Skip to main content

tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  January 21, 2022 5:00pm-6:00pm PST

5:00 pm
guys are absolutely right. both of you are absolutely right, mine is a fun one, i'm mad at the nfl, i don't like what they did with collin kapernick, but the half time show, one that's coming up, maria, dr. dre, snoop dogg, eminem, you may be mad at game but i'm still excited for the halftime show. chris hayes starts now. tonight on "all in". >> every voting machine in the country should be impounded right now, more than enough probable cause to justify that. >> jaw dropping documents released to january 6 committee, including the executive recorder donald trump was considering that could have ended democracy as we know it. >> yes i was part of the process to make sure there were
5:01 pm
alternate electors. >> what we learned about the trump plot to fake electors, plus the first arrest of someone threatening the lies of election officials, and why life needs to imitate art as democrats look to salvage parts of the build back better plan. >> it's real and it's coming, if anyone tells you different, they're full of -- >> the "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york, i'm chris hayes. well, they got the trump documents. committee investigating the insurrection on january 6th has now taken possession of more than 700 pages of donald trump's pages from national archives, ex-president fought all the way up to the supreme court to keep them out of the committee's hands but the court ruled against them earlier this week. it's now clear why he fought so hard, they appear incredibly i incriminating and one of the biggest smoking guns we've seen yet, though i note there's been
5:02 pm
a few. the committee has in their possession this draft executive order that politico published today, dated december 16, 2020, entitled presidential findings to conserve, collect and analyze information regarding the january 2020 election. before getting into it, having read this, if this draft had been issued and signs by the president back in that december, i think it would have very clearly signalled to the country and to the world, the united states was in the midst of an attempted coup. it would have created a moment of forced constitutional crisis, one we didn't ever quite get to until the day of january 6th. the order, contemplated and drafted would have seized voting machines used in the 2020 election, quote, effective immediately, the secretary of defense shall seize all machines, equipment, electronicsly stored information and material records, citing a federal law about retaining election records. the unsigned order also cites a
5:03 pm
slew of conspiracy theories, alleged evidence of international and foreign interference in the election which is i guess why the secretary of defense would be involved here although that is deeply strange. the executive order also would have direct the secretary of defense to complete an assessment of the election and submit that to the director of national intelligence within 60 days. now, betsy swan notes in politico, that date in december, could have been a gambit to keep trump in power until february. the final provision of the order is a special counsel to oversee this operation and see proceedings appropriate based on the evidence collected. or in other words, you use the power of the department of justice to investigate the 2020 election. now we still don't know who wrote, who crafted this executive order. we do have some clues how it may have come about. in the very first sentence the
5:04 pm
order notes two classified documents, national security presidential memoranda 13 and 21. we knew of memoranda 13 but not of memoranda 21, a source with knowledge of both of those quote, the fact that the draft executive order's author knew about the existence of memorandum 21 suggests they had access to information about sensitive government secrets. you also have the context of what we know was going on at the white house and around the president at the time of this memo. the conspiracy theorist and lawyer sydney powell visited the white house multiple times in mid to late december 2020, on one of those visits, just two days after the executive order is dated, powell is joined by former national security adviser flynn, ceo of patrick byrne and little known trump official emily newman for the trump presidency, of course,
5:05 pm
which is saying something. how they spent hours in the oval office with the president trying to convince then president trump the voting machines were rigged, flip votes from trump to biden were part of a plot, proposed declaring a national security emergency granting her and her cabal top secret security clearance and ability to seize voting machines. team already looked into the claims and found all the allegations fell apart under basic scrutiny, people were yelling and cursing as agents tried to shoot down powell and her allies. multiple reported that sydney went back to the white house on december 20th, where according to new york times, was once again pitching an executive order on seizing voting machines. those white house meetings on the 18th and 20th took days just after sydney powell laid out clearly what she thought the president should do in this issue with the far right epoch
5:06 pm
times. >> well, given the level of foreign interference we can demonstrate and the country has evidence of in our filings of foreign interference in the election, it's more than sufficient to trigger the president's executive order from 2018, that gives him all kinds of power to do everything from seize assets to freeze things, demand the impoundment of the machines, i think under the emergency powers could even appoint a special prosecutor to look into this which is exactly what needs to happen. every voting machine in the country should be impounded right now. >> seize the machines, appoint a special prosecutor. boy, that sounds like a lot, like a real executive order there. now, we don't know why the order was never issued, thank goodness it was not. one answer may be it was clearly would not have stood up to legal scrutiny, then attorney general bill barr made that clear at a
5:07 pm
press conference on the 31st. >> does the president have authority to seize voting machines around the country? >> i see no basis for seizing machines by the federal government, you know, a whole sale seizure of machines by the federal government. >> keep in mind, by the way, just to note that that guy, that coward, just tucked his tail between his legs. he wrote an overwhelmingly ludicrous in column to donald trump in resignation what a swell dude he was and then ran away from the constitutional crisis, that's william barr's legacy, but we know from the reporting on the december 18th global office meeting he was considering sydney powell's ideas he told his staff, you guys are offering me nothing, these guys are at least offering me a chance. they're saying they have the evidence, why not try this. again, had the executive order been issued, we would have been
5:08 pm
in completely new territory. we would have been very far beyond any familiar frontier of constitutional governance and in the midst of a crisis unlike anything this country encountered in more than a century. ian bassen served under president obama, now director of organization dedicated to fighting effort to see under mine democracy and joins me now which ian, as someone who worked in former white house councils office and familiar with executive orders and their drafting, what's your reaction to this document as a document? >> first off, it's incredible if it was in the oval office and presented to the president because executive orders go through an enormous amount of legal review before they make it anywhere near the president. now we don't know if this went to the president or he even saw it but the fact it's possible in this mix says a lot about the disfunction in the white house, this never would have passed a laugh test as a lawyer in the
5:09 pm
white house, you cannot simply cite a series of statutes and say therefore i authorize the president to shoot someone on fifth avenue, this is what this would have done to our democracy. >> again, he doesn't go through with it, but president trump issues executive order directing the army, the pentagon to seize voting machines. the military sees voting machines as just like, that's a one sentence description of a coup for anyone hearing it and i think would have been read as such domestically, internationally, everywhere. >> i mean, one of two things is true here. either the former president of the united states corruptly tried to overturn an election knowing that what he was doing was unlawful and inappropriate, in which case, very likely there were crimes committed, that i point out earlier this week, 1,000 alumni, more than 1,000 of the department of justice signed letter endorsing maker garland's promise that he would go wherever the facts lead and go
5:10 pm
with indictments whatever level they're at. or, the former president of the united states was so misled by conspiracy theories and believed things that were so patently false that everyone who looked at them other than a handful of cooks in his office rejecting including his own attorney general that he sought to overturn american democracy based on those lies. either one of those things suggest something incredibly dangerous was occupying the oval office and i would just point out, there's another culpable party here other than the former president and that is the republican party right now which i did not see making statements today about how this man should never be allowed anywhere near power again, and you can bet the house that if documents suggested that china was behind this, every republican in congress would be knocking themselves over on the way to the television cameras to rattle their savers, yet mitch mcconnell to this day says he will support trump in 2024. >> that is a really important
5:11 pm
point. the other point i think about here is in the end this doesn't happen and i think it speaks to something that's at the core of what happened during that period, which, and i think it pertain to see the work that you're very focused on which is how do you fortify and strengthen guard rails of american liberal democracy and constitutional governance. there was this threat that people would quit. there was the specter of a saturday-night like massacre, we got this text from sean hannity and mark meadows around the same time, on december 31st, says we can't lose the entire white house council's office, i do not see january 6 happening the way he was told. i think this was pertaining to another part of the plot but ultimately, it seems to me a huge part of what happened was enough people in the white house around said we'll quit if you do this and the political blow back from that is what stop it'd from happening as best as we tell. >> that's true, seems to be true of those bureaucrats within the administration but where it has
5:12 pm
not been true and not true today in terms of the continuing efforts to undermine future elections is among the elected leadership of the former president's party of which, steve and daniel, authors of "how democracy died" made the point of three requirements of political parties in healthy democracies. one, they unambiguously accept political defeat, two, they ashoo violence and three, break with antidemocratic extremists and over the last year, republican party failed on all three of those. there are good members of the party, good members that are elected that need to do more but too many aren't doing enough, need to bring that party back into the full of healthy democratic governance in order to preserve this republican for the next generation and right now failing at that. >> ian bassin always a pleasure, thank you, i now bring in congresswoman elaine lory who
5:13 pm
serves on the committee investigating january 6th, let me start by asking how significant it is, how important to the work you're doing to now have possession to have won this case in supreme court and have possession of this document the committee requested. >> well, chris, i would say that, you know, this is so far the singular most important outcome of the investigation of the supreme court, held an eight to one vote that the committee should have access to these documents and we recently received 700 pages of documents. you know, this is the truth, the facts, in writing, these are the documents that were closest to the president, that his staff was using to brief him, to plan and execute the work of the white house, so this is an incredibly important development. >> yeah, there was another document here that politico published parts of, this is public record, not asking you to comment on anything that hasn't been released, which is a draft of an address for the president to give the day after january 6th. it was never given, but i want
5:14 pm
to read parts of it and get your reaction to what it says, that it it was drafted and never given. it was labelled remarks on national healing. and these are some of the portions, like all americans, i was outraged, sickened by the violence, lawlessness and may hem, i'm directing the department of justice to ensure all law breakers are prosecuted to the full extent of the law, to those who engaged in acts of violence and destruction, i want to be clear. you do not represent me, do not represent our movement, do not represent our country and if you broke the law, you belong in jail. what does that say that it was drafted but never given. >> well, you know, chris it's very clear those words you just read never came out of the former president's mouth but they certainly should have. that's the kind of statement we needed, that the country needed in order to understand what had happened was wrong, that this big lie was in fact a lie and that we needed to move forward and have a smooth transition of power to the new administration to tell the people overrunning
5:15 pm
the capitol to leave and stop the violence and, you know, the committee put out numerous times, we waited 187 minutes, over three hours for the president to take action and it's very clear, you know, the bottom line on this is there are people, there are people who, within the white house, who knew the right things to say. they tried to put that message forward. someone drafted this speech, it was very eloquently and appropriately written for the moment, but did the former president make a choice to deliver those words? no. he did not. he said essentially, the opposite of that. he said something like we love you to these rioters and that was just, you know, obviously, not the leadership the country needed and, you know, as we said from the committee is really a dareliction of duty, he had the opportunity to stop this violence and didn't do it. >> it is striking to read the words if you go to politico and read the excerpts, like great, this is the obvious thing a politician should say. >> this is what the president
5:16 pm
would say. >> anyone, any person, just a normal like, you know, normal person who saw this happen or felt responsibility for this happening. one of the other things i think we've seen in the documents that, again, have been made public or hinted at, an excerpt quoted in the letters, is just the fact that the president is in a small group of people who seem to be most gung ho about these various plots, attempts to stay in power, amidst a bunch of people who are either sceptical or outright opposed and that seems like one of the avenues, if fair to characterize that you're pursuing or one of the narratives we're seeing come out of the committee. >> well it certainly is, and going back to something you said earlier on in this reporting, the fact there was this presidential memorandum number 21 that wasn't publicly reported
5:17 pm
or known about, that's concerning to me, it means someone with knowledge of the document at highest levels of government participated in providing information in order to draft this document, and, you know, that's what we need to look at. we don't know right now where a document like this came from, how high it got within the levels of the white house and administration, but it's a record that the archives provided and white house documents. so it does bear full investigation and we really have to understand, who was involved in this. it wasn't like, you know, some fringe person, maybe sydney powell or people who were not involved in the government, wouldn't have access to that kind of classified information. how would they have known a document like that existed in order to cite it in this memorandum, so there's a lot for us to look at and, you know, i haven't had a chance to look at it personally, 700 pages last night so still a lot to digest but these are huge questions the committee has. >> yeah, that's a great point. i mean just aside from the citation of memorandum 21, something classified, just the
5:18 pm
fact this was part of the archive of white house papers means this wasn't something that was like drafted on a napkin in a bar by someone who was four steps removed, like this was a white house paper. it was in the possession of the white house, circulating through the white house's paper system, must have gotten some consideration. >> it's very concerning when we clearly outlined in request to the archives what types of documents we wanted, things like press secretary's briefing books, president's working papers, very clear the kind of things we think are important from within, you know, the workings of the top white house that would inform or investigation and the fact that, you know, something like this could of wound up there is really overly concerning and, you know, this is part of what we have to get to the bottom to in the committee's work. >> all right, congresswoman elaine lauria, thank you for making time for us. it was clear no shortage of themes for donald trump,
5:19 pm
including another plot on january 6, next the plan to install fake electors in seven states, new reporting on the trump rolled in the election. that's next. in the election that's next. ♪ it wasn't me by shaggy ♪ you're never responsible for unauthorized purchases on your discover card. for people living with h-i-v, keep being you. and ask your doctor about biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to and stay undetectable. that's when the amount of virus is so low it cannot be measured by a lab test.
5:20 pm
research shows people who take h-i-v treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit h-i-v through sex. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. tell your doctor about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. if you have hepatitis b, do not stop taking biktarvy without talking to your doctor. common side effects were diarrhea, nausea, and headache. if you're living with hiv, keep loving who you are. and ask your doctor if biktarvy is right for you. ♪ i see trees of green ♪ ♪ red roses too ♪ ♪ i see them bloom ♪ ♪ for me and you ♪ ♪ and i think to myself ♪ ♪ what a wonderful world ♪ a rich life is about more than just money. that's why at vanguard,
5:21 pm
you're more than just an investor, you're an owner so you can build a future for those you love. vanguard. become an owner. well, would you look at that? jerry, you gotta see this. seen it. trust me, after 15 walks... gets a little old. i really should be retired by now. wish i'd invested when i had the chance... to the moon! ugh. unbelievable. san francisco was a beacon of hope for my family to reach the middle class, and i've been helping others ever since. when the pandemic hit bilal was right there, helping restaurant workers make ends meet. in the obama administration, bilal worked tirelessly on innovative policies. the status quo isn't working.
5:22 pm
bilal is the best shot we have for meaningful change. i'm bilal mahmood, and i know our city can become ait's been nearly two years. since the pandemic started. our students and teachers tried their best, but as a parent, i can tell you that nearly 18 months of remote learning was really hard. i'm so angry that instead of helping our kids get back in the classroom, the school board focused on renaming schools schools that weren't even open . please recall all three school board members now. for the sake of our kids, we can't wait one more day, never mind a whole year for a fresh start. so we talked at length on this show of the many ways trump sought to stay in power, whether it was bullying georgia officials to find one more vote that he needed, one tactic that escaped the same level of
5:23 pm
scrutiny until recently is the trump campaign's attempt to send its own electors to replace the rightful biden electors. in a normal right, the elector process is still pretty complicated, the washington post explains, quote, before election day presidential candidates or their parties nominate a slate of potential electors in each state where they appear on the ballot, after the popular vote is certified, governor in each state required under federal law to certify the winning candidate's electors, the electors then meet in mid december and have signed certificates recording their vote to various places including the national archivist and u.s. senate, votes are tallied on january 6, that's what they were doing in the capitol that day. but as my colleague rachel maddow has been leading the way in report, while the legitimate electors were meetling, trump appointed electors were signing certificates suspiciously similar to each other saying
5:24 pm
they were the real electors and went so far as to submit these certificates to the same authorities. if that sounds, say, fraudulent to you, you're not the only one. in michigan, one of the states where republicans submitted fake electors, says there's absolutely enough evidence to bring criminal charges against the 16 republicans who signed a certificate saying to be the state's electors. the house select committee has trained its sights on the false pro-trump electors. so how did republicans across the country decide to move forward with the plan of signing and submitting identical fraud i tell certificates? the fake electors themselves, watch what happened when one of them was confronted by local journalists. >> did you have direction from anybody in doing this? was it you, 11, yourself, doing this, or somebody give you the advice on the matter in which you do it?
5:25 pm
>> so i'm simply, i was one of the electors, right, i'm not in charge of the electors. >> how did you hear about it? >> you would need to ask the party -- >> you're the person who received the call, to show up -- >> as i said, you can go ahead and ask the party chair the logistics of it. >> ask them how you got a phonecall? >> do you not know how you arrived at a place. i appreciate you, have a great one. >> excellent, excellent questions there. despite sophisticated evasion like that we all know who organized all this, it was donald trump's personal lawyer rudy giuliani who was just subpoenaed by the investigation on tuesday. amy, great to have, first, sketch out what the scheme was or what happened in these states with these alternate slates of electors. >> sure, so in the days leading
5:26 pm
up to december 14th, as you pointed out, which was the day the electors were due to gather in their state capital to see vote, the, led by rudy giuliani, trump's top lawyer and other trump officials, the trump campaign was planning to, and encouraging his slates of electors in those states to convene and vote for trump. and to send that vote on to washington. we know this from talking to numerous republican officials, party officials, campaign officials, in the states in question. we know that they talk by phone, the weekend ahead of december 14th and that they were -- they were discussing really, really nitty gritty details like which legislature in michigan was going to let them in the building, in georgia, or
5:27 pm
pennsylvania or nevada and, you know, where they were going to meet. what's really interest, too, is that they discussed at length the fact that there were a number of electors in the original trump-nominated elector slates who balked at this plan because they believed biden was duely elected president so had to scramble to find replacement electors for those unwill to get do so and we learned this from talking to a number of people and nobody really provided evidence that it's not true. >> yeah, we should just note the complexity of how america elects its president, which is really quite complex, that you're voting for basically like a team of people that are going to be the slate of electors, team a or team b and what you're reporting says, and what we know from other reporting, even at the time we knee this meeting was going on, you know, if biden, if team b wins, those are the people who send in their certificates because they won the state, and what we had was team trump being like, acting as
5:28 pm
if they had won and getting together anyway and going through the motions as if everything had happened with trump winning the state so as to send these electors on to washington dc and maybe talk a little bit about, i mean, what's crazy here is as far out as this plan might be, the idea of disputted electors is contemplated in electoral count act, there's american history and would have given mike pence a kind of pretext to do the things donald trump was prevailing on him to do. >> yeah, and i do appreciate your lengthy description of the process because it is complicated, and i only learned in reporting this story that the governors of the states are required by federal law to scenario in what is called a certificate of ascertainment to washington that says who the rightful electors are and the governors in these states, two
5:29 pm
of which were republican already done so. so what's really interesting and i think you're alluding to this, at the time, this was happening in plain sight, it's not news that these electors gathered, what is news is that it was used to try to persuade mike pence to do what you just described which is deny biden his victory on january 6th and it's interesting, at the time the electors were gathering they claimed it was just a contingency plan, just intended on the point that some or one of their many legal challenges would prevail even though most of them already failed in court, but there were still some out standing so they claimed it was just in the event a legal challenge prevailed because if you don't have the electors in place on the 14th, there's not really any force for you, which is true, but what's important to note here is that the existence of the slates of electors and the fact that they voted on december 14th was used as evidence for mike pence to do what donald trump wanted him to
5:30 pm
do. >> right, because he now, the argument was, well who's to say which of these electors, you got to throw it into both houses of congress, there's a complicated process by which they can determine who the true slate is. there have been contested slates of electors in other times of american history, particularly reconstruction when white supremacist governments like to send electors into washington even without control of the state. i want to point out, on my colleague's program tonight, confirmed he was doing it, yes, under the direction of rudy giuliani. take a listen. >> yes, i was part of the process to make sure there were alternate electors for when, as we hoped, the challenges to the seat of electors would be heard and successful. everything that was done was done illegally by the trump legal team, according to the rule and see under the
5:31 pm
leadership of rudy giuliani. >> to your point, amy, he seems to be holding to the line this was just a contingency, even though your reporting indicates it was something more than that, amy gartener, great reporting for the washington post, thank you for your time. >> thanks, chris. coming up, election workers around the country subjected to so many threats and acts of intimidation, department of justice created a special task force to handle them all. tonight, their first arrest. that's next. tonight, their first arrest. tonight, their first arrest. that's next. how do you cashback? chase. make more of what's yours. if you wake up thinking about the market and want to make the right moves fast... get decision tech. for insights on when to buy and sell. and proactive alerts on market events. that's decision tech. only from fidelity. meet ron. that man is always on.
5:32 pm
and he's on it with jardiance for type 2 diabetes. his underhand sky serve? on fire. his grilling game? on point. and his a1c? ron is on it. with the once-daily pill, jardiance. jardiance not only lowers a1c... it goes beyond to reduce the risk of cardiovascular death for adults with type 2 diabetes and known heart disease. and jardiance may help you lose some weight. jardiance may cause serious side effects, including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration that can lead to sudden worsening of kidney function, and genital yeast or urinary tract infections. a rare life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, ketoacidosis, or an allergic reaction, and don't take it if you're on dialysis. taking jardiance with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. a once-daily pill that goes beyond lowering a1c? on it with jardiance. ask your doctor about jardiance. i booked our hotel on kayak. it's flexible if we need to cancel.
5:33 pm
cancel. i haven't left the house in years. nothing will stop me from vacation. no canceling. (laughs) flexible cancellation. kayak. search one and done. with relapsing forms of ms... there's a lot to deal with. flexible cancellation. not just unpredictable relapses. all these other things too. it can all add up. kesimpta is a once-monthly at-home injection... that may help you put these rms challenges in their place. kesimpta was proven superior at reducing the rate of relapses, active lesions, and slowing disability progression vs aubagio. don't take kesimpta if you have hepatitis b, and tell your doctor if you have had it, as it could come back. kesimpta can cause serious side effects, including infections. while no cases of pml were reported in rms clinical trials, it could happen. tell your doctor if you had or plan to have vaccines, or if you are or plan to become pregnant. kesimpta may cause a decrease in some types of antibodies. the most common side effects are upper respiratory tract infection,
5:34 pm
headache, and injection reactions. ready for an at-home treatment with dramatic results? it's time to ask your doctor about kesimpta. ♪ life can be a lot to handle. ♪ this magic moment ♪ but heinz knows there's plenty of magic in all that chaos. ♪ so different and so new ♪ ♪ was like any other... ♪
5:35 pm
donald trump and his allies started the big lie the election was stolen from them, there has been unprecedented wave of threat against election workers across the country, everyone from state officials down to just volunteer poll workers, attacked, harassed threatened with violence, in response, department of justice appointed a task force, arrested today a texas man who was hiring people
5:36 pm
to kill election workers in georgia. reporting on the arrest for politico, joining me now, josh, tell me a little who this individual is and what they are alleged to have done. >> so this fellow, name is chad stark, he is 54. from travis county, texas. and he's alleged to have gone on craigslist about a year ago in january of 2021 and to have posted sort of a want ad on craigslist, you know, you can list something like a bike and a price and he said he needed georgia patriots to kill a chinese agent for the price of $10,000 and then he laid out a series of grievances against top officials in georgia, election officials, who happened to be the focus of donald trump's ire at that particular time for the fact that they weren't doing what he wanted to, you know, reverse the results of the election in georgia.
5:37 pm
>> yeah, let me just read a little bit from the craigslist hit he allegedly put out. it's time to put a bullet in treasonous chinese official a, then we work our way down to official b, the local and federal corrupt judges, take back our country by force. do we know who these individuals are, i know they're not mentioned in the article -- >> well we don't know for sure who all of them are, but we believe the top one is georgia's secretary of the state, brad raffensberger and then we think more senior officials as opposed to the rank and file election workers who have been receiving the plethora of threats you just talked about a moment ago. >> yeah, we should note that, and again, there's obviously, this is not a coincidence that he would direct this ire at brad raffensberger these are people directly pointed to at donald
5:38 pm
trump and the media sympathetic to him as the problem here, also, for your point, georgia really got the brunt of this that ruby freeman was singled out by donald trump about 18 times in a now famous column which he pressed georgia officials to alter the state results, called the 62-year-old temp worker a professional vote scammer, husler, known political operatives and she too faced death threats and harassment outside her apartment so there was a real atmosphere for this at that period of time particularly for people in georgia. >> right and some people in fact are surprised this is the first case that has been prosecuted by this six month old task force and it took them a year to bring it. they did tell us today that justice department said they've investigated dozens of matters through this task force that focused on specifically, election-related threats. so we'll see if any of the other ones come to charges. we should say, they have brought other threat-type charges in
5:39 pm
connection with january 6th and public officials and so forth, but this is the first one to stem from the particular effort that the deputy attorney general lisa monaco announced about 6 or seven months ago and i would also point out, chris, you mentioned donald trump's comments about the officials in georgia, as recently today, he is still issuing public statements, former president, staying nefarious people are trying to protect the people who committed crimes in places like georgia so this kind of rhetoric is still out there for unhinged people to seize on and escalate even further in this kind of vulgar way. >> all right, josh gerstein thank you so much for joining us. ahead of the future of the build back better bill, more uncertain than ever, i'll make my case the most important things democrats need to salvage from this bill, after this. d toe d toe from this bill, after this so you can breathe better.
5:40 pm
claritin-d. breathe better. woman: i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's skyrizi. with skyrizi, 3 out ofeople achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months after just two doses. skyrizi may increase your risk of infections and lower your ability to fight them. before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, such as fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches, or coughs or if you plan to or recently received a vaccine. ♪ nothing is everything. ♪ woman: talk to your dermatologist about skyrizi. learn how abbvie could help you save. woman: talk to your dermatologist about skyrizi. i'm gonna earn 3% on dining including takeout with chase freedom unlimited. that's a lot of cash back. are you gonna stop me? uh-oh... i'm almost there... too late! boom! earn big time with chase freedom unlimited with no annual fee. how do you cashback? chase. make more of what's yours. finally. our honeymoon. it took awhile, but at least we got a great deal on our hotel with kayak. i was afraid we wouldn't go.. with our divorce and.... great divorce guys. yeah...
5:41 pm
search 100s of travel sites at once. kayak. search one and done.
5:42 pm
what happens when you block heartburn with one prilosec otc in the morning? search 100s of travel sites at once. heartburn doesn't stand a chance - day... or night. excess stomach acid can cause heartburn. prilosec otc works differently by preventing excess acid production. so don't fight heartburn, block it. prilosec otc. one pill in the morning blocks heartburn, all day and all night.
5:43 pm
need to get your prescriptions refilled? capsule pharmacy can hand deliver your medications - today - for free. go to we handle your insurance. all you have to do is schedule delivery. go to to get started in 15 seconds today. with unitedhealthcare medicare advantage plans... can take advantage of $0 virtual visits. - wow. - uh-huh. $0 copays on virtual visits for primary care and mental health. take advantage now. wow! it's clear to me that we're going to have to, probably break
5:44 pm
it up. i think we can get, and i've been talking to a number of my colleagues on the hill. i think it's clear that we would be able to get support for the 500 plus billion dollars for energy and the environment issues that are there. >> president biden made news this week that he's going to break up the big domestic agenda, the social safety net, the climate bill called build back better. now that is a combined entity, he passed in the house back in november after going through a lot of negotiations to get the votes of senators joe manchin and kyrsten sinema, now joe manchin no longer seems to be on board and even his own $1.8 trillion compromise no longer on the table. so what happens next? a lot of reasons we're at this point, people are angry at manchin and i get that. one thing i think is under appreciated is the failure by progressive groups to achieve
5:45 pm
consensus on domestic policy prioritization. back in 2008, when barack obama was running for president, it became clear throughout that campaign that healthcare was going to be the big first domestic policy, for a variety of reasons, a bunch of interest group politics come together, the fact they'd taken a by the of the apple under clinton and failed and felt they had to do it this time. in 2020 it never happened under an issue, never clear what the sing the domestic priority was going to be, i would ask presidential candidates what your first bill would be and other than elizabeth warren who talked about the anticorruption bill, most candidates said something along the lines of we need to do everything, walk and chew gum, and that has continued today for politicians in the democratic party, interest groups, i mean take the climate group the sunrise movement which has done a lot of amazing stuff,
5:46 pm
been very spirited in activism, deserve a lot of credit pushing climate to the floor. after biden with build back better, the sunrise spokesperson said the idea of breaking it up into smaller bills is a false choice for democrats, everything in the bill is needed. that's wrong, i disagree, it's not a false choice, it's a very real choice. if everything is a priority, then nothing is a priority. that's definitional. the nature of prioritization is putting one thing over another, it's hard to do, it sucks, but it's what legislating often requires. right now, i think the priority has to be climate, which is not to say the other parts of the bill are unimportant. i would have voted for the original plans from bernie sanders, some $5 trillion. there's lots of amazing stuff in there. it's awful it will be left on the cutting room floor, but to take the metaphor of the film, don't look up. if there's a comet headed
5:47 pm
towards earth you have to act like it. you can't say we're not going to deal with a comet until we get the child tax credit. no, you send the rocket ship up to hit the comet. the odds of democrats having a governing trifecta of anytime in the next ten years are slim, the clock is ticking, lawmakers must do whatever they can to get the bills climate provision signed into law, that is what prioritization demands, it's what the planet demands. , it's , it's what the planet demands. and give steve a break. for people living with h-i-v, keep being you. slack. where the future works. and ask your dr about biktarvy. biktarvy is a complete, one-pill, once-a-day treatment used for h-i-v in certain adults. it's not a cure, but with one small pill, biktarvy fights h-i-v to help you get to and stay undetectable. that's when the amount of virus is so low
5:48 pm
it cannot be measured by a lab test. research shows people who take h-i-v treatment every day and get to and stay undetectable can no longer transmit h-i-v through sex. serious side effects can occur, including kidney problems and kidney failure. rare, life-threatening side effects include a buildup of lactic acid and liver problems. do not take biktarvy if you take dofetilide or rifampin. tell your doctor about all the medicines and supplements you take, if you are pregnant or breastfeeding, or if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis. if you have hepatitis b, do not stop taking biktarvy without talking to your doctor. common side effects were diarrhea, nausea, and headache. if you're living with hiv, keep loving who you are. and ask your doctor if biktarvy is right for you.
5:49 pm
5:50 pm
5:51 pm
. we have been talking about climate change as a future problem instead of a present one. the reality is the humanitarian crisis is going to spill over. >> they have marktz and protests can spark change. so is money, it's not been good for business. that's been proven time and time again. >> democrats must unite around focusing on passing the climate agenda that president biden has proposed. no matter what that takes. no matter what it requires to be split off the big build back better bill. that's my view. president biden is opened to splitting the major domestic policy agenda into climate and social net bills. i want to see what two lawmakers who wouldn't have to make that
5:52 pm
legislation a reality think of this strategy. senator ed markey, democrat of massachusetts, who sits on the environment and public works committee, democrat khanna. both join me now, senator markey, do you agree climate should be prioritized above everything else, do everything you can to salvage that point of the legislation? >> i believe with joe biden. we should prioritize climate. it's largely been negotiated. the financing is there. we should use it as the foundation and then if we can get the 50 votes on any other family protection provisions, in the build back better bill, we should add that in as well. but climate should be the foundation. and then, it's absolutely imperative that we set a deadline, that we use the state of the union address on march 1st as the deadline to get it
5:53 pm
done. we should bring a bill out in february onto the floor of the united states senate. the time for talking is over. it's now a time for action. the time for negotiation is over. it's now time to reach an agreement so from my perspective, climbed has to be the foundation. it's the healthcare, environment am, economic, national security, moral issue of our time. we cannot miss this historic moment. we can reach an agreement upon that issue. joe manchin said it's the easiest area for him to reap an agreement. we should take him at his word and add in everything else on social issues. >> we should note the climate, in case people think this is wishful thinking. the climate portion of the bill, the $3500 billion went through a man. in washing, a bunch of stuff he objected to got taken out, including things i really
5:54 pm
support. i the both of you support, the clean energy standard got taken out. i think we should have it in. you can't get a vote for it, congressman khanna, do you agree with this strategy? >> i do, first let me say, i rarely am on with senator markey, rarely has anyone do for the senate and house than he is. climate will be the foundation for what we come up with. it will be about $500 become as you said senator man. ch /* manchin is on. i think he will be not just for climate, he is for universal pre school and raising classes on people wealthy, for negotiating on prescription drugs. i think he can come up with something that will have the consensus support of the president, support of house progressives and we should give him that opportunity. and, frankly, we should do it with respect.
5:55 pm
going in and attacking him isn't going to get you the 51 votes. >> i couldn't agree more. we are agreeing with each other. i think the strategy here senator markey was, we're going to lob on this thing and get manchin and sinema to come along, you can't invent leverage over a person you don't have. i watched polling today, joe biden's approval is 29%, joe manchin is 64%, donald trump is 65%. that's west virginia voters. sob if you can get the west virginia on board for half a trillion in climate spending, senator markey, that's not bad. >> yes. in california we worked hard on the bill. we got it passed through the house in 2009. but a lot of talking, a lot of negotiation in the senate and it
5:56 pm
died and that was 12 years ago. we have lost a lot of time. we cannot lose the next ten years. so this is our opportunity to use climate, again, as the foundation. we can do this. but time is running out. >> yes. >> time is our enemy. time is the, is the friend of the climate denial fossil fuel industry. so if we take advantage of this and again roh khanna has done a great job leading in the house of representatives and so many other progressives. we have to take a win here we have an opportunity for a big win. we can add in other big victories that ro khanna was referring to. if we do it, it will be a historic victory for joe biden and the planet and the democratic party. because the democratic party will be liking up at this threat
5:57 pm
of climate change and we will be putting the solutions in place. >> i just want to be clear here, there is tangible modeling on this, look, we don't know the future. it's all to a certain degree speculative. here's the drop in emissions. there is just an infrastructure bill or chuck, can we put this up? the 2030 goal which is the dotted line there, the current trajectory doesn't get us there. if you can get the climate provisions in build back better, we get there. now, again, the future is unwritten. lord knows what happens, our best guest, if that is the thing that puts us on trajectory. i want to ask you you this, to go back to thesis of the last block, i know you will not pull back the curtain anyway. i will ask it anyway. when you look back at the healthcare and this was unfinished business of the democratic party. the last time there was a democratic president and house and senate it died. clinton care didn't happen.
5:58 pm
enormous setback. the dream of henry truman on forward for democratic presidents to get healthcare. waxman marky named after the senator on your screen right there henry maxman was the big unfinished business of the domestic policy of the obama administration. my question, congressman khanna why wasn't climate that thing that health care was back in '09 this time around? >> it was a part of an economic bet. i think part of it was donald trump had just one. there was economic anxiety. president biden said i will rebuild america. in part, that was the 14 if you deal or climate new policies. but it was one piece of the puzzle. but i agree with you, it's the most important piece, because we, it's irreversible. who knows when we will have this problem again. i actually don't think it's that complicated. if you give senator manchin the
5:59 pm
pen, i know some progressives don't like me saying this. give him the pen, let him come up with something. i think he will come up with something that is going to be extraordinarily much better than nothing on climate and i think we can get consensus on that and he will look good in his free senator markey already has a place and joe biden will look good in history and will do something for the planet. >> is that the feeling in the caucus, senator markey, do you think, on your side? >> i think once president biden spoke and said that he wants to move on climate and add in these other large chunks of policy that are critical to the 12-being of american families, i think that our caucus will be moving in that direction. and if we don't on climate, we miss one the ability to create millions of new union jobs in clean energy. two, the ability to rectify the
6:00 pm
environmental justice to those mosted a impacted, mostly poor people. third, we reduce greenhouse gases, i think our caucus will move in that direction. i am glad that president biden is giving us the leadership. >> once again, we finished all the world's problems, that is all in for this week. the rachel maddo you show starts. >> thanks at home for joining us this hour. rachel has the night off. but she will be back on monday. what a week this week has been. it feels like several week's worth of news have been crammed into the last few days. it doesn't all fit. we start with a brand-new development that has just broken today. starting in june of last year, journalists published hair-raising report of threats and harassment of election workers. they focused, in particular