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tv   Deadline White House  MSNBC  July 9, 2020 12:30pm-2:00pm PDT

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in those schools to $65,000 a year. making sure every child 3, 4 and 5 years old can go to school. every study shows that increases the chance by 58% that that child will go all the way through and graduate. imagine what a big difference it will make. because of this pandemic everyone has renewed appreciation on just how hard our teachers work, how important their job is. let's give them the resources and support they need to get through this crisis and empower the next generation of american ground breakers. let's pay them. these aren't somebody else's children. they're all our children. they're the children -- those children are the kite strings that hold our national am by am
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ambitions. finally, we've seen the cost of systemic racism. it didn't just about police reform. it's about dealing with the wound of systemic racism in this nation. we need a dedicated agenda to close the wealth gap, expand affordable housing, invest in brown and black and native american entrepreneurs. make real the promise of educational opportunity. for too long the battle over racial equality has divided america. it should be used now to unite us. donald trump says he's saving the american heritage by embracing the confederate flag and generals who were treasonous
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against the united states of america. do you think donald trump has any idea that 360,000 pennsylvanians fought on the side of the union to defeat the flag, that confederate flag, including more black soldiers coming from the state of pennsylvania than any other state in the nation? you think he has any clue that 33,000 pennsylvanians died in the civil war fighting against what that flag stood for? i see a different america than trump, one that despite all our short comings is still after more than two centuries dedicated to equality, liberty and human dignity. the challenge we face today are among the biggest in our history. we have to come together in our country to solve them. there's no other way. i got criticized during the primaries by saying i was running for three reasons -- to restore the soul of america, to
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rebuild the backbone of the country, the middle class, and three to unite america. i was told you can't unite america. we're done. i've long said america is at its best when we act as one nation, one america. that's the tragedy of donald trump being president. he's exactly the wrong person to lead at this moment. he'll not bring this country together. he's determined to drive us apart, to keep his base in place. he'll not be president for all the american people. his base. he believes he's elected president only by his base. he will not appeal to the best instincts of the rest of us. he's determined to stroke the worst moments of our past. i have no illusion how tough the road ahead is going to be for our country. i'm an optimist for one reason. i know the history and the heart
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of this country. given a chance, just a chance, ordinary americans can and have done extraordinary things. they'll never ever, ever let their country down given half a chance. they have won they won't let it down now. the only thing that can tear america apart, no foreign country, not the way he cuddles up to -- i shouldn't even get into this -- cuddles up to putin and others, they can't tear us apart. the only entity that can tear america apart is america itself, period. we just need to remember who we are. this is the united states of america. there is not a single thing, nothing, not a single thing we've ever failed to do when we decided to do it together.
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that's what this is about. doing it together. we have a great opportunity to build back and build back better. god bless you all. may god protect our troops. thank you. >> joe biden speaking at a metal manufacturing plant in dunmore, pa. his father's hometown. when the noise started, a shower had slid off the western edge of the pocono mountains and interrupted the middle of his speech. we have three esteemed guests who have been patient enough to wait with us until the conclusion of the vice president's remarks. one question about what we just
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heard. because of your daily beat, infrastructure weak as no one needs to remind you, became a punch line over three years ago in this administration. joe biden is trying to refocus the attention of americans on this need for roads and bridges and airports and the like and wanting to put money behind it. >> that's right, brian. what we saw from former vice president joe biden was really a speech whose thesis was president trump hasn't done enough for the american people and he's only focussed on himself and his wealth. joe biden was going for the jugular when it came to trump. he was talking about the fact that he thinks he can do better and president trump has been all talk and no action. he also said that president trump can't relate to the vast majority of americans, working class people, black and white,
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just trying to provide for their families. he said donald trump doesn't get the american people. the other thing he said was that president trump is someone who doesn't believe that american should be better, that it needs to grow and embrace all different cultures. this on a day when president trump is struggling and visibly angry. he was just in the white house with cameras. even as the supreme court said the congress couldn't have his tax returns, he was told today that he cannot claim immunity when it comes to holding his financial records away from state prosecutors. it was not a good day tofor the president. we can see supporters of joe biden would say he was hitting his stride. he's gotten more clearer in his message. he didn't stumble in the speech. there were no moments where he struggled. this is joe biden in a clear term saying this is why i should
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be president and why donald trump shouldn't get a second term. >> melissa murray, the biden speech ended with this line -- if you can't unite america, then we're done. it would appear that donald trump has succeeded, at least in the 7-2 matter of uniting the supreme court. for nonlawyers ruling that no one is above the law, no one is above criminal prosecution. can you talk about the blow that it is? i was mentioning to brian at the top of the hour that a former justice department official, someone in contact with this white house, said this is trump's nightmare. he's been accustomed to political crisis. he has true fear and that's why he was so hysterical when jeff sessions recused himself in the
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russia investigation and on edge during the mueller investigation. what does this mean and why is it so upsetting to trump? >> it has to be upsetting on some level because the president went to great lengths to prevent these records from being exposed. the fact the court said in two 7-2 decisions that the president was not above the law, has to be a blow. to be realistic, in both cases the court sent the decisions back to the lower courts. in t in the manhattan d.a. case, it said the president could use whatever he can to challenge the subpoenas. in terms of the congressional subpoenas, those too went back to the lower courts to fashion out a workable compromise that prioritizes separation of power concerns with congress' need for
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ov ov oversight. this was a blow for the president. make no mistake about it. this is a president who wanted privacy for his personal records. today the court said it's not absolute blanket immunity for him. >> joyce, our friend neil said this is not a mixed bag. the court rejected his bogus claims of broad immunity. can you pick on what professor murray is talking about there and do you agree with neil? >> i do agree with neil. we've had a chance to discuss that a little bit. what the supreme court does today is an unambiguous rejection of the president who late last year talked about having an expansive second amendment to the united states constitution that gave him unlimited power. today the supreme court, including two people that donald trump nominated for their roles
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of supreme court justices, today that court rejected that notion that presidential power is not constrained in any way. he's subject just like any other citizen to investigation by a state court grand jury. sure he has the ability to argue that cy vance needs to narrow his subpoena. that is something that could happen relatively quickly. then we have this notion of congressional oversight which the president has also maintained he should not be subject to. again, the supreme court rejects that with clarity and tells him -- i think, nicolle, this is the most interesting part. the supreme court talks about how normally this sort of request from congress to the executive would be worked out in what the court calls the hurley birly, the back and forth of politics. donald trump has engaged in no
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negotiation with congress. the court references it. they tell them this case will go back to the lower court and the lower court will play the role in accommodation between the executive branch and congress. donald trump doesn't slip the same kind of oversight any other president is likened too. >> professor murray, here's donald trump. came to office knowing little of the written history, modern history of the supreme court and how it works. here he is, along with other republicans, running on the notion of conservative judicial appointments. a lot of, for example, christian conservatives who find him culturally abhorrent in every
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other way support him because of conservative appointments to the judicial bench. fair to say he's probably quite upset not getting the bang for what he thought was his buck in two appointments to the supreme court? >> to be clear he's been most successful in appointing judges. at this point in his administration he's nominated and had appointed over 200 judges completely transforming the lower federal courts. in this case the two justices he nominated, neil gorsuch and brett kavanaugh, voted with the liberal wing of the court. you could view this decision in a conservative manner. it's simply following a lot of precedents that have been stated by the court. there's united states versus nixon. clear precedent that said the president was not above the ordinary court of the law. this is a court following past precedent and they're very
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conservative values. >> i wonder if that makes it hurt even more. what is the vibe like at the white house today? the president obviously not on anybody's script, just unloading as brian referenced at the top of the hour, on everyone from the supreme court, to his predecessor president obama, to vice president biden. the white house not driving a message of any sort other than the president's ire. >> the president is clearly not in a good mood. he was at the white house listening to -- that's one way to put it lightly. he had this event at the white house. his arms were crossed. he had a scowl on his face. he was using words we heard him use over and over. this time in reference to the supreme court saying it's all a witch hunt. it's all a hoax.
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these are words we heard him talking about when he was getting impeached. we heard him say it with the robert mueller investigation. the president is going back to the way he talked about things when he doesn't like the way things are going. the president is also seeing as brian just said you can appoint supreme court justices. doesn't mean they'll say everything you say is right. the president over and over said there was some sort of absolute immunity. the president has now heard from several judges, including the ones he nominated, that he's not a keing. he cannot put things out there. that's the message that president trump is continuing to think about today. that's why you see him pretty mad. >> as i said, a panel of esteemed guests who were very patient in talking to us about the court while we dipped into live coverage of joe biden's remarks.
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our thanks to you all for starting us off on a busy thursday afternoon. nicolle, i think mr. gump had it right when he said life's like a box of chocolates. you never know what you'll get. the 3:00 afternoon is like that. we cover our share of live events. this is where i turn the coverage over to you and become a viewer. >> you know what i was thinking with you in your remote location, me in mine, this is going to be so different from four years ago when we did this in the same studio at the same desk in 30 rock. it's amazing how the public has adapted. they're used to seeing political events that look like that and seeing us. i'm happy to report there's no standing water in my basement today. it is remarkable for as adaptable as the public is, donald trump hasn't changed his
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tune one iota. it's never boring. brian, thank you. when we come back reaction to today's big supreme court decisions from a house democrat who has been at the forefront of the investigations into president trump and her testimony today from the ousted former u.s. attorney appointed by trump of the southern district of new york. that's ahead. live pictures from midtown manhattan where the words black lives matter are being painted on fifth avenue right outside trump tower. stay with us. ump tower. stay with us but as i reflect and see all the amazing things you've been doing... one thing is clear, technology has never been so important. you're turning living rooms into conference rooms, backyards into school yards, and bringing doctors into homes virtually and securely. you are transforming business models and virtualizing workforces overnight. because so much of that relies on financing, we have committed two billion dollars
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this morning the highest court in the land reaffirming that the president of the united states is not above the law. while house democrats appear to have lost the battle for now to get ahold of the president's taxes they're charging forward with investigating the conduct of this administration. earlier today the house judiciary committee heard from former manhattan based u.s.
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attorney jeff berman. he was investigating some of the president's closest alleys. berman was fired last month by attorney general bill barr and then by donald trump himself. it drew backlash from legal experts around the country. joining our conversation is someone in the room where it happened democratic congressman eric swawell. what did you learn today? >> the room where it happened is where people come forward and give sworn testimony. john bolton has never been in a room like that. what we heard was a pattern of conduct of bill barr protecting the president's friends and
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punishing the president's enemies. this was essentially the equivalent of bill barr's do us a favor to mr. berman. get out of the way. take your experience overseeing important kacases, resign so we can put in our person. that's what he was asked to do. mr. berman rejected that. >> did mr. berman testify that he was pushed out so someone could come in and have an impact on the ongoing investigations? >> he wouldn't go into any ongoing investigations. that's appreciated. we don't want to jeopardize those. he did say it made no sense. he was told privately and publicly that he had done a good job and for him to be replaced by someone with no experience in criminal prosecutions that was
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concerning. concerning because that office -- he did not say this. i believe it was implied. that office investigates very sensitive -- involved in very sensitive investigations. it prosecuted a number of allies of the president and allies of the president are currently under investigation. >> one of them is rudy giuliani. other than the headline about him being punked by sasha baron cohen we haven't heard much about the investigation concerning two of his former associates and all his business dealings. that's gone very quiet which doesn't mean anything about what's happening behind closed doors. was there anything that mr. berman could shed light on as to whether or not that was still an active probe? >> he wouldn't go into ongoing investigations. we have bill barr coming at the end of the month. he'll be confronted about this firing and also what happened in the roger stone case where we
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heard testimony that bill barr's team was putting pressure on the stone prosecutors to reduce the sentence, again, for another friend of president's. of course we're awaiting what's going to happen with michael flynn where bill barr has dismissed the case against the president's friend michael flynn. this is a pattern of corruption, the supreme court weighing in today hopefully reaffirms that in this country no president is keng. in congress we'll do our oversight work to make sure that's true. >> let me get you on the record on two other headlines today. on the decision about the congressional prerogative, congressional access to the president's financial records where do you go from here? the white house made their strategy clear it's stone wall. the court sent the case back to be narrowed. what does that mean in the near term? >> the courts were clear in both
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cases that the president doesn't have an absolute right to refuse subpoenas to congress or criminal prosecutors. i know we had a leadership call today with our team and we'll look at where we go from here. i think for most of us we view this as the president is impeached forever. the senate did not remove him. we can remove him at the ballot box in 117 days. we'll continue to be the ankle monitor on the president that he needs so badly to protect the integrity of our systems, but it really is going to be on all us to go to the ballot box. that's where all the change will have to come. >> congressman, a busy time up there. we're grateful for you waiting for us to come out of the biden speech. >> of course. the supreme court rules that no one, not even donald trump is
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above the law. "deadline white house" next.
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hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in the east as a visibly rattled president trump publicly grapples with the reality of the extraordinary decision by the united states supreme court today that no one, not even donald trump, is above the law. "the new york times" explains the supreme court on thursday cleared the way for prosecutors
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in new york to see president trump's financial records, a stunning defeat for mr. trump, but a decision that means the records will be shielded from public scrutiny under grand jury secrecy rules until after the election. the court's decision in favor of the new york prosecutors was a major statement on the scope and limits of presidential power, one that will take its place with landmark rulings that required president nixon to turnover tapes of oval office conversations and forced president bill clinton to provide evidence in a sexual harassment suit. the ruling is not a mixed bag. it's a rejection of donald trump's bogus claims of immunity. it's abundantly clear in a seering opinion offered by chief justice john roberts who writes, no president not even the president is categorically above
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the duty to produce evidence when called upon in a criminal proceeding. we hold that the president is not absolutely immune from subpoena, nor heightened to a standard of means. roberts add that president trump has the same rights as any other citizen. it came down in a sweeping 7-2 vote, which may have fueled trump's fierce immediate reaction. he wrote courts in the past have given broad defense, not me. now i have to keep fighting in a politically corrupt new york. not fair, blah, blah, blah. manhattan d.a. cy vance saying
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this is a tremendous victory for our nation's system of justice and its founding principle that no one is above the law. our investigation will resume goidi guided by the grand jury following the facts. the case brought by vance and his team in new york centered on donald trump's hush money payments to women and whether the trump organization falsified business records to cover up those payments. it's the scheme that michael cohen described under oath in testimony before the house oversite committove oversight committee last year. >> mr. trump is a con man. he asked me to pay off an adult film star with whom he had an affair and to lie about it to his wife, which i did. what i did each and every time is go straight into mr. trump's
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office and discuss the issue with him. when it was ultimately determined -- this was days before the election -- that mr. trump was going to pay the $130,000, in the office with me was alan wise l berg the chief financial officer of the trump organization. he acknowledged to alan he was going to pay the $130,000 and alan and i should go back to his office and figure out how to do it. >> it's worth -- let me introduce everybody. some of our favorite reporters and friends. tim o'brien is back. nbc legal analyst, mia wiley. chuck rosenberg and katie barlow is here. chuck, i was going to ask you, it's worth going back in time. i remember being on tv with you
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when the michael cohen sentencing memo came out in december of 2018. that feels like 180 years ago. donald trump was an unindicted co-conspirator. chris christie said on the air that it was always the scariest legal prospect to donald trump what had gone on around the hush money scheme. >> absolutely. i recall that well. i recall talking with you about it, nicolle. the president was identified in federal court as individual one as part of a conspiracy. today's decisions are momentous. if you were hoping to pour over the president's tax returns, it might feel like a loss. but it's a victory for the rule of law. the president is not immune and
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like all citizens has the obligation to provide all information to a grand jury. there may be some disappointment, but very important cases, not terribly surprising and a resounding legal victory for the court of law. >> tim o'brien, someone in contact with this white house said this area of potential criminal legal exposure is donald trump's trigger. this is what he fears most. the bad press is something he's become, if not numb to, accustomed to. there is this fear and it triggered his rage at jeff sessions. it triggered 23 months of rage at robert mueller. it brought donald trump to say in an interview with the "new york times" it would be crossing a red line if mueller looked into his business dealings. now the supreme court said fair
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game. >> not only fair game, nicolle, but there's a likelihood should trump not when in november that he's also going to lose the insulation of the white house and his executive powers as vance tense his case. trump is going to be much more exposed in the prosecution of cy vance's case next year quite possibly more than he would have been this year. you have to ask why the president of the united states unlike every president before him hasn't been transparent and voluntarily released his tax returns. i would suggest he's worried about things like possible tax fraud or money laundering or the identification of foreign sources of income, all of which he wants to hide from the public. no defendant in a case, if they've got evidence that exculpatory goes out of the way to prevent that from coming into
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the public purview. secondly, unleashes this rage rodeo on twitter that he did today as soon as the rulings came down. this is a devastating ruling for him. i don't know that the tax returns coming out before the election would have been pivotal in november. i think that's a loss in the near term. as chuck pointed out, this is a landmark ruling that says the president does not sit on mt. olympus and isn't governed by the rules that govern the rest of us. >> mia, you and i have sat next to each other and covered a tsunami of trump scandal since the hush money payments to the important star. that's like seven scandal ago. they always represented to the people closest to the president one of the clearest cases where
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he was vulnerable, where he dark da -- "the new york times" published on its front page the checks. it's a story that's so seedy and so easy to understand. he paid to keep quiet a relationship with a porn star. >> yes, he paid to keep a relationship quiet with a porn star after already struggling with an "access hollywood" tape from years earlier in which he admits to sexually assaulting women and laughing about it, that they always let you grab them. not that that was the stormy daniels allegation, but there was already a substantial issue in the public's view about what kind of person is this. except now we find that he was hiding more of the truth so that voters could not make a fully
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informed decision. the reason it's a crime is because democracy requires information. voters require the ability to assess who they want to vote for. you're not supposed to hide it by using your resources and not declaring that, hey, i'm using my resources to hide something that might interfere with voters voting for me. this is the crux of a pattern of behavior that we've seen from donald trump that certainly tells the american public here a man who will lie, cheat and we don't know what else in order to when public office without it being fully transparent to you, the voter. >> katie, what did we learn about the united states supreme court today, not just in the way they voted, 7-2, but in the way
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they invoked so much history. there were references to george washington. they were written for the history books. >> they really were. we learned two important things about the kourpt and its role in history. we know the president has tweeted presidential harassment 38 times in the last two years. the court today resoundingly rejected that claim. the most important, the core part of what they said is no one is above the law. in a ruling 7-2, as you said, there were two decenters. in the decent by justices alito and thomas said the president is not absolutely immune. in a real sense the court said the president is not immune, is not above the law 9-0. further, two of the justices he
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appointed, justice gorsuch and kavanaugh wrote in their opinion -- justice roberts said no one is above the law. justices gorsuch and kavanaugh said in this country, as the court has stated many times, no one is above the law. that principle of course applies to the president of the united states. >> chuck, do you know what i thought? you might take exception with this. i wondered if mueller had pushed orn this issue, had probed the president's financial records -- it's not clear from the mueller report whether he got his hand on the tax returns or not. if that had escalated -- all nine justices decided a president is not above the law. >> right. i would have been surprised to learn that mueller did not
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obtain the tax returns. let me tell you why they're so important, nicolle. we keep talking about tax returns. it's not because we're curious to see how much money he made or how much he donated to charity. in a way that doesn't matter. what we want to see is how did he treat those checks he wrote to stormy daniels on his returns? in other words, were they expensed as legitimate business items? if they were, it would make the tax returns false. it's not just a purient interest. it's evidence of a crime. that's why i think mueller would have gone after it. there's so much detailed information in financial documents. it's not just that they want it, they need it to prove a crime. >> tim, if you could pick up on that, i feel like that's what you were getting at as well in your first comments.
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they're a road map. it's unclear if donald trump even understands that analysis that chuck just gave, that depending on how those checks were treated on his tax return, he may have committed additional crimes. do you think there's a sense of the danger that these records represent to the president? do you think it's more of the yanking back the curtain and the man standing behind it? >> i think he's definitely afraid of it. donald trump is not a bright man. he's not a sophisticated man. he watches his money closely. he's been a life-long grifter. this has come up time and again in his casino business, in his real estate business, in all the
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reporting about the trump family's broader finances. they play shell games. they move income around to avoid paying state and income taxes. trump as con sorted with shady people in all sorts of deals. there's all sorts of stuff in this that his brain, the survival part of him, recognizes he's in danger. i think that explains why he went off on twitter because he knows the manhattan district attorney's case will come down to financial fraud, accounting irregularities, all circling around how they tried to hide the money and payments to stormy daniels. it's possible fraud and i'm sure he and his children are well aware of this. >> mia, i want to stay on the
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same topic, but turn to a different development with you. the ousted sdny u.s. attorney jeff berman, a long time republican, i believe he was hand picked a couple white house counsels ago. he was on capitol hill today talk about william barr's firing of him. he painted a pretty clear picture of attempts to politicize that office. what do you think they're working on? what's your gut from what we see on the outside? >> well, we know there's so many things related to the trump organization, related to close associates of donald trump, lev par nis and others. they're looking into his inaugural committee. they're the ones who seized all the records that michael cohen had and had his cooperation.
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we don't even know all the threads that those documents led them to. you started at the top of the hour, nicolle, reminding us about michael cohen's testimony and how much he knew and understood of the financial dealings and also wes l berg. we don't know how many investigations they may have or where the investigations we know about may have led and we don't know all the other associates who may have come before them for other reasons that donald trump was concerned about. the bottom line here that we have to remember is that since donald trump has taken office, not just what he did before he got there, this is a man who has demonstrated his willingness to abuse it for his own gain. just remember when he was trying to get heads of state to his -- without going through an
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appropriate process, to get to one of his properties which he would benefit financially from before it blew up in his face. we know he has had business dealings in other countries. it's not clear whether his foreign policy has followed the best interest of the nation or the best interest of his pocket book. we have no clue. we just know there's got to be a lot of smoke coming out of the dumpster fire that is donald trump's financials. >> you almost want to see history accelerate and see, as you said, everything underneath that smoke. katie, i want to read you something that's been said about the speed and process and to pick up on chuck's first point that it doesn't mean we'll see anything. neil katyal says if courts can
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decide a presidential election start to finish in 36 days, it's easy for courts to decide the new york case especially because the supreme court's decision leaves president trump very little to say. >> i agree with him in substance. to speak on chuck's point, i don't think anyone is going to be seeing these any time soon around the dinner table, certainly not tonight. the point on timing, i think -- we will be able to see these documents, or at least the grand jury in new york will be able to see the documents rather quickly if cy vance wants to. the president's lawyers often lose, but they do so while skillfully drawing out the litigation.
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cy vance, as an attorney who has been opposite him, if the facts allow it he'll pursue it and pursue it swiftly. i suspect that will be the case here. >> thank you all so much for starting us off. we could have kept going. i could have talked to all of you for the rest of the hour. when we come back, groundhog day? a return to darkness. the pandemic that has gripped the nation for months shows no scenes signs of slurring. tulsa's health officials say the surge there is tied to trump's indoor rally. why is trump and his traveling petri dish going to new hampshire? trump's allies are talking about life after him. all those stories coming up. l t. you say that customers make their own rules.
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in a situation like that all the testing and contact tracing isn't going to slow it down and we're back to square zero. >> a scary and sad thought, that the united states is today back to square zero, back to where we were in march. his assessment matches what we're seeing in the nation's coronavirus hot spots. strained hospitals, icus at capacity and ppe in short supply. look at this graph. the daily case count in arizona when normalized for population is peaking higher than new york in its worst days.
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speaking of worst days, the united states hit a record for daily new cases yesterday with more than 60,000. it's fif its fifth time hitting that marker. today dr. fauci stressed for history not to repeat itself. >> we can't say all or none. we went from shutting down to opening up in a way that skipped over all the guide posts. that's not the way to go. we have to rethink that and do it differently. >> joining our conversation our friend dr. lena wen and amy s d stoddard. dr. wen, we're making new mistakes very similar to the mistakes. i remember when georgia and texas and florida were re-opening and we were looking up the cdc guidelines that dr.
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birx briefed and it included a 14-day declining cases. i don't think any of those states had 14-day declining cases. we're ignoring our own advice. how do we turn this around? >> you're right, nicolle, and we're thinking about re-opening schools. part of those guidelines require we're at phase two and we have a 14-day decline in number of cases. why is the president saying we need to re-open schools? haven't we learned our lesson? we have an opportunity to hit reset and say for the states undergoing surges they should think about shutting down again. we have to suppress the level of infection. for those states still on paper doing well, there is almost
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certain to be community transmission that's ongoing. maybe they should hit pause on re-opening, assess where they are and think through their priorities. >> a.b., i want to ask you about the president's role in all this. it's inescapable. he's literally bringing covid with him where he goes. that's not my assessment. that's the assessment of the tulsa health department. the director said the past two days we've had almost 500 cases. we had several large events over two weeks ago, which is about right. we just connect the dots. he is more than negligent. he is doing harm in this case not just to his supporters, but to people that interacted with his staff in tulsa. >> right. we know from reporting from the white house that the president is nervous about getting it himself. he doesn't want anyone around
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him who isn't tested frequently. he's had scares with people who work closely with him. he's very cavalier when it comes to these gatherings. bruce dart said before the tulsa rally that his city was already in a surge and that he was asking the president not to come. these people do come voluntarily. they wave their rights to sue the trump administration or the venue. the one in new hampshire is supposed to be outside, but the truth is that the more dangerous trump policy is the federal posture, the position he's taking as leader of the federal government as we look at march into may into july into all these months and the arc we've seen with this resurgence where he's not teaking the time we wee
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in lockdown to create a federal policy where he would help the states and localities come up with guidelines and that he would take them seriously himself and message on them that would allow time to scale up testing, help with ventilation systems, whatever it takes to get schools open in the fall. it was open everything. open the bars. places like bars and churches are super spreading environments. you can't seing. you can't be indoors eating and drinking. we know this. it was just to focus on the economy and here we are like all the experts are saying, all the epidemiologists and doctors, that we're back at square one. it was never supposed to be a permanent lockdown. it was to give us time to figure this out. both his personal campaign message and his message as the president that he's done with this. it's over.
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he doesn't think it's a problem just shows you we don't -- not only have we never had a plan, he's not going to adopt one now even though we're seeing these surges in positivity rates. he's not going to get up at the white house where he did in march and april and say this is very serious. >> but it is very serious. doctor, the world health organization updated its information about the virus being airborne and that it affects how we act and look at even do indoor spaces. can you explain? >> we've known this is a respiratory virus. we were talking about respiratory transmission through droplets. we thought that's what would lead to transmission. we've known for sometime that just breathing and speaking can also transmit covid-19 because of these smaller microscopic
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droplets, aerosols, they also carry the virus. this is why we were saying keep six feet apart, wear a mask. this is why we're saying being in ddoors is more dangerous. when you're outdoors the air around can diffuse the virus particles. we've known this, but the w.h.o. is being explicit about it. this is the reason why indoor gatherings are dangerous. these aerosols will linger in the air. extended family members, friends, do not invite them indoors at this time and stay outdoors to protect yourself and them too. >> i'm spending a lot of time on my driveway. a.b., i want to ask you, what gets attached to the republican party based on the handling of the virus by the republican governors of arizona, florida, georgia and texas?
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>> it's obviously -- the white house has been open about their willingness to excerpt political pressu pressure, pushing governors to open up, making sure there's economic growth as the campaign heads to november. he's been explicit about it. it's been the republican governors that pushed very hard and some democratic governors felt conflicted about it. they want their own communities to thrive and economies to return to normal. they are really -- this whole anguish between governor abbott and texas defying the messaging on masks for a long time and then turning around and initiating a mask mandate is an example of the fact that he realized his people were in so much danger he had to defy the messaging from the president on this. it's a very tough place to be. what the republican senators up
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for re-election know is that covid is the number one issue of the election and the voters will have that foremost in their mind when they go to the polls in november. >> i guess all i would add is this shouldn't be a tough position to be in. abbott changed his guidance on masks when the hospitals in houston were almost at capacity. a.b., dr. wen, thank you both for spending time with us. up next with a bit more than 100 days until election day is trump close to the point of no return when it comes to losing to joe biden? but we also write. [szasz] we take care of ourselves constantly; it's important. we walk three to five times a week, a couple miles at a time. - we've both been taking prevagen for a little more than 11 years now. after about 30 days of taking it,
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woi felt completely helpless.hed online. my entire career and business were in jeopardy. i called reputation defender. vo: take control of your online reputation. get your free reputation report card at find out your online reputation today and let the experts help you repair it. woman: they were able to restore my good name. vo: visit or call 1-877-866-8555. we heard cautious fearful talk about it leading up to the 2018 election, a blue wave. then we saw the democrats pick up 40 seats in the house.
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amy walter is saying 2020 is looking more like a democratic tsunami than a blue wave. she adds republican strategists think trump is close to the point of no return. trump's popularity is so low. the "washington post" reports it's as if the unpopular incumbent president doesn't exist. this deliberate approach underscores the difficult position republicans find themselves in as they head into an election season that looks increasingly grim for their party. joining our conversation basil and nick. nick, trump is what trump is. the republican enablers became something they had never been
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before. they may have championed ideas that were not the right ideas. they green lit somebody who grabbed women in the bleep, someone who called african nations bleep hole countries. they're so deserving of the political pain they find themselves in right now. >> well, nicolle, the president's party accumulated a debt of checks the president has written on members of his own party in the senate and the house. the problem for them is that he dominates the political band width like no other president in history. he craves the spotlight. he grabs it, sometimes compulsively and not necessarily with a well-planned strategy to expand his appeal. he does it to pick fights. he dominates our attention in a way that people find exhausting. it's so very hard for members of
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his own party to do a normal kind of separation from the incumbent. you would see that anyway. it's always a challenge if you're the party of the incumbent president. now it's almost impossible. this election is a referendum on trump period, not anyone's views on a job program or an infrastructure bill. it's all about trump. >> basil, it's a referendum on trump and those who enabled trump. i think that congress stopped functioning -- i worked for a republican president who championed policies that were incredibly controversial. i think 100% of the viewers of this program did not support the president's foreign policy. they saw as many republican critics at times when things were difficult as they did democratic critics. so under trump, this congress failed to function as congress functioned under other
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republican presidents. >> that's absolutely right. i think to nick's point earlier there should be a sense of nervousness in the trump's camp. you don't see -- you talked about enablers. you don't see republicans engaged in their behavior with respect to the president at this juncture. you're starting to see them not nationalize. he's the president of the united states. they should be more allied with him, but instead they're focused on local cam papaigncampaigns. the president has lost several cases at the supreme court, the affordable care act case notwithstanding. there's a lot of things they should be rallying around, but they can't. not only is it a structural issue, but they're fighting
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against public opinion which is so incredibly strong against this president that states like georgia and florida and north carolina are now in play. that should make the republicans and the president's administration nervous. >> nick, as unreliable as national poll numbers are, there are some poll numbers around attributes that are good predictors. i was reminded a few weeks ago in 2012 on the question of strong leader mitt romney bested president obama on the question of understands the problems of people like me, which is the other axis on what voters make their choice. president obama was so far ahead of him that he was unbeatable by mitt romney. there's no scenario where donald trump even competes with joe biden who drips empathy. >> right. well it would certainly be hard
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for him at this stage of the game. if you look at his strategy, what strikes me about his strategy, it's to tweet pictures of black people rioting to stoke fear and racial resentment. it's not because that's the best possible strategy for him. it's because it's the only strategy he's capable of executing with any consistency overtime. the problem is a majority of americans are sick of what he's doing on twitter and elsewhere. they want something different. it was possible to paint hillary clinton as out of touch. it wasn't necessarily true. she had a long history of issues. joe biden doesn't have those problems. he hasn't settled on an effective message against biden. if he has, it's not sticking. i think biden has this level of
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trust. he doesn't have the rich, target rich environment that hillary clinton provided for donald trump. so it's not going well for the president. >> basil, we took joe biden's speech live. he said if we can't unite as americans, we're done. do you agree? >> i think it's absolutely right. think about the fact we sau sa diversity and that -- against
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donald trump, they view him as a leader that's not competent, who is reckless and doesn't care about his own supporters. for democrats those are the same voters who helped us regain the house in 2018 and will be important for us in 2020. >> basil, nick, thank you for spending time with us. two of the smartest people to talk to about these issues. up next for us, we've reported from the u.s./mexico border for the last two years. we'll talk about the horrors witnessed of families torn apart. that's next. apart. that's next. to severe psoriasis,
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it has been two years since jacob stepped foot inside a former walmart that the trump administration was calling a shelter for boys and young teens who had been separated from their families. as one of the first journalists allowed into the facility, jacob begin telling the horrific story. in his new book "separated" jacob lays bear the truth behind the family separation policy and crisis. on june 17, 2018 jacob entered
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the processing center. he described as we approached the enclosures chain link fences on all sides. my first thought was dog kennels. inside were children. joining us now is jacob soboroff. jacob, take me back to that day thinking you were walking up to dog kennels. >> it makes me sick, nicolle, every day i talk about it, when i talk about it with anybody and when i talk about it to this day. you saw me there walking next to the border patrol agent. children under mylar blankets, on concrete floors, supervised.
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kids were separated from their families. today they're still not all reunited and family separations continue in this country as we speak. >> that was my question for you. how much has changed and how much is still as horrific? >> it's just as bad, if not worse than it ever was. that's part of the reason i wanted to write the book, nicolle. there was so much i saw and experienced. those were the facts on the ground. how did we get here? how is this happening? how is it continuing to happen in the united states of america? those are questions i didn't know the answer to shamefully. that's why i started digging. today while we don't have over 10,000 children, less than 1,000 children are in the custody of the federal government, many of them, thousands are sitting on
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the other side of the border in mexico because the trump administration won't let them in or expelled them under the guise of the coronavirus. when you talk to activists and lawyers and anybody who knows anythinginhumane and it just shouldn't happen. >> well, i was going to ask you about that, and this is what i want to ask you to come back and talk about, steven miller and the president have always looked for external rationals for treating migrants more harshly and more brutally than even what we already talked about. how are they using covid in that way? >> well, some of the same people that were involved in family separations to this day are involved in the messaging and the execution of the so-called recovery from covid and actually wrote about that in my very last days of writing and it is all in the book, but what i want people to understand this is not something that was sort of thrown together, haphazardly, from the very earliest days of the trump administration on
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valentine's day 2017 i lay it out in the book, members of the trump administration sat in the office of kevin mcaleenan and talked about separating children to fulfill the wishes of -- the dreams of president trump, candidate trump, and steven miller. this was all very well thought through, very planned and this is exactly what they wanted to happen and the evidence is, like i said, still ongoing. it is happening right now. if they wanted to, they could release families together as we talk, but the administration is still considering separating children from their parents and family detention today, right now. >> how many -- i hate to talk about numbers of any of these calamities because each human tragedy is just that, human tragedy. but how many families, how many children are right now today separated in u.s. custody? >> it is such a good question. i'm glad you asked that. the answer is we don't know. and i asked aclu who was the lead lawyer in the lawsuit which
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won the reunification essentially of these children, stopped donald trump and his policy in its tracks but what they can only say for certain is that first group of 2800 kids that was identified was either reunited, or placed with a sponsor. but the thousands before the policy started and the thousands after, there's still an accounting that has to happen. 400 poirnt parents were deport without their children. one father who i met, who was subjected to that, if it wasn't for a lawyer, lindsey tislowsky, he would have been deported too and not seen his son. he had to wait five months, but it is better is not the right word, it is not the situation that all these other parents ultimately faced and many of them still face today. >> jacob, there is so much more that you write about that the day propublica released the tape of the small child wailing, i will never forget, it is your coverage of this that has left
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its mark on me like almost no other story, so please promise me that you'll come back and we'll pick this up very shortly, as soon as -- >> anytime. thank you, nicolle. >> the book is called "separated: inside an american tragedy." buy it. read it. don't forget it. up next, celebrating lives well lived. t forget it. up next, celebrating lives well lived i wish i could shake your hand. granted. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪ ♪ now is the time to support the places you love. spend 10 dollars or more at a participating small business and get 5 dollars back, up to 10 times with american express. enroll now at
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she always had a big smile on her face. she was always nice and kind to you. and when you left the cafeteria, your day was instantly better because you saw doris and she made you smile. even on your toughest days. >> it seems like such a simple thing, right? the ability to make another person smile but it is a talent so offer undervalued. doris sims had it, defendants, judges, didn't matter, the
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cafeteria, the courthouse she worked at in dallas everyone was treated with respect and most left with a smile on their face. doris was also the head of her family, the one they all went to for support and encouragement. which is why her presence is missed now more than ever. mere hours before her death from coronavirus, doris' daughter keshia died of the disease too. so we're thinking today of them and of sherry todd who lost her mother and her only sister on the very same day. and talking about those with the talent for making other people smile, this is william lopez, a man somehow made of kinder, sweeter stuff than the rest of us. 18 years he spent shoveling snow, mopping floors, cleaning desks as the night shift custodian in a new jersey school district. he was one of those unsung heroes, the guy who cleaned up after everyone else had left, the guy who always said good night with a grin, a good man through and through and beneath it all, a profound sacrifice and a love of family, he worked
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here, in this country, in order to send money to his family back home in el salvador. william died last month, so today, we're thinking about his family and everyone at the school where he worked. we promise we'll remember william lopez. that does it for our hour. thank you for letting us into your homes during this extraordinary time. our coverage continues with chuck todd after a quick break. chuck todd after a quick break tt we're helping members catch up by spreading any missed usaa insurance payments over the next twelve months so they can keep more cash in your pockets for when it matters most find out more at for when it matters most saturpain happens. aleve it. aleve is proven stronger and longer on pain than tylenol. when pain happens, aleve it. all day strong.
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♪ welcome to thursday. it is "meet the press daily." i'm chuck todd. good to be back. we're following two big stories, the unrelenting surge of covid cases in the united states, and the fallout from the supreme court's landmark rulings and the president's tax returns and the bigger question of whether a president is above the law. first, the latest on the


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