tv NOW With Alex Wagner MSNBC January 23, 2012 9:00am-10:00am PST
the republican party and jimmy williams. ain't no sunshine in the florida primary the race is getting nastier than ever. i ask is you my dear panel how long will this go on? >> forever i hope. wouldn't that be great for the democrats. i think the wisdom a month ago was that mitt romney would walk away with this, welcome to south carolina, governor romney. that is not how it works. he lost iowa, and what happens in florida, it's a very, very different state than all three that have occurred. he has a heck of a race ahead of him. he has just bought air time, and newt gingrich is raising money like a good candidate. >> i had a different word, i did the not want to use it. >> were you surprised with the result on saturday? >> not at all. not at all.
i have to tell you that people are angry. they are angry not just in south carolina but across the united states and i know it's a big play of yours at the end of the day, this is what i think, it's a long race, i agree, jimmy. but more than that, these candidates will be probably vetted and the candidate will prove to be the next president of the united states. >> boom goes the south carolina dynamite. the anger thing is interesting. and we have a lot to sort of unpack on that issue. i want to play a little bit of sound from mitt romney responding to this contention that newt gingrich is the angry candidate. this is from this yesterday. >> something mike huckabee said, he said i'm a conservative and i'm not angry with anybody about it. i think we are not angry. but we want somebody that can lead our country and our party. >> that was from last night with nbc's peter alexander, didn't he
prove that it is anger? >> i think it's about fear and anger. people of the united states are suffering and people understand his message and getting aboard. i don't think that it necessarily the anger at one another. it's more about a bad economy and people saying we can do better. >> i agree with that and to make a nonpolitical point. you have to be not be paying much attention to the political news over the past several years to think there was not a lot of anger driving the energy and the ideas in american politics. there was the tea party, and occupy wall street. they come from different places but it's made up of anger and the media piece is not the
traditional right wing idea. the media stands in as a polished relatively set of elites and newt has seized on that. i would have expected romney to say, we are all angry and this is what we are going to do about it, i'm the solution candidate and the reasonable person channelling the anger. but he said something that is totally off base which is we are not an angry party. have you seen the party? >> there is nobody more establishment than newt gingrich and he was a rebel in '88 and he h has been up ending things. he is selling a bill of goods about who he is. >> and i think the "new york times" as they are want to do, had an interesting point of view, shall we say on their editorial page when they talk
about gingrich's hypocrisy. the insider whose personal wealth and political experience are creations of washington become the anti-establishment candidate. >> i don't know about that. >> i think that is hogwash, this is about being authentic. when he speaks he speaks as though it's true. he believes it. he is passionate. whether you agree or disagree. that is what people want to see. >> what does being authentic mean? >> newt gingrich is a irresponsible person that deceives on a variety of issues. it's well documented but where i agree with you is we are not talking about a cross section of the american public. we are talking about people who run for president. it's like saying this boxer is aggressive. all boxers are aggressive.
out of the people running, he is the movement conservative. out of the people running he is the bigger person that is not consistent and not honest. i have problems with him. as compared to mitt romney or santorum or huntsman, he is a figure of republican politics and blowing up the building which is why he got run out of his speakership. >> he is only blowing up mitt romney's campaign. >> this is what i say for the record. i want to be the defender of no republican or , but i think tha the american people want change. whoever has the best message that people understand and believe that will be the nominee. what we have seen with our earned media, specifically the debates the person that out performed everyone is the speaker. what happens in florida, jimmy, we will see. we will wage but we will see.
>> you said that the american people won't change, i would say that the american people continue to want change and if that's the case, i think the country is upset and angry and they continue to be all of these things. they were in 2008, don't forget. knowing that, the republicans will probably put up mitt romney who has nothing in common with the average sufferer in this country and if he got angry he might be winning this nomination. but he is not. so you'll put up the guy that looks perfect and perfect blah blah blah against the guy that was supposed to bring the change? that is a heck of a choice for people. >> i think the president spoke about hope and change but he really lacked a defined -- a defined agenda. what the speaker does really well because he is very educated when it comes to history, is he can --
>> he is a historian >> no, no, no, he has a pph.d. - >> these are positive kind of glowing gingrich vibes coming from the table right now and i think, i don't usuallily quote tweets but glenn, david gregory made this point yesterday and said, tonight's romney loss parallels did -- on last year's budget, gop's establishment blesses party based revolts every single time. this is being borne out on the national stage this is a party that is having an identity
crisis, is it not? >> no, we will have a well honed candidate that will be able to go toe to toe with the president. >> newt gingrich is not being skr criticized on his record or saying that he did not want people in his private life but he was going into people's private life. he is now saying that business people are the problem, his record and statements are not being called into account because of the point i made earlier. >> and i would say that there's one person that will be examining gingrich's record and that is mitt romney. we are seeing new attacks out from the romney campaign, we will talk about that and much more after the break.
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at the end of four years, it was proven that he was a failed leader, and he had to resign in disgrace. >> he has embarrassed the party. he was run out of the speakership. >> he went fromm pillar to post in a way that is irradic >> the new message, no holds barred from the romney camp. meow. that was actually my addition. we were talking about whether mitt romney can get angry enough to compete with newt gingrich.
some pollster said use the word eradict, shame. does it work, jimmy? >> sure. it makes, listen, romney has a i'm not real problem. i blogged this the on your website -- >> "now" with alex dot something he is. >> i read that he is a ken doll, he is perfect and his wife is perfect and his kids are perfect. he led the most perfect life of all time, it's astonishing how perfect he is. we cannot relate to that. i want to see him angry and go after rick santorum and gingrich and the president. >> is this something that you buy angry attacks from someone like him the does it work with the messager is mitt romney. chris christie makes a more
forceful argument for mitt romney's time at bain than he z >> something has to go wrong in your life -- >> you can argue -- >> you can argue this is the worst thing that has happened to this man, and it not that bad. newt has been kicked around and kicked out and been through the ringer. they say you have to be sad to be a comedian. r romney has to be angry that his campaign is crumbling and we want to see that if we will see him go toe to toe with obama. >> the frustration in the romney camp must be palpable. we know the news debate, nbc, debate, brian williams is tonight. i expect you'll see arrows co coming from the romney side.
>> i have a great deal of respect for someone to be able to amass the amount of money he has to run a campaign. some people do not have a countanence for it. i would not attempt to go down that path, if question is, if he goes down the path, will he be successful, and i think he will? >> you think romney will? >> i think that he has to go down the path. it's a consensus, you have to talk about disgrace and shame and all those tough words and then you have to could it in such a way that you can bring everything back at the end of the shoot and build a coalition. >> can you, you are telling romney to be somebody he is not. how many times can everyone say do this, and he still doesn't do it. >> and then there's the issue of getting angry and getting into gingrich's report. >> you cannot go personal, this is my take away. americans have a line in the
sand, if you cross the line, we rebuke a rebuke it and go in the other direction. >> romney needs to go after him and do it on the stump. >> a perfect a sag way, let's look at the new romney ad out this morning attacking newt gingrich on housing. >> while florida families lost everything in the housing crisis, newt gingrich cashed in. gingrich was paid over $1.6 million by the agency that helped create the crisis. >> an hist romorian, really? >> really, for real? and you could expect, i was hockhoc -- i was shocked how quickly this was dealt with. you can bet that romney will hit him on this over and over and over and over again until it is
drilled into the minds' of the american public. >> unless he can explain it well. and go on a debate and give a great -- >> i hate to tell this, i was a lobbyist for seven and a half years and newt was a lobbyist. doesn't matter what his contention is. if you get paid $1.6 million, to talk to your former colleagues in the house of representatives about a group, freddie mac, that has a lobbying arm to it, you are a lobbyist. you can walk like a duck and quack like a duck, but you are not a chicken. >> this is what i would say, you have four stellar candidates running for the republican nomination. you are not talking about santorum. >> we will get to him. >> you think that ron paul is st stellar? that is not a word that i come to. >> i think that each of the
individuals you can literally make a case for them being successful this the bid. you could. i could take you through everyone of them and give you a >> is that why the establishment is sitting on the sidelines. it's telling that jeb bush is not making an endorsement -- >> or rick scott. >> right. >> do you think they think their endorsements would not mean anything? >> you mean like nikki haley? >> i am going to arm wrestle you. >> nikki haley hurt romney. >> we don't know that. he simple daily not have a presence in the state of south carolina until recently. my contention is a combination of the governor and the treasurer brought him to second.
when they showed up the crowds were larger. >> i don't know, i think that it's telling that rick scott and jeb bush are sitting on the side lines and there's a sense, again i will say, that the republican establishment doesn't know how this thing will turn out and or they are just scared of newt gingrich, which seems to be the case with many folks in the media. we will talk about newt gingrich's uncomfortable relationship with the elite media later on in the block. but first, gossip. how gingrich turned an attack on his character to an assault on the media. ♪
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details about newt gingrich's second failed marriage led up to the primary but did the scandal effect the election? if you believe the study that was done, that talking about the negative behavior is a benefit. with the hole marianne gingrich thing, if we look at the numbers coming out of south carolina, not only did newt gingrich not lose the female vote, he won it. and in terms of, unfavor ability and electability he came out on top. >> yes, the voters said that the most important thing was that he could beat obama with. people think he is the most
elect able republican. they are wrong. if you look at the comparison of where newt gingrich is nationally right now -- >> yep. >> -- he has a 56% disapproval rating. >> unfavorable. >> that means the vast majority of americans, you cannot wrap your head around the fact that the majority of people already have a fully formed negative view of this person, which is incontrast to say, mccain, whose numbers were half that and he lost. even if they liked newt a lot personally they have a concern about a train wreck because the public opinions are formed over 20 years and they are hardened and they are negative. >> let me just say, with all due respect, he out polled women, he
out polled evangelicals and he did it all within a span of two weeks and that happened because when he debated he talked about things that were relevant to south carolina and the nation. he talked about the economy and being over regulated and the assault on the small business. >> this is not a disagreement about your opinion or whether you are -- >> it's about -- >> this is a disagreement about the entire country and the slice of a slice of conservative voters. >> it's not, the great thing about south carolina, jimmy knows this, we have a pocket of moderates and liberals. we are a cross section of the entire united states. >> like those debates that newt does so we, do i get a 30 second rebuttal, and then we will leave it -- >> there was a little you've never been there kind of thing. but i've been there.
conditi continue, ari >> the pocket i'm talking about is the pocket of 56% of the usa. >> let's make note of conservative commentators is that they are saying the problem is the down tick effects. they will look at him and say he cannot be at the top of the ticket because americans don't like him. >> if republicans really get out, if people decide in the republican party, what the democrats are hoping for is it will motivate the diseffected base, that they are so angry and do not like newt gingrich. we do not know what the mobilizing effect of newt gingrich will be. >> i think i do. >> he is a contender for the president of the united states, nobody would have thought that. >> i think the mobilization
affects of newt gingrich will be shocking. what happens with the women who are independents who are 30 to 50. that is who delivered the democrats the congress in 2006 and the president his presidency. and guess what? white women, hispanic, woman, 30 to 50, who are independents, not democrats those people decide those elections. newt gingrich against barack obama, what a motivator. >> we had a website that focuses on women within that category and i can tell you those women are interested in three things. the economy, spending and a strong national defense. and what i can tell you is that every republican candidate fairs better in that populace than the
president. i predict that we have a republican president. >> taking that and running with it. we will discuss the dynamics that make the sunshine state so very unique. next on "now." [ coughs ] what is this shorty? uh, tissues sir, i'm sick. you don't cough, you don't show defeat. give me your war face! raaah! [ male announcer ] halls. a pep talk in every drop. no, i wouldn't use that single miles credit card. nice ring. knock it off. ignore him. with the capital one venture card you earn... double miles on every purchase. [ sharon ] 3d is so real larry. i'm right here larry. if you're not earning double miles... you're settling for half. really? a plaid tie? what, are we in prep school? [ male announcer ] get the venture card at capitalone.com and earn double miles on every purchase every day. what's in your wallet?
pure adrenaline. whee whee wheeeeeeeeeeee! everything you love about geico, now mobile. download the new geico app today. whee wheeeeeeeeeeee-he-he-heeeeee! it's a wide open race right now and we feel really great. >> we are delighted to be here tonight and we are delighted that things are going so well. [ applause ] >> south carolina's third and fourth place candidates are waxing optimistic they say they are in it for the long haul. is this race not down to two other horses at this point ? >> i feel strongly about that, no, alex. >> go ahead. >> ron paul is the guy with the most support in the race outside of romney.
that is just where things are. newt gingrich did a lot of exciting things very recently, i get that. but ron paul has been discounted from the very beginning, he has a lot of views i disagree with, but for people that want to objectively measure this race, he was second until south carolina, and now he is second or third close he gets less attention than santorum and gets dogged by the media and by republican powerful bun did itp. >> you heard me say four people. >> you cannot be serious. >> he has a core constituentsy that will follow him. >> i will follow him, but he has to direct them elsewhere if the republicans want a serious race. >> i have employees that will take time off and lose and take time off to follow him across the united states to hear him speak. >> he is more anti-establishment
than newt. >> it's discounting him as a candidate, he has a core constituentsy that is emotionally attached to him that will go to the ends of the earth for him. whether that makes him a feasible general election candidate, that is another question. florida, so far, it's more accurate as to what a general election would look like. you have red meat southern conservative voters and you have a hispanic population. obama won 57% of the hispanic vote and the cuban american vote, traditionally republican, there are a lot of different constituents.
>> this is more similar to what you have to do in a general election. you have to appeal to them or you don't. that is why the other candidates are out of luck in florida. we will see the top two. >> i hate to agree with you. i'm frightened but if i were santorum and paul, i'm not sure i would play in florida. >> paul is not campaigning in florida. >> santorum doesn't play in florida, it's an expensive state and big state, it does not go to his core strategy. does he have to get out? >> he will run out of money. >> i disagree with you. jimmy, you and i are on opposite sides. what is going on? >> if you do not have money you cannot go to the store. it's not new hampshire, it's not a tiny state, it's a massive state. >> but there's that super tuesday that happens right after
florida. >> and a magic number, 1144 and it will take a long time to get to that number. >> you are talking about the core supporters are romney and santorum. so, has ron paul increased his support from the last 17 times he ran for president? >> yes. >> has mitt romney? has mitt romney? >> no he flat lined at 27%. what happens with santorum, if you to not have the money you cannot go after florida. >> you are wrong. jimmy, i'll bet you right now -- >> florida has four major media markets how the he advertise down there? >> there are ten. >> four major. >> four major. i don't think that he plays. i was advising santorum, i would say focus on super tuesday, don't play in florida. he is hard fought and he has constituents young the value voters that frankly none of the other candidates compete with.
>> i did not know that south carolina was such a divided state. we have our resident south carolina residents here. can he weight long enough for newt gingrich to implode? >> he can -- he can give romney a more solid lead, the longer he stays in, he is conservative alternative that doesn't have the baggage that beginnigingric. he will play to the core, core pro life voters in the republican primary in florida. as long as he stays in, he is the anti-gingrich conservative and that helps romney and hurts gingrich. there's incentive for him to stay in. >> maybe he believes he will be the next president of the united states. i mean, i believe that senator
santorum has that vision for himself i think he is in for the duration. you'll have ron paul, santorum and governor romney. >> that other guy. >> i think he will be in -- >> that other dude will be debating tonight with some other dudes it will be interesting. >> and i predict they'll shine. >> state of the union or state of the campaign, does the state of the union have an impact. that is next on "now." i love that my daughter's part fish.
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union address, how does that speech play out with the american public? >> i think it's important that, and i wrote this also that obama channel prior democrats particularly fdr, similar to the circumstances. he has to delineate what the democrats stand for, we are ending the two wars as a nation we are strong against terrorism, he made inroads into the economy, he thwarted a terrible slide. he has to do that and he has to put it back tot represeon the r. he has to say is that here are the protects that will no longer be. i don't want it to be a laundry list. right? i hate laundry list state of the unions, make it a sweeping beginning of the the 2012 campaign and make it as simple as possible.
not too complicated. >> the white house signaled they want to hit on three things, jobs, that is where every conversation starts. and they need to acknowledge the uprising, and it's across the ideological spectrum. and they need to figure out whether they have anything new and concrete to say about the way the system is broken. there has been some talk about money, super pacs and campaign finance reform. let be clear, this is a president that opted out of public financing and delta blow to the public financing system. which we thought was wrong. whether he does it on money or the broken senate, he has to find a way, i think though touch on not only the jobs and the uprising, but also how do we fix a broken system that prevents meaningful change on my issue. >> and we know he will be channelling some of the
rhetoric, the give -- he will be talking about with a more fair tax code. it's interesting to see how the republicans have prebutted this straight of the union. >> it sounds to me like the same old policies that we have seen. more spending, higher taxes. more regulations. the same policies that have not helped our economy, they have made it worse. and if that is what the president will talk about tuesday night, i think it's pathetic. >> not happy with leaving pathetic be the final word, this was released. that is a stressful ad with the flashing and all the visuals. >> can we correct that, a thousand days without a budget, the president presents it, the
congress has failed to do the budget. it not the president that has failed to produce a budget. >> when you are in leadership, i think when you are in leadership, if you are unable to draw conclusions. if you are unable to bring people together you have failed. and i think this is about broken perhaps and about no hope and no change and i think we will have a new president. >> if you look at the polling, the american public feels the president is more effective than the congress. the approval rating is historically high. who ends up on top after this. >> i like the sound bites but there's a problem. the president of the united states does not sign the budget. if the congress passes it, the president doesn't sign it first. >> professor williams. >> no, i did seven budgets on the senate floor. here is the deal. from 1789 to 1974, the united states did not have a budget
process. the president did whatever he wanted to do and the congress passed whatever they want to do. from 1974 to now, we have passed and four budgets. someone tell me how the budget act of 1974 has produced good result ares for the american people. more spending? i'm sure that since the president has been in the white house, he had a republican congress to deal with that, spending has gone down. so where is the more spending. taxes are more than they were under george bush. so, if there's more spending and there's less tax cuts under barack obama, according to speaker boehner who i respect. then i would like to know what they are smoking over there on the house side of the capitol because frankly it's a lot of bs and it not true. >> let me say, the congress wants a budget. >> then they should pass it. >> they want to pass a budget that recalibrates where the
united states is going. >> but they can. technically they can pass the budget. it's their budget to pass. he has nothing to do with it. he does not sign it legally. >> we have democrats in the senate that are stopping it. but just for a second is jimmy. we have more regulation. >> like what? like what? >> epa. >> like what? do you have a specific regulation? >> jimmy is right, there's more regulation. >> give me a break here. we have more regulation. >> environmental regulation. >> we have more regulations. we have more government intrusion, we have all of the things that our founding fathers believed were not in the best interest of our nation and it's all coming together now. >> i'll say as far as regulation goes, regulation is a boondogle for many folks. this is the first time that regulatory effecting job
creation will be cussdiscussed r the break. what now, a legend dies, and that is all next on "now." >> hi, i'm andrea mitchell, coming up next on "andrea mitchell reports" the republican debate. mitt is in attack mode. joe scarborough is here with analysis and florida democratic party chair, rod smith on what the obama campaign needs to do to win this key swing state and congressman cummings to state of the union. on "andrea mitchell reports" in less than 15 minutes. plaque psoriasis. i decided enough is enough. ♪ [ spa lady ] i started enbrel. it's clinically proven to provide clearer skin. [ rv guy ] enbrel may not work for everyone -- and may not clear you completely,
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no to advertising from outside groups. i thought it was a nice news story here. everyone joining hands to prevent third parties -- >> except this is a state with two major media markets so to say no to pac advertising is not that big a deal. he has a lot of money and she has a lot of money. they are well known already. so this is not california or new york or even florida nfor that matter. >> i think sets a pattern to do this. there are people that did it before, fi finegold had a rule set is for his own staff, saying you could not buy anything of value. i remember because when i was working for a different senator, they were like it sucks. everyone else gets the free stuff but by 2006, those rules
were written into the lobbying reform act and become law. >> and he lost his seat in the senate. so i do not know if that was good for him politically. >> the pacs can set a standard that will be law. >> purely on a human level, it's d great to see people running against each other make a pact. >> let's see how long that works. >> today we are marking the 39th anniversary of row v wade, we talk about social issues and the fact that they are part of this 2012 race. i wonder what you make of the 39th anniversary in the shadow of an increasing march to restrict reproductive rights or ban abortions across the
country, jimmy? >> i'll state, i've never had an abortion, so i do not think i should have much of an opinion as to what a woman does with her body. it's none of my business, period. god did not give me the right to carry a child, and it none of my business, and when men tell women what the do with their bodies they don't like it. >> when you look at south carolina, i agree with jimmy, only eig8% said that abortion wa main issue for them. we have not caught up with the fact that large, large majorities in this the country, while people care deeply about this, it's no longer a top priority or leading voting issue. it may be personal to people on both sides. but this is not going to be a big issue in this election. >> i think that life for republicans is part of the test. what i can tell you is that the economy has enveloped it though, at the end of the day, if you are getting divorces because
there's not enough money, and it trickles down and effects the family and all the things. i do tell you that i think that republicans hold life as sacred >> the south carolina voters disagree with you. >> you say that because the evangelicals voted for 40% plus for gingrich. >> it not my opinion. they said that 8% said it was a main issue. >> on a main issue, but what i'm telling you is that it's a core value of the republican party life. >> it is. but ron paul has a divergent view and he is still in the running. >> i want to close on a up mono, i don't know, maybe a down note. gabrielle giffords is resigning, she is going to be attending the state of the union, the
president called mark kelly her husband, an incredible story. i know there are a lot of mixed feelings about her retirement. it been a year since being shot at point blank range and you see how far she came, it's an inspiration. thank you to all of you for joining us today, that is all for "now "i'll see you back here tomorrow at noon eastern, we will have a look at what was googled during tonight' debate and show case the most popular politico videos online. you can follow us on the old twitter machine. "andrea mitchell reports" is live from tampa bay. the home of tonight's nbc debate, hello andrea in >> hi, alex, thanks so much. the mitts are off as romney comes out of the corner swinging. on the 39th anniversary of row v wade, we will talk to plann ene
he has records that could represent an october surprise, we could see an october surprise a day from newt gingrich. >> right now on "andrea mitchell reports" fighting mitt. hours ahead of the face off, he suggests that the former speaker may have even broken the law. >> at the time he was lobbying republican congressmen for medicare part d, it could represent an evidence of lobbying but potentially, wrongful activity of some kind. >> on "meet the press" newt denied that he lobbied for millions. >>