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tv   The Week With Joshua Johnson  MSNBC  January 16, 2021 9:00pm-10:00pm PST

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♪ democracy has come to the usa, to the usa ♪ tonight the nation is on edge. state capitols are ramping up security ahead of the inauguration of joe biden. i'm joshua johnson. welcome to "the week." we're following breaking news tonight. capitol police arrested a virginia man at a security check point yesterday. the man flashed an inauguration credential that authorities described as unauthorized. they say during their search of his vehicle they found an
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unregistered handgun and more than 500 rounds of ammunition. meanwhile, the fbi says it's investigating whether foreign governments or organizations or individuals funded the right-wing extremists who helped plan the january 6th riot. this comes after years of mounting evidence that russia and other foreign adversaries have tried to secretly support political extremists. with everything going on, no wonder at least 19 states have activated their national guards this weekend to help secure their capitols. here in washington the capitol has a new feature, a seven-foot non-scaleable fence topped with barbed wire. behind it are hundreds of armed national guardsmen. at the same time the senate is preparing for the second impeachment trial of donald trump. three sources familiar with the president's impeachment plan tell us some of his congressional allies will
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probably play a role in his senate trial. the exact details are in the works but the names being thrown around include ohio congressman jim jordan and florida congressman matt gates. mr. juliagiuliani was $ spotted leaving the white house around the same time and ivanka trump. you can tweet us @theweekmsnbc. according to a person involved in the planning, mr. trump has
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discussed recreating the traditional pageantry of a formal visit by a head of state. this could include a color guard, a military band, a red carpet, even a 21-gun salute. these are still tentative plans but still, president donald trump has made it clear to his staff that he wants a celebratory sendoff full of fair man and an msnbc contributor. let me start with you and what you've learned about the president's plan for wednesday. >> he is going to be leaving very early in the morning, around 7:30 a.m. that's really unusual. usually the outgoing president participate in the inauguration, is at the capitol, participate in a luncheon and is there for the transfer of power at 12:01 p.m. the president is getting out thereof to use air force i one
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last time and he won't be interacting or attending any of the inauguration events. all of that pomp and circumstance is being tentatively planned for joint base andrews, which is where air force i departs from in washington. it's a moving target. there was at one point a discussion with holding a rally for him with a lot of supporters, which have no and they are trying to give him a sense of an exit that has very little to do with reality. in reality he's exiting with an approval rating that is at an all-time low for him and an historic low for but he's going to see images and happiness and welcome home, mr. signs that
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will make him feel like he's living an alternate reality from what he's actually facing as he leaves office. >> before i get to ali, presumably he would be. >> the plan is for him to depart to his new home of mar-a-lago, where he will be surrounded by the guest and be the club owner that he has never stopped being during four years in office. the whole time he was the president, he still kept careful notes about who is a number, who will drop out and taking away the twitter makes it much harder for him to. >> but in terms of what happens after he gets home to
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mar-a-lago, it's a big tbd. >> what is i don't. >> well, biden himself reiterated just yesterday that he's feels comfortable with the security measures being taken by the city of argument if that you can see and stop and also the threat that we've all been doing with, they've always known that this inauguration was going to look different. you're not going to see people in the streets. they're keeping the hallmarks that they can but safety was always of paramount concern but now it's hammered into actual i
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going to be. certainly we throw around the word unprecedented but it is one of the scenarios where it actually fits. >> allie, we understand there will be a big push in the beginning of the administration, the biden administration to issue a flurry of executive orders and start getting stuff moving really fast out of the gate. what more do we know about that? >> reporter: well, there are the specific words in a memo that incoming chief of staff ron klain sent to white house staff and reading in between the space of the words. in terms of what we're hearing, none of this is really new in terms of what they want to do in the first 100 days, but this even boils it down more specifically to the first ten days. it is specific executive actions that president-elect biden hopes to take, things we've heard from them before like rejoining the
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paris climate agreement, reversing the muslim ban, all of these things that circle back to the four crises we've been talking about for several months which is covid, the recession, climate change and racial injustice. but then there's reading between the lines, what is not in here. i was struck by the fact this memo actually could have been written two months ago when they talk about this quartet of crises, because this has always been the focus of the transition even before they officially won, before the networks call it. i remember being in a parking lot in wilmington not too far from here, and this was the messaging that they were coming off the campaign with. so the consistency is really stunning. then i also think it is interesting as you read this memo that there is no mention in here of the insurrection on capitol hill and the impeachment article that has now resulted from it. it is telling because obviously they have an agenda that has nothing to do with those things, but politics doesn't happen in a vacuum and those are not issues that are going away any time soon. we know that this is a team that
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expects that they're going to have to see a senate juggle the potential for getting that article of impeachment, but also having to act on biden's agenda. they know this is a reality, but in the memo, not so. >> nbc's ali vitali and annie carney of "the new york times". appreciate you both starting us off tonight. thanks very much. washington's other big story this week, of course, was impeachment. the senate is preparing for its second impeachment trial in one year's time. democrats need to convince at least 17 republicans to convict president trump this time around. three sources familiar with the president's thinking say his legal team hopes to prove that a president can't be tried and convicted once he leaves office. as for the political case, allies of the president say it is time to move on. they argue that a conviction would further divide an already divided nation. let's continue now with congresswoman stacey plaskett representing the u.s. virgin islands. the representative will serve as an impeachment manager in the upcoming senate trial. good evening.
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thank you for making time for us. >> good evening. thanks for having me. >> what is your strategy for winning? what is the one most important thing that you think securing a conviction in this trial will depend upon? >> well, i don't want to talk about the strategy that the impeachment managers are working on and what our trial discussion has been. just suffice it to say that we have a phenomenal group of individuals that speaker pelosi, we have all been honored and humbled to asked to be a part of, with great counsel and, of course, amazing staff that are working on this. we have, in fact, a case of a president who has done what the founders anticipated, that is an individual trying to grip on to power and utilizing a mob to try and destroy our democracy to do that. i think that we have all been witnesses to this, and that's what you will hear in the trial. >> john adams once said, "the jaws of power are always open to
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devour." i think that one of the interesting things about this is a lot has been made about the hesitance of some republican lawmakers to more openly condemn president trump's actions because they're concerned about their own power, their own political power and their political futures. how much do you think you will have to get over that hunger for power, that hunger to not lose it on the part of republican lawmakers as opposed to just appealing to shared american values, a common sense of decency, protecting the democracy and so on? >> well, i believe that the job of the impeachment managers is, in fact, to try a case, correct? we're being entrusted with presenting the article of impeachment, which says what this president did. i believe that all of the senators were there and know what happened. it will be our job to tell that
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story again. i have great confidence in all 100 of those senators. i'm not just going to be speaking to a select group or trying to bring one side over to the others, but the impeachment managers, working together, are going to try to present a case to those senators, those jurors, those witnesses of the crime that the president perpetrated and has been perpetrating for a period of time against the american people and against our democracy. >> there are a number of counter arguments that i think have come up already just on the floor of congress with the vote, not only to approve the articles of impeachment but also during some of the deliberations over the electoral college votes. one of them was this is democrats just going after the president again. i don't think that's the strongest argument because if you keep going after a jay walker saying, oh, you just say he's going to jay walk and then he jay walks, well, i was right all along.
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let's set that aside. the other argument though has to do with the causal connection between what the president said and what the crowd did on january 6th. some are saying that you can make a first amendment argument that would help indemnify the president from liability over their actions. how viable do you think that is? is it possible to make a first amendment argument that exonerates the president? >> well, they are going to make whatever argument they would like to make. it is whether or not the argument is valid. the first amendment is not -- >> goodness, i think we lost the congressman. that was congressman stacey plaskett from the virgin islands. let's see if we got the connection clean. are you there, congresswoman? >> yes, i can hear you.
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can you hear me? >> i can. good. right when i was getting to the question i really wanted to ask we lost your connection. let me ask you to start that one more time before i have to let you go, in terms of the first amendment argument and its potential to exonerate president trump. >> sure. we know that all speech is not free. you are not allowed to give whatever speech you want. one example that is always put forward is that you cannot cry "fire" in a crowded movie, correct? in the same way, the president in particular cannot say the things that he did, knowing what was out there, knowing what was going to happen, and to do that. additionally, we know that this president, numerous people requested that the president say something to stop the crowd. well after he was aware of what had happened, that the capitol had been breached, and he did nothing. he knew on this particular date,
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january 6th, that congress would be convening to carry out their constitutional duty to certify the election, and he chose that date to have his rally, to bring his followers and to destroy our -- attempt to destroy our democracy. >> congresswoman stacey plaskett of the u.s. virgin islands, one of the impeachment managers for the second trial against president trump. congresswoman, i appreciate your making time. thank you. >> thank you so much. still ahead, we will get your reactions to this week's events throughout the next two hours. we've gotten plenty, but feel free to send us more. tweet us. we are @theweekmsnbs or e-mail us, coming up, we will look at the legal challenges facing president trump. could a self-pardon be in the works? for that matter, can he do that? . also, it has been almost seven years since the flint water crisis began. nine former officials are now
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indicted including michigan's former governor, rick snyder. congressman dan killede represents flint and will join us ahead. nbc's ken delaney has new reporting on the fbi investigation, that is next when "the week" continues on msnbc. m. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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whether foreign governments, organizations or individuals helped fund the insurrection at the u.s. capitol. among other leads, agents are investigating a $500,000 bitcoin payment. it was apparently made by a french national to key figures and groups in the alt-right before the attack. on top of that, federal and d.c. area police agencies have noticed that since the riot russian, iranian and chinese influence actors have, quote, seized the opportunity to amplify narratives in furtherance of their policy interests amid the presidential transition, unquote. joining us now is nbc national security correspondent ken delaney. he broke the story this evening. tell us more about this fbi investigation. it sounds like -- and i am breaking this all the way down. i know i'm way oversimplifying this, but it sounds like there may be foreign money behind the attack on the capitol, at least in part, to further much larger
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aims than just what these insurrectionists may have wanted, it has become a geo political matter. is that overstating it or is that kind of it? >> no, i think that is certainly what the fbi is investigating. first of all they're looking at the $500,000 in bitcoin transfers that appear to have been made by a french computer programmer who seems to have committed suicide. this was like his last act. while that may have seemed like it could be potentially a front for a foreign intelligence operation, people look at that and say, no, i think that really was a french computer programmer. it is a lot of money that went to some significant alt-right figures on december 8th, so a few weeks before the protest. it is larger than that because the fbi -- look, there's a long history of the russian government making common cause with far right and far left extremists in the united states. the fbi is looking to see whether there was any of that here, russia or even other adversaries, whether there was any recruitment of these people, whether there was any funding, because, look, looking at what
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the russian government and the chinese government are doing now on social media, they're trying to seize this episode and use it to their advantage and try to denigrate the united states and feed their narratives. so the fbi is looking at whether they had anything to do with sort of motivating people. look, it is clear this was a domestic movement, a domestic -- mostly a united states phenomenon, but there may have been foreign influences. if there were, that might be a crime, joshua. >> in your reporting you note how white supremacist movements in the west and the russian government have long been believed to have this kind of affinity between them. elaborate on that. >> yeah, there are -- the fbi has seen evidence for years, i am told, of attempts by russian intelligence officers to infiltrate these groups, to be in their chat rooms, to recruit them. some have even gone, some americans and westerners have gone to ukraine for some kinds of training, and so there's --
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you know, there's a symbiosis. we even saw the russians seeking to infiltrate the national rifle association, a white republican group. some of that is not illegal, but if the russians funded people who were intending on an insurrection and breaking the law, there are a lot of potential criminal charges. also, it is a counterintelligence issue. it is -- that's why the fbi's counterintelligence division is part of this investigation, joshua. >> let me put a few viewer questions to you, one having to do with the security issues in the district. there are red zones and green zones that have been set up around the capitol and the national mall to kind of delineate where people can and cannot go in and out. you can see there on the screen kind of the area around the washington monument, the lincoln memorial, the capitol, up to the white house. there's a security barrier, blocks and blocks away from that. carolyn asked on twitter, do you
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think the fences, walls and barriers are going to stay up in d.c. permanently? so sad for our capital city. ken. >> i don't think so, joshua. these barriers are designed to address a mass gathering of people and a potential mass demonstration. they are not needed to protect the capitol on a day-to-day basis. we may see more fencing, more security based on what happened january 6th, which should never happen again, the infiltration of the u.s. capitol. but what we're seeing now is about as militarized as washington, d.c. has been, some people say since the civil war, not even during world war ii or after 9/11 were there this many armed troops, barriers and vehicles and streets blocked off. so that's not really sustainable and i don't think we will see that going forward. >> yes. living in d.c. you get used to seeing various kind of security presence, including for the inauguration, but not like this. one more quick question from twitter. a viewer asked, why have we not
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heard a peep from the dni, the director of national intelligence? wouldn't he be involved in protecting our capitol from attack? where is dni ratcliffe? >> i think it is a fair question. ratcliffe issued a press relief welcoming space force into the intelligence community but he hasn't said a word about the riots. if you talked to people over there they would say, look, we are mainly a foreign intelligence operation, foreign facing, the dni includes the fbi and the national counterterrorism center which grapples with these issues of domestic terrorism. there was clearly a potential intelligence failure here and the director of national intelligence has not said one word about this, joshua. >> nbc national security correspondent ken delaney. we appreciate the reporting. thank very much. coming up, the clock is ticking on donald trump's presidency and his legal problems are piling up. we will see why his second impeachment trial will not be much like the first, just ahead. stay close.
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♪♪ it is one article of impeachment and it is very clear. it has to do with the fact that the president's words incited people's actions to commit a deadly insurrection at the united states capitol, and i think once we layout all of the evidence of the senators and the american people will see very clearly that you have to hold this president responsible. >> that was texas congressman joaquin castro. he will serve as one of the house impeachment managers for president trump's upcoming senate trial. this will be the second trial. the status quo has changed significantly since the first one. democrats will be leading this process in both chambers, albeit by a slim majority in the senate. also, last year's case revolved around a private phone call that mr. trump made to a world leader. the evidence for this year's charge was televised live for the entire world to see. we all saw the same thing at the
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same time. for more on the legal challenges facing the president, let's bring in joyce vance, a former u.s. attorney, and chuck rosenberg, also a former u.s. attorney and former fbi official. both are msnbc legal analysts. good to see you both. we are delighted to have both of you as we have plenty of legal questions. let's start with a viewer named chuck. no, it doesn't get you to the top of the line if you have the same name as one of our guests but it doesn't hurt. chuck asks, if trump pardons all of the insurrectionists, leaves office and then is impeached and found guilty by the senate, can the pardons be overturned? i think that the answer is no, that the presidential pardon power is one of those absolute pieces of the presidency that is sort of grandfathered in, but what would you say? >> i agree with you, joshua. it is not quite absolute. the constitution itself puts at least two restrictions on it.
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it can only be for federal offenses and not in cases of impeachment. short of those two things, and now i'm talking to the other chuck who has a wonderful name, by the way, i don't think it matters if the president is impeached and convicted as long as the pardons were authorized and authored during his presidency, before he leaves office. they would be valid. >> joyce, the big question, a self-pardon. is that still possible? what does the law say about self-pardons and what do you think about the prospect for one? >> well, the law is delightfully ambiguous on the self-pardon topic. there's no clarity. it hasn't been tried before, and although there's some dispute among legal scholars, joshua, i think the better part of the argument is relatively clear that the president can't pardon himself. this is because one of the principles of the rule of law is that no man can judge his own case. if the president can self-pardon, he can in essence commit crimes for four years and
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then hold himself above the law on the way out the door. so that to say a self-pardon is unlikely to hold up in court, but there's very little that keeps this president from parting with convention. we could perhaps see one before he leaves office. >> joyce, to carry on that, one of our viewers wants to know can trump issue pardons for the act that gets him impeached, either for rioters or for himself? joyce. >> so i think it follows from that earlier answer that he can't in the sense that it wouldn't be legally valid. it wouldn't hold up in court if down the road he was prosecuted by the united states government for those same acts, tried to offer a self-pardon to say you can't prosecute me, and at that point we would be on the way back to the supreme court to let them decide the issue. my legal crystal ball suggests it wouldn't work in the president's favor. >> all right. let's whip through a few more legal questions. chuck, what about a pardon, does receiving a pardon assume an
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acceptance of some kind of guilt? that question has come up in terms of what it might mean for future litigations. >> yeah, absolutely. so there's an old supreme court case, i think it dates back to 1915. it is called burdick, and what the supreme court said in that is that offering or granting somebody a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and accepting that pardon is a confession of guilt. now, i don't know necessarily that somebody who receives a pardon would be bound legally -- in other words that someone who receives a pardon would have confessed in the conventional sense to having committed a crime, but there is that imputation of guilt in the offerance of a pardon and there is that -- and perhaps it is a bit of a legal fiction, joshua, a confession of guilt in the acceptance of a pardon. >> before i have to let y'all go, let me get your sense of what this trial might look like. joyce, we understand that congressman jim jordan of ohio
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and matt gaetz of florida are two of the people who might be part of the president's legal team. what's your expectation of the trial including if the two of them, two of president trump's most stalwart defenders, are part of his legal defense in this impeachment trial? >> well, it will be colorful, loud and tough for the american people to sit through after everything else that we've been through. but one thing i would highlight, joshua, is this is a most unusual jury in the senate because they're both jurors hearing the case against the president, they are also victims of the crime itself in a very real sense. one has sensed real movement in terms of how they receive this president and whether or not this was an act too far and an abuse of his power. this i think will be a very unfriendly jury if there is a trial that's held. >> chuck, before we go, what about the nature of the evidence? i almost feel like this is more like the george floyd homicide in terms of the way that it has
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shifted support for black lives matter. everyone saw the same eight minutes and 46 seconds at the same time, raw. so there was no question as to what we were looking at. we saw what happened at the capitol raw. there was no question about what we were looking at. how much of a difference do you think that will make this time? >> well, you're quite right. we saw and heard and felt the evidence, but i don't think that the trump speech on the morning of january 6th is the entirety of it, joshua. look, there's lots of other things that he's said and did leading up to that january 6th speech, which i think are relevant and important and probative of his state of mind. there may also be lots of evidence that comes from people with whom he spoke, both before and after his january 6th speech. oh, by the way, depending on when the house delivers the article of impeachment to the senate, the democrats will control the senate and can call witnesses, something we did not see in his first impeachment trial. so it could be quite different in that way, too.
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that may feel like a really lofty goal considering where we are right now. more than 31 million vaccine doses have been shipped out, but fewer than 11 million americans have received at least one dose and only 1.6 million have been fully vaccinated against covid-19. yet all over the country people are stepping up to help the vaccination effort. that includes one young person in philadelphia who's determined to help those in need. nbc's stephanie gosk has the story. >> we're really taking part in something that is nuts, just totally nuts. >> reporter: this was the scene in the pennsylvania convention center right before the launch of the largest mass vaccination site in the state. >> every single patient is going to get a time-stamped sticker here. >> reporter: a test to see if 1,200 people a day can be vaccinated at a rate of 150 an hour. >> they're running a very orderly operation of having people preregister and then come in, socially distance and safe.
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>> the health department can't do this alone. >> reporter: dr. caroline johnson is deputy health commissioner for the city of philadelphia. >> thinking outside the box is what it takes, is for people, you know, who do have enthusiasm and ideas and can put them into action. >> reporter: and in just two days, the health department vaccinated 2,500 health care workers, relying on an unlikely partner. >> it is really the health department here who is giving us a shot. >> reporter: 22-year-old andrei is a graduate student at drexel university who gathered a group of his friend and one of his professor and founded philly fighting covid at the start of the pandemic. >> we don't think like institutional, you know. we are engineers, we are scientists, computer scientists, cybersecurity nerds. we think a little differently than people in health care do. >> reporter: they are self-described problem solvers. when there was a ppe shortage they used 3d printers to make face shields, donating 5,000 to local hospitals in low income
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neighborhoods. they then moved on to covid tests, offering them free in underserved areas, totaling 20,000 over seven months. andrei's bulldog ran security. >> they stepped up and said we will figure out a way to help. >> reporter: a large mass vaccination site was the next step. >> we are doing everything electronic allowing us to move people quickly. >> reporter: they found an easy-to-use registration software. enter your information and you will be notified when it is your turn. >> it took about two seconds. i went on the -- clicked the link, picked the time i wanted and entered my information and got a text message and here i am. >> reporter: what would you say are the key things that make this innovative, that make this successful? >> it was really the whole idea that we took the entire model and just threw it out the
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window. we said to hell with all of that, we will completely build a new model that is based like a factory. >> reporter: including an assembly line of sorts for the syringes. one group of nurses prefills them while another group does the actual vaccinations. to overcome staffing challenges, the organization tapped nursing students to assist. >> reporter: do you see this model as something that other cities and states can use? >> yes, and we encourage people to reach out to us and our engineers will talk to their engineers and we will make sure that our model is as transparent as possible. >> reporter: so you are just going to share it with everyone? >> yes, we want to get out of this pandemic. >> reporter: for newly-vaccinated joanna vasquez who works at a children's crisis center, the end of the pandemic can't come fast enough. >> to have them see our faces is going to be amazing. i am hoping it is not too long. >> reporter: getting vaccines out quickly and efficiently is key. >> my grandmother died of covid earlier this year, so it is kind of bittersweet.
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sorry. and i'm just really happy. >> that's nbc's stephanie gosk reporting. tomorrow we will answer more of your questions about covid-19 or the vaccine. dr. ezekiel emanuel is on president-elect biden's transition covid-19 advisory board. he will join us to answer them. so e-mail us. the address is or tweet us a 30-second video @theweekmsnbc. your question might be answered on air tomorrow. up next, nine officials have been charged over the flint water crisis seven years ar it began. how are things there now? michigan congressman dan kildee joins us next. it sucks the minerals out of the tooth's surface. pronamel is formulated to help deliver minerals to the tooth's surface to help reharden and strengthen your enamel. hey, dad! hey, son! no dad, it's a video call.
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♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [laugh] dad i got a job! i'm moving out.
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[laugh] dream sequence ending no! in three, no! two, keep packing! one. ♪♪ this week prosecutors announced new indictments in michigan against nine former officials for their allege roles in the flint water crisis. the defendants include michigan's former governor rick snyder. the crisis began in april of 2014, part of an effort to save money. officials in flint switched the city's water supply from detroit's water system to the flint river. that exposed residents to dangerous levels of lead. at least a dozen people died, more than 80 people got legionnaires disease, a severe form of pneumonia caused by bacteria in water. in a press conference on thursday, michigan's solicitor general said this about the charges against former governor
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snyder. >> let me be clear. there are no velvet ropes in our criminal justice system. nobody, no matter how powerful or well-connected, is above accountability when they commit a crime. >> joining us now is congressman dan kildee. he was born and raised in flint and represents the area in congress. congressman, good evening. >> thanks, joshua. thanks for having me on. >> what does justice look like in this case and do you expect justice to be done in this case? >> well, it remains to be seen whether justice will be done. i never get ahead of a criminal investigation or criminal charges. i think the process will work itself out and the people of flint finally will have their day in court. but justice for the people of flint comes in lots of forms. holding these individuals accountable, and especially thinking about the times we're
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in right now, seeing that the state of michigan, this current prosecutor team is not letting anyone off the hook no matter who they are, no matter what position they hold. the facts led them to these defendants and even though they were in high positions of government they're going to face a jury and a judge. i think that's obviously one measure of justice. there are lots of other things that flint needs in order to have real justice as a result of the water crisis, making sure that everyone has the support they need in order to overcome the barriers that this crisis has created, dealing with the economic impact, the psychological impact, all of the health impacts, some financial compensation for the losses that people faced, but this is an important part of the march for justice for the people of flint. not everyone is satisfied with these charges, but i think it is pretty extraordinary that this prosecution team did their job, followed the facts, and it led them to the people at the highest levels of the
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government. >> the state senate minority leader has said that he still can't trust claims that the water is safe to drink. everyone i have talked to this week just in my own life about this story is like, i wouldn't trust it either. i don't know how you go about rebuilding confidence in the water system that people are paying for that is still not necessarily safe to put in their children's bodies. first of all, how is the water in flint right now? is the water drinkable and where do you see the effort to make sure that people trust the water once it is drinkable? >> those are two really interesting and distinct questions. whether it is drinkable or not, people don't trust it. they were told it was drinkable before by some of the people that are facing these charges. you know, hence some of the facts that will work against them. the quality of the water has improved, but there are still problems for sure. we are almost completed in terms of replacing all of those led
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service lines, and i don't think anyone is going to completely trust it until all of those led lines are gone. but you raise a very important point. this is a community that had government fail virtually at every level, and it is really tough to ask them now that we're telling -- you know, that we want you to trust us now, don't trust those other people. you notice, the folks in flint, they see government as a set of institutions that failed them and i don't take it personally when folks are suspicious. i think we have to give the people of flint a little bit of space, but also make sure that what we're doing is not just getting them back to where they were before the crisis. i think that would be the ultimate breach of trust, because what that will say to them is that we're going to get you right back where you were before one miscalculation put this whole community in free fall. the underlying problem that
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fails, i think we have completely failed to address as a society is that we have too many places like flint that are just teetering on the brink. >> yes. >> this time it was water. it could have been something else. we have to find a way to make sure the basic elements of civil society, whether it is affordable drinking water or, you know, basic public services that are of a reasonable quality, that ought to be an assurance for everyone, not something that we have to question. >> i did want to ask you before i let you go about these protests that are feared in connection to the inauguration. flint is not too far a drive away from lansing, michigan, the state capital. what is your sense of how prepared michigan and michiganders are for what may happen on wednesday? we remember the protest that happened last year with the angry mob that was literally calling for governor grech inwhitmer's head. what do you expect to happen in lansing on wednesday, if
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anything. >> well, the events that occurred in michigan before were just a dress rehearsal for what we saw in washington, and i think our governor and the entire security infrastructure will be prepared. but, you know, joshua, there's really an important thing i want to say. you know, we are expecting the president at some point -- obviously he will leave office -- to tell the truth. i don't know that we can expect that, but one thing we can expect, all of those members of congress and senators that went along with the lie because it served their political purposes, they have a responsibility right now to help tamp this down by doing the hard thing, and that is tell the truth. acknowledge that this was all a lie. apologize to the people who have been hurt by this. now, whether they will do that or not, i don't know, but i think they have an obligation. those people who voted to overturn this election, those state officials who went along with this big lie, they have an obligation to help tamp this down by telling the truth.
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we'll just see if they'll do that. >> congressman dan kildee who represents flint, michigan, congressman, we appreciate your time. thank you. >> thank you very much. we have much more to get to in our next hour including the latest on the situation here in washington. security is beefed up all around the capitol. new threats of violence are coming ahead of the inauguration. also, we'll explore how something called "the invisible obvious" may explain the biasses that shaped the capitol riot. and i'll share my thoughts on the emotional work we may need to do to prepare for this year and this presidency. that's all ahead when "the week" continues from washington on msnbc. [laugh] dad i got a job! i'm moving out. [laugh] dream sequence ending no! in three, no! two, keep packing! one.
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the tent. we forgot... the tent. except about that. xfinity home. simple. easy. awesome. hey look, i found the tent! get xfinity home with no term contract required. click or call today. are you feeling a little edgy tonight? if so, you're definitely not alone. four days before joe biden's inauguration, security is very high at the u.s. capitol and at multiple state capitols across the nation. they are preparing for the possibility of more violence. from nbc news in washington, i'm joshua johnson. welcome to "the week." ♪♪ consider this. right now there are more american troops here in washington than th


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