captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> ifill: good evening. i'm gwen ifill. >> woodruff: and i'm judy woodruff. >> ifill: on the newshour tonight: >> madam secretary, i understand that there are people frankly in both parties who have suggested that this investigation is about you. let me assure you it is not. >> ifill: hillary clinton in the hot seat. house republicans grill the former secretary of state for hours on the benghazi attack that killed four americans and sparked a 17-month long investigation. >> there was never a recommendation from any intelligence official in our government, from any official in the state department, or from any other person with knowledge of our presence in benghazi to shut down benghazi, even after

>> woodruff: also ahead this thursday, a priest in mexico offers a place of refuge along a perilous journey to the u.s. >> ifill: and a beer maker's secret recipe for success-- letting employees own the company. >> the better i do, the better we do... it really does inspire us all to go above and beyond in a way that i haven't experienced at other employers. >> woodruff: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> and by bnsf railway.

>> and by the alfred p. sloan foundation. supporting science, technology, and improved economic performance and financial literacy in the 21st century. >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> woodruff: republican paul ryan now appears all but certain to run for-- and be elected-- speaker of the house. the wisconsin lawmaker won support today from key moderates and from mainstream conservatives.

the latter group called him "the right person to lead the house". ryan cleared an even bigger hurdle last night when most of the harder-line conservatives in the "freedom caucus" voted to support him. the house will choose its speaker next week. >> ifill: president obama vetoed a sweeping $600 billion defense bill today. in an oval office ceremony, he took issue with increasing war spending, by going around budget caps set by the so-called "sequester." >> i have repeated called on congress to eliminate the sequester and make sure we are providing certainty to military so they can do out-year planning, ensure military readiness, ensure our troops are getting what they need. this bill instead resorts to gimmicks that has not allowed the pentagon to do what it needs to do. >> ifill: republicans are considered unlikely to muster the votes needed to override the veto. >> woodruff: secretary of state

john kerry voiced cautious optimism today about ending a spate of israeli-palestinian violence. he met with israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu for four hours, as both men visited berlin, germany, and he spoke to reporters afterward. >> there may be some things that could be, in the next couple of days, put on the table which would have an impact, i hope, on the perceptions of everybody engaged that there is a way to defuse the situation and begin to find a way forward. >> woodruff: kerry called for an end to incitement, without singling out either side. he plans to meet with palestinian prime minister mahmoud abbas in jordan, on saturday. meanwhile, there was fresh violence in jerusalem. two palestinians wounded a jewish man in a stabbing attack. police killed one of the assailants and wounded the other. >> ifill: the people of sweden

were stunned today by a savage attack on a school. it happened in the southern part of the country, where a masked man fatally stabbed two people, before he was killed himself. cordelia lynch of independent television news filed this report. >> reporter: clad in black, wearing a metal helmet, wielding a sword, casually posing with students unaware of the malice behind the mask. they assumed he was dressed up for halloween, but it's believed moments after this photo was taken, he attacked and killed and a teacher and pupil, injuring two others. police were called to kronan school in trollhattan, north of gothenburg shortly after 10 a.m. they said the 21-year old attacker knocked on the doors of two classrooms and targeted those who opened them. after shooting the attacker

dead, police search his home and recovered what they called interesting items. they are now looking into possible far-right sympathies. but what led up to this chilling image and the rampage that followed is still unclear. happened here today and this is why it is a tragedy that affects the control country. >> reporter: the town has a large immigration population and this is an ethically diverse school. the killer lived locally. the fact that's he seemingly entered so easily has prompted calls for much tighter security across the country. >> ifill: the last such attack on a school in sweden was in 1961. >> woodruff: the russian military has announced plans to build a base in an island group that's partly claimed by japan. the islands, known as the kuriles, are located just miles off the japanese mainland. the soviet union seized the chain at the end of world war ii. as a result, japan never signed a formal peace treaty with moscow.

>> ifill: in economic news, the united auto workers union approved a new, four-year contract with fiat-chrysler, after rejecting an earlier version. and wall street got a big boost from upbeat reports by mcdonald's and e-bay. the dow jones industrial average gained 320 points to close near 17,490. the nasdaq rose almost 80 points, and the s&p 500 added 33. >> woodruff: and from now on, a round of golf could mean a term in jail for members of china's communist party. new rules have banned all 88 million party members from playing golf, in a crackdown on corruption and high-living. the party's anti-corruption office says golf courses are where illegal deals get done, and where officials spend time playing instead of working. >> i know some people not going to china >> ifill: still to come on the newshour: a marathon hearing on benghazi; how a brewery raises

the stakes on employee performance; finding sanctuary on the dangerous journey to the u.s., and much more. >> woodruff: hillary clinton returned to capitol hill today to defend her actions as secretary of state during 2012 attack on a diplomatic outpost in libya. the republican-led select committee on benghazi is investigating the attack on a u.s. consulate which left four americans dead, including ambassador chris stevens. the democratic front runner was front and center during the hearing which was at times contentious and emotional. political director lisa desjardins reports on the contentious hearing. >> reporter: it was a full-blown capitol hill spectacle, with one of the longest lines in recent years, and reporters crushing forward to try to get inside. republican committee chairman trey gowdy began by defending his investigation. >> madam secretary, not a single member of this committee signed

up to investigate you or your e-mail. we signed up to investigate, and therefore honor, the lives of four people that we sent into a dangerous country to represent us, and to do everything we can to prevent it from happening to others. >> reporter: clinton, in turn, started with a slow, deliberate tone. >> as secretary of state, i had the honor to lead and the responsibility to support nearly 70,000 diplomats and development experts across the globe. losing any one of them, as we did in iraq, afghanistan, mexico, haiti and libya, during my tenure was deeply painful for our entire state department and

u.s. aid family and for me personally. i traveled to 112 countries as secretary of state. every time i did, i felt great pride and honor representing the country that i love. >> reporter: soon, though, republican susan brooks of indiana launched what would become a theme: was clinton paying enough attention to benghazi? did she let it happen by negligence? brooks pointed to a small stack of clinton's benghazi e-mails the year of the attack, 2012, and a larger one the year before. >> there are 795 e-mails in this pile. we've counted them. there's 67 e-mails in this pile in 2012. and i'm troubled by what i see here. in this pile in 2011, i see daily updates, sometimes hourly updates from your staff about benghazi and chris stevens. when i look at this pile in

2012, i only see a handful of e-mails to you from your senior staff about benghazi. and let me just share for you in your records that we have reviewed, there is not one e-mail to you or from you in 2012 when an explosive device went off at our compound in april. >> well, congresswoman, i did not conduct most of the business that i did on behalf of our country on email. i conducted it in meetings. i read massive amounts of memos, a great deal of classified information. i made a lot of secure phone calls. i was in and out of the white house all the time. there were a lot of things that happened that i was aware of and that i was reacting to. if you were to be in my office in the state department, i didn't have a computer, i did not do the vast majority of the work on my e-mail.

>> reporter: but another republican, georgia's lynn westmoreland, wasn't satisfied with clinton's defense. >> you knew about these two incidents that have been mentioned previously. it's not a matter if you knew about them, it's a matter of what you did about them. and to us, the answer to that is nothing. >> the experts, who i have the greatest confidence in, and who had been through so many difficult positions, because practically all of them had rotated through afghanistan, pakistan, iraq, yemen, other places, they were the ones making the assessment. no one ever came to me and said, "we should shut down our compound in benghazi." >> i'm not saying-- i'm not saying shut it down. i'm just saying protect it. but still allowed official u.s. statements to claim it was a

spontaneous anti-american mob. >> why didn't you just speak plain to the american people? >> i did state clearly and i said it again in more detail the next morning, as did the president, i'm sorry that it doesn't fit your narrative, congressman. i can only tell you what the facts were. >> reporter: clinton's fellow democrats sounded their own theme arguing she's the victim of a partisan political witchhunt. >> even today's hearing, not a single solitary thing that hasn't already been discussed, repeatedly. so we've learned absolutely nothing. the question is have we found anything substantively that tells us something different about what happened in benghazi? and the answer to that question is no. >> reporter: the partisan tension bubbled over as republicans repeatedly asked about e-mails about libya from longtime clinton friend and previous committee witness, sidney blumenthal. >> the gentleman yield. >> elijah cummings broke in to accuse distorted information.

>> these facts directly contradict the statements you made on national television. the committee aims to finish its investigation by january. for the pbs newshour. lisa desjardins for the pbs newshour. >> woodruff: we take a closer look now at today's hearing with anne gearan, national correspondent with the "washington post," and yochi dreazen, managing editor of "foreign policy" magazine. i spoke with them a short time ago. and anne gearan, yochi dreazen, thank you both for being here. you both have covered this story, this benghazi story for so long. so yochi, listening to today, what is it that this special committee was trying to do? >> genuinely, i think there was some truth to what kevin mccarthy said, the old joke about how a gaffe in washington is when you actually tell the truth. he lost his speakership, arguably, by saying this chit was trying to damage hillary clinton politically.

if you were watching the hearing today, europe not hearing anything new. these questions have been asked again and again. the answers were given again and again. basically what you saw almost from the beginning were democrats and republicans literally yelling at each other. this was not like an august hearing trying to get down to something we didn't know. this was politics pure and simple. >> woodruff: anne gearan, was the committee trying to make the point that hillary clinton was responsible for the decision that left this outpost in libya unprotected, and that led to the death of the ambassador and three others? >> yes, absolutely. the republicans went at it several different ways, but their basic goal in that line of questioning was to try to establish a link between hillary clinton as the secretary of state and decisions that were made in the bureaucracy that either could have contributed or could have ameliorated what happened in benghazi.

and again, as yochi said, this is something that has been explored really ad nauseam before, and her answer was really pretty simple. which is, look, i was the secretary of state. i was not going to be down in the weeds of a lot of these security decisions and i wouldn't presume to tell professionals whose job it is to make those decisions exactly how to do their jobs. and she'd really try to turn the table on republicans in a couple of places, including by pointing out that it's the same diplomatic security agents who protect them when they were overseas on trips and making the point sort of, you know, subtly that, hey, do you want somebody else telling them what to do? >> woodruff: bud of but yochi dreazen dwe learn anything more about how those decision were made and her role in what finally happened? >> i think the most interesting moment by far was when congressman jim gordan in some

detail, you, secretary clinton, told your family in one e-mail, that that was an attack led by al qaeda, and then saying but the talking points coming out of the white house at the time were there was not al qaeda and this was linked to this video. i thought that was the most effective and new moment in the entire line of questioning. and her answer back was not terribly strong. her answer back was we were trying to sort our way through it. but she couldn't quite give a direct answer why he was saying in an e-mail was different from what she was telling the public. >> woodruff: why does it matter she was saying one thing-- she was saying i tried to warn other countries. we didn't want to see this happen anyplace else. >> the republican charges are she ignored security and suband could have done more to make the compound safer and more damaging from her point of view that the white house basically lied. they said the white house knew

one thing, and she was a major part of that cover-up. that's basically what they've been trying to say for three years that she deliberately misstated the cause of the attack and the e-mails were their best attempt today to try to make that point. >> woodruff: anne gearan,un the hillary clinton campaign, they had some worry going into this hearing. what was their strategy? >> well, yes, there was some concern. benghazi remains the largest black mark on her time as secretary of state and her time as secretary of state is one of her main resume points in seeking the 2016 presidential. so for sure, this is a big hurdle they had to get over. her campaign is chiefly concerned that there might be some moment where, you know, who knows? maybe the republicans do have some ace in the hole they could pull out and surprise her with, something that she wouldn't be able to answer. failing that, there's a general

concern that there could be some replay of the kind of emotional display she had the last time she answered questions about benghazi on capitol hill when she famously waved her arms and said, "what difference at this point does it make?" she made the point that she was making back then today a couple of times, but in a much more nuanced way, and that point basically is, that it doesn't matter in terms of what happened in the death of four people whether this was a premeditated terrorist attack or a spontaneous event that grew out of a street protest. and that's the crux of the issue about whether the white house was covering up the true origins of the attack. >> woodruff: so yochi dreazen, what comes out of this? where does this lead? i mean, after she has testified, the committee goes on. what do they do with this information? >> so some of the numbers just on the hearings, it's astounding. this is the 21st hearing on benghazi. byomparison, there were 22 public hearings on 9/11. just to compare the two, 22 on

9/11, 21 on benghazi. the investigations are thought to have cost about $5 million. this has been going on now 17 months. it's not clear to me-- or i think to really any observer-- what is new that could still be found. they've already pulled out that there are things said publicly different from what were said privately, that there were security fairlies. that has all been out for quite some time. there was one moment that i thought was interesting, she said back to them that the response to this shouldn't be that washington decides, democrat or republican, that diplomacy is too dangerous, that it shouldn't be something where america pulls out of dangerous places because of attacks like this. i think that, ultimately, in some ways, is the danger. set aside the politics and if america decides we will not send diplomats into dangerous places, that the the legacy of benghazi. >> woodruff: i want to thank you both, yochi dreazen, and anne gearan, we appreciate it. >> thank you. >> thank you.

>> ifill: for the first time since 2011, an american soldier has been killed in iraq. it happened this morning during a rescue mission at an islamic state prison. according to the pentagon, american and kurdish commandos raided the site in northern iraq, freeing 70 captives, including more than 20 from iraqi security forces. five i.s. fighters were captured and several were killed. reporter michael gordon is in iraq covering this story for the "new york times." i spoke to him a short time ago. >> ifill: so, michael, tell us about what the importance was of this strike. >> well, it was important in a number of-- for a number of reasons. first of all, it was a rescue operation, and a fairly daring one that involved american special operations forces, including delta force and kurdish special operations forces brought to the scene by

american helicopters. so it was a very kind of proactive operation. but, also, it was really the first time that we know of in which american advisers have accompanied iraqi or kurdish forces on to the battlefield. i mean, up until now, they've been advising or training them but only in the confines of training areas and bases. this time they were advising them in a support role, but they were on the battlefield with them as well. >> ifill: who were the 70 hostages? who are they? >> well, we don't know precisely, but it was the-- clearly, the americans and the kurds thought there were some peshmerga fighters there who they were trying to rescue, and they thought there were, perhaps, 20 people there. had they got there there, there were about 70, and they included iraqi sciewrs forces but not peshmerga. they included some local

citizens, who have been incarcerated by the islamic state, and perhaps some people, the islamic state suspected add traders in their ranks. but we don't really know who all of these 69 people are. the kurds are still sorting through them. >> ifill: was this strike designed to and did it achieve significantly degraigd isil at the islamic state forces in that area of northern it iraq? >> well, it was a rescue operation. it was-- they, you know, perhaps 20 or so militants were killed, depending on whose figures you can believe. but the point was the it's aim of the operation was to rescue the people who were being held in a building in hawija, and who were under threat of execution. there have been a number of atrocities there in recent days. here in the "new york times" it bureau, we hay report of a few days ago how 11 young people were hung and strung up on a bridge as retribution to their

parents or associated with iraqi security forces. so this was first and foremost a rescue operation. >> ifill: you mentioned, michael, earlier, that there was significant u.s. involve independent this rescue mission. what does this tell us about the state of the iraqi peshmerga forces involved? >> these kurdish forces are usually pretty capable. these would have been the high-end commando forces. on the one hand it tells you that the americans have enough confidence in them that they would join them in a rescue operation in enemy territory. this was a very islamic state stronghold, so that they would have a certain agree of confidence on them. you know, clearly the kurds are not at the point where they can do these things entirely on their own, but that's really not surprising. i think the raid is really going to perhaps energize the debate

in the united states over the american military role in the middle east. i mean, a lot of critics say that if we're going to make headway against the islamic state and roll them back, we're probably going to have to do more than just have advisers that stay within the confines of military bases. even general dempsey when he was chairman of the joint chiefs said there might come a point when he would recommend that advisers accompany iraqi forces if for example the coalition was going to try to evict the islamic state from mosul. the critics, on the other hand, are going to cite this as an example of mission creep. here you had advisers and one was killed. this is the first american who was killed, died of his wounds, since american forces returned here after 2011. so i think the raid is going to have a lot of significance for the debate in the united states about our role here, and that

may be sort of its larger significance in terms of american policy in the region. >> ifill: it certainly will be a it being debate and not one that's ever flagged. michael gordon for the "new york times" tonight in baghdad, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> woodruff: stay with us. coming up on the newshour: migrants find rest 200 miles from the u.s. border; lessons learned from the housing crisis; and a stray bullet that changed a young girl's life. but first, let's look at an unusual way of running a business-- by having your employees own the company. one popular craft brewery has made a name for itself in part by going that route, with strong results so far. economics correspondent paul solman has the story, part of our weekly series, "making sense," which airs every

thursday on the newshour. >> reporter: new belgium brewing, known for its quirky culture and "fat tire," its "belgian brew." this is its notorious "tour de fat," a beer-financed travel- fest pushing bicycles over cars. at company headquarters in fort collins, colorado, co-founder kim jordan loves to show off the suds themselves. >> should i show you how to do the perfect pour? >> reporter: the perfect pour, yes. i screwed it up already. this is a perfectly horrible pour. but what drew us here was not the beer, though new belgium now sells 4% of all u.s. craft beer, 1% of all the beer in america. new belgium's distinction, however, as a business, is that it is entirely owned by its workers. ex-new yorker doug miller has been at new belgium for 20 years. like most americans, he had no stake in the firms he worked for

in his early days back east. >> it's a job and you're just coming in and you're punching the clock and you're doing your job. here, you just do it more because you're working for yourself. like, i don't work for new belgium, i am working for doug miller. i am working for people who work here, you know that's the difference. >> beer is malt, and hops, and yeast, and water... >> reporter: and why did co- founder and c.e.o. kim jordan sell the company to her workers as opposed to a well-heeled rival or a private financial firm? >> one of things that we think is a big societal issue is this widening gap between the haves and the have not's. and we realized that we had an opportunity to support people owning something that was increasing in value. "shared equity" has been an incredibly powerful engine for us. >> new belgium's a great example

of using this structure to preserve a legacy. >> reporter: worker ownership consultant chris mackin, who's advised new belgium. >> for a company like that to be consumed by a multi-national firm, and to lose its identity, to lose what's special about it in order to make a few extra bucks, that's not what kim jordan was gonna do. >> you'll notice on your glass here, see this lacing? that's actually the sign of a well-made beer. >> reporter: so the founder became a poster child for worker ownership, initiating an esop -- an employee stock ownership plan -- which began giving stock gradually to its workers and ended in a 100% takeover. >> what she's done has made it possible to preserve that independence and to be able to reward the people who made her a wealthy woman. >> reporter: reward them with shares they sell back to the company when they retire. a stock-based pension plan. esops represent both ownership

and retirement savings, which is why congress made them the only pension plans allowed to borrow money for funding. >> we were so excited to brew this beer that we decided to put it on tap today. >> reporter: new belgium, with a host of varieties, is now the eighth largest brewery in america. its fans flow through the building on tours all the day long. >> ok, how do you pour a beer? i'll show you how! and then the taps are yours, ok? >> reporter: the employees seem, well, pretty juiced themselves. >> i feel like i have a stake in what happens here and that i have to play a part in making this, this awesome place successful. >> reporter: tiffany banfield works in the marketing department for new belgium; carrie weady is a graphic designer. >> the better i do, the better we do, and i personally take that to every day of my job and it really does inspire us all to go above and beyond in a way that i haven't experienced at

other employers. >> reporter: why doesn't everybody do it? >> my perception is everybody doesn't do it because they don't believe it is a profitable model. >> reporter: but it is, kim jordan insists. if management puts in the effort and is willing to empower workers in a variety of ways. >> we're more profitable than our industry standards. we have a 3% turnover rate. and more importantly to us, is our feeling of our engagement with our coworkers. >> reporter: a key feature of new belgium's worker engagement: open-book management, teaching every employee how to read the books. >> and so, they had classes for us to go to. like, we're going to teach you, how to read an income statement, how to read a balance sheet, how to understand cash flow, all those things. >> reporter: the upshot? the workers know exactly how the company is doing financially, and how they are doing as well. >> so i am making like the same money now that i was making 20 years ago when i was working in

the bronx in new york city. but i have more money now. it's just because i can manage it better. that's the thing that blows me away, it's that, you can be making $30-50,000 a year and live in a $300,000 house if you manage your money well. are you operating at a profit this month? you know that's what you got to ask yourself. >> reporter: to chris mackin, who's been pushing worker ownership since the 1980s, esops are a no-brainer. the main and obvious obstacle: workers don't have the money to buy their businesses. >> for this idea to go to scale, you have to find some way in which working people who don't have assets can acquire companies that are worth value. >> reporter: so mackin has started an investment fund that will allow worker groups to compete with private equity firms and well-heeled competitors when an owner wants or needs to sell. >> the other beer that we make is called felix and that's the one that we get to taste today. >> reporter: happily for its workers, new belgium didn't need mackin's money.

a bank ponied up much of the cash to buy kim jordan's stock. she financed the rest, by accepting i.o.u.'s from the company, to be paid off from future profits. the risk: that the company will flounder, meaning lower pensions for workers and iffy i.o.u.'s for lenders. which suggests that it might take an unusually committed owner to make worker ownership happen. so why did jordan take the chance? >> one of the things that has been really fun about business is understanding that you can chose what you do with profits. you get this one life, right? and you get to think about, "what am i going to do that makes me, sort of joyful and sing?" and this makes me joyful. >> reporter: fortunately for her, kim jordan's i.o.u.'s look like a pretty safe bet. new belgium is slated to open a new operation in north carolina in 2016, and since it's only in

38 states thus far, the beer may be coming soon, to a state near you. >> and push in now. you are very close to a perfect pour. >> reporter: for the pbs newshour, this is economics correspondent paul solman, long an enthusiast of worker ownership, but only recently of the perfect pour. >> cheers. >> ifill: while the u.s. debate over illegal immigration rages on, for many mexicans, the border dispute represents a humanitarian crisis. on a recent trip to mexico, fred de sam lazaro met a catholic priest who has made it his his mission to protect those who defy laws to make the journey to, and across, the u.s. border. a version of this story aired on the pbs program "religion and ethics newsweekly."

>> reporter: in the city of salteo, thousands of rail cars carries goods made in mexico north to the u.s. they also carry migrants from central america on their 1100-mile journey from mexico's southern border. in it salteo, most will hop off for the final leg of their journey north, trying to avoid detection not just by mexican and u.s. authorities but also criminal gangs. many will attack a brief respite at casa dterks les if migrante, started by a jesuit priest. the migrants may be violating the law, but the priest says his primary responsibility is to be an advocate for people in poverty and in danger. >> ( translated ): every migrant is a potential kidnapping victim, and the criminals extort up to $5,000 in order to set them free. >> reporter: with pressure and aid from the u.s. government,

mexican authorities have been clamping down on central american migration and the number of people making it as far north as the u.s. border has dropped significantly, but they haven't stopped coming. >> reporter: these guys are really tired. they just got here early this morning. >> reporter: the new arrivals are part of a mexican dragnet who deported migrants. unaccompanied children, thousands of whom were reaching the u.s. in 2014, are now intercepted long before they could get this far north. i asked why they keep coming. >> ( translated ): the answer is, as one migrant said to me, "yes, i fear organized crime. i fear want police, but i fear hunger even more. and violence." >> reporter: many of the mostly male migrants say they're fleeing forceable recruitment into criminal gangs that now

dominate urban life in guatemalahonduras, and el salvador, nations with the world's highest homicide rates. >> ( translated ): they have young gang members on every street corner and they know exactly who lives in every house, who goes in and out. >> reporter: this 22-year-old, who wanted his identity concealed to protect family back home, escaped el salvador but not mexican authorities who intercepted him on a train ride with four fellow migrants. the group wasn't arrested but were stripped, forced into a nearby pond, and robbed, he toll me. >> ( translated ): they took all of our money, our phones, shoes, and they threw our clothes in the water. they were laughing at us. >> reporter: they found it refuge in a church and were sent to a shelter. >> ( translated ): we get the details of each person. this allows me to communicate with their families if they get kidnapped, if they die, if they it end up in jail, or get lost on the route.

>> reporter: santosss was being registered on this day. >> from which country? >> honduras. >> and a telephone number we can reach loved ones? >> reporter: he's hoping to return to texas where he worked undocumented for years before a traffic stop led to hit deportation. he said returning to the u.s. is much harder now because gangs are bigger, stronger, and more brutal. >> ( translated ): in the 90s, you could easily cross. now they it own the river. if they catch you, they'll beat you up, even kill you. the only way now is to find a good cyote. >> they were traffickers usually tied to gangs, charge about $4,000, he said. others put price tag much higher. there's no guarantee, he says, and no choice. >> ( translated ): the situation in honduras is that for a 46-year-old, no one will give you a job in my line of work, construction. if you try to start your own

business, no matter how small, the gangs would extort any earnings. >> ( translated ): my life was threatened by the gangs because i couldn't afford to pay the extorsion. >> reporter: 36-year-old marva also fled honduras, leaving behind her small shop and two oiledder children. she brought her three-year-old, emly, on a journey that turned from tiring to terrifying. emily was snatched from her by men posing as goo good samaritas who offered her a ride. >> ( translated ): it was about 3:30 in the morning. it was really dark. that's when they came and took my child. they shoved me to the ground, took the child, and said i had to pay $10,000 to get her back. >> reporter: sensing her anguish, mexican authorities were sympathetic, she said, as were many strangers. in the end, emily was found in the custody of child protection authorities, apparently turned over by her kidnappers.

>> ( translated ): the moment i lifted her up was the happiest moment of my life. to hug her, ton she was alive. emily told me she was very scared, kept saying, "why did you leave me to travel by myself? why did you leave me alone?" now every time i hug her, i tell her she's not it alone. >> reporter: other migrants say the threat of crime aside, the journey is dangerous, getting a foot jammed between train cars, for example. that's what happened to 50-year-old laura. >> ( translated ): i thought i was going to die. and all i kept thinking was let me die in a town so they'll it be able to identify me and take me back to my family. and then i saw a man and shouted for him, and he called the red cross. >> reporter: after three days in the hospital, she was brought to the shelter. she will wait several months for a prostheesis and rehab. after that she plans to continue her journey north. >> ( translated ): i know it will be more difficult but what

else can i do? i have to support a family, not just my daughter, but i have grandchildren. they don't even have a place to live. >> reporter: she can stay here for as long as she needs. there are some 60 shelters along the migrant route in mexico, most run by catholic individuals and groups. only this one has no time limit. >> ( translated ): all people who come here injured or hurt, they do not leave here until they're completely recovered. they have to leave here as persons who are free and with dignity. >> ( translated ): inien sis, chapter 12, god called abraham to be a migrant. in reality, we are all migrants. >> reporter: for the migrants here the shelter helps where it can for the onward journey. it helped marva and emily get visas to legally be in mexico. that will allow them to make a much safer bus journey to texas where they will seek asylum.

that's not an option for santos, who is preparing for the perilous hike to the u.s. border. his main task-- finding a trafficker with both a good track record getting people across, and one willing to take most of the payment once he's safely in the u.s. for the pbs newshour, this is fred de sam lazaro in salteo, mexico. >> ifill: fred's reporting is a partnership with the under-told stories project at st. mary's university of minnesota. >> woodruff: now, some seven years after the housing crisis, a look at what happened, how well did the government fix work, and where are we now. all of that can be found in the newest addition to the newshour bookshelf. jeffrey brown has our conversation. >> brown: in the world of fanny and freddie strange is actually normal, that's freddie

may and fannie mac. and the line about how strange they are comes from a new book titled, "shaky ground," that explores their role during and since the 2008 financial meltdown. author beth 18 mclean joins me now. welcome to you. i think we have to start by reminding these people what these dismiewgz because they play very important roles. >> they're part of the hidden machinery of our world, part of the important stuff of the background that makes up part of our existence, the lives of almost every american but we don't realize it until there's a problem. fannie mae was created in the wake of the great depression. the idea was that if lenders could sell their loans, if banks and other primary lenders could make a mortgage and still to another institution, they'd be more inclined to make that alone. and that would help even out the flow of mortgage credit and thus increase the available of home ownership in this great disparate, diverse nation of

ours. and that happened. >> brown: so the old mystery for many people was what are they? what are they doing? the new mystery you're writing about is why are they still with us after what happened? remind us sort of what happened. >> so in the 2008 financial crisis, the fear was that fan itee and freddie would go bankrupt. the securities they create backed by americans' home mortgages, they're immense. there are over $5 trillion outstanding and they move through the global financial system like water. the fear was if these two company melted down they would take the global financial system with them. so the u.s. government put them in a state known as conservatorship, where they were backed lie a bien of credit from the u.s. treasury and managed effectively by a government agency. and the idea was the silver lining in the financial crisis was we're going to rethink how we finance home ownership. >> brown: a silver lining. >> a silver lining. we're going to come up with a better way to do this. this thing called conservatorship was supposed to

be temporary. >> brown: these things we often refer to as quasi-governmental, but it came to look in reality the private sector had the upside where the public sector, the rest of us, had the risk. >> the big source of controversy about these companies, president obama actually said it in a speech he gave recently, saying these two it companies had to be abolished because it was heads they win, tails taxpayers lose. what he meant by that, in good times executives and shareholderes of these companies would make money, but in bad times, taxpayers would be left holding the bag. and that is sort of how it panned out. >> brown: well, so, as you said, they're in conservatorship. there is an ongoing fight. we cover it here occasionally as somebody bubbles up, ongoing fight over what to do with it. >> what to do. and it's a huge question. it's one that's important to every american's lives. if you have a mortgage, the availability of mortgage credit helps dictate the toarms which you get your mortgage. it's a critical component in home prices which are the major assets most americans have. even if you don't have a

mortgage, these $5 trillion of securities are out there, and they matter for every part of the global financial market. stow it's this critical big issue, and we're not talking about it. the company's in limbo seven years after the financial crisis and nobody seems to know what to do. >> brown: and it involves very big players. this is what you learned digging into it. because the investors are major hedge funds, foreign governments, including china and japan. so there's a lot of consequences for what happens or doesn't happen. >> the consequences are huge to average homebuyers, to investors everywhere. and you have this huge fight indeed, and almost paralysis, because the government doesn't know what to do. the two companies are intensely controversial, and investors who bought the remaining fanny and freddie securities are now agitating for-- to get paid. so you have all these different very powerful people fighting over the outcome of these two companies. >> brown: and if it were to be abolished, if they were to be

abolished, which is possible, there is still that argument about the historic role where you started about allowing affordable housing for so many people. >> right. i don't think they will be abolished, and i've actually come to the point of view that i'm not sure they should be. in the wake of the financial crise, were it not for fanny and freddie, the mortgage market would have completely shut down. you can no longer say that these two companies unnecessary. i think-- i think-- i think that's part of the problem. many people believe that without fanny and freddie the 30-year fixed ready fully prepayable mortgage, which is this fixture of american life-- i think over 80% of the people who got a mortgage in the last six months took out this kind of mortgage-- without fanny or freddie this kind of government backstop this kind of mortgage would not exist. would be a radically different housing market. are we prepared for that? i don't know. >> brown: you have written about enron. you looked at the financial crisis. when you looked at these two institutions even as somebody used to looking at this kind of thing, were there surprises?

>> i think it's incredibly surprising. i think it's really weird that you have this most domestic of assets possible, a home, financed by foreign central banks. a home in kansas financed by china. we just don't think about it. the fact that since the financial crise the hue and cry has been more capital. give banks more capital and the financial system will be safer. fanny and freddie with their more than $5 trillion outstand regular running on most no capital. if interest rates go up, if they suffer a loss, taxpayers will have to foot it the bill again. >> brown: that risk is still there. >> that risk is still there, and it's a total example of government dysfunction that we've had seven years to figure out this problem and we've done nothing. >> brown: briefly, do you expect some resolution? you're laughing as i say it. >> i'm laughing as you say it. there is a big fight over this notion should we have the government in the housing market or not? should we just get the government out and let private capital-- if you consider big

banks to be private capital-- finance the housing market? what would the mortgage market look like without that? and how do we-- how do we move forward? spht investors, the big hedge funds who have taken stakes in fanny and freddie have points of view on this, too, and are big players in the debate. >> brown: "shaky ground, the strange saga of u.s. mortgage giants." thank you. >> ifill: violence in urban areas is nothing new, but one does not have to be targeted to become the victim of gun violence. two years ago, 11 year old tayloni mazyck was shot and paralyzed by a stray bullet near her home in brooklyn, new york. filmmaker shiho fukada followed tayloni's recovery, focusing on how her devoted mother, a single parent, coped with the tragedy. the result was a new york times film, "stray bullet."

>> when she had dreams about her being shot, or when she hears loud noises, she gets panic attacks. i've run up in there and her heart be racing. she was like, "i can't deal with this. i can't do this. i can't do this." she said, "i should have ducked down and lay on the floor." she keeps saying what she should have did, what she should have did, what she should have done. >> he's 17 years old. his life is over. just like my life is over, her life is. his life is over, too.

>> i can't hold all that. because i got enough going on. so i have to be able to function and do what i got to do for her, and by me holding that resentment is going to stop me from moving forward. >> have to wash my hair. >> have to wash that, too. and i get a little depressed because it's like i don't even have a life. she my daughter, my husband, and everything all in one. i have to do it everything, mostly everything is on me. don't, don't move. and that puts a lot on me because tayloni does not let me breathe. you complain about everything. >> because it hurts. what else do you want me to say? >> how can washing your face hurt? >> you was washing my neck and that hurts. >> okay, all right. tayloni gets very frustrated

because he can't just get up and do it herself. >> mommy, hurry up. >> everything is, "mommy, mommy, mommy." sometimes i hear her calling me in my sleep and she don't be calling me. >> what do we want? >> justice! >> what do we want? >> justice! >> when do we want it? >> now! >> we rallied against violence in our community. we have this morning two young people that this organization stood with, and we're glad that they are here to be with us. tayloni, who was shot in brooklyn, and paralyzed. tayloni, she's here today. ( applause ) you made it through! here's our gun violence for you. ♪ amen, amen

amen, amen. ♪ amen, amen, amen >> jerry, why are you in my room? >> you better stop because one day it might be him doing this? >> no. >> you never know. >> i'll be walking by that time. >> you believe you can walk, ask god to help you walk again, and you're going to walk again. that's it. because nobody else can tell you different. >> jerry, i'm going to walk. when i walk, that means i'm going to run so i can catch you. >> i'm just glad she's still here. that's all i got to say.

she said she wants to be a doctor or a lawyer. i want her to be the best that she can be. that's what she has to do. >> ifill: you can watch more "new york times" documentary on their web site, nytimes.com. >> woodruff: a news update before we go: republican congressman paul ryan of wisconsin has formally declared his candidacy for the speaker of the house of representatives. in a letter to colleagues, he said, "now we have an opportunity to turn the page, to start with a clean slate." the vote will take place next week. >> ifill: and that's the newshour for tonight. i'm gwen ifill.

>> woodruff: and i'm judy woodruff. join us online, and again here tomorrow evening with mark shields and david brooks. for all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and good night. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: ♪ ♪ moving our economy for 160 years. bnsf, the engine that connects us. >> the lemelson foundation. committed to improving lives through invention. in the u.s. and developing countries.

on the web at lemelson.org. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

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