tv Nancy Grace HLN July 22, 2009 8:00pm-9:00pm EDT
breaking news tonight t. mystery surround iing the sudde death of music icon, michael jackson intensifies. questions mounting as to the sudden death. his $500,000,000 empire. his family publicly claiming he was murdered. bombshell tonight. just hours ago, the dea, lapd and houston police join forces in a surprise raid on jackson's live-in doctor. police searching for evidence of
mans laughter. images of computer hard drives. scores of documents, charges aimed at jackson's live-in doctor by the family who points the finger at the private doc. he performed cpr at the time jackson died. to make a case on homicide including a bedside oxygen tank. a bag of liquid. at the same time, the raid goes down hours ago on jackson's private doc. is grandmother, katherine jackson declaring michael jackson incompetent at the time he wrote his will? is she being played like a fiddle by father, joe jackson?
legal experts say incompetent is the only way the jackson's can finally get their mitts on jackson's half a billion dollar empire. not one, but two autopsies revealed. the deadly drug propofol in jackson's system. yes, it was predicted women would come out of the woodwork claiming to be the biomom of his kid. is there a fourth jackson offspring? all this as we uncover the secret location of jackson's body, hidden miles away to stop would be body snatchers. a battle to stop the jackson brothers plan for a burial theme park at neverland. it's war. a high-tech security system
measuring every inch of the home with a system of jackson's final moments gone. a bag of drugs, iv pole, ser i thinks, gone. fresh needle marks in jackson's neck. riddled with track marks, skin paper white, reports he wanted to be put under with an iv drip for days on end, lying there like a living corpse as the vultures circle his dead body including aeg trying to sell video of his last performance. the fate of his three children unknown. >> breaking news for you on the michael jackson investigation. >> clearly what you are seeing
is a full scale search on the offices in houston of doctor murray. >> police searched michael jackson's personal doctor. they served a warrant that quote, authorized law enforcement to search for and seize items at the defense of mans laughter. >> they say throughout this investigation, they have been completely cooperating with authorities saying if they wanted anything, they should have asked for it. >> murray was emerged as a central figure in the investigation of michael jackson's death. the doctor was with the singer when he collapsed and died last month. >> during this investigation, cops attempt to take it to another level. >> you want to know about foul play? this doctor, he ran away. it took three days to find him. what do you think happened?
to me, it's foul play. >> i never seen my brother have different or abnormal behavior in any substance that would cause that. to say these things, i don't know. >> good evening. i'm nancy grace. i want to thank you for being with us. the mystery of the sudden death of music superstar michael jackson intensifies. >> you don't take a doctor and stick him in the room and the doctor give him something to make him rest, then he don't wake up anymore. something is wrong there. >> federal agents are searching a houston building in the investigation of the death of michael jackson. they use the word manslaughter. they are searching the houston office of doctor conrad murray. they tell cnn they are assisting
the lapd in a search warden. >> the dea help iing out. the clinic of doctor conrad murray. he was with michael jackson at the time of his death. he's been interviewed by investigators in los angeles. they are going in, looking for more material. >> somehow, i understand he left or went to sleep or something. i don't know what happened. something went wrong. when they try to bring michael back, he was dead. something went wrong. >> the spokesperson for doctor murray's attorney, they say they are surprised by this. they have been cooperating. anything that they want from us, we are more than willing to give them. they are surprised that a search warrant was served. >> something happened there. there's something behind all of that. it's foul play. i'm not sure -- i was totally
against that. i fought to get him in neverland. his work is his imagination. it's what he dreamed of. he brought it to reality. i feel that's where he needs to be. >> in the last hours, the dea joins forces with the lapd and houston police in a surprise raid on michael jackson's live-in doctor. straight out to ted rollens joining us in l.a. >> reporter: a copy of the hard drive of a computer in his clinic was taken out of the clinic. the shocker, when you talk to doctor murray's lawyers, this was a complete surprise to them. they had open dialogue and a third interview scheduled in l.a. on friday between murray and investigators. this was a shock. that search warrant saying they
were looking for material that would back up, basically, a possible -- possible case of mans laughter against murray. it's a death investigation or homicide. it's a homicide investigation. >> ted, in every search warrant, as you well know, there has to be probable cause for police to swoop in and start searching. what was the probable cause? what did they lay out? >> we don't have a copy of the search warrant yet. that's troubling. it was probably filed under seal. to get more, like you say, more information as to the probable cause, clearly there was probable cause during the investigation. something they came across, whether the interviews with murray or other doctors that led them to go to the clinic and get what they wanted. not ask, but go in and get it. a judge said you have the
probable cause, go ahead. it was signed off on. big difference in the whole investigation between the cooperation level. >> ted joining us from l.a. mike, this is serious because all this back and forth, it's not a homicide, it is a homicide, they go in, in a surprise raid on this guy's office, a private doctor, live-in doctor with michael jackson to raid him, go through his computer, take images of his hard drive. scores of documents were taken, what do you think, ted? >> for them to get the search warrant, the viewers might not know what probable cause is. it would lead you to believe a crime is being committed, has been committed or will be committed. >> senior editor with "us weekly," weigh in.
>> this has been building all along. it's what the jackson family wanted. they have been after proving that michael was in great form. this is exactly a total mystery to us. meanwhile, they have been lying through their teeth. there's intervengss planned. he was not in as good of shape as we thought. a lot of different things going on with him at the time in getting ready for this. jarring the system and the drugs, then the doctor running away after he died. it plays into the murder mystery and it's more and more real by the day, as we can see. >> since subpoenas went out, the former nurse to michael jackson, her office searched by the coroner, today. thank you for being with us. i think i have her with me. are you there? okay. liz, try to hook me up with her. in the meantime, let's unleash the lawyers. jew san moss, renee rockwell.
hugo out of miami. donna in toronto, hi. >> caller: hi. >> what's your question? >> caller: it's more of a comment. i like michael jackson and i feel badly that he's gone, but at what point do we take responsibilities for our own health. he has three children, now they are orphans. he was playing russian roulette with his life. ♪
>> leave him alone. stop the crazy names they call him. what more do you have to do to make people realize he's a human being. >> i have a lot of concern. >> what are your concerns? >> i can't get into that, but i don't like what happened. >> there's nothing in his history, nothing doctor murray knew to lead him to dlooef he would go into sudden death. >> he said my daddy, he was a human being. he was a father, an uncle, a brother, a son. they need to leave him alone. he's the number one donor of charity around the globe, giving his every cent from his tours, giving it to charity. to paint him to be this person that he's not, it bothers me, it
bothers my family. it bothers all of us. >> out to the lines, dee in texas. hi, dee. >> caller: hello, nancy. i have a quick question. michael had this drug before and seen the doctor give it to him. it sounds like he already had an iv catheter in. could he have put it in himself and given himself the lethal dose. he knew he would be able to sleep, and he wouldn't be afraid. he'd had it before. >> out to bryan, former jackson family attorney. what about it? >> that is exactly what the police are investigating. you have so much speculation. so many accusations being made here. you have to listen to the police and watch their actions. their actions today say they
mean business. there is big fire where there is smoke here. and the police are saying, through their actions they have evidence that they are acting on that evidence, it's going to be slow and meticulous. watch out, they are doing their job, i give them an a plus. >> bryan, that was not remotely the question. the question is -- >> you cannot tell the answer to that. >> the question was suicide. what the police did has to do with manslaughter. >> you cannot tell the last hours of michael jackson's business or speculate what they are. let the police do their job. they are doing it well. >> to doctor marty mccarry joining us from johns hopkins. doctor mccarry, physically speaking, i don't know the psyche of michael jackson. would that have been possible to
commit suicide in that manner? >> it would have been a single large dose of prof fpofol. the second you turn it off is the second you wake up. >> back to terry, joining us from l.a. what did they seize, ted, regarding the computer? >> they went in and copied a hard drive of one of the computers inside the clinic and took 21 separate documents aside from that. on the hard drive, you can imagine there could be thousands of documents and the history they were looking for dating back to who knows what. the computer hard drive is most likely the key bit of evidence here. >> to nakita moody musical editor, what do you make of it? >> i think people have been focusing on conrad murray for a
long time. they are going to look at him. he was the only person in the room. i think there's so much speculation and so much intense interest, the police have to do whatever they can to really find out exactly what's going on because there's so much intense interest from his family, fans. people want to know what exactly was his role. >> back to the lawyers, leonard, susan, renee, hugo. susan moss, the attorneys for jackson's live-in doctor say he's cooperating. he's having all these interviews with them. another was set up. that's bs. the police have had it up to here and they raided him. >> michael jackson had so many doctors, they should be called the jackson 12. there's a whole host of people giving prescriptions to the guy. the fact he had dep van in his
house is outranlous. they are all going to go down and some will go down for murder. >> to you natisha lance, what can you tell me about grandmother katherine jackson being manipulated into trying to declare michael jackson incompetent at the time he signed his will. >> she filed a petition. she's asking to assume a role of administer. there's two executors on the will. the only way to find it null and void is if he was competent when he signed his name on the will back in 2002. >> leonard lee, how likely is it there's a battle of competence, he was out of it, crazy at the time he signed the will. how hard is that to do? >> virtually impossible. to go back seven years and say he was incompetent, it seems
reasonable. he left the estate to his kids and mother. what's wrong with that? >> it's very simple when it comes to the children. the will is what it is. it's the will from my brother because that's the way he was done. that's the way he did it. my mother gets full custody of the children and the children will be fine. they are with my mother now. anybody that tries to contest the will on any level, whether with the executors or anything, they are not living out michael's wishes.
what he was looking for was sleep. as for medication he had previously to help him to sleep. he wanted to have a good eight hours sleep. >> what did he say exactly, miss lee? >> he said that i want an iv and he was telling me the name of the medication, which sounds so much like other medications. i said repeat it again.
he said it. it said i don't know what that is. let me check it out. after checking it out and everything, i went back to michael and said, this is a medication that is not used in a home, especially for an iv to sleep. you don't want to do this. against all my advice, i said don't do this. >> joining us tonight exclusively, that nurse, the former nurse to michael jackson, today, her office searched by the coroners office. they made it clear, publicly, she is not a suspect and is cooperating, helping police in their investigation. thank you for being with us. >> caller: thank you very much, nancy for having me. >> yes, ma'am. i know you tried to stop michael jackson from his collision course. coroners at your office today. what were they looking for?
what did they take? i have been conversing with them ever since friday. actually, friday before july third. the fourth of july. we were to meet at my office. based on traffic and right before the holiday, we didn't meet up at my office. one of the deputies was going to meet me at my office. we have been in communication. i knew they wanted a copy. i had a call last week, last friday that, you know, based on pro protocall, we have to issue you a subpoena. i said i know. she said she will e-mail it to me and i can fax it back to them. i said okay. then i thought about it and said i went through so much and everything i have been stating is in details in the file. i wanted to make sure it was very clear on every nutritional level as far as testing
breaking news in the investigation into the death of michael jackson. just hours ago, federal drug agents raided the office of doctor conrad murray. >> now found in michael jackson's home. this is used in operating rooms to knock out patients. >> conrad murray was with him at the time he died. >> if they were administered by another party, this could be a homicide investigation. >> the lawyers say detectives are looking for evidence of
manslaughter. >> after my tour ended i remained out of the country to under go treatment for addition to pain medication. >> if it was the cause of death, anyone who issued it and was not there to administer it committed gross negligence. >> the "sun" newspaper ver viewed tito jackson. they say he said quote, my opinion is he panicked when he didn't wake up. the doctor figured there could be trouble. he tried to revive my brother. if he immediately called for help, we might have him here today. >> i'm not sure if he's in mr. gordy's crypt or whatever it is. but, i was totally against that. i fought to get him at
neverland. it's his work. it's his imagination. it's what he dreamed of. he brought it to reality. it's where he needs to be. >> we are taking your calls live. out to sharon in florida. hi, sharon. >> caller: hi, nancy, how are you? >> i'm good. >> caller: you said on several, several occasions, the doctor left at night and came back in the morning. why was he there at lunchtime? >> excellent question. excellent question. what do we know about it? >> he would be on call for michael jackson anytime. when ever michael jackson needed him is when he would be at the home. >> where we got a lot of that information is when his personal chef was describing the oxygen tanks coming in and out of the home. he is the one that details how the doctor would come, conrad
murray would come in the evening and leave in the morning. basically, he could come when ever, correct? >> correct. >> the former nurse to michael jackson, today, her office visited and searched by the coroners. files taken. miss lee, they wanted what you offered, which was basically jackson's entire medical file that you had. >> caller: yes. but it didn't quite happen like that. the call that i received was, they were going to -- actually they sent me an e-mail with the subpoena and told me i could fax over -- >> right, i heard that and it was too much to fax. >> caller: i told them they could pick it up. >> i understood that from before. what is in the medical file that would be relevant to jackson's death?
>> caller: they wanted a hard copy of what i stated. they said thank you for coming forward about the medication to look for. they wanted it in writing. they had to follow legal, you know, protocall. >> the lawyers, they have sated clearly, that she is not a suspect, renee rockwell, but when you are a subject of a surprise raid, i'm not talking the nurse, i'm talking the private live-in doctor, you have problems. his lawyers keep going on tv saying everything is fine. we are cooperating. we have having interviews. this is a raid. >> yeah, nancy. i disagree with anybody that said this this is merely an investigation. to me, it was always a murder investigation. the doctors involved themselves,
had dialogue with the police. this was definitely a surprise attack and i imagine it's in light of the fact more material could have been destroyed. >> hugo rodriguez? >> i have to agree. they wanted to surprise him. obviously, we know that michael had this medicine in him. i read report that is he traveled previously with anesthesiologists that would take him up and bring him down. they want to find out who administered what and what doses. this is going to be a battle of medical experts. >> joining me is karen stark out of new york. it's great to see you, again. two things, number one, a doctor. i can imagine this physical image hovering over jackson, putting an iv in him, making him sleep overnight on an operating
room sedative. doctors can make a very, very fat living off just being a doctor. why do something like that? >> i feel like it's the celebrity, nancy. it has to do with wanting to be around somebody like that. it's so powerful people begin to do things they wouldn't ordinarily do. it's hard to resist when a celebrity is asking you to do something like that. >> karen stark, we are hearing reports that grandmother, katherine jackson, the legal guardian to his children is being manipulated, pressured to challenge jackson's competency at the time he wrote the will. in other words, he didn't know what he was doing. they were all out celebrating an anniversary at his favorite indian restaurant. how can the two things fit together. >> if he didn't know what he was doing, he named his mother to
have custody of his children. that doesn't make sense, either. she doesn't seem like that kind of person, but she's getting a lot of pressure because of financial gain. perhaps her husband is behind it. it doesn't make any sense. >> we all know, reports that aeg is trying to sell the last video of jackson's rehearsal for $60 million. the family getting the lion's share of that. 40% would go to katherine jackson. 40% to the children and 20% to charity. we predicted people would come out of the woodwork claiming to be a biomom. now, a bioson came out of the woodwork. what's that about. >> allegedly, he was at the memorial. his mother, according to reports, they lived at neverland
for a certain period of time. she is the mother of this child and michael jackson's youngest child, blanket. people are crawling out of the wo woodwork. >> look at the screen. we are showing the jackson family at jackson's memorial. there's a red arrow on the left of the screen pointing to this young man. >> right. we haven't been able to confirm it. you have to question the sources. you have to wonder, is it a legitimate claim or just because it's michael jackson and there's a lot of money at stake here. >> this guy, 25 years old claiming he's the bioson of michael jackson. >> it's allegedly what you saw. >> what we think we saw. >> correct. >> leonard lee, you are the expert in wills and estated. why would he wait until jackson is dead to make a claim?
>> i think he just thought of it. >> what? >> nobody thought jack southern would die like that. who knows. he would have to have a blood test to prove he's a son. maybe when jackson was alive, he never came forward. >> marty mccarry, tell me, can you do a fraternity test post autopsy? >> sure you can. the dna is still there. >> how? >> there's an analysis that takes four or five days. they get a map of the dna and try to match it. >> quick break. we are taking your calls. every year, hundreds die from a silent killer in their own home. carbon monoxide. here are the tips to protect you and your family. install carbon monoxide detectors outside every bedroom.
early this morning, a team of l.a. detectives and dea agents entered the clinic with search warrants. they spent two and a half hours inside going through medical records. >> a source told us numerous bottles of prescription medication was found in jackson's $100,000 a month mansion. >> if that's the primary cause of death, how is that not
murder? >> they were looking for evidence of manslaughter. the l.a. police may be pursuing it. >> doctor conrad murray was with michael jackson when he died. murray is only one of several doctors who treated jackson. l.a. police won't say if there's search warrants for any other positions. >> michael jackson had a good relationship with his doctors. he put a physician on his payroll for the concert. evidently, he was telling him what he needed. >> i've never seen my brother have different, abnormal behavior that would -- any substance that would cause that. to say these things, i don't know. i've never seen it. i would say no. >> back to ted rollins. explain how the raid went down, what time, what happened, who was there, did they let him in,
did they bust the door down, what happened? >> they didn't have to bust the door down. what's that? >> good to know. >> yes. cooperation is still taking place. they knew what they were looking for. they brought with them some folks with the dea that are experts in this field that could help them basically target their search. l.a.p.d. had help with people familiar with clinics and pharmacy spheres looking for records. they got a hard drive. 21 documents, then they were out. two and a half hours, not a big deal. when you look at the video, they brought a lot of agents. >> was the doctor there when the raid went down? >> no, apparently not. he was not there when the raid went down. they said it was a complete surprise. >> do we have any idea why this doctor went missing, was hiding
for three days after michael jackson's death? >> totally false. initially after michael jackson died, murray was at the hospital, talked to investigators for a short period of time. then he left. he retained council out of houston. they came to los angeles to help facilitate the communication between murray and detectives before he talked to detectives. he wanted a lawyer. that's all it was. there was a time delay and it got blown out of proportion. doctor mccarry, what are they looking for in his hard drive? i mean, if, if, he were illegally getting his hands on propofol, what you give them before they go into surgery to knock him out for hours on end, days on end, why would it be on record on the computer?
>> it would take a lot to get it. ordered overseas or come from a distribut distributor. right now, the problem with this case is they have nothing that directly connects this doctor with michael jackson's death for the exception he was doing cpr when the medics arrived. >> how long will propofol stay in the system? will it show up in an autopsy? >> yes, it would. >> if the doctor is there with fresh track marks in the neck, i doubt he shot himself up in the neck, that's powerful evidence, isn't it? >> they could make a case someone else administereadminis. there's going to need to be hard evidence to make a connection for manslaughter. >> out to andrew, senior editor for "us weekly." i understand debbie rowe is in
the fight for control of not only his money, but custody of his children. >> she is. there's several false reports. i since found out by people close to the jackson side of things saying he wants to settle for money. she doesn't want custody of the kids. she doesn't want to see them. i have interviewed debbie rowe many times. >> out to nicole in missouri. hi, nicole. >> caller: hi, nancy, i love your show. >> thank you. >> caller: is this available only in a hospital setting, how could the doctor get ahold of it? i was thinking inside help from a hospital. >> how does that work? how could they? >> these are locked up in a hospital. not even i have easy access to
this in the hospital. someone has to get it from a locked, secured area. that's how it's supplied. >> to christy in montana. hi. >> caller: hi, nancy. my mother maxine and i absolutely love your show and you are a true blessing. >> thank you, thank you very much. >> caller: my question is for the last few weeks, i know they have been talking about whether or not his dermatologist could be the potential father of a couple of the kids. i'm wondering, they never questioned the paternity of any of the children while he was living, why is it in question at his death? i mean, he was obviously a good father during the time he was living, why would they question who's the father now? >> over money would be the only reason i could think of. leonard, a lot of people want that half billion dollar empire. if they had to cut out the three
children claiming they were neither adopted or bilogical,it. >> i think it's so far removed, that's not even reasonable at this point. he's the father on the birth certificate. that's just an impossible challenge. >> well, we don't know he's the bio father and he never formally adopted. >> he was married to debbie rowe. she's the mother. and my understanding is that he is on the birth certificate. how are you going to challenge that now? >> i imagine demanding dna. i don't even know if that's legally possible. we'll be right back. we're taking your calls. happy birthday to one of our stars, makeup superstar, happy birthday, denitra. happy 85th to dorothy, friend of the show, mother of ten. grandmother of 30. great-grandmother of 44 and one great-great. happy birthday, dorothy.
saying that i beat michael, that's not true. a lot of people in america spanked their kids. if they say they don't, they're lying. they're lying. michael was never beaten by me. >> come on, joe jackson. even michael jackson's cousin came on the show the other night trying to defend you and had to admit you beat him with a strap, okay? so what do we think you did to your own son? that was joe jackson trying to claim he never, never played a hand on michael jackson. senior editor of "us weekly" what do you make of reports from
e! that propofol or diprivan has been found in both autopsies, including the autopsy requested by the jackson family? >> i think that's absolutely true. i have heard personally about this drug since i was interviewing michael years ago at the beginning of the decade. so i know about this drug. i heard about demerol. none of this is new and none of this is surprising. >> mike brooks, wrap it up. >> dea, lapd is on the case. they're going to find out the cause and manner of death is. it looks like manslaughter, homicide or accidental overdose. >> and, doctor, what do you think will be the final outcome with the children? right now they don't even understand their father is dead. >> i think they will wind up with their grandmother and this will always affect them, nancy. there will be a big hole in their hearts. everyone, let's stop and remember captain todd seibert killed iraq.
highly decorated, also served iran. a penn state grad, a member of the marine historical society, loved collecting world war ii memorabilia and landscaping. leaves behind parents thomas and dorothy, brother thomas, sisters denise and diana, 9-year-old daughter, alicia, -year-old son, nicholas. todd siebert, american hero. thanks to our guests and a special good night from a group of young crime fighters from the junior d.a. program, fulton county, atlanta. aren't they beautiful? we wish you to all grow up, go to law school and become prosecutors. i'll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp eastern and until then good night, friends. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com
coming up next on "issues" fast-breaking developments in the michael jackson death investigation. a law enforcement raid on the houston officer's abductor, conrad murray, the doctor who was with michael jackson at his l.a. mansion when he collapsed and later died. and we're also learning from tmz that the l.a. coroner's investigator has gone to the office of nurse cherilyn lee. she is the nurse who told the world michael jackson begged her for the powerful surgical knockout drug diprivan. we also have an espn shocker to tell you about. a woman working hard to do her job on espn as a newscaster allegedly violated by a pervert who took photographs and video of her naked inside her hotel room and put it on the internet. we'll have the latest.
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