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tv   The Last Word  MSNBC  November 27, 2013 7:00pm-8:01pm PST

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literally five days earlier was essentially unfathomable. that does it for us tonight. be sure to catch my show this weekend. saturday, sunday. 8:00 to 10:00 p.m. eastern time. now time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. have a great night. >> you know what is going to happen tomorrow. to some of you anyway. you are going to be at the table, one of your crazy relatives is going to go off on obama care, or benghazi, iran deal, our socialist president. and the smart thing to do of course is to just ask for more dessert. but. you feel look ruining everyone's meal, you can actually start arguing. tonight, we will give you've the facts that you need to win. >> it has been a rough couple weeks in washington. >> grab your pitchfork. >> once again here we have. >> republican colleagues trying to scare everybody. >> again. again. again. >> when it comes to obama care. >> obama care scandal. >> there is no way to fix this. >> how about we defund the whole
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thing. >> the republican spotlight returns to the benghazi tragedy. >> benghazi attacks. >> so many questions about benghazi. >> calling it a scandal bigger than watergate. >> the strategy of never tell the truth. always say you are winning. >> a big hearing on capitol hill. >> my question is who is going to jail over the scandal. >> nobody. >> please, don't answer yet. >> once again. here we have, my republican colleagues trying to scare everybody. >> the 16 day government shutdown finally came to an end. >> god bless the tea party. >> the shut down was so magnificent. run beautifully. so proud of the republicans. >> let's be clear. there are no whinners here. >> every aspect of life in america today is worse. >> my republican colleagues trying to scare everybody. >> everything is worse. >> who is going to jail. >> obama care scandal, scandal, scan scandal. >> never tell the truth. >> have you really thought your strategy through?
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tomorrow, you might be at the table sitting beside a beloved crazy relative who says something like this -- >> the politicians of washington tell us don't worry about it. obama care is just going to be peachy keen. you go to the 1940s. nazi germany. look, we saw in britain, neville chamberlain who told the british people, accept the nazis. yes, they'll dominate the continent of europe. but that's not our problem. let's appease them. why? it can't be done. we can't possibly stand against them. >> here to help you with how you should respond to your crazy uncle who says something look that is crystal ball, co-host of msnbc, and sarah clift, health policy reporter, and michael
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hilsik, business reporter for the los angeles times here with me. crystal ball, do you have a ted cruz supporting relative who quotes him at the dinner able you might be sitting beside tomorrow? >> i think we all do, yes. so when he brings up -- nazi germany in the same sentence with obama care, you would say -- what? >> indeed. well, i -- i think that any team you go immediately from providing health care to millions of people to -- to nazis -- it's a pretty far logical leap. now my personal strategy as you said, lawrence is just to ask for more dessert try to ignore it. sometimes you just scacan't hel yourself. i think pointing out the simple distinction, murdering people, as nazis did, versus -- providing health care. to folks may be the website is not that great. still the intention is to provide health care to a lot of people. pretty cut and dry distingttion
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thedistingttion -- dry distinction. >> sarah cliff, if somebody was to say this affordable care act is a disaster, hopeless, we should repeal it and get back to that wonderful health care market place that we had before the affordable care act, what do you think should be the response to that? >> the first thing might be to bring up whether it is such a wonderful market we have right now. right now about 20% of all people are rejected from the individual market. they're not allowed to buy the products that they want to buy. so that is a pretty, pretty challenging market that exists right now. as for the disaster, it is certainly true that the rollout has not been what the white house wanted. they have said -- they botched the rollout. they do not look how this is going. they're trying to fix it. does it mean the law is doomed? there is evidence tout there that suggests it is a little too early to say. we see state exchanges. places like california and here in washington where i am spending thanksgiving that have actually had successful rollouts. they have had tens of thousand of people sign up. which suggests the problems are
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technical rather than demand? so i think for any thanksgiving relatives who are going to suggest it is doomed you have pretty good evidence on your side that is a little too early to declare the death of obama care? >> michael hilsik, you have been doing great reporting in california for the l.a. times on how the affordable care act is working here. when you hear the nazi rant at the dinner table about obama care, you, you would say what? >> first of all, i think it used to be out of order under any circumstances. to compare anything to nazis. >> yeah, we are long past that. turns out everything is comparable to nazi germany. >> yeah, i would take what sarah said a little further. i have a foolproof comeback to all of these criticisms about obama care when i hear them. that is just think about what things were look in the past. i mean it was not that long ago that we all hated the insurance companies. we hated the insurance system we
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had. we had people getting thrown off insurance because they were sick. we had people uninsurable, for things like hay fever, cancer diagnosis, or carpal tunnel syndrome, that was the old system. nobody liked it. i mean every time you would open up the newspaper you would hear, you would see a story about somebody who couldn't get insurance at all. or whose premiums were completely through the roof. well all that is now illegal. a thing of the past. that's really the comeback. >> now, someone in america, couple peoplen americ ein ameri going to be sitting beside michele bachmann at thanksgiving. she may say something like this. >> the american people, especially, vulnerable women, vulnerable children, vulnerable senior citizens, now get to pay more and they get less. that's why we are here. because we are saying, let's
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repeal this failure before it literally kills women, kills children, kills senior citizens. let's not do that. let's love people. let's care about people. let's repeal it now while we can. >> so, chris crystal bal, l, yo teaching michele bachmann, as a relative, what the word literally means. >> literally. >> when she says the affordable care act, literally kills women, children, senior citizens. go ahead, crystal respond. you have michele bachmann beside you. >> quite a night at the bachmann household. maybe in this circumstance query. when you say it is going to kill people. exactly which provision in the law is going to literally kill people. is it the part where it bans insurers from having a lifetime
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cap on coverage. where people get catastrophically ill and are cut off? the part that keeps insurers from -- from, banning you from having coverage at all because of a pre-existing condition? or -- or the part that bans insurers from going back after you get sick and finding something as simple as an irregular period to kick you off of your insurance coverage. which piece is it exactly? that is literally going to kill people. i must have missed that some where in the coverage. >> sarah cliff, michele bachmann in there says that people are going to have to pay more and get less. wh how would you respond to that? >> yeah, a little difficult to find in the text of the affordable care act. if you want to spice up your thanksgiving dinner. bring along a copy of the law journal. >> one relative may do that. if they will go, this law is so big. must be terrible argument. >> it happens on the floor of
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congress, why not at thanksgiving dinner? >> look, what i would say, the affordable care act, it requires insurance plans to cover a really significant number of benefits. these are some things that aren't covered now in a lot of individual market plans. such as ma teternity care, 1/3 plans don't cover. i think the more accurate critique of obama care. one you do see happening is that it requires people to pay more, and also get more. it is really hard to see where an are gaumegument about peopleg less comes in. i would add, paying more. people will be getting subsidies to pay higher premiums. bit of a balancing act. as crystal points out. this is a great opportunity to say, okay, where -- in the affordable care act does it out out -- does it cut the benefits. you may get into death panel territory. easy to shoot down. there are not death panels in the affordable care act. hard to find basis in the affordable care act, there are less benefits. a conservative rallying point.
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there are more benefits required by the law. a lot of people don't like paying for the benefits. >> michael, you have done some reporting digging into this question of people paying more and getting less. >> right. i have literal numbers for, for congressman -- >> afraid that is cheating with michele bachmann. if michele bachmann is next to you. you aren't allowed to use numbers or facts. >> there are 30 million americans in or expected to be in the individual insurance market through the law. 20 million of them are coming into the market from having no insurance whatsoever. now, when you look -- >> they start with nothing. >> they start with nothing. this act will be an unalleyed boon for them. we also know that, st some wher between 71% to 80% working through the exchanges will be subject or eligible for a subsi subsidy. some are not going to get premium subsidies that if will
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get help with their co-pays and deductibles and all the other cost sharing. we know all of this. we can -- we can compare that to the number of people we know who may be aren't going to get subs deeps who are going to have to give up plans and get new plans. that's about 5 million people. and the best estimates we have seen -- is that maybe, a third of them. maybe less. million and a half people, are actually going to be paying more than today for service that are as good or not as good. that's the, those are the obama care victims. those are the people with -- rate shock. if you compare them to the 30 million people who are going to get insurance. 20 million who are getting insurance who didn't have it now. that's -- that's a pretty good balance if you ask me. >> let's listen to -- what rand paul has the to say about this and we'll -- give you've the answer about how to respond to him. i think government is inherently inefficient. the other side thinks government
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could do anything. a great faith. government can fix any problem. the way i see it, the private market place, is miraculous in distributing goods. they have to have a profit motive. government doesn't have a profit motive. government is not very good at most things. >> crystal, that's actually what rand paul is going to be wearing at thanksgiving dinner. we got a special, special clip. without the necktie. so, crystal your response to rand paul and the glory of the profit motive in the health care sector. >> there are two pieces -- government can't do anything. which conservative minded folks can be reminded that -- our military -- is pretty successful, pretty well run, and is in fact government. the other piece of this, is that the private markets are miraculous. helpful to remind folks our current market is a private market and much less than miraculous. and to boot, obama care is not -- as they may believe, a
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government takeover of health care. it is actually just a set of reforms and subs deidies to the existing private market place. you may agree and say, you know what, you are right. i do think it is best for us to have a private market solution like obama care that works within the existing framework to help people get coverage. >> crystal ball, sarah cliff, michael hilsik, thank you for joining us. >> thank you, lawrence. >> thank you. >> more ways to win with your crazy uncle tomorrow. david corn, and stephany miller will join us. and stephanie will have jokes you can use at the table. and a new report from glen greenwald tells us today, the nsa is tracking online porn viewing. are you worried now? glen greenwald will join me for a "last word" exclusive. in the rewrite, rob lowe, allison janning, richard shipp,
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>> what i like about thanksgiving, a lot of tips by celebrities how to cook the thanksgiving turkey. speaker of the house, john boehner, when they prepare the turkey at his house they know it is done when it is the same color of his face. is it right there? yes, it is perfect. life with crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis
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>> i think it is a deathblow to the narrative that this was a protest spawned by video that went bad. the 60 minutes piece conclusively proved from people on the ground, people in libya, that al qaeda was behind this attack that they had provided warnings to washington, all of their additional security requests were ignored. no one has been held accountable. >> joining me now to discuss how to survive thanksgiving dinner with lindsay graham at the table, mother jones washington bureau chief, david kornan, favorite syndicated radio host, stephany miller. stephanie, you have been talking to republicans your whole life? >> i was going to say my
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90-year-old republican mother does not clutch her pearls as much as lindsay graham over this benghazi thing. there is no there, there, lawrence, there is no there there. >> when lindsay graham brings up the 60 minutes expose that proved the whole thing do you want to mention to him it was proven completely false? >> yeah, he is like your drunk uncle hank. okay, hank, that guy was at his beach villa and not fighting a terrorist off with a rifle. but i can see where it is the same thing on fox news. >> let's listen to the big controversy of the week -- what the -- the appeasment accusation about the iran deal. listen to sean hannity. >> president obama's naive remarks, modern day equivalent, chamberlain's peace in our time. why would the president trust them. what is it in him that trusts them? >> he is a liberal. you didn't have to go back as far to neville chamberlain.
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go to clinton's peace in our time, north koreans, hailed on the cover of "the new york times." a triumph we give them nuclear material, $5 billion in aid. they give us a promise not to build nuclears. so they take all that. they go feverishly to work building nuclears. >> david, at the thoek tabanksg table. sitting between sean hannity, ann coulter. they start talking appeasment over your plate. >> not sure i get paid enough, lawrence. i can't imagine what we are eating, what they may be eating. uncle morty. i know, he doesn't like this. if you were to read it, the israeli newspaper, you would find out lots of israeli generals, people who fight the wars, people involved in israeli military intelligence think this
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is not such a bad deal. why not uncle morty. listen, for six months we get to test them. everything comes to a stand still. yeah, they get four to six billion in sanction relief. listen, just a little amount for us. not the big ball of wax. go right become to sanctions which actually, the guy in the white house. you don't like so much. put there in the first play. which helped get a more moderate. not much moderate. more moderate guy elected president of iran. let's sit back. let's have our matza ball soup. not so bad. see what happens over six mumucht months time, uncle mortie. >> uncle mortie will not let you talk that long uninterrupted. >> i'll wait till he starts to eat. >> who doesn't like the deal, uncle lindsay graham. listen to lindsay graham on this. >> i saw a movie like this before. north korea, did not end well.
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what does this accomplish. >> in iran they're spiking the football in the end zone. >> stephanie, he has seen movies i hadn't seen. i never saw the north korean movie. so this thing, this appeasment, you know, obama has -- has lost the universe in iran. >> yeah, yeah. already. here's what i love too. it's all like, right-wing, amazing race to hitler analogy. some sort of game show. how fast they can get to. it is just like hitler. it's not anything like hitler. munich. or appeasment, or i mean that happened once in history. every other comparison is a bad one. this i think any normal person would say, is a huge, the american people, in a approximately poll today, 2 to 1. a stunning diplomatic success like syria was. they called that a debacle. tell me how getting some one to disarm without firing a shot is a debacle.
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>> to get up in arms, you have to argue there is a long term consequence that may, may not kick in. bah because the it is quite clear. what they have to do, iranians, bring everything to a stand still. more importantly the transparency, the amount of inspections are going to go up to such a degree that if they were to cheat, it would be the minimal amount of cheating they probably could get away with. so if you think, we're getting a bad deal here. it's because you say well this is going to deteriorate sanctions over time. or, after this is over. in six months time. they can kick in again. start going faster and developing a nuclear weapon. even itch thf that's what they' doing, which is still not proven. a really solid pause. at laes feast six months time. you have to hate neville chamber ln to be against this -- chamberlain to be against this deal. >> let's listen to what benjamin
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knelt kne netanyahu. i know uncle mortie will quote netanyahu. let's listen to this. >> what was concluded in geneva last night is not historic agreement. it is an historic mistake. not made the world a safer place, like the agreement with north korea in 2005. this agreement has made the world a much more dangerous place. stephanie, what i find interesting about that. that is exactly. exactly what barack obama needs netanyahu to say. that's what, that's what we need the iranians to hear. if any one, if israel, israeli leader were to stand up and say this sound like a pretty reasonable first step. end of the de. iranians out the door. good-bye, this is impossible. >> he didn't bring his pictures of the cartoon bombs, the acme exploding bombs with him. people need to understand. he does not speak for israel.
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speaks for the israeli right. the generals in the military want to give this a chance. so i think the problem is, a lot of times, they keep people afraid of in israel. keep vote in netanyahu. nothing changes. keep building settlements. nothing changes. an historic opportunity for something different. something different. we haven't talked to iran in 34 years. >> we will take a break. >> can you stay? can i talk you into staying and talking more. >> ow. >> david. stick around. need to hear more about uncle mortie. stay there. >> okay. >> coming up, the nsa actually, reportedly, any way, spied on people, men, the government worried might try to convert people to radical islam. and then, threatened to blackmail the men with what they discovered their online porn habits. glen greenwald has broken the story. and glen greenwald will join me next.
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>> edward snowden, nsa and online porn. nothing like a little sex scandal to avert terrorism it seems. or at least that was the plan considered by the national security agency according to new documents leaked by edward snowden and reported by glen greenwald and huffington post. the nsa spied on six muslims it deemed radicalizers in order to
quote quote
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exploit personal weaknesses including online porn habits. one of the leaked documents states "radicalizers aper pear be -- in response, a spokesperson for the nsa, national intelligence, told the huffington post it should be not, it should not be surprising that the u.s. government uses all of the lawful tools at our disposal to impede the efforts of valid terrorist targets who seek to harm the nation and radicalize others to violence.
quote quote
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joining me now for an exclusive interview, glen greenwald. coming to us on a connectionen south america. i'm in los angeles. all going through new york. i think we can expect a little delay between the two of us here. glen, what, what, what are the key elements of this story that you think we should know? >> first of all that the -- none of the people who have been targeted are kiddconsidered by nsa to be terrorists none involved in terrorist organizations or terrorist plots in any ways. they express views that the u.s. government kids radicals. secondly one of the persons is deemed by the nsa to be a u.s. person. means heap is a citizen or gre card holder which entitles him to increase protections under the law. americans, u.s. persons are not exempt from this program. then thirdly, there is a long, ugly history, lawrence in the united states of the u.s. government deeming certain ideas
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radical. such as the civil rights movement. or socialist and communist. or, anti-war protesters. then taking action to destroy them either their reputations or, their, their professions. and, i think we all ought to be aware of that history and wary of these kind of programs. >> there is a former nsa general counsel, stewart baker who said if people are engaged in trying to recruit folks to kill americans and we can discredit them we ought to. he said on the whole it is fairer and more humane than bombing a target. he said, describing this tactic as dropping the truth on them. what's your reaction to that plan? stewart baker was a top level official in the bush administration. basically the mentality he is conveying. whenever we don't look anybody. even if there is no evidence of them actually doing anything wrong. he said they're recruiting people into terrorists. there its nothing in the
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document that suggests that. then we simply go and destroy them. in the world of stewart baker and those who think like him, the question is not do we need a trial, do we need to present evidence, should the government be restrained. do we murder them? or do we use their online sex activity and violate their privacy in order to destroy their reputation. and for him that's the only choice. i think there is lots of alternatives. >> the according to the leaked documents. two of the six targets, have what they call vulnerabilities that included something of a sexual nature. this attempt to undermine people who are, as they called it rd c -- called it radicalizers. do you see any valid purpose they would have in freeing to t undermine them? >> of course if the u.s. government believes there are people in the world who are
quote quote
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expressing view points that are dangerous, of course the u.s. government like any government wants to go out and undermine them. there are a lot of people who express radical views all the time including on lots of cable tv stations i would look to go in and undermine. that doesn't mean i want the state trolling through the most private data and releasing it to the world to humiliate them and destroy their reputations. that's not something that we want the state, authorized to do. remember we are talking here, the document says that the six people are exemplars of how this can work. not confined to just this six or even, muslim radicals. just anybody the u.s. government thinks are radicalizing people with their view points. >> so far there is no case of the nsa actually as you put it releasing this kind of information to the world? >> remember, lawrence, we have a certain set of documents that our source provided to us. we have far from the entire set of documents in the nsa. what the document is doing, a document that implicates at
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least 15 different government agencies of the highest levels of the government. talking about the kind of nef a nefarius plans. we don't know, they met and planned to release it to destroy reputation. that's what surveillance scandals in the past have been about. >> glen greenwald, thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you, lawrence. >> coming up -- how to talk more of how to talk to your crazy uncle when he starts going on about barack obama the socialist. and tonight, i will hand over the rewrite segment to some very special friends. >> every year on thanksgiving the president pardons a turkey. >> he pardons a turkey? >> yeah. ♪
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on this day in america, this happens -- >> from jasper farms. tell them what you're doing? >> dropping off the turkeys. >> no one left instructions, a pass for northwest entrance. >> dropping off the turkeys. where should i put them? >> cjs office. cj craig's office. cj right here. handles all the bird. cj. >> what's next for me in the week of unendurable thanksgiving nonsense. >> hi, cj. >> hi, carroll.
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[ turkeys gobbling ] >> oh, yeah, the turkeys came. >> wait, wait, wait. wait, wait, wait. i'm coming. the turkeys came. >> so carol said. >> they said they should go in your office. >> turkeys. >> turkeys for what. >> you weren't here last year? >> when? >> over thanksgiving. you were sick. >> every year on thanksgiving the president pardons a turkey. >> pardons a turkey? >> why are there two turkeys? >> sorry? >> why are there two turkeys? >> customarily, the press secretary decide which of the two finalists is more photegenic. >> their names. >> i don't want to know their names. >> this one is eric. this one is troy. >> eric and troy. >> yeah. >> i'm to choose the more photo jenni i genic to receive a pardon. i have a masters degree from university of california-berkeley. >> that's a good school.
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>> yeah. >> they eat grain or really whatever is lying around and -- troy doesn't like to be touched. >> i would look to be alone now. >> i understand. >> good afternoon, everybody. happy thanksgiving. the office of the presidency, the most powerful position in the world, brings with it many awesome and solemn responsibilities. this is not one of them. but -- but the white house turkey pardon is a great tradition and i know malia loves it. as does sasha. generally speaking, thanksgiving is a bad day to be a turkey. especially at a house with two dogs. so i salute our two guests of honor, caramel and popcorn, for their bravery. they came all the way from outside badger, minnesota, to be
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with us. 80 turkeys on john's farm competed for a chance to make it to the white house and stay off the thanksgiving table. it was quite literally the "hunger games." ha-ha. >> ha-ha. >> then after weeks of vocal practice and prepping for the cameras, the two tributes, caramel and popcorn went head to head together for america's vote as top gobbler. the competition was stiff. we can officially declare popcorn is the winner. proving, there you go, proving that even a turkey with a funny name can find a place in politics. as for caramel he is sticking around and busy raising money for his next campaign. yeah. we give thanks for the service and sacrifice of our brave men and women in uniform who serve our nation around the world.
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for those of you who are watching, you keep us safe, you make us proud, and you remind us of our own obligations to build on the work of our predecessors and leave something better for our own kids. so, on behalf of the obama family i want to wish everybody a very happy thanksgiving. tomorrow as we gather with our own friend and family we will count ourselves lucky that there is more to be thankful for than we can ever say and more to be hopeful for than we can ever imagine. with the power vests in me, i want to grant, popcorn, a full reprie reprieve, come on. i want popcorn, you have a full reprieve from cranberry sauce and stuffing we were you well, and we are going to give caramel a break as well. all right. so -- as a business owner, i'm constantly putting out fires.
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>> the big news this week is that the u.s. finally got iran to agree to stop making nuclear weapons in exchange the u.s. freed up $8 billion of iran's assets. when asked how it plans to spend the money. iran said "we're going to buy nuclear weapons." open up a lot of dawn -- tough on grease yet gentle. dawn helps open something even bigger. [ all ] 3, 2, 1! this year, dawn is also donating $1 million. learn more at [ chicken caws ] [ male announcer ] when your favorite food starts a fight, fight back fast with tums. heartburn relief that neutralizes acid on contact and goes to work in seconds. ♪ tum, tum tum tum tums!
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>> barack obama is a socialist. he believes in socialism, in redistributing wealth, in, in confiscating hard-earned dollars of our small business men and will se women so they cannot reinvest their dollars, hire more, and grow and expand. he believes in failed socialist policies. >> joining me again now to talk about how to respond this time to say sarah palin sitting beside you at thanksgiving dinner is syndicated radio host stephany miller, politics editor for business insider, and david,
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mother jones, and msnbc political analyst. stephanie, in the middle of dinner, some one goes on the obama is a socialist rant. you say what? >> my favorite side dish, sarah palin, word salad. like an idiot ambrosia. made more sense than usual. an english sentence. but, the dow hit a record high as you know. his health care program was thought up by heritage foundation, bob dole enacted by mitt romney. i don't know where to start on it. he is a socialist. >> josh barrow, the socialist accusation -- how do you deal with that? >> you know? i would point out when george bush was president. the top income tax trarate, if owe $3, you have to fork $1 to the government. your uncle should look broadly. surrounded by all political parties. trying to use the government to
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take people's money away and spent on things they think the government should spend the money on. >> let's imagine, sitting beside bill o'reilly, at thanksgiving dinner and he says this. >> if health care is a constitutional right, then everything associated with good health would fall into the civil rights category. your environment would all have to be paid for by the state. if you could not afford it. that's a form of communism. no country could afford the payments without seizing the assets of everybody else. it's impos bsible. >> bill ups the ante to communism. what do you say? >> i say pass the stuffing. listen, you know -- i am still thinkin ing ing about uncle mor. i see you getting around pretty well today. the new help you have. medicare. what is medicare? other than taxing people using
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it for social good. social security check you have coming in. kind of socialistic as well. people used to go with communism. going back to what stephanie said. that, 401(k), that ruthy made you buy into when you didn't want to. looking good at 16,000 on the dow. come on. if this is socialism. we are all socialists. >> that's exactly. that is my argument, there was that 2009, "newsweek" cover story. we are all socialists now. and, stephanie that would be my argument is yes, barack obama is a socialist. he mixes socialism with capitalism. i am, you are, everyone is. yeah, reagan was. and so i, you know i am always torn when i hear people denying that, this, that, angrily denying, obama is a socialist they're missing this other part of the story, yes, we are all happily involved in some form of
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socialism. >> yeah. li like that scene in and out and where everyone stands up to say i'm gay to support everyone. david corn makes a good point. look if we privatized social security like george bush wanted us to, you know the old people, uncle mortie would eat cat food now. if he did it now under barack obama, uncle mortie would be doing good because of how great the stock market is doing. >> president obama chose the form of health care reform that he enacted because he was trying to avoid, avoid this socialist label. which would have been, which they believe would have been attached to him if he had gone for the single payer solution. >> he was trying to avoid that. he was trying to build a political coalition that would include various interests including insurance companies. insurers got to have a role in it. related to the socialist charge. republicans will say the president wants a government takeover of health care. you know, the system we had
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before. the product they were selling was heavily regulated. under obama, the product will be subsidized and regulated more. a little bit more socialist than it used to be. on some sort of continuum. not like we are divided between capitalists and people who are pure socialists. we are tin kerri tinkering, how economy will be regulated by law. >> someone, some one is going to have to sit beside rush limbaugh at thanksgiving dinner you. know he is going to say this. >> socialism doesn't work. communism doesn't work. you run out of other people avenue money. there is never the money to pay for socialism. there is never the money to pay for democrat programs. and when they need more -- they just -- propose it. republicans oppose it. republicans are accused of having no hearts and no compassion. and of hating people.
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>> stephanie, he was not talking about agriculture subsidies. for some strange reason, they kind of leave out that. >> right. right. >> let's not forget somebody eating dinner with him is going hungry if they're having dinner. >> ow. >> that was a classy, bad joke. listen, i could have said pass the oxycontin potatoes. i dent say idn't say it. >> rush is a football fan, football being the ultimate socialism sports enterprise, stadiums, paid for by taxpayer dollars. all sorts of socialist giveaways to the nfl. >> when, when it is the corporations getting the breaks they call it free enterprise. when it is middle-class americans and low income americans getting advantage they call it socialism. just a stupid argument. i mean, not, i mean, i can't say i am surprised that rush is bringing that up at the thanksgiving table. but, you know, it boils down
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to -- are you, for, or against, programs like medicare and social security. because if you don't want, if you say that socialism doesn't work, you don't want any socialism. get out there tomorrow and say that you are ready to pull the plug on grandma. you want death panels. get rid of medicare and you will get your death panels really fast. >> josh barrow, medicare is a much more purely socialistic system than the affordable care act is. >> absolutely. it's a single payer health care system. sort of, the protypical tea party statement during the fight over obama care was, you know i want to get the government out of my head care. people hatve this idea, once there is a government program nay like, it isn't socialist. just a good government program. i think this term made our discourse stupider than it need to be. there is a real fight to be had, how big the government should be, how it should be financed and what it should spend money on. when you throw the term socialism around. it means i don't look this
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program. >> stephanie, do you think, we are making any progress with the understanding of what socialism actually is? that is the problem in this whole area. the people who -- who hurl socialism as an accusation, don't actually know what it its. >> right. well, here is where i think that we could come to look a magical ending around the pumpkin pie. >> so perfect. the show is coming to an ending now. >> uncle mortie's eyes, you are right. single payer is the answer. >> there you go. david, josh, thank you very much for joining me tonight. >> sure thing. >> thank you. >> you know, i am going to ask for a last word from, stephany miller, i have been asked to actually say some last word tonight that, that i -- i just don't want to say. not the usual last word of the show. here on a card. would you kind of look in your camera over there and, and, can i just hold your cue card right here. >> in there too. i will do anything for you, lawrence o'donnell.
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>> anything? we do have more time? >> stretch. >> this is your last word. >> happy thanksgiving, everyone. and caught on camera is up next! fifth. what all three of these people capture on camera is shocking. >> something hit me like a ton of bricks. >> in plain sight and in their homes. >> get out of my face, man. >> using video cameras to f