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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  June 24, 2013 11:00pm-12:01am PDT

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important thing, lawrence, it's not only ending women's safe access to legal abortion, a lot of these planned parenthood centers provide a whole other centers provide a whole other range of health care as well. and that's what we're beginning to see, people are beginning to connect the dots here, even if where's waldo? let's play "hardball." >> good evening. i'm chris matthews up in boston. anyway, we're up here at quincy market to mark tomorrow's special election for the united states senate. in just a few minutes, we're going to be joined by the democratic candidate, massachusetts congressman edward markey up here.
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first let me start with this. you can tell a lot about someone by knowing where they're headed in life. when edward snowden went public with his u.s. intelligence surveillance program, he struck a mixed chord with the american people. some on the right join some on the left to see him as a hero. others on the right called him a traitor. many on the center and left questioned his motives, even as they were gladdened to see light shed on what this country is doing in the cause of fighting terrorism. the question tonight is simpler. where is he? and what does that tell us about his purpose, his loyalties, his values, his future? david corn is washington bureau chief for mother jones magazine and msnbc analyst. and michael isikoff is nbc's national investigative correspondent. here's what we know about snowden's travels as of this moment. he left his home in hawaii in may and went to hong kong. he stayed until sunday when with the help of wikileaks he fled to russia. that's where is he still believed to be. he had reportedly booked a flight to havana, cuba, with the final destination of ecuador.
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but snowden never boarded that plane this morning, and it's unclear what his plans really are. let's go to michael isikoff, who is always good at these questions. where is edward snowden and where is he headed? >> well, i was on the conference call, chris, with julian assange of wikileaks today. he said snowden is in a safe place and in high spirits. so look, the u.s. government believes he's in moscow. he was thought to have been -- that he was going to take that plane to havana. he wasn't on it. the seat was empty. assange would not say where he is. would not say where he's headed. we do know that he's applied for asylum with ecuador. and iceland and possibly other countries. assange would not say what those other countries were. we did -- did he say that, because the question was asked, his passport has been revoked. how is he traveling that he
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received something called a refugee document of passage from the ecuadorian government, sort of shades of casablanca here. but how far that will take him, where it will take him we still don't know. we do know assange did say, because there was some question about how is he traveling. and assange did say at one point we paid for those arrangements. that is his flight from hong kong. so he's clearly embraced wikileaks here or wikileaks has embraced him and he's traveling to governments that are, to say the least, not friends of the united states. >> let me go to david on this because when most people travel, they have three facts with them. they have three facts with them. they've got money to travel. they've got a passport, and they have a destination. it's kind of murky because even at the ecuadorian government for
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its own strange reasons wants to give him a document, physically, how did they get to it hong kong? a passport is a piece of paper. it exists. it's a document. it isn't some e-mail. how do they get it to him and who's paying for the trips he's taking basically around the world here? third, where do you think he's going to end up? >> it seems ecuador is working with wikileaks. they are harboring julian assange in the embassy in london. so it seems to me if they're working with wikileaks, they may want to get some sort of travel document to snowden, if he is stuck in the moscow airport right now, they probably can find someone at the embassy, somebody to do that. you know, wikileaks does have some financial backers. i'm not sure we know who they are, but clearly they're using some of their funds. michael ratner who works for the center for constitutional rights, a civil liberties group in new york city that obviously has some financial support to keep going is involved in the case. so i have no question that there are people out there who would give money to wikileaks to help edward snowden get to wherever he wants to get.
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at the same time now, we have this diplomatic standoff. we don't know how much pressure or what's going on between russia and the united states in terms of keeping him from leaving russia. and if he transits through havana, from my perspective, i don't think that's very good pr for edward snowden. he is a guy that talks of media freedoms and transparency, yet right now he is really relying on the help of countries that have been very anti-media, ecuador in particular has had very restrictive press freedoms, and the president there has been basically at war with independent media. so there are a lot of wrinkles to this very, very dramatic and sort of interesting to watch case that i think is far from over at this point. >> let's take a look what the secretary of state john kerry, he's traveling in india right now. here he is commenting on the irony, as you pointed out, the countries that snowden has chosen to rely on as he evades justice, if you want to call it justice. let's watch. >> i wonder if mr. snowden chose
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china and russia as assistants in his flight from justice because they're such powerful bastions of internet freedom. and i wonder if while he was in either of those countries he raised the questions of internet freedoms, since that seems to be what he champions. >> you know, michael isikoff, not everybody gets the money from their friends. they get the money anywhere they can get it. is this guy basically on the lam? is he running so hard he'll take help from anybody even countries that don't wish us well like russia and china? and certainly ecuador now. is he relying on the kindness of strangers or is he a person that is allied politically with the countries helping him? it's the question a lot of americans would like the answer to. >> there was nothing in what he had said publicly prior to all in that indicated he had any particular sympathies for the chinese government or the cuban government or the russian government.
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so look, he has been criminally charged by the united states. one in that position who does not wish to face american justice would take help from whoever they could get it. i think he said there was something else, you know, david mentioned before that being allied with the ecuadorians and others who are enemies or not exactly friends of press freedom might undercut his credibility. he said something else today or at least was quoted as saying something else today that could further undermine his credibility a bit. the south china post posted a story quoting him saying he only took the job as an nsa contractor so he could get access to nsa secrets and help expose them. so that does undermine a bit the idea that having seen the invasions of privacy by the nsa caused him to become a whistleblower.
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>> okay. let me go over to michael, over to david on this. what does that tell you? i'm not sure it tells me anything. suppose the guy says i'm going into some organization to do espionage on them because my hunch is they're doing stuff they shouldn't be doing. why does that make him less a whistleblower the fact that he went to the job with booz allen so that he could penetrate the nsa? why is that a bad thing? >> i'm not sure if it's a bad thing, but if his story was i was doing any job and i discovered something that was wrong, and therefore i felt compelled to release it, that's different than saying i'm going to knowingly sort of lie to get into a position because, you know, he has to sign a nondisclosure, you know, confidentiality agreements, and he did all that stuff. so it probably makes it harder for him legally. i'm sure -- i'm not sure he's going to face trial but a lot of what he's doing the past few days is not going to help him if he should reach trial. one thing he has to worry about too, if he's getting help from the russians right now, you know, are they asking him for
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anything in return. that could really change a lot of his legal standing in the case that the u.s. is going to put against him too. so it's -- he's in a very difficult position that he put himself in. and there are a lot of complicated issues here. and, you know, he may not even be able to get out of the moscow airport for god knows how long. >> including the charge some people are making in the press that he was told by the chinese if he wanted to get out of hong kong, he had to download his entire stash of information off his computer. anyways, this is an interesting case of politics making strange bedfellows. here we have rand paul, a libertarian man of the right who has been somewhat sympathetic to snowden. he had a strong warning, however, for him today. let's listen to his change of party. >> for mr. snowden, if he cozies up to the russian government, it will be nothing but bad for his name in history. if he goes to an independent third country like iceland, and if he refuses to talk to any sort of formal government about this, i think there is a chance
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that he'll be seen as an advocate of privacy. if he cozies up to either the russian government, the chinese government or any of these governments perceived still as enemies of ours, i think that that will be a real problem for him in history. >> what's so interesting is how people are coalescing. here is senator dianne feinstein, chairman of the senate intelligence committee, what you might call an establishment liberal democrat. here's her reaction to what we're watching. >> i want to get him caught. and brought back for trial. and i think we need to know exactly what he has. he could have a lot, lot more. it may really put people in jeopardy. >> and here's the republican chairman of the house intelligence committee. it all sounds similarly sympathetic to -- actually, unsympathetic to snowden at this point. here's mike rogers. >> they should use every legal avenue we have to bring him back to the united states. if he really believes he did
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something good, he should get on a plane, come back and face the consequences. >> you know, mike isikoff, it's beginning to sound like the cops against the robbers. everybody in a position of authority and understanding u.s. intelligence and guarding it is now angry with this guy. i guess the real libertarian right and the very left on the democratic side, the left side if you will, are still sympathetic with this guy. its an interesting division in loyalties. >> can i just say something, chris, particularly about senator feinstein's comments. she's been a hawk on this. she's a hard liner on it. and yet one of the news that came out of the house intelligence committee hearing last week is that general alexander, the head of nsa acknowledged that the nsa is now reviewing that use of section 215 of the patriot act for this massive precollection of all phone calls in the united states which was probably the single most shocking thing that snowden revealed. and when pressed on that, when i
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pressed the nsa on that as to why they were doing this review, they said senator feinstein in a closed session of the intelligence committee asked the nsa to do that. in other words, she was disturbed enough by what snowden revealed even though she would have been briefed on all this to request a review and see whether it was really necessary. couldn't the nsa just wait for when it had evidence about possible terror ties of somebody in the united states and then go to the phone companies and then get the information rather than collecting tens of millions of phone records in the united states, storing it in a massive database for five years without any evidence of any connection to terrorism. so for all her and other hard liners on the hill, you know, calling for snowden to be fully prosecuted he has initiated some change within the u.s. government. and that's worth noting. >> what's also interesting here, chris, is that was his intent.
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he said i wanted to start a debate. i wanted to get people thinking about this in its public and on capitol hill. but yet, because of all the drama the last few days of his flight and the human interest story he's created himself now by going public -- he didn't have to go public. remember, he chose to go public. he has now made the story more about him than about these great issues that mike just talked about and that we were talking about last week, and that i hope we continue to talk about. the debate has been muddied up with whether he is working with the russians, what is happening with ecuador. and that's really because snowden decided to go public and do all this in a very -- in front of the whole world. >> well, i'll say one thing for edward snowden. he knows how to get press. this guy's traveling around the world like d.b. cooper or where's waldo. we're going to keep following him around the country. check your papers in the morning so see where he is. david corn as always, thank you, michael isikoff, the best investigator around. coming up, tomorrow's big senate race up here in massachusetts. tonight what the democrats are doing to protect the senate and
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prevent a two-house takeover by the republicans come 2014. this is "hardball," the place for politics.
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well, we're expecting a number of big decisions this week from the supreme court, but today the court passed on a chance to decide the constitutionality of affirmative action itself by a vote of 7-1. the court said it challenged an affirmative action program at the university of texas back to a lower court, ducking the big question whether affirmative action itself is constitutional, and disappointing the obama administration and other supporters who wanted to see it upheld. we'll be right back. 
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i've got to have a folks in the united states senate who are willing to stand up for working people just like i have.
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i need folks in the united states senate who every day are waking up thinking about the people who sent them there and trying to figure out how do i make sure that they are getting a brighter future? that's who ed markey is. i need ed markey in the united states senate. >> welcome back to "hardball." we're up here in quincy market in boston, massachusetts for the big race tomorrow. that was of course president obama at a recent campaign event for massachusetts senate candidate ed markey. he's sitting with me right now. he's received heavyweight endorsements that include the president, the vice president, bill clinton, the former president, of course, he recently stumped for markey and the campaign's playing in a big way his new web video out today. let's watch. >> you have as well qualified a person to send to the united states senate as has been nominated by our party in any state in a month of sundays. in area after area after area, ed markey knows what he is doing.
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>> tomorrow night, ed markey faces voters here as massachusetts plays host to a rare special election. it's being held to replace the vacancy left by john kerry. it's a critical race. the majority in is down to 54 seats thanks to christie's appointment of a republican to fill lautenberg's seat. five are retiring next year. the polls have markey enjoying a fairly sizable lead, about ten points against the challenger gomez. in today's suffolk poll, markey was up seven points, 17 points in may. markey's lead las ranged from plus 3 to plus 20. the trend is clear. the "huffington post" shows markey with a consistent lead over the latest. their latest has him at ten. joining me right now is himself massachusetts congressman and dean of the delegation and senate candidate democrat ed markey. congressman, what is it like to
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have obama come up and campaign for you, bill clinton campaign for you. michelle obama come up and campaign for you and last but not least, caroline kennedy? >> you know, this is political central. we're in boston. we're the hub of the universe. to have all of those superstars come in, absolutely means the world to me where we got the bruins trying to get the stanley cup. all we really read is the political section and the sports section up here in boston. >> i know. >> for me to have all of those superstars in really has been something that i never would have thought in my life it could have happened. >> let me talk to you about this city. i've been watching boston for a long time trying to figure it out. i want culture from you. you're from this area. when new york was hit on 9/11, the reaction was we're going to get those s.o.b.s. boston had a somewhat nuanced reaction. mainly, it was get the people to the hospital. let's take care of our own. look out for our own. let's support the police. it was very not to sound too lefty about, communitarian.
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what is the boston mentality, the massachusetts mentality. what is different? >> no, i would say we have pretty much the same reaction. >> you're like new york? >> in the same way that the first responders in new york headed towards the trouble, the same thing happened here. we had the first responders heading towards where the bombing occurred. we had ordinary citizens responding in extraordinary ways heading towards the bombing. i think the same thing happened in both cities. i think it brought out the best of both cities and i think in that way, we're just americans. we're responding as human beings. the fact that we don't like the yankees or the rangers or the knicks is separate from when a catastrophe happens, how we respond to human suffering. >> okay. here is the bigger question. right now, we're coming off the news now. edward snowden is like a where's waldo. everybody is trying to decide whether they like him or don't like him. people on the fringes made up their mind if they like him or don't like him. 90% of the country is trying to figure out if they like him. do you think he's a good guy or bad guy? >> i think that we've got to be
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tough on terrorism but we can't trample the constitution. so i think like any other person that engages in civil disobedience as martin luther king said, he's got to pay the price. he should go to jail. he broke the law. at the same time he's opened up a big, big debate in our country, the line between privacy and security. we have to make sure that while the police, while the national security agency is looking for a guilty needle, that the tens of millions of americans who have their haystack of innocent information, their phone calls, their internet records are not compromised unless there is a legally obtained warrant. >> do you think they are? >> i'm not sure. i don't think we really know whether or not there are standards in place to truly protect the innocent. and we need to have that debate in washington. and to that extent, this is a very important discussion to have. i've been the founder and cochair of the privacy caucus in congress. but i've also been a member of the homeland security committee.
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we need to do both and we can do both simultaneously. >> would you like to have it where i was struck by the other day a week or two ago when the story broke about the nsa, that u.s. senators like ron wyden, do you know, from oregon. >> very well. >> he would come out and say i don't know anything about this thing. is it possible they're relying on checks and balances if u.s. senators who are smart like wyden don't know what's going on? is there enough information getting to the as you know it. >> we no longer live in and analog world. we live in a fiberoptic world. the capacity to gather information is a thousand times greater than it was. >> are we getting the information? >> i'm not sure we fully understand what the safeguards are to protect against the compromise of innocent information. that's one of the reasons i want to go to the senate to play that role in helping to create that balance. >> you've had the bombing up here at the marathon. basically the bad guys struck one of the great traditions up here. let's talk about violence in this country.
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i don't understand some of this stuff. i understand deer hunting in pennsylvania where i grew up, i understand that, getting a shotgun out or a rifle with a couple of rounds in it. i don't understand people that want to have semi-automatic weapons in hand. i don't understand why mississippi as of tomorrow will have open carry without even a license. every single person in mississippi can now be matt dillon. or the other side of matt dillon. he can be the bad guy, walking around with guns, showing off. what's massachusetts' view of guns? >> well, massachusetts is not west virginia. we're not pennsylvania. we're not the laggard. we're the leader. yeah, we need background checks and now senators from those states can support that. we don't know the why assault weapons should be on the streets. >> your opponents for assault weapons? >> my opponent says that assault weapons should not be banned. my opponent supports high capacity magazines. i asked him in the debate last week where would a civilian in massachusetts need a weapon that could shoot 100 bullets in under
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two minutes. and he has no answer for it. later he said it was for fun. but the problem is that those guns would be in the hands of people who would be causing harm to families not just here in massachusetts, but across the country. i want to go down to the fight the nra on the issue of assault weapons and high capacity magazines. they both should be banned. >> we invited mr. gomez on the show. we invited him next time but he didn't want to show. let me ask you about -- >> what? >> violence is not a country. it's england. >> oh, good. >> okay. this doesn't make any sense. look, i'll be right down there in a minute, okay? i'll let you talk. give me a minute. >> welcome to boston, chris. >> it's great, it's great. >> democracy in action. >> let me ask you about turnout. these special elections, i saw the polls. you saw the polls. you can't poll. there are so few of them there is no history. how do you get people out to break their focus on the bruins and the cup and focus on this thing and why should they? >> over the last four days, we have made 400 door knocks, i
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mean three million doorknocks or telephone calls to voters in massachusetts. you're right. people in massachusetts are not used to having an election in a 97 degree day in the end of june. it's all about get out the vote. i've been crisscrossing the state. we've been making the personal contacts. we've been trying to separate the two candidates on the issue of gun control. on a woman's right to choose, on wall street reform, all the way down the line. we think we have done that, and we're ready to get our vote out on election day tomorrow. >> congressman markey. >> thank you. thank you very much. >> thank you. if you're a voter in massachusetts, make sure you go to the polls tomorrow or else you don't matter. this is "hardball," the place for politics.
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all right. we're back here at quincy market with all the people here and getting a little point of view. this is a real touristy spot. a lot of the people are from massachusetts but some nearby rhode island. what do you think about this senate race? >> i would not vote for mr. markey. >> why? >> oh, boo. >> i know. see, i'm from rhode island risks you a republican? >> i am a republican. >> boo. >> well, it makes sense. it makes sense. >> so i don't count. >> actually, i am a republican by registry. >> yeah. >> i am fiscally conservative. and socially liberal. >> and who did you vote for in the presidential election last time? >> i did vote for mr. romney. >> who did you vote for? >> i voted for mr. romney and the year before that, i voted for mr. mccain. >> so you're a republican? big deal. your standard issue. you're fine. you're fine. >> i work for the legislature. i knew eddie markey when he was a state rep. >> and? >> i like him. i knew why he got moved out of the office. i knew the kid who moved his desk.
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and that got elected him to congress. >> they can tell me where to sit, they can't tell me where to stand. >> there were ten democrats and five republicans running in that primary. >> his fight with mcgee i remember. >> what do you think? >> i wonder why what you think about how riled up the left is about snowden? >> well, it's mixed. there's some people in the net roots very upset about it. they're for him. they like assange and like him. they're basically questioning the establishment. there are other people like me, i find this a hard one because i want to know what he told me. but a lot of times people do things, you don't like them but you like what they did because you learn more. nobody else told me what was going on. feinstein didn't tell me. this guy did. >> what's your sense of what the country thinks? >> i think the country's mixed. they know the law. >> it's a hard one. >> it's a tricky thing. remember, we hung john brown, and he was fighting slavery. so it's complicated.
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>> speaking of slavery, i'd like to say something to address president obama and mr. markey. standing in the cradle of liberty in the hub in boston, i would like to see the declaration of independence read to the people of this country so these people could understand what it means that we shouldn't have had slavery. women should have always been able to vote and everybody should have equal rights. >> i'm a big fan of the declaration. >> an asian president, a gay president, a woman president, anybody. >> well, we're getting there. >> i'm from new jersey, but i'm a democrat. and i love it because they work for the people. >> okay, thank you. anybody else here? >> yeah, i'm from michigan. this is our first trip to boston, the cradle of liberty and freedom. i'm left of center. i guess i like the guy. >> thank you. by the way, that's faneuil hall. does everybody remember? in 1960, that's where john kennedy spoke to the american people the night before the election. i remember walking. i had never heard of faneuil hall before. >> incredible. >> any more thoughts. anymore thoughts? you sir?
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you're well dressed. >> i just -- i'll speak -- i'm from massachusetts. but i guess i feel as if for those people who are trying to do the right thing, they should live with the consequences. back in the 1960s was willing to go to jail and stood trial because it was the right thing to do. >> okay. i think we heard that from markey already tonight. take your punishment. all right. we'll be right back with more. ,
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>> welcome back to "hardball." a north carolina, a grass-roots protesters gathered today as they do every monday now to push back against the state's ironclad republican control. in both houses and the governorship. they're getting national attention protesting gop cuts to social programs and refuse toll expand medicaid, something we've given a lot of attention here on "hardball," efforts to suppress the black vote, which could
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include photo ids and elimination of same-day registration. judith browne dianis heads the advancement project and has helped to organize the protests. this is a very important issue. tell me what you think is the worst thing that's going on in these state houses controlled by both houses controlled by republicans and in many cases 24 cases they've got the governorship, as well. they're able to do whatever they want to manipulate the electorate. >> that's right, chris. this is the first time that the republicans have actually held on to both houses in north carolina and the governor's mansion since 1870. so what they did is when they won all of those houses, they decided to move an agenda of extremism, an agenda that not only hurts working families by not expanding medicaid, but cutting off unemployment
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benefits, and then moving to give a tax credit to the 23 wealthiest families in the state, and then add to that they're going to try and cut back voting rights at the same time so that people won't be heard when the next election comes. so this is the kind of extremism we see when they take over both houses of the legislature and the governor's mansion. and what is great about north carolina is north carolinians are standing up against this extremism. >> what's extraordinary to people who watch this program, who know what's going on in politics is these are states in many cases that voted for alabama. and yet because the way people voted in 2010, maybe the democrats were just sitting on their butts, but whatever happened, the conservative movements in this country and the hard right movement were able to grab control of the levers, deciding who votes, deciding how money was spent. enormous power, even in states that we call blue or purple. how does that happen? >> that's right. you know, of course, in 2010, we
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had republicans really did a yeoman's job of creating, of using redistricting in order to gain their own power in the future. then in 2012, what we saw was when people turned out in 2008 and 2012 republicans said wait a second, what is happening here and started to try and pass restrictive voting laws. and in north carolina, they were able to grab the governor's mansion. now we have -- we're starting to see the agenda that they wanted to put in place because they're finally in power. so you know, at the end of the day, what is great about what is happening is that while they have been able to get control and let's not forget how much money they have put into politics to winning these elections. you know, in north carolina, you know, we have the koch brothers all over the country. in north carolina it only takes one guy, his name is art pope and he can buy and sell the legislature.
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and at the same time, on the other side of the coin we have the people. and the people are standing up against big money. and the people, if you look at that movement in north carolina, it is a locally grown organic movement that started in 2007, has continued through now with the north carolina naacp at the helm of it, and really bringing together people across racial lines, across economic lines. the people who are being arrested are doctors and nurses. they're teachers. they're firemen. you name it. we've had city councilmen from varsities throughout the state being arrested because people are saying no to this agenda of extremism, no, you will not cut a gaping hole in the safety net for north carolinians, and we're not going back to where we were. >> let's take a look at the state of play now. republicans control both houses of the legislature. plus the governorship as i said
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in 24 states now. that's nearly half the states obviously under total republican control. state house at both legislatures. democrats have the same power in just 14 states. so i get there's a couple of messages here. i don't know whether protests work. you think they do. i think voting works. i think unless you get democrats especially minorities and young people to understand, you can't be a sprinter in politics. you've got to be a long distance runner. >> that's right. >> you can't just vote in presidential elections and feel satisfied because the government's being taken away from you. >> that's right. but chris, here's the thing. you can't just vote but in between you have to be engaged. and that's what is happening in north carolina. the forward together movement is keeping people engaged during these off years, right? too off we focus on just, you know, going to the election cycle, going to the booth. we vote and then we leave. well, in fact, what we need to do is be engaged. we need to watch these state legislatures. as you said, they have taken over so many state legislatures they're passing regressive laws that are harming working families and the poor, that are
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really dividing our country. and so instead, what we've got to do is in north carolina, they've taken the path of moral mondays and protesting. but it's about gaining momentum. because what's going to happen in north carolina is we'll start with these protests, but the north carolina naacp, democracy north carolina, and others are ready to register people to vote because they're going to show their voices when they go into the voting booth. >> anything you can do to juice up the voters and the citizenship of this country is good for everybody. thank you, judith for joining us on moral monday. >> thanks, chris. up next, what the democrats here in massachusetts are doing to protect that seat in tomorrow's special election here. this is "hardball," the place for politics. before we do any major projects on our home... we do a ton of research on angie's list. at angie's list, you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. with angie's list,
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the president of south africa says nelson mandela remains in critical condition. president jacob zuma is asking the president to pray for mandela, and says doctors are doing everything possible to help mandela feel comfortable. mandela has been in the hospital now for 17 days, suffering with a recurring lung infection. zuma also said president obama will go ahead with his visit to south africa later this week. and we'll be right back.
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we're back here in massachusetts from quincy's market. quincy's market is a great place to visit right now. we've got two people very identified with the commonwealth of massachusetts, people that know the state very well. the widow of senator ted kennedy, vicki kennedy. she is here with me right now. vicki, thank you for coming. >> of course. >> and we've got tommy o'neill, who is getting to be frighteningly resembling his dad, tip o'neill. i was fortunate to work for him awhile. vicki, this whole question in massachusetts and trying to get to the bottom of the state, ted kennedy was always re-elected
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because it wasn't because he was a celebrity, it was because he worked for the state. >> well, massachusetts is just a wonderful, fabulous place to live, and people are concerned about is the same things they're concerned about around the country. they're concerned about their families. they're concerned about their futures. i've been lucky enough to travel around recently on behalf of ed markey. we have an election tomorrow for the united states senate. ed markey is on the ballot. i hope everyone will go out and vote. it's very, very important for their futures. i've been hearing the same things i heard when i was traveling around the state with ted. people are worried about their futures. they're worried about what kind of future their children will have, what kind of future they will have. and those are the issues people are talking about. those are the issues ed markey's been talking about. >> you know, tommy, the state, when i went to school up here, this other place, holy cross back in the '60s, this place wasn't doing so well. with the help of government money and education and health care, the big hospitals, big universities like m.i.t., bc, harvard and all the rest of
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them, your dad and ted kennedy showed how government can make a place like this grow and prosper. >> let me say something where vicki left off. the state historically and these folks if you level with the people, they'll follow you. we're back here in massachusetts, from quincy's market, by the quincy market. a great place to visit right now. more progressive, perhaps, than even they are. because they believe in them, because they understand that direction and that leadership is going to show to a higher ground, they're going to elect them. that's her point about eddie markey. he's done exactly the same thing. levels with them. >> ted kennedy was known as mr. health care for decades and got in with his signature at the end. obama, is that an issue of this campaign? >> it's a huge issue. i saw ed markey push this issue. i was lucky enough to work with him on pushing this issue over the finish line. you know, when teddy, in his last days, he knew he wasn't going to be here to see health
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care become a reality. those of us who loved him committed ourselves to making sure it became a reality. ed markey was one of those people. i sat in his office with him. as he had papers in front of him. as he had the strategy in front of him. how we were going to get this to work for the people. how we were going to take care of children. how we were going to take care of seniors. how we were going to take care of families to make sure that no family was going to have to suffer and lose insurance when they got sick. how health care was going to be a right for everyone. and ed markey was as committed to that as anyone i have ever seen. and with his hard work, along with the other members of the house of representatives, that passion was turned into law. and i -- and that's the same commitment he brings to all the issues he works on. that's why i'm so passionate about supporting him. >> upsets are still possible. the state doesn't always vote democrat. republicans governor, people
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like that, pretty popular guys over the years. >> two good pieces of news tonight, bergeron is going to play for the bruins, number one. eddie markey is going to carry the vote tomorrow with 8% to 10% of the vote. he's been a workhorse in the u.s. house of representatives for years. he's not a show boat. he's a workhorse. he's filed legislation, provided leadership. every issue, every measure you can give a man over 37 years in the u.s. house of representatives. the key here is that you're going to have environmentalists, going to have women, you're going to have latinos supporting eddie markey tomorrow. latinos against a man who is a latino, supported, by the way, in this town, by the only latino newspaper supporting eddie markey. there's a reason for it. the other guy hasn't said or done anything. there's no girth there. >> he's got some points of view. he's for the rights of people to have semiautomatic rifles. he doesn't want a ban, doesn't want a ban on the big 30-round magazines. he wants it completely up to -- anybody can have that stuff.
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he doesn't believe in any kind of gun control. >> if you can believe that, and understand that he has that standard, he thinks he's right, then he tells eddie markey not to use a slaughter in a school in connecticut as an issue because it's unfair. i'd say there's something wrong with him. >> i think he's out of step with the people of massachusetts on that issue. without question. we have in this state some of the strongest fun safety laws on the books of any state in the country and we have the lowest fun deaths in the country. and there's a reason for it. even though we have porous borders. and here we have a candidate who says that it's okay, that it's fine, to have high-capacity magazines, a weapon that can fire 100 rounds in 2 minutes. i think that's out of step with the people of massachusetts. ed markey has been on the cutting edge. he has been a positive voice for safety.
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not just gun safety, not just common sense gun safety, but internet safety. protecting our children online. for protecting our privacy in our cell phones, in our medical records. he's been on the cutting edge, forward thinking, thinking about problems really before we've thought about them. >> what do you make of this focus up here? i know, we're up here for a reason because this state, this commonwealth, surprised the country when they elected scott brown a while back. what happens, is it the bad candidate, democratic side, who's not that strong of a candidate, doesn't connect with the people? how do these upsets concern? there's a big concern, the reason obama's been up here, biden's been up here, caroline kennedy's been up here, mrs. obama has been up here. >> ed markey is going to take all the support he can find and put it to work so he wins tomorrow, number one. number two, scott brown is a candidate who had given 20 years of service in the state legislature. he was an individual who knew
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who he was. he knew where he stood on the issues. this guy has a campaign. i dare say he came into this race not expecting to win it. and not completely understanding who he was when he got the nomination. >> governor, you have a great voice for politics. you should go into it again. tommy o'neal. former lieutenant governor. and vicki kennedy. thank you for being here. we'll be right back from boston. after this. [ female announcer ] the best thing about this bar
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let me finish tonight with this. i have an easy proposal to make. when you're about to vote in an election, think about what you believe, then think about what the candidate believes. if it's different, be careful. let me put it this way, if you don't vote your beliefs in the voting booth, why would you count on someone else voting for them on the floor of the u.s. senate later in there are a good number of politicians in this country i like but would probably never vote for. i like the first president bush. i like gerald ford. i like bob dole. i like them all as people but never voted for them. if the majority of other people voted for them, i'd wish them well but wouldn't vote to reelect them. i've come to believe the best reaction to liking or disliking a candidate is to be honest about it, say good things about the ones you like but vote for the one who will vote like you do otherwise you end up with a senator that makes you angry. not just how he votes but how you voted. politicians like most people don't off change so if you see a candidate votes like you do, you better vote for him because the people who don't agree with you are sure as heck voting for other guy. most important, get out there
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and vote. if you don't, things are going to get done the way the other people think they should. they're not sitting around thinking about what you would like done. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. good evening, from new york. i'm chris hayes. and thank you for joining us. tonight on "all in" the trial of george stimerman. charged with a second-degree murder of the florida teen trayvon martin has begun in florida. we'll have a full report on the riveting opening arguments and possibly the worst and most awkward knock-knock joke ever told. also tonight, it might not surprise you to hear that supreme court justice clarence thomas really doesn't like affirmative action. you might be a bit taken aback by his opinion today in which he compares justifications for affirmative action to justifications for slavery.