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tv   MSNBC Live With Velshi and Ruhle  MSNBC  June 27, 2017 8:00am-9:01am PDT

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>> thank you. good morning, i'm stephanie ruhle. >> and i'm ali velshi, let's get started. >> ominous warning to syria. >> the new stern statement implies an attack by the assad regime could be imminent. >> a warning that took some u.s. military officials by surprise. >> it's an unnerving statement, i'm not sure what information he has i'm all for deterring assad from using chemical weapons. >> i'm trying to figure out by the end of close of business today, there a health care bill we're talking about. >> you think it's not going to impact you and your family, dead wrong. >> it's not people are getting pushed off, it's that people will choose off not to buy something they don't like or want. it's the biggest signature issue we have and biggest promise we've ever made in the modern era. >> have you seen a single person come out on the air on your program or anywhere else saying this is a good bill? >> no. >> obviously it's not good news, the important factor is my state
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is medicare expansion state. >> it makes me more concerned. i've been uncommitted and i remain uncommitted. >> this mean, ugly bill. >> the white house is issuing a stern warning to syria. citing evidence that the syrian government is preparing another deadly chemical weapons attack aimed at its own people, including preparations are similar to the attack in april that killed dozens of civilians, including children. days after that attack, a military response from the united states. this one, dozens of tomahawk cruise missiles slamming into syrian government air base. >> 59 tomahawk missiles, it cost $180 million and now a white house statement issued by press secretary sean spicer last night warns that if mr. assad conducts another mass murder attack using chemical weapons, he and his military will pay a heavy price. all of this, this is what i want you to pay attention to, caught
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some u.s. military intelligence officials completely off guard. >> they didn't know what this was about and what information the president was working off of. hans nichols has been covering this live from the pentagon. you've been digging around to find out who knows what about the information that led to sean spicer to put out this press relief. >> reporter: mid morning here around 8:30, pentagon officials started saying yes, we have seen that intelligence and they kind of detailed what they saw and that is that it was compelling and it was suggestive of intent by the assad regime to potentially, the hedge there, use chemical weapons, it was in the same air field and actually from the same hardened air shelter that was hit in the april 7th strike. just in the last hour, i've been talking to a lot of officials here and they are saying don't think of this warning from the white house as anything akin to preparing for battle or battle plans. yes, they do have naval assets in the eastern mediterranean but what's happening right now at the pentagon is fundamentally
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different from what happened in early april. now, as to why this warning was issued, secretary -- ambassador nikki haley spoke to that moments ago and kind of walked through everyone what the reasoning behind the warning was. >> i believe that the goal is at this point not just to send assad a message, but to send russia and iran a message, if this happens again, we are putting you on notice and my hope is that the president's warning will certainly get russia and iran to take a second look and i hope it will caution assad from the fact we don't want to see innocent men and women and children hurt again. >> just the initial reporting on this last night, also the context of the tweet from sean spicer with the statement without a lot of context, the initial reporting was that pentagon and military officials were caught off guard when we were calling around people last night. no one seemed to know this
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statement was coming. i think we should separate the statement -- >> from the intelligence. >> here's what's sara huckabee sanders said, in response to several inquires regarding the issue last night, we want to clarify that all relevant agencies odni were involved in the process from the beginning. anonymous leaks to the contrary are false. and guys, just in terms of where secretary mattis was last night. he was on his plane flying to germany. general dunford was in afghanistan and will be for a few days as they do the strategy assessment. >> it's interesting, you're not hearing from mattis or mcmaster or kelly, you're hearing from two people, sean spicer and sarah huckabee sanders who work over time on president trump branding and messaging he wants out there. >> interesting you do hear from nikkei haley, not rex tillerson. >> hans, thanks very much for that. we'll continue to cover that as
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it develops. we want to talk about trumpcare. >> without a doubt. there it is in senate and we know that 22 million americans will lose health care under the republican bill and we got that figure from the bipartisan congressional budget office, cbo score, we talk about it all the time. >> now susan collins of maine says she will vote no on a critical test vote that comes as early as this afternoon. it's called an mtp, a motion to proceed. the reason i give you initials if you look at her tweets she refers to an mtp. three other senators also say they are voting no on the motion. >> don't count out majority leader mitch mcconnell. it is a strategic plan and can only afford to lose three republican votes, so vice president mike pence is heading to the hill for meetings today to try to convince those holdouts and they have a lot of money in the budget they could offer up goodies, pence is going to be hosting a dinner tonight for conservatives to hear their specific concerns.
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>> and there are concerns about premiums and dedublgtibles. i want to break that down for you and apologize ahead of time because it's complicated because this is complicated. i tell you what, for those on twitter, tweet me @ ali velshi and tell me what you don't like and i'll fix it throughout the course of the day. >> healthcare, who knew it was so complicated. >> i'm using aca in place of obamacare, if you don't like that, i'll change it to obamacare and bcra, better care resolution act. this is trumpcare in the senate. by 2026 obamacare would be increasing at the rate of 5.5% a year. trumpcare will be according to the cbo increasing at the rate of 4.4% a year. nothing is going down. i need to understand this, senators tweeting that premiums are going down. nothing is going down ever under any circumstances. it may go up by less.
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there's an asterisk to that as well. a 40-year-old making $36,000, we benchmark as a silver plan, brongs a bronze and 1i8 ver plan. this person would pay $6500 a year. under trumpcare by 2026, the 40-year-old making $57,000, a little more than the american average would pay $5,000 a year in premiums. now, let me show you what the asterisk is, it's not the silver plan. if you look under trumpcare, what they are offering is something that is much more akin to a bronze plan because there are basic minimum coverages that don't have to be there. this is the apples to apples comparison we should be making. by 2026 that person under obamacare would be paying $5500 for the same coverage under trumpcare they'll pay $5,000.
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this is the apples to apples comparison that you're not seeing in the cbo score we had to work for many hours to figure out. they have something called act wearial values, the silver care has a value of 70%. it pays roughly 70% of your cost and bronze pays 60% under obamacare, the trumpcare bill, average will be 58%. as i said when this came out, you're going to possibly pay less than you would have under obamacare for less insurance coverage. there's no free lunch anywhere in life. it's less money for less coverage. let me give you another example, a 40-year-old making 26,5,000, a low income individual, that's a little over the poverty line but low income individual. under the affordable care act, getting a bronze package, because that's what we're working with. this is the new benchmark and getting subsidies, their cost
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would be $700 but the subsidies are going away, a 40-year-old making 26,000 by 2026 now going to pay almost double of what they would have under obamacare. one more example, a 64-year-old, at 65 you can get into medicaid. 64-year-old making $57,000 by 2026, under obamacare, silver package, they would have been paying 6800. under obamacare, the bronze package which we're now using as the benchmark because that's what trump care has, they would pay a lot less, $4400. this is what they pay under trump care, $16,000. a 64-year-old making a little more than the national average will go from paying $6800 paying $16,000 for less coverage than they are going to get. that's the story of premiums. >> we talk a lot about trickle
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down economics, if people had more money in their pictuocket would spend it. i don't see a parallel between the tax cut for the wealthy resulting in more boom to our economy. unclear to me. >> the interesting thing about that particular way of looking at things, when you give tax cuts to people who live close to the bone, don't have a lot of income, that tends to get used in the economy, a dollar of a tax cut to somebody who is living close to the national average gets spent in the money. a dollar given to somebody at the top 1% doesn't have the same effect. >> that person close to the national average isn't benefitting. i want to take a close look at trump care and specifically medicaid. >> that's the big deal. >> the federal government is going to be reducing its spending on the program by $772 billion over the next ten years. by 2026, the cbo expects 15 million fewer americans will be enrolled in medicaid and most of them would not buy private coverage with the price of
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premiums and deductibles most likely too high. >> there's a reason you're on medicaid, you don't have the luxury -- >> we need to break down who gets medicaid in this country. it's 20% of all americans. 39% of all children, 49% of all births covered by medicaid along with 64% of all nursing home residents. where are they going to go for coverage? that is according to the kiser family foundation and we'll break down this down with david hoppy, a senior correspondent for the one nation health coalition that supports the effort to repeal and replace obamacare and also president of hoppy's strategies. i want to start first with president trump's base, he had a populist base, forgotten americans who felt they couldn't afford health care. we look closely at the senate bill, where we know poor people could be paying more, elderly people will be paying more and overall coverage will be less, that's psident trump's base,
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not wealthy gop donors and healthy mil lennials who don't want to buy coverage. how does this serve those forgotten americans who voted for president trump? >> under obamacare they could not afford health care. i was listening on a program this morning and somebody came on and said he's a middle aged man who has a wife and three kids and had a mild heart attack and he was on obamacare. price for $500 for premiums and $8,000 deductible for each individual. i haven't been to the doctor since. so obamacare did cause that. the question you have to look at and what cbo -- >> before you get to that, if he couldn't afford abomb macare, how will he afford health care better under trumpcare sir? >> that's the key here. because what you find is that the cbo analysis does not take into effect a marketplace working. one of the reasons is, it's not their fault, the model doesn't
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reflect the fact that markets work. there's no morkt place in health care in the united states, never has been since world war ii. what we're looking at can you create a new system which will put competition out there so families and doctors make the choices and they can work together to find the health care they need. you're going to need transparency of this and know what a doctor charges for this and that and the other and what a hospital charges and different services are charged. those are things you'll have to have. but the question is will the market work if families and their doctors -- >> let me ask you a question. you and i had this discussion once before and you promised to come back with an answer. give me one place, anywhere on earth, any country you want, you can even use adjoining planets where a privatized fully private marketplace works to cover people for health insurance. just one. if you give me one, i'll stop down this line.
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>> the united states doesn't have one. singapore maybe and other places come closer but we're not -- >> nobody has one. >> not a single country -- i'll answer the question -- >> you don't have to because i'll answer it myself. here's the situation, even if you put into effect and i hope they will put into effect a system which gives the states more authority to work with their people to find a better way of doing things than the federal government does it and give families and doctors more choices you will still have a system that includes medicaid, medicare and the employer system funded system and also those people who are veterans and those people. it won't -- it's not like you're going to a system that's totally market oriented. it's not because there's going to be help for some people at the lower end and some people who are elderly -- >> david -- >> within the system the people we're trying to help are the people under obamacare lost their doctor, had payments going through the roof and can't afford to use the health care
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they have. they have health care but can't afford to use it because they never can pay the $8,000 of the deductible. the question is, can we change this around and look to change this government centered system to one that has families and their doctors working -- >> i don't know what means. i just showed you numbers. you're welcome to challenge my numbers. >> doctors think this is a bad idea and it violates the first rule of medicine. i want to pull this up. this is from the american medical association, letter they wrote to mitch mcconnell just yesterday, quote, medicine has long operated under the presept of premium non -- >> i can't even read this or first to not harm. the draft of the legislation violates that on many levels. these aren't my words, this comes from medical experts -- we've had this discussion before, you talk to individual doctors and some of them like it, some don't, talk to the ama,
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they came down because they are a political organization and helped work on the aca bill and got things they like in it and standing by it -- >> let's look at another thing, a different situation -- >> you think the situation is in the pocket of obamacare. >> let's look at states that have not had the sort of problems we see in states that have nobody funding the exchange, no insurers coming into the changes and there are states like that and a lot of counties within states where you have it. let's look at the state and good example is indiana, which in 2007 under mitch daniels started a healthy indiana plan it was continued on under governor pennsylvania and he made changes and got help by getting a waiver from the obama administration. that's a state in which health care seems to be working and seems to be working because the state looked and found what worked for them, what worked for their people, helping them have accounts there like health
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savings accounts. >> i have to ask you, i can talk to our bosses about getting you a show at the moment this is ours. answer a couple of questions. >> sure. >> i don't even know what we're saying about the american medical association, why they would be a unique interest group but add to that list, there are more than a dozen, aarp, american cancer association, american heart association, american diabetes association, american nurses association, every single one of them has come out against this bill. >> and by the way, before mitch mcconnell met with the 13 members of hommittee that wrote this, he met with lobby t lobbyists from the health care industry, to say they are special interest groups working with obamacare, they are also working with the senate. >> what he's met with them as others have met with them. he's met with groups like the aarp and other groups and doctor's groups and patient groups and a lot of people. that's what senator mcconnell does. >> he actually hasn't, to be clear he actually hasn't.
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they actually have letters and come on our network every day to say he has not granted them a meeting. lobbyists got meetings, health associations didn't. >> i haven't seen the letters, that's fine. the key here is can we solve the problem of health care in the united states, which is deepened and gotten worse under obamacare because people can no longer afford it. and the question is, is there an alternative to the government making all decisions? if you make that fundamental change where the family and their doctor starts to get to make decisions, they also have the ability to have access, benefits and choigss and health savings act, pay their premiums, pay deductibles and pay their doctor directly, are we going to free and open up this system so people have the right to make choices along with their doctors for their families and you and your family? that's a question right now we're going through because we've seen that obamacare under the hands of people who loved it
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and tried to nurture it, didn't work. you couldn't keep your doctor or plan and your prices went up dramatically. something is broken here and everybody knows it is. how can we solve it? through people having the power to make decisions for themselves and family with their doctor or solve it with the government taking more power. that's a fundamental decision we're looking at right now. >> we can agree something is broken. the question is, is the current senate bill the correct thing that will improve it? thank you for joining us. >> happy to be here. >> this just in, health care holdout rand paul will go to the white house to meet with president trump at noon today. remember, he is a holdout and the white house can't afford holdouts on this. >> straight out of the gate on friday quick to go to the cameras and say it is not a repeal of obamacare, and didn't think it was enough. we'll have much more on that right here and we'll live the big city and head to trump country in rural ohio to hear what people there make of the
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senate republicanss plan, on their mind, one word, can you guess what it is? medicaid? >> what does it mean to be a patient if this health care bill passes, what will change for you and what will stay the same? >> the problem for parents is going to be do i choose my child's medicine or my child's food. it is a reality that without health insurance, someone who is trying to feed their family will put off their own health care. people put off their own health care as it is. (baby crying) ♪ fly ♪ me to the moon (elegant music) ♪ and let me play (bell rings)
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welcome back to velshi and hoo ruhle. i missed. let's talk more on the impact of the senate health care bill. >> because six days isn't enough for us. >> we're going to talk about it until it gets voted on. the largest savings in the federal budget will come from the roll back of medicaid, which is the state federal program that covers poor people and others. this is going to result in the biggest number of uninsured peop people. >> behind the numbers are real people. ron mott visited a small town in ohio where he found enormous concern. >> reporter: like much of rural america, barnsville, ohio has few health care options and many challenges. suffice it to say, republican led efforts to overhaul the nation's health system are followed intently, invoking fear
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and loathing here. >> there's a lot riding on this. >> reporter: for jeff britain, which operates this and three other non-profit family health centers, higher premiums and deductibles and medicaid roll back are the stuff of worries. >> when medicaid expansion dollars went into existence, we were able to expand services and provide additional services to our patients and expand the number of patients we could serve. so rolling back those dollars is going to significantly roll back our services. >> page holland works full-time at mcdojd's while holding down a second job and medicaid expansion covers her health needs. >> i've been having a lot of appointments and take more medications than i like lately it's really been helping me out with being able to pay for them and i know if it does go away, it's going to hurt me a lot. >> reporter: with monday's congress budget office report predicting 22 million covered won't be if the bill becomes law, their frustrations are
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apparent and page points the fickif i can finger of blame towards president trump. >> it's whole array of emotions but confusion on why he's doing this to the people who really need it and then anger of why he's doing it. >> reporter: medicaid expansion added 700,000 ohioans to the health care rolls with intended benefits, percentage of people with high blood pressure and obesity and elevated cholesterol dropped. in ohio where opioid addiction have reached alarming levels, significant decreases in medicaid funding or likely to have widespread impact. >> we'll make sure we still give the care to the patients but it's going to be huge financial burden. >> spending cuts will affect oep yad treatment nationwide especially in ohio where the rate of fastal overdose was twice the average in 2015. for courtney taylor, much simpler, dire needs, only filed
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one medicaid claim but enjoys affordable coverage as she pursues a college degree. >> this is a big deal. maybe some people don't completely understand what is happening, they might need that help and maybe it won't be there. >> that was ron mott. joining us now is dr. natalie azar, nyu langone medical center in new york. there's people in the group -- most people get -- >> how about everyone? >> lots of people get their insurance through the way i'm talking about how you get covered, you have group coverage and medicaid and medicare and then people with no insurance. >> yeah. >> how do these proposed changes affect a patient when they go to a doctor. >> to your point, the majority of p.m. in this country do get employer sponsored health care. this whole discussion we're talking about millions of people but it does represent a smaller percentage of the big nut but that doesn't mean it's not
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important. the medicaid numbers in and of themselves are staggering. to ron's piece about the rural aspect of all of this, there are nuances and differences between rural medicaid health care and urban health care. lots of people look into this health care policy experts have done studies and there are subtle differences between the two but nonetheless very important. rural patients to be older and sicker and hospitals are typically there in rural areas not for profit. you don't have that much margin for error and rethey rely on public funding. >> could those differences make an argument for shifting this to state coverage. people made the argument to us, what works for maine doesn't work for california. is there an argument to be made each state should make the decision? >> intuitively i would say yes, a state is going to say this is my bucket of money and we happen to have more under age births
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and we have a higher percentage who require oep yad epidemic interventi intervention. i understand that but globally and i say this i'm not an economist, but if you're losing the funding from the federal government, you're going to make cuts where you need it. . you have to think of infrastructure and education and all of these other places for reasons that are inexplicable to me, this seems to be the places where the slash comes most easily. >> you hear people say transferring the responsibility to the state and it also means if it's your responsibility, you've got to pay the bills and states can't run deficits the federal government can. it's such -- it's a complicated problem. >> i don't think governors are -- >> who knew. >> coming up, thank you so much, three words, in a mountain of uncertainty for refugee, we'll clear up the confusion over the phrase bon fid relationship and
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the trump administration is getting ready to implement parts of the travel ban reinstated by the supreme court monday. the 90 4i6 day ban restricts people from coming to the united states from six muslim majority countries, iran, libya, smol i can't and sudan and syria. now, that can include a family member living in the country, a student admitted to a u.s. university or worker with a job offer. a bonafide relationship is not a relationship that exists only to get around the ban. for example, one between refuge guys and immigrants rights groups that may reach out as potential clients, that's not included under the ruling the total number of refugees admitted for this fiscal year will be capped at 50,000. federal officials are busy getting ready to implement all of this and reviewing vetting
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procedures of visa applicants expediting completion of a biometric entry/exit system and the state department will resume in person interviews for all people seeking nonimmigrant visas. there's not much time because this order is set to take effect on thursday. ali velshi, i mentioned syria on that list and the white house put out the statement there could be a threat of a chemical attack. if you're living there -- >> worried about the them cal attack but can't get here as a refugee, even under attack from different groups of people, reporting bipartisanship to the test in congressman from both sides of the aisle on the spot. is there any hope for a happy medium on health care? we'll find out. >> the world's confidence? pld trump is plummeting in a pugh research poll of 37 countries, only 22% of respondents expressed confidence in trump.
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that is a seat decliteep declin confident in his leadership at the end of his presidency but russia and israel are bright spots for trump, the only two countries with favorable opinions with him. we'll dig into that next. we'll be right back.
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(b♪by crying) minutes old. ♪ a baby's skin is never more delicate. ♪ what do hospitals use to wash and protect it? ♪ johnson's® the number 1 choices in hospitals. >> welcome back. here are the top stories we're watching right now. the white house claims the
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syrian government is preparing a new chemical attack and warns the assad government it will pay a heavy price if it carries out such an attack. >> with the health care bill in danger, we just learned president trump will meet with one republican senator against the bill. rand paul's office confirms he'll go to the white house to meet with the president at noon. the congressional budget office announced it expects $22 million people to lose their insurance and six republicans are against the legislation. >> european antitrust officials fine google $2.7 billion. google is accused of unfairly favoring some of its own services over its rivals. google says it's considering an appeal. >> a former nsa contractor accused of leaking classified documents will be in court today. her name reality winner, she has pled not guilty and has been denied bail. >> it's day two of jury selection in securities and wire fraud trial ever former
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executive martin shkreli. potential jurors used words including evil and snake and greed to describe shkreli. i imagine they didn't make it on the final jury. more than 100 have been dismissed. not a well liked guy. >> quite a personality. >> the much needed effort to build republican support for the president many's trump care bill. mike pence will have lunch and series of meetings of lawmakers withhe key test vote could come as early as today. >> it's a procedural test vote before they can run the actual vote. >> are you with me? >> let's go to the big stage. >> raul ruiz from colorado who served as an emergency room doctor before joining congress in 2012 and republican member tom reed and co-chair of the diabetes caucus, we kept them waiting so they probably solved
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the whole problem between them. we have bipartisanship going on in front of us. good to see you, medicaid has helped people in california immensely. let's put stats on for the audience to see. there were 7 million people, almost 8 million people on medicaid in california before obamacare. and the total medicaid and chip, children's health insurance program is up 58% to 12.2 million people. medicaid is a bill deal there. >> absolutely. the medicaid expansion is the lifeline to many parents throughout rural america and state of california and big urban cities. you have about 46% of kids who rely on medicaid, 76% of kids who are impoferrished on medicaid and people in nursing homes who potentially lose that resource for them as seniors if we repeal the medicaid
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expansion. it's 15 million people will lose their health insurance by the repeal of the medicaid expansion. >> congressman meade, what do you say about the state of new york, specifically in upstate new york who depend on medicaid? >> obviously the fundamental bill supports the base medicaid with 100% and poverty and below being taken care of even under the senate bill and house bill. what we're trying to do stand with the working poor. the medicaid expansion population those that are working. we can target tax credits to choose not to participate in medicaid. people want their own health insurance. >> sir, working and affording health care are two different things. if people lose coverage they should go out and get jobs, people have jobs, it doesn't mean they can afford their health care. >> listen, there's people out
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there working two and three jobs, because where i represent, people that i grew up with, still don't have the means to pay for their health insurance and kids -- they are going to lose out in having health insurance. let me tell you about hiv positive man who is work, not making enough to pay for his anti-retrovirals but because of medicaid expansion now able to pay for his hiv medicines that have kept him alive. he's extremely concerned that with the repeal he's going to lose his health insurance and unable to pay for his medicine. this can be applied to many people who have chronic illnesses. >> let me ask you something, you are on the diabetes committee. i wantouote you fm a huffington post articl what happens when people with diabetes lose medicaid. it says looking at the 26 states plus the district of columbia,
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the expanded medicaid in 2014, researchers found that new diabetes diagnosis rose 23% in the other 24 states they rose by less than half a percent. i found that one of the clearest explanations, however you do, you expand coverage to mr people. in the medicaid expansion states more people got diagnosed with diabetes, one of the most expensive prevalent sicknesses in america and nonmedicaid expansion states, how do you interpret that? >> well, obamacare environment, you need to improve upon the situation where it's collapsing and medicaid expansion is about providing additional coverage to folks and i share that commitment. we just have a different way of going about it. medicaid expansion big -- that have to fund this massive government program. we want to use the taxpayer dollar to give them tax credits
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to buy private shegt insurance, because when i talk to folks, they tell me all the time, i'd rather not be on medicaid but have my own health insurance to go to my own doctors and make the choices for myself. that is the better way to approach this situation. >> congressman ruiz, you're standing next to congressman reed. i know you agreed to come on television together. you went into politics for a reason because you want to serve the american people. as you stand there side by side are you buying what he's saying? >> you know -- i'm going to -- i'm going to believe his intentions and also the co-chair of the diabetes caucus and we work good together to make sure diabetics get the medications and treatments they need. and i know that the diabetics out there aren't idealogical, don't care about big government or small government, they care their glucose is controlled and have it under control so they don't go into the emergency department with a diabetic coma
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or have to amputate their leg. the medicaid expansion gave them the ability to detect diabetes early, to get their medications that they need and prevent those atrocious end results that diabetes can bring. >> you know, gentlemen, we like having democrats and republicans on and like bipartisanship. the other day i had brenda lawrence on and french hill from arkansas, a republican on and at the end of the segment, i feel they kind of hugged. i wasn't sure. feel like they kind of hugged. i'm putting it out there. >> raul is a good guy, i served with raul, we have different philosophies and ideology a little bit but we both care about our fellow americans. that's where more of us are coming together, we're working together and that's why we can work out these differences because at the end of the day if you have the common good of the american people standing together we can find a solution to these problems. >> i'm ready for a bro hug, guys? >> little handshake there. >> there we go.
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that will make it under the reel of bipartisan hugs. >> it's a start. >> we appreciate the time you've taken and efforts you're making to talk to each other. raul ruiz and tom reed of new york's 23rd district. coming up, we're going to carry on reporting on things going on elsewhere. reports that jared kushner just beefed up his legal team hiring a prominent trial lawyer to represent him in inquires into his links to russia. stay with us. i'm only in my 60's.
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welcome back to "velshi and ruhle." now to new developments, president trump's senior adviser and son-in-law jared kushner hired a prominent liar awyer to represent him. also scrutinized, a loan the washington post reports kushner's company received from deutsche bank a month before the election. joining us now, james woolsy, former cia director under president bill clinton, now the chairman of the foundation for the defense of democracies. big deal, he hires a high powered criminal defense
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attorney. if you're robert mueller digging through your trash, wouldn't you want to do that too? >> sure. i mean, what's wrong with hiring a lawyer? >> yeah. so from your perspective, though, you've seen a lot of this stuff, you've watched this unfold, the investigation into the trump people's alleged ties to russia. what do you see as an intelligence person? are we in early days, are we halfway through the game, are we getting to the end of it, are you seeing anything that seems troublesome or more smoke than fire. >> sure, troublesome. russians are never not interfering with the neighbors. elections, their churches, everything about them. it is just that they used to be only able in the 1930s to get as far as the serbs and germans, but in recent years, because of the development of cyber, they can get to us. and they're always interfering. it is what they do. they call it disinformation. they lie, they cheat, they steal, they do all kinds of
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things to foul up other countries, particularly democratic countries, commitment to their principles of democracy and it is what they do. it is the way they are. >> that's not new news. what about smoke as it ties or associates itself for president trump and the trump campaign aiding and abetting this type of behavior? >> i don't see what the crimes are or the steps are that would suggest that they have aided and abetted a behavior. i think what has aided and abetted the russian behavior substantially was president obama's decision to draw a red line in the sand about syria and then shrug and turn things over to russia when the red line of use of chemical weapons was crossed by assad. that made the united states look foolish and weak and has done more to damage our ability to deal with foreign countries than anything i can think of in recent history. >> when we -- a little earlier, talking about a survey that showed that in many other countries people are sort of not
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thinking that america is all that strong, does this -- does this russia investigation hurt that? does the allegations of trump's involvement with russia, does this still being on front burner hurt our appearance to other countrys? >> we're americans, we're always having investigations and arguing with one another, it is the way madison set us up so we would always be struggling with one another. that's not the point. the point is i think what the obama administration did and looked weak, very weak by anybody's standards made us really the laughingstock by this red line in the sand and then backing away and turning everything over to russia. >> it was a ridiculous thing for the united states government to do. >> thanks so much for sharing your thoughts today. we appreciate it. >> james cool woolsey. coming up, sean spicer is going to hold, get th sitting down, an on camera briefing along with energy secretary rick
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perry. >> who knew it was energy week. >> yeah. that's 2:00 p.m. eastern time. stay with us. r a dvt blood clot. i sure had a lot on my mind. my 30-year marriage... 3-month old business... plus...what if this happened again? i was given warfarin in the hospital, but wondered, was this the best treatment for me? so i made a point to talk to my doctor. he told me about eliquis. eliquis treats dvt and pe blood clots and reduces the risk of them happening again. not only does eliquis treat dvt and pe blood clots. eliquis also had significantly less major bleeding than the standard treatment. eliquis had both... ...and that turned around my thinking. don't stop eliquis unless your doctor tells you to. eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. don't take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. if you had a spinal injection while on eliquis call your doctor right away if you have tingling, numbness, or muscle weakness. while taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily... and it may take longer than usual for bleeding to stop.
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seek immediate medical care for sudden signs of bleeding, like unusual bruising. eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures. eliquis treats dvt and pe blood clots. plus had less major bleeding. both made eliquis right for me. ask your doctor if switching to eliquis is right for you.
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last week congressman francis ruini came on our show to talk about trump care. we asked him about cuts to planned parenthood and he said that he read in a research report that nonabortion services are way down at planned parenthood and there was some
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out there who said that when i challenged him, i was a liar and fudging the truth. well, i beg of you, please check out this graphic. now, while contraception and cancer screening prevention services are slightly down. >> slightly. >> std testing and other women's health services are up. what does that include? other services? pregnancy tests, prenatal services, miscarriage care as well as well woman exams and other services for planned parenthood, family practice services for women and men. adoption referrals and urinary tract infection treatments. so for those of you out there who said i was fudging it, this f is a fact. >> right now, let's send it over to andrea mitchell reports live in los angeles. >> right now on "andrea mitchell reports," a new red line of late night warning from the white house to the syrian regime, saying if there is a new chemical


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