wanted man in the west 134 years ago today. when news breaks out we'll break in. breaking news changes everything on the fox news channel. the dow is on a tear. we're up 75. neil cavuto up now with stuart varney. see you later. what a stunning historic mistake? >> it would be irresponsible to walk away from this deal. >> this is a bad deal for america. a bad deal for iran's neighbors in the middle east. and a bad deal for the world. >> this is an important step in putting the lid on iran's nuclear program. >> it doesn't look like a very good deal. >> if we don't have the agreement, then you will have a nuclear arms race. >> if we don't stop this deal, you created a nuclear arms race. >> as the debate grows, over here consider who is happy over there. welcome, everyone. i'm stuart varney in for new

cavuto. this is your world. now doubts about it how iranians feel about this deal. because they're celebrating in the streets literally. and it's not just iranians. russia's vladmir putin is breathing a sigh of relief. and iran's supreme leader is thankful. count rudy guiliani supremely worried. he's here and so is republican senator tim scott. to kevin corke at the white house, what america just agreed to. >> good day to you. always a pleasure to be here on the show. we're talking about years of diplomacy, my friend not to mention that marathon negotiating session that took us all the way up to the final hour and ultimately 150 plus page agreement that the white house says will keep iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon for at least a decade. as you know, this has been a long process that has been handled not just by the secretary of state and the

secretary of energy but alsothal president's innercircle. the national security team hard at work along with the diplomat corp. they say they're going to have according to this deal more inspections and monitor the inflow t flow and out flow of materials that could be used for enrichment. the president is calling this deal ground breaking and historic. >> today's announcement marks one more chapter in this pursuit of a safer and more helpful more hopeful world. >> meanwhile secretary of state john kerry has been very forceful today, hailing this deal saying, look the alternative was not going to be better than what whey they came up with. if you do nothing, iran continues to hurdle towards a possible nuclear weapon. on capitol hill lawmakers are skeptical. many saying the president chose

legacy over logic. >> the administration kept lowering the bar time and time again, defending the violations of the iranians. every step of the way. going legacy shopping here's another item off the shelf. the iranian nuclear deal. >> and one more thing i want to share with you. this is not about anytime anywhere inspections. the administration is saying it's going to be anywhere in a timely fashion. a lot of different bait coming up on this. the president will talk about it himself in a news conference tomorrow morning. >> kevin corke, thank you. gop candidate donald trump slamming this deal. >> i think the deal is horrible. it's horrible for us. but it's really really bad for israel. one thing, we have four people over there. prisoners that they're keeping. hostages whatever you want to call them. that's not part of the deal. why isn't it part of the deal? why are we giving them all the money back.

keep the money. we don't have the right to unfettered go in there and check whenever we want to anytime, anywhere. we don't have the right to do that. what kind of deal is it? we know they're going to cheat. >> to another new yorker now, this one is a democrat who is opposing the deal. new york state assemblyman dolph hiken. you say this deal is naive and dangerous. why is it naive? >> it's naive to trust iran that they will abide by any agreement that we make. four days rouhani, the president of iran is in the streets with hundreds of thousands of iranians chanting death to america, death to israel. we are going to trust the iranians. this is cupitchulation. this is appeasement. this is dangerous for america because they will development deadly weapon the nuclear weapons.

this endangers the survivor of the state of israel. six million jews. >> what about verification? the president says this deal can be verified. do you agree with it? >> i don't believe it. i know the iranians are laughing all the way to the bank. they're going to be using $100 billion to spread their violence terrorism all over the world. hezbollah is having the greatest day they've ever had. hamas, the terrorist organizations supported by iran. i call on the american people this is not about republicans, this is not about democrats, this is about the future the well-being of the world that we live in. this president has failed everywhere in the world in foreign policy. we are to trust him on this particular issue that involves nuclear weapons? no way. this is appeasement. >> it may not be about politics. it may not be about democrats or republicans. it is about votes in congress. the president will veto any move to block this deal.

have you in congress got the 2/3 majority you need to override the veto? >> i think the american people are going to do everything in their power here in new york with senator schumer who wants to be the majority leader or mittnoter leader. schumer always says he's the protector of the jewish community. we'll find out if senator schumer is going to support the survival of israel or support the appeasement deal. this is chamberlain 1938. >> are you going to pressure heavily senator schumer. >> schumer and democrats. i'm a democrat. i want to see fellow democrats look at this deal for what it is. it's a betrayal of our friends all over the world. >> you're a democrat. most democrats are in favor of what president is proposing? >> i am an american. i care about the well-being on this country. my parents went through the holocaust. my grandmother died in a concentration camp in a gas

chamber. israel is being threatened. four days ago, death to israel death to america. some people don't want to believe that. i believe it. i believe they want to destroy the state of israel. what are we going to do about this? are we going to sit back and do nothing? or are we going to do everything in this world to make sure. israel more than anyone wants a deal that is real. this is not real. this is about president obama and his legacy nothing else. >> okay. in the last presidential election over 70% of the jewish vote went to the democrats to president obama. in 2016 will the democrats still get 70% and more of the jewish vote? >> if this goes through and democrats support it i think there will bow a dramatic change. this is not a minor side issue. this is about survival for the people of israel and i am saying to the american people iran is a terrorist regime that can aim its weapons one day

towards america. we should be very concerned about that. >> you clearly feel passionately about this. we thank you for sharing it with us on this program. thank you. oil initially falling in price on this iran deal before bouncing back later in the day. traders believing we won't see any glut of oil on the market from this deal at least not right away. next case after this young woman loses her life growing calls today for cities protecting illegals to lose something else. >> what did she say before she went down? >> help me, dad. you total your brand new car. nobody's hurt,but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do, drive three-quarters of a car? now if you had liberty mutual new car replacement, you'd get your whole car back. i guess they don't want you driving around on three wheels. smart. with liberty

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another pneumonia vaccine, prevnar 13® may help provide additional protection. get this one done. ask your healthcare professional about prevnar 13® today. more on the iran nuke deal and the threat to congress. if congress doesn't go along with the deal the president said he would veto any legislation that prevents successful

implementation of the deal. senator tim scott has a plan to deal with the threat. welcome to the program. the president says he'll veto any attempt to block this deal. that means you need 67 votes in the senate to override that veto. do you think you're going to get them? >> i will you that does not sound like a statement of confidence when your first response is not to suggest the strength of the deal but to stress the importance of a veto if you don't go along with a deal. i wonder why there's trepidation and fear out there about us moving forward with a deal. perhaps it's the fact that within just a few years, five years or so they could see the lifting of an embargo on arms. perhaps it's the fact that at the end of the first ten years that we'd find ourselves with iran being able to have a nuclear weapon. this deal as far as we can see so far does not stop iran from

moving forward with a pneumnuclear weapon frlt weapon. finding the votes to override the presidential veto we will figure out whether or not we have those votes. today, it's difficult to say whether we have them or not. >> president reagan when he negotiated with the soviets. he said you have got to trust and also verify. do you trust the iranians and do you believe this deal allows us to verify that they do what they say they're supposed to do. >> absolutely i do not trust the iranians in this situation. i will simply say it's hard to make a good deal with bad actors. so far what we've experienced in the past is lost opportunity after lost opportunity. because we could not trust the other side to do what they said they were going to do. frankly, now we're hearing new language presented to us not, you know inspections anytime, anywhere. but as needed. there's a softening of the language which suggests to me the deal will not be to my

liking. >> i have not heard any passionate defense of this deal. i've heard opposition to the deal. but i've not heard passionate defense. have you? >> i have not, honestly. i've heard some folks say they need to take a step back. my friends on the left i will simply say as netanyahu said historic mistake. this is a real challenge for the world. not simply for the united states and israel but for the entire world. this deal stands as a challenge for all of us to take a look at. >> republican senator tim scott, south carolina. thanks very much for joining us. we appreciate it. >> thank you, yes. it may have been a sanctuary for the defendant, but it sure as hell was not a sanctuary for a young woman walking with her father. at a minimum, change the name of whatever benign sounding program cities like san francisco want

to follow and the money ought to be cut and i would hope that you would insist that federal detainers be honored and not be discretionary. >> you have no opinion as to whether you think sanctuary cities are violating current lar which i'm assuming you're flal with. >> i do not have a legal opinion on that question. >> i'm appalled that you don't. >> jeh johnson offering no opinion on the legality of sanctuary cities. sacramento sheriff scott jones, he has no problem offering one. he says they need to end now. sheriff, how are you going to end the whole concept of sanctuary cities? withdraw federal funds, maybe? >> i think first of all thanks for having me on. i appreciate it. yes. we don't want to cut off our nose to spite our face. it should be a little bit more surgical. we should things that support law enforcement and public safety that are wurltorth while to

continue. how can you'd simultaneously have a federal law and give money to cities that enact ordinance that contradict federal law. >> we had a report that came out yesterday that 8,000 criminal illegals were released in 43 states in just eight months. and 1,400 of them went on to -- were convicted of new -- other crimes later. the outrage is growing about this. i would suspect you've got a lot of public support on your side. >> well you would think so. it's growing support. i don't think people really understand that the entirety of california is a sanctuary state because the federal government's unwillingness to stand up and assert their authority over immigration and to assert contrary opinions other than that has happened in one little jurisdiction in oregon. which has allowed the aclu to write a letter to every sheriff threatening a lawsuit. that's the reality. i don't honor any ice detainers

because the federal government -- i asked the administrators in washington, d.c. stand with me i want to enforce federal law. they have made it clear to me in this administration it will not change. i, as well as most sheriffs in this state and across the country, we don't honor any ice detainers at all h. we would have had a similar result as in san francisco. >> i want to play you a sound bite from today's congressional hearing talking about making detainer orders mandatory. listen for this for a second and react, please. >> there were over 12,000 detainers of mine that were not acted upon. >> why don't you make them mandatory, mr. secretary? if cities like san francisco are not complying with federal detainers, why don't you make them mandatory? >> i think that would be a huge setback in our ability to work with state and local law enforcement. i suspect they would agree as well. >> let me pick up on that. it will be a huge set back for

local law enforcement if detainers were made mandatory. you're in local law enforcement, would it be a huge set back for you? >> that's absolutely untrue. matter of fact you have to realize prior to a few years ago they were mandatory. it's not up to jeh johnson to make them mandatory. the law says the local jails shall retain this guy for no than 48 hours. it's transition during this administration that have gone from a mandatory debate. >> let's get at it is this all about the hispanic vote? >> honestly, i believe it is. i've gone back to washington. i've become a part of the conversation on immigration officers since our officer was killed by someone removed five times. neither the democrats or the

republicans want meaningful immigration reform. they allow the states to come up with their immigration schemes even though they have no legal authority to do so. the federal government allows them to do it unchallenged and unchecked. >> sheriff scott jones, sacramento county california. thanks for joining us today on a difficult and important subject. liberals celebrating after scott walker was called a national disgrace. is that fair? we will debate it next. bank no branches equals great rates. it's a fact. kind of like shopping hungry equals overshopping. ♪ quicker smarter earlier fresher harder and yeah, even on sundays. if that's not what you think of when you think of the united states postal service watch us deliver.

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the head of the aflcio calling scott walker a national disgrace. and rolling stone magazine ran this headline. america's top union leader destroyed scott walker in six

words. to democrats strategist richard goodsteen who said they are absolutely right. you know richard tronka and the unions lost three elections in wisconsin. three in a row. could it be that he is a sore loser? >> stuart, i don't like to engage in name calling. i'll leave the characterizations to him. i like to engage in is facts. crushing unions is not an end in itself. the goal is job growth. president obama was in wisconsin, you saw recently he compared wisconsin with minnesota. very similar populations, very similar demographically. very similar economically. in scott walker he crushed unions. he cut taxes to the wealthy. he stuck it to the university system. minnesota, they raised taxes to the upper 2% and invested more in education, minnesota saw more

in -- >> i've got job growth over the last year in wisconsin 1.8%. job growth in minnesota over the last year .8%. >> that's -- >> in wisconsin, $23 billion. exports in minnesota, $20 billion. i've got the deficit when scott walker came into office at $3.5 billion. it's down by $2.2 billion. it seems like he's been a success and not the failure you suggest. >> not by his own stardsnds. >> the wisconsin sources were projecting a one billion dollars surplus at this point in his administration instead of $2.2 billion deficit they're facing. relative to all the states nest midwest, they're lagging. it's half national -- it's like

kansas. tax cuts thinking it's going to be a panacea. >> it's a national disgrace. scott walker offered freedom for the people of wisconsin to leave the union if they did. and many of them thousands of them especially public sector workers, they left. he offered them that freedom and they left. and he's a national disgrace for offering freedom to people who took it? >> well again, the fact of the matter is what the bottom line is what the state of wisconsin's economy has done under scott walker. not just this past year but the time he's been in office. relative to the national and regional averages, that's a disgrace. if he took that -- >> sir, the unemployment rate in wisconsin is 4.6%. the national rate is over 5%. is that a national disgrace? >> they started at a lower level

when the recession hit, wisconsin was hit less hard. the fact of the matter is the people of wisconsin were polled by marquette. approval 48%. disapproval. 56. against hillary clinton hew loses 52 to 40. somehow he'll break through these blue states not if this poll is any indication. >> it's a long way from a national disgrace. we appreciate you being with us. good debate. thank you. he saw terror strikers so rudy guiliani wants to know why are we striking a deal with terror? he responds in just a moment.

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this killer found sanctuary in a city. could the city find sanctuary in a court? forget releasing the deal's details. is it time for iran to release our hostages? yeah. we are back in 60 seconds. ♪

♪ (vo) making the most out of every mile. that's why i got a subaru impreza. love. it's what makes a subaru a subaru. new york state is reinventing how we do business by leading the way on tax cuts. we cut the rates on personal income taxes. we enacted the lowest corporate tax rate since 1968. we eliminated the income tax on manufacturers altogether. with startup-ny, qualified businesses that start, expand or relocate to new york state pay no taxes for 10 years. all to grow our economy and create jobs. see how new york can give your business the opportunity to grow at ny.gov/business this deal is also in line with a tradition of america leadership. it's now more than 50 years since president kennedy stood before the american people and

said let us never negotiate out of fear, but let us never fear to negotiate. he was speaking then about the need for discussions between the united states and the soviet union, which led to efforts to restrict the spread of nuclear weapons. >> president obama says this deal is about leadership. former new york city mayor rudy guiliani could not disagree more. welcome, good to see you on the show. you don't trust the leadership of president obama? >> i don't trust the leadership of iran. and this deal trusts the leadership of iran. the idea that we're going to be able to inspect properly there is totally belied by history. we've had deals with them before where they have cheated. they were caught in '01, '03 and '05 in enriching uranium.

they were caught by a group i know quite well the iranian resistance movement. since that time in preparation for this deal in iran they have slaughtered many of the many who used to be the spies. the killings in iran have gone up. i think president obama didn't check that. since acmu the killings have gone up because they don't want the people of iran to think the reform picture showing to the world is killing off the spies so they can enrich uranium and hide it for us. since they'll get warnings about our inspections, that is -- >> you're referring to verification now? >> yeah. >> if we want to look at investigate, check out a facility. >> they get -- >> we have to ask the iranians and they've got 14 days to respond.

they can do all kinds of things in those 14 days? >> that would be like me getting a search warrant when i was investigating organized crime and giving them 14 days' warning before i searched. >> you can't trust them and you can't verify -- >> why would you make a deal with someone who has lied to you? would you play poker with somebody who had cheated you before? not unless -- >> why is president obama pushing so hard and tried so hard for this deal? >> you never make a good deal when you want it too badly. you know that in business. you have to always be able to walk away from a deal in order to make a good deal. he wanted this deal too badly. iran got everything it wanted. we really have gotten nothing but iran's word which is worth nothing. we have done something completely astronomically irspbl

irresponsible we've made a dear with a homicidal maniac. the ayatollah of iran. killing hundreds and hundreds if not thousands of his people. he has killed thousands and thousands of people. he has killed americans. recently during a war in iraq killed americans. so we're making a deal with a man who is publicly committed to the destruction of the state of israel. to the spread of islamic extremism. has said he is not going to back off any of those positions. and we are getting him closer to havingsator wanttitiously having nuclear weapons. >> we want peace and quiet, we have fought two difficult words. americans genuinely want peace and quiet. they don't want more confrontation which might end in a military situation with iran.

they don't want that. this want this deal to go through. they want to believe in it. >> americans wanted to get out of the civil war in 1863. abraham lincoln didn't take him out. we had draft riots in new york in 1863. if president obama were in office then what would he have done? taken us out of the civil war? that's why it's the opposite of leadership. >> let's suppose that the republican is elected president in 2016 and that republican president wants to take us out of this deal if it's still in place. can that be done? once you've got something like this as complicated as this involving all these nations. once it's in place it's hard to say deal's off. >> he can take us out of it because the president is not a treaty which it should be. it should be -- he's going to get this true with one third of

congress. this really should be a treaty. presented to the congress. i grn you if it were a treaty it would not be ratified. he couldn't get a majority for this. so an american president could take us out of this deal. the problem is business now would have opened up all the other countries, could you get the rest of those countries to join us in that deal? unless we catch them cheating. and they have done everything over the last two years, meaning iran to prevent the people who caught them last time from being alive to catch them this time. which indicates to me that iran learns from the mistakes of the past and we don't learn from the mistakes of the past. >> i've heard a lot of passionate opposition to this deal. i've yet to hear much passionate enthusiasm for it. and you're part of the former group that is passionately opposed to it. >> passionately opposed to it and convinced it is one of the

worst deals america has ever made. to make a deal with a homicidal maniac is a terrible mistake. particularly one who has lied to you repeatedly before and made a fool out of america several times. >> ashe carter defense secretary is going to israel next week. maybe trying to mend some fences or to sell this deal to israel. do you make anything of that at all? >> i can't imagine how israel could possibly change their position on this deal. unless the ayatollah were to say i withdraw my desire to destroy the state of israel. >> which is not going to happen. >> it's not going to happen. here you are, basically a few miles away and this man is going to be able to -- first of all he'll be one year away from a nuclear weapon under the best of circumstances. and you know he's going to cheat. if you don't know that he's going to cheat, you don't have

common common sense. >> rudy guiliani clearly in the skeptical camp. we appreciate you being here. if sanctuary cities to blame, is san francisco going to get off because of the courts? we'll deal with it.

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there's nobody that can look me in the eye and tell me that that man had any right to be walking free in the city of san francisco with the ability to shoot and murder my sister kate. but the sheriff has said regarding the fact that they've done nothing wrong, i'd like him to look me in the eye and tell me that there's no blame to be put on this policy. it's ridiculous. >> kate steinle's brother telling megyn kelly he blames san francisco's sanctuary city policy for releasing the illegal

immigrant accused of gunning down his sister. that's why this attorney says kate's family would win a lawsuit if they sued the city. but counselor weinstein says they don't have a case. they don't have a case are you telling me that in america where you can sue anybody for anything that parents of a child who was lost because of the activities of a city and a city official you're telling me they've got no case? >> it's a tragic think that happened. my condolenced go out to the family. when you say anybody can sue anybody, they can. the question is do they have a case. cities are not liable for failing to protect a citizen unless there was specific knowledge that he was going to commit this crime. he was taken into custody, transferred to san francisco for drug charges that the prosecutor decided not to prosecute and let him go. >> before we go to lisa i'm going to press a moral question to you. >> not a legal one, a moral one.

>> i'm talking morality. surely it is moral for the parents of that youngster to sue the city and win on moral grounds that nobody should be doing that kind of thing and getting away with it you would agree with you on that? >> i would agree with you on that. the question is going to become -- that's an interesting point. what's happened in san francisco and california cases before they haven't gotten past a judge -- judges dismiss them. >> it's legalistic stuff. >> perhaps they would win on a moral issue. >> tell me why they can sue and how long it's going to take to get some justice? >> it's really not a question of governmental immunity. it's a question of unconstitutional statute which is the ant quated sanctuary laws which were put in place for a different reason. you have sanchez, he's convicted of felonies seven times deported five times. yet released without giving any information to the ice,

immigration and customs enforcement agency which would have detained him. totally preventible. a year ago, just a year ago, the united states v arizona came out and said cities and states must share the information with the federal government regarding immigrants. and they can't -- >> it would seem to be a slam dunk case. federal law was not enforced. >> the conflict lies is who is to blame and who caused the damage to this family. >> look the united states of america, we go to our courts for justice. and if they can't go to the court for justice in this case there is something wrong. >> the shank chew ware laws were on a -- >> they haven't been overturned. that's the issue that's been coming before the court many times. hopefully this one will change and they will find it unlawful.

>> i think we'll both agree this leaves a very bad taste in the -- >> absolutely. >> this could be the case that overturns that law. >> i would agree. >> we thank you very much for a good debate. we appreciate it. after the deal, what's the deal for our americans being held hostage in iran? that's what one democrat lawmaker is demanding to know. bp 64/40 sterilize sites. multiple foreign objects in the body. tweezers. (buzz!) (buzz!) if you're the guy from the operation game, you get operated on. it's what you do. (buzz!) if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance you switch to geico. it's what you do.

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under no circumstances should we relieve pressure on iran relative to ballistic missile capabilities and arms trafficking. >> to lieutenant shaver who says that's exactly what we just did. we did relieve pressure on missiles and also tony i want

to point this one out, we're allowing iran to expand its enrichment program after eight years. we're letting them do this. you can't approve of that, i'm sure. >> this is the obamacare of international agreements. if you like nonnuclear iran you can keep it if you know what i mean. this is tragic. what happened with north korea back in the '90s, the same framework. we're looking at a process of allowing things to happen. this is not a partisan issue. i'm looking at this purely from the military and intelligence aspects. you do not have a clear path to inspect nuclear facilities regarding the military and that's critical. we learned that lesson in the the '90s with north korea. the next thing you know north korea had six weapons. we knew it a long time before we announced it. when you look at the sites we're trying to get to it's not going to be -- not going to be able to play a bureaucratic game to wait us out. we're freeing them up to expand

rapidly in the conventional sense rapidly and this will stimulate an arms race on both sides. the russians are now trying to sell weapons to our arab allies and iranians will do the same thing. >> if the past of obama is fairly clear that will stimulate the nuclear arms race in the gulf. the president says he's just stopped. >> it's totally insane. let me be clear again. my friends at brookings and the left you're completely out to lunch. and by the way this agreement is not about what we believe. it's what our arab allies believe. they do not find this credible stu. we talked to them and the saudis are now getting ready to take delivery of their nuclear weapons from pakistan. pakistan is opening a nuclear bazaar and the egyptians are doing the same thing. >> i'm out of time on a very important and very big news day. thanks very much for joining us tony achltshaffer. joe biden will speak about this deal tomorrow. dan kildee is one of them and

joins me now. congressman, i understand that one of your constituents is being held in iran amir hekmati. is his release included in this deal? >> no it's not and quite frankly while i think it's important that members of congress consider all of iran's behavior including the fact they hold americans who are innocent as we consider the deal it is important that we emphasize they should ever have been part of the transaction. even amir hekmati. >> why not? they've been held as pawns, their hostages. >> by definition if they were part of the deal presumably we would have i havegiven something in exchange for the freedom of these americans and amir hekmati has said that he would not want to be exchanged, an innocent man, for something that presumably would make the world a less safe place. >> are you going -- >> i want to be clear. people on both sides of this agreement have agreed that we

wouldn't want to make the americans a part of the transaction but it's an important consideration as members of congress now evaluate this deal. >> exactly. >> we can't erase from our minds all of iran's other bad behaviors including the fact they continue to hold these american. >> can't you raise this issue as the proceed and congress looks at this deal you can raise this issue presumably and put pressure on the iranians via president obama, get this done get these guys out of there. >> absolutely and in fact i've been raising this from the very beginning. i was one that thought that the release of these americans should have been a precondition to initiating the talks but now that the ball is in the court of the congress and congress has to consider this i think it's entirely within our authority to consider all the factors including the status of these americans before congress makes a determination. i certainly will weigh it against august the other factors that i have to consider when determining whether or not this is a good deal. >> okay. dan kildee democrat michigan

congressman, thank you very much for joining us on a big day. thank you, sir. >> thank you. we are used to presidential candidates invoking the gipper but now they're invoking his economic adviser, that would be art laffer and art laffer joins us nix. ...that sound good? not being on this phone call sounds good. it's not muted. was that you jason? it was geoffrey! it was jason. it could've been brenda. when you do business everywhere, the challenges of keeping everyone working together can quickly become the only thing you think about. that's where at&t can help. at&t has the tools and the network you need

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light. liberty mutual insurance. governor scott walker detail his plan for the economy while announcing his presidential bid using an analogy about kohl's to explain how bringing down taxes would give americans more money to spend. >> we used to call that a similar plan was successful under president ronald reagan and back then we used to call it the laffer curve. today i call it the kohl's curve. you can spend it better than the government can. >> look who's here. laffer as in art laffer who joins me now. art, you were successful with the laffer curve in the 1980s, a

boom for the economy, lots of new jobs. do you think that the same deal the same lowering of tax rates would have the same effect in this new economy, 2015/'16? >> it may not have the same effects but it will have a positive effect. what we really need on taxes is we need a low rate broad-based flat tax and you need to have it so that people have the least incentives to evade, avoid or otherwise not report taxable income and have the least place to which they can place their income to avoid taxation so that's what you need. then you need government spending restraint and as scott walker said that's the best way to do it. people spend their own money better than the government does by miles. >> would you say that most if not all, of the republican candidates who have declared so far are in favor of either a flat tax or certainly lower income tax rates for individuals? >> a couple of them are ready for a flat tax. some are for a flat tax. others want to make it flatter. some by very little bit but

that's what competition is all about. now, i don't know if all of them do. i don't know if santorum -- i don't know what donald trump's plans are but the rest of the candidates i know well and they're all moving in a pro-growth positive agenda. i can't be more excited about the field than i am. >> now, governor walker used your name in his presentation there. and governor walker has just been called by richard trunka the head of the afl-cio. a national disgrace. you're shaking your head. >> it's so self-serving of him. scott walker has done the best labor reforms in wisconsin imaginable and got right to work this year and everyone knows that right to work is the strongest engine of growth for state policies. if you looked at my book along with rex sin feld travis brown and steve moore, "the wealth of states" we show unequivocally that those states that have right to work laws grow much faster than those states that have forced union and why any

american would want to support a forced union situation where you honestly don't even have a choice stuart you have to join the union period and you have to pay the dues and use those for political contributions, scott walker got rid of all of that in wisconsin, in wisconsin no less. >> when he gave workers in wisconsin the freedom to leave the union, literally -- >> he did. >> thousands of them did exactly that. >> and the contributions, political contributions tumbled as they should. these people don't have any right to spend yours or my money. they can spend other people's money if they get the permission for it but shouldn't be able to get to spend that money if you don't give them permission. >> art it i was a pleasure as always being with you again. we'll see you again soon. art laffer. >> thank you very much stuart. pleasure. gop presidential candidate george pataki taking to twitter to take on hillary clinton's support for the iran nuke deal. he tweeted this "i'm saddened and shocked that in endorsing

this deal hillary clinton has so clearly forgotten the lessons of 9/11." he'll let loose even more tomorrow when he students me at 9:00 a.m. the name is "varney & company" and governor pataki will be with us then. "the five" is next. >> i'm dana perino along with kimberly guilfoyle, juan williams eric bolling and the brother i never wanted greg gutfeld, it's 5:00 in new york city and this is "the five." president obama proudly announced a nuke deal with iran this morning that he claims will make the world safer and more secure. >> because america negotiated from a position of strength and principle, we have stopped the spread of nuclear weapons in this region. this deal offers an opportunity to move in a new direction. >> israel's prime minister has a very different assessment. >> the world is a much m