tv Up W Chris Hayes MSNBC January 20, 2013 5:00am-7:00am PST
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as an american express cardmember you can expect some help. but what you might not expect, is you can get all this with a prepaid card. spends like cash. feels like membership. a live shot of the white house this sunday morning. a little more than 24 hours away from the second inauguration of president obama. good morning from the nation's capital where we have taken the program for the this historic event. i'm chris hayes. yesterday was celebrated as gun appreciation day as gun shows around the country. five people were shot in separate incidents at three gun shows. and here in washington, vice president joe biden is about to take his official oath of office to begin his second term and we're standing by to bring it
live to you as it happens. right now i'm joined by msnbc contributor jerry bernstein. former chief economist and policy adviser for vice president biden. and new york tannen. former domestic policy direct or four the obama/biden campaign. and jen saki and former obama white house deputy communication's director now seep your vice president and manager director at global strategy group, i public affairs and research firm and back at the table, democratic governor mallory of connecticut. good to have you back, governor. >> good to be back. >> we're going live to the vice president's residence of the naval observatory in washington by his swearing in of supreme court justice sonya sotomayer and the vice presidency is a job biden said he didn't want. in 2007, he told a reporter in iowa and this is an amazing quote which somehow doesn't get played enough -- i absolutely can say with certainty i would
not be anybody's vice president, period, end of story, guaranteed, will not do it. in the spring of 2008, according to the atlantic magazine, consultant mike mcdonald said, you mean to tell me if an african-american tells you he needs you on the ticket in order to win you'll say no? biden did not and has since proven to be a kwooe force in the obama administration. last month the vice president used his extensive experience of dealing with republicans in congress to secure a innovative deal and help to close the 2011 deal lifted the debt ceiling. and most recently the vice president has been leading the way in the president's push for workable gun safety policies. on thursday, biden spoke for almost an hour at the meeting of the u.s. conference of marz and acknowledged that the white house is likely okay come under criticism for many of its gun proposals. >> we'll take this fight to the
hauls of congress and take it beyond that. we're going to take it to the american people. we're going to go around the country and make our case and we're going to let their voices, the voice of the american people be heard and we'll be criticized because people say if we spend that much energy we're not spending enough energy on umm grags. we're not spending enough 234r7b8g on the miss energy on the miss kwal problem -- on the fiscal problem. presidents don't get to choose what they do. they deal with what is before them and what they'd like to long term. >> governor, i'm curious to get your thoughts on the package of reforms. it was interesting that the vice president was tasked with this and they put out this package and i just also wanted to say that i thought you handled the horror in newtown with tremendous grace. >> thank you. i appreciate that. and you know, when you're in connecticut, painfully aware of how traumatic that's been for
every resident of connecticut, particularly the families and residents of the families of deceased and the residents of newtown. being down here for a few days it's remarkable on how it has affected everyone. and it's a different perspective. we get in the fox hole a little bit and in connecticut over this. i spent about 1:20 with the vice president on friday at his office. lequacious as he is, we both tend to go on a little bit but he's done a great job in putting the package together. he talked to everybody. i mean, for instance, he talked to every family that lost someone in newtown in the process of doing this. and he and i had talked about that before and i urged him to do it and he followed up and did it. but he's talked to everybody. and they've put forward these kind of common sense things that the american people actually get. not the advocacy organizations
that are paid by an industry to sell weapons. but everybody else does. i mean, i can't talk about this package without pointing out and everyone automatically shakes their head. if i have to have a background check to get an airplane and every person does and by the way, we don't have a small-airport exception. everybody does. you know, then it makes sense that somebody wants to buy a weaponing that end someone's life should do it. and the other point, you know, we have spent so much time, stigmatizing violence. if we had spent a fraction of the time and a fraction of the money destigmatizing health understanding when team get treatment they get better we would be so much further along but we glorify violence and we have games that disturbed people can play for six or seven hours a day.
on the day that newtown happened he had access to a game where he could go into a school and shoot people in a video gail. it doesn't make sense. >> one of the things that's interesting of the role the vice president has played in the administration and the campaign and is very much true in respect to guns, is, as a kind of validator, if you're engineering the campaign for a man named barack obama to be the president of the united states, you have this obvious issue which is most guys don't know somebody named barack obama. he doesn't look like a lot of voters. joe biden is kind of quintessentially like next door neighbor material. i thought this clip was interesting in 2008, here's joe biden being that kind of validator for voters on specifically, this issue of gups. take a look. >> i guarantee you, barack obama ain't taking my shotguns. so don't buy that malarkey. don't buy it. they're going to start pedalling that to you. i got two.
if he tries to fool with my barretta, he has a problem. i like that little over and under. i'm not bad with it. so, give me a break! >> i think that's joe biden threatened to shoot his running mate. is that the subtext of that quote? that to me was quintessentially the role he's played from a kind of commit cal in terms of the image -- crafting the immamg of barack obama and selling him to voters. >> one i'm thrilled that malarkey has been around that long. it's an important word in our history now. but i think what people don't realize about the vice president, they focus so much on how he's this folksy guy and he speaks their language and that's absolutely true and he has a personal touch open a case like gups that's so sensitive in a state like connecticut but across the country people feel like he gets it. beyond that, he's persistent. he's going to fight like heck for this and he has kind of a
combination of those two things. and that's why he's so effective. i think people shouldn't forget beyond guns he's taken on some really, not just challenging but really, not that glamorous task in this administration. whether it was the stimulus or the -- you know, the debt limit and he's taken them and run with them and he's been a real team player and, you know, somebody i think people thought really understood. >> one of the these tasks which i think is kind of buried in the resume after we announced we weren't doing missile defense in eastern europe he was sent to even europe to talk to the eastern european leaders. jared, i'm curious, you worked with the vice president in his office. it's been strapg to me, joe biden has had such a long career in politics. he started at 30 years old. >> 35 years in the senate before he became vice president. >> and he's gone through different iterations in his public appearance and one then that's interesting is there's this kind of cartoonish version
of joe biden that the right has pushed. in fact, we have -- here's an example of -- this is funny, the onion has this whole image they crafted. this is joe biden's official twitter account referring to the onions, joe biden, the onions joe biden has written an autobiography. this is the actual joe biden teasing them about the transam that the onion says he likes. but i do wonder, how much distance do you think? what are the things we get wrong about the vice president from the perspective of hthis caricature? >> i think we get a lot wrong. there's an inside and outside. fraeg, i was his chief economists. me insisted on knowing as much as anybody in the room for any meeting. we would have briefings where he would go so far down into the weeds i would be running for
help eventually from research assistants. every time we went to a state which you do a lot with the state, he wanted to know about the economy in great detail. he does massive preparation and i think when he sits down at a table to say, do a fiscal deal one of the reasons he's able to close that deal is because, a, he has decades of experience in compromise which some of these kids today up there don't really know much about. and he understands the granularity of these issues and we saw this and it's helpful. >> vice president joe biden is going to take the oath of office for a second tomorrow right after we return from the break. ♪
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we're awaiting the official ceremony in which vice president joe biden will be sworn in by supreme court justice sonya sotomayer at the vice president's residence in the naval observestory. we're talking about the role joe biden has played and will continue to play in the obama administration. in some ways it's an odd pairing. the vice president was running against barack obama. what do you think we're going to see in this next term? i don't want to get into gaming out of 2016. we're -- >> thank you. >> we can take it a deep breath but i think there's -- it's been notable to me from a political permanent that the first two big initiatives of this year of 2013, the president has had vice president joe biden help. it was the president presumably who directed joe biden to open up a line of negotiations with mitch mcconnell and that was widely reported. when the deal was struck, they
was to the benefit in terms of representational capital o'and with the gun task force as well. what does that indicate to you? >> it indicates what we've been talking about. the vice president has 30 years of experience and he has a wide variety of experiences. both in foreign policy and on the crime bill, the '94 crime bill is something he shepherded and his extraordinary ability to deal with senate republicans in a way a lot of people can't. senator reed and mitch mcconnell don't get along that well so i don't read nieg into it other than the president has an eset in the vice president and he's using that asset and he's deploying him well. the thing we should be mindful of is that there's over the next four years there's going to be a lot of tea leaf reading but at the end of the day, you know, the president is using the personing that get a job done and he's done an extraordinary job so far. let me say, passing this legislation will be tough.
it's important to put your best feet on the ground there because it's really not -- it's going to be tough to get these bills passed. >> and it's not just ability. the vice president -- and again i worked closely with him for a few years -- he really likes this kind of political dealmaking in a way i don't think the president likes that much. if he's pushed to it he can do it. but the vice president looks at politics like a chess game and he's always figuring out how to get from here to there. some of the best political analysis i ever heard was sitting in his office saying what do you think politician's x are in the next election and you hear this spontaneous analysis that was always very deep and comprehensive so he has a kind of feel for what it's going to take to close the deal. i think one of the things that's been tough for him is that as he likes to say, this isn't your grandfather's congress so he's getting used to the tea party. >> but he's good at it. he's got this joe, everybody per
so that. people like him. a lot of politicians the public meets. they're in awe and they honor the person. >> like the governor of connecticut into that's not the case. but. >> people come away and genuinely like him and that's a skillset and cal he want and a communication's ability and that's very important to this administration and i -- by the way, there's this other thing about him. you can't keep him down. you really can't put him in a room and not hear him. so he's a force and why not use him? >> i also think that, you know, i no ewe're not bog to get into the tea leaves about 2016 but the vice president is not someone that shies away from the fight. i agree with what you said about gun control and how challenging that's going to be in their variety of reasons why but he's okay to teak on a challenge he may lose or win or you may win some pieces and i don't think that's going to change over the next four years. >> and i think, again, i don't
want to -- but it matters in this respect. you conduct yourself differently as a politician if you're preparing a run for national office. for president than you do if this is the last job you're going to hold in public life. >> so that's why, okay, this is a good and brave thing he's doing. this will be a difficult issue and it's important. politics of taking on preventing gun crimes is not an easy issue. it's not clear to me that -- so that's going to be an issue which is polarizing down the road and he's taking it on and that's good for him. that's showing leadership and we should applaud it. >> i was all under the impression he wouldn't run for offers afterwards. >> i was about hillary redding so jeremy? -- they're administering the prayer and we'll bring you this live in a second into thank you for saving me from that. >> this is his nbc news reported this quote, this is biden telling a republican voter to vote for him in 2016. he says, i'm not trying to talk
you into voting for me i just want to say hi and after it's all over, your insurance rate will go down and you'll vote for me in 2016 so i'll talk to you later. >> are you going to announce? >> no. >> he's going to be successful. >> we're going to make changes to gun laws. i think we'll do some on a national basis and we're clearly already starting it on a state by state basis. so i'm there is going to be a level of success. it's locked in and i think you have to put that into -- i know it's hard for what people in washington to think that something might actually be gotten done but it's going do happen. this newtown changed discussion and whatever is not gotten in the first round, eventually will be gotten because there's going to be more newtowns. we're so far extended on access to weapons of mass destruction that there are going to be other incidention. >> we were looking in the wrong place, right? >> right. >> who would -- you're right. they are here. you know? and when a disturbed individual
can take two magazines, 30-round magazines, tape them together so he literally -- all he had to do was turn it around and get another 30 shots off and have multiples of those as you walk into a school, that's who we are right now and america's growing sick of it. and if we start to forget what happened in newtown, there's going to be a another during the time that the vice president was working on this, three more shootings in schools. >> and a thousand -- a thousand gun deaths. >> right. >> i think that's what i really important. we've changed the framework so we hear more about the five accidents yesterday at gun shows and you hear about the crimes committed with guns every day. the media is covering it. reporters are dealing with it but it's put a new framework an the whole discussion and that's why this is different than the past. >> the loophole will go away. i think we'll close it. >> i think we're about to hear from the supreme court justice
son se sonya sotomayer. the reason they're swearing in today, in case you didn't know, this is the 20th, it's constitutionally mandated that the president and vice president are sworn in on january 20th. the traditions that been going back all the way, back to the 19th century and certainly since eisenhower, when the 20th falls on a sunday, the president and vice president teak their official oath of office in a private ceremony. this is that ceremony right now. >> pleasing with place your hand on bible and raise your right land and repeat after me. i, joseph r biden do solemnly swear, that i will support and defend the constitution of the united states. >> that i will support and defend the constitution of the united states. >> against all enemies foreign and domestic. >> against all enemies foreign and domestic. >> that i will bear true faith and allegiance to the same.
>> that i will bear true faith add allegiance to the same. >> that i take this obligation freely. >> that i tick this obligation freely. >> without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion. >> without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion. >> and that i will well and faithfully discharge. >> and that i will well and faithfully discharge. >> the duties of the office on which i am about to enter. >> the duties of the office on which i'm about to enter. >> so help me god. >> so help me god. >> congratulations. >> thank you. [ applause ] >> thank you.
>> madam justice, these are some of my friends and my family. and i want to explain to you what a wonderful and honor it was and how much out of her way that the justice had to go. she's due in new york and she has to leave right now so i apologize. we're going to walk out to. her car is waiting. she can catch a train i hope i haven't caused her to miss and i'm leaving and going to meet the president to do the traditional laying of the wreath at the tomb over in arlington and we're having breakfast. i'll be back, they tell me, in 40 meant. i hope some of you will still be here but i thank you very, very much for sharing this morning with jill and me and madam justice, it's been an honor, a great honor. >> thank you. enjoy breakfast. be back in a few minutes. >> vice president joe biden,
officially now vice president, again, for his second term, having taken the oath of office administered by supreme court justice sonya sotomayer. there's a little joke there about justice sonya sotomayer is on a book tour so theyed that how change the schedules around to make a book appearance. i want to get back to you, the issue of guns here. because the president with the vice president, obviously, was spearheaded the 1994 crime bill. it was the 1994 crime bill that included the assault weapon ban and there's a lot of looking back now at that legislation about what it did and didn't do and governor, i'm curious what your sense of what that bill did. >> this is the problem. you can buy a weapon that shoots a single bullet when you buy it. and you can take it home and you can put a magazine on it and suddenly, it's -- it can do the things we've now seen happen place after place after place.
at the very least, under the '94 law, those larger magazines were not legal. and in large part, didn't exist. it doesn't mean that, you know, some of them didn't somehow get somewhere but they didn't exist by and large. and just as in the '30s, machine guns wam about and criminals got machine guns and we decided people shouldn't have machine gups. guess what? we don't see that type of weapon. people shouldn't have grenades. we decide that was illegal and we don't see a lot of crimes committed that way and that's what the '94 bill did. now, it was too broad with respect to the definition of an assault weapon and that was a weakness but other than that, it did some really good things. >> but the devil is in the details here. i want to play the vice president talking about the specific issue of magazines and their capacity. and then, talk about the ways in which the definition of what assault weapons are and were actually mattered in the details. we can't say assault weapon ban
in the abstract because when the legislation gets written it will make a difference. take a look at the vice president. >> some of you are deer hunters, bear hunters, big game hunters. i'm not being facetious, i'm being literal. most of the weapons used, rifling used in that endeavor can take clips that can accommodate 30, 40, 50, you don't -- but they can accommodate it. >> high-capacity magazines don't have a practical sporting purpose or hunting purpose as one hunter told me. if you have 12 rounds, you got 12 rounds it means you've already missed the deer 11 times. you should pack the sucker in at that point. you don't deserve to have a gun period if you're that bad [ laughter ] the vice president talking about that. >> his high-capacity magazine. but in 1994, there was a question about what got written into legislation and how you define assault weapon. and i think in retrospect, there's a lot about that that
was quite porous, right? >> there's better ways to define it. if it has a handle it's an assault weapon. if you can change it relatively easily into somethinging that do that sort of thing it's an assault weapon. but you know, let's -- you know it when you see it. that's what it is. you know it when you see it but people, interests, have worked on a definition that's wide enough to drive a truck through and so, you know, it has to look like this and it has to have one or two or three or four similarities with a military instrument. it's really what most states have gone to that have even tried to do it on their own. and it's just too wide or broad. >> essentially what it was is a menu of features. if you had a certain amount of those individual features, you were over the line of assault weapon and if you didn't, you could keep underneath the ban. >> so the definition was lobbied do death. >> and in fact, the weapon what was used in newtown, versions of
that did exist on the assault weapon ban. it was modified to fit. >> even in our state, that definition didn't work. your state has it. so, we're pretty controlled and even there, it didn't work. >> yeah, i think the issue here is, we recognize that that didn't work in the past but that doesn't mean it won't work in the future and one of the big chamgs you have the nra talking about how the salt weapon's ban and high-capacity clips didn't work and we've had studies that show when we have this assault weapons' ban the number of guns that were covered from criminals -- that have assault weapon features were declining. it took a little while because they grandfathered a lot of munitions in. but it actually was effective. so i think the challenge here as there's a lot of misinformation in this debate and that's why this is a strong lobby but it won't be effective in the future and as the president says, we
can save one child from something happening here we should take it. >> i had -- i'm sorry, let me share this. i spoke to the u.s. conference of mayors about this yez. an older mayor in ticks came up to me and said, our family had a browning. and that browning could hold five shots. and under the texas law that existed when i was growing up, two of those had to be sealed. so it could only carry three. that's how far we've come. from that -- >> how far we've come. >> to magazines with 150. >> but one of the problems here is that we can't do pliltally or legislatively what we've done before. you visit it '94 and then in 20. there's going to be loopholes. they'll creep in somehow. are we saying we can't come back to this for ten years? no. the nra will try to block the technology every step of the way and frankly, a smart, humane
politics is not going to let that happen. that's where we need to be. >> that's why i remeend folks we'll see more of this and this will go on for a period of time. the cat's out of the bag until we put the cat back in the bag and that's going to take some time, some effort and some serious discussion and i think states will lead the way. new york is obviously acted very quickly. but other states will act. we're certainly going to change things significantly. martin will do maryland. so this is going to play itself out. on the other hand, on the national level, let's get what we can get. let's get as much of this and it's great to see how resentful they are that the president is taking executive action as if no republican president has ever taken an executive or made any -- as if -- >> young one really important port for people who are advocates for this or kinds of new advocates of it which is a really important population, is, one of the nra and one of the right-wing talking points is it's too hard to define an
assault weapon. we shouldn't do it. they have the same approach on video games. there's no research or study. we don't know that mental health is actually -- so, you know, this is a -- it's too challenging. it's too hard. let's just not do it which sounds ridiculous but it's something that people fall prey to and people out there that want this to happen, need to wap out for that. >> yeah. >> i want to talk about what this means for the second term. both in the political calculation and what the politics are. the role of the president vice president joe biden who is now officially resworn in for his second term and what it means for prioritizing the agenda in the second term. i thought what joe biden said in that clip we played at the top, which is presidentses don't get to choose. they deal with what's in front of them, there's a lot of weight this that. i want to talk about that after this break. se prego. prego?! but i've bought ragu for years. [ thinking ] wonder what other questionable choices i've made? i choose date number 2!
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president prepare to to the public ceremony tomorrow and the vice president has already been sworn in and the president will be sworn in later today. i think no one thought four months ago that this, now is the time the president's plan to protect our children from gun violence would be the first thing that happened in 2013. i think that's fair to say it didn't come up on the campaign and it only came up to assure people we're not going to do anything on this issue. how do you think this changings the political calculation of how much space there is on other things. are other priorities getting pushed down the queue because of this? >> so, i think, you know, i think in the first two years when we had very strong democratic majorities, there was this theory of the case which is, we have to pass health care refo reform. nothing else can pass. we have to focus on that because there's a real issue rahm emanuel will call you up and yell and curse at you and say back the eff up.
>> i know this from reporting. >> i know it from phone calls. >> don't talk to that congressman or senator about that issue because we have to keep pristine, everything on. >> we have no idea what you're taubing about. >> you're all looking at me like -- >> so maybe that happened. and but i think that, you know, it was hard to pass health care reform and it was like every vote counted in the end. now i think the president recognizes that live this republican majority and a minority in the senate. there's a different strategy. you need to organize public will. there's a quart of "flood the zone" strategy which is you can disrupt the opposition because they can't really gain speed on any particular issue. the opposition really games speed on health care. if you're pushing all these issues it's not like the congress does too much. on a regular basis. so you can actually take on these issues and make the forceful case. the question is, will the president be making the argument?
there's a limit on the president's time so can he make the arguments fiscal cliff, immigration, immigration reform is a huge, important task that needs to get done and it's on important task for him to get done for the democratic coalition to hold together in the future so, you know, it shouldn't come at the expense of things but he has to pay attention to all these issues. >> this is a moment in time, on gun control and you couldn't have predicted that six months ago and even with aurora, as terrible as that strategy does, this as we've seen in polling, kind of created more of an openness to it in this country than existed before. something, obviously, the president has supported it, whether it's possible. and on, you know, i think there are many things he wanted to get dope, right, to your larger question. immigration, obviously they layed out a little bit of what they want to do. they know they need to do the fiscal cliff and deal with the fiscal cliff issues. all the fiscal issues are not the definition of what he wants in the second term. they're what he needs to get through in a survivable way.
we wants to get immigration and energy and wants to do everything he can on gun control. >> and. >> we know that the republicans will do nothing for two years and so we're also testing whether they're willing to do nothing for four years wtd belief that's not the case and that you can not be a national party on -- on the basis of you're doing nothing for a four-year period of time. so let's flood. let's pour it on. let's people understand who and what we are. >> i'll add that there are a lot of republicans that are interested in immigration reform. >> they have to be. >> i think the point is really a central one about this change in the theory of the case from the single priority that that must be preserved and put forward and the cost of that is, everyone can target their fire, right? everyone was against the affordable care act to the idea of throw a lot of things out there and kind of confuse the opposition because they have too many things to handle and i'm to talk about that later gep.
and we and we have the former chief economist to vice president biden and democratic governor dan mallory of connecticut, thanks for joining us. >> thank you. one of the most consequential decisions of president obama's second term may happen this week. that's next. tina, change engineering in dubai, aluminum production in south africa, and the aerospace industry in the u.s.? at t. rowe price, we understand the connections of a complex, global economy. it's just one reason over 75% of our mutual funds beat their 10-year lipper average. t. rowe price. invest with confidence. request a prospectus or summary prospectus with investment information, risks, fees and expenses to read and consider carefully before investing. but with advair, i'm breathing better. so now i can be in the scene. advair is clinically proven to help significantly improve lung function. unlike most copd medications,
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in his inauguration speech tomorrow, president obama will lay out his agenda fire second term. we already know some of the major components. sweeping reforming to gun laws, a massive overhaul of the immigration system and a renewed effort of some kind to stimulate the economy. all those measures are broad by popular. one major obstacle. the filibuster. the senate has turned the filibuster into an unprecedented impediment to legislation. stopping the body from debating let alone voting on bills by the president. the senate has passed the 2.8% of the bills and the lowest since 1947.
so it is no wonder that before the election senate majority leader harry harry reid said one of his biggest regrets is not reforming the filibuster. the president announced he was considering major changes to the rulings. reed wanted to change the rules by requiring filibuster senators to occupy the floor and speak if he want to delay legislation. now, however, as we approach the deadline for making the decision, it seems like senator reed maybe backing away. the senate is currently in recess until tuesday and when they return they'll have to make a decision, whether to make good on genuine reform of the filibuster. a watered-down compromise that many say doesn't go far enough. this is one of those reformers. senator john udall. and the executive director of the democratic national committee.
thank you both for being here. >> thank you, great to be here with you, chris. you started covering this very early. >> senator, you just sat down and i said this morning before this interview i looked at the notes that i transcribed from the interview i did in your office on 2011 on precisely this issue which was the last time it was with you and senator merkley proposing changes to the filibuster and you got a little bit of attention. and it ultimately, nothing happened. two years later, you're in a much better position so i guess my first question is, where are we on the right now? it's been very difficult as a reporter to kind of gain where this is. this is very inside baseball. where are things from your standpoint? >> well, the first thing that's tremendously important is we need to change the way we do business in the senate. everybody knows that the senate is broken. that it's not operating the way it should and you just laid out all of the figures and statistics. this is has been -- this has been the 112th congress we just came out of has been the least
productive in the history of the country. so we're going to change that. and here's what we need to do. we need to take the filibuster and make sure that if you're going to perform a filibuster you do it out in the open and you do it transpainttransparentu do it in a way so the public knows what's going on. i don't have a problem coming to the floor. whoever it is, they want to read a phonebook or talk or whatever they want to do, but it's out in the public so whatever bill we're pursuing, we want to make sure that the public knows what's going on. right now, we have secret stealth silent filibusters and they are very, very damaging to the senate and the final point here is what people need to realize, this is about doing what the american people sent us here to do. >> okay. >> so let's get into the weeds a little bit. the reform you're proposing and
that you and senator merkley have been working in tandem on this for years, now, is to reinstate what you call "the talking filibuster." if you want to delay you have to talk, right? right now that's not the case. but there's a lot of other aspects to the way the filibuster has developed and it sounds to me from what i've heard from senator harry reid, that he's looking at not fully rei stating the talking filibuster but a package of reforms that would get rid of some of the worst abuses. in is sort of tea leaf reading off an interview from a local nevada media outlet, the pbs station in las vegas. let's take a listen. >> we need to do is change the filibuster. we have things that are so stupid. if i want to get on a bill, i have to file -- lyndon johnson filed it once in his six years. i filed it 390 some odd times. so we've got to change that.
if you invoke that on a piece of legislation, people get 30 hours to sit around and do nothing. i want to get rid of that. i think we should not have the 30-hours post. and i think that we have to make sure that on a regular piece of legislation, if somebody wants to continue objecting to it after it's been invoked they should have to stand and talk. there should be a talking filibuster. >> okay. so there's -- can you explain this 30-hour thing? i think that -- in the grand scheme of things is the most egregious which is, you know, filibustering the motion to proceed and then, there's this weird kind of period after you filibuster with motion to proceed where it's mandated no one can do anything? >> well, there are two familiar low periods. first is when eye file the 16 senators file a motion that moves towards kloture and that's
two full working days and then you have the vote and if you achieve, you're cutting off debate, then there's a 30-hour period that follows after that. and that 30-hour period is supposed to be used to dispose of amendments and debate. but frequently what happens is we just burn the -- we burn the time. and so that 30 hours runs, it delays what we're doing. >> and no business, no other business can happen on the floor in that 30 hours? >> that's correct. and what should be happening is there should be debate. we should be disposing of amendments. both sides should be participating. and we want the minority to be a part of this. one of the big accusations out here is that somehow were we're take i can away minority rights. no, we want to craft this in a way where the minority can participate and amend and debate. they can be a part of the process. >> the word "ripen" which is the -- natural process you can't
control. but this is some rule we can change, right? ripening is not -- it's not granted by biology or god that you have to wait 30 hours. you can just get rid of it. >> there's knotting in the senate that's natural. >> nothing. it's an -- >> the senate is ripening to the point of compost. >> it's rotting, right. a fine line between the two. i want to talk about where the white house is on this and why the white house has not made this more of a priority. i think the president's reputation has been damaged by this and whether senator reid is going wobbly on you after we take this break. and lowlights. for color that's true to you. i don't know how she does it. with nice'n easy, all they see is you.
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that's a new afd from the workers. an, sfrakt issue. just to set the table empiricily on what the trends have been. this is a line graph that shows bills passed as opposed to closure invoked. how many bills the senate passing and how often is cloture being passed. and obviously, those two things have a lot to do with each other. given the fact that the president has had such an ambitious legislative agenda, why hadn't the white house been more outspoken? why hadn't there been more pressure from the oval office to fix this? it seems like it's the president's agenda and in some
ways his political capital that's been the most urt hurt by this institution? >> chris, i'm assuming you're making reference to, perhaps if first two years the president was in washington and in the white house where the filibuster conversation was not central to his agenda and to the debate. i point you toward the statements that have been made in the last few weeks and months by white house spokes people by the president himself, about how the american people rendered a verdict on this kind of inaction back on november 6th. it's pretty clear we need action and movement in the united states senate on the dream act, on jobs, on all of the important reforms. >> nominations. >> nominations, right now, there are 19 judicial nominations that are sitting in front of the senate, many with bipartisan support that just aren't moving because of this kind of paralysis and the white house is firmly behind the actions of senator reed and the leadership of senator udall. >> and have you talked to the white house? >> yes. every time the president has come before us in terms of a retreat or anything else he's been very strong about -- we've
got to have filibuster reform. we've got to change the way we do business and we've got to move in such a way so that we can deal with the agenda he's laying out and which we may modify some but it's important that we get to that agenda. not sit around in a bunch of filibust filibusters. >> i think what the senator said is important. it's also about reading between the lines of what he says. is he out giving a speech on filibuster reform every day? no. i don't have any data but i don't think think 99% of the people in this country know what filibuster or any of this is. the question is, if this keeps moving and hopefully it does, can the president get out and talk about what this means for immigration in what it means for guns? translate to people understand? that's the reason that commercial was very effective and that should be the message around this. >> from where i sit and i'm sort of the minority on the. i'm of the belief 50 years from now people will look back and the thing will care is whether
we stopped the planet from melting or not. >> i agree. >> i hear you. >> and. >> consistent on that. >> and there's no way of conceiving of a 60 senate votes in any iteration or configuration of american politics or interest, 60% of votes that prices carbon. i can imagine a universe of the united states politics that gets 51 votes but i don't ever see 60 and that seems like there's no way of getting over that. >> chris, it was the filibuster on the health care bill that ran out the clock that made it so we were unable to deal with the climate change legislation. to come over from the house. so it's clear to me at every step if you look, it's. this silent secret stealth filibuster that's slowed down progress on the things the american people really want to see. >> and i do think there's been a lot of movement. a lot of people were opposed to any reforms two years ago because of leadership and
merkley's leadership. there's been a lot of activity on the. i think it's good that this program is working and we're talking about it now but it's also important to get a lot of it in the next 24 hours. >> i want to talk about where the resistance lies. there's institutional prerogatives. let talk about that after the bike. ♪ you can't let a cold keep you up tonight. [ snores ] vicks nyquil. powerful nighttime 6-symptom cold & flu relief. ♪ [ sniffles, coughs ] excuse me. i need something for my cold symptoms. [ sniffles ] we've got dayquil for day and nyquil for night. [ thuds ] you didn't see that. [ male announcer ] right now at walgreens dayquil and nyquil are just $6.49 with card. let's say you pay your guy around 2% to manage your money. that's not much you think. except it's 2% every year. does that make a difference? search "cost of financial advisors" ouch. over time it really adds up. then go to e-trade and find out how much our advice costs.
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and these come together, one thing you can depend on is that these will come together. delicious and wholesome. some combinations were just meant to be. tomato soup from campbell's. it's amazing what soup can do. arlg national cemetery in washington where president obama and vice president wyden are expected momentarily to participate in i wreath-laying ceremony in the tomb of the unknowns.
vice president and a relatively small ceremony in his residence, the favor value observatory. later in the white house, president obama will be sworn in as well. we'll carry that live here on msnbc. all of that is mandated by the constitution to happen on this day, january 20th, but tradition has it if it falls on a sunday the public ceremonies are the following day so we'll, of course, be bringing all of that to you live tomorrow. hello from washington! i'm chris hayes and i'm here with senator tom udall and the center for american progress, jen saki former obama traveling secretary. pepper talking about filibuster reform and senator udall has been one of the most outspoken voices about that and there's agreement that the conversation has moved. there's an awareness of just how dedysfunctional things have grown but there's still resistance. i want you to talk about where that resistance comes from both from republicans and democrats and from people in washington
more broadly. >> sure. you ask about the issue in terms of senator reid and where he's at. one of the things we need to remember is five months ago he came to the floor and he said, the reformers, tom udall and jeff merkley and others, were right. i was wrong. we should have changed the rules. and so there's nobody more determined, i think, than harry reid to do this. and the thing that is important to me is that he's chosen the constitutional option to do it. at the beginning of a congress in the first legislative day, you can take 51 votes, cut off debate and adopt the rules. and so really what we're talking about here is 51 votes. we'd love to have republicans but we have 55 now. and if we pull together, we can do it. >> do you have to -- >> we're determined to do that. i believe we haven't gotten to the point and this is the crucial thing, chris. what is the plan going to be?
when harry finally is able to pull it all together, i think on that day and he walks into the caucus and says -- this is the plan. this is what we're going to do. there's going to be 51 votes for it. >> you think there will be 51 votes for it? >> yes. >> do you think, john cornyn who was one of the most outspoken proponents of changing the filibuster back when the republicans had the majority and the hi bob si goes in both directions. there were tons of liberals saying, oh, my god, the filibuster, it's tyranny. they were wrong. >> they never said it rooirnenned. >> they were wrong so the hypocrisy goes both ways. senator cornyn said something that was interesting which accounts for some of the tea leaf reading we've been doing in the press of what it's at. the history is the people get to the edge of the abyss, look that and pull back because the majorities realize that they are
transient and today's minority can become the majority and what they do is what they have to live with in the future and that usually prompts some sort of negotiation and agreed outcome idea being, sure, take the 51-vote majority to change the rules at the beginning of the session but do you really want to do that because you're settling some dangerous precedent. do you think it sets a daeng rouse precedent? >> i don't think it does. i think it brings acountiability to the process. if the senate at the beginning of the congress knowing there's been abuse of the rules and the place is dysfunctional and it's not working if you step forward and say as a majority, these are the rules we're going to function under, this is how it's going to operate and we're going to get things done and we're going to exercise our majority power, i think that's a good thing. but you know, let's remind people. you say "jewels of the democracy" the two -- i know tongue-in-cheek. the two big accomplishments of the filibuster, they -- it
prevented for 25 years, civil rights legislation. anti-lynching legislation. so if you talk about what the filibuster has been about, it's been about preventing progress. that's why we need to reform that. >> as people who are going to be working in politics for a while, do you worry about -- >> we're retired. >> do you worry about -- i mean, is this precedent-setting thing something to be concerned about? i'm not concerned about because basically i believe in democracy so that's like -- >> so anyone on the other side is a totalitarian, is that right? >> no. we believe in transparency and the great conversation. tomorrow when the president is being sworn in all of america is being invited to the great debate about where we are and where we're headed and that should open up and liberalize the conversation and should not be stymies by the rulings. we're talking about the ripening
of cloture. people want to know what the senate is doing on jobs and reform and on all the things we need to do to continue to make ourselves competitive and, yet, here we are talking about -- >> that's precisely the problem. it attenuates the bonds of democratic accountability, precisely because -- you even see that sometimes activists will say, so and so is supports the bill. but then is using procedural mechanisms that no one contracts, to kill it. so you don't know who is actually on your side if you're trying to advocate for something. >> i think the big challenge with what's happened in the last couple of years is a product of a process that's going on far a while was really that the process is so difficult to discern that it makes it -- it makes people much more cynical about what's happening in their government which actually, in the end, feeds conservatives' views that government can't do anything and anything else. so that's why i think it's critical to take steps. the truth is, things are so bad
at this point, this congress -- the senate is so unproductive if you just had people enforce the rules as they were meant to be, which is meaning people be there on the floor, that would be a huge difference. so, i think there's some question about what steps they have -- what rules they'll really have to adopt to make the changes because the truth is, it's become so perverted it l.a.x. transparency and people have no idea what's going on. you have to become totally expert in senate procedure to each understand what's going to happen. which also feeds armies of lobbyists as well. >> neera, that's why if you have senators go to the floor and lodge that filibuster. >> absolutely. >> and be there talking, all of you on the outside, the media, the public, they say -- what's going on in the senate today? well, senator so and so is trying to block this thing with a filibuster and then you can have the interaction which is what democracy is all about. >> and quickly, senator, we're
talking patrick made this point which is true. it all seems an strakt and there's a small percentage of americans that are tuned into filibuster reform and a significant majority that watch this program but that said, you have to get elected in the state of new mexico? you have to talk to voters -- do you talk to voters about this? if so, what are those conversations like? >> the amazing thing, starting this a little over three years ago, is that in town hall meetings and discussions and in a variety of settings, this is a big issue and more than anything i think they understand the talking filibuster. the idea that mr. smith goes to washington. and people remember that principled mr. smith going to the senate floor and trying to fight off the action that was going on. they think, why isn't that going on now? what the senate is broken. we've got to restore that and
bring that back to the senate floor. >> senator tom udall of new mexico and neera, thank you all for joining us. that was great. >> thanks, chris. the lessons from four years in the white house. that's next. l in love, get married, have a couple of kids, [ children laughing ] move to the country, and live a long, happy life together where they almost never fight about money. [ dog barks ] because right after they get married, they'll find some retirement people who are paid on salary, not commission. they'll get straightforward guidance and be able to focus on other things, like each other, which isn't rocket science. it's just common sense. from td ameritrade. it's just common sense. i've always had to keep my eye on her... but, i didn't always watch out for myself. with so much noise about health care... i tuned it all out. with unitedhealthcare, i get information that matters... my individual health profile. not random statistics. they even reward me for addressing my health risks.
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four years ago president obama said -- >> on this day we gather because we've chosen hope over fear. unity of purpose over conflict and discord. on the day, we come to proclaim an end to the petty grievances and false promises the recriminations and worn-out dogmas that for far too long have strangled our politics.
>> and any notion that an obama administration would bring about an end to dogma or discord quickly evaporated during the first of the presidency and seemed positively quaint after republicans resumed control of the house. the lessons learned by the administration in the first four years have made the president a very different leader. far less conciliatory in to be and arguably in substance. in the central message of 2008 to change the way the ligs does. he characterized the messy political process as something not to overcome, but rather to embrace. >> democracy in a nation of 300 million can be noisy and messy and complicated. we have our own opinions. each of us has deeply-held beliefs. and when we go through tough times, when we make big decisions as a country, it necessarily stirs passions. stirs up controversy.
that won't change after toenlt and it shouldn't. >> joining us now are bill burton, executive vice president and cofounder of priorities usa and former depth they press secretary at obama white house and democratic congresswoman barbara lee of california and patrick is still here. wonderful to have you here. pleasure. our second producer, allison coke chose those two sound bytes. and you don't want to make too much out of it but there's something interesting about the difference between the vision in that first bite and the vision in the second. the vision in the first bite is that discord conflict are kind of problems about politics. they're symptoms of something dysfunctional and in the second speech, after four years that he gave on that election night is, conflict is just endemic. it's what politics is about and there's no getting around conflict. and i think -- do you think that's one of the main lessons
that the president and the people around the president have taken away or you in congress have taken away? >> i don't think that anybody could have guessed just how intransgent the republicans would be. they were all against things they supported themselves. >> just a slight correction. >> no, no, but even the nominees that they support and they would block welcome on and on and on and the fact that the president has to fight on things like the debt ceiling that no president has had to fight like he's had to fight on, i think, sets the tone for what is going to be you know, a very, very tough second term. >> was the level of republican that bill talked about, aas a colleague of same republicans, was it surprising to you? was it as surprising to you as it appeared to be surprisetion to the white house? >> no. it wasn't. because that night they were planning their agenda and remember, senator mitch mcconnell told us very early
that their goal and the first priority was to make sure that president obama was going to be a one-term president. follow that we saw the obstructionist tea party congress willing to throw the economy and the country under the bus. so we knew this from day one and we just saw how they said, no, no, no, even to the president's jobs anticipation agenda. >> if you knew it from day one, do you think that the white house approached it wisely, foolishly or somewhere in between in terms of the way that they dealt with this kind of opposition? >> of course, the president wanted bipartisan cooperation. he's an optimist. he knows the country still wants to come together to do the job for the american people and that's to create jobs and turn the economy around and so, i have to give the president a lot of credit because he's started from day one and when i listen now to the republicans, you would think that the president never, ever tried. here i'm there saying, oh, my god, he's going too far. he's doing this and that and from day one we wanted --
>> too much. >> so -- but he was willing to try and i give him a lot of credit. >> have you seen, senator, an arc in the -- and you're someone relatively new. you came in 2006, right? >> i was in the house. >> right, right. but you have been in the senate for decades, right? and you've seen this latest crop of republican kind of procedural obstruction and so forth. do you think the white house has evolved. the president has evolved in the way he approach this is? >> barbara's comment about mitch mcconnell saying his number-one goal was to defeat president obama in so many words, almost precisely, that i think that really showed how far they had come. a leader of a party would not have said that a decade go of either party, like bill 15id they wouldn't have fought on raising the debt ceiling so i think the president wanted, like barbara said, he wanted to cooperate and see bipartisanship and wanted to see some way of moving forward together and
pullinging people together in this country be i think he's realized there are hundreds of examples now, in half a dozen really prominent examples where they simply won't work together and won't compromise and i think the president who 2r50ied so hard and through his whole life was a good convener and good consensus-builder in his previous jobs leading up to this rooelszs this is a different league and a whole different crowd of people he's dealing with. >> so i want to talk about that if that's the dauntding realization that's more broadly shared. i think it took a while where people, particularly in the center left among the democrats and activists and the people on capitol hill, this is the way this is going to be. what that means. ♪
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with multiple lacerations to the wing and a fractured beak. surgery was successful, but he will be in a cast until it is fully healed, possibly several months. so, if the duck isn't able to work, how will he pay for his living expenses? aflac. like his rent and car payments? aflac. what about gas and groceries? aflac. cell phone? aflac, but i doubt he'll be using his phone for quite a while cause like i said, he has a fractured beak. [ male announcer ] send the aflac duck a get-well card at getwellduck.com. quick realtime correction. i said the two republicans that voted for the recovery act. senator brown pointed out it was three. one was arlen specter who
subsequently changed parties. >> so there's only one left. >> we had a switching party. >> that story has not been finished yet. i want to play two other bi bitetio bitetion. from the president and he talks about the impending debt ceiling where he's urging a compromise talking about a grand bargain and the second is him talking more recently in which he says, i'm not going to compromise. take a look. >> i'm asking you all, to make your voice heard. if you want a balanced approach to reducing the deficit, let your member of congress know. if you believe we can solve this problem through compromise, send that message. america, after all, has always been a grand experiment in compromise. >> one thing i will not compromise over is whether or not congress should pay the tab for a bill they already racked up. if congress refuses to give the united states the ability to pay its bills on time, the
consequences for the entire global economy could be catastrophic. the last time they threatened this course of action our entire economy suffered for it. >> all right. the trajectory of the perspective of compromise. >> that's entertaining but i think a i have a little bit of minority opinion. some of it is a bit overstated. in you're preamble setting this up. to assume that when the president was delivering that speech in 2009, that he did not understand just how difficult the road ahead would be and just how much recess substance he would get from the other party. i think, understates the sophistication that this man has about politics and he knew what the moment was in 2009. i think that right now what you're seeing from this president is a clarity in his sense of what the opportunity is of the moment. he understands what we've come to and let's be clear. when he was talking about, the end to that kind of resistance, he meant paralyzing resistance.
we got health care done and we d the economy forward and we enhanced important civil rights reform so the president is saying we're not going to be paralyzed by this but we'll move forward as a people and make meaningful change. i think these clips show a more muscular president coming off of what happened in connecticut recently, i think the president is very clear about what needs to be done to make sure we protect all of america and continue to move forward on important things. >> but the president's posture is unquestionably been more aggressive and forward-leaning toward republican obstruction, it just didn't last several months. >> i think the deal that was struck on the 31st in the beginning of the year, in some ways, was an affirmation that trickle-down economics don't work. trickle down from the rich doesn't work. you build tfl middle class and you build the economy from the middle class out and i think the
president, i think that agreement spoke to that and i think the president has always unz stood that and is going to govern with that in mind much more in the years ahead. >> you say that but one of the things that's interesting is in the history of the post 2010 election where he's had this, all the reporting behind the sundays about the many different interactions and negotiate usas they've had have been about working toward, quote, entitlement reform, my least favorite phrase. gutting this and betraying promises they made to people. and that the republicans have been their worst enemy in that the president has been willing to make a deal and the republicans have squoched the deal again and again and the question is, given that, are you confident the white house won't offer some kind of deem like raising the eligibility age or cuts to social security benefits in this next iteration of negotiations? >> i'm very confident of that. we have an election. and elections have consequences and the american people said
very clearly, no cuts to social security. no cuts to medicare. and no cuts to medicaid. now, of course, there are ways to address efficiencies. we could allow for the bulk purchase of prescription drugs. you know, there are ways you can save money. but i think the public is very clear and, you know, i'm confident that the president is not going to go there. >> but congresswoman, i remember a week or two where raising the -- raising the eligibility amg on medicare, a terrible policy idea. >> but again, members of congress, progressive caucus, the black caucus, black, asian pacific caucus, all of us said, no way that could happen because we know what tim pacts of this could be. it was terrible. >> i building on what she said i think that that's where the public weighs in and that's why people that care about -- they're protecting the pell grants and preserving social security and medicare and not playing games with the cost of
living adjustment and not raising the retirement age on medicare, the kinds of things that matter to people's lives that people have to weigh in and it's great that members of congress have spoken up and barb has been a leader in that and so has tom udall but we need the public engaged to make sure the president, the 08d fdr story, he met with a group of progressives. he said, i agree with you now make me do it. president obama is strong and focused but the public needs to keep him on the course and make sure the compromises don't break these promises. >> i think that's right. the issue is that if you look at washington and how broken it is, i think there's a crisis in governance that's we've gotten to because of the crisis in politics. the american people themselves are divided. there's been no price the republicans have been for this in washington so the republican house was re-elected. if you look at even the president's. >> with a million less votes than the democratic members of congress received. >> but still re-electnonetheles
there's isability the same kind of political pressure on the republicans to work with the president and get the kind of deals that would be good for the american people that you would hope for. >> and you made the opponent about how washington works. i want to talk about that was one of the theemt of the '08 election was not just substantive legislative accomplishment and substantive agenda including things around climate and the economy and health care it was also structural changes to how washington works. i want to talk if that's been abandoned or made good on. ♪ hi dad. many years from now,
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policy, but also changing the way washington works. right? that was a part of the 2008 theme. here he is in april of 2008 making the case. >> we've got to change how business is done in washington. the problem, we've got in washington has to be fixed. the problem of lobbyists and special interests and big money, dominating the agenda and the american people not being heard. >> and then, this is the president four years later in september of 2012 in an interview basically saying i learned you can't really change washington from the inside. take a look. >> one of the things i learned after four years is remained me that the change doesn't come from the inside. you got to change washington from the outside. you change it with the help of ordinary americans who are willing to have their voices heard. >> bill, i want to talk to you about this because that big money special interest quote in the beginning, right, the idea that big money and special interest dominate, the white house explicitly, we know they
negotiated with phrma and they negotiated with a lot of interests with regard to getting the affordable care act passed and you headed that up, a product of the citizens united decision that the president condemned in the state of the union, that a lot of democrats a decision a lot of people don't like there's now a 501 c 4 headed up by jim messina and it will use the same struck sure as karl rove's group. the question is, has the president acclimated himself to essentially playing by those rules. >> i love that you're trying to make bill the spokesperson for big money and special interest. >> i didn't do the super pac. he did it. don't look at me. >> you know what it's a big problem. there's too much money in politics and super pacs shouldn't exist and the way 5 0 1 cs allowed to be run is the fact
that they can spend $100 million trying to influence the presidential election -- and regular voex that are supposed to have the right to impact the political system, don't. what you see from the president is say realization that to paraphrase donald rumsfeld you're dealing with the rules that you have, not the rules you wish you had. so in this environment where republicans are spending hundreds of millions of dollars to try to defeat health care reform, you have to ask the question -- well, what are democrats going to do? who are progressives going to do to make sure our voices and values aren't droubed out because of the system we're in right now? >> you know what? we have to overturn citizens united. we need a constitutional amendment to do that and we need public financing of campaigns but i agree with bill. until we get there and the public has to push to get us there, we have to defeat some of the very -- this agenda that is really destroying the country and also, our democracy. it's making the voices of
ordinary people, what is happening now, this undisclosed corporate money in politics is shrinking the democratic process and allowing corporations to dominate the political agenda and the voices of the american people are being diminished. >> so what are we going to do bt it? you've been very outspoken open this. you saw a ton of outside money too come into your race. i feel like what ends up happening is issues we talk about it and we move on. i understand why we do it but we talk about it and move on to fighting over guns and imgreat lakes and these structural and procedural questions get sidelines. >> there's a couple of things we should do. the nra, we know, spent at least $700,000 on outside money. that's some of the only money that we can identify where it came from. they spend $40 million total. we, in part, made it, issue that it's the oil companies that are coming in and wall street coming in against me. and that's not necessarily heard by the voters that want to
reach, the low-information voters are likely not going to vote on that issue but that's tactally what you do in a campaign but when a number of democrats say -- we beat the big much this year it's not that big a deal. >> thank god. >> and thank god for bill burton but thank god, too, we had better candidate the around the country, look at north dakota and montana and missouri and indiana, we had better candidates. that's one of the reasons we wop. we had a better presidential candidate to be sure. that's one of the reasons we one and it was sort of the tiles. we had the auto rescue in the industrial midwest and what we had done withlily ledbetter, all of those issues. so i think -- >> you think there's a little come pl complacency about it? >> how we get an amendment is arduous, to put it mildly. we need to pursue a constitutional amendment and this is always a major issue and we have to continue to organize
around this and using this in talking about this, because our democracy can't sustain this kind of money. >> and we're continuing to organize, senator. i think one of the most important developments for progressives and all americans the fact that the president and his team have decide that they're going to go to obama 3.0, they're launching organizing for action to make it clear that 20 million americans that gave some measure of tlems themselves during if campaign will come to have their voices heard and their as separations expressed. in your clips, the real contrast is when barack obama walked into the white house in january of 2009, he was looking inward and thinking of how he was going to do this and now he appreciates that those 20 million americans and all americans have to walk through that door with him and have to come toage date and agitate and agitate. >> i think barack obama as president for the united states, for a lot of reasons and one of which is he got up at a small rally in semitic when he was a state senator and said, this war
in iraq is unwise. i think the president's arc in terms of national security policy and civil liberties very interesting over the first term. we'll talk with the only member of congress to vote against the authorization for the use of military fours a few weeks after september 11th, barbara lee, we'll talk about that after this break. with a will or living tr. and you'd like the help of an attorney. at legalzoom a legal plan attorney is available in most states with every personalized document to answer questions. get started at legalzoom.com today. and now you're protected. [ coughs ] ♪ [ male announcer ] you can't let a cold keep you up tonight. vicks nyquil -- powerful nighttime 6-symptom cold & flu relief. ♪ 6-symptom cold & flu relief. living with moderate to semeans living with pain.is it could also mean living with joint damage. humira, adalimumab, can help treat more than just the pain. for many adults, humira is clinically proven to help relieve pain
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ooh, i got it, i got it! (narrator) the calorie-smart nutrition in beneful healthy weight... includes grains and real chicken, because a healthy dog is a playful dog. beneful healthy weight. find us on facebook to help put more play in your day. as i said before if break, barbara lee, you voted against the authorization of the use of military force as a resolution voted on by both houses of congress in the wake of 9/11. and tlone number to do so and you've been very outspoken and called for the war in afghanistan to be drawn down and i'm curious, when you think about the president's trajectory on national security issues, what your sense is of where he is, taking the oath of office as he will be in just a little bit, now, as opposed to four years ago. >> certainly, the president has changed direction from the previous bush administration as
it relates to global peace and security and, yes, i had the vote against that resolution which was the authorization to use force. it was a blank check. it just said, the president, any president, is authorized to use force, any time, any place, against any nation, any individual, any organization he or she deems connected to 9/11. that was a blank check. and so we have to repeal that. i want to repeal it and i'm working toward that. i think this president ended the war in reerk. he made that commitment with regard to afghanistan he's drawn down and there's some of us in a bipartisan way. hundreds of members of congress wrote to the president and said you need to expedite this. there's no military solution. we need to bring our young men and women home right away in a safe and orderly fashion. don't wait until 2014. let's begin this now and the billions and trillions of dollars that are being invested. >> i think the american public more and more would emphasize
what barbara said about investing in this country. we now how willfully inadd kwaet our infrastructure is as a nation. water, sewer, highways, broaden band, community colleges, all the things we need to do better. i give the president credit. i wanted him to wind down faster in iraq and afghanistan than he did but he did it responsibly and he did it generally the right way. i think another point of what the president's done is he really took foreign policy off the table politically in this country for democrats, which no democratic candidate or incumbent has done. >> off the table because of the broad popularity? >> in terms of that he had enough consensus in his policy the democrats couldn't be attacked as being weak on defense which has been a problem for more than a generation. that allowed all of us to focus more on domestic issues and that's a good thing. some of the ways he did it so sometimes i don't always agree with but i think the success measured that way is pretty significant. >> well, i mean, i've been
someone on that program, quite critical of the national security policy of this administration. i should note sometimes it guessed glossed over. iraq was the defining political battle of the formative years of a lot of people in this country. and the president did end the war in iraq, a promise he made he got done. once the war in iraq was finished it was looking like a fait accompli but it wubts necessarily obvious in 2008 that the war would end and if john mccain has been elected -- >> we might be somewhere else. >> a big twiens between 2008 and 2012 is that in '08 we had a big debate about iraq. and that's why he's president now in large part but in 2012, because mitt romney seated foreign policy to barack obama and the republicans have come off if not weak, at least, with the president on a lot of the things he's for, the american people i think, lost out on what's usually a very important part of a presidential election
which is air debate about some of the big things that america is doing on their behalf. whether it the drone program or afghanistan or whatever it is, we didn't really talk about it that much because there was mostly agreement. >> republicans reduced the foreign policy conversation to whether or not the president was on an apology tour. >> and mitt romney and i said this sitting at the anchor test on the night of the third debate where mitt romney basically agreed more than hi disagreed and said, yeah, wreshd debate these things. disagreement is important. >> can i just say, we need to -- in this context, look at the pentagon's budget now and really understand that we can save quite a bit of money. the cost savings to the pentagon are enormous and when we talk about sequester and when we talk about investment in jobs, we need to go to the pentagon. we can keep a strong national security without -- we can have these savings and maintain a strong national -- >> and the president made the case during the campaign and the
final point i would make here and to return what you're saying, we have seen something, i think, similar to what happened when truman gave way to eisenhower which was the passing of the time of the cold war from one party to the next and the national security act passed under truman that created this architecture that's persist since and we still have if national security council we've seen a war on terror, even though it not called that, passed from a republican president to a democratic president and i think repealing the authorization to use military force is a key step for congress to assert its prerogative and to declare that that era is over even if al qaeda is not totally vanquished we're moving to an important place and i think that's important for viewers to keep their eyes on to follow. what area should know coming up next. personalized information and rewards for addressing my health risks. but she's still going to give me a heart attack. that's health in numbers. unitedhealthcare.
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ahead. first, a personal update. i will moderate a panel from the obama administration at new york university this wednesday, january 23rd. it starts at 4:30 p.m. for more information go to facebook.com/upwi facebook.com/upwithchris. like us. it's weird to say that, but that's how it goes. what you should know for the week coming up. if you want a response for the white house from the we the people website, you have to get more signatures. when we the people was launched in 2011, they were required to get 5,000 signatures before they got a white house response. it grew in popularity then it was pushed up to 25,000. with continued viral growth, the white house will, from this point forward require 100,000 signatures before requiring a response. it won't be for those already
posted to the site. including the one to remove district attorney carmen ortiz. this tuesday marks the 40th anniversary of the roe v. wade decision for women to have a constitutional right to terminate their own pregnancies. 63% of americans are opposed to overturning row v. wade with 29% favoring scrapping the decision. it's similar to that from 20 years ago. somewhat remarkably, 48% of republicans -- 48% of republicans don't want roe overturned more than the 46% who do. in march, 2006 only a third of poll respondents said abortion was not that important. this last poll, a slim majority said that. those aged 18 to 29 didn't know
or could not identify the roe v. wade decision. finally, you should know the president will be sworn into office because the constitution requires it to happen on january 20th. at least as far back as president eisenhower, when it falls on a sunday, the president is sworn in on a quiet ceremony with the big one held the next day. we will have live coverage later this morning on the mhp program. we will cover the big ceremony, the inauguration parade and more here on msnbc tomorrow beginning at 10:00 a.m. eastern time and continuing with special coverage throughout the day. magically, i am now back in my seat. i want to find out what my guests think we should know for the week coming up. patrick? >> richard blanco is the poet.
the search for unified national identity. it's interesting a young, cuban american is going to say who we are and where we are going. in the words of his poem, let nut thag happened here be forgotten by us. >> richard also an engineer. >> yep. >> you should know more about the $8 billion bank settlement. i did a series of round tables in ohio this week, talked to a lot of people who wrongfully have been foreclosed on. there's thought the $8 billion fees the banks are paying could be deductible against their federal taxes as were the dollars bp paid for the clean up. it's something congress needs to stop if it comes to that. at the same time, the largest six banks and the power they have, we need to break up the banks. >> i agree. congresswoman? >> you should know in 2005, i pulled together several members
in congress to form a caucus. we realize the economic policies and foreign policies of the bush administration would lead to a spike in poverty. unfortunately, now 50 million people are living in poverty. 16 million are children. we passed a bipartisan resolution to cut it in half now we need a national strike that di- and plan to end poverty. it's a shame and disgrace 50 people in america are living in poverty. >> real fast, when the roe v. wade decision came down, the lead sentence of the story was finally settling a long contentious policy debate in america. not so much. >> nut sg settled in politics. i want to thank my guests today. bill burton, sherrod brown. thank you all. our thanks to everyone here at the washington bureau for amazing hospitality during our
visit this weekend. thank you at home for joining us. we'll be back in new york next weekend. next is the one and only melissa harris-perry. join us for msnbcs inauguration day coverage tomorrow. see you next week here on "up." ♪ pop goes the world pop in a whole new kind of clean with tide pods. just one pac has the stain removal power of six caps of the bargain brand. pop in. stand out. nothing. are you stealing our daughter's school supplies and taking them to work? no, i was just looking for my stapler and my... this thing. i save money by using fedex ground and buy my own supplies. that's a great idea. i'm going to go... we got clients in today. [ male announcer ] save on ground shipping