tv The Dylan Ratigan Show MSNBC August 10, 2011 1:00pm-2:00pm PDT
breaking news this hour. triple threat. good afternoon, i'm matt miller in for dylan ratigan. he's hard at work on his book, but he'll join us this hour on the epic rant that's dominating the blogosphere. first the dow drops triple digits, down more than 500 points amid new fears of european debt. the massive volatility has driven gold to a new record high, $1800 an ounce. by trple threat we're talking about taxes, trade and banks. we need to reform all three to get our company back on track. we start with clyde, founder and president of the washington think tank, the economic strategy institute. clyde also served as a senior trade official in the reagan administration and author of "the betrayal of american prosperity." clyde, welcome. good to see you.
>> good to be with you. how are you? >> i'm good. the markets have just closed, another terrific sell-off. a lot of phones worried, the dow off something like between 17%, 18%, and the last 10 or 12 trading sessions. what's going on? the world, as we knew it, is changing. i'm surprised at the shock of this. the u.s. economy has consistently run large trade deficits. the fundamental theory underlying the global economy was that the united states would always be the consumer of last resort, that deficits didn't matter, that in europe the bonds of spain or greece were as good as the bonds of germany. all those assumptions are being shown to have been false. and we're going to get a huge
rebalancing and readjustment of the global economy, which in the long run is necessary, painful in the short run. >> do you think this stock market volatility will keep up for some indefinite period? what do you make of what european officials are trying to do to stabilize their own debt situation. >> i think in the case of europe, it's been a situation of too little too late for the last two years. the real questioned for europe is do the europeans want to be european, which if they have a single currency, they'll have to have a single bond, they'll have to have a single finance ministry and actually have an integrated financial and political system. that's a question mark. the germans are reluctant to go there. the euro is in trouble and maybe
the european union -- similar to here in the united states, we have been overconsuming for a long time. we increasingly don't make tradeable goods and services, and we've been running these big trade difficult sets. a lot of things are telling us that game is pretty much over too, which means we'll have to consume less, begin to export more, import less, big adjustments. >> so, clyde, i've been sounding the alarm on a lot of the competitiveness concerns for years. what's your short list of the agenda that you think we readily need and what washington needs to do to get off the stick to try to turn this stuff around that's producing so much anxiety. >> i actually met with president obama about a year ago first on my agenda was jobs.
and i said it would be difficult to do more stimulus, and we've seen after a while the stimulus is not very effective. but there's one play to go to get jobs, and that's our trade deficit. we have a trade deficit of about $700 billion a year, equating to something like 5 or 6 million jobs. what it means is we need the president and the congress, we need to have a series of policies we need to deal with the undervaluation of the chinese currency, the chinese yuan. we need to match the incentives that countries like singapore or israel or ireland are offering to entice producers in the u.s. to move their factories abroad. we need to change the tax system in the u.s. so we are competitive and the global economy with corporate taxes. we need a value-added tax, which
is rebated on exports. those are some of the top things on my agenda, but i think the main thing is america has to start making stuff. what was that old saying, you know, we have to find a way or make it? we need to get back to being a producing nation. >> clyde plestowich, thanks very much for sharing those thoughts today. >> great to be with us. >> democratic congressman brad sherman of california serves on the financial services and foreign relations committees. welcome, congressman. >> good to be with us, matt. >> you had a baby daughter the other day, lucy. so congratulations. i wanted to congratulate you on the good news amid the market turmoil. >> she was a very happy baby until i told her her share of the national debt was $47,000.
she's been crying ever since. >> that's a perfect segue. what do you make about the buzz. with the different -- also the question with whether with all this kind of turmoil and markets, whether congress should be called back, instead of taking a vacation? what's your take? >> i doubt we would pass a jobs agenda if we were back here, but the country is in trouble, and i think we should shorten this period, get people back. the super committee worries me, because the republicans have appointed es whereas senator reid appointed max back us, a fine senator, but who voted for the bush tax cuts and might be willing to go along with the six
republicans. so one party is not ready to compromise, and the other party is appointing at least one xrmer so far to this committee. >> i actually wrote in my "the washington post" column today, that in my view, the super committee is doomed for the reasons you mentioned. if you look at this from the republican point of view, they basically have obama where they want him now, full ownership of a lousy economy. it seems that mitch mcconned annual the republicans -- all they'll want is some kind of medicare reform, and it takes medicare off the table for the 12012 election, and a continued pledge to not include taxes. with those things being their nonnegotiables, isn't it clear there will be no deal, this thing will stagnate? >> i'm not sure they can reach a deal that at least one democrat will go for, that's why i'm concerned there's six absolutely solid no deal, our way or the
highway, and one of those democrats might very well go along with some sort of deal with the republicans, even if the president and mainstream democrats were a little less win to make that compromise. so i think the one possibility is this committee deadlox, although possible is they come up with a deal that's not good for democrats and more importantly not good for working families. >> who would you like to see as the house appointees to this committee? do you have a short list? are you looking to get it on in yourself? >> i'm not looking to get on it myself, but i think nancy pelosi will appoint three outstanding people. i think if the republicans had appointed one or two of their apostates or compromisers, then pelosi could do the same, but in a circumstance like this, six out of six hard-line, no tax revenue no matter what happens, signers of the pledge, democrats
d.i going to be very hard for pelosi to appoint a blue-dog democrat as one of the three on the committee. let's talk about the anger that's out there, both at congress and at president obama. you have a poll out from cnn orc showing that 49% of americans would not reelect their representative in washington. one woman even rented a plane to fly a banner over s&p saying that congress should be fired. everybody field like obama has caved, and isn't standing up for progressive values. is this anger justified? >> well, the anger is justified, because the results are bad. clyde was right when he said we've got to addressing the
deficit, and the main streams are with weight on what our trade policy ought to be. as long as we don't make things in the united states, as long as there's so much money and power for those who want to make it cheap abroad and sell it in the u.s., we'll have huge economic problems. as as far as congress, people have a right to be angry. only 82% disapproved of congress, which means the other 18% aren't paying attention. >> well, congressman brad sherman, thank you for an honest, candid and reflective assessment of the situation. i'm glad to be in burbank broadcasting from your own district, sir, a bit of harmonic convergence there. thanks for taking the time. >> if you're in the san fernando
valley, this would be one of the best shows of the year. still hailed, the rant heard around the world. >> we're sitting here arguing about whether we should do the $4 trillion plan that kicks the can down the road for the president, or burn the place to the ground, both of which are reckless, irrelevant and stupid. >> i know you're thinking what brand of coffee does dylan drink? dylan is joining us on the hot line this hour to discuss the incredible response and how to turn that energy into real solutions for american prosperity. but first britain burning. why are these young people so mad? plus speaking of mad, do you ever get the feeling that nothing works anymore? forget washington or wall street. evening the simpling task seem more -- we turn to a tech comedian. woman: day care can be expensive.
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wisconsin democrats failed to take control last night in the recall elections. democrats ousted only two of the six republicans that backed scott walker's laws. it was expected to be a referendum on the republican governor, with $30 million spent. what does all of it say about 2012? let's ask our megapanel. msnbc contributor jonathan ca
capehart, and imogeg, and kristin -- sorry to be the disembodied voice instead of with you in new york today. jonathan, this is like the jop than capehart channel. >> msnbc capehart. >> you roll from show to show, doing a great job for martin bashir today. >> thank you. >> what do you make of this? a lot of energy on the democratic side. the democrats feeling like they fell short, but you could say the glass was half full, because they did mobilize and got some recall wins. >> i think what this shows is part of what we're talking about a country which is sharply idea logically divided.
wisconsin is a state that really reflects that. you have strong, ardently felt activi activism, but very ardently felt expression of the opposite view. i think this vote really shows that the stay is divided in the same way that the country is divided. >> imogen, what do you make of this? you have an international perspective. what does this suggest to you? >> i can't help partisanship was set aside? new york to bring about same-sex marriage. that's how the american political system works. you have to have compromise across the board to get things through. that's not happening in
wisconsin. you do hope that states will go the new york/new jersey way. >> one of the things that suggests is andrew quoema actually took on some of the health care and pensions that have been so at odds. that suggests it's not quite as partisan as it sounds. >> it's the old adage, all politics are normal. they can read the latest deal that -- and it's wildly more generous than the private sector who's maybe pulling down and has to work until they're 65, so i think governor cuomo is working in an environment that's
conducive to him striking a deal with the legislature to slash spending. >> if we segue from a fight to a town like london, continued rioting, calling short his vacation, and a real concern about whether they're going to use water cannons now, this is a country where the bobbies tend to not to carry pistols and these riots have not been seen in many, many years. >> i toot on the road leading up to buckingham among a million people, and it was all very peaceful. what is happening here is shocking. it's down to me to three reasons.
first the police messed up on saturday. they didn't take control, and it went wrong. there was luting and so forth, but most importantly there is social and and we're seeing this here in the u.s. as well. let's not forget that it's one in 7 americans, which is the highest, yet the number of millionaires were up by 8%, so i see a mirror image, and we need to get to grips with the social and economic inequality happening on both sides of the atlantic. >> i see a debate emerging already. the conservative side making the argument this is just hooliganism and criminality, folks taking advantage of opportunities to, you know, to loot stores and get cell phones and flat-screen tvs, but then the others making her point, this is the inevitable result of
the kind of rad equal inequality we're seeing develop. which is it? >> i'm on the radical inequality side, but i think it's more than that. i think this is the result of directly the result of the really radical austerity program that the cameron government is imposing. the people who are out there on the streets are responding to the fact that the government is shrinking and not shrinking for everybody. it's shrinking for the poor. having said that, though, i think the response we're already getting from cameron is to push even harder. this will be framed as, you know, cameron saying these are hool gans, these are the bad guys, and i am the man who's going to stand up for middle-class england. not to anticipate too much sort of the rest of our discussion, but i think what we're seeing in bring, which i think we'll see
in the united states, is times of high unemployment that last for a long time create a politics which is not about compromise, which is not about the nation coming together. they create a politics, which is very mean and very nasty, and i think we're going to see that more and more in all of the western developed world. >> jonathan, it's hard not to have a kind of class edge to this, especially in the uk, when you have the prime minister an eaton graduate coming back from his villa in tuscany to try to manage the crisis. the class edge, it's even a question of whether that can happen in thes united states. how do you filter in the class angle to the points that chrystia is making. >> whether that sort of thing could happen here in the united states where the -- inequality
gap is not just great, it's vast, i think as americans, and, you know, folks in washington and state capitals around the country come to grips that the spending and the things they used to do in the past will have to come to an end. i've been saying for a while that the protests we saw in greece, that we saw in londsen that we've seen all over europe, they're destined to come here, because really tough decisions are going to have to be made that will change the economic structure of this country. and there will be pain that has to be shared. so i'm very cureual to see how the american people react. will they riot in the streets the way that's happening in london? i'm not sure. i hope not, but we have to be mindful that that could be a possibility. >> all right. we're going to be exploring that issue tomorrow on "the dylan ratigan show." can. coming up, what you can do right now to change the course of our country. my doctor told me calcium
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my next guest is a man who understands the current economic crisis and says the most profound effects are yet to come. unemployment, crushing, more divorce, generations of kids graduating into a horrendous job market. joining us is don peck, author of "pinched, how the great recession has narrowed or futures and what we can do about it." welcome, don. >> thank you. >> congratulations on the book. you're looking at it from the long term, not just the immediate market turmoil what has your research shown about the long-run impact? >> we tend to think of recessions as temporary phenomena, housing values go
down, they go back up again, but for it lairly deep long downturns, they are not temporary. they change society permanently. already this recession has changed the places we live, the work we do, in some cases, especially for the unemployed, even who we are. those changes with far outlast this recession itself. >> so before i get chrystia freelened in, what is it to worry about? earnings will be forever lower? is it the fact there's a whole new culture and psychology that may set in? >> i think there are two things worth worrying about. one is the average duration of unemployment is nine months. there are millions of people who have been out of work for a year, two years, more. those people will have an extremely hard time finding their way back into the work force, and so i think there's a real risk that they won't do that, and the economy somewhat
shrunken will simply move on without them. the second risk, though, is i think to young people. when i started my reporting for this book, i fully respected young people would bear the lightest scars. they don't have many responsibilities, they're in and out of the work force anyway, but what we know is just the opposite. academic research shows how you start your career is to a large extent how you finish. people who start out behind never catch up. it's not just an economic issue, though, the character of generation can change significantly in periods like this. we saw that certainly in the depression, where people who struggled, you know, really had a sense of fatalism that they retained throughout their lives. i worry that the longer this period goes on, the more you're going to see the millennial generation shaped in really unfortunate ways. >> chrystia has a question. >> first of all, thank you for writing this book.
i found it very depressing, but very important. i have two questions for you. the first is, if unemployment is such a generational, historic blight, why isn't it at the center of the dao el bait in the united states? and is it already too late to do anything about it? a deal has been done on spending. i mean, are there any bullets left? >> those are great questions. you know, it should be at the center of our politics right now. i think one reason it isn't is that this recession has affected different people in very different ways. what we have seen is for people with professional degrees, for people with good educational backgrounds, for the top of society, the meritocrattic el e elite, it hasn't been so bad. so i think there's a tendency among the most influential people, including those in washington, not to see and not
to worry about the struggles that many everyday americans are experiencing right now. and it's not too late to change this, but the path of government action recently has been extremely worrying, and the turn from stimulus and support to austerity in the most pronounced fashion with the debt ceiling deal is extremely worrying. it's going to take at least a couple more years for consumers to pay down their debts. it's appropriate and necessary in fact for the government to step in in the meantime, expand fiscal policy, provide jobs and money for the economy and it's extremely worrying that's not happening right snow. >> jonathan. >> generations this country will be pinched. it sounds as though it's going to be -- there's going to be a passive reaction. do you see not any kind of passive reaction, but an
aggressive reaction to the situation and circumstances people find themselves in, and to the policies and decisions that will have to be made that might make that pinch hurt a lot more. >> it's interesting. when you look at prior pertains, the 1970s, the dizzy pression, the 1890s, what you see is american society is quite resilient, and people can withstand economy blows for two, three, four years. when periods like this stretch much beyochbd that, politics become meaner, frustrations build, antiimmigrant sentiments rise, support for the, life becomes meaner and more contentious, so i think you'll see rising frustration and more contentious politics and even more contentious daily life in the u.s. if we don't get out of this period soon. the problem is even as that
happening, the ability to undersay large actions tends to diminish because politics become meaner. so i fear that we could get into kind of a political trap where the worse things get, the harder it is to do the things we need to to do to get out of the this situation. >> imogen, i want to get her in. if you have young people being the most screwed, and you've got young people who will bear the brunt of the fiscal adjustment, because the super committee or whoever finally comes together to get our fiscal house in order, all grandfathers and grandmothers, the spending cuts and tax increases on the kids, i think that's a pretty turbulent recipe for youth. speaking of youth. imogen, you have a question. >> very kind. do we have to change and manage our expectations in the west in a big way? a big constituent about the
chinese, they save 28% of their income, americans in the west, we save about 5% of our income. do we have to wake up and actually move, change our expectations? >> absolutely, imogen. much of the last decade was a process of denial. the housing bubble masked a lot of problems. americans were routinely outspending their incomes, partly because people's paychecks weren't grows. and americans i think do have to recognize that certainly we have to live within our means, and that the next few years or more might not be high growth years. in my reporting around the country, i have seen evidence of that shift. i think people are moving more towards an attitude of thrift and away from materialism. that happened in depression, too. honestly if this period leaves us with that sentiment, that would be a good thing at least.
>> all right. don peck, the book is "pinched, a sober assessment of the impact of this recession" with messages at the end about how the country will pull through, hopefully. congratulations on the book and for sharing your thoughts, and thanks alleges to our megapanel. terrific insights as always. we'll talk to you again soon. >> thanks, matt. up next, the rousing wake-up call to congress. we don't know who in washington was listening, but a whole lot of other people in the country western. >> democrats aren't doing it, republicans are not doing it, an entire integrated financial system --. i love that my daughter's part fish.
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that impromptu rant on yesterday's show still has people buzzing 24 hours later. dylan himself is taking a few minutes out from writing his book to join us on the hotline. welcome to "the dylan ratigan show." >> a very -- i'm more nervous as a phoner than i am to host it. >> dylan this has touched a nerve. what did you mean by the extraction, that people ought to be upset about. say a little more about that to keep the information flowing. >> what i was trying to communicate was my sense that everybody, whether you're a conservative, liberal, whether you're a democrat, a republican or an independent or martian worshipper, you are aware that the american tax code is bought. those who fund or politicians get beneficial tax treatment, whether it's corn, whether it's
health insurance or the oil companies or loopholes for wealthy versus those who work. regardless of what you think the tax code should be, everybody knows it's a bought code. everybody knows that the trade agreement with china is extracting money from us. we get a report every month, half of our trade deficit every month is a result of the fact that china taxes then, but do we tax them? everybody knows that. everybody knows that the banking system is not structured to take the trillions we good i have it and lend or facilitate an investing market that's investing in america. that's costing tens of trillions. we're truly harvesting our own wealth for the benefit of a few interests in trade banking and the tax codes, and i they for me i guess i just boiled over a bit. >> well, it clearly struck a nerve even more so when you see the market turmoil like the last couple days, when it seems like
the jig may be up, in ways that you have been talking about for some time. now that people seem to be energized, looking for, what can i do? what actions can i take? what would you tell people that they ought to be doing now that they can do to make turn the thing around. >> the stunning thing for me is the overwhelming nature of the response, not just people who share the emotion that i'm feeling, but also people who have amazing ideas to what can be done. so i was thinking about that, and thinking about the energy and anger and frustration, and how valuable and dangerous that energy is, matt. it's an intense thing when people are this frustrated. i think the most valuable thing for everybody to do, and we wrote something about this today. that goes like this. if you understand how the tax code and the banks system and
the trade systems senior misaligned, are unfair, explain it to everything that you know. help them better understand this. anybody can understand this if those who understand it take the time to help those who don't understand it. that's the first thing. you have to ed kay yourself before you use the energy. you don't want to use it wrong. the second thing is if you don't know what's going on and how that can be used to either drive money into any nation, not just others, every nation, ask for help. ask something, i don't understand this tax, trade and banking thing, and if we simply start on the process of beginning ourselves to learn more about how that affects the giant flows that we're dealing with right now, i think we'll be in a much better position as the months unfold. as you pointed out, matt, this is not going away, to make better informed, more wise it decisions as this goes. and then the last thing, if you
want to do something right now, is there's three trade agreements, one with panama, one with south korea that promotes paying slaves in north korea that then refunds the north korean government, and one with colombia that does business with the country that leads the world in assassinating union organizers on a level that makes their per capita number look insane. if you want to do something about that, trade is the most thing to do, and call congress 202-224-3141, and give them your zip code and tell them what you think. but focus on learning how our policy is affecting -- basically causing money to leave our nation for the benefit of a few people. we need to figure out a way to engage it. >> dylan, i know you're working hard for your book "greedy bastards" which would further that cause of deepening of
public understanding of all these issues in a way you've been so passionate and eloquent about. let us let you go back to work. thanks for dropping by your own show. >> one thing before i go, matt, a lot of people have been trying to reach out. if you want to get in touch with me, the best way to do it is we created an e-mail inbox that's mad firstname.lastname@example.org. if you want to engage on this conversation. >> be well, dylan, and proud to keep your chair warm for days. >> you're doing great, matt. i'm grateful for your partnership in carrying the torch. >> we'll be talking to you soon. >> take care. what your cable box can tell you about the state of america.
aw! >> so sad it's funny. never mind that washington is broken, and no one has jobs. we can't even accomplish everyday tasks anymore. it's the little things in like that can turn the knife. or the six-hour window you wait through to get the cable ghoul to your house, and when you try to get away, the vacation starts with a five-hour excursion on the runway. joining me on the lighter side is comedian dan ninen. what is it. i know you've got a bunch of things you're frustrated by. >> it's unbelievable. i travel about 150,000 miles a year, and i do this times ten. technology helps, but it can also be a hindrance. >> when i'm on the tarmac, they're padding the flight times.
i live in l.a., l.a. to san francisco flight is about an hour, right? >> right. >> when you look at the flight times, it's like two hours, two and a quarter, because they're trying to show they're on time. they're padding it. that's just one symptom. what is it that angers the most? >> just as the commercial said it's calling, if you're calling, press 1, or calling about that, press 2. what's even worse, they call and ask you for your account number, you type it in, and then they ask you for it again. it's like but i already typed it again, well, it didn't show up on my screen. well, why not? it's unbelievable. >> i hear you have an innovative cure. >> you can always try to push zero, but the companies have gotten wise to that there's a site online which is caused gethuman.com and it shows you what button, press pound 3, then
0, and then how to get right to a human. it's awesome. >> one of my other pet peeves, the whole decline of service. it seems like every hotel trying to shunt you into the worst room, and you've got to complain so you're not in the smoking room by the elevator. the same with insurance companies, with the claim and wait for you to complain some more. how do we get out of that? >> it's a case of where the squeakie wheel gets the grease. the key is to complain. but i think you can do better for yourself if you're very, very nice. just no matter how frustrated you are and angry inside, see, because these people deal with people swearing at them and cursing and screaming. if you are that one exception that is really, really nice, no matter how frustrated, you will be surprised at what you can get if you're really, really nice all the time to these people. >> does that work even if the impersonal bureaucracies that seem to dominate? the mom and pop shop even used
to offer service. it seems like now in every walk of life you're dealing with technology, and it's hard to find a real human that can be helpful. >> now it's the monolithic byzantine bureaucracy, and you have workers who don't have a skin in the game. in the old days you would have a propry tore willing to hold the place open for five extra minutes at the end. here's the key. since you're dealing with these large corporations, what i do is if i have a problem that's unsolvable, i will call the ceo, i'll find the corporate headquarters and call -- you'll never actually get to tack to him or her are but the assistant will put you to a vice president of customer service, so i believe from going from the top down instead of the bottom up. always ask for a supervisor, manager and if that doesn't work, ask for the ceo. >> dan, thank you very much.
a comedian who gets to the ceo to solve his problems. >> thank you very much. coming up on "hardball," leadership moment, chris breaking down the simple step that the president needs to take. but first ari has a message for congress -- grow up. yes! ha! [ clicking ] ♪ what happened? power went out, want a hot dog? [ female announcer ] oscar mayer selects are made with 100% beef and have no artificial preservatives.
on recess. republicans are holding symbolic sessions in order to prevent recess.. since obama came into office, republicans have blocked an unprecedented number of nominees from ever getting a vote. republicans have blocked almost half of the nominees for judicial nominations, the worst obstruction rate in u.s. history. the targets aren't random, either. they've hindered female and minority from the most. here's a statistic -- every district court nominee from the senate judiciary committee republicans has been a woman or a person of color. you know, people forget that supreme court justice alona kagan was first nominated by president clinton, but republicans wouldn't allow her a vote on that nomination. then when president obama nominated her to be the third woman to ever serve on the high court. the same rpgs complained she
didn't have the experience as a judge. meanwhile, nominees for jobs shaping economic policies have been totally shut down. he nominated pedder diamond to the federal reserve board over a year ago. republicans filibustered, renominated two times, and he ultimately withdrew in disgust. the top stout pell consumers bureau remains empty. and the med of industry and security at the commerce department. both of those posts were finally filled through recess appointments last year, but it's only gotten worse. this week white house officials said they need tim geithner to extend his term, in part because republicans would filibuster a vote on his replacement. you don't try to shut down one of the most important jobs on the president's economic 25e78. the solution is pretty simple -- senator reid and president obama should call the senate back in
session now in this hot august summer. they should refuse to adjourn until there are votes on all these gnomes. they can use quorum calls, break the silent filibuster, and they can keep every member working seven days a week and refuse to adjourn unless it's for a real old-school recess, when recess appointments are on the table. just imagine the president speaking to the nation about making government work again instead of pleading for compromise with his tormenters, imagine him seizing the initiative, and imagine making a case for an american government based on the people who want to serve or government, run our schools, protect our borders and put our people back to work. it says a lot about our congress that they found a way to hinder government and recovery while even on vacation. let's bring these guys back to washington. >> ari, great point. what it does is echo the fact for those who say there's a