Skip to main content

tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  December 10, 2015 11:00pm-12:01am PST

11:00 pm
ennobled or enriched by hatred or revenge. a bump for trump. a shock for the gop. let's play hardball. good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. far from hurting him, donald trump's call for a ban of those of islamic faith entering this country has fueled him. he's got a marginal edge among the party base on turning away muslims as a policy. this has put a scare into the republican establishment who now fear trump may have enough gas politically to get to the convention next summer. keeping any other candidate from coming to cleveland with a majority. that's second only to their worst case scenario that donald trump arrives.
11:01 pm
the notion of three or four or more candidates battling it out day after day on live television would be ratings bonanza for everyone. imagine the horror of it. i'm being sarcastic, democracy on live television. the latest new york times cbs poll released today shows trump climbing to 35% nationally. 35% among republicans. his closest competitor, ted cruz is 19 points back. ben carson comes in third now. followed by marco rubio at 9. in south carolina, this is the big story, a new fox news poll out today of republican primary voters shows trump ahead by -- he's at 35%. 20 points ahead.
11:02 pm
the polling was in the field when trump was calling for that ban on muslims coming into the country. it turns out that the call to keep the muslims out of country helped him with republican voters in south carolina. before he made that comment, trump was at 30%. in the two days following the comment saying so more muslims in the country, trump rose to 38%. they liked it down there. there's a brand new poll late today that shows republicans moderately behind even trumps proposal itself to ban muslims. 42% said they favor it. 36% say they are opposed. meanwhile, in a number of television appearances trump said republican voters agreed with him on the muslim ban. he blasted the republican establishment that come out against him. >> they all pretended i'd never run. then they said i'd run for a couple of weeks and get out. i play to win.
11:03 pm
they look foolish. some of them look stupid. some of them like carl rove is a fool. he thinks romney won the election. i think romney won. these people look very bad. i understand it. if i were in their position, i'd feel the same way. >> the establishment is foolish. these are foolish people. the establishment seems to be against me. i'll tell you who is not against me, the voters. the people you interview on the street, they had one network that looked out on the street. they couldn't find anybody against me. >> what a beautiful town. trump is said to speak within this hour. michael steele is former chair of the republican national committee.
11:04 pm
katie, thank you for joining us. it's been a rocky road covering this guy. i guess i'm surprised. he's rocking and rolling on these numbers no matter what i said or anybody else said, his base looks rock hard. >> reporter: nicole wallace describes it as it's the greatest untold story of this campaign season. they're coming out of nowhere for a lot of people. the gop has underestimated its republican base. the country in general has underestimate what had the republicans were looking. trump is what they were looking for. they just don't understand, don't trust muslims. that's why this ban that trump is proposing is going over so well with donald trump supporters and going over so well with republicans in this country. when you speak to supporters out here at his rallies, even one woman was saying they're just not like us. they don't fit in here.
11:05 pm
they do things differently. they're lifting weights instead of playing soccer, the kids are. these things that are a little bit out there or a lot out there. his supporters are that extreme by much more down the middle. people who say they are just a bit weary. they don't know what to do and feel like this is the only way to keep this country safe. they give limb the benefit of the doubt and say this is a temporary solution. >> it reminds me way back when he became muslim. a lot of people don't like it. a lot of people said he's great boxer and great american. let's root for him. we must be getting worse on this. where did he get the idea. he had that republican voters supports him. does he do quick polling or is it just, you said the same thing the other night, you can walk through his crowd and you have an automatic poll.
11:06 pm
>> reporter: his campaign and he, himself, have been adamant about not having pollsters on their payroll. sorry, there's a train. they do not pay pollsters. i think it's okay. they don't pay pollsters. they're not wasting their money. i think trump is being himself. there's a lot of people who like donald trump. they like him on the apprentice. the ones he's speaking to are embracing him and putting their arms around him saying give us more. >> that's not consistent with our history. people like franklin roosevelt back in the 30s when he went to back the court they didn't like him.
11:07 pm
most are vulnerable to making mistakes that hurt him. if this guy doesn't makes mistakes that people disagree with, but it doesn't seem to hurt him. that's fairly new, isn't it? i think it is. >> reporter: i think so. i've asked do you agree with him. they say i don't always agree but i like him. he's going to get my vote. even when he says things they don't agree with or too far or language that they use is just too extreme, donald trump, his supporters say it's okay. we trust him. we give him the benefit of the doubt. we think he will get in there and fix things. we think he'll iron out the details of his plans and smooth down his rhetoric and talk to foreign leaders in a nicer way. they're giving a pass where nobody else would get pass. >> we hope they're not really going to do what they say. if you're willing to kick out people, you see to me going
11:08 pm
through another door here. those aren't moral issues, necessarily. whether you have a religious test for getting into america. >> it's about who we are as a country. we have gone through these things before. you know the irish catholics were once looked at this way. they were subject of a foreign power. >> we got in. we got in and they hated us. >> my wife has her grandfather, great grandfather. we have his indentureship papers. >> when you talk about fdr or
11:09 pm
jerry ford, they were president. he is not president. even if he is at 35% of the republican base right now, that'sabout 17% of voters. he represents a sizable minority that has always squawked. >> let me make a point about your party, the center left or the left. let me talk about the center right. it seems dead. it didn't seem like there's an establishment left. tom rich said i'm not going to vote for him no matter what. nobody else is saying that. >> i think there's less that they're dead, it's more they don't flow what to do. they don't have a candidate that they can congeal behind to give him the kind of momentum to go toe to toe now. >> who is mitch mcconnell's candidate? >> they won't tell you. they don't want to see -- >> it would be the kiss of
11:10 pm
death. trust me, i get the math. everyone likes to dumb it down to 17% is small. that national poll that showed that 56% of americans thought islam was not compatible with american values, that wasn't just conservative republicans. that was a swath of people. democrats supported -- >> that could mean any number of things. doesn't mean keep them out of country. >> if you want to bake it and shake it any way you want, the question was very straightforward. >> how about a question to everybody before they are polled? do you know anybody muslim personally? just a starter. if you know them, you like them better. >> a guy on a wanted poster. >> this conversation is why donald trump is where he is. you're not understanding the fundamental -- you want to discount 43% of the democratic
11:11 pm
party that answered that poll. >> that poll is an outlier. >> keep saying that when he's president next year. >> absolutely not. >> what do you think are his chances? >> 50/50. >> 75/25. >> he's not going to beat hillary clinton. >> i mentioned the republican party is a lot higher percentage than it was two months ago. it's preparing for a convention. robert costa reported the senate majority republican party chair and other republican officials convene in a dinner last night, monday night this week where much of the discussion focused on the possibility of a broken convention. according to the quote, mcconnel did announce a deadlock is something to repair -- prepare for.
11:12 pm
the possibilities of a contested convention was more likely this year than any time in mod modern history. where is trump in terms of being a republican and blowing the whistle on a foul against him. he says if i'm not treated right, i'll jump and do my own thing. what is not being treated right mean right now? >> reporter: not being embraced and told he's the best and right in his various ideas. i think that's what he believes. he keeps dropping the hint he could run as an independent. he tweeted it. he's been asked about it. he won't rule it out despite the pledge he signed a couple of months ago. i think donald trump knows his best chance of winning is on the republican ticket. he wants to stay on the republican ticket. if he can take it to the
11:13 pm
general, he believes he has a good shot of beating hillary. i think it's a mostly empty threat because he would like to remain as a republican. >> it would be interesting. >> it would be fun. >> i wouldn't. i'm to ernest. there's a chance he could become president. >> that was my point. >> they're all saying this is an extremist point of view. you'll alienate the muslim world
11:14 pm
and that will hurt america. how do you react to a guy like cheney? >> i was against the war in iraq in 2003. >> let's keep it here. >> wait a minute. wait a minute. cheney started the war in iraq. talk about an extremist. >> you know what o riley's problem is he was with chaney. >> i'm with trump there. >> trump was right there. they're saying no. it's much more reflective on where the base is. that fuels some of this energy behind him. people don't want to acknowledge it. >> a broker convention, a contested convention all fascinating.
11:15 pm
>> all i can tell you is they have another war they want to start. they always got one they want. thank you. thank you for being out there all the time for us. great to have you out there on the front line, if you will. thank you so much. michael steele, your argument , all the people are guilty. that's the room where trump takes the stage. it's trump against the world. britain wants to keep trump out of the country as law. who else can trump offend? more details from the san bernardino shooter. a lot of news coming there. was that marriage between the two just a step in their march to mayhem. was it all part of it? divers have searching a nearby lake after a lead came into the fbi. what do you think they are looking for? more hardware, more guns? finally, let me finish with a
11:16 pm
difference between great politics and gamesmanship. this is hardball, a place for politics.
11:17 pm
bernie sanders of vermont is at 32. martin o' mallearthquake y at 3%. 65% for the former secretary of state. sanders, 21. we'll be right back.
11:18 pm
when a moment turns romantic why pause to take a pill? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use is approved to treat both erectile dysfunction and the urinary symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently, day or night. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. do not drink alcohol in excess. side effects may include headache, upset stomach, delayed backache or muscle ache. to avoid long-term injury, get medical help right away for an erection lasting more than four hours. if you have any sudden decrease or loss in hearing or vision, or any symptoms of an allergic reaction, stop taking cialis and get medical help right away. ask your doctor about cialis and a $200 savings card.
11:19 pm
get up to 48 monthsw interest-free financing on tempur-pedic, save $300 on beautyrest and posturepedic, or choose $300 in free gifts with stearns & foster. the triple choice sale ends soon at sleep train. welcome back. donald trump versus the world.
11:20 pm
the global community hits the proposal to ban muslims from entering the u.s. david cameron slammed trump. an online petition to ban trump from entering the uk. great britain is the most popular campaign on the government's website. they have over 250,000 signatures. trump responded today with an op-ed. quote, the uk politician should be thanking me instead of pandering to political correctness. each called it hate rhetoric and totally erroneous. trump cancelled his trip to israel. according to the post, a source that was involved in planning the trump visit attributed to
11:21 pm
cancellation to a petition signed by 37 lawmakers calling netanyahu to cancel the meeting and lawmakers will ban him from entering. everyone on the campaign went bezerk. the american people are used to get their news about america, focused on america. it's insulated in so many days. we care more about an nfl game than what's happening in most of the world. we do. it's fact. does the american people, do they care what the world thinks of donald trump or not? am i missing something? >> probably not. this whole brawl probably helps him with the conservative electorate with whom he is doing well. trump projects strength and his supporters see it as strength. people don't know about the
11:22 pm
intelligence sharing agreements with the germans or all these countries that trump is slamming. >> what he's saying is inconceivable. >> what is it about religion that makes the world obsessed with how bad the issue is? >> it's viewed as a complete overreaction to an issue. we went through all sorts of difficulties. did any leading serious contender in british politics say we need to close the doors to everybody from ireland. that's not seen. >> thanks for joining us. we're going to go to himself, donald trump.
11:23 pm
>> a level of it's the beauty of some of the greatest people that i know. no matter where i go, i just, the first people i see are the police. i always feel safe. i always feel good. i was invited up here, i think for a reason. i think i was invited up here for a reason. they tell me they have a big surprise for me. i don't know what the surprise is. i know my two friends just left the stage for a reason. if they give me a bad vote, i'm going to go crazy. a lot of things are happening and i believe that right now you're in the fore front of just being even more important than you ever were. when you look at what happened in california with those two people radicalized and look at the way the police took them out, that was tough stuff. [ applause ]
11:24 pm
>> tough stuff. we're going to do a lot. they're taking way the military equipment now. every time i see a conflict, i see a van pull up. i see an armor plated humvee pull up. i see tank pull up. we've got to let our police have the finest equipment and the finest training and if we don't, we're making a tremendous mistake as a country. a tremendous mistake. i've traveled up from new york. we've had people talking, i will tell you that. we have them talking very positively because people are saying trump is right.
11:25 pm
when i did my announcement at trump tower in june, i mentioned illegal immigration. the heat i took was unbelievable. it was unbelievable. the heat was incredible. i've never seen anything like it. far greater than what's happened over the last couple of days. you know that. he's shaking his head, you better believe it. the heat was incredible. within two weeks, people started saying wow, this is bad problem. we have people pouring across the border. we have drugs and crime pouring across the border. not even talking about the economics and the jobs that are being taken away. all of a sudden the other candidates who were criticizing me started saying well, actually i think -- then they say we need border. we need border. when i came across it and i said pay for the wall. i do that, i get these unbelievable applause from everybody. from everybody. we have the the boarder.
11:26 pm
if you don't have a border, you don't have a country. they want the wall. the right wall. not these jobs that we build right now. they build ramp and trucks go over the ramp and come down. load it up with drugs. they sell the drugs. we get the drugs and they get the money. doesn't work that way anymore. it's not going to work that way anymore. we're going to be very tough, very smart. i went through this so much and now i see the same thing happening. when i said, illegal immigration, all of a sudden people started thinking. two weeks later, three weeks later it was a nice conversation. when i talked about what i said the other day, all of a sudden i'm watching the shows this morning and tonight, you know trump has a point. the visa system is not working.
11:27 pm
this woman came in on a marriage visa. she was totally radicalized. she came in and all of a sudden they're saying it's not working. the visa system. another show was talking about something else not working. we've got to get down to the problems. we can't worry about being politically correct. we just can't afford anymore to be so politically direct. [ applause ] [ cheers and applause ] there's nobody in this country, if i wanted to be, that could be more politically correct than me. nobody. i have a high education. went to an ivy league school. i could be so good. you'd fall asleep. you'd fall asleep and it would take a long time to say everything. there's nobody.
11:28 pm
i will say this, we're going to get down to brass tax. so many people knew that those two in california were up to no good. they saw bombs sitting on the floor. they had one guy who bought the guns. they another person that said, i didn't want to report them because i didn't want to go racial profiling. oh, okay. pipe bombs sitting all over the place didn't want to racially profile. how stupid do they think we are. the person that said that, to me, they're under investigation. that was probably some lawyer said they have you called. they know you saw it. say you didn't want to racially profile. that's where we are as a country. we can't allow it to happen. people have to be vigilant. people have to keep their eyes open. if they did that, you wouldn't have had the world trade center.
11:29 pm
if they did what i said, you would have had bin laden killed before he got to the world trade center. he would have been killed. i wrote a book in the year 2000. i write about bin laden. that's two years before the world trade center came down. people said, wait a minute, he wrote about osama. what happened is i would see this guy on television. he was very threatening. i said, you better watch that guy. he's a bad guy. i wrote about it in my book. some of the commentators said trump wrote about bin laden before the world trade center came down. i get a lot of credit for it. i don't want credit. i want to have a safe, great country. [ applause ] normally i wouldn't make this trip but i had to because of my love and respect for police and
11:30 pm
law enforcement. i'll come back in a couple of minutes. can you imagine if they don't positively. look at all the press. that will be headlines, trump rejected. i feel confident. we'll be back in a couple of minutes. we'll be back in a few minutes. i love you. we'll be back in a couple of minutes. thank you. >> that's donald trump, of course up in portsmith, new hampshire. you've been the most outspoken on trump.
11:31 pm
you've been really tough. you're not the only one. you defined it rather well. you might want to do it again what a facist is. why does he meet that description? >> he's exercising outside of what is the democratic system. he's saying we're going to ban all people from entering this country based on religion. our constitution, our tradition doesn't allow that. he's beyond our constitution and tradition. he's using democratic means as an attempt to get power in which we would exercise it presumably in way that's unconstitutional. >> you said the belief in the strong man. the leader can beat any other problem in the world. there's superficial comparisons. they create an overwhelming sense of crisis that only a huge
11:32 pm
personality can overcome. they create the sense of victimhood. victimhood say they are foreigners and people who are victimizing us. it comes down to this huge personality that's needed by extraordinary means. >> a lot of people saw a big difference in what he said a few days ago about keeping muslim people out of country. that was nonsense. it doesn't affect the polls. the polls haven't shown any change. >> probably helped. >> that's something the white house is pointed out too. in the past the white house has not commented on the things that
11:33 pm
trump or any of the republicans have said. this week you saw stark change from the obama administration. you had white house press secretary hitting him really hard. >> netanyahu hitting him. >> yeah. saying no thank, i reject this proposal. all these candidates coming out against this proposal distancing themselves. >> supporting trump now is to make a statement in support of what he's been saying. i don't think you can say i like him except for this. that's hard way to say that's something over here. it's front and center about our country. if you say you're for a guy that wants that, then you're for that. >> his deportation policy is facist too.
11:34 pm
that's going into homes and breaking up families. there's a lot of families where there's somebody who is undocumented and legally. >> i know the cruelty aspect. >> this could be a turning point against trump. what's necessary to happen here is not just his opponents and others saying i disagree with his policy. they need to call him out and say he's not acceptable. he doesn't speak for conservatives. >> none of them will say i will not support. >> that is correct. >> they're saying i am with him. >> i've been trying to press the candidates on that. it's easy to not respond to e-mails and bypass supporters. i hope they say will you support him. >> he says if you don't treat me fairly, i'm going third party. >> they're afraid he will take his people with him. the round table is staying with us. up next, cruz control.
11:35 pm
who's the real guy sneaking along behind trump who is hoping to win? texas senator ted cruz is quietly rising to the top. you're watching hardball.
11:36 pm
11:37 pm
great time for a shiny floor wax, no? not if you just put the finishing touches on your latest masterpiece. timing's important. comcast business knows that. that's why you can schedule an installation at a time that works for you. even late at night, or on the weekend, if that's what you need. because you have enough to worry about. i did not see that coming. don't deal with disruptions. get better internet installed on your schedule. comcast business. built for business.
11:38 pm
donald trump has been endorsed by the police organization in portsmith, new hampshire. let's listen again. >> the job you do in this room is second to none, and everybody in our country knows it. everybody in our country knows it. i want to thank you guys. thank you very much. what a great honor. thank you, jerry. that's great.
11:39 pm
thank you. one of the things we were just discussing and i was back with the board and i said, and the question was asked, they've had a hard time. police forces throughout the country have had a hard time. a lot of people killed. a lot of people killed very violently sitting in car, waiting, sitting car, watching. somebody comes from behind, and i said that one of the first things i'd do in terms of executive order, if i win, would sign a strong statement that anybody killing a policeman, policewoman, police officer, anybody killing a police officer death penalty. it's going happen. okay. can't go. we can't let this go. we can't let this go.
11:40 pm
such great honor. i guess over the period of time i'll be given other honors. there will be nothing more important than this night. thank you all very night, board, and thank you everybody else, police. great evening. great honor. thank you. >> i was talking to robert costa today, he said trump will be low key until next tuesday night. they expect all the attacks will be on him and the focus of the cameras and the story will be on him. he wants to save his ammo. >> he's going to have to defend the position he took. >> he's ready. he knows it's coming. >> he's going to be ready for whatever attack. it will be interesting to see who goes after him hardest. >> what happens when chris christie throws his round house punch and trump is waiting for
11:41 pm
him and knocks him right dead. you didn't know about the bridge too christie. i think he wants it. brings him to the center of the attention again. >> i think that's part of the the reason he released this plan when he did. when you see someone like ted cruz starting to do better. >> we all focused on trump. around him, circling him, sort of getting ready to move up is cruz. he's not a lot more attractive to most people in the political center or left than trump. what he's done, if you look at the polling up there, the poll in iowa where he has real good chance with the home schoolers and the very religious right. he's taken the thunder completely from ben carson. carson has lost. he's won. he's in first place ahead -- >> he's not necessarily the savior consensus candidate. >> i don't think he'd be. >> i'm not sure that's going to
11:42 pm
help him. he's deflated carson. i don't think trump and cruz are necessarily looking at the same voters in iowa. there's the very strong evangelical component. that's who cruz is going after. trump is in his lane looking for that angry disaffected older white male voter. >> also in the favor of trump, i think he's more secular. nobody accused him of being homophobe or anti-gay. he's not in that league. >> i don't see them as going head to head with each other because they're not competing. cruz is waiting as a scavenger if and when he falls. >> he's not going to go after trump. trump would probably start attacking him and he would see his see his numbers go down. if ted cruz is smart, i think
11:43 pm
he's very smart, keeps doing exactly what he is doing and he will come in first or second in iowa. >> cruz has benefitted a lot from trump being in this race. cruz looks like the reasonable, nonestablishment. >> he's at 24 in iowa and trump is at 19. carson is down to 13. he's lost 19 points. explain. >> he's the obvious choice. carson, they decided that carson is probably not electable. trump, they've decided maybe he's too toxic. cruz is the place they can setting on. that's why cruz benefits from trump being in the race. >> if you're hillary clinton, i'm probably rooting for cruz. he's a great debater, a brilliant guy in my ways, he's not likable at all. >> yeah. >> well, if you're hillary clinton, she keeps saying she'd like to debate donald trump as well.
11:44 pm
>> that's easy. would you really think she would like to debate donald trump? >> maybe not necessarily debate him but i don't think she would mind running against him. >> i've seen her debate really well. >> when she gets fired up. >> when she's prepped and confident and she's really good. i'm sorry. i don't want to overwhelm you. i can't set you straight. what's your opinion? >> i think when she's fired up she's very -- ted cruz isn't bad to beat either. he's doing so well because he had break out debate appearance. >> i've seen fired up guys that lost the debate. up next, these people tell me something i don't know. this is hardball, the place for politics.
11:45 pm
11:46 pm
michael, tell me something i don't know. >> in january after the holidays there's going to be a big effort by some republican money people to put together some super pacs and put a lot of money behind it and try to finish trump off. i don't know how they will do it. >> who is the leader of the band? >> i can't really say. it's going to be big money. >> you can't say because you don't want to tell me or you don't know? >> it's going to be big money
11:47 pm
and they will try to hit him hard. >> why are they being so secretive? if so courageous, don't they tell us who they are. >> it's not time yet. >> i hear you got a good one. >> as you may have noticed on sunday night when the president gave his address, he spoke behind a lecturn. typically he would sit behind the desk. i looked into it. it's not unprecedented what he did. jfk stood behind a lecturn to give a speech. typically presidents sit behind the desk. >> did you think it looked right? >> i thought it looked a little interesting. >> i keep thinking who else is in the room. it's like people before him but there's nobody before him. there's a couple of camera guys bored to death. >> it was noticeable. lots of people noticed it. >> it was like a belt and suspenders. all the props at once. i'll give you a preview of my sunday column. iowa will make news on february 1st with the vote. they will make news on january 1st because they are launching
11:48 pm
the most radical and rapid privatization of the program. we'll be talking about in iowa a fight between the republican governor and the obama administration. if they let it go we'll see -- >> how does the privatization affect the average american? >> they're being kicked off the traditional fee for service program and got to go into this managed care system. >> they haven't lined it up. >> thank you. thank you, everybody. up next, new details emerging in the san bernardino investigation including an fbi search of lake looking for evidence. what are they looking for? more guns or ammo that may be linked to the two killers? hardball returns after this. (politely) wait, wait, wait! you can't put it in like that,
11:49 pm
you have to rinse it first. what's that, alfredo? no,that can go in. no it can't! what are you, nuts? that's baked-on alfredo. baked-on? it's never gonna work. dish issues?
11:50 pm
trust your dishwasher with cascade platinum. it powers... through... your toughest stuck-on food. better than finish. (to the hostess) see, told you it would work... (turns to girl 2) you guys heard me say that, right? cascade. the tougher tough-food cleaner. epic comebacks! and now epic meatz! i love football...and pizza. get our new epic meatz pizza. with five meaty meatz. just $12 for a large. better ingredients. better pizza. better football.
11:51 pm
welcome back to "hardball." investigators out in san bernardino, california say that one of the shooters, syed farook, discussed staging a terrorist attack in the l.a. area with his friend and neighbor enrique marquez, a convert to islam, as early as 2012. that's three years ago. but farook got cold feet at that time. today the fbi had four dive teams searching a lake near the shooting scene. look at that. following a tip that the shooters may have visited the area either before or after the attack itself. nbc's blake mccoy joins us tonight from san bernardino. what's the evidence that people are look for? blake. >> reporter: that's the big question, chris. i just got back from the lake.
11:52 pm
the fbi held an impromptu press conference because a lot of people in that area, a lot of neighbors have come around and are gathering and are concerned about what they're looking for in the lake. the fbi says they have leads that place the couple in this park around this lake around the time of the shooting. they won't say what evidence they're looking for but we do know that in previous searches around the home they found two crushed cell phones that had tried to be destroyed by this couple. they're working to see if they can get any information off of those cell phones. so it is very possible, and they're working under the assumption that there could be more evidence that this couple tried to dump or destroy. you can see one of the dive teams there. and i'm told that water is very, very murky. that's why you see them even just on the shore there feeling around with their hands to see if anything's in that water, chris. >> i can't see anything. what about enrique marquez? what's his explanation publicly for why he bought them the two rifles? semi-automatics. >> well, he purchased the two rifles, 2011 and 2012. he's being interviewed by the fbi. we're told he's been interviewed several times, is being
11:53 pm
cooperative. this is a childhood friend of farook. he checked himself into a mental hospital right after the shooting, was released sometime on sunday and has been cooperating with authorities since. now, the fbi today at that press conference, chris, would not answer any of our questions relating to him. just saying that he is being questioned. one interesting thing to come out of the press conference, though, is they said even though the two shooters are dead they're being very careful about evidence gathering and what information they share with the media because the potential that this could go to trial, that potentially charges could come against somebody at some point. we should point out, though, marquez is not a named suspect. >> okay. thank you so much for that. blake mccoy. malcolm nance is executive director of the terror asymmetrics project. give us a sense. the mystery here, it's not romance exactly but i think everyone would like to find out how did this pair get together? what was the sequence of events? was it radicalization first? getting together first? do we know anything about that, how it happened?
11:54 pm
>> i think the preponderance of evidence is starting to point to the direction that there was radicalization first and then he went out onto the marriage network, which is very overwhelmingly seen everywhere in the middle east. you see online websites for wives and brides and things like that. and so they were two people of a like mind and they came together and after a period of time here felt that they had to take action. but i don't believe that this was a situation where they infiltrated an agent through a marriage bureau. that's just -- >> so there's no reason to believe that she was ready to participate in a terrorist act before the marriage? >> well, it's quite possible that she was radicalized in the sense that she felt that things that were going on in the middle east weren't to her liking and that they were not as religious as they could have been. and she was living in saudi arabia. very, very orthodox society. >> sure is.
11:55 pm
>> but you have to understand isis's ideology and the ideology of al qaeda and groups like that is far more orthodox. and they consider that a more perfect society. so for her she probably did get radicalized at some point. but the question is when they came together when did they decide to transition from that to attacking the nation that they had lived in. >> let's keep trying find out. malcolm nance, thank you as always for your expertise. when we return let me finish with the difference between great politics and gamesmanship. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics.
11:56 pm
11:57 pm
11:58 pm
11:59 pm
let me finish tonight with the difference between great politics and gamesmanship. politicians should propose what they believe is good for the country. is that too simple a notion? the people running for office should stick to advocating the policies they actually believe in. and does anyone really believe that donald trump thinks it would be good policy for the united states to deny entry to this country anyone who follows the faith of islam? how would you possibly decide? would a u.s. immigration official be responsible for separating the true believers from those who simply look like they come from a country with a large islamic population? and what about those who come from a largely christian or buddhist country? how would the person at arrivals at the airport know the person standing next in line is a muslim? so just off the bat it would be impossible to carry out trump's latest nostrum. and 23 he can't carry it out why is he proposing it? this is all apart from the rightness or wrongness of what he's pitching. as much as i don't like following the crowd on much of anything, as you know, in this case the crowd is right and
12:00 am
trump is wrong. worldwide. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in" with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on "all in" -- >> the establishment seems to be against me. >> republican leaders hold an emergency meeting to prepare for a brokered convention as the evidence showing that donald trump isn't going anywhere mounts. >> i don't play games. i play to win. then, ted cruz makes his move to take out trump. a house democrat's questionable remarks on islam. >> it can be anywhere between 5% and 20% from the people that i speak to that islam is their religion and who have a desire for caliphate. and as paris talks continue, a look at our changing climate from space. >> extremes of weather that are occurring in places that you normally don't see them.