister of russia and you now advise putins administration on foreign policy issues. that's right, isn't it? yes, you will. last in ukraine in january. russia has said it's so called special military operation was to liberate ukraine from nazis. but we now have despite moscow's denials, credible allegations of war crimes carried out by russian forces, including summary executions of civilians, torture rape. when is the criminal going to drop the pretense that it's there to protect people and started making that it same is just to control the country any way it can. it's a very serious question because originally the special midra duration was planned to be concentrated on the bus. there are 3. don't ask and logan's
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republics bod, later on, it became a with more broad goal. we should put in describe s. dennis, if you cation and then militarization grade, and in fact, the costs are elimination total, elimination of the possible grad from ukraine to russia. and that's why this military operation, the day is gunning more and more in the real war. though the war is not declared. but it's hard for moscow, isn't it to stick to this rational or the declared rationale when, when, since, when does liberation involve destroying residential areas, wholesale, shelling, civilian infrastructure, shooting civilians, raping women, and stealing civilian property. doesn't have much to do with liberation. does it in
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southern way? yes, of course, but war is war and such kind of things happens. the question is, i mean, is that the justification for the tremendous brutality that we've seen? no, it's read it or i've seen many war in my life in different parts of the world and morally as the future sometimes is the say, this is a choice, isn't it though this was moscow war of choice? ah, it was most goes to susan. yes, it was most of the season and moscow is trying to implement that in a full strength. this is the position of putting and you should understand that this person i know here for many years will not stab back. you will continue, feel you will reach the goal. and the goal is to change french
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speaking to change the regime in ukraine and to make your grain if not friendly, but a kind of neutral on 3, which she will not consider as attentive for us. it's a country that's great, it's going to hate russia for the foreseeable future for what it's done, killing its people, and destroying cities and towns. this is one of the biggest problems when i was with ukraine many times or during last years. and of course, the mood is changing. if, for example, 10 years ago, there was more much more rational feelings, especially the eastern trade out edition is changing. and during my last visit, the crane, i've seen this with my own eyes that even the russian speaking population is now changing its opinion or, or this now is maybe turning point. are the problem,
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is that in a current situation, we are really, are see ukraine now as an to russia. and this is probably the worst case scenario for us because it was such kind of mood of the nation. it could be very hard to achieve the goals which were put in front of this operation. and i see that this kind of goggle psychological tent, any criminal society, will have a very long term influence and very long term negative effects for russia. yes, absolutely, absolutely. and not only for actually the sheep i, because unfortunately a lot of my friends in ukraine are now considered russian, russian citizen as enemies as leaders, et cetera, et cetera. so this is reading
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a lot of personal contacts, ruining a lot of a lot of historical traditions, historical ties, and to overcome this. current crisis will be terribly mr. potent has repeatedly complained that the west never listened to russia's what he called legitimate security concerns. but when he did listen and ovi western leaders trooped off to moscow to talk to him, he simply lied direct to their faces and presented them with an ultimatum. they knew they couldn't accept. that wasn't serious diplomacy. was it? i should start from somewhere from 2007 or something like list from ms. munich speech. when put in became pressed that at the beginning of 2000, she was really thinking about having good dialogue with europe, with united states,
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with nature who was trying to make up some steps towards what the problem that are within this dialogue he became more and more disappointed, and he feel, he feels himself that i the, this, the attitude from the west, the russia is more or less becoming the same like it was those the so do unit and for put in the current policy is the current from his point of view, the policy of protection, russia from the same problems which solid unit phase. and he is considering military venture from the west from late. so as one of the key challenges for him personally as well. but isn't it true that he just wanted to get his hands on ukraine and control it from top to bottom by any means available to him? and he wasn't going to ever negotiate that. seriously, you doubt?
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i mean, you've been a deputy foreign minister, you don't negotiate by just putting down all your demands into a draft treaty telling everyone to sign it and threatening them with force if they don't. that's not, that's not genuine diplomacy, is it genet. diplomacy in the current iteration is not working at all because as i said, this situation is very strange for many points of view. it's not the war. it's a special mid preparation. it's a situation when geneva convention on the war prison so or is not working. and you know, the problem is the falling that we lost a lot of time before all this thing started. there were chances in the past to solve a number of issues with the grade of but it was not met from the criminal side, sometimes a with
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a reasonable response. sometimes it was mistake from our side and, and our now our traditional diplomacy, by the way, which takes a lot of time is not working. oh miss. any other of all that talk that we heard over the years about ukrainians and russians being one people. and then to prove those strong ties, you climb into your tanks and you go and kill them already. more than 1400 civilians have died. doesn't nobody in the russian government and you, you deal with the presidential administration. there's nobody there have any concept of the senseless misery that they're causing to ukraine. ah, i would like to say that are psychologically, we are still the same nation, the same slavic, our nation rationally and the credit and grins are very close. still, even in this allies in the day by day. yes. yes, it's a,
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it's a problem of military operation. and it's a problem of, ah, ah vision. because a for our big part of our leadership is not for all are, it's, are considered model as war against ukraine and ukrainian there considered that it's a war against masses. that was a lead by living there, living in fantasy land, bernard bay, maybe some. yes. people yes, because i think that sometimes there is not enough understanding what is going inside gray. and i see that there was some miscalculations during last year's go turning your grade, mrs. in, in the un general assembly 93 countries voted to suspend russia from the human rights council,
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citing reports of gross and systematic violations and abuses of human rights. not a surprise was it after all, the latest allegations of civilian executions in butcher and other places previous they occupied by russian units. the world isn't buying. the kremlin denials does put in care one way or the other trust for russia was ready for such dying. quoting, and it wasn't the mother's shock, surprise for moscow, but about this body. we don't care too much for us, of course. the most important thing is security council and our ability to continue to repress that was there to bring our use there. but the reason of growing guys, relational russia is existing, i have to confirm it. it's never been a problem for the russian security forces to kill in large numbers. have it. we saw
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this in the to was in chechnya, tens of thousands killed the capital grenade, devastated by massive russia bombing and shelling with very little regard for civilians. rushes army doesn't do small surgical strikes, does it? oh, i see that jason i experience is influencing a on the special meal preparation ukraine, because feel today rush rami sprang roy, direct, heavy attacks. miss our tax on big city is like kind of go here, but cetera. we are you, paul? devastated completely for yes, i know i was my friends in the city is destroyed nearly 90 percent today. this is clear, this is the really we just had a bomb over the railway station in crime. tosca nice. that's killed at least 50
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people yet. but this does not regard civilian life at all, is not concerning the slot. last case. it's messiah the bomb. it's a special investigation on this case because this chromosome, by the way, is $1.00 0, and was one of the most russian cities in ukraine. previously, mr. piano of political killings had been on the rise as well under this government . haven't they? in russia itself, in other countries, we've seen one after another president putin's political opponents. they've been attacked, murdered, mysteriously fallen off their balconies or had their clothes smeared with chemical agents. this government has no qualms about killing for purely political reasons, does it? oh, it's hard to say if it's a political jelly, so in some cases,
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of course the opposition do against the welcome in russia. and it's obvious why under statement isn't it? it's, it's, it's crushed today. opposition to put in this smashed crashed. it's not just going to call it a long, long established kremlin traditions and conviction, but ruling by fear and violence is much more effective than trying to be liked it. subtle. so the issue for russia, if it will tell you in the taurus period or in peril, russia period, it was more of the same method of in political life, especially before the rational lucian you should also understand that russian culture is totally different than many cases from european culture. and sometimes that is
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the feeling that feast is stronger than what you talk almost academically about what's going on. but aren't, aren't you ashamed of personally of what your forces are doing and ukraine. ah, 1st of all, even me, i don't even me and many others. we don't have a real to what is going on. and this is maybe maybe a mistake in our information campaign. because from my point of view and i expressed publicly, we need to seriously enlarge the volume of the information of the week of our forces. there are because you can see the natures you can see the devastation. yes sir. i can see the parties aren't, aren't you? ashamed of that, and it's a tragedy, it's real bread that the what and what has happened to the us with the 50 people
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skill in one more read for your brain as well, for russia. and i, i think that russia needs to be much more open information space or show what was real and what was fake. it's not gonna happen is it, it's not going to happen. there's a huge clamp down on media. virtually all independent media has been shut down, hasn't it? not all, but largely, virtually yes, on. many of them are now labeled as a foreign agents and are not able to present their opinion to the public. or though, of course, are still there are just for some individuals raise their was against the military operation. but generally, generally, at this stage in the mood in the nation is in favor of douglas. but
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it's already clear that in a number of key aspects, russia's military operation has failed, at least in terms of its initial aims. you said yourself in february putins instruction, initial instruction was to have a full victory over your grade by march. the 2nd here we are moving a month on russian forces a seem to have given up on key f and the been routed from a number of towns and locations. and finally, we had an admission that they have suffered significant losses. who is going to be paying for those failures of the rush? it's still very hard to say it's a trailer not because the battle is still going, gone and going to be formed, poorly, hasn't it? the army is not before then i'm just more or less than the normal a like they are or the they're ordered. so poor plan didn't supply tanks that run
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out of fuel. that kind of the problem is the other that the territory on which ration mom is now is operating, is much larger than it was probably originally lambs. well, they didn't have a map. they didn't know how long. no, it's, no, it's not a map. it's something it will if you will take the degree of put in it was a degree special mil, 3 obliteration for secure dog bus, a new dance group, public. there was no one in this degree about here about how to go about this. so something like this, but the problem is that procedure is and the fact that the main goal as it was cold diameter is ation. and then as if you cation of your grade
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is not possible only of the limit that there are 3 of us. and the dolls aliamanu for the separate if russia, once the realize owners go, it needs to come from home. and if it's not this, this stuff needs much more horses then are now and you pay. but it, but it, it's already clear that this war is a disaster for your country because it's brought russia will, the things it doesn't want. russia wanted recognition and respect feats and all of the global top tables. now it's been shunned, it wanted less nato on its borders. it's going to get much more. it's got an ego huge economic hit and it's clamped down, is forcing the brightest young people in the country to leave in that tens of thousands. can you think of one single benefit this war has brought russia at this stage? i don't see any benefits myself. moral. even more on one of the dea shows in
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moscow, i named 2 figures in 1980. the 1st real war here in i've got his them, we lost in one year, 1584 soldiers and officers more or less the same figure will lock in one bar in ukraine. so compare this, and you will understand that this is a problem for russia and even the best go for press secretary for who is recognizing this last this last us will have, of course, very serious implants later on, on domestic situation. russia, because what is the most dangerous scenario? russia is that such and of ration will last long. but does
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putin realize that with all these apparently unforeseen reactions and results from this war, that he's actually losing it? he's not going to win this. the wester said you're there determined that he should not win in ukraine. that doesn't have a fit in the kremlin. and it was, by the way, just best the day once again, that affected by fiscal ins press secretary that the victory is near. this feeling is domini still explained, can you oh, there is a feeling that wireless isn't coming days or maybe coming weeks of them to read 3 will be reached and this will then
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you grantley, the ship on their knees. and they will agree on any documents of, beside with rush, they really believe that still yes, there is a believe. and the western sanctions and the western support that's been given to ukraine, hasn't changed their mind about any of this. prentiss, picking up lester sanctions, are in fact long them sanctions and influencing the day very seriously. though yesterday it was probably the figure that 60 percent of russian citizens feel themselves the inference of dissension. but for everyday lives, this benches are not at all and not so sue's who, but the question is, how long will the whole story though? and the other thing is that must go. and
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russia still don't feel themselves in international azelli's. and this gives a certain strength the position of trying to hook. so you think they're just kidding themselves? you think they just don't want to see reality. they're living in some sort of parallel universe here on the yes. sometimes we can say that we are living in the ivory tower and i think that there is, of course now more wish to see the rectory. then realization of the fact that the victory still thought do you accept that? thanks to russia, the world is going to be a much, much more dangerous place in years to come by waving his nuclear weapons at the west. putin has challenged the doctrine that has held for 60 years that no nuclear
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armed states would fight to war with each other because neither side could win. but put in now seems to be saying, well, i know you to the west. i know you've got nuclear weapons, but i might use mine anyway. that's, that's a huge upset for this doctrine of mutually assured destruction isn't it? i'm sure that after this, your grand war crisis will be over, the world will be different. and all the previous approaches, all the previous conceptual. so i'm here to get our and so balance will not work anymore. and i can agree with you that it's a dangerous development because i know the existence of nuclear arsenal will be not anymore both psychological administered barrier and very few other thanks very much for being on conflicts on. thank you. thank you
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for your time. thanks. ah ah ah, with
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a spiral of violets. without end with a film about family, faith, masculinity, of fathers, and starts april 16th or dw. ah, this is dw news, and these are our top stories. russia has confirmed that the top warship in its black sea fleet, the moskva has sunk, while being told back to port in stormy weather. valley of the kremlin acknowledge that the ship had caught fire following an explosion. ukraine says the blaze was caused by its missiles, which struck the vessel off the port of odessa noon
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