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tv   Lockup  MSNBC  November 16, 2013 7:00pm-8:01pm PST

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due to mature subject matter, viewer discretion is advised. ♪ the shocking execution style murder of four women results in two arrests. >> i don't want to die for something i didn't do. >> now with pressure mounting, distrust comes between them. >> most definitely going to turn out to be brother against brother. >> it is soap. it actually comes out of the showers. >> an inmate with a long arrest
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record discovers an incredible talent. and -- >> i had her like this and she had my hair. >> a fight breaks out between two female inmates, but there's more behind it than meets the eye. >> i'm glad you're here, i love you. >> i love you, too. >> and one of these two friends will suffer an unthinkable tragedy. with the population just under 400,000, tulsa, oklahoma still maintains a small town feel. but it is not immune to big city crime. there are about 1800 men and women incarcerated at the tulsa
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county jail. most are only accused of crimes and are awaiting trial or the resolution of their cases. >> okay. i'll see y'all later. be good. >> because the inmates are innocent until proven guilty, officers try to afford them as many privileges as possible. but one man who has been just been booked into the jail will require special handling. >> this guy in holding cell nine is here on four counts of murder. we keep him in the cell by himself because of the high publicity of the case, you know, we don't want him to be with the general population in case maybe someone out here is a relative of someone he is accused of murdering. it is for his safety and ours, just keep him locked up by himself. >> the new inmate is james poore. he is charged with first degree murder for the execution style slayings of four women a month earlier. the victims were discovered together inside a tulsa apartment.
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all four women had their hands bound behind their backs and each had been shot in the head. poore lives in the same complex, says he was friends with two of the victims. though he has yet to enter a formal plea, poore says he is completely innocent. >> people say you supposed to have faith in the system, but it don't work like they said it was supposed to. they are looking to kill me for something i didn't do. i don't want to die for something i didn't do. the part that got me so emotional is that these are my friends and now they saying i'm being charged with their deaths. >> poore recently completed a 12 year prison sentence for armed
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robbery of four convenience stores and has had numerous jail stays on less serious convictions. >> for the first time in my life, i'm innocent. and everybody except me and god think i'm guilty. >> tulsa homicide investigators believe poore is not only guilty but that he did not act alone. they say he was aided by another man who was booked into jail a few days earlier on parole violation. it is poore's older brother and he, too, has now been charged with four counts of first degree murder. >> my name is dwayne poore, i haven't killed no one at no time ever in my life. it is not my case. perio period. do i know what's going on, no. am i lost, yes, do i need help,
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yes, am i ready to cry, yes. i am pissed, yes. i don't really have no feelings about this case. i don't want to sound cold-blooded or cold hearted, but i don't. i don't have no feelings towards this case because it is not my case. as for my brother, though, i can't speak for my brother, but i don't believe my brother had nothing to do with this case at this point. i don't believe it. >> seen brothers turn against each other for just little bitty stuff. it is like they wasn't brought up the right way or something. >> raised in a large family, james and cedric say nothing can break the strong bond they share. >> my relationship with my brother is tight, all my brothers, got five of them, all of them is tight. very close. we are very close. >> we always say after finish
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talking on the phone, basically saying one love. >> nothing i wouldn't do for my brothers. >> i don't believe nobody love me more than they would because we done went through so much coming up. >> those bonds could soon be put to the test. though both brothers have served past prison sentences for armed robbery, they've never faced such serious consequences. if they are found guilty of the murders, they will be eligible for the death penalty. >> i know i done wrong in my past, but i honestly don't think i'm going to get a fair shake on this one. >> why? >> because of my past. >> why are you so convinced you're going to be found guilty? >> because my last case i didn't go into nail the store, i didn't shoot at the people and i got booked for it. now i'm in the same position and i don't know who to tell who.
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so gonna get locked up again because i didn't snitch. except this time i don't have no parole date or anything like that, there's going to be an execution date. >> but james poore might have already spoken. the police report states that he says he and cedric committed the murders and robbed the victims and now that's been reported in the media as well. >> i don't want to say my brother got me involved in this, i don't want to say he don't have me involved in this, i don't want to say what the news media is trying to get me to say, that my brother is implicating me in this. i don't want to believe it, so i'm not going to say it. do i love my brother, yes. would i kill my brother, hell no. would i lie for him? hey, talking about death penalty. >> cedric poore, please come up, please. good morning. >> when the poore brothers make their first appearance before the judge, one is left feeling
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betrayed. and -- >> she said no, what you should have did was move out my way. i said no, bitch, what you should have did is said excuse me. >> a fight between two inmates has an ulterior motive. which means it's never been easier to get a new passat, awarded j.d. power's most appealing midsize car, two years in a row. and right now you can drive one home for practically just your signature. get zero due at signing, zero down, zero deposit, and zero first month's payment on any new 2014 volkswagen. hurry, this offer ends december 2nd. for details, visit today and you work hard to get to the next level. it feels good when you reach point b, but you're not done. for you, "b" is not the end. capella university will take you further,
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like most other jails, tulsa county has plenty of hard luck stories among its 1800 inmates. drug addiction is often at the center of those stories. richard roberts is no exception. >> i had a cocaine addiction. it was brought on about '86, and it's been an on and off struggle. >> drugs led roberts to numerous jail stays in the past 23 years. he pled guilty or no contest to 14 different charges, ranging from driving with a suspended license to burglary and assault
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and battery on a police officer. he says he's drug free now, but that his current problems are rooted elsewhere. >> i said after 56 years, i finally realized women are the downfall to all great men. go to adam and eve, to napoleon, even to bill clinton. [ laughter ] >> and now richard roberts. >> now richard roberts. actually i have always been a womaniz womanizer, that's what most people say. something about a nice man in his 50s with a nice smile, healthy body and a full head of hair, women have a tendency to attract themselves to him. they're like moths to a light, they flutter right on in. >> though roberts considers
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himself a lady's man, some of the women in his life might disagree. he is currently charged with assault and battery against a former girlfriend. he has pled not guilty and is awaiting trial. 16 months earlier, however, he pled guilty to three counts of violating a protective order taken out by another woman and served 60 days in tulsa county jail. >> i was kind of hooked on women for a long time, after my wife left me and everything, my attitude kind of changed about women, and that was probably where the switch started going in reverse toward cocaine. >> though he has been caught in the jail's revolving door, roberts says it was during a stay two years earlier he had an epiphany. it had to do with discarded slivers of soap in the shower stalls. >> i actually take the leftover
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refuse that's in the showers and i turn it into art. this is soap. and it actually comes out of the showers. >> what do you mean? >> it is off the floors of the showers, leftover, it is not new soap, it is used soap. my company's name while i'm in the jail house is nut soap crafting. because the soap sometimes has filaments of other people's parts. i started back two years ago. i was sitting in jail and had been here two months, you know, just boredom. i said let me try something and i told my cellie i was going to make a monkey. he said nah, you can't do it, and i made a monkey. and i take all the soap in little bits and pieces on the floor, i take the little pieces and bring them in here, dry them out, then i grind them into a
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powder. since it is contraband and there's a window right behind you, i wear my cape while i am working, that way the officers can't see exactly what i am doing. after you grind it into a powder, you add a little water and make clay. >> he also makes sculpting tools from other items. >> this is basically a broken pencil, lead still intact, put it in the sharpener, and sharpen it to give you a little edge on it. >> a lot of work for the feathers and skin and detail. >> yeah. that's staple work. the ours sitting with the stapler. etching one scratch at a time. >> though roberts' artistic skills are notable, technically his soap sculptures can be considered contraband. >> the system has a belief that anything that's not in their matrix is contraband, but to me
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i'm utilizing the soap, maybe not to take a shower with, but i'm not losing it in any of the quantity of soap. all i am doing is altering the shape. what i tell them, if you're going to be upset at me for using soap, you should be upset with everyone that uses it for showering because they altered the soap as well. >> if in fact staff has turned a blind eye to robert's repurposing of soap, there are many other infractions that will result in being sent to administrative segregation. as trinity baker learned, after fighting with another inmate. >> i have been here for eight days, that's long enough because i bit my tongue. i go crazy. i will never fight again, i promise. >> like all other segregation inmates, baker is confined to a single person cell 23 hours per day and lost most of her
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privileges. >> i spend my days trying to sleep, though i can't. i try to write, read, read a lot. >> this is baker's final day in segregation. and her time at the jail is coming to an end as well. she's awaiting transfer to prison to serve a five year sentence after pleading guilty to a charge of false declaration of ownership at a tulsa pawn shop. at the time of her arrest, she was on parole for earlier convictions of auto theft and possession of methamphetamine, a drug she says she has been addicted to for the past ten years. >> i was so bad my mom passed away, had cancer, and i didn't notice. i still haven't dealt with it. all she wanted was a relationship with her daughter and i was so high, i couldn't do it. now she's gone and i can't go back to that. >> the incident that led to eight days in segregation began with a spat with her bunk mate
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in the general population unit. >> she walked past me, pushed me, i told her you could have said excuse me. >> i went to get on my bunk and i walked past her without saying excuse me. >> she said no, what you should have did was move out of my way. i said no, bitch, what you should have did is said excuse me. and we started cussing each other out. >> i just broke it up, had them come to the desk, call an escort in to get them separated in. >> after detention officer rich broke up the argument, she decided it would be best to move baker to another housing pod. >> she was the one that was really severely agitated. she was the one that was being really verbal. >> she said y'all moving me because of this bitch, i'm going to get you, bitch, i'm going to get you, bitch. i had her hair, cutting her like there, she had my hair, and i was on top of her. >> i yanked baker off, pinned
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them on the floor, told them to quit resisting. baker said the only way she was leaving that pod is going to seg. and that's where she went. >> the girl is crazy, she needs medication. >> it seems like she wanted to go to segregation and turns out she did, because her best friend, michelle wise, was also in segregation. >> i was like if i'm moving, might as well fight her, go to seg because i knew michelle was there. i would rather go where i know somebody. she encouraged me to do well, it works because i listen to her and i don't listen to nobody but her. >> during the one hour she's allowed outside her cell, baker was able to visit with wise, but wise recently returned to general population. >> ready to go, baker? >> yes, sir. >> all right. >> now it is time for baker to return to general population as well. >> where am i going? >> but she's going to housing unit f-22. not f-20, where michelle wise was assigned.
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>> why the sour face whenever i told you you were going to 22? >> coming up. >> back to see me, huh? >> back in general population, trinity baker works the system and another inmate to get the housing assignment she really wants. >> i guess she did what she had to do to get to where she needed to get to. >> my best lawyer is me now. >> the poore brothers face the judge and each other. i didn't want nicotine to give up nicotine. [ male announcer ] along with support, chantix (varenicline) is proven to help people quit smoking. [ mike ] when i was taking the chantix, it reduced the urge to smoke. [ male announcer ] some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these, stop taking chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of depression or other mental health problems, which could get worse while taking chantix. don't take chantix if you've had a serious allergic or skin reaction to it. if you develop these, stop taking chantix and see your doctor right away
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the superdelegate at that county jail is only a few miles from the courthouse. to save time and resources, routine matters like arraignments, proceedings in which inmates are formally read charges takes place in the jail through a video link to the courts. >> we will see you back here on the 4th. good luck. >> three days after being charged with the murders of four women inside a tulsa apartment, james and cedric poore will have their arraignments today.
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it is the first time the brothers will have seen each other since they were charged. >> cedric poore, please come up to the podium, please. all right. good morning, mr. poore. >> cedric had been out of prison 11 months, prior to being charged with a quadruple homicide. served 17 years for armed robbery after holding up customers at a tulsa strip club. >> i want to live like the judges, like the jennifer sons but like donald trump. i suffered the consequences for doing it. >> detention on four charges of murder in the first degree and three charges of robbery with a firearm. on the murder charges, you're held without bond. >> facing charges that could result in the death penalty, cedric cannot afford an attorney. >> my best lawyer is me right now, only thing i can do is
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continue to file requests to get into the law library. i can read, i can write. don't take much for me to learn. >> appoint a public defender to represent you on this case. good luck. james poore. good morning, mr. poore. i believe you're represented by kathy try, is that correct? >> yes, sir. >> unlike cedric whose public defender is likely to carry a heavy case load and have limited resources, james poore hired a private defense attorney. >> miss fry has already been in this morning, not guilty plea entered on your behalf, good luck. >> after the arraignment, the two brothers try to talk, but an officer notices the exchange and separates them. >> cedric, let me ask you, did that go the way you thought? >> oh, no. i didn't know nothing about no attorney. how is his court process moving quicker than mine.
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>> i wanted to talk a little after you were arraigned. >> how was you able to afford this attorney. i was trying to get an attorney myself. >> never hurts to shed a tear. >> on advice of a new attorney, james declines to discuss the case any further. as he is led to single segregation cell, cedric has much to say. >> for awhile i was standing by the code, believing that as long as i don't talk, as long as i don't snitch, i'll be all right. there's no way in hell my brother throw me up under the bus so to speak, but now i don't
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say it with great pride, trust me, i don't say it with great pride at all that i have to do what's best for me and mine, so i got to start talking to save my o ass. >> when you say you have to talk, what does that mean? >> tell them everything i know. >> so that indicates to me you've awareness of this crime. >> yes, i do. i have awareness of the crime, yes, i do. >> how did you come about this awareness? >> it was handed to me by both -- two of the three perpetrators that actually done the crime. >> who are the two of three? >> i'd rather not say right now. do i got anything to do with the crime? no, i do not. did i kill anyone? no, i did not. there's only one person that's implicated my name in this
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crime, and unfortunately that's my brother. you know, you have an attorney, you could have gave me indication or something about it. i mean, makes it seem as though you trying to push everything into my direction, like it is not going to happen that way. this is my brother put me at the scene of a quadruple murder and armed robbery now. this is most definitely going to turn out being brother against brother. coming up. >> cedric poore. >> cedric poore gets a visit from the woman that might help prove his innocence. >> kind of was one of those situations i didn't want to take him but knew for the betterment of the facility, i had to. >> richard roberts' sculptures wind up in the hands of authorities. sculptures wind up in the hands of authorities. osculptures wind up in the hands of authorities. soasculptures wind hands of authorities. psculpture hands of authorities. soap sculptures wind up in the hands
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i am melissa rehberger. the taliban claimed responsibility for a bombing in kabul today that killed ten and wounded more than 20.
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the blast happened hours after the u.s. and afghans agreed to keep troops there beyond 2014. protesters are calling for toronto mayor rob ford to step down, a day after city council stripped him of many of his powers after he admitted to doing drugs and alcohol. now back to "lockup." due to mature subject matter, viewer discretion is advised. residents of tulsa, oklahoma often describe it as the kind of city where people know their neighbors and are close to their families. it can be like that in the tulsa county jail as well. >> you can't do that. >> i had to. >> trinity baker admits to fighting another inmate in order to be sent to the highly restrictive segregation unit because her best friend,
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michelle wise, was there for fighting as well. now both women are back in general population housing units, but they're not in the same one. though baker might have discovered family in heather morton. >> who am i? >> heather morton, she thinks she's my cousin, so she wants to be my cousin, i am her cousin. right now she's my cousin. >> my mom and your mom, remember, bakers? your daddy is a baker, remember we discovered this. so anyway, that's when we found out we thought we was cousins. >> why is the other woman claiming to be your cousin? >> i don't know. >> i am glad to see you, cousin. come back to see me, huh? >> my mom trinity baker have the same last name. we hit on people that was related to her that was related to me, so that's the reason we thought we was cousins.
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yeah. this is my cousin. but i know her regardless if we are cousins or not. really, i think we're cousins. >> we're cousins. >> don't we look alike? >> later that day baker filed what's known as a keep away request on morton. >> that means they keep you all away from each other. >> specifically it is a form jail inmates fill out to let them know they have a problem with another inmate in their housing unit. >> i like heather, i had to put a keep away on her. i had to do it. >> we don't want to see someone hurt. if someone says they are or have been threatened by an individual, we need to move them for safety. >> does heather know, no. but you can tell her if you want. i mean, i don't care. she knows how it goes. >> oh, trinity baker, trinity, trinity, trinity. that's trinity. yeah, i guess she did what she had to do to get to where she
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needed to get to, but you know, that's trinity, you know. i mean -- >> i am happy to see you. >> happy to see you, too, but you need to calm down. >> with a limited number of female housing units, baker has now been transferred to the same one as michelle wise. the coincidence is not lost on staff who know that inmates sometimes use keep aways to manipulate housing assignments. >> so the keep away game only has one real outcome if you keep playing it, and you'll eventually run out of places to go and have to go to administrative segregation. usually around the time it is time to go to administrative segregation, the truth starts coming out and we start finding out that keep aways are manufactured. >> i didn't know that y'all were waiting on me. >> why you throw the big dog out there like that. what about that. >> what is this connection with michelle? >> i love her, i just love her. >> i'm so glad you're here. i love you. >> i love you, too. >> her brother is the one that
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connected us and now we love each other. >> baker is currently dating wise's brother, but they share other things in common as well. both mothers and meth addicts, both have prior drug related convictions and are awaiting transfer to prison. each have five year sentences for crimes that while unrelated were fueled by their addictions. >> i used a friend's id to not have to use my own name because i have warrants. i have been on the run two years and it caught up with me. it always does. >> i have been here about three, four times since i was 18. i have been to prison twice. this will be my third trip. >> wise who holds a noncompensated jail job serving meals says this time around she's grateful for what the tulsa county jail has done for her. >> i've come in here three
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months pregnant, strung out. been here eight months, had a healthy nine pound baby and i would not have had that had i been in here. >> six weeks earlier wise was transported to a nearby hospital to give birth to her son. she was with him for three days before giving him up to her brother and returning to jail. >> my brother is all the family i have. he came and picked my son david, i named my son after my brother, he picked him up from the hospital and i snuck contraband back to the hospital, my baby's shirt and hat, kept it wrapped in plastic so i could smell him every time i needed to smell him. >> wise says she hopes her stay at tulsa county and upcoming prison term will help her stay off drugs for good so she can be a better mother. she says a children's book borrowed from the library helped her bond with her newborn son. >> i read this book every night in my cell during my pregnancy. every time i called, my brother puts me on speaker phone, i hear
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my son making noises with his mouth. i know he knows my voice. so in that manner, helps me to, you know, be close to my six week old. coming up. >> hey. >> cedric poore gets a visit. >> i miss you, too. >> from his wife. and later, two best friends await transfer to prison. but before they leave, one receives devastating news from home. which means it's never been easier to get a new passat, awarded j.d. power's most appealing midsize car, two years in a row. and right now you can drive one home for practically just your signature. get zero due at signing, zero down, zero deposit, and zero first month's payment on any new 2014 volkswagen. hurry, this offer ends december 2nd. for details, visit today
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[ drumming ] ♪ ♪ ♪ it's go time. ♪ [ van damme ] it's go time. godaddy.
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with 0-calorie monk fruit in the raw. it's made with the natural, vine-ripened sweetness of fruit, so you can serve up deliciously sweet treats without all the sugar. raw natural sweetness, raw natural success. there is at least one inmate at the tulsa county jail that says incarceration exposed a hidden talent. >> everybody looks up to me i guess because of my soap sculpturin sculpturing.
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gives them something to admire. and they all appreciate it. >> richard roberts says it was an earlier stay at tulsa county that led him to discover the incredible things he could do with discarded shards of soap. now other inmates contribute. >> i get them in the window or under the door. guy last night brought me a whole bag of broken up soap, so everybody contributes. >> but robert's soap sculptures were recently confiscated. >> my opinion of the sculptures, that is a talented man, he is extremely talented. it is one of those situations i didn't want to take them but knew for the betterment of the facility, i had to. >> because i took soap out of the shower off the floor that was garbage and made something beautiful, i was penalized for it. >> i explained to inmate roberts what the problem was, of it being an unsanitary situation,
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and he really didn't quite get it. >> but the confiscation of contraband is routine. robert's case is brought to the attention of the woman that runs the facility. >> he had an elephant sculptor with big ears, big thick feet, tusks, it was phenomenal, phenomenal. i wish that they could use those talents for something other than soap sculptures in jail. >> though staff followed policy confiscating the sculptures, all was not lost. chief deputy has put them on display. >> i moved them down into the library where the programs manager is. we are gearing towards an art program. we have so many programs right now that talk about life skills and getting your ged and all of the bible studies and all of the church programs, but we don't yet have something geared toward the creativity of the individual
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inmate. so she's putting together an art program because that shows everybody that they can do something positive while they're in jail. if we can have one person leave this jail better than what they came and give them a skill or tool to use when they leave so they get a job that may effect their coming back, then that one is a success. >> roberts hopes he might be the jail's next success. >> is that it? >> that is it. >> all right. >> he entered a guilty plea on charges of domestic assault and battery and larceny. the judge gave him a suspended sentence of 18 months, plus time served. so today roberts will be released and have another chance to make it on the outside. >> man. one moment you're tied, you're locked, you're shackled, and one moment all of a sudden the chains are gone and now you just
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ready to fly away. >> cedric poore says he looks forward to a release day as well, but that isn't likely to occur any time soon. he and his brother james are charged with the execution style murder of four white women. before he stopped speaking to us, james said he feared race would influence their trials. >> truthfully i didn't expect to get no fair shake at this anyway, we in the state of oklahoma, it was four white women that got killed, and me and my brother are two black gentlemen with prison records. i mean, you do the math. >> but cedric says if nothing else, he can prove he's not a racist. his wife of five months has just arrived for a visit. >> who are you here to see? >> cedric poore. >> j-11. >> cedric poore for noncontact. >> today i get one of my joyous
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visits with me wife. i am waiting for her to come through. >> what do these visits do? >> keep me motivated, keep me going, get my spirits up, get me thinking about anything besides these four walls. >> hey, sweetie, how you doing. >> good, how are you? cedric is very family oriented, he is quiet, if you don't know him, not racist. yeah. the media is portraying him to be racist, obviously i am his wife, i am white, his best friends are white, he is not racist. >> i miss you. >> i miss you too. >> i don't even know that they know he is married to a white lady. surprise! >> i want to touch. >> i know. anxious. >> this glass is killing me. >> frustrated. >> yeah, that will work, too. that will work, too. that's the closest we can get, babe, for now. >> i know. when i learned he had been arrested and charged, i actually had to pull over and vomit on
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the side of the highway. my world has changed in every aspect. i have received threatening texts on my phone telling me to do the world a favor, pull out the gun and pull the trigger. i love you. >> i love you more. >> not possible. let's say we're even. he is very close to both my kids. he actually taught my 15-year-old how to drive. he is not going to be here when she gets her driver's license. i am going to get upset, sorry. >> what have you told your children? >> not to believe what they see on the news.
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he wouldn't be with someone that would do that. >> how you doging emotionally. >> i am okay. >> no more roller coasters? >> always a roller coaster while you're in here. i am handling the roller coaster better. >> you at the controls now? >> yeah. >> that's what i am talking about. all gas, no brake. take me up the hill, all gas, no break. >> i'm sorry. i wish i could fix it. >> i wish we both could fix it. it will be all right. you fixing it right now, you here. rain, sleet, or snow, you here, you fixing it, it will be just fine. >> i believe my loyalty and commitment to him has been shown and he realizes that he chose the right person to marry because i am willing to be with him through thick and thin, good and bad, 'til death do us part. >> kiss. >> i love you. >> love you, too. >> one more. i'll see you. >> i love you. >> love you, too, bye.
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get a sense of calm when you know you got somebody there for you all the time. but now this is like the ultimate test and she's like front and center. she don't care. she just right here. i'm a little lighter because anything going through my mind or doubts i have running through my heart at times, you know, all that gets taken away. coming up. >> let's get a hold of chaplain. >> a phone call brings tragic news for a tulsa county inmate. . on the u.s.s. saratoga in 1982. [ male announcer ] once it's earned, usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation because it offers a superior level of protection and because usaa's commitment to serve current and former military members and their families is without equal. begin your legacy. get an auto insurance quote. usaa. we know what it means to serve.
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inside the tulsa county jail, michelle wise hopes her latest drug related conviction will be her last. though she is due to leave the jail to serve five years in state prison, she said her goal this time was to overcome her addiction and become a better mother to her three children,
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including the two month old son she gave birth to while incarcerated. he has been in the care of her brother. >> is one of my classification officers there? we have an issue. now sergeant collette just received tragic news. >> last name of wise, w-i-s-e. first name will be michelle. she doesn't know or maybe she does know, i don't believe she does, that her child died. the baby was i believe two months old. let's get a hold of the chaplain to see if he's aware of that, let's rehouse her in medical if we can. all right. thank you. all right. bye-bye. >> sergeant, what's that about? >> if she doesn't know that the child has died, i want to make sure the chaplain's office knows, so i sent one of the officers to touch base with chaplain's office to make sure they are aware her child did
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die. then i have her going to mental health department, and mental health we have on staff now make contact with them so that they can be available to her and talk to her. at the very least, i want her moved down to medical where they can keep a closer eye on her. >> jail chaplain ken farnum delivered the devastating news. but it was almost one month later before wise was willing to discuss her son with us. >> my son stopped breathing. my brother found him unresponsive in his crib and i don't know. >> his death was attributed to sids, sudden infant death syndrome. >> i didn't believe it at first, i thought it was a sick joke. i didn't -- i just didn't believe it. i don't know.
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i mean, you know, i got three days with him in the hospital. my life has been so messed up because of my drug addiction and because of my choices and my mistakes since i turned 18. i have two other children that i lost, due to my drug addiction. and this was going to be a chance that i was going to have to change, to be different, to have my son, to be a mother to my child. that's why this is so much harder because all of me, every bit of me wanted to change. that last day was the hardest, when i had to just say good-bye because i didn't know how long i was going to, you know, i didn't know how long it would be before i could see him again or hold him again or smell him.
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and now i can't hold him or smell him or see him. >> jail officials permitted wise to attend her son's funeral. >> i remember him being warm and soft and huggable. not in that casket and being cold and stiff. but i don't regret, i mean, i'm glad i went because i probably would have regretted not going. >> wise who no longer has a relationship with her son's father last saw her brother at the funeral. but she has not been able to reach him since then. >> my brother got two full months with my son and i got three days. and now my brother is nowhere. it is like my baby's dead and now he's just gone. i don't have my baby, i don't have my brother, and i don't understand how he can't. but i know he's grieving. but my son is gone, my brother is gone, it is like what the [bleep].
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i am here by myself, i need my brother or my baby, one of the two. >> is there someone here you can talk to? >> just i don't want to talk to people. i just want people to leave me alone. i go to all my classes. at nighttime i lay in bed and i have all kinds of bad thoughts. >> normally wise would have had her best friend and her brother's girlfriend, trinity baker, to speak to, but baker was transferred to prison two weeks earlier. >> it was so sad watching her go. it was just a crying battle because she was a really good support for me, you know. and i would like to think i was for her, too. it was sad watching her walk out. >> let's go to the chaplain. >> today wise will have someone to speak to. her brother. chaplain farnum arranged for the two of them to have a special contact visit. >> he agreed to come at 10:00.
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he may just be running late. >> is it past 10:00? >> a short time later, however, it becomes apparent her brother has not made it to the visit. >> i just want to see him. >> i know. and we're going to work on you seeing him, even if you don't see him today because the problem is he's running through the same processes as you. and you know the other day on the phone you told him this isn't his fault, you know, you talked to him about that, but you telling him that and him coming to the belief of that is two different things. you realize that, don't you? >> yeah. >> remember you questioned the other day was it something you did prior to your child being born. you questioned all that. david is going through the same thing. he's questioning is it something i did, could have done different, could have done better, could have done, and until he settles those questions in his mind, as much as he knows you love him, it's hard for him to come see you.
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for that reason. so there's two reasons he might not have made it, he just doesn't know what to say to you yet. i know that doesn't help your feelings any because you really want to see him. >> this just makes me angry. >> yeah. and that's fine to be angry. >> she has no answers yet. she's hoping by seeing her brother she can get answers. most of all, michelle wants him to know she cares for him, she loves him, she doesn't blame him, and that's what she wants him to know.
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due to mature subject matter, viewer discretion is advised. msnbc takes you behind the walls of america's most notorious prisons to a world of chaos and danger, now the scenes you've never seen, "lockup: raw." >> every time we step into another prison we are amazed by the world that we enter. it's violent, it's loud, [ bleep ] -- very intimidating but through it all is a fascinating place. >> the daily grind of prison life has pushed some inmates to the brink.


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