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tv   Deadline White House  MSNBC  October 13, 2021 1:00pm-3:00pm PDT

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hi there, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. there have been countless people at this point warning of the dangers of the former president, the dangers he poses to our democracy and our country over the years. few have been as prophetic as congressman adam schiff who said this about the dangers of aquitting donald trump during the first impeachment trial. >> the plot goes on, the scheming persist asks the danger will never recede. he has done it before. he will do it again. what are the odds if left in office that he will continue trying to cheat? i will tell you. 100%. not 5%, not 10%, or even 50%. but 100%. if you have found him guilty and you do not remove him from
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office, he will continue trying to cheat in the election until he succeeds. then what shall you say? >> we were all warned. we were warned by adam schiff who turned out to be correct on every single count. more than a year and a half after he said those words on the floor of the united states senate we all are living the fallout of the now twice impeached disgrace asked deplatformed expresident's attempts to steal the 2020 election. we are grappling with an ongoing threat to our democracy as the republican party sets the stage for an attempt to overturn the results of the next presidential and midterm elections if they don't go their way. few people have witnessed the degradation of our democracy at the hands of trump and the republican party up close and personal in the way that adam schiff has. in his new book, he describes the current situation, our system of government depends on two functional parties. now we have only one. the gop have become an
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anti-toout anti-democratic cult organized around the former president. for a brief moment when emotions around the insurrection were high and public sentiment against trump was powerful and deep, mccarthy and mcconnell flirted with casting him aside. like a candle in the agrees their flirtation with truth quickly flickered and died. when that small light extinguished prospects for the damages -- the phony election you had at it is and the endless stream of disinformation pouring out of the right like this, quote, republicans are preparing the battlefield for the struggle to overturn the next presidential election if it doesn't go their way. should they regain majority in congress they might be successful. each as i write these words the idea is an astonishment. the evident to overturn the next presidential election might be successful. all this makes the investigation by the january 6th select
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committee and the prosecution of the insurrectionists by the d.o.j. all the more vital. brand-new video released in one of the more than 600 capitol attack cases shows a crowd of trump supporters streaming through an entrance to the capitol building just ten minutes after the vice president had been escorted off the senate floor. breaking, news of the january 6th committee may take action against a former official who is a key player in trump's plans to overturn the election results. "washington post" reports, the committee may issue a subpoena as early as today to jeff reclark. he's a trump justice department official who sought to reemploy department resources to support former president trump's false claims of massive voting fraud in the 2020 election. today also the first of a series of deadlines that will be a test for the committee's resolve. documents are due from organizers of the rally that took place just before the capitol was attacked. in the next two days, four trump aides, including steve bannon r
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due for their deposition. last night congresswoman liz cheney made it clear that anyone who doesn't comply with subpoenas from the committee will be received for criminal prosecution. watch. >> in general, people are going to have to appear or, you know, we will move contempt charges against them. >> do you feel -- depositions with meadows and patel on the 14th and 15th of this week. >> we are. >> are they going to show up? >> if they show up, we will be prepared. i think the main message that people need to hear is it's their duty as american citizens. we have a number of people who are coming to us every single day voluntarily because they understand it's their duty as american citizens. we had an assault on the capitol, an assault on the constitution. and for anybody to be obstructing the investigation, for anybody to be avoiding information, avoiding providing testimony about what happened,
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they are violating people's fundamental business as citizens to get to the bottom. >> congressman schiff will be our guest. we will start with matt miller now an msnbc justice and security analyst. you had been atop the last democratic-led department of justice. this democratic-led department of justice could suddenly be thrust smack dab into the more public part of holding the insurrectionists and those who incited the suction accountable not the rather opaque investigation into the insurrectionists themselves. what are your thoughts as we head into these deadlines. documents from the rally planners due today. depositions for cash patel and steve bannon due tomorrow. mark meadows and dan scavino on the 15th. then those rally planners should be heading in closer to the end of the month. do you think any of these deadlines are going to be met? >> no, i don't think. i think they have all made clear
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they are going to blow off the committee. these are all people who when they were part of the trump administration got used to the fact there was no accountability for any of their actions. they continue to think there will be no accountability. i have been heartened by members of the committee the chairman on down saying clearly if people don't comply with their subpoenas they will refer them to the department of justice for criminal prosecution. i hope the department takes thatters isly. to be clear what's going on here, the department has a long standing position that if you were subpoenaed by a committee of congress and you are a member of an administration and the president has invoked executive privilege for and you you are referred for criminal prosecution the department will not prosecute you. they will respect the fact that the president invoked executive privilege. that hasn't happened. donald trump is not the president of the united states anymore. the signature president hasn't invoked executive privilege. and steve bannon's attorney, who wasn't a member of the administration for the events he
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was subpoenaed to testify on, steve bannon hasn't been contacted by the president. absent a claim by joe biden, the just department ought to take the referrals seriously. and they ought to go a step further, they ought to publicly say to these witnesses and any others thinking about blowing off subpoenas if there is in the an invocation of executive privileges from the sitting president, you are not immune from criminal prosecution. we will hold you accountable. >> so the deadline for steve bannon and cash patel is tomorrow. how quickly could that happen? >> i mean the referrals from the committee could come instantaneously. once the deadline is passed they are not in compliance with their subpoenas and the referrals should go to the department of justice, to the u.s. attorney for the district of columbia. they will conduct an investigation and decide whether
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to criminally prosecute them. look, you could have wrangling if the former president decided to try to assert executive privilege, something which it is not clear that he could do. he could try to go to court to block the subpoenas. but he and his attorneys have been somewhat quiet about this. it is not clear what they will do. there is no reason to think right now the justice department has to pay attention to what donald trump thinks it ought to do anymore. he is no longer the president and joe biden hasn't invoked executive privilege. the department can conduct a quick investigation and i think they ought to move forward with prosecutions if people don't comply with these subpoenas. >> jeffrey rosen, who became the acting attorney general after bill barr departed sort of mid-koop plot, was reportedly appearing or is appearing or is said to be appearing or has appeared before the january 6th select committee today. talk about him as a back reason not just to what jeffrey clark wanted to do, but what donald trump wanted to do if dodge
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would simply declare the results fraudulent or corrupt. he had donald trump had a plan. he detailed it to clark. he named names of those who were going to help him overturn the election results. >> rosen is a fact witness complying with his call to come in and testify. he was there at the justice department when this subordinate official to him jeffrey clark was cooperating with in back doorway with the white house, something he is not supposed to be doing to conduct his own hair brained investigations into what had happened. he wanted to send letters to states encouraging them to not certify the election. and jeffrey rosen, the deputy attorney general, who was a longtime partner ever bill barr's. in private practice, he was brought into the justice department by bill barr was there supporting i would say some of the worst abuse of bill
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barr leading up to the election but in the aftermath of the election stood strong when donald trump working through subordinate jeffrey clark was trying to get the dodge to put its thumb on the scale in a way that would have been invery appropriate. he is there to testify about other department of justice officials actions and what the president did and this fateful oval office meeting they had in the aftermath of the election. it is important to contrast him with bannon and patel and other witnesses. jeffrey clark -- sorry, jeffrey rosen was instructed by the justice department that we are going to waive any privileges we have. the events around january 6th are so important, the events involving the former president trying overturn an election are so important, we are not going to invoke not just executive privilege but any of the other privileges that administrations sometimes use to thwart congressional committees and block officials from testifying.
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you can go in and testify. so he did. jeffrey clark, another d.o.j. official is ignoring that instruction from the justice department and so far is refusing to testify. looks like he will be subpoena. if he doesn't comply with the subpoena, i hope he is prosecute . >> we will put both of those pieces of information to our next guest, adam schiff, a member of the house select committee investigating the deadly attack on the united states capitol on january 6th is our guest. he is the author of a brands new book "mi midnight in washington, how we almost lost our democracy and still could". congressman, thank you for sending time with us today. >> great to be with you. >> we read from some of the book. i want to go back into what you write about mcconnell and mccarthy and really drive into that. but i want to start with some of today's breaking news and something matt miller just touched on, which is the testimony of former acting
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attorney general jeffrey rosen. was he before the select committee today? >> you know, we are not confirming who is appearing before the committee because we have a great many people we are talking to who don't want to acknowledge necessarily their appearance. but i can you know certainly confirm what matt was saying about the position of the administration, which is top officials at the justice department who have very pertinent information that we are talking to -- i just won't be more specific than that -- the administration is not standing in the way. they are not going to claim privilege. they understand how extraordinary that is, but they understand this we are talking about an attack on the capitol. and the american people need and deserve to know the full facts. and i'm grateful that we have that kind of relationship with the white house where it will not interfere with our important work. >> so, without asking you to name names, there are a couple individuals whose deadline is tomorrow. we can just talk dates. what will you do if the deadline
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comes and goes for two witnesses who have been subpoenaed and they don't show up? >> we will move to hold them in criminal contempt. so our committee will produce a report about the efforts that were made to get them to testify. we will submit that report. and we will call for a vote on the house floor. that will send it to the justice department. our expectation is they will be prosecuted. i think part of the reason why some of these witnesses fell like they can thumb their nose at congress and the power of the subpoena is for four years that's exactly what they did. and they had an attorney general in bill barr who would not enforce the subpoenas because anyone covering up for the president was doing bill barr and the president's work and they were not about to hold them accountable. but that is a very different situation than today. today we have an attorney general that respects the rule of law, who upholds the principle known as above the law. and we expect those subpoenas to be enforced and enforced with
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prosecution. >> by the end of the week, with that stipulated, you could have a vote on criminal referrals for cash patel, steve bannon, mark meadows, and dan scavino. is the ultimate goal to get them to blink somewhere in that process and come and disclose everything they know and saw to the committee? or is it more a matter of trump and his allies steam rolling the oversight role of congress through two impeachments, i guess to mueller's investigation and others. just tell me what the preference is, what the priority is. >> i think it's twofold. it's one to get the information to the american people, to make it as part of our comprehensive report at the ends of the investigation. the other is to once again affirm the rule of law. the reason why some of these witnesses, people like steve bannon, who have been public about their contempt for congress feel they can get away with it is for four years, they did. bannon, during the russia
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investigation showed up before a committee even when it was led by republicans and refused to answer all but 25 questions that were written out for him by the white house, by the subject of our investigation. he felt he could do that because he would never be held in contempt. he would never be prosecuted by the trump justice department. but those days are over. and i view that not only as essential to our investigation. but i also view this, the enforcement of the rule of law, as an early test of whether our democracy is recovering. >> i watch the republicans, and i make this comparison all the time. like bruce willis in the sixth sense, i see republicans as maniacal and unstoppable when they aim is agreed upon. and that -- sort of the call has gone out. all republicans are going to pass voter restriction laws. all republicans are going to remove the brad raffenspergers
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of this country and put in cronies. i want to read what you write about why. republicans are preparing the battlefield for the struggle to overturn the next presidential election if it doesn't go their way. should they gain majorities in congress they just might be sum of even as i write these words, the idea is an astonishment. the effort to overturn the necks presidential election might be successful. i agree with you. but if that's the case, your party is not powerful. you control the house. you control the senate, you control the white house. why not urgently make federal voting rights legislation about protecting our democrat creation from the ongoing koop? >> i think you are absolutely right. i have had those conversations with the white house about the urgency here, about the imperative of finding a pathway to get the voting rights legislation passed, to guard against these efforts around the country which are a existential
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threat to our democracy. the infrastructure bill is important, a democracy needs to deliver for its people as the president says. but the foundation is the right to vote. take away that foundation and the rest of the edifice crumbles. now, i have the belief and the sense from joe march ib that if we can find the path with him, if we can help him explain to the people back home why this is so important, that he will move forward. that was the case in impeachment. you know, it wasn't easy to urge someone that trump had won their state by 30 points to vote to remove that president but we made the case successfully to him. we need to make the case successfully to him that the filibuster cannot again be used to disenfranchise people of couple. it can't be used to undermine and diminish our democracy. and that case is urgent. so i am in complete kpleemt. certainly doing all i can. >> i want to ask you -- complete
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agreement. certainly doing all i can. >> i want to understand what you are saying here. you can't let them see you, a republican member said the me during the capitol attack. he's right, another republican member said. i know these people. i can talk to them. i can talk my way through them. you're in a whole different category. in that moment, we were not merely members of different political parties, but on opposite sides of a much more dangerous divide. at first i was oddly touched by these gop members and their evident concern. but by then i had been receiving death threats for years and that feeling gave way to another, that if these republicans hadn't joined the president in falsely attacking me for four years i wouldn't be concerned about my
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security, none of us would. tell me about that? >> i wanted to people to understand why when it was all over, said and done my anger was as great at the republicans as anybody climbing on the capitol that day. because the people outside the capitol, they believed the big lie. their conduct was horrible and they should be prosecuted but they believed the big lie. the people in the chamber that day understood it was a lie. they kept telling the lie. they keep telling it today. steve scalise on sunday couldn't even bring himself to admit that the election wasn't stolen. they are destroying our democracy. and it's these insurrectionists wearing suits and ties that are the most dangerous. it is their intention around the country to take the power away from the brad raffenspergers and replace them with supporters. the president is still pushing
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the same lie that incited the first insurrection on the capitol. there could be another. and that's how democracies come to an end. the last point i want to make on this because i know it's oppressive, all that's going on, is there have been some real heros the last four or five years, marieia van vich and taylor and others have shown us we can stand up to the most powerful people in the world and reclaim our democracy. i wanted to include that in the book, that we can reclaim our optimism. >> i wanted to ask you about the optimism. the republican campaign to push through more than 400 voter suppression, voter nullification bills, more than 33 passed,
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there are bills in 48 states. raffensperger has been primaried. as your comments made clear you are working on bringing your own party sogt. the democratic party isn't committed to saving the right to vote and undermining nullification bills, how can you be optimistic. >> the combination of the two bills we are going to pass and the american rescue plan will be the biggest investment in the american people since the new deal. that's really important to our democracy, too, to show that it can deliver and to meet the needs of prankly a lot of people that donald trump appealed to back in 2016 when he called them forgotten. because we are actually helping their lot, where donald trump simply made it worse. that's an important piece, that very positive agenda. but you are right, the voting
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rights stuff is essential. and we need to get that done, too. but we can't put all of our eggs in that basket given that the congress is almost completely evenly divided. even as we try to get voting rights legislation passed we are working around the country to bring about stacey abrams-like efforts in every state to overcome every single hurdle. we will use litigation to fight these laws. we will go after corrupt officials if they do try to subvert and overturn an election. we will do everything necessary to protect our democracy because we love our democracy more than they wish to tear it down. that's why i know we are going to get through this. >> congressman adam schiff defending his optimism. he is sticking around. matt miller will be sticking around as well. when we come back, the congressman's inside account of donald trump's first impeachment trial. the stories of heroics, the warnings about what could happen if donald trump were to get away with clear, flagrant public
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abuse of power with more than just holding him accountable what they were trying to do. it was more about saving america from something worse that could happen. more from his new book next. you probably heard about product shortages, long delivery times escalating prices for food, tvst, cars, another warning about christmas, for toys. the president addressed that today. we will show you about his plan moving forward. school officials and school board members facing harassment and threats of physical violence. all of those stories and more when "deadline: white house" continues after a quick break. don't go anywhere today. e today. ♪girl, i don't know, i don't know,♪ ♪i don't know why i can't get enough of your love babe♪ ♪oh no, babe girl, if i could only make you see♪
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two impeachments ending in acquittal and one insurrection later, our guest congressman adam schiff writes, he's learned that getting to the truth still matters, writing n the crucible of congress i watched the trump presidency reveal the degree to which some of my colleagues valued nothing, so much as their own position in power. but it also introduced me and the country to william taylor, who chose the infantry in vietnam and never stopped serving. and alexander vinman, who braved roadside bombs in iraq and claims of disloyalty at home and fiona hill who brought her intellect and at that time to a country her father loved but never got to see. and marie yovanovich whose parents fled communism and fascism seeing their courage, their selflessness and their
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love of country and knowing that such wonderful public servants populate all of our agencies and departments was enough to reassure me. of course, they were all run offer by the steam train of donald trump and rudy giuliani. i wonder if you feel motivated more by not seeing trump convicted in either of the two impeachments in our work on the select committee? >> i certainly feel a sense of urgency about the fact that this man could once again become the president of the united states. seeing what he did already, the way he retaliated against anyone who stood up to him, how he hounded out the members of his own party when they did, how he was able to force out people
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like marie yovanovich under threat of her life and people like colonel vinman and his twin brother and so many others. i remember vividly, i write about this, all the faux outrage in the senate during the trial when i made reference to a cbs story that those that cross the president might find their heads on pikes. immediately after the trial there were all kinds of heads on pikes. all sorts of retaliation. it inspired the protection of whistle-blowers, the protection of inspector generals. one of our reform packages in addition to the two you mentioned, protecting our democracy act is our own broad set of post watergate reforms designed to protect those abuses. those were apparently necessary as a result of the last few years. >> where is that? is there a head of steam behind that?
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it seems like everything we learned from trump, everything we see, you said it -- the atlantic writes many of knows who oppose trump are frantically folk used on the danger of trump and his gone allies trying to teal 2022 and 2024. it is not without justification. these watchdogs risk missing the graver danger. some could win this fair and square. >> look, i think we mis -- we underestimated donald trump once too often in 2016 with disastrous consequences for the country. i used to tell a joke during the 2016 election that there was no way he was going to become the republican nominee because republicans weren't that crazy and democrats weren't that lucky. turns out they were that crazy and we weren't that lucky? yeah. >> we won't make that mistake again. i do think, though, as time goes by and it will become
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increasingly more clear as we gain perspective on the last four years americans will realize what a disastrous presidency donald trump's was, how many people needlessly lost their lives during the pandemic because of his nas simple and incompetence. also how his daily dose of bile and poison in the american body politic turned american against american, and they will not want to go back to that. i think it is going to become increasingly clear over time. but we cannot use that as reason to become complacent or aig take anything for granted. we are not through this yet but i think what we do now will determine how quickly we can get through it. >> i used to believe that, too. and bod woodward says the edict, the truth emerges. it always gets out. it is certainly true of my time in government and the -- campaign. you have got facebook that reflects phony propaganda spewed out from the most watched
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commentators on fox news. that's just what is public facing. i am sure there is opaque repeated and amplified adversaries -- blubl when trump is revealed his base will crumble? >> i do. i think it is only a matter of time before the fact that the emperor has no clothes is exposed and trump and trumpism comes crashing in on itself. these kind of fanatical movements like donald trump's always ends up cratering in on themselves. it is true that one of the real contributors to this whole phenomenon has been the revolution in communication, the fact there is now this major medium in which lies and anger travel literally with virality. we haven't figured out how to deal with that, how to be good consumers of information. but we will figure it out. time is not going to be kind to donald trump. it's not going to be kind to any of the enablers and sycophants in the congress who upheld him
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during this period. one of the things that i really can't understand about my colleague is how do they believe they are going to explain this to their children and grandchildren one day, when they are asked, what did you do when that awful man was running the country? please tell me you did something to stand up to him. tell me you didn't go along with him. i don't know how they are going to answer. but i have the same faith that i heard myth romney express when he gave his verdict in that trial and said that he was a depositly religious man and he had children and grandchildren to answer to. i feel that keenly. i am very confident history will rebuke donald trump and everyone who stood with him. but we are not there yet. we are not there yet. and we are going to have to work to make sure that we are moving the country forward and we never go back to that kind of a presidency. >> i know the january 6th investigation is following the facts as did the impeachment trials but what is your theory
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of the case? we know from reporting that donald trump sat there and cheered the insurrection and the insurrectionists. we know he told them he loved them on a video. we know his aides don't want to talk to you, they are facing a vote of criminal comcontempt by tend of the week. and you mentioned steve scalise, who has kids and i think grandkids won't acknowledge the outcome of the 2020 election that returned him to congress and his caucus. if you think it was fraudulent, you should ask every republican house member to resign. are you sure they don't want a naked emperor, that they don't seet trump and the republicans for who they are and want it anyway? you had a smoking gun in the first impeachment trial, a smoking gun on the shelf next to it after the second impeachment trial. you had a smoking gun while the insurrection was going on where he said i love you. can you imagine another smoking
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gun on the shelf that has no impact? >> no. i think that over time people have come to see and will increasingly come to see the disaster of donald trump and the destruction he has brought to this country. why do steve scalise continue to peddle the big lie or refuse to tell the truth about it? why does kevin mccarthy done the same thing? power revealed to them that they don't have the courage of their own supposed convictions. but their time is numbered. historically, those that they are following are rebuked by history, and they will be, too. so i have every confidence that that's going to happen. but, again, i think that we need to look not to those that have capitulated. we knew in stichktively i think before this whole chapter in our national history that courage is
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contagious. we found out so is cowardice. let's let the courage be contagious. let's let the four figures you put up on the screen inspire us with their courage. there are lots of good people who are sticking their neck out, liz cheney, adam kinzinger and others. let's look to their example. i would like to think they are the future of gop a gop that once again becomes a party of ideas and ideology. what we are going lieu in the united states is not unlike what other countries have gone through around the globe as a result of economic changes and profound instability as a result of the information revolution. it has been a perfect storm of awful. you add the pandemic to it. an environment in which conspiracies just proliferate. but this storm will pass, and we just have to work hard to make sure it passes soon. >> if the delta wave can bend perhaps the storm shall pass.
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i hope you are right. the book is "midnight in washington". congressman adam schiff, thank you for spending time to talk to us about it ask. matt miller, thanks to you for starting us off this hour. the white house today addressing serious economic problems touching just about all of us. the back loving goods getting to our fellow americans. the white house plan to get on top of that next. ♪ there are beautiful ideas that remain in the dark. but with our new multi-cloud experience, you have the flexibility you need to unveil them to the world. ♪
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[sizzling] i may not be able to tell time, but i know what time it is. [whispering] it's grilled cheese o'clock.
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president biden today on what the white house calls a 90-second sprint to relieve record congestion at key u.s. ports that have as you may have noticed or read about made many products impossible to finds or more expensive. it is due to an unprecedented surge of people getting just about everything delivered to their home during the pandemic creating backlogs in supply chains. cargo sheps are floating off our coast waiting to unload. currently 8 1 out of the port of l.a. president biden announcing this afternoon that the ports, and delivery companies and retail companies would help. tell us what is happening. >> well, it is extraordinary to
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be here, nicole n a place where you can really see the past laid to rest when it comes to our expectations as americans. we have always been a country that thought things would arrive at our door whenever we wanted them to. but it turns out it was not magic. it was a fragile global supply chain. it was blown apart by covid. the port was overwhelmed. in april we spoke to the executive director who told us he was staring down the barrel of an unprecedented surge in shipping in the 94-year history of this port. the port has retooled. it is jamming 60% more cargo onto the ships. it is building some of the biggest cranes in the world in order to handle bigger ships. office this a reaction to what's going on. of course there is a secondary problem. that is the problems we didn't foresee. i mean, our system for predicting what you and i are going to buy, the kind of thing that allows us to receive thing as quickly as we do is based on
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predictive algorithms. the algorithms were destroyed by covid. climate change. storms over the winter caused 1,000 containers to go overboard. one of those containers can be the inventory of an entire business. right now the white house is stepping up saying the private sector may not be able to do this. we have to orchestrate. >> i want to get to the president's speech today his comments. i want to play those in a few seconds. jake, i want to understand what you are saying. i will cop to being blelt as an amazon addict who orders -- that one button is addictive. my question is people have been doing it now for 19, 20 months. did it break because of how long people were shopping like that? did it take -- just explain how we as humans who maybe changed our shopping habits strained the system and if there is a human piece a human responsibility, to getting through it.
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>> there are so many things that are playing into this, right? think about it this way, right? we suddenly 19, 20 months ago all decide we have to work from home. we all need pcs and lap tops. the semiconductor makers pivot away from putting semiconductors into cars and put them in pcs. that blows up the car market and that's why you have a hard time buying a new car in the united states right now. talk about people walking off jobs they are no longer satisfied with. people walked off the jobs, quit their jobs, that includes food and logistics. so you suddenly have a lack of truckers and all sorts of other things. you have multiple human factors. now we are getting our arms around unloading the boats. but after and before that what happens matters. it shows you what a fragile
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system we are operating in. >> here's what the president said today. >> i know you are hearing a lot about supply chains and how hard it is to get a range of things from a toaster to sneakers to bicycles to bedroom furniture. i want to be clear, this is across the board commitment to going to 24/7. this is a big first step in speeding up the movement of materials and goods through our supply chain. but now we need the rest of the private sector chain to step up as well. this is not called a supply chain for nothing. >> this seems of vital importance to the biden presidency to get what they proposed today right. >> yeah, it is, nicole. i mean the resulting inflation that we have seen has chilled consumer confidence and also weighed on biden's approval ratings which i think we have all been very closely watching, especially ahead of the gubernatorial race. but it is a double edged sword
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here on calls today government officials acknowledged that the $179 trillion package that biden signed into law at the beginning of his presidency, the american rescue package, to help stave off the economic recession from the pandemic is in part why the u.s. recovered so well, was also responsible in part for this supply chain bottleneck. there is really only so much that president biden can do according to economists that the "washington post" has spoken with. but that's why you see biden making a call to the private sector and also using this opportunity to call on lawmakers to pass his build back better bill. and the infrastructure plan. he made a point strongly in this speech in order to get through this supply chain issue and be competitive global they will need that to pass and go into law so that a once-in an had
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generation investment in infrastructure across the country could be made. >> one of the early crises was the hacking attack on the gas supply in the mid atlantic east coast. i no that the white house chief of staff made this a top priority. it was about solving the problem. it was about solving the perception there was a problem and about proving their own competent as a new white house a new administration. talk about the importance or the plan or the outreach on the hill for solving this crisis, which could potentially stretch longer and impact just about everyone in the country. >> yeah, we have seen this white house snap into action, especially today, tributing talking points because a big part of this is, again, public relations, the optics aspects of this, as official, you know, try to calm the markets and want to provide talking points to lawmakers to ensure that there is a plan ahead in order to save off this supply chain issue which if people continue to
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panic over it could actually exacerbate the situation. so the communications aspects of this problem is really important, is paramount for the white house going ahead. but this is a white house and a democratic congress that has overall in the past year exhibited a pretty strong working relationship with the leg affairs office on capitol hill. they have had to with how much they have been negotiating and hashing out on a range of budgetary issues. i think we will see that continue this week as congress grapples with an array of economic issues at the moment. >> certainly turning everyone's attention in that direction. jackie, jake, thank you for spending time with us on this story. we will stay on it with your help. william shatner, actor, now civilian astronaut went up today in another space flight carrying normal americans not astronauts,
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to the edge of space something the 90-year-old actor called the mow profound experience of his life. we will have that story with a special guest next. fe we will have that story with a special guest next ♪ ♪ ♪ hey google. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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i hope i never recover from this. i hope that i can maintain what i feel now. i don't want to lose it. >> wow. that was actor william shatner describing his experience of being part of the flight to the edge of space more than 50 years after his debut on "star trek." he's the oldest person to go into space. the flight lasted ten minutes and was the crew's second mission. joining us now, neil, director of the hayden planetarium in new york. you guys are friends. a picture of you and william shatner. can you talk what was on his mind today? >> we're not beer drinking buddies, but strong acquaintances i would say. when you think of the era of
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astronauts and there's no emotion and what they said and just science and engineering and now we send up a beloved actor. in other missions, we've sent up basically one of us. people we care about. people who live up the street. it's a reminder that may be it's overdue for the solar system, space, to become our collective backyard. where it's no longer a position of privilege, it's a position of where we would all have access to take that glance at earth that we would not otherwise will be able to see. >> we're consumers of everything you create. regulars at the planetarium. you look at the way young children view the planet. it's still sacred to them. they don't take it for granted. plastic bottles aren't a thing they see, grab, it's a market. i wonder if you can talk about
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aside from a beloved actor taking this extraordinary trip, just talk about the importance of what you just said. space becoming accessible. becoming our backyard. to solving the problems of the planet. >> well, think about what would happen if we started sending poets and artists and journalists. people who have access to different branches of civilization and what would then happen is space and space has a frontier, to boldly go to this frontier, space would then begin to infuse into our culture. where we all become participants. even if it's only vicariously. and one of the advantages when you ascend earth and first, you see how thin the atmosphere is. you say, oh, my gosh. the atmosphere is to earth what the skin of an apple is to an apple. you realize that. then of course there are no color coded countries such as
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what we've been trained to look at in this school room globe of our social studies class. all of a sudden, earth becomes one. and in these tribalistic divisive times, i think we need that more than ever. >> i have a feeling that uncommon sensation. would you like to see teachers up there so they can come back and bring this to live in the classroom? >> yeah. teachers, what we could also do is make sure there's some sort of, whatever the minimum age, i think they said 18. we could start grooming middle school kids and say who's going to be the next 18-year-old to go into space? and teen beat can follow them. are they eating well? >> i love that. >> just imagine if it becomes a participatory culture. so definitely teachers so they can share that life experience and one day, we wouldn't have to share the experience because everyone would have had access.
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and didn't ask, but i want to slip in here the concern that this was the billionaire's boys race, right? the dawn of aviation, only rich people flew on airplanes because it was expensive. it was kind of novel. and if you're novel and expensive, rich people do it. an entire industry of aviation. i see what's going on now, the dawn of a new marketplace. joyriding on holiday. but also people who can benefit from a new perspective. by the way, politicians, we send them first. they'll come back holding hands. >> love it. that's quite a profound point and that's the reason we asked you to be here. such a pleasure to have you here. thank you so much for spending time with us today. >> happy to be there. >> the next hour starts after a
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i don't reject people coming here and speaking their voice. they do it all the time. we don't stop them from doing that. i don't reject them standing outside my home. i reject them following me around in a car. following my car. i reject them saying they're coming for me, to beg for mercy. when they are using their first amendment rights, they're going behind my home and brandishing their weapons. that i have to take a dcs investigator on her play date to check for burn marks. that's what i'm against. which is a credible threat and calculated. >> wow. hi, again, everyone. a chilling account from a school board meeting in florida
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yesterday. board member jennifer jenkins detailing the threats she's dealing with. we've seen the months around mask mandates, vaccine mandates, around critical race theory, right for trans kids and more et escalate to new heights where school board members and teachers are facing threats of physical violence. >> these are demonic entities in all the school boards of all of the united states of america. >> not that non-science -- >> the death threat was you're going to get knifed you [ bleep ] you're going to get a [ bleep ] you're dead. >> people are throwing fists and hitting each other outside the auditorium after the board voted to approve wearing masks. >> we know who you are! we know who you are!
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we know who you are! we'll find you and you'll never be allowed in public again. >> don't look away, guys. that's who we are. the intimidation and bullying of local officials has reached such a critical level that yesterday, the bravard county school board passed a resolution that promises to provide a safety environment for everyone at its meetings. the federal government was also asked to step in after receiving a request for assistance, doj directed the fbi and u.s. attorneys to work closely with local law enforcement leaders to address these heightened threats. in a memorandum, garland writes this, quote -- the department takes these incidents seriously
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and is committed to using its authority and resources to discourage these threats. identify them when they occur and prosecute them when appropriate. in response to the doj's efforts to quell the intimidation and violence, guess what republicans did. well, they're outraged, of course. that violent people spewing vicious threats. instead, they're mad at doj. 31 republican house members wrote a letter to garland saying they're quote, deeply concerned by his memo. mitch mcconnell went further saying the memo lacks clarity. that parents have every right to be involved in their children's education and that grass roots interest parents have shown should be commended and encouraged. once again, grass roots -- christopher goldman is here. he monitoring national security
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issues. also joining us, a.b. stoddard and former republican congressman, david jolly. the national chairman of the serve america movement. i almost always say save american movement. i want to show you what josh holly had to say to lisa monica on this. >> harassment and intimidation, what do those terms mean in the context of a local school board meeting? in the first amendment context, we talk about the chilled speech. if this isn't a deliberate attempt to chill parents from showing up at school board meetings for their elected school boards, i don't know what is. i'm not aware of anything like this in american history. we're talking about the fbi. you're using the fbi to intervene in school board meetings. that's extraordinary. >> senator, i have to respectfully disagree. that is not what -- see the
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attorney general's memorandum made quite clear that violence is not appropriate. spirited public debate on a whole range of issues is absolutely what this country is all about. >> why is it being investigated by the fbi? >> it is not. when and if any situation turns to violence, then that is the appropriate role of law enforcement to address it. >> so the question is why does josh holly want people to be able to brandish weapons and threaten violence? why does josh holly want that? why doesn't he want the fbi to investigate any american who brandishes a weapon, files claims to the department of children's services in florida? i think that's what she was referring to. why does josh holly want people protected from this?
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david jolly froze on us. a.b., do you know? >> it's obvious that josh holly is courting a constituency for the passing of donald trump off of the political stage at some point and the young holly is hoping for a big political future as a presidential candidate so he has, you know, fist bumped to the inth direction and on and on. the problem is these republicans who are remaining silent or trying to pick a fight with the government that's looking into threats against people's lives and stalking and harassment and real endangerment are actually complicit that we have a growing threat of violence. look how far away the next
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election is. we have school officials and school nurses with threats to their lives and people harassing them and stalking them and running them out of these jobs on purpose. this is not a spirited debate. at a school board meeting. this is not a peaceful protest. these are real threats. it's outrageous and it's dangerous and we're talking about real potential for violence that they know is coming. and in their silence or their faux outrage at the fbi, they are complicit in stoking this violence. they know how scared these people are. they know they're leaving their jobs in droves and it's intentional. >> david jolly, i think it's time to just call out the republican party as comfortable with, in bed with, violence.
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josh holly is comfortable with, in bed with, the insurrectionists. josh holly is acting stupid and he's a whole lot of things. stupid isn't one of them. he knows exactly why the fbi's involved. because people are committed crimes. he knows who the people are. it's being furthered on right wing websites. a lot of it is out in the public view and i'm guessing mr. holly sees it, too. but what i want to understand and actually, chris, let me bring you in on this. how brazen are the calling to violence in and around school boards? >> i mean, they're explicit. all you have to do is tune in to any of these live stream videos that local towns have put up about what's been happening.
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the goal is to intimidate and harass these people until they quit so these maniacs can put their friends on these boards. >> i want to read some reporting that gets at that. conservative pundits have talked about these as part of a larger political strategy. ian pryor, who has claimed credit for loud and awakening, his army of mom fired up by school board protests will sweep democrats out of office. the heritage foundation celebritied the great parent revolt of 2021 which includes the founding of new parent groups that might thwart federal education bureaucrats. a.b., what are they protesting? what is being fabricated that an army is needed to have a great
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parent revolt. most of us just want our children back in in-person schools and not get covid. what is this about? >> well, in the last school year, it was largely about masks and now it's about critical race theory and the 1619 project and masks mandates and they've really fired up these, these moms or parents because it's been a great fund raising gimmick and they really are hoping that they will be politically energized for the next election. the problem is, as i said again, you know, coming to your school board meeting as a parent and protesting what is part of the curriculum or what is being taught or the way it's being taught is one thing and that's fine and it's absolutely part of the process and parents should be very involved in their kids education, but stalking and harassing and threatening people and their families is another.
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and that is, it's intentional. it's designed to terrify them and make them leave their jobs. so that they can replace them with people that they prefer who hold these views. it is just like what they're doing to election officials. it's very intentional. it's very deliberate and it's very effective. it's working. there is no person who can put up with this for too long. i mean, you can see, i must say i really have to, some of us who are sane and reasonable have to hold the line, but really, how long can you ask someone like that woman in florida to continue living that kind of a life and that's what we're seeing not only in school boards, but with the purging of election officials as well. >> david, i'm going to tell our viewers what's going on. every time we go to you, we lose our shot. we're going to consider all of us warned. i've been trying to get you in on this and you know, florida is where that first woman lives. i wonder if there's any pressure
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protect these individuals. the party is all in on threats of violence is the new normal. >> apologies for technical difficulties. i concur with everything you've discussed. josh holly knows and he is making himself a fool by suggesting that somehow doj is referring to people exercising their peaceful right to speech. he's not. it's all the. it's stalking. it's harassment. those are behaviors that need the attention of law enforcement and what the federal government is having to do is say look, in states like florida where you have a craven republican governor who is determined to make his way to the white house who will underinforce these incidents of violence and stalking and harassment, the federal government's going to step in and try to play some role to restore order. i know the discussion has been around the culture war issues
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that drive and inform voters. we are witnessing the case where -- >> david jolly froze. i'm going to use the moment to hit pause and bring you some breaking news and we'll get david back to react to this. the select committee investigating january 6th has just this hour subpoenaed mr. jeffrey clark. i'll read from the letter. the select committee needs to understand all the details but efforts inside the previous administration to delay the certification of the 2020 election and amplifying this information about the election results. we need to understand mr. clark's role and learn who was involved. the select committee expects mr. clark to cooperate fully with our investigation. just to remind our viewers, mr. clark was the doj official with whom donald trump has become very close. there was a plan for mr. clark to replace acting attorney
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general rosen, who replaced mr. barr. if mr. rosen didn't go along with donald trump's plot, plan, to overturn the election results. we learned a lot of that from the interim report. just days later now, the subpoena for jeffrey clark to provide testimony to the select committee investigating the insurrection. joining our conversation, "washington post" congressional correspondent, jackie. what do you know? >> hey, nicole. the committee just issued a subpoena were jeffrey clark, which we reported several hours ago, that that was to be expected. this is as the committee ramps up their measures. they want to move as expeditiously as possible and after negotiations between clark's legal team and the committee collapsed as they were trying to hash out the terms of the -- >> a.b. -- i apologize for all
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of our gremlins. maybe they're at the ports with our amazon orders. a.b., let me bring you back in on what congressman shift said in the last hour to me. the four individuals who were the first people subpoenaed, their deadlines are this week. and i asked if they do not comply, appear, if they will refer them for criminal prosecution. he said yes. do you see jeffrey clark stacking up with those who will try to stymie this election or do you think after seeing how serious this committee is, they may start hearing from some of these individuals? >> i can't really, i don't have any prediction on the individual case because it really probably has to do, like the congressman was describing, with the pressure that is mounting as they hear from members of the committee about their intent to not be derailed and their hope
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and their faith and their confidence that doj will act and prosecute. now that they've made that quite clear, more clear than we sort of new last week, i imagine that that provides more motivation for people to cooperate. so i think that you know, it's more likely that he complies than steve bannon, but i think the committee has made their intentions clear and really put the pressure squarely on the attorney general to act. >> david jolly, we should sort of help people understand why it's so different. it's not just the select committee investigating january 6th with the urgent mission of understanding everything that led up to the insurrection. you've got a justice department and a white house that has not exerted privilege. so jeffrey rosen has already offered hours of testimony to the senate judiciary committee and is also to meet with the 1-6 committee. so they have reams of testimony
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already about these individuals and jeffrey clark is sort of the clutter within doj. i wonder if you can speak to his importance as a witness, david jolly. >> yeah, this is critically important and i think any issues of privilege will get litigated and likely will go against the witnesses who are trying to claim privilege or at least exert trump's brif ledge. this tells me the 1-6 commission is dialing in. they are circling around the president. this is clearly about what did the president know? when did he know it? what did donald trump's team do to help organize and orchestrate and perhaps even fund the events that led to the attack on the capitol? there's no other way to look at the witness list thus far than to say that the chairman and ranking member and the committee, they're circling the wagons around donald trump. they want to know what donald trump knew and when he knew it. >> a.b., to david's point, the committee writes, select
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committee's investigation has revealed credible evidence that you attempted to involve the department of justice in efforts to interrupt the peaceful transfer of power. as detailed in a report, you proposed that the department send a letter to state legislators in georgia and other states suggesting they delay certification of election results and hold a press conference announcing they were investigating voter fraud. those are rejected by leadership as both lacking a factual bases and inconsistent with the department's institutional role. the report indicates you -- allegations of vote fraud and failed to abide by the department's policy of contacts at the white house. as a result of your efforts, the president considered installing you as acting attorney general. all of that conduct involved other accomplices and i'm thinking of john eastman who wrote the memo. the architecture for the delay which the insurrection did bring about a delay.
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pence went back, but it did bring about the delay. there's some other signals in here around georgia. i wonder what that paragraph signals to you, a.b., they're looking at. >> well, these made it clear they're looking everywhere and they've said some of the members have said things in interviews like they don't know what we don't already know that we are revealing that we know. since they know so much about mr. clark and there are so many efforts across the spectrum to go at the president in georgia. what the members of congress were doing. what people inside the white house were doing to lead up to an incite 1-6. what they did during. what they did to cover up afterward. what they will do to disbar people like rudy giuliani. it would probably be given all they know about mr. clark's
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conduct as a plotter, better for him instead of facing prosecution since he's not actually hovering up a lot of secrets at this point to cooperate with the committee. i think there are others who think what they have done is not known and they are likely to be the most prominent foot draggers. different from steve bannon who just likes to breathe fire and refuse no matter what because he thinks it helps his profile, but i think someone like clark understands well that they already know most of what he did and it's probably better that he comes in and complies. >> jackie, i want to come to you on the clock. it starts ticking. the subpoena compels mr. clark to produce documents by october 29th and appear for a deposition on october 29th. any reporting from you or your colleagues about what the initial reaction was from mr. clark to the subpoena and the deadline? >> mr. clark's lawyer declined
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comment, but the fact we know clark's team was engaged in negotiations with the committee already differentiates him from people like bannon. i think we're going to see a striation of characters here as it relates to the january 6 committee. those who are very quietly and cautiously and trying to keep it as private as possible complying with the committee and those like steve bannon who are calling bluster on the committee and are daring them to move ahead and proceed with criminal contempt and force the biden department of justice to act accordingly. you have people like kash patel who said he's engaging with the committee, but again won't confirm anything else specifically about whether or not that means he's appearing for depositions and what kind of documents that he's providing. i think these people who are still close to trump and make a living, continue to make a living off of the former
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president, have to be really careful. they might want to cooperate but after the president released a letter demanding these former top advisers not comply with the committee in any way, they need to tread pretty lightly. >> david jolly, last word on this. i just want to remind people of all of these deadlines that we're sitting on and that are ahead. the, obviously the four individuals we've been talking about, their deadline for producing documents was the 7th. it's passed. sitting for depositions is tomorrow and the next two days. over the next two days. today was the deadline for all of these event planners. the name that is probably the most helpful is katrina pearson, the former trump campaign official. kash patel and steve bannon, the 14th and mark meadows would appear for deposition should he comply on the 15th. i want you to speak to the pace of these deadlines coming and going.
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>> we did not have a peaceful transition of power in the united states in 2021. it is a black mark in american history that resulted in violence in the near undoing of a otherwise peaceful election. there are people who know why that happened. there are people who participated in that orchestration. they have been subpoenaed and rather than share what they know, they are now facing enforcement for their own noncompliance. i think this could be litigated between the witnesses and the congress, but ultimately, nicole, mer garland and -- so we are living in a new era where we almost saw an election endown undone. garland has to weigh that as part of the decision. now is the time.
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>> i'm really glad we got david jolly's technical issues worked out. yours, too, jackie. thank you all so much for starting us you have and going with that breaking news. when we come back, the frightening and growing number of active duty veterans growing the groups. why so many fighting men and women have been radicalized by right wing militias. plus, new cases of havana syndrome have hit officials and their families. are we getting any closer to finding out the cause of these attacks? and kyrie irving finds himself embraced. whether the nets have made a decision about whether the unvaccinated point guard will play. don't go anywhere today. point play don't go anywhere today. ♪ there's heather on the hedges ♪ ♪ and kenny on the koi ♪
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tonight my family will kill him. [ gasps ] [ screaming ] the house committee on veterans affairs hosted a hearing today on the growing threat of violent extremism present in our military today. something we've covered after the insurrection. but a new report is painting a picture of how big a problem this is for the pentagon. new reporting that a data leak from a chat room has revealed that 133 members use their dot mill, their government e-mail address, to sign up for the group. some alleging their currently serving in the military. this comes as the dod is trying to figure out the best way to
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combat extremism. officials announced that all defense personnel are now subject to vetting to spot insider threats with surveillance of their postings coming soon. joining our conversation, eugene daniels, white house correspondent, msnbc contributor. kris goldsmith still here. this is something you know a lot about. tell me what you see and how long you've been seeing it. >> i got out of the military in 2007 and i was a lot like these people who are joining unlawful militias and these white nationalist gangs. i mean, i came out as a hard core republican libertarian. the first thing that i read, night that i got out of the military was 1984. i was falling down rabbit holing on youtube watching conspiracy theory videos. these are things that i
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understand because i've been there. what i've spent the last couple of years doing is joining these organizations, infiltrating their online networks and monitoring them and letting people know what they're up to. you know, what's disappointing to me is that 130 some odd people use their dot gov address to sign up for the group, but this follows a pattern in what combat veterans saw in iraq and afghanistan. i deployed to iraq in the third year of the war. the guys told me all the dumb ones are gone. we dealt with them already. they're getting better. they're getting smarter. those 130 ones, those are the dumbest ones. we can assume they are a tiny percentage of those who are active duty and on reserve status who have joined in the wake of the insurrection. who saw the insurrection and said you know what, i'm going to
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choose the insurrection side. and that's the shame because the military ought to be teaching people how to think critically. you know, the reason why fox news and the right hate critical race theory is not because of the word race. it's because of the word critical. critical thinking and analysis erodes their audience. so as long as they can stupefy people with outrage and with fear, they can keep them donating their money, watching their commercials and, you know, lining the pockets of everyone from trump and the murdochs to josh holly and the rest of the insurrection caucus. >> i know enough about what i don't know to know that this can't be solved from outside and i wonder, kris, if you can talk about how this gets fixed. >> what we heard at the hearing today, and by the way, i have to compliment the democrats on the committee who maintained their composure despite the fact that
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a bunch of republicans came in and acted like clowns. i was personally offended by the fact that a bunch of republicans came in like madison and wanted to set up this perfect instagram background before he felt like addressing veterans. you know, these people don't, don't take this issue seriously. of veterans being recruited by extremist organizations. it's not that they're just like going outside of a post or going into a dfw or legion and they're like grabbing people, signing them up. it's not how it happens. they radicalize them. what's different about 20th century extremists and today is today's are studying all of the fascist movements, the propaganda movements of the 20th century. they're reading the same books that i am. and they're taking the lessons from them and applying it to the 21st century. they're using memes, knew mettic
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warfare. they're using guys like tucker carlson, they're convincing them that white replacement theory or a great replacement is something that's going to get eyeballs on the television screen and it's working. and you know, like i said last week, fox news is the most watched channel on all military bases across the world because the dod, their contractors just look at the nielsen ratings and go, oh, fox news is the most popular so we have to feed these young individuals mostly young service members, propaganda that is anti-american, anti-democratic, and that actively cheers anti-constitutional action and things like extrajudicial killings. condemns the police when they're defending elected representatives and raises up people like ashli babbitt, who
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was unfortunately brainwashed by that type of television and tried to jump through a window and attack, you know, the second and third ranking people in the american government. and none of these things are acceptable. what we need is for the military to engage in teaching critical thinking and critical analysis. it can't be, you know, teaching people just about what the white nationalists are up to and what these memes and code words mean. they have to learn how to look at evidence, examine arguments, consider the biases and weigh them fairly. that's not something that the military is good at teaching. at least not right now. and that is going to be key. critical thinking is essential to stop people from getting radicalized in the first place. >> eugene, i, there are lots of ways that the sort of way that
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the republican party has abandoned any pretense of trying to govern damages the country and threatens our democracy. perhaps none so much as on committees like this. i wonder what this sort of view is from democrats on the committee as to whether or not they can solve this problem without the republicans doing much more than creating moments for themselves. >> i think that the democrats have, for months, especially after january 6th, mostly just tried to focus. put on blinders and try to focus at the task at hand because they know, one, first of all, a lot of these committees over the years have not been great places to really find information because publicly, you know, you, there's a lot of grand standing. there's a lot of speech making and not a lot of questioning. both sides have done it in the past. i think it's more dangerous when it's on something like we're talking about right now. and i think that is something
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that republicans have seen themselves doing more and more, right? and someone like madison hawthorne who has mostly been in congress to kind of shake the table and not really legislate, that is something that i'm going to continue to do. so democrats have to stay focused. whether or not they can actually do anything, it depends on which the speed with which they're willing to move and it also depends on the administration, who's very, very focused on this issue. >> we'll stay on it. i'd like both of you to be part of this conversation moving forward. eugene, kris, thank you so much for spending some time with us. when we come back, a flurry of new cases of the mysterious brain ailment, havana syndrome. one of the earliest victims is for the first time speak out about it. that story's next. rst time speat about it that story's next. hey google. ♪ ♪ ♪
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just play it for you so you can hear. >> it was a lot worse earlier. it was persistent. kind of at the same level all the time. very, very loud. it's nothing you could sit with. >> did anyone else in your neighborhood have this experience at their homes? >> yeah, another embassy family then the people on our left and across the street from us were both canadian embassy employees and in the end, all four households were diagnosed.
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>> that was andrea mitchell sitting down with some of the original victims of the havana syndrome. a mysterious illness. one victim saying his doctor told her it's like quote, you aged 20 to 25 years all it wasn't. it comes in a new reporting that at least five american families connected to the u.s. embassy in colombia have been inflicted with the mysterious element before blinken is expected to visit there. joining our coverage, someone who knows a lot about this, former fbi assistant director for national intelligence. why weren't we doing more? >> why indeed. as you said, i have become passionate about this because i know people who appear to have been victimized by these attacks. i don't see the central
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coordination that's being claimed out of washington. i don't see someone clearly in charge. i see various age agencies doin their thing. still despite the fact this has been going on for many, many years. kudos to this administration for actually stepping up and now taking it very seriously. however, they're taking it very seriously because the attacks have stepped up. whoever is doing this is sending a message to the united states. we can attack you at will. we can attack you wherever we want and whenever we want and you can't catch us. >> let's be really blunt here. covering the government response and you're right, through two administrations, who are clearly acts of aggression. act of war. these aren't attacks on people that work at museums. they're attacks on u.s. government officials who work in the intelligence and diplomatic
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circles and they all happened to occur right before a high level cabinet official appears in these countries. if they're acts of war, why are we still debating whether they're real? >> well, inn because we've had a history early on in this mystery of saying, boy, this could be kind of a psychological thing, a mass hysteria thing, but the more this happens, the more diverse the geographic locations and the more you can now pinpoint it, as you said, to visits of high level officials. this happened with kamala harris' trip. had to be delayed. same thing for cia director burns. members of his staff on the ground in india felt the systems. in vice president harris' situation, those officials had to be medevaced. now we've got it with tony blinken about to appear in bogota and with revelations that
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bogota has been attacked. i've got to tell you something. this is an intelligence filure. shame on us if we cannot determine who was in those places at those times. we're talking about some kind of portable device. we're talking about a nation that has, or organization, that has the resources to put people on the ground throughout the united states in sync now with travel from high level officials. shame on us if we can't pinpoint foreign intelligence officers presence in certain locations at certain times. we've got to get to the bottom of ilt. it's beginning to impact intelligence officers and decisions to post overseas. decisions to bring family with them on accompanied assignments. obviously this is impacting our ability to have, to effectively carry out our mission. >> if you were investigating this, where would you look? >> well, the first thing i would
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do, of course, is look at signals intercept across the country. i would talk to our allies. we've heard nothing really significantly about allies also experiencing this. this is got to be a task force set up with all the countries that work together. then i would medically center analysis so that one medical expert unit is reviewing brain scans and other evidence to say yes, indeed, you are showing the signs of attack. right now, i'm hearing this is being done piecemeal across agencies. >> there was a model when the military started looking at tbi that way during the afghanistan and iraq. there's plenty of lessons learned and you're right. it's an extraordinary failure of imagination that no one's supplying those recent lessons. we share your passion. thank you, my friend. when we return, a revolution in the ongoing saga of nba
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megastar, kyrie irving, who has refused to get vaccinated. that update's next. sed to get v. that update's next so, you have diabetes, here are some easy rules. no sugar. no pizza. no foods you love. stressed? no stress. exercise. but no days off! easy, no? no. no. no. no. but with freestyle libre 14 day, you can take the mystery out of your diabetes. now you know. sir, do you know what you want to order? yes. freestyle libre 14 day. try it for free.
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they say durable is the new black. okay, no one says that. but, it's true. just ask sharon. after three years these barstools still look brand new. even with these crazy lovebirds. [ squak ] alright i'll take the barstools! you can keep the birds. okay. y'all gotta hear this next one. kevin holds all my shirts and shorts. he even stuck with me through a cross country move. yeah, i named my dresser kevin. wow! i need a kevin that holds all my clothes. alright. i am sold. . it's been a high-profile game of will he or won't he, with millions at stake. the saga of keyry irving and the vaccine mandate. his apparent refusal to get vaccinated prevents him from playing in any and all games in
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brooklyn. but the season just a week away from starting, we should note 96% of all nba players are fully vaccinated. there's some questions about whether nets would accommodate irving by allowing him to play games on the road where there want a vaccine mandate. the news today, finally an answer -- the answer is no. nets are refusing that possibility, setting up a potential fight between the team and the players union. mel hill, what do you think? >> i'm not surprised by this outcome. if you are the brute lynn -- brooklyn nets, you kind of don't have a choice. you're pursuing a championship. you need irving available.
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they have to maybe their choice in -- >> there's strange bedfellows, he has donald trump junior and ted crews in his corner. how is that going over? >> it's so funny that ironically the same people who, when it came to social justice issues, or other things, they told him to shut up and dribble then. now it's okay for him to talk, because it aligns with the point they want to make. also what is so hypocritical, with republicans lining up behind keyry irving, they're all vaccinated, you know?
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they're trying to keep this -- they're trying to keep this as political as possible, this is a public health issue that should not be partisan in any form. >> sort of a stab at what motivates him. what is your sense of what is driving kyrie irving's decision not to get vaccinated? >> well, i mean, nicolle, which is the same player who last season, i think it was right around the time of the insurrection, or maybe even before then, he took some personal days. he's the type of person who is very affected by what's happening in the world. he was a player who did not want to play in the nba bubble last year, because he felt like their entire focus should be on social justice issues. he's given money to george floyd's family. he is somebody who is immersed everything that's happening in our world. on some level it's not
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surprising, but on the other hand it is surprising, because i guess this is not a fight that i would have guessed he would align with, especially with him being of native american and african-american heritage. the devastation in those communities has been really unbelievable. given his commitment to social justice issues, my thought is he would have seen the vaccine as a social justice issue. clearly he sees it differently. >> do you think he'll be moved off his position? >> no, i don't. i mean, knowing what i know of kyrie irving, you know, a lot of people say, as it gets closer to the start of the season, surely he'll change, much like andrew wiggins from golden state did, but i don't think so. he's already made a lot of money in the nba. maybe he'll be okay with his $30 million salary being chopped in
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half to make a larger point, but he seems to be very dug in about it. i guess i don't really expect this to change. it will be interesting to see what ultimately becomes of this. does he retire from basketball altogether, or does he wait around until, i guess, there's no veeck mandate? i'm not sure. >> what do you think the impact is of this case. distraction was a pretty good news story of 96% fully vaccinated, but the nets aren't just any team. they're really serious contenders again this year. does that change with him out? >> i think it probably does, even though the nets were able to make it pretty far into the playoffs last year with kyrie irving broadband hurt. i think it will be a tough challenge. this is a team that, with him, i think a lot of people were
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picking them to go to the nba finals, even though the bucks are the defending champions. maybe from a big-picture perspective, i understand that winning is everything. sometimes there are bigger picture issues, but this is a strange hill to die on, especially when you consider over the course of your lifetime as a player, you don't get that many opportunities to win as a title. that has got to mean something, that you don't just kind of throw away. >> we really hope it isn't the hill he dies on. we hope he stays safe. jemele, thank you. i saw your tweets, and had to talk to you about it. a quick break for us. we'll be right back. > a quick bs we'll be right back. and a passionate trader community sharing strategies right on the platform. because we take trading as seriously as you do. thinkorswim trading™ from td ameritrade.
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thank you so much for invites us to your homes. we are grateful. "the beat" with ari melber starts starts now. james carville joins us as well. we begin with the top story. the biden administration on the offense against a resilient pandemic, taking measures biden one hoped would not be necessary, pressing forward on the specific rules for the partial vaccine man dade for large companies, could be hit by next week. he's waging a policy war that's actually unnecessary in many other countries, because partisan attacks on science and vaccines are not as


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