tv Hardball With Chris Matthews MSNBC December 2, 2019 4:00pm-5:00pm PST
december 5th. go to msnbc.com/sdny. we have a few tickets remaining. msnbc.com/sdny. if you're in new york or anyone you know in new york. if you can't make it, we'll put it up on the podcast as we do with these extra events. that does it for me. "hardball" starts now. a case against donald trump. let's play hardball. good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington where there is a serious momentum in the impeachment drive. tonight, the house intelligence committee is unveiling its report on donald trump's conduct in the ukraine matter. after nearly 35 hours of public testimony, from 12 witnesses in seven hearings, members will spend the next 24 hours reviewing a draft of that report, which makes the case for impeaching this president. the intelligence committee is
set to vote late tomorrow to approve the report before turning it over to the house judiciary committee. as "the new york times" describes it, the hand-off of the report, which will most likely form much of the basis for articles of impeachment against mr. trump will be a stylistic and substantive turning point for the inquiry. it comes as the house judiciary committee prepares to hold its first impeachment hearing on wednesday. that's this week, convening a panel of expert witnesses to describe the historic and constitutional basis for impeachment. judiciary chairman jerry nadler tonight announced the four lawmakers who will make up that panel. from there, according to politico, the committee is expected to have at least one more hearing, likely the second week of december, week after this, in which they will make their case against trump. aiming for a full house vote on
impeachment articles before the christmas recess. amid all this, and with his legacy hanging in the balance, president trump has declined to mount any formal defense against the accusations he faces. the white house counsel yesterday informed the committee that nobody will represent the president in wednesday's hearing, calling the proceedings unfair. i'm joined tonight by former director of the cia john brennan. we begin tonight with democratic congressman raja krishnamoorthi. this report, it seems to me, is pretty clear cut. your report as you understand t it, will call for the impeachment of the president. >> i think that is going to law out the facts and evidence of serious wrongdoing. we're going to send that to the judiciary committee. they'll have to decide what they want to do with it in terms of drawing up articles of impeachment as well as what types of articles, if they
decide to proceed that way. >> do you find the president committing unlawful conduct impeachable conduct? >> oh, sure. yeah. there's tremendous evidence of unlawful conduct, and it's the type of evidence that would be impeachable conduct. the founders of this country, as you know well, chris, did not want an outside influence on our elections. but in this particular scheme, there's serious evidence that the president wanted to pressure an outside power, namely ukraine, to get involved in our elections by investigating his domestic political rivals. and then secondly, he basically is using the tools of his office -- there's evidence to suggest that he's using tools of his office to investigate a private citizen, which is perhaps the biggest fear that any private citizen has about their government, that the office of the presidency would be used tore political purposes
to investigate an individual for wrongful purposes. >> here we are, december 2nd. we're moving into the month where it looks like you are scheduled to vote articles of impeachment before christmas weekend. i want to run through with you when you think the critical moment this occurred became clear what was going to happen. we had the whistle-blower. we got word of that, that there, in fact, had been a presidential conversation with the president of a foreign country in which the president held up military aid as his quid pro quo. then you had the call memo from that call. we got to see what was actually said. then speaker pelosi said this is the baby. this is what we've been waiting for. this is clear-cut evidence of impeachable behavior. then 332 members of the house voting for this action on impeachment. witnesses last two weeks, we mentioned -- when was the critical moment it was clear that the house democrats were moving toward impeachment, of all those moments?
>> well, there's a lot, as you know. when mick mulvaney came out in that press conference at the white house and basically said sure there's a quid pro quo, basically military aid conditioned on an investigation of the dnc and the president's political rivals, get over it, i think that was a turning point in a lot of people's minds. that not only are these folks engaging in wrongful conduct, but they're also telling us that it's something that we need to accept. >> yeah. >> and that's unaccept kraable you know. >> yeah, live with it. >> yeah. >> as "the new york times" summarized, house republicans plan to argue that president trump was acting on genuine and reasonable skepticism of ukraine and valid concerns about possible corruption involving americans, not political self interest. that's the republican report.
it also claims, the republican report, that the president's initial -- i love this word -- hesitation to meet with president zelensky or provide u.s. taxpayer-funded security assistance to ukraine without thoughtful review is entirely prudent i love these words. based on the accusations and assumptions of unelected bureaucr bureaucrats who disagreed with president trump's policy initiatives and processes. this language is so fraught with crap. in other words, if you weren't elected, you're not worth listening to. if you're a public servant who never ran for office in some town, you're not worth listening to. all public officials are, in other words, liars and not to be believed. that's what this republican caucus talks like. >> that's right. >> who are they talking to? >> works of fiction. >> yeah. >> i like works of fiction like any other person but this republican report is absolutely ridiculous. and you're absolutely correct that basically they are
parrotting the trump narrative or president trump's narrative that any public servant who wishes to bring forward evidence of wrongdoing against him is a member of the deep state, they are a never trumper and so forth. but you and the american people saw for themselves exactly how compelling marie yovanovitch is, bill taylor is. >> i did. >> lieutenant colonel vindman, fiona hill, and the list goes on and on and on. these are not people who are political. they are career public servants who stuck their necks on the line to tell the truth. and because of that, i think that the american people believe them. >> i think they did. thank you. those who watched and listened believed. thank you, raja krishnamoorthi. >> thank you. >> let me bring in former director of the cia. a long weekend, i kept thinking, you know, there was a time when there was -- a period in which a
reasonable person might have voted for trump when they heard he was going to rebuild the country. he's going to be a great executive because he made all this money. he has not rebuilt anything. he gave all the money to the rich. in terms of the government he was supposedly going to run, he has attacked it from day one. in other words, instead of being a chief executive, he's a chief attacker of the entire u.s. government. it's like he never took it over. >> so i wonder -- >> by the way, a lot of these cases wear reasonable person would have voted for him and he has betrayed them. >> yes, and so many members have family members who work for the government, public servants, civil vst ants and donald trump as well as the republicans now who disparage the very work that they do. >> because they do it. >> well, because, in fact, they're challenging him. they're standing up to him. and more people that stand up against donald trump will actually show how much he has failed to follow through on what the american people expect, which is honesty, integrity in government. >> do you think he's sane? >> donald trump?
>> yeah. let me ask you about logic. when he sees a logic report from an intelligence agency that people worked on for weeks and get it down to an executive summary that he's willing to read, do you think he's reading it like a person would read something like let me learn something here? >> no, i don't. i'm notty amedical doctor. i don't know if he is sane or not but he views the world through his own prism. how am i going to take advantage of this or defend against it to protect his own interest. i think of him going off to the nato summit, he looks at everything through the dollar sign prism. how can we cut back as opposed to the thinking strategically, nato, working with our allies, will protect this nation's security. he has a very unique perspective on everything that he looks at and everything that is brought to him. how does it affect him politically and how will he, in fact, take advantage of it? >> an example of weird thinking.
brain power here. president trump said president of ukraine has just again announced president trump has done nothing wrong with respect to our phone calls but a reading of "time" magazine shows he defended his integrity for not caving in to trump but acknowledged the pressure that trump put on him. zelensky said look, i never talked to the president from a position from quid pro quo. i don't want us to look like beg ars but you have to understand, we're at war. if you're our strategic partner, you can't go blocking anything for us. i think that's about fairness. who is the person blocking it? trump reads it and says this exonerates me. no, it indicts you. >> zelensky is taking a big swipe at donald trump, saying if you're our ally, do not block things such as military assistance. i think zelensky recognizes now that trump is in a weaker position so i think he's willing
to stand up against him, which i think is critically important. >> what do you make watching as an intelligence expert, the republican statement tonight, the thing we read a few moments ago on the show now about their claims? they're not thinking at all about the fact that -- history books will be filled with why this president was impeached when he's impeached. they're not talking about that. >> they have no interest in finding the truth or being honest with the american people. clearly they have bets on mr. trump and will continue to stay with him. it's the bed they've all made together. they cannot refute any of these allegations based on substance. they'll continue to try to disparage those that stood up against him. i think the republicans are just going to continue to look blindly at the impeachment. >> french had to root for the germans once they cut the deal with the nazis, the nazis had to win. after correcting his discredited claim that ukraine hacked into
the democratic national committee email server, john kennedy of louisiana is again arguing that ukraine interfered in the 2016 election. here is how kennedy was challenged by our chuck todd yesterday on "meet the press." >> i think both russia and ukraine meddled in the 2016 election, but the fact that russia was so aggressive does not exclude the fact that president poroshenko actively worked for secretary clinton. now if i'm wrong -- >> actively worked for secretary -- my goodness, wait a second. senator kennedy, you have the president of ukraine saying he actively worked for the democratic nominee for president? come on. i've got to put up -- you realize the only other person selling this argument outside of the united states is this man, vladimir putin. you've done exactly what the russian operation is trying to get american politicians to do. are you at all concern that you've been duped? >> no, because just read the
articles. >> in claiming interference, kennedy is citing articles from 2016 about ukrainian politicians who openly opposed trump's candidacy. politico is now reporting that the republican-controlled senate intelligence committee thoroughly investigated that theory and found no evidence that ukraine waged a top-down campaign to help trump win in 2016. >> first of all, senator john kennedy is a great discredit to his name. >> we can agree on that one. >> secondly, he's not being dup duped. he knows he's being dishonest, trying to defend and protect donald trump at all costs and so he's not going to be honest with the american people. clearly, he has continued to propagate this narrative and that's why they allow this to go forward despite every indication from the intelligence community
that it was russia that engaged in a systematic sweeping interference of the election that helped donald trump get elected. >> i've been to a lot of the conventions the last 34 years. inevitably they praise their previous presidents, democrats, fdr, harry truman, jack kennedy. republicans it's roosevelt, reagan. i don't think this guy will be on their list. a few years from now they'll be pretending that they never met the guy. they will do to him what he has done to everyone, i didn't know him that well. the white house is refusing to send anyone to present a defense for the president at this wednesday's judiciary committee hearing. nothing. no defense. mrs. trump's obsession with british politics. the president arrived in the uk ahead of the nato summit in london. one week ahead of their election, the prime minister has warned trump personally about
inserting himself in the election. will he be able to resist his temptation to get involved? >> and former secretary of state here john kerry joins me to talk about the case for impeachment, 2020 election and dire warning signs of climate change. much more to get to tonight. stick with us. maria ramirez? hi. maria ramirez! mom! maria! maria ramirez... mcdonald's is committing 150 million dollars in tuition assistance, education, and career advising programs... prof: maria ramirez mom and dad: maria ramirez!!! to help more employees achieve their dreams. wean air force veteran made of mom doing what's right,.ez!!! not what's easy. so when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out
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we don't have rights to lawyers. we don't have rights to anything. impeachment is a dirty word. it's very unfair. >> who can view these proceedings as fair and impartial? >> a bunch of depositions in the bunker in the basement of the capitol. we get this, all based on some anonymous whistle-blower, no firsthand knowledge, bias against the constitution. >> this is an unconstitutional,
illegitimate process. >> mound of damning evidence against the president when it comes to his open solicitation of dirt for arms. they've adopted instead to focus on the process. jerry nadler invited the white house to join the process, which they refused. in a late saturday night letter, we cannot fairly be expected to participate in a hearing while the approximate witnesses are yet to be named and while it remains unclear whether the judiciary committee will afford the president a fair process through additional hearings. we do not anticipate to participate in your wednesday hearing. there you have it. jerry nadler add if the president thinks the call was perfect and there's nothing to hide then he would turn over the thousands of pages of documents requested by congress instead of
blocking testimony with baseless privilege claims and provide any exculpatory information that refutes the overwhelming evidence of his abuse of power. joyce, i hope we can clear up the record of those watching only fox. there was no secret partisan underground basement hearing. those meetings were open to republicans as well as democrats. 40-some republican members were at all those meetings. number two, that they were not denied the chance to offer testimony. they were offered testimony all over the place. it seems to me they were able to argue that there's unfairness when there was no unfairness. how do you think they can keep saying that to themselves, this constant chatter of unfair when every charge they make about secret witnesses was not the case or they say we didn't get to provide witnesses of our own. not true. you blocked all the testimony from all the players in this thing.
how do they get away with keeping saying something that is so completely wrong? >> we're seeing a real-life illustration that you've heard criminal lawyers say, when have you the law on your side, you argue the law. when it's the facts, you argue the facts. when you've got nothing, you pound the table. that's what the republicans are doing here. trump has given them nothing to work with. they have no facts. the law is not on their side. it's clear that trump engaged in a bribery scheme in exchange for the release of aid to ukraine. and so republicans are literally left pounding the table, arguing that the process that they themselves established when they were in the majority is unfair. and the remarkable thing about this is that it continues to fool anyone. i think the reality here for trump is that his little house of cards may crumble if this continues to be exposed and if people actually begin to think about republicans are saying as opposed to just feeling the
tribalism that keeps them in check. >> why did the republican party make the decision not to fight the main charge here? did they argue it was legal or constitutes for the president to play hardball, if you will, saying buddy, i want something from you, want to move the process along. do me this little favor. they never made that argument. >> you saw the white house chief of staff try to make it in one press conference. i got the impression the attorneys told him after. >> mick mu will. vaney said it was a quid pro quo. live with it. >> from a white house perspective they're not winning but they're not losing. >> define that. the polling did jump up to 50% to 30 or lower since pelosi made her move and said this is the place we're going to fight. >> republicans are sticking with him. he is not in danger of losing any republican votes in the house. he is most likely not in danger of losing any republican votes in the senate. that's where this will end. party line vote in the house.
party line vote in the senate and he will claim complete vindication and exoneration and move along to his re-elect. >> why do you think failure to convict or remove from office will be an exoneration? who will call it -- >> he will call it an exoneration in all caps tweets fr every day from now until the november election. >> for a while he said go ahead, i'll jujitsu it. you hit me with impeachment and i'll acquit on the senate and win. where is he now? >> i think he's of two minds. he doesn't want the historic stain and doesn't want to be in the same company of presidents who have been impeached in the past. same time he has political advisers whispering in his ear saying this is great because he will be able to claim he was cleared by the senate. >> a week ago, chairman of the judiciary committee asked the state department for documents related to joe biden's calls with ukraine. graham's decision to partake in
the partisan investigation represents an about-face, who once said joe biden is as good a man as god ever created. the only republican to have complimentary things to say about biden over the years. three years ago during a farewell address to the departing vice president, number of republican senators had good things to say about biden's integrity and character. >> obviously, i don't always agree with him, but i do trust him, implicitly. he doesn't break his word. >> joe, you've lived the life of a patriot. you act like a gentleman. you're my friend. >> according to "washington post," mcconnell's handling of trump's focus on the bidens will prove more critical than whatever graham cooks up. he will set the tempo for how aggressively the senate goes after his friend, joe biden. they're institutionalists. i've worked with them they love the senate. they love the house. they care more about -- lot of things they care about.
they also care about their friendship at the top. these friendships are real. >> yeah. >> are they going to throw joe biden under the bus because trump told them to? >> of course. >> of course? >> this is the same reason that john mccain, mitt romney and even george w. bush are spoken of by much more highly by democrats. if vice president biden will be the democrat nominee for president, the issues related to his son, the work, will be front and center in this campaign. republican senators are willing to help the president make that issue. >> you just said something i don't agree with. people say good things about john mccain a long time. >> sure. >> it wasn't just when he was out of business. >> there were a lot fewer complimentary democrats in 2008 than there were at any other time. >> yeah. that's during an election year. >> yeah. >> joyce vance, thank you. michael steele, making the best case. president trump's visit to london comes ten days before the big election over there.
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loving allies and friends, what we don't do traditionally is get involved in each other's elections. when you have close friends and allies like the u.s. and uk is best for neither side to get involved in either side's elections. >> last two. when you were -- >> that was british prime minister boris johnson over whether president trump, who landed in london early this evening should get involved in the upcoming uk election. the president, our president, is deeply unpopular in the united kingdom with only 26%, about a quarter of the british public, saying they approved of his leadership in the latest gallup poll. johnson likely doesn't need trump's support. that's ironic. his opponent, jeremy corbyn faces 61% unpopularity, according to ugov and anti-semitism to boot. trump hasn't stayed away from politics in the past.
>> the mayor of london. he has been a not very good mayor from what i understand. he has done a very poor job. >> the ambassador has not served the uk well. i can tell you that. we're not big fans of that man. corbyn would be so bad for your country. he'd be so bad. he'd take you into such bad places. boris johnson. good man. he's tough and he's smart. they're saying britain trump. >> anita kumar, politico white house correspondent associate editor and bobby ghosn. it looks like this guy, boris johnson, doesn't need trump, doesn't need him anywhere near him, in fact. >> well, yes. i think he's trying to create a bit of a distance between himself and president trump, knowing how unpopular trump has been here and every trip that trump has made to this country, this city, he has been greeted
with protests, although he has been shielded from some of them. and let's not forget, this is where that famous balloon of the baby trump first made its appearance. so, johnson doesn't want to be seen anywhere near any of that, and that little radio clip you showed earlier of him saying we don't interfere in each other's politics is his own trial balloon if you like. president trump doesn't care about these political niceties and traditions. if he feels like he wants to speak his mind on johnson, someone he prefers, then he will probably say so tomorrow or the day after. >> anita, do you think trump will stay out of this? >> probably not. >> why does he think he might have a chance after louisiana and after kentucky, he can actually identify with a win? >> well, his point is that when he's asked, and he's often asked, he likes to talk to the media. he likes to tweet. if he's asked about something, will he weigh in. he doesn't generally say i'm
overseas, i'm not going to talk about something. his aides may be telling him, look, this is what the uk wants. don't get involved. but he has already been involved. when asked a question, he tends to answer. >> bobby, tell me about -- it strikes me, not always lately, of britain wanting to go the way of brexit like they don't want to be part of europe at all. there they are, hosting the nato meeting this week. is there going to be fire works at this event this week? >> well, this time, for a change, it's not only president trump who could toss a hand grenade into that room so to speak. although that's always a likelihood. this time you have at least two other people, the president of turkey. erdogan, and the president of france, macron, who in the lead-up to the summit have been hurdling insults at each other and questioning the future of nato. we are expect iing one or more these three people to say
something. as anita pointed out, they will, when they "meet the press," be asked about the things they've already said. that's when you can expect one of them -- my bet would be on president erdogan of turkey, to say something ininflammatory and incendiary that will throw this whole meeting -- it's meant to be a celebration. nato is 70 years old. britain is where the first summit was held. this is meant to be a celebration. the mood going into this event is far from celebratory. it's much more wary. there are questions about the future of this alliance, whether it can survive different members of the alliance have different ideas about where the threat comes from. erdogan, for instance, says russia, not a threat. we don't regard russias a threat. nato was created because russia was a threat. that was one thing everybody could agree on. there's no agreement anymore. yeah, we can expect some fire works in the next day or two. speaker of the house nancy pelosi was asked about what she
thought about it over there, impeachment, while attending a conference in madrid. she declined to criticize trump while she was abroad. watch. >> we aren't here to talk about impeachment or the president of the united states. we're here to talk about -- i have a rule of codels when we travel we don't talk about the president negatively and save that for him. >> do you think president trump will save his anti-democratic attitu attitudes till he gets home? >> he was already tweeting, talking about impeachment, the federal reserve. he doesn't really hold back in that regard. i mean, he hasn't really hear what the speaker says what she's saying. and maybe she and others adhere to that, but the president doesn't. we hear him talking about all kinds of things and not sticking to the point. to the point about whether there
will be fireworks, this isn't a summit. it's a leaders meeting. they won't have a joint agreement because they're not sure the president will sign t in year three of the president's term and they've learned their lesson on how to try to get it to be less -- to be less fire works. they expect less. >> all trump does is destroy. anita kumar, bobby ghosh in london, thank you. up next, senator john kerry joins us to talk about his vitally new initiative on climate change and his thoughts on impeachment, the crowded 2020 democratic field, the works. john kerry coming in a minute. you're watching "hardball." you're watching "hardball.
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>> welcome back to "hardball." united nations general secretary, speaking ahead of a u.n. climate change conference that began today in madrid, spain. his dire warning follows the release of a u.n. report last week, that indicated rapid, unprecedented cuts of greenhouse emissions are the only hope of an ever-increasing cascading of consequences. military generals and celebrities who will begin holding town hall meetings across the country, urging americans to combat climate change. the group is called world war zero. joining me right now, one of the founding members, former secretary of state john kerry. senator, mr. secretary, how about i ask you the question, how is it going in the argument about climate? who is winning? >> well, earth isn't winning, that's for sure. and that's the problem, chris. emissions are going to go up in major countries around the world.
the united states emissions are rising. they weren't a few years ago. the european emissions are rising. china is rising. india is rising. no country on the planet that has a major obligation to try to get things done is getting it done. this is an urge sent moment and that's why world war zero, and i urge people to go to worldwarzero.com. there's only one way to solve the problem and that's globally. the world has to be involved. there are people who have declared war on science, war on facts and war on the health, safety and welfare of their fellow citizens. people are dying in the united states today from mudslides, from fires, from floods. amazing amount of storm damage. $265 billion spent to clean up after just three storms two years ago. so, their facts speak to us loud and clear. what we're going to try to do is mobilize americans and as much
as we mobilize many years ago when we passed the clean air act, safe drinking water, and created the environmental protection agency. people have to be involved. no one gets a free pass. democracy only works when citizens take part in it. and we have to make this one of the primary issues, which we're organizing around. republican and democrat alike. >> how do you operate a bipartisan effort on a war to deal with climate when you have the republican party completely hijacked by this president? you have some people like kasich, former governor, recent governor of ohio, schwarzenegger, former governor. you have stars on your group. but the republican party is 90% with trump, who is 100% against climate concerns. >> we have elections in the united states, chris. we have to create ultimately accountability, because the american people mobilize and demand it. we're not going to get involved in a specific election. we're not supporting one candidate over another.
but we are going to be very clear about making climate change a primary -- climate crisis really today a primary issue that america has to confront along with the rest of the world. people will make their own decisions about who is ready to move forward. if a party decides they want to stay on the sidelines, i suspect the american people are going to find a way to hold them accountable for that. but we're not trying to emphasize the differences here. we're trying to emphasize the common things that bring us together. we do have important republicans who -- like chuck hagel, secretary of defense. bill cohen, secretary of defense, senator from maine. hank paulson, former secretary of treasury. these are smart people. these are people who stake their lives on defending our country and on patriotism. and their sense of patriotism now is to try to come together,
democrat, republican, liberal, conservative, generation across ideologies to recognize this is a national security crisis for our country. it's a health crisis for our country. and in the solution, chris, there are millions of jobs to be created. building out an adequate energy grid for our nation, beginning to retro fit and put efficiencies into companies and appliances. there are enormous job benefits. the fastest growing job in america today already is, in fact, solar powered technician. solar panel technician. the second fastest job is wind power, wind turbine technician. there are many, many more of those jobs than there are people working in coal industry, for example. now we're not trying to -- what we want to do is organize around the best possibilities of the future. but one thing is clear, chris. if we don't treat this like a war, if we don't organize
ourselves much in the way that the professor at yale, professor paul kennedy, who has written a book called engineers of victories, which highlights the key decisions that were made in order to win world war ii, it wasn't automatic that it was going to happen. and it's far from automatic that we're going to win this right now. but if we make key decisions about how to dhi qar bonize electricity, how to build the infrastructure necessary for an electric fleet in america, electric vehicle fleet, how do we begin to change what's happening in agriculture or industry, which is producing an enormous amount of the emissions? there are many, many things available to us, solutions to this. and moreover, if we invest the way america invested to go to the moon to win the race that john kennedy sent us out on, if we were to begin to invest in the alternative possibilities of
different fuels, whether it's hydrogen, fusion, something nobody has talked about yet, america has an extraordinary record of breaking through, of setting the pace, of being first and that's what we have to do right now. but we don't have the leadership calling us to that challenge. >> we'll be right back with secretary kerry to talk about everything else in the world, especially the 2020 race for president and the democratic party. we'll be right back. e democratic party. we'll be right back. do you have concerns about mild memory loss related to aging? prevagen is the number one pharmacist-recommended memory support brand. you can find it in the vitamin aisle in stores everywhere. prevagen. healthier brain. better life.
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the ambassador, the woman, she wouldn't even put up -- she's an obama person, you know. i said why are you being so kind? well, sir, she's a woman. we have to be nice. >> we started to see his default mode. his default mode is always to judge against the president of the united states. that's problematic. >> there's no reason that anybody in our government across our administration should be actively working against the president. >> that was president trump and his fellow republicans, taking shots at some of the witnesses who testified so far during the impeachment inquiry. during the impeachment inquiry. secretary of state john kerry. mr. secretary, if you were a member of the united states senate, where you worked so long, would you vote to convict and remove this president from >> first of all, when i was a senator, i never dealt with
hypotheticals and i'm not a senator now. so let me say this about where we are. excuse me. i used to be a prosecutor. i prosecutored a lot of cases and that i think one of the things we were taught as lawyers and litigators, if you have the facts on your state, you argue the facts. if you have the law on your side, you, a to you law. if you don't have either on your side, you just argue. that's what we're seeing today regrettably. a lack of respect for the constitution and the constitution has been pushed, i think, into a second position to party and to president and to power. that is not what the founding fathers of our nation intended and i hope that over the course of the next tweeks, as this unfolds, we're not just going to see a food fight that proves to theig world the dysfunctional
state of america's democracy. this is serious business. i will say as a former prosecutor, an american citizen hook at the facts, facts are facts. as john adams once said, facts are stubborn things and people are circling the wagons here. but w they ought to be circling them for the constitution and for tcountry. and wherever i have traveled in reason days around the world, and i've made a number of journeys, i fine people absolutely incredulous. they act, what has happen to the united states? to your leadership? people expect us to know in a position to lead. right now, unfortunately, we're just far from that. one other point. it is sad to see people who choose public service as a lifetime commitment and who care enormously about country being attacked for not supporting the
president. when they're doing is they're supporting the law. and they're supporting the constitution and they're supporting most of all their department. the place they've chosen in the state department's case to put their lives on the line to represent our nation in very difficult places in the world. i knew marie yovanovitch. our ambassador. i worked with her. and i think it is very sad. i applaud those who have stood up for what they believe and who are telling the facts as they understand them. they're certainly being challenged on them. they're being vilified and attacked and that's a sad moment for all of us. >> you and i have talked a lot about our country. i want to ask you a hypothetical. what had america look like the next five, ten years if trump is reelected? >> well, look. every american will make a judgment on that. i came here to talk about the things can bring us together.
not the things that divide us. one of the problems we have in america today, we haven't been able to focus enough on this in several presidential debates. there wasn't one question about climate change. this is something that ought to unite all americans. it is based on science. it is based on evidence, based on facts. so the generals and the admirals and the former defense secretary who's have come together, what we call the top roots of politics are joining together with the grassroots. and we're in sync with a lot of the groups, particularly the young kids who are saying to you, hey, you adults. you have to get this right. they don't have a vote in the congress. they don't have a vote in the board room. they are relying on adults to be adults and i think it is critical for us to have a new discussion about health in america. affected by climate change.
and feignbly jobs and the possibilities of a very different future if we make the decisions we need to make. >> secretary john kerry. well said. this conversation is just beginning again. thank you so much. up next, the clear truth in the battlele for 2020. i'm talking about the democrats and the stakes. you're watching "hardball." e sts you're watching "hardball. ♪ things are getting clearer, yeah i feel free ♪ ♪ to bare my skin ♪ yeah that's all me. ♪ nothing and me go hand in hand ♪ ♪ nothing on my skin ♪ that's my new plan. ♪ nothing is everything. keep your skin clearer with skyrizi. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. of those, nearly 9 out of 10 sustained it through 1 year. and skyrizi is 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. ♪ i see nothing in a different way ♪ ♪ and it's my moment so i just gotta say ♪ ♪ nothing is everything skyrizi may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight them.
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>> i think one truth is becoming clear for the walt in 2020. there's something worse than losing in the primaries. losing to your fellow partisans is something they can endure. they tried. did not make the cut. time to stand with the nominee. there's one bigg deep defeat that will not be forgiven. it the one comes out in the primaries and then loses to donald trump in the end. that's based on an incontestable fact. trump is beatable. that being clear, the democrat who runs against him, how can a democrat lose to a president who has for his entire term been rejected by a consistent majority of the american people in to lose next november, even in the low depths to which this president has taken us would be unforgivable and it can only happen if the democrats choose a candidate that lacks the wit, the guts, the basic appeal to be
a major party candidate in any year. if you presume to be trump's strongest challenger, you'd better well defeat him. no one wants to hear that you lost in a noble cause. history has already written that cause. it is for a country that is better than donald trump to show it. that's "hardball" for now. all in with chris hayes starts right now. tonight on "all in" -- likely new charges for rudolph giuliani's ukraine crew. >> i don't know those gentlemen. >> as the impeachment of donald j. trump proceeds. >> here's what i think they will advance. one is bribery. >> tonight what we know about the intelligence committee found. >> there is nothing more dangerous than an unethical president who believes they are above the law. >> what the judiciary committee is planning this week. >> no one is above the law. >> what it means for the president and his lawyer. >> i can't wait to come