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tv   Breaking Hate  MSNBC  August 25, 2019 7:00pm-8:00pm PDT

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hundreds of extremists. and while jeff scoop still has a long road ahead of him, my hope is that with him and other former extremists by my side, hundreds is just the beginning. this is an msnbc special series. >> white lives matter! white lives matter! >> hate is on the rise in america. it's embolened. >> the war on whites is real. >> normalized. >> the government is nothing compared to the jewish menace. >> and destroying lives. >> there are people who will say, once a nazi, always a nazi, and that you can't change who you are. but i know change is possible. from the age of 14 to 22, i helped build america's first
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neo-nazi skinhead organization. i believed diversity was a code word for white genocide. that jews controlled the media. immigrants were raping our women. and i was going to save the world. recruiting vulnerable kids and transforming them into violent extremists like me. but now, instead of pulling people into hate, i'm guiding them out. >> i invoke mein fuhrer. that's a scary thing. i know how it is to get sucked into this movement. >> i hate people messing with me. before i was just gabe. now i'm gabe the skinhead and everyone respects me or fears me. >> it happened to me, and i'm not willing to let it happen to anybody else. >> first thing i'd like to say about the american flag is i don't salute the american flag
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because two of the stars stand for nonwhite states, alaska and hawaii. i do not salute that flag and i stand for my own flag which is the banner of the white race. >> with me today, chris picciolini, 19 years old, director of the illinois chapter of the northern hammer skinheads. >> well, i believe we're warriors today and we're fighting for a great cause, which is the white race. >> it's painful to admit, but that's me. 22 years ago. today i see the world very differently. >> joining us now, christian picciolini, cofounder of "life after hate." >> hello, this is christian, tell me what's going on, man. >> for more than a decade i've made it my mission to help people disengage from hate groups before they destroy their lives or the lives of others. >> does he ever talk about like being violent? has he ever talked about using weapons? >> there's a resistance to work with somebody who was a violent white supremacist. but i've helped over 100 people
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disengage. >> they're preparing for the race war what is he said. and there are so many more people who need help. i get calls and emails from parents all the time saying that they're worried about their son or their daughter. that they might be violent. >> i used to keep up with my photo albums really well. >> and that's gabe? >> yeah. yeah. >> okay. >> laurie brown contacted me a year ago, terrified she was losing her 21-year-old son, gabe, to the same skinhead crew i helped lead. the hammer skins. >> when gabe got those tattoos, i just thought his life was over. nothing good is ever going to come out of this. >> i remember when you called me. >> yeah. >> and you were devastated by it. it's your baby. >> yeah. yeah.
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my beautiful little baby boy. >> what do you think it was that led gabe to go down and search for that kind of acceptance? >> i was having problems with drugs and alcohol. emotionally i wasn't there. i was there physically but not emotionally. i'd gotten into an abusive relationship. i was supposed to stop seeing this guy, and i didn't, so that's how i initially lost custody. >> it took gabe a long time after his mom contacted me before he would even talk to me. but he finally reached out.
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gabe had told me he attended monthly white power rallies. provoked violent confrontations and once dragged his mother's black boyfriend out of her car and beat him up in a parking lot. gabe and i have been working together for eight months now, and he's making progress. but i'm still worried about him and need to check in. >> hey, what's up, man? >> what's up, man? what are you doing, little brother? >> good. good to see you. >> how's it going? >> good. >> so tell me what's going on, what's new? i haven't talked to you in a couple months. >> got a girlfriend now. >> tell me. i want to know more. where'd you guys meet? >> at work. he's from puerto rico. >> oh, wow. >> so that's different. >> that's a little different for you. >> yeah. just a little bit. >> happy to hear it. in the past you never would have considered even being nice to somebody who was from puerto
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rico. >> right. >> and here you are in love with this girl because you see her and not just her skin. i don't know that anybody grows up to aspire to be a hater. something happens in their life that turns them from a normal, everyday young person into someone who wants to scorch the earth. >> first time i ever heard anybody use the "n" word was my grandmother. i didn't really think too much about it until i went to a predominantly black middle school. i was always getting messed with. picked on. i looked at myself as garbage, really. that's how i saw myself. >> in my work, i call these potholes. the small traumas that shatter a person inside and drive them towards any community that will accept them. >> i hated people messing with me. that to me was really like when i first started to feel that
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resentment. and as i got older, i looked at it as, i don't have to take this [ bleep ] anymore. you shave your head, you put on some boots, and nobody's going to mess with you. before that i was just gabe. just nobody. now i'm gabe the skinhead and everyone either respects me or fears me. >> according to the southern poverty law center, there are currently 78 racist skinhead groups in the united states. the hammer skin nation, my old crew, is the oldest and largest and have a reputation for being extremely brutal, a kind of white power special forces unit eager to engage in a race war. gabe was a hammer skin prospect for nearly two years, channeling his personal frustrations into the group's hateful agenda. >> i guess the difference between now and then is i was trying to change the world to make myself happy in it, instead of trying to change myself so i could be happy in the world that i already had. >> i'm really happy for you,
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man, i'm proud of you. you've made a ton of progress. i've got to be honest too, i'm also concerned. since we started working together, gabe has severed ties with the hammer skins. but i found out just a few months ago he marched in the largest white power rally in more than a decade. >> jews will not replace us! jews will not replace us! >> on august 11th and 12th, 2017, 500 white supremacists descended on the small college down of charlottesville, virginia. >> white lives matter, white lives matter! >> calling themselves unite the right, they claimed they were protesting the city's decision to remove a confederate monument. more than 1,000 counter protesters met them in the streets.
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police lost control, and the governor declared a state of emergency. >> it's 2017. how can you hate somebody that you don't even know? >> a lot of people got hit. a lot of people got hit. >> at 1:40 p.m., nazi sympathizer rammed his dodge challenger into a crowd of peaceful counter protesters. >> this is why we didn't want them here! this is why we did not want them here! >> when it was all over, 19 people were injured and a 32-year-old woman named heather hire was dead. >> what were you thinking?
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you were making this progress, and all of a sudden you're like, oh, i'm going to go to this rally that ended up being this tragic event? >> i still hadn't fully separated myself, i guess, from the ideology. there's still a lot of things that i struggle with as far as like my mindset. i'm still in that nationalist mindset way of thinking. >> for most of his young life, gabe has had this identity as a neo-nazi skinhead. it's hard to leave what he left. sometimes if things go bad, it's easier to go back. and the last thing i want him to do is go back. ender bender." (clown 1) sorry about that... (clown 2) apologies. (clown 1) ...didn't mean it. (clown 3) whoops. (stilts) sorry! (clowns) we're sorry!
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our movement. >> in the 1980s and '90s, i pushed white power propaganda wherever i could. but i wasn't born a racist, and i wasn't raised one. my earliest memories are of chicago, surrounded by family that adored me. my parents were italian immigrants pursuing the american dream. while they worked 14-hour days, seven days a week, i was on my own. the weird foreign kid who spoke italian at home and english at school. i was lonely and bullied by the all-american kids who refused to welcome me. i felt abandoned. i felt worthless. i felt like an outsider. and i was angry. i spent a lot of time walking these alleys. one day at 14 years old, when i was probably my angriest, i was standing here and i was smoking a joint when a car came roaring down the alley and a man got
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out. and he had a shaved head and boots and he walked over to me and he smacked me in the head and pulled the joint from my mouth. then he looked me in the eyes and he said, "that's what the communists and the jews want you to do to keep you docile." he saw in me somebody who wanted to belong, somebody who was looking for a family and could be easily molded into something that he wanted. 14 years old, i went from a normal kid to somebody who was plotting to hurt other people based on the color of their skin or who they loved or the god that they prayed to. i became a mouthpiece for hate. the front man for two american white power bands. today there's a more powerful tool for recruitment, the internet. >> the war on whites is real.
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>> there are countless voices of hate that permeate the digital world. >> it is diversity that has decided white people. >> we need to nuke africa and cut off the aid there. >> gassing every last [ bleep ] on earth. >> liberating women is the worst disaster ever. >> welcome to the radical agenda, it's a show about commonsense extremism -- >> this is alt-right shock jock christopher cantwell. >> here at "the radical agenda" we used to think being called a racist meant we were doing something wrong. after you're here for a little while you'll realize racism is normal and the only reason you haven't seen it is because the jews have been censoring it, right? >> cantwell isn't so different from what i used to be. now we're on opposite sides of the war. >> he tells people, if you stop hating your life will improve.
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that's not what this is [ bleep ] about. he was a [ bleep ] gang member who didn't even [ bleep ] his [ bleep ] gang. >> i don't think he's even white, okay? >> yeah, he doesn't look white. >> he looks like [ bleep ] sheikh mohammad. >> i don't give a damn if guys like cantwell insult me. but i am worried about the thousands of people who are infected by their poison every day. >> there will be a great deal of pain and suffering as we strive to take our rightful place as the rulers of the earth. >> people like gabe. >> i invoke ein reich, ein fuhrer. >> i've been working with gabe for eight months and thought we were making progress. but it's clear he's still holding on to some demons. >> what kind of looks did you get when you wore that shirt out? >> not good ones.
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when i wore the shirt it was mainly to recruit people. >> were you ever embarrassed to wear it? >> you know that embarrassment is empathy. you were worried about how it would affect other people. it wasn't so much your embarrassment of wearing it, but i think what you were feeling was how that might affect others as you were changing. you may not even have recognized that. you know, i see a confederate flag hanging on your wall. a lot of people in charlottesville were marching with the confederate flags. it was pitched as this rally to save a confederate monument. do you think that's what it was about? >> i believe that that's part of it. but they were trying to erase any symbol of white identity in america, white history. both sides think they were right. both sides had points, valid points, they were trying to make. >> but somebody died because of those actions. >> right.
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>> and because of the rally. and it doesn't matter to me whose side they're on, innocent people shouldn't die. >> this might come across -- i think if we were separated we wouldn't have these issues. just throwing everyone together and blending them together and then saying, hey, get along. obviously that's not working. the people who want to be living together in harmony and unity and whatever should be allowed to do that, but the people who don't should be allowed to do something else. >> what would you you do if given that choice? >> hm. i can't really say. if i had to make a split-second decision on it, i would have to go with the separatists. >> gabe can't imagine a world where different races coexist because he's never allowed himself to be a part of one. to help him escape the twisted
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what made me turn away from hate? it's the question i'm asked most often. the answer is complicated and didn't happen all at once. by 1994, i was 21 years old. married with two children. and still a committed neo-nazi skinhead. one night as i beat up a black teenager outside a mcdonald's, his eyes caught mine and it hit me. what the hell am i doing? but i couldn't let go. my wife and kids left me when it was clear i chose a violent movement over them. hatred wasn't giving my life meaning anymore.
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it was destroying it. but before i hit rock bottom, i opened a record store to sell white power music. >> are you sick and tired of that alternative grunge crap? well, that's why i'm here at the supplier of the underground chaos records. >> to make ends meet, i had to offer other music genres. and that meant talking with customers who were black, jewish, and gay. i began to realize i had more in common with these strangers than the skinheads i'd surrounded myself with. and that changed the course of my life. what happened to me was a form of immersion, and it's now a critical tool in my work. i push people to have an open dialogue with the enemy, the people they think they hate. >> jews will not replace us! >> gabe is just like i used to be. living in a white power echo chamber.
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the march at charlottesville, convinced his history and identity would be erased. he had no idea those lies would lead to the death of an innocent 32-year-old woman named heather heyer. and that her death would touch a nerve, not just in charlottesville, but around the world. my only story of transformation has caught me that dialogue can lead to understanding and acceptance. the opposite of what the white supremacists are pushing. that's why i want to speak with heather's mother, susan monroe, who's agreed to open her door to
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a man with my hateful past. >> good morning. >> hi, susan, how are you? >> fine, i'm going to come out here. i've got a wacky ankle so i'm not wearing shoes today. >> i'm christian. >> hi, i want a hug. >> so nice to meet you, i'd love to give you a hug. i can't even imagine what it's been like for the last couple of months for you. >> i just -- i just looked at the salt and pepper shakers in the house and i said, well, i guess i don't have to worry about heather inheriting any of those now. come on in. these are baby pictures of heather and pictures of the family. >> this is heather here? >> that's heather. >> happy baby, huh? >> yeah. she's giggling with her brother. she was a pretty happy kid. always opinionated. always had to question everything when she got old enough. she had a strong sense of right and wrong. she was always out talking to
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people. she was trying to make a difference. >> susan raised heather in a single-wide trail in the hills just outside of charlottesville. it was a hardscrabble life but it instilled in heather a passion for social justice. >> jews will not replace us! >> no nazis, no kkk, no fascist usa! >> heather never planned on counter protesting until she saw cell phone video of the racist chants at the torch rally. >> i saw actual videos of heather that day talking to a young lady from the alt-right, asking her, why are you here? what are you doing? and the girl kept saying "no comment." but i have to hope that somehow the girl went home and thought, geez, what the hell am i doing
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here? maybe she'll remember that heather talked to her and have some soul searching from that. >> how did you find out about heather's death? >> her friend justin called me. and he just kept saying, 80 think she got hit by that car." and i september saying, "what car, i don't know what you're talking about." he said, "the hospital, they need to find the next of kin." i said, oh [ bleep ]. i called my parents. i said, please pray. when we got to the hospital, two ladies grabbed me and walked me up. and i walked in the room. and the detective looked at me and he said, "she was
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pronounced." and i remember just putting my head down and sobbing so loud. for the first few weeks i kept thinking, i raised her just to have her go away like this? but the impact that her death has made on so many people, i guess i can -- i can bear it for that. maybe the world will be a better place because of it. >> what legacy do you want this to leave? >> i want us to help capture those kids who are vulnerable, who are needing friendship. let's preemptively prevent it in the first place. let's learn to care for one another. >> yeah. i'm working with a really amazing young guy, his name's
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gabe, who was really heavily involved in the movement. and he was actually at the rally here in charlottesville. this is a kid who wants to do good but doesn't know how because he was never set up with the tools to do that. i would really love it if you guys met. would you be open to that? >> i think so. if he's willing to meet me, i would like to talk to him. maybe gain some insight. >> i really appreciate that. and i think what's possible is that we work hard to make sure no other mothers lose their sons -- >> that's my goal. i don't want anyone else to have to be in this club. there shouldn't have to be mothers who lose their children because of hate. >> susan's willingness to meet with gabe is both generous and brave.
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now i have to convince him to return to charlottesville and confront the truth of what happened here. i've always been excited for what's next. i'm still going for my best... even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib not caused by a heart valve problem. so if there's a better treatment than warfarin, i'll go for that. eliquis. eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk better than warfarin. plus has significantly less major bleeding than warfarin. eliquis is fda-approved and has both. what's next? sharing my roots. don't stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to,
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i'm richard lui with the top stories. white house officials spent part of the day at sunday's g-7 trying to walk back comments from president trump that he had second thoughts about his escalating trade war with china. explanations range from trump that he did not hear the question, that he meant that he should have raised tariffs more quickly. president trump getting a new challenger from within his own party. today former illinois congressman joe walsh announcing he will be running in the republican primary. for now back to "breaking hate." picciolini must die. [ bleep ] lover peach leni should be executed. kill yourself, it is the right choice.
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the white power movement i walked away from now considers me the ultimate traitor. i've always had to look over my shoulder. it's not something that i like to do. it's not something that i like to put my family through. but i know that when i get these responses, it's touching their nerve. i know that i'm getting to them. and that means that i am on the right track. i was willing to die for something a long time ago that frankly was garbage. if somebody wants to hurt me now for doing the right thing, i'm okay with that. but i do take these threats seriously. because white supremacist violence is on the rise. >> arraigned in district court today, 20-year-old james alex fields said he understood the charges against him. second degree murder, malicious wounding, and hit and run. police say fields used his car to intentionally mow down a
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crowd of anti-hate demonstrators on saturday, killing 32-year-old heather heyer. >> six months after the rally, alt-right websites claimed james alex fields isn't a murderer, he's a martyr. forced to flee a crowd of violent protesters. >> the nationalist community defended ourselves against thugs. >> outside the courthouse today, two self-proclaimed white nationalists began screaming that police, the media, and counter protesters were to blame for saturday's violence. >> it's all part of a culture of victimhood white supremacists use to justify their anger and their actions. the 2017 unite the right rally was just the latest example. >> white people have a right to stand up for themselves. southern people have a right to stand up for themselves. when you try and take down our statues we're not just going to be little [ bleep ] anymore. >> the architect behind this chaos is himself a charlottesville native and a new
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come tore white supremacist circles. >> my name is jason kessler. i was the organizer of the unite the right rally. >> shame, shame, shame, shame! >> the hate that you hear around you, that is the anti-white hate. that fueled what happened yesterday. >> the unite the right rally catapulted kessler's status among white nationalists. >> her name was heather! her name was heather, jason! her blood is on your hands, her blood is on your hood! >> he now boasts more than 13,000 twitter followers. a dangerous platform to celebrate the tragic outcome of his rally. he's riling people up, making fun of a woman who was murdered. i believe that people need to be held accountable for what they do.
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i know i can't change jason kessler. but i can expose him for what he truly is. >> youtube, this is jason kessler. i've promised you on twitter and began to have gab to have a little debate today. i just thought it would be interesting to talk to this guy. his name is christian picciolini. you call yourself a former white power person. you were in a skinhead gang, flight. >> why do you keep putting up air quotes? >> because i don't ewe the term white power. what i am and what i think a lot of people in the alt-right are pro-white. we're not nazi skinheads. i believe white people deserve to be represented like other groups are represented. every other racial group, every other identity, whether it's gender or a sexual orientation identity, they have lobby groups. >> that's because they're searching for equality. they're not trying to wipe out white identity, they're trying to be recognized.
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>> but i think that these anti-white activists, i mean, they just hate everybody who's white and has accomplished something. they want to tear us down instead of building themselves up. >> do you hold yourself accountable for the violence that happened there? you were the organizer of this rally. >> those protesters put themselves in a very dangerous, very risky situation because they were defying the state of emergency order. >> but it was an alt-right person who came to that rally who ultimately drove his car into a group of people. correct? >> that's true, but he has not been found guilty. and i would say that there is a lot of reasonable doubt in that. >> how do you justify marching alongside swastika flags? i mean, you claim you're not a neo-nazi, you claim you're not a white nationalist -- >> it wasn't marching besides swastika flags, it was one guy with a swastika flag. >> who was chanting "the jews will not replace us"? >> i was not chanting that but
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one of the predominant themes of the alt-right is skepticism and criticism of jewish power. >> do you believe the holocaust happened? >> i don't know. i'm not a historian. >> you can sugarcoat this all you want. you can claim a public face that has a smile on it. but behind those closed doors i know exactly what you guys are. i've spoken to -- >> no, you don't know who we are. >> i do, i do. >> i can say that there are more people -- >> we used to be able to spot a skinhead or a klansman a mile away, and we knew they were dangerous. this new movement might be dressed in pretty clothing that looks like what our doctors or our lawyers or our teachers look like. but they have an agenda that is sinister. the real danger are people like jason kessler, who are able to hide who they truly are. >> they cling to their twisted worldview and have no interest in empathy or self-reflection.
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but for those who want to disengage from white supremacy, i can help. if they have the courage to confront their own hatred. i'm going to charlottesville in two weeks, would you consider going with me? >> for what purpose? >> i'm going to meet heather heyer's mom and i'm going to sit with her. she's going through a lot of pain because of what happened to her daughter. would you consider going with me? >> i will consider it. i can't say yes or no for sure, but i will consider it. >> what are your reservations about it? >> i feel like whatever she would have to say would be revolved around -- trying to make me feel guilty, i guess. >> you haven't met her, though, how can you make that assumption? i wish i could shake your hand. granted.
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♪ what's up, six star? >> how are you? >> i'm good. >> six months after marching in the deadly unite the right rally, i've asked gabe to return to charlottesville. it's time for him to confront the painful truth about what really happened here. most of the people i work with have never had a meaningful interaction with the people they claim to hate. jews, african-americans, or the counter protesters at the charlottesville rally. what saved me was interacting with the people i thought were my enemies. >> usually the only time you meet someone from the other side
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when is you're like at like a rally and you're both screaming at each other, about ready to, you know, fight or something. but i'm willing to talk to anybody that's willing to talk to me. >> i can't promise anything. but i am willing to stick with your side and i promise you that i won't leave. at my request, gabe has agreed to meet with susan brough, heather heyer's mother. >> susan, this is the young man i told you about, this is gabe. >> hi, hi gabe, nice to meet you. >> this is susan, this is heather's mother. sit down. >> have a seat.
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cold enough for you? >> yeah. pretty chilly out there. >> yeah, a little bit. >> gabe, what are you feeling right now? >> to be honest with you, a bit awkward. >> yeah. >> so do i. just because we both know that you were here this summer. >> gabe, what's it like being here now? what's the feeling of being back in charlottesville? >> just realizing the magnitude of what happened there. because that got like national attention. i wasn't even expecting that, to be honest with you. >> how did you feel when you heard that somebody had been killed? >> i really didn't know how to feel. no offense to you, at the time honestly i really didn't care. >> i understand. >> it was someone from the other side. >> i think that's part of the problem, there's this image of
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this communist protester rebel. >> oh my gosh, so not her. heather came from a broken home. her dad had drug problems. he's clean now. but he was never clean while she was growing up. heather seemed to just take it all in, but i know it damaged her in ways. >> gabe, would you mind sharing your upbringing at all with susan? >> i mean -- when i was around 7 years old, my mom kind of went off on a bender for a couple of years. drinking and drugging and dating less than desirable men. one of those less than desirable men tried to kill her on christmas eve while me and my brother were in the house. that was -- that was fun. >> i'm so sorry. >> it's --
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>> i know we shrug, but it's a lot of pain. it's just like, you can't fix it, but yeah, i get it. >> well, i appreciate you listening to me. because a lot of people that may have knew your daughter or share the same ideals that she had would probably want to kill me. can i ask you something, ma'am? >> yes. >> it was a pretty common sentiment revolving around the nationalist movement that she didn't die from injuries from the car accident, she died i from a heart attack. is that true? >> the medical examiner's report says blunt force trauma to the abdomen was the cause of death. so yes, her heart did stop. but it stopped because she was hit by the car. >> not because of a heart attack? >> not because of a heart attack. you know, jason kessler was in the courtroom. and he knows that the medical examiner's report said blunt
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force trauma to the abdomen. and he has not issued that information to anyone. >> in fact, he's done the opposite. he's helped spread the fake news. >> helped spread the heart attack >> he helped spread the heart attack theory. >> that is pretty -- sorry we are on -- >> i think god understands. >> because you can't keep something going and base it off of lies and expect it to last. the thing that really didn't settle in to my mind until later was how was going to this city that i have never even heard of before and provoking these people to violence how is that going to really change anybody's mind about anything? it just makes everyone look bad. really. and you know, people got hurt from it.
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>> susan, i'm assuming nobody had has ever reached out to you and said, really sorry for what happened? >> nobody who was at the rally, but i don't hold him responsible. i hold the leaders responsible. they deliberately stirred up the anger. he was used. i'm sorry, you were manipulated. >> sorry, you lost your daughter. >> thank you. i appreciate that. but i don't hold you accountable. you understand? so where do we go from here? how do we fix this? >> honestly, susan, i don't know how. >> i don't know either. i think we are all trying to figure it out. >> you think a good start is sitting down and talking about it. two people that normally would never do that. it's a start.
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susan's only daughter, heather, was killed by a white supremacist just six months ago. >> can i help you up? >> do you remember now. >> yes, just like that. >> to witness her compassion for a misguided young man like gabe is remarkable. >> want a hug? if you are not comfortable just say, it's okay to say so. okay. i give long hugs. >> at first i was reluctant to meet with heather's mom. >> seems like you guys connected. >> yeah, we did. i was glad she was able to see where i was coming from. >> this is a big step in gabe's journey. but it's not the last. y. but it's not the last. (woman speaking french) are you crazy/nuts? cyclist: pip! pip! (woman speaking french) i'm here, look at me. it's completely your fault. (man speaking french) ok? it's me. it's my fault? no, i can't believe how easy it was
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before gabe ever contacted me he was so desperate to shed his skin head past, he used a lighter to try to burn them off of his face. he couldn't do it then. he's ready now. >> i think starting with a clean canvas is going to have a major impact. >> for sure. >> people deserve a second chance and you're getting one. >> i know it and i'm pretty grateful. >> you can put those on. three, two, one. there you go. >> everybody that i meet i see as me 30 years ago. i know that they weren't born that way. they learned to do this.
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>> one, two, three. there you go. >> if somebody were to look at gabe a year ago, from a mile away they would have judged him as being a monster. >> atphrgt 15 seconds. 3/4s done. five, four. you got. come on. you're tough eput it on, you got to be tough enough to get it taken off. >> gabe changed the outside but that didn't really change the real gabe. >> there's probably going to be some people that i know that are
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going to think i'm a trader or whatever. it's pretty refreshing to say i don't give a [ bleep] >> it takes a kind of twisted nerve to join the hammer skin nation. but it takes real can curage to walk away from them. >> it's just little stuff that happened that built that doubt more and more. just grew that seed of dissolution. >> i think the people that stay are afraid, afraid to start over. >> i want it to be me again, not thuggish skin head nazi guy. that's not how i really felt. >> hate always has consequences. it destroys everything in a person's life.
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if we let it. >> they tried to kill my child to shut her up. well, guess what? you just magnified her. you need to find in your heart that small spark of accountability. what is there that i can do to make the world a better place? you take that extrastep, that's how you're going to make my child's death worth while. i'd rather my child but i got to give her up, we're going to make it count. >> 30 years ago i dedicated my life to spreading hate. i can't erase those years but i'll never stop trying to make amends for what i've done. just got another email says i
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need your help. you're my last hope. >> like it or not i know this is what i'm meant to do. 30 years ago i'm i-embraced hate there was nobody willing to help a skin head like me. >> another 15 seconds. >> today i'm the guy i needed back then. i help people break their hate. account for their wrongs and start over again with a clean


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