tv FOX News Sunday With Chris Wallace FOX News May 13, 2013 1:00am-2:01am PDT
see you back here on monday night. >> greta: tonight, an on the record special. held hostage ten years of terror. three girls kidnapped and now they years of torture are inside a cleveland basement. >> on one of the mornings you will not soon forget. missing for ten years finally found and today they are free. >> i have a caller on the phone with a female who says she is amanda barry and a she had been kidnapped ten years ago. >> nothing short of a miracle. >> three women missing for ten years found alive.
amanda barry, gena dejesus and regina knight. >> charges against 52-year-old ariel castro. >> she says he has been holding her here for ten years. >> i have been here a year. i was barbecuing with the dude. we eat ribs and listen to salsa music. >> and you had no indication -- >> bro, not at clue that that girl was in that house or anybody else was in there against their will. >> this might be for real. >> i will tell you this. because i was there to see her. all three girls. god works in mysterious ways. >> got the others in the house. >> go ahead.
>> we found them. we he found them. >> thankfully. and i mean thankfully due you to amanda's brave actions these three women are alive today. >> i just signed criminal complaints charging four counts of kidnapping and four counts of rape. no charges will be filed against the other two at this time. there is no evidence that the two individuals had any involvement. >> the child kidnapper operated a torture chamber and private prison in the heart of our city. >> the only opportunity after interviewing the young ladies to escape was the other day when amanda escaped. they were in that home, they don't believe that they have been outside of the home for the last ten years respectively. >> ariel castro charged with kidnapping and rape. kidnapping and rape. kidnapping and rape on the third. and kidnapping on the fourth.
>> they were not in one room but they did know each other and they did know each other was there. >> while in captive itity they were about put through repeated beatings. they were bound and restrained and sexually assaulted. basically never free to leave the residence. >> michelle knight said castro got amanda barry pregnant and forced knight to deliver the baby in a plastic baby pool to contain the mess. she said she got pregnant five times but every time he forced miscarriages by depriving her of food for two weeks and repeatedly punching her in the stomach. >> the amount of effort. the amount of leads. the amount of work hours and dedication that went into this, i have never seen it before over the last ten years. >> these three young ladies have provided us with the ultimate definition of survival and pe perseverance.
>> greta: they escaped from the horrible years of tenuous sexual assault and torture. but they are not the only ones terrorized by ariel castro. his former in laws say he beat his then wife breaking h her nose and breaking her arms and even locking her in a box. the 48-year-old died last year. her second husband fernando colon joins us from cleveland. good evening, fernando. >> good evening, ma'am. how are you? >> greta: i'm very well. fernando, tell me, when did you first meet ariel? >> i met ariel around 1995 right after i met grimelda. >> greta: under what circumstances did you meet both of them? >> i met grimelda at the hospital where i work in as a security officer. she would come in with different types of injuries and
for her appointments that is where we met. >> greta: did she ever tell you where she got the injuries or who you she got the injuries? >> yes. she stated to me that the injuries were inflicted by mr. ariel castro. she -- i saw her with a broken nose. dislocated shoulder. broken nose. i think fractured ribs. also to the extent of a missing tooth. >> greta: did she come in is that just one incident or come in more than once with injuries? >> she came in more than one time with different injuries, yes. >> greta: how did you at some point you and grimaldi developed a relationship. was she already is separated from ariel? >> yes, she was. when i met her we spoke about her injuries because she was looking kind of devastated and
kind of afraid of something. i approached her and we started talking. she explained to me the situation and what she was going through. >> greta: did you at some point move in with her or marry her? >> yes. shortly after that occurred in the hospital where we met and we talked for i think probably two, three weeks, i asked her if she would accept my help to get away from mr. ariel castro. she accepted and she moved in with me, and the kids. >> did she ever call the police on him? >> she made police reports, yes. but to call them directly, no. >> greta: at some point so the two of you are living together and are you living with h her children with ariel? >> yeah, she was living with me and we had the four children.
ariel castro, jr., emily, angie and arlene. >> greta: later on as time marched on suddenly the community learns about the fact that there are these missing girls, one of whom is gena dejesus, is that right? >> yes, that's correct. >> greta: were you ever questioned about that disappearance? >> yes, he was. >> greta: explain what happened? >> i was at work as a security officer for international investigations at west 110th and lorraine plaza. i was told by my employer that the fbi wanted to talk with me and that they needed the patrol car i guess to check it out for any type of evidence. >> and did that happen? did you talk to them? >> yes, i did. i went with them downtown to
their field office and i was interviewed with them, yes. >> and were they asking you about the disappearance of gena? >> that's correct. they asked me if i knew gena, if she was ever with me in the house. was she ever in my vehicle. if i ever spent any time with gena. >> greta: why were you interviewed? who put your name in this? >> my thought is that mr. ariel castro had informed them that sense i was living with the girls and they were friends that they must have been around me and possibly had something to do with it at that point. >> greta: so ariel castro the guy who gets caught now with gena and the other two he is the one that sent the fbi out to talk to you? >> that's correct. >> greta: fernando, did you ever tell the fbi they should investigate ariel?
>> yes, did i. i told them to look into ariel castro. >> greta: did they do it? >> no, they did not. >> did you ever suspect ariel castro of having any involvement in gena's disappearance or the other two? >> let me put it this way. it did not surprise me that this did happen. i knew the type of person that ariel was. he is a very smart man. i also said he is like a psychologist, very possessive and very dangerous man according to everything that his ex-wife has told me. >> greta: did his ex-wife ever suspect him in the disappearance of the three? >> as far as i no, no, she never mentioned anything. >> greta: had you ever been inside the house? >> no, as far as i have been is to the front of the house. >> greta: so when you heard the other night that he was arrested, your thought, your
first thought was what? >> my first thought, i thanked god because for a long time i was saying that ariel castro was a very dangerous man. he had the opportunity and the means to get those girls. they disappeared in plain daylight with no struggle whatsoever. and also i felt very happy for my ex-wife as you know she passed and i took it as a revenge to her for everything that he did to her. >> greta: thank you very much. >> thank you. >> greta: and now to the neighbor who is being called a hero. charles ramsey hearing amanda barry's chilling screams for help and racing to the rescue. >> i was eating my mcdonald's and i hear some girl screaming so my neighbor he come across the street and i looking at him going across the street
wondering where he is going. he goes next door to my house and i look and see this girl and she's just going nuts on the door. i'm like what your problem you stuck just open the door are and she says i can't he got it locked. i looked how he has it and it is only enough to reach your are hand out to grab the mail and close the door and she naturally going to pry it open. that didn't work. so we had to kick open the bottom. nothing on that door was aaluminum. it was cheap. she climbed out with her daughter and went to my house and called 911. when the police get here she says there is three more girls up there and that is when gena -- and that is when gena dejesus and they brought two more girls out. >> you saw' manda barry and geena davis? >> ain't that something? >> did you know it was then. >> no, i ain't never seen. >> it was only when the police said. >> the detective told me who that was. i didn't know who that was. >> how did they look in what condition? >> oh, malnutrition. >> they didn't look good?
>> no, no. no, none of that. they weren't none of that. no gatorade or nothing. they looked like they hadn't been fed in a long time, bro. a long time. they were skin in when they come out of the house. we sue this dude every day. i mean every day. >> how long have you lived here? >> a year. i barbecue with this dude, we eat ribs and what not and listen to salsa music. >> you had no indication. >> not the a clue that that girl was in the house or anybody else was in there against their will. he just comes out to the the backyard and plays with the dog and kicking with the cars and motorcycles, goes back in the house. you look and look away because he is not doing nothing but the average stuff. you see he what i'm saying? nothing exciting about him. well, until today. >> greta: three girls now young women grabbed and held against
you know what i'm saying that is my backyard. >> greta: did he live there because some people said they didn't even know he lived there. they thought it was boarded up and he would come and go and check ton. >> he would go to work and come like 9:30 in the morning. come out o the ground of the school bus with a big bag of mcdonalds and a bunch of sodas. i was thinking what is this man doing but he did this every day for a long time. he would take a bunch of food in the house and come right back and go right after work he will come and jump on the motorcycle and take off a little bit and come back and switch the clothes up and get a car or something. it was ariel doing ariel. >> greta: did you hear any noise coming out of the house? >> 2011 my sister was walking
home, late 1030 o the ground at night. she was shaken up terrified. >> greta: your sister. >> she said i believe i heard a girl with a little girl in her arms at ariel's house. i go over there and there is plywood on the windows and bags all over the place so you can't see in or out the house. i called the police like she asked knee call the police and the cops came maybe a half hour later or so. they pound on the door about 20 times. it was maybe 5-6 minutes. there was no answer and they approached off the porch and walked into the driveway and shined a light and there was nothing there. they got in the car and took off. >> greta: when did you see amanda with the baby? >> when she first came out of the house running. >> greta: that is the first you saw of her. >> first ever seeing her face. i never new them until the story came out ten years ago.
>> that was the babe by you had seen him with? >> sunday at park. >> greta: you must have fallen over when you saw? >> when i seen the baby go out the house. i was like that is the the same child i seen at the park yesterday playing with my daughter. and then for me to notice that this is the man that has been having these kids in here all this time and we are out here talking to this damn monster and i am thinking i have a trend and a good neighbor and he turns out to be a piece of crap. how would you feel about that? >> greta: not good. what would you like to say to him? >> he don't want me to say something. if i go in prison again i promise you i will be your and your two brothers worst nightmare. i will put you through hell. i promise you. i will put you in the [ bleep ] forever. >> greta: straight ahead, did friends and family miss clues and warning signs about ariel castro's evil dark side? his former band member and a
>> greta: three girls kidnapped and held hostage for ten years as they grow and become women. was any one ever suspicious of bus driver and band member ariel castro? tito says he played in a band with castro and was inside the house. what did he see there? here is what he told us. >> greta: tellle me, how long did you know him? >> roughly 20 years. >> greta: and during the 20 years anything remotely odd or like what has developed in the last 24 hours? >> not at all. seemed like a normal person, a normal musician as we call it because i never really dug deep into his personal life. maybe people don't want the personal life anybody's business and i respected that and it was music between us. >> greta: you are in a band together? >> yeah. >> greta: you have been inside his house? >> the first couple of years that i met him for rehearsal and everything. two years back i was moving out of my house and i sold him some
appliances and he took a bunch ou help me take some of this stuff home and i'm like sure no problem and we unloaded the appliances in the driveway and leave it here are and help me take the stuff inside the house. i got the as far as to the living room the beginning of the house and really didn't notice anything out of the ordinary. he had furniture and he had his instruments out there and he seemed pretty calm. he wanted me to chill out with him like he said and i said no i have to go, i have a performance, i really can't stay, i got to go. he seemed like normal. not knowing that possibly gina and the other two girls were there. >> greta: did he say he lived with any one? were his brothers there? >> ever since i have known him i have known him to be a loner. he was divorced. i have never seen him with a woman. >> greta: and in the house, no noise or anything that might indicate a woman was leving in
the house? >> no, not at all. >> greta: windows boarded at all. >> they weren't boarded. it was dim like maybe be somebody had the shades down or something. i kind of like really didn't notice because i didn't go in there looking for clues. i didn't know what was going on. i was there to help him out, not knowing that he was doing when was doing. when i found out yesterday it is just a shock to me. >> greta: the discovery of the three kidnapped young women stunning neighbors. one perez says he knew ariel castro for decades. the man he once called kind hearted he now calls a monster. we spoke with perez in cleveland. >> i have known him very well for 22 years. >> greta: the describe him. >> the way i knew him, he was a great guy, a nice guy. very impressionable. charismatic and very kind. and just kindhearted. you didn't feel a need to put your garden. you just were able to be
yourself. me as a kid growing up, i have a lot of friends that didn't have male role models that you know he could have filld that void if it they needed it. >> greta: are you surprised by this? did this stun you in light of how you think of him? >> yeah, i don't -- everything i just said is canceled. it was all a lie to cover up the monster that he really is. >> greta: it did he have odd hours or anything peculiar at all? >> the last two or three years i have seen him go in his house usually in the morning for about 20 minutes at a time but i he thought the house was vacant. i thought he was just going to make sure everything is okay and make sure no one broke in. i thought he lived in another property. >> greta: why did you think that? >> because i never saw him around. i just saw him pass by. i saw the windows covered up and i thought it was just like the other houses that are empty. they are just empty. >> greta: were there lights on in the house at night? >> no. >> greta: so it looked completely vacant to you?
>> yes, it did. >> greta: why did you think that he just owned a vacant house or didn't try to sell it or live there? >> me personally? just off my thought, the property value may raise up with time. i thought he was being smart in not selling right now. >> greta: how did you hear there was something going on there it? where were you? >> we were outside with my nephew and we heard commotion outside and my nephew looked outside and he was like there is an ambulance and a bunch of cop cars outside. come out and there is like 20 cop cars and i see the hero ace call him because he is a hero, i see him talking very animated with the police officers. i thought he was in trouble. i don't know him that well. my first thought was the new guy on the block is in trouble. turns out he wasn't because i found out one of the police officers, lady officers had said to another officer can we get some waters for them in the
ambulance and i was like oh, okay, something else is going on and a cop came us to us and let us know what on and i hurry up and got up and ran to my mom and told her because she has been praying for those girls like they are h her own. >> greta: there is a little girl, too. do you know about that? >> a lot of people can't see a positive in this ugly situation besides that they are all okay but the negative situation something positive came out of it which is a new born 6-year-old baby, a precious child. that is a blessing from god. >> greta: coming up "on the record" is on the ground in cleveland. you will see what our team uncovered at the scene of each kidnapping. plus the legal panel is here. this is "on the
>> greta: three kidnapped girls now women all free. we went back to the scenes of all three kidnappings. >> greta: on august 23, 2002 in this area michelle knight was last seen. no one knew what happened to her after that date. where she went. whether she was dead. whether she was alive. see simply vanished and what is interesting about this is that 8 months later about three blocks down lorraine where amanda barry was working at this burger king she left that night and incidentally it was the day before her birthday. told the family she would be coming home and then her family hasn't heard from her in more than ten years. but no one knew what happened to amanda bar arery. she vanished into thin air. teak a look at the school. wilbur wright elementary school. back on april 2, 2004 it was wilbur wright middle school and this is where gina dejesus went to school. looks leak a lovely place for
your child to go to school. on that date, april 2, 2004, something dreadful happened. gina who was a special education student decided she would walk home from school. left the school never to arrive home and they all just vanished in areas in broad daylight that looked perfectly safe. this is where it happened. 2207 seymour street and if you look down the street you can see the fbi is still processing the white houses where the three women and a young child apparently have been for many, many years. neighbors give all sorts of different stories. some describe the man who lives there castro as an ordinary guy but the story that sort of we hear from everybody is how surprised they were. they never in their wildest dreams believed that those three women would be held captive in that particular house. >> on the record has been on the investigation of the missing girls now women from almost the beginning. right after 14-year-old gina
dejesus vanished in 2004 we spoke with her cousin and cleveland police. >> what can you tell me about the investigation so far? >> well, so far there is no ties to any criminal activity. gina just kind of december thin air.ed into >> looking at this as an abduction or a runaway? >> we are hoping it is a runaway but could be an abduction. treating it on both sides of the fence there. >> greta: i take it that the family contacted all their friends to see whether gina made a call home or a call to them? >> they did that the first day when they fay that wily realized she wasn't coming home and her mother and father immediately started going out to all of her friends and calling people to find out where are she might be and nobody had seen her since she walked away from her last girlfriend on her way home.
>> greta: the disappearances of the three girls no you women also keeping cleveland reporters bessy for the last three years. julie kortright of ktm radio. nice to see you. >> thanks for having me. >> greta: the information about a cell phone, amanda's cell phone being used a short time after she dis' peered. what happened? >> well, about a week after she disappeared we were -- police were searching combing through the area and amanda's mother luanna received a call from amanda's cell phone and it was a man who said that he had amanda and they were married now and she would see her soon. and the cell phone was traced back just within maybe a mile from the seymour avenue address. and that is the last they heard from amanda. >> greta: did they follow up any clue on the cell phone
pinging at all do you know? >> i'm pretty sure that they did but you would think i mean it was so close to where these girls were found. it doesn't -- i don't -- they followed up but i don't know if they took it as seriously as they should have if they would have known. >> greta: what about the 2004 sketch? >> the 2004 sketch, now that was a someone who said they witnessed gina dejesus getting in a car with someone and that was a composite sketch that he gave and it turned out are yellery much like are yell castro. >> i understand there was a dig and a search for one of the young girls or young women and that ariel castro went to the dig. what happened?
>> he was going to the vigils. a prisoner claimd that he knew where the body of amanda bar arery was and it was within walking distance of the seymour avenue address. so investigators spent the entire day digging this empty lot. they didn't find anything and according to the witnesses they saw a man who looked very much like ariel castro who went up and was asking people if they found anything. >> and then finally the thing i wanted to ask you about a child left unattended in a bus and he was questioned. >> well, i don't know if he was ever questioned. that was in 2004. they actually police went to 2207 seymour and i'm pretty sure that was before gina was kidnapped but that was when amanda and michelle should have both been captive in the house
and he left the child unattended on theminal charges. they decided that he had no criminal intent in that situation. >> greta: julie, thank you very much. i bet you are glad you have been working on this case a number of years so i bet you are very happy of the news. looks like it is over. thank you very much. >> completely. thank you. >> greta: will the state of ohio seek the death penalty? how can they prove murder all these years later. our panel investigates the charges he faces next. plus, clues surfacing for nearly a decade. was is right in front of them all along? did the fbi and local police ignore key evidence that could have cracked the case years ago? held hostage, ten years of terror, continues next.
and every act of sexual violence, rape, each day of kidnapping, every felonious assault all of his attempted murders and each act of aggravated murder he committed by terminating pregnancies that the offender perpetuated against the hostages during the decade long ordeal. >> greta: and the prosecutor confirms the charges could include the death penalty. also we now know for sure the dna is just back from the lab. it shows ariel castro is the father of amanda barry's 6-year-old child. joining us the legal panel. san francisco prosecutor jim hammerin and here in washington, dehe fence lawyer bernie grimm. he say he is going to charge for each day of kidnapping. is that possible? >> is this one kidnapping. >> the good news is it doesn't matter such.
on the sexual assaults each rape is a separate crime. once you started the kidnap if you move that person from one room to the other i don't think it is a separate crime. the prosecutor could argue if the victims left the house and he forced them back into the house the key being into a place of greater danger. you could argue those are separate acts of kidnapping. >> why would you infect the issue with an appealable issue? if he had the women outside and brought them inside that is another count. in another room and forced them to go into another room that is. why he would you take the chance. stack all of the sexual assaults and now a possible murder and get what you want out of the guy. >> greta: he says he will charge each act of aggravated murder for are each pregnancy terminated as a result of his conduct. how does he prove that? enough for a woman to say it happened five times or three times or four times or need an
eyewitness or some physical evidence? >> no i mean -- go ahead, jim, i'm sorry. >> greta, we prosecute a lot of cases based upon the testimony simply of a victim. people commit crimes in secret for reason so there are no other witnesses and bernie and other defense attorneys go after and sometimes they arecc. the testimony of one credible victim is plenty. >> greta: here is what i see as a problem. the victim says i was raped 15 times maybe it was only 10 times and becomes overwhelming to the jury to figure out because they have to be convinced beyond a reasonable doubt. and a victim's memory whether it is 15 or 30 is regrettable -- >> greta. >> greta: what? >> yoyou are right. they have to identify the dates
she can remember and stick with those. >> greta: i think when said he will charge every charge. overwhelm the jury. pick the ones you can do. >> why would you take the dump truck approach. the jury will back there and say ten years that was the one that happened in 2011. try to get them in the the mindset of trying to remember the date as best you can although they are not watching tv or reading newspapers. i don't know why you would take that chance. have probably five to ten good felony rapes on him and hit him with those. >> greta: the death penalty based on aggravated murders based on the incidents on which you are relying on o the ground the recollection whether it is 10 or 15 or 30. the thoughts whether that willle be proveable to support a murder or death penalty? >> the interest legal issue in the case. we don't know the facts about how pregnant the victims allegedly were when allegedly we read beat them in the belly
to force the death of a child. i think the question is going to be in terms of legally is it fetucide under ohio law you that is up to 8 years or homicide. homicide in the course of a felony that is fellly murder and he could face the death penalty for that. >> greta: panel if you will stand by. straight ahead. did cleveland police and the fbi botch the case. clues, evidence, even phone calls. all pointing right that the house of horrors. the panel investigates, next.
he said that he told the fbi to go look at ariel and they did not. >> they knocked on the door and nobody answered and they left. 2011 a woman said there is women in the back yard with chains on their necks. the police came and knocked on the door and left. somebody said there is a naked woman in the back yard of the house and the police thought the woman was maintaining a joke. the police maintain none of the calls were ever made. >> greta: your thought about all this? >> just you have to be furious and think that could have been prevented or stopped earlier. so eerily like the jayce e&s
case here in california. spent 18 years as a prisoner of this evil man living in the backyard. he was on parole, greta and many times at least parole officers came to the door to do the parole inspection. never bothered to go in the house and the backyard. they would have found that young girl. she was raped and force ared to father children by this guy and lived this nightmare for 18 years. if the government in that case had done their job she would have been freed many years earlier. people ought to look hard at the case. do we force our way into the house and say i want to see every room and make sure there is no woman in here or young child in danger. >> greta: and there was a call from amanda barry's telephone a short time after she was kidnapped and the cell phone tower indicated it was from seymour street. would have been a good hint if you follow the cell phone and it is the seymour street. maybe you ought to knock on doors there. >> in situations like this,
everybody is looking for are a fault. it is the police fundamental, i one to react because it is a difficult job to be a police officer. six separate occasions where somebody tried to say listen there is something unusual going on at the house. >> greta: if they get sent out and knock on the door and get nothing that is not doing the job. that is giving up. that is going to get a doughnut down the street at the 7-eleven. it is not like hustling or doing your job. >> police officers do good work every day. 99% of them do good work in my experience. rareugh the cases are ray they they are not unheard of. >> greta: another clue they missed. the sketch in 2004 the sketch looks just like him. how many more clues? >> yeah, and it makes you -- you know, when you listen to the early police accounts and i
think you did that interview, what, ten years ago where people treated it like a missing persons case or a runaway in fact she was a sex slave and or a prisoner the whole time. if people looked at the clues and had gone door to door god help us she might have been freed five or six years ago. >> greta: panel, thank you. coming up, new clues coming out of cleveland by the minute. our on the record special held hostage, ten [ male announcer] surprise -- you're having triplets. [ babies crying ] surprise -- your house was built on an ancient burial ground. [ ghosts moaning ] surprise -- your car needs a new transmission. [ coyote howls ] how about no more surprises? now you can get all the online trading tools you need without any surprise fees. ♪ it's not rocket science. it's just common sense.
>> greta: three kidnapped girls, now 10 years later, all three women, now back home, they're spending time with their families. the victims' family expressed relief, family members accused aerial castro are ripped apart, they are in shock claiming they had no clue what was happening inside of the home. this investigation is far from over and we'll be following it on the record as a team on the ground digging up clues and searching for answers. when we have them, you'll be the first to hear them. thanks for joining us. good night. factor.
>> good monday morning. we are going to have a great week. i am ainsley earhardt. >> i am heather childers. thank you for joining us. it is monday may 13th. thank you for watching "fox & friends first". now it's time for your 5@5. top five stories making news at this hour. they are searching for as many as 3 gunmen after 19 people including three children were injured at a shooting at a mother's day parade. the shooting lasted seconds. >> when i saw people falling i ran inside and i found my daughters. >> m