tv Morning Joe MSNBC April 15, 2022 3:00am-6:00am PDT
security as national security. >> yeah, an extremely important issue that you guys are covering there. we appreciate it very much. michael allen, thank you as always. >> happy easter, jonathan. >> thank you so much. same to you. we will talk to you again soon. thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" on this friday morning and all week long. enjoy your weekend. "morning joe" starts right now. battleship presents famous sinkings. april 9th, 1987, fleet commander fires the shot that sinks his brother's destroyer. this is remembered as the last time he was allowed in michael's room. august 19th, 1987, playing electronic battleship, he programs a devastating attack. >> you sank my battleship. >> history is made. battleship and electronic battleship from milton bradley. it is a hit. >> wow. a key russia missile cruiser is now at the bottom of the black sea.
ukraine claims credit for sinking russia's battleship. what that means for the ongoing war and potential response from vladimir putin. meanwhile, a new warning from russia to the u.s. about its involvement in the war. the european union takes a step closer to banning russian oil as putin admits for the first time the sanctions are hurtis hinge country. we are following a number of stories, including a new way to check for covid. how breath tests could reshape the way we track the virus. elon musk has a big plan for twitter if he can find a way to buy it. how the social media giant is responding to the multi-billion dollar offer and what it could mean for free speech. and the january 6th rioter whose lawyer said he was following president trump's orders was found guilty yesterday of all six charges
against him. with us for the morning we have the host of "way too early" and white house bureau chief at "politico" jonathan lemire. former aide to the george w. bush white house and state departments elise jordan. joe has the morning off. we begin with that huge setback for russia as its flagship vessel in the black sea has sunk. russia's defense ministry yesterday said the "moskva" was being towed to port after suffering heavy damages and sank in a storm. a day earlier ukrainian officials said their forces hit the ship with two anti-ship missiles, causing significant damage. moscow denied the claim, instead saying that a fire began on board causing ammunition to detonate. u.s. officials say they cannot confirm what caused the explosion on the vessel. the missile cruiser was a symbol of russia's naval power. willie, either way it is symbolic of russia flailing to
an extent. >> yes, symbolic and strategic. we heard from pentagon press secretary admiral john kirby yesterday. at that point 24 hours ago he said they thought it was being towed back to russia. in the process of being towed we now know that that massive ship, the flagship of the black sea fleet for russia, has sunk now. let's go straight to ukraine. joining us, nbc news foreign correspondent raf sanchez live from turnip hill. raf, what can you tell us about the ship, what it means to ukraine, what it means to russia and more broadly what is going on in the war today? >> reporter: willie, good morning. there is huge celebration here in ukraine at the news of the sinking of this ship. the defense minister says he is looking forward to scuba diving in the wreckage of the "moskva" after his side wins this war. as you said, it is hard to overstate the symbolism of this. the "moskva" is or it was the flagship of the russian black
sea fleet. now it is likely to be remembered as the largest warship sunk by enemy fire since the second world war. now, the russian defense ministry says the ship went down last night as it was being towed into port for repairs, but the ukrainian military says it hit that ship with two missiles yesterday. the russians very pointedly not giving any cause for the fire aboard that ship. they're also not saying how many of its crew members may have died in either the initial explosion or the sinking that followed. but, willie, i will tell you underneath the celebration here in ukraine there is real concern about how and when and at what scale vladimir putin may retaliate for this apparent humiliation out on the black sea. one of president zelenskyy's advisers warning that russia is likely to respond, and there were reports of airstrikes around kyiv last night.
one ukrainian mp suggesting that could be just the beginning of putin's response here. willie. >> yeah, and there is, for all of the celebration that you point out rightly in ukraine about the sinking of that ship, the reign of terror continues. the death toll in the donetsk region has reached 59. ukraine's defense ministry yesterday said two more children succumbed to their injuries. according to the ministry, seven of those killed in the attack were children. the ministry tweeted a photo of a blood-soaked toy horse that was left behind. said they will send it to the u.n. as proof of the barbaric crime. more than 100 people were injured when russian missiles struck a packed train station in the eastern city of kramatorsk. russia troops carried out attacks in the region yesterday. the military administration says at least three people were killed, nine others injured including a child when russian shelling hit residential
buildings. he also said around 15 civilian structures were destroyed in the area. and russian forces advanced in the center of the besieged city of mariupol and captured a metal plant there. russia's defense ministry saying yesterday more than 1,000 ukrainian marines voluntarily put down their weapons and surrendered at that plant. ukrainian officials confirmed some of their troops had conceded to the russians earlier in the week. ukraine's 36th brigade warned they were low on ammunition and fighting their, quote, last battle. raf, i will go back to you on this in mariupol. so many people have been watching closely whether mariupol would fall. obviously we have seen with our eyes, with reporters like you, the devastation inside that city. how close does it feel now like mariupol will go to russia, which is one of the key strategies that putin has been hanging on to here? >> reporter: yeah, willie, it is not clear how much longer the besieged defenders of mariupol
can hold on here. you know, marines from ukrainian forces have been posting on social media they're going into battle with empty weapons because they've run out of ammunition. the conditions in that city are almost beyond belief. we actually had a woman come up to us on the street here, we're in the west of the country but she is from mariupol. she said she hasn't been able to speak to her elderly mother in three weeks now and she has no idea whether she is alive or dead. the u.n. world food program is saying people are starving to death inside mariupol because there is not enough food getting in. there's certainly not enough water. unicef saying up to a million people all across ukraine, many of them in mariupol, do not have access to drinking water right now and they are being forced to drink dirty, brackish water just to survive day by day. now, as you said, mariupol would be an enormous prize for president putin, especially after his failures in the north
and the center of ukraine. it is a key port city. it is one that his forces have been beseiging for weeks now. it is a victory he would certainly like to have ahead of the may 9th holiday in russia when russia commemorates victory during the second world war. they hold those large, very symbolic parades in moscow. so u.s. officials are saying they assess that at least parts of mariupol are still in ukrainian hands, but it is not clear how much longer they're going to be able to hold out. willie. >> and that steel factory i mentioned a moment ago is one of the last places where ukrainian forces had held a position, and it looks like that has fallen this morning. nbc foreign correspondent raf sanchez in ukraine for us again this morning. raf, thanks so much. mika, we should be clear about those starving civilians in mariupol. they're not getting fooled, water or medicine because russia is not allowing humanitarian convoys into the city, effectively starving out the people of mariupol.
>> and following the announcement of a new weapons package to ukraine, russia is again warning the u.s. about its involvement in the war. in a two-page letter obtained by "the washington post" this week, moscow reportedly threatened, quote, unpredictable consequences if the u.s. and nato continue to add fuel to the conflict. it comes in response to a new $800 million shipment of military equipment to ukraine, approved by president biden on wednesday after a phone call with ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy. that package contains mostly defensive weapons aimed at countering russia's expected attacks in the donbas region. in its letter moscow also reportedly accused the u.s. of being oblivious to the, quote, threat of high-precision weapons falling into the hands of radical nationalists, extremists
and bandit forces in ukraine. the state department declined to comment to the post about this latest warning. let's talk about it with columnist and associate editor for "the washington post," david ignatius, and national executive director of the association of u.s. navy retired navy master sergeant jason beardsly. he is a decorated combat veteran, an intelligence officer with a combined 22 years of fleet, navy, army, special forces and joint special operations experience. i want to ask him about the warship. but, first, david ignatius, this letter, which is very pointed to the u.s., a threat to an extent that things could get, quote, unpredictable. at the same time what are ukrainians and what is the west supposed to do, let ukraine lose? ukrainians are doing way better than anybody might have thought. are they supposed to pull back for fear of more atrocities? what are the options at stake?
>> mika, the russians obviously would love it if the u.s. were intimidated by this letter and reduced or stopped its shipment of weapons. that's not going to happen. what the letter tells me is that the weapons that the united states is sending in increased volumes are going to have an effect. the russians would not be nervous and sending this letter with vague warning about unpredictable consequences if they didn't feel the battlefield effect. in that sense we should credit the biden administration. they're looking for weapons deliveries that meet the tests of really augmenting ukraine's forces without going into unnecessarily risky territory. these are things like counter artillery radars that allow you to locate exactly where the fire is coming from and take it out. there are additional anti-aircraft and anti-tank weapons. there are a range of things that the u.s. is providing that obviously make the russians nervous. we are about to start round two
of this war, and in a sense the sinking of the "moskva" however it happened, we still don't know the details, is a powerful, symbolic -- it is like you had a drum roll for the beginning of this second act of the war. it has improved ukrainian morale clearly and probably has harmed russian morale, but we need to remember that what is ahead is immense russian fire power. what they'll do in the next phase is what they didn't do in the first. they will have mass fire power and they will concentrate it narrowly. what is coming at ukraine will be even more aggressive than anything we have seen i suspect. >> the question is will they be prepared. master sergeant jason beardsley, let's talk about the warship. how does that happen? is it possible they sank their own battleship? and how important is it is in the grand scheme of the battle
from morale to symbolism to actual tactics? >> very important, and there are just layers of complexity here that suggest that this is a great turn for the ukrainians. number one, if these are coastal missiles that were used, the neptune missiles to strike the "moskva" ship it implies electronic warfare capability viable by drone or potentially other assets that may be shared nato alliances, because sinking that ship, but also targeting the capabilities to intercept, and if it was done it was well done and well placed. more importantly, it will put the russians on their heels in the black sea fleet because it is about area access denial. how do you deny russian's maneuverability around the coastal lines for their amphibious assaults if they want to go to odesa in the west or for others, interdiction
campaigns by launch of the cruise missiles and so forth. these is a glaring aggressive design phase in launching these. it is a great success but it implies a lot more going on. i think there's a lot of shared intelligence in the background and as david ig nashts says, credit to the biden administration for dancing on a fine line here between supplying the right type of weapons to ukrainians while keeping the forces out, which is a very difficult threshold to cross. a lot of credit due there. >> the western alliance and the white house certainly cheering the sinking of the battleship. we heard national security adviser jake sullivan saying it didn't really matter why it went down, it is a bad outcome for russia either way. there's a growing concern as to what this disaster may prompt
putin to do next. this is a humiliation. he may now take it as an excuse to escalate the violence. we heard rockets landing in kyiv last night, first time in several days that has happened. in particular zeroing in on the idea of potential chemical weapons being used. we should be clear it was not confirmed that they were used as a regiment suggested they were. u.s. and western officials not clear about that. we heard from william burns, cia director, who says he believes putin might be willing to use a tactical nuclear weapon in this conflict. he knows as ambassador to russia putin as well as anybody. >> that's the real game changer, right? the world has just been waiting, and the billion dollar question is will putin go there. is he going to -- you know, the nuclear blackmail that he has been threatening, is he going to actually act on it. and if putin chooses to do so, then the war has really entered a new phase and the west is
going to also enter a new phase with the support for the ukrainians. so i think that it is just as much of a slippery slope for putin to actually use those weapons as it is for the west to increase our support at this point for the ukrainians. because really it is going to -- this war could go on for years. >> yeah. >> if we continue the level of support now or potentially we up it, this could, you know, reach some kind of turning point. that actually was a really big deal, and that's what i want to go back to the master sergeant on. the blowing up that flagship vessel is a pretty big, symbolic moment. just a week ago i was talking to a retired military official who said, you know, we need more anti-ship weapons to be going to the ukrainians. what does it tell you about their capacity that they were able to blow up such an important vessel? >> again, very impressive because it takes radar acquisition, it takes electronic
warfare capability to identify the signals, to make sure that the target is positively identified, and then it takes continued electronic capability to suppress the ship's anti-missile system, the intercept. so they're having to do this because, remember, in 2014 the russians took the cry mean pennies law, which is where the ukrainian navy was stationed and flipped all of the ukrainian navy ships into russian vessels. they're largely manned by ukrainians still. so the russian naval fleet and the capacity to dominate the azov sea and the black sea are now hampered and it is an economic disaster for putin. these are expensive ships. russia is a land expansionist power, so trying to balance and maintain a naval fleept with warm water port access is very difficult for them. now that they've lost a prize asset for their fleet, it hurts very much for them. again, kudos to ukraine for development of these weapons. i would suggest that they've been selling that technology to
russia and china. they own factories, but that is part of what is happening underneath this war. the capacity to build the sophisticated weapons systems is on the ground right there. so that's what everybody is eyeballing from the outside. again, big marks for the ukrainians doing this. >> sergeant beardsley, i'm curious what you made of vladimir putin earlier this week not saying in so many words but effectively conceding the big goal of a couple of months ago is lost. we didn't roll into ukraine, subdue the ukrainian people, take kyiv easily, have a victory parade, install our government and now control that entire country. he basically moved the goalpost and said what we really want is the east, what we really want is the don bas, what we really want is to take mariupol and make the land bridge. he changed his strategic goals without conceding any kind of
defeat. as a military strategist, what does it say to you about what he may do next and what he is capable of given the military losses he has suffered in the last six weeks. >> we can't take a lot out of it but he has rational considerations here and a lot of pressure on him from those surrounding him. this is an embarrassment. the humiliation of an empire is happening in the muddy fields of ukraine right now. so this shows us that he's actually reacting to the real world, which is a great suggestion that he's still got some constraints left on him. we don't know where he is going to go with this, but focusing on the east in the donbas where they've been at war for the last eight years, the ukrainians have experience there. they've done marvelous at guerilla warfare tactics. our green berets have been in there reshaping how they think about the battlefield. it is not easy. the general who was appointed to
do this has to consult multiple different commands that lost senior officials. again, that point to western intelligence helping to predict and precisely identify these guys and let the ukrainians do the targeting. all signs point to the humiliation putting putin in a rational place where he has to back off and focus his forces in the east. that's the best we can take out of it. to elise's point there's a slippery slope here for kyiv and the west as we watch what the blow back may be. european officials are drafting an embargo on russian energy. coal was banned, allowing a four month transition period to complete ongoing order. "the new york times" reports the bloc is now likely to adopt a similarly phased ban on russian
oil. "the times" notes, quote, the approach is designed to give germany, in particular, time to arrange alternative suppliers. now, the eu's decision comes as russian president vladimir putin is now admitting the strain his country is facing from western sanctions. in a virtual meeting yesterday putin reportedly conceded to government officials that sanctions targeting russia's energy and gas imports had become a, quote, urgent problem. yesterday putin claimed there was, quote, no reasonable alternative to russian gas in europe and said attempts to replace his country's energy sources would be extremely painful for the global economy. david ignatius, my question to you is at what point is it worth it to go all in on gas and energy in russia, or is that not possible? are there more smaller measures that can be taken given that he is feeling this? >> so putin is obviously feeling
the squeeze. he's said so to his own ministers yesterday. he's saying that economic sanctions are beginning to really hurt the russian economy and that's encouraging. that's the clearest sign that the strategy that the u.s. and its allies adopt is having some effect. it flows that more sanctions that take away russian revenues, that make it harder for russia to fund military activities will be effective. the trick is to do this in a way that doesn't end up harming the western economy, even as it squeezes russia. i think that's part of the discussion that's going on, how to phase these sanctions like an embargo on russian oil and other products so it doesn't end up hurting germany and other european countries. but when putin himself is saying he has problems, you take that seriously. just come back to something we were discussing earlier, which was the speech yesterday by cia director william burns, who
knows putin better than anybody in the american government, he served as moscow's ambassador. i'll just read a couple of things he said in the speech. he talked about the danger as putin becomes more desperate, he said, nobody should take lightly the possibility that he would use tactical or low-yield nuclear weapons. then he said this about putin. i have watched over the years as putin has stewed in a combustible combination of grievance and ambition and insecurity. that's our cia director's snapshot of the person we are dealing with and it should make us all realize that this is a cornered individual who really is capable of taking unusual risks. that's another thing that burns stressed, putin's risk appetite, especially for ukraine, has kept increasing. >> all right. retired navy master sergeant jason beardsley, thank you very much. david ignatius, stay with us. still ahead on "morning
joe," one of the most outspoken critics of vladimir putin, gary kasparov joins us in the 9:00 hour of "morning joe". also ahead, ambassador to poland mark brzezinski will be our guest as poland emerges as a key player in everything that is happening right now in eastern europe. we also have an update on the suspected new york city subway shooter following his first court appearance. plus, another trump supporter is found guilty on charges connected to the capitol riot. we will look at the impact it could have on the hundreds of cases that could still go to trial. a little later, why elon musk's bid to take over twitter represents a larger problem for social media. you are watching "morning joe." we will be right back. [sound of helicopter blades]
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beautiful shot of new york city at 28 past the hour on this friday morning. let's get a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. the fda has granted emergency authorization to the first code 19 breathalyzer test. the test collects a breath sample by exhaling into the device and analyzes for chemical compounds associated with the coronavirus while producing results in just three minutes. the fda did say a positive result from the breathalyzer should be confirmed with the pcr test. meanwhile, pfizer is preparing to ask the fda for approval for a booster given to children, aged 5 to 11. the company said in studies a
third shot showed a 36-fold increase in antibodies against the omicron variant of the coronavirus, and a six-fold increase against the original strain. this as two subvariants of omicron are making their way through the new york region, surging in cases. meanwhile, the suspect in the mass shooting on the new york city subway this week made his first appearance in federal court yesterday where prosecutors argued he committed an act of terrorism. nbc news correspondent ron allen has more. >> frank, why did you shoot all of those people? >> reporter: after a massive manhunt frank james appeared in federal court, wearing a green jail uniform, sitting silently with his attorneys. only nodding yes when the judge asked if he understood the charges he's facing, committing a terrorist act or other violence against a mass transportation system. prosecutors argue james should be denied bail saying the attack during tuesday morning's rush
hour was carefully planned causing terror through the entire city. after releasing smoke in a crowded train, investigators say he fired 33 rounds before his gun jammed. police say during the chaos james shed the distinctive construction worker's jacket he was wearing when he entered the station and fled on a train across the platform blending in with other riders. defense attorneys requested a psychiatric evaluation and asked the public not to rush to judgment. >> he called crime stoppers to help. he told them where he was. mr. james is entitled to a fair trial and we will ensure he receives one. >> reporter: though james did call the tip line himself, police say they were already closing in. a tweet posted about 10:30 in the morning alerted them to the suspect's location. he was arrested hours later carrying a wisconsin driver's license, $38 and a second found. the first was found at the scene. the 29 people injured, five remain hospitalized. >> i got shot in the back of the
leg, in back of my knee and it comes out through the other side. >> reporter: he says he was sitting right next to the gunman. >> got him, so that's good he's off the street. >> nbc's ron allen reporting for us from new york. the judge denied james bail and he did not enter a plea during yesterday's hearing. mika. after becoming twitter's top shareholder last week, elon musk is offering to buy the whole company in a $43 billion deal. nbc news correspondent tom costello has more. >> reporter: calling twitter a de facto town square, elos musk said he is trying to buy twitter in a $43 billion deal to preserve democracy and prevent censorship. speaking at a ted conference -- >> it is just really important that people have both the reality and the perception that they are able to speak freely within the bounds of the law. >> reporter: after announcing last week he has taken a 9% stake in twitter, the world's
richest man shocked wall street and the world by making a take-it-or-leave-it offer, suggesting he could dump his own shares if the board says no. >> i could technically afford it. this is not a way to sort of make money. >> reporter: wall street is skeptical. >> the offer heard around the world, the twitter takeover by elon musk, whether it happens -- >> reporter: both twitter and tesla moved lower, with concern that musk would need to sell tesla shares to buy twitter. twitter has become a critical channel for sharing news and information, but it has also moved to shut down hate speech and conspiracy theories. president trump was banned after the january 6th insurrection. musk himself has engaged in name calling on twitter and came under sec sanction for making financial statements about tesla. >> i'm, you know, tweeting more or less stream of consciousness, you know.
>> reporter: he also has 82 million followers and uses twitter to unveil new ideas and innovations. full ownership would only increase his influence. >> i think he loves it. at the same time it is a dicy financial proposition for him even as the richest man in the world. >> tom costello with the report. joining us, co-founder of "axios," michael allen. what is musk's plan to buy twitter? he said on stage it would be great for people to be able to speak freely within the bound of the law. i don't think that's what is happening exactly right now. >> mika, you are exactly right, that this is just the beginning. so there are a lot of signs that this hostile takeover by elon musk isn't actually going to happen, even conceded that a little bit in the vancouver event we just saw that tape from. but it is the beginning of an effort by a variety of tech
billionaires to create, mika, their own parallel media universe. it will be a social universe with fewer rules, more voices, more unfettered speech. here is the big point we hear from left and right, less control by the establishment media. so these vocal billionaires, a lot of them on the right, are spending big to try to do this. so that's where you get not only eamonn elon musk trying to make changes at twitter, you get your parler and trump's social. those parallel systems don't work. people go on twitter to tell you what they have on their parallel system. second, running a social media company like running most companies, harder than it looks so far. this is a lot more talk, mika, than it is action or delivery. >> hey, mike. jonathan. great to talk to you again. certainly truth social has seemingly struggled for users and the other ones on the right
also dwarfed in size by twitter. talk to us a little bit more about elon musk and why he has become sort of a celebrated figure among at least some on the right. tell us what the appeal there is and what they think he might do to twitter were he to get it. >> so this is fascinating, jonathan. the right has really embraced elon musk. if you look at what he said over the years you wouldn't necessarily expect that. but on my church thread yesterday on the text, they were saying wait until elon musk replaces the blue check mark with the american flag. that's the way a lot of conservatives are viewing musk, and one of the reasons is that tech has united, left and right. like both of them want to rein in tech. as i talked to trump supporters, and i know, jonathan, you have the same conversations, when republicans, trumpers talk about
big tech, so much of it comes back to twitter kicking trump off. like that was the seminal moment for some of them. they also will mention hunter biden. they will mention the lab leak theory, but conservatives have all kinds of grievances against tech in general, twitter in particular, and they see elon musk as a solution. >> michael allen, thank you so much. it looks so beautiful there in washington, so happy friday to you. >> and happy easter, mika. >> happy easter. thank you, mike. coming up, trump told me to do it defense fails in federal court. we will have legal analysis on what it means for the hundreds of others who are accused of the capital attack. we're going live to grand rapids, michigan, where more protests are expected today in the aftermath of a deadly police shooting. plus, new reporting on the u.s. military getting involved in
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switch today. ♪♪ that is a beautiful live picture of the united states capitol. it is 6:41 on this good friday. the january 6th rioter whose lawyer said he was, quote, following presidential orders was found guilty yesterday on all six charges he faced. dustin thompson was the first defendant who tried to convince jurors it was former president donald trump who was at fault for the capitol insurrection. thompson's attorney argued, quote, donald trump encouraged people like thompson to storm the capitol an took advantage of, quote, vulnerable people like his client. a justice department prosecutor told jurors in closing arguments trump was not on trial. they should not consider trump's actions even if they think he is to blame for what happened on january 6th.
thompson was found guilty of a range of charges including obstructing congress's duty to certify the final results of the election. that count carries a sentence up to 20 years in prison. the judge, a bush appointee, ordered thompson to remain in jail until his sentencing. he called the defense, quote, disingenuous but stressed he believed trump's conspiracy theories helped lead to the attack on the capitol. joining us now, justice reporter for nbc news ryan riley and state attorney for palm beach county, david aaron bure. good morning to you. this was an attempt, the attorney effectively infantalizing his company saying he didn't know what he was doing, he was laid off from his job, he just wanted the respect of donald trump and was following orders. the jury didn't buy it. >> it was an embarrassing defense for the defendant to have to sit through because a lot think that they are still
not the smartest in the room, they think they know what the media isn't telling everyone and they're above everything and he had to admit that he didn't know anything, he didn't know who rudy giuliani was, he admitted, he didn't realize he was the lawyer for the president. he had to sit through his wife's testimony talking about how he got sucked into the conspiracy theories after he was laid off from his job as an exterminator. while she was still working he was sitting at home, and at one point she even mentioned on january 6th she was kind of relieved to have the house to herself and it was quieter at home when he was off storming the capitol and stealing the coat rack and stealing a bottle of liquor from the nation's capitol. >> david aronberg, given all that was revealed over the many months since the attack on the capitol about what was going on in the administration, the text messages to mark meadows and to the people around trump, trump's behavior, trump avidly watching
tv, seeming to laugh it all up, excited about the people running around for him and assaulting the capitol, could the "trump made me do it" argument be effective and could it be used a lot more? >> mika, i think yesterday hurt that argument that trump made me do it, because this verdict was expected but it was also important because it shows that juries are not going to give these january 6th defendants a pass for being allegedly under trump's spell. in this case was different than the previous case where the defendant was acquitted because he said the police officers waved him in. i think as a result you'll see more of that defense than this defense that, hey, look, trump made me do it. you have to believe that trump's -- the defendant's lawyers that washington, d.c. went for biden by over 92% of the vote, so this defense seemed crafted towards a washington, d.c. jury pool, to focus away
from their defendant and towards donald trump who they called evil and sinister. but during cross-examination, yeah, as ryan said the prosecutors mocked the defendant's alleged helplessness. they asked him, were you a child or a 36-year-old college graduate on that day? and on that day on january 6th, did you get dressed all by yourself? he said yes. they said, because you're not a child, right? said correct. that's why the jury came back under three hours with a guilty verdict. also this whole trump made me do it, i was just following orders defense, that defense has never worked well in history and that didn't change yesterday. >> hey, ryan. it is jonathan. i want you to know three minutes later i'm still chuckling at the defendant's wife saying she was happy, the house was quieter when he was off storming the capitol. i wanted to ask you about this. this was a successful prosecution in front of the judge and jury. we are seeing a couple more of the cases going to trial and have largely ended up in the
prosecutor's favor. give us a sense how many more should we be expecting. do you think it would be a warning sign to other defendants that might be inclined to take a deal? >> this is going to go on for a very long time. two years, three years, four years from now we will still have the trials going on. right now we are closing in on 800 cases and only 250 of those individuals have pleaded guilty. if you step back and look at the total scope of this and the total universe, i have worked a lot with those investigating this and it has been confirmed by the justice department over 2,500 people entered the capitol on january 6th. add on to that the hundreds of people who assaulted police outside the capitol are still wanted by the fbi. if you go on the fbi's website you will find a list of photos of 350 people who either assaulted officers or assaulted members of the media outside of the capitol who are still wanted by the fbi and not under arrest. so we have a long time and a
long road ahead here. >> dave, elise jordan here, so if you were someone who stormed the capitol, one of many people, and you are about to go and get sentenced or be tried, do you want to be in front of a jury or do you want a judge sentencing you? what do you think the recent result says for defendants who are going to face their moment? >> reporter: elise, if i were one of the defendants i probably would want to roll the dice with a judge because so far the department of justice is three for three on jury trials. these defenses have not worked. yesterday that defense was a reach. i mean civilians don't take orders from the president and trump wasn't in this unemployed exterminators chain of command. even if he was, you know, people follow orders to commit crimes can still be prosecuted for their crimes. i think the best defense may be, hey, the police waived me in. the one time it worked was in front of a judge, not a jury,
and it was a judge who was appointed by trump who had said some controversial things, like wondering if the department of justice is treating the rioters in portland the same way they're treating the january 6th rioters. that defense of, police waved me in, may only work in front of that one judge. i have a suspicion after yesterday's verdict a lot of criminal defense lawyers are burning up the phones with prosecutors to try to get their clients a deal. >> state attorney for palm beach county, dave aronberg and justice reporter ryan riley. thank you both for your insight this morning. still ahead, presidential debates may be a little less interesting if there's only one candidate on the stage. the latest on republican plans to boycott events that are over seen by the independent commission that runs them. also, we will turn back to the war in ukraine with more expert analysis from david ignatius.
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sky news u.s. correspondent mark stone has more from ukraine. a warning, the following report contains disturbing images. >> it is a week since the bombing of the train station in kramatorsk and doctors want to show us the cost. yanna is 10. she was at the station with her mother last friday, fleeing the fighting further east. she lost one of her legs, the other foot and her mother. next door, catarina. she is 12. doctors saved her badly injured legs and yet she too lost her mother. goodness knows their trauma and understandably doctors have asked that we didn't show their faces or interview them. but then what more needs to be heard? andre was at the station, too. the three young ukrainians were with thousands as they tried to board trains away from danger when it was targeted by the missile. he's now without his arm.
there is a quiet and a calmness here, but it is not safe. the windows are prepared for whatever might come next. the city of today dnipro is split by the river, a buffer for ukraine from advance by the russians from the east. this week russian missiles hit the city's new airport. on the east side of the river is the dnipro branch of the ukrainian association for the blind, a place that is now a refuge for anyone who needs it. in the quiet of the corridor we found larissa bovina. she describes this place as heaven and from the hell she has escaped it certainly is. there were a whole range of feelings, she tells me, in my hands, my legs, my ears, the vibration from the bombs. this is the experience of war for the blind.
thank you very much for sparing the time to talk to us. the city's mayor is boris vilitov. he doesn't stay in one place for long. the russians have said they will target command centers. this isn't a military command center but he won't take his chances. >> we need three things. weapon, weapon and weapon. >> reporter: and the american president has said $800 million worth of weapons will be coming. >> yes, we are -- we are happy and tell thank you for our western friends, but western help is late, late, late. >> reporter: the challenges for dnipro are huge, caring for the wounded and the displaced but also preparing as much as they can for the days ahead. >> sky news u.s. correspondent mark stone with that report. coming up, the ukrainian president slams european leaders
for giving putin what he calls a lifeline. we'll explain that. meanwhile, ukraine's forces just got more military might. what it is and who gave it to them. . and there's a new sign that economic sanctions are having an impact on russia's economy. we are back in two minutes. what does the future of strength look like? it's dynamic weight that adjusts for you in real time for a more efficient workout. and you can only experience it... (sigh) on tonal. ♪♪
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we will kill them, drown them, he says. they have no options. >> reporter: so you don't think they can take odesa? we will sink them and it will b. >> all right. two weeks ago a ukrainian troop predicted some trouble ahead for russia. today one of the kremlin's most important battleships lies at the bottom of the black sea. nbc news national correspondent gabe guiterrez has the details. >> reporter: it was one of russia's most important warships but it has sunk according to russian officials after its crew was evacuated. the ukrainians claim their cruise missiles hit the "moskva," named for moscow, in the black sea. russia says there was no attack but ammunition on board detonated. >> we cannot confirm ukrainian reports it was hit by a missile but we are also not in a
position to refute that. >> reporter: the ship's loss is not just a military september back but a symbolic embarrassment to russian force, in southern and eastern ukraine where a senior u.s. official says they're now all located, though the major anticipated offense itch in the east has not begun. in kharkiv the government is accusing russians of brutal attacks on civilians. finland and sweden are now debating whether to join nato, while president vladimir putin is warning of retaliation for doing so, ukrainian president is blasting europe. we don't understand how you can make money out of blood. we visited a bakery where
russian troops were said to be staging and 15 people were killed in a war strike. the war coming right to this 75 year old's doorstep. there were bombs everywhere, she says. i was shivering all the time. in a nearby village this member of the ukrainian armed forces nicknamed wolf showed us a school yard where he says russian soldiers dug a trench to hide an armored vehicle, also rounding up men and executing them. did you expect this type of brutality? of course not, he says. he and his fellow soldiers are bracing for a drawn-out fight as the war enters its eighth week. >> gabe gutierrez reporting from ukraine for us. the united states military in europe soon will begin to train ukrainian forces on some of the new weapons being added to the ukrainian arsenal. "the washington post" reports the training will focus on howitzer cannons and two radar defense systems. a senior defense official
telling "the post" the training will take a few days at most. it all revealed information about ukrainian soldiers who were in the united states for training when the russian invasion began. they were taught how to use switchblade drones as well as new coastal defense drones included in this week's $800 million aid package. those soldiers returned to ukraine last weekend where they will train others on using the same weapons. meanwhile, a new air defense system, the largest item a nato country has sent so far, reportedly has arrived in ukraine. according to "the new york times" the soviet era equipment was donated by slovakia at the encouragement of the united states. it is made up of 48 surface-to-air mills ills, launchers and radars to guide the rockets to their targets. in response the u.s. has promised to back fill slovakia's aging missile system with an array of american-made patriot missiles. jonathan lemire, david ignatius with us at this hour.
we add jon meacham. and pulitzer prize winning columnist, associate editor of "the washington post," eugene robinson. good morning. great to have you with us today. david ignatius before we talk to jon and gene i wanted to talk to you beautiful about the stories i laid out about the united states support for ukrainian soldiers, the $800 million aid package. we completely understand the pleas from the ukrainian people, from president zelenskyy for more, more, more, but when you stop for a moment and you look at just how much aid, military and otherwise, just how many sanctions have been placed on russia, the united states really is as we said yesterday rallying a war time effort here. >> i think you are right, willie. the u.s. is stepping up its assistance. the most significant part of that news report for me was in addition to supplying additional weapons the united states is training ukrainians in how to use them, training them both in europe and some in the u.s.
this is the array of weapons the ukrainians are going to need to try to push back the russia offensive. the ability to use counterartillery radar, for example, to low indicate where the fire is coming is important. the switchblade drones, very advanced, can be carried by individual soldiers. training in those is key and that apparently was done in the u.s. over the last few weeks. these are significant moves. whether they're enough, we'll watch and see over the next weeks. >> all right. more from ukrainian president volodymyr zelenskyy. 50 days after the invasion began, he reflected on his country's extraordinary resiliency. here he is in his daily address yesterday on telegram. we have put the translation on the screen.
>> so, jon meacham, we have a couple of things going here. first of all, very symbolic, the warship named after moscow at the bottom of the black sea for great humiliation for russia for sure, but we also have vladimir putin warning of unpredictable consequences if the u.s., the west, nato add fuel to the fire. i'm curious what kind of precedent we have seen before in history, nuclear blackmail to an extent, is putin doing more of the same that we've seen over the decades, inviting aggression? and does that ultimately if we do the same thing just put nato
nations and sovereign nations in more danger in the future? at what point and have we ever done things differently and gone all in on sanctions in every way to squeeze him? >> right. to me the most fascinating thing -- two fascinating stories are unfolding with ukraine. one is the remarkable courage that president zelenskyy embodies. it is just for a nation, our nation that in many ways takes democracy for granted, it is a very, human and visceral reminder of the will to be free and what that could do, you genuinely put your life in harm's way when harm's way is seeking you out. let's be very clear. the ukrainians were attacked. david would fact check me on
this as i offer this. what is remarkable, and always be careful using the word unprecedented because from the garden of eden forward almost everything has some precedent. what is remarkable here is with the exception i would argue -- and there are differences there -- with the cuban missile crisis in 1962, this is the first time we have been almost eyeball to eyeball in this situation with this -- so you have this ancient conflict, driven by ancient desires, ancient greed of a land grab, a grab for wealth and status and access in europe. the oldest kind of aggression is what putin is doing, and it is unfolding in a nuclear age. in korea, in vietnam,
everyone -- the big players had a team so to speak, right. so there was a little bit of insulation. there is not as much insulation now, so when we hear what we hope as mao used to say the empty cannons of rhetoric, but we don't know if they're empty cannons of rhetoric. when he uses the image or we use the image of fuel to a fire, this is a fire that has deadlier consequences than any other moment, i would argue, since the autumn of 1962. that's not to be alarmist. it is not to be hyperbolic. it is just the case. i think that's what it requires of us and of nato and of ukraine to think very hard about every step we talk. >> fair enough. but, david ignatius, okay, we don't know if it is rhetoric but we do know what he is doing at this point.
we do know what he has done in the past. might have question is the same to you, at what point do we do things differently with russia and maybe try humanitarian zones, maybe try something. we know what is coming given what we have seen his past history to be. >> mika, we have already augmented the level of assistance that we're giving as have some of our allies providing additional weapons, anti-ship missiles as an example. there may come a time when that needs to be reconsidered with even more aid. to jon meachem's point i have heard u.s. military leaders say this crisis is in some weeks to the 1962 cuban war missile because there's a war going on even as there is increasingly from russia the threat of the use of nuclear weapons.
there's a real war going on. we've never had someone classified as a war criminal who is nuclear armed as he conducts a conflict. it is a situation that is unprecedented and i think john and other historians will be mondering -- pondering what to make of how this unfolded for years to come. >> we have seen president zelenskyy joined in the last few days by western leaders including the prime minister of britain walking freely through the streets of kyiv, and now two republican lawmakers have become the first u.s. officials to travel to ukraine since february. steve dane and victoria sparks yesterday got a look at kyiv and saw the mass graves in bucha. in a statement senator dane wrote, there is indisputable evidence of putin's war crimes everywhere. the images of shallow mass
graves filled with civilians, well and children are heart wrenching. danes added the world needs to see russia putin's atrocities now. not after time has passed when the evil and blood shed has been cleared up. congressman sparks recently sent a letter to the biden administration asking to redeploy u.s. diplomats to lviv to help coordinate in ukraine. jonathan, you had this reporting that the u.s. government at large is considering who to send. there have been calls for president biden to do what prime minister johnson did. perhaps it could be secretary blinker, it could be secretary boston. what does it look like now? how likely that the president may go to ukraine? >> the president was asked about it yesterday on his way to north carolina as he was about to board air force one. he confirmed that the white
house is having ongoing discussions about sending someone to kyiv. the decision will be made soon. it is nice when the president acts as a confirming source for your country. they have not decided on who, and general sake late yesterday said almost certainly it would not be the president himself. it would be blinken or austin the most likely. the rocket strikes in kyiv might change the calculation slightly. eugene robinson i want to get you involved in this and get your tack what power a symbolic visit would have. what more can the west do right now? many think the war ends only when putin says it does. we have seen the economic sanctions. there's talk europe might finally cut off oil and gas. that would really help, but sending on weapons, what can the
president of the united states do? >> there's not much he can do, but in coordination with the allies with nato and the eu and the rest of the free world he can try to change putin's calculus by making the war even costlier for him. that means an oil embargo of some sort. that's a very difficult thing, especially for europe, to pull off. but i think the pressure has to be ratcheted up on putin in some way so that we -- you know, he's got a very high sort of risk tolerance, and the russians can lob rockets and cruise missiles at ukrainian cities indefinitely, until they run out, and there's very little that can be done about that except inside putin's head. to get inside putin's head i
think it has to be costlier for him, and so that to me seems to be the next step. in addition to the military aid that's being given to the ukrainians like perhaps apparently they did with the "moskva." they've been sort of chewing up the vaunted russian army and now navy, and that's costly as well. but i think the oil -- i think oil and gas are the big thing and that's the next big step that the west can take. >> big picture, new this morning, finland's european affairs minister says it is highly likely the country will join nato. she made those comments during an interview with sky news. she tressed that a final decision has not been made by parliament but noted there is a lot of public support to join the alliance. finland shares a border of more than 1,500 miles with russia. you see it is one of the
countries in blue at the top right of the map. moscow was warned it would retaliate if finland or sweden joins nato, including threats of moving nuclear weapons into the baltic. elise job an, we are hearing his threats again. we will talk about those open the hours to come on "morning joe." between the logistics of the russian military, the symbolic losses, putin's friend being captured, his warship sunk and the potential new members of nato, it appears, big picture, putin's world is getting smaller. >> all of the momentum in the world is on the side of the ukrainians and can it translate on the battlefield. that's what we will see over the next few weeks with many more coming in and helping the ukrainians and targeting. we just need a moment where
ukraines once and for all can decisively put russia on their heels. they've had so many losses at this point, too. an estimated 15,000 to 20,000 troops. so the russian military is very weak right now. you see where putin, who could have foreseen that they would join nato. putin is in a very tough place. i have no idea what the next surprise coming from him could be, but i do think that clearly the world has galvanized on the side of the ukrainians. >> jon meachem, before we go, some of the history of ukraine as pertains to the war we are witnessing play out right now there were those in the foreign policy community over the last 20, 30 years that were concerned about ukraine poking at russia, trying to join nato.
there were some saying there maybe shouldn't be support for ukraine to be a member of nato, for ukraine to go in a different direction, join the eu ultimately, but not to be so full frontal against russia and almost exacerbating the tensions between the two countries. my brother ian is coming up on the show. he actually lived in ukraine for a couple of years helping the nascent country back in the early '90s develop defense policy. this has been a long road for them. were the pressure to get toward nato, the support for ukraine to be a part of nato, was that potentially a strategic problem. well, all of that is going to be sorted out in the fullness of time if you are living under the threat now of chemical and possibly tactical nuclear war, you know, the view from the
council on foreign relations and the history department is interesting but not dispositive as we sometimes say. one of the things that it does teach us, the entire experience, is that human nature is constant, and in this case the will for the europeans to be free, to self determine and the will to power that is embodies in putin's aggression, they're the most perennial impulses. the united states with the allies in a global sense since the 1940s, 1949, nato has been going now for almost 75 years, the marshal plan. we locked the 75th anniversary
in june. the notion was that we could help contain the west of forces, communism, and project values of liberty. we don't always practice them here, but by and large the wond has been better off than when under autocratic control. tuesday very hard it seems to me to tell a people, to tell a country it is not geographically or strategically convenient for us for you to be free. that's not what is on the statute, right? harry truman didn't announce that as he announced the truman documents. that said, we are living in our
own power to effect events elsewhere. this is the conundrum and tragedy but also the possibility of state craft. >> john beechem, thank you very much. at the top of the next hour the u.s. ambassador to pole beyond mark brzezinski will be our guest. still ahead on "morning joe," police in michigan are bracing for more protests this morning following the deadly police shooting of an unarmed black man at a traffic stop. shaquil brewster joins us live with the latest from grand rapids. you are watching "morning joe." be right back. and it looks like he's gotten into some new healthier habits, too. what changes are you making for your type 2 diabetes? maybe it's time to try trulicity. it's proven to help lower a1c. it can help you lose up to 10 pounds. and it's only taken once a week,
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i'm trending so hard that “hashtag common sense” can't keep up. this is going to get tens and tens of views. ♪ ♪ ( car crashing ) ♪ ♪ but if you don't have the right auto insurance coverage, you could be left to pay for this... yourself. [yawn] bro trip! if you book with priceline, you'll save more, so you can “broooo” more. [impressed] broooooo. broooo!!!! broooo!!!! broooo!!!! [in unison] brooooooooo!!!! [splash] [disappointed] broooo... good thing you saved on the trip! priceline. every trip is a big deal. protests continued last night in grand rapids, michigan, over the death last week of 26-year-old patrick lyoya, a black man shot in the head by a white police officer during a traffic stop. joining us now from grand rapids, nbc news correspondent
shaquille brewster. shaq, what do we know this morning? >> reporter: willie, i spoke with the family yesterday and they are understandably heartbroken and are now demanding justice. that's a common refrain you are hearing from members of this community, especially after police released about 20 minutes of video showing the entire inof interaction. i must warn you, willie, some of the images we are about to see are disturbing. >> can't none of us go back to seven, ten days ago and bring our brother back. >> reporter: overnight in grand rapids a community meeting boiling over, more tension and outrage of patrick lyoya when he was shot and killed by a police officer. it shows the moments when it was turned into a fatal shooting. the lyoya family calls it an
execution. >> translator: when i saw as a parent, when i saw him on top of him i said, okay, now my son is safe, maybe he can arrest him. what was so surprising, pulled the gun and blow off his head. >> reporter: the 26 year old native of the congo was pulled over last monday. >> the plate doesn't belong on this car. >> reporter: after a brief exchange. >> 1915, got one running. >> reporter: lyoya begins to run and a physical struggle ensues. >> hands behind your back. >> reporter: video shows the two wrestling, the officers taser is discharged twice, police say never making contact. at one point lyoya appears to have his hands on the taser before being brought to the gound. >> reporter: while police say the body camera was unintentionally shut off during the skirmish, another recorded by his passenger shows the officer on top of him, shows him
reaching for his gun and shooting him in the head. >> 1915, i was involved in a shooting. >> reporter: the officer who has not been identified is on paid leave. >> the test will be whether in the view of a reasonable police officer it was needed to prevent death or great bodily harm to the police officer. >> reporter: is that something you thought you would have to worry about? >> we came here because we thought it was safer. >> reporter: now, the shooting is being reviewed by multiple law enforcement agencies including minnesota -- excuse me, michigan state police. but i have to tell you, i had a conversation with the national use of force expert last night. this is the expert that testified at both the derek chauvin trial and kim potter trial, and he told me after reviewing the video, quote, there are red flags that suggest the shooting was problematic, there's not enough in the video alone to draw a definitive conclusion on if the deadly use
of force was justified. so we have a long ways to go before we have a conclusion in this investigation. willie. >> the investigation just starting there. nbc's shaquille brewster with disturbing images out of grand rapids, michigan. gene robinson, that is difficult to watch obviously. the only reason we saw it, the body cam was turned off, is because the passenger took that video. to see it with your own eyes, we have seen it too many times in this country, haven't we, that we don't know the full story behind it? it will come out in the investigation. it is an awful thing to watch. >> right, we have seen it again and again and again, and how did it start? it was a traffic stop. it was a traffic stop. you know, how does a situation escalate to that point from a traffic stop, a question about a license plate. that's what is so extraordinary. that, just stand back from it
for a second. if you got pulled over because, you know, your license plate was expired or there was something wrong with it, do you think it is conceivable that you, willie geist, would end up in a battle for your life? >> no. >> and it wouldn't happen. it doesn't happen that way, yet it happens with african americans, particularly black men, again and again and again. this whole sort of aggressive posture that police take in these situations escalates rather than deescalates the situation, and so then you get to a situation, well, was the deadly force used justified, there was a struggle. there shouldn't have been a struggle. it shouldn't have been allowed to get to that point, and it is just frustrating. it is, of course, tragic for the
family, the lyoya family, for the community of grand rapids, but for the nation. this has to stop. we have to -- we have to learn. how can we never learn from these situations? how can we keep repeating them again and again and again. >> and, again, there will be an investigation, but it raises the question again why lethal force was needed there. if he was resisting arrest, and it looks in the video like he was, why does that escalate to lethal forth. >> exactly. he was not armed, he was not dangerous. why? why? you have to come back to the fact that he is -- he was a black man being stopped by a white police officer for a traffic infraction. >> more to come in the days ahead on this story out of grand rapids. coming up this morning on "morning joe," nbc's molly hunter joins us live from
ukraine with the latest from the ground there. plus, the u.s. ambassador to poland mark brzezinski will be our guest with an update on the humanitarian efforts for millions of ukrainian refugees in the country where he serves. that includes the work of chef jose andres and the world central kitchen. chef andres doing the lord's work once again joins us as well. also, donald trump was banned from twitter for using the platform recklessly. is elon musk using his wealth to avoid a similar fate? we will look into that when "morning joe" comes right back.
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as the sun has come up over washington. a beautiful friday. good friday. the republican national committee says gop candidates must abstain from future debates over seen by the commission on presidential debates. the group that handled the process for decades, the vote was unanimous. in a statement rnc chair ronna mcdaniel said in part, quote, the commission on presidential debates is biassed and has refused to enact simple and common sense reforms to help ensure fair debates. going forward, the rnc says, presidential candidates will have to sign a pledge they will appear only at party-sanctioned primaries and general election debates. at the end of the day the candidates, not the party, have the final say on whether to participate in the debates.
jonathan lemire, i sense they're trying to get this debate like ready for trump or something. i mean what in the world is going on here? . >> it is two words. it is donald trump. >> oh. >> remember back in 2016 when he debated hillary clinton he had complaints about the microphones. we have heard from him every time he has debated saying that the moderator was biassed against him, including those that worked for fox news. last time around he was angry at the debate commission, mind you a non-partisan group that's done this for decades. trump was angry at the commission because they asked one of the debates to be held remotely. why? because donald trump had coronavirus and he was highly contagious at the time and yet he objected to that and they ended up cancelling the debate and we only got two between trump and biden last time around. this is clearly something geared towards trump at the moment and we can say he is the most likely republican nominee in 2024.
let's say it is not trump, trump doesn't run or is defeated and another republican nominee, how could they square it? do they give up the possibility to debate whether it is president biden or some other democrat in front of tens of millions of people. >> it will depend on the nominee, but will they have that big a problem disavowing something for political expediency to gain that audience? no. this is catering to donald trump right now. we see how the rnc continues to cater to donald trump as their de facto leader still. no, they're not giving up the stage for anything if it's not -- >> all right. let's turned to the platform that used to be donald trump's playground to be cruel to people, twitter. twitter's board is reportedly evaluating elon musk's offer to buy the company. he has been critical of the company suspending users to
tweet threats of violence, hate speech or harmful misinformation. musk said he believes twitter must be transformed as a private company. it is unclear how he will finance a potential purchase, but he said yesterday he's not interested in making money off the platform. joining us now columnist lynnent lopez with a few thoughts about this. her latest piece is entitled "elon musk's attempt to buy twitter represents a chilling new threat: billionaire trolls taking over social media." let's look at an excerpt from your piece. musk as a twitter user has trafficked in much more than stupid means. theoretically and in practice it makes sense that someone who uses a platform so recklessly should be thrown off that platform. donald trump used twitter to foment a movement that cull mind
cull mind that culminated in a riot. one has to assume that other petulant billionaires are taking note. it has taken years of failures for twitter to separate the concept of free speech from the practice of moderating its platform. now in comes musk, how bent on muddying the waters again. don't be confused. whatever musk is using his billions to do with twitter isn't about high-minded ideals or making the platform better for users as a whole. it is about elon musk. i think you bring up a great point, but, lynette, are there anyways to stop him if he wants to buy twitter? are there any guardrails around
something like this? because this could be a very dangerous precedent. >> well, sure. the board could reject his offer. fundamentally what elon is arguing is that all of the changes that twitter has made over the past few years to make its platform safer are actually bad for the platform and actually bad for shareholders. i think shareholders have a different argument. i think shareholders have been pushing twitter to be the van garland of labelling misinformation, kicking off bad actors, moderating behavior, moderating speech. i think it is important to note that elon doesn't just think that dangerous speech is like whatever on twitter. in real life he has allowed dangerous speech like racist speech, violent speech to fester at his factories, which is why tesla is being sued for diss kim nation in california. he wrote a letter to his staff in 2017 saying, hey, if somebody
says something racist to you just take it on the chin, and if you are a minority you are not allowed to be a check either. >> putting them on the same level as people being jerks. they're not the same. the humanization led to black people at his factories being treated like garbage. having to clean the floors and do the most menial tasks at tesla. he doesn't believe in the consequence of words. when words mean things we have to take that seriously and then to want to own the company is ridiculous. also, he harbour town a sitter. he is not allowed to tweet things about tesla without legal review because he used twitter to commit fraud. i mean, without. would a grown person. >> gene. >> well, you know, lynette, my question is about twitter's
employees. how must they be watching this saga or, you know, morality play or whatever it is. watching this play out. stow must's record at tesla of, you know, a toxic environment. must not the twitter employees be on the ceiling about this. >> they're terrified? they now he creates toxic environment. they've had meetings about it, everyone is freaking out, but elon doesn't care. he does it because it amuses him and he eastbound joys people freak out wef he does thing. he loves throwing a rock in the pond and watching the ripples wave through. and wall street is always happy to see him take risk so we'll see how it plays out. but i think the board has a real argument for saying, look, we
made changes to our mod indication for the good of the platform and for our community and the world. it is not good for the stakeholders, for the stock and definitely not for the country. >> the new piece is on insid. still ahead, russian forces may be closer to taking control of mariupol, a city they destroyed, but a victory there comes at severe cops to his own troops who seem to be dlousing the pamts for morale, not after it sunk. , not after t it sunk. is. your mover, rob, he's on the scene and needit sunk. mobile.
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sometimes to remember but that's how we heal. it's important to do that as a nation. that's why we're here today. between sundown and duck, let us shine the lights and darkness along the sacred polar reflection and remember all we lost. >> joe biden, the day before taking office back in january of 2021, addressing a grieving nation about the lives lost to covid-19. at the time the u.s. was nearing 400,000 coronavirus deaths. more than a year later, we are rapidly approaching 1 hill beths from covid. the former white house deputy director private sector engagement up to date president obama and author of the new book "grief is love" living with loss. ma ressa, it is so great to see
you, my friend. i am so happy you are getting all this love for the extraordinary book have you written. it speaks your open grief. i want to read a piece that appeared in the atlantic magazine entitled. grief everywhere. millions and millions manys of americans are figuring out what life will look like for them, as they try to live, are forced to live -- without that western they love. month or a year or a years it is an ongoing process they will deal with for the rest of their life. grief is the repeated experience of learning to live after loss. we must not mistake a return to normal life at the end of someone's paper. maris sarks you know this all too well. 14 years ago you lost your mother to cancer, because are you who you are. you start an entire organization called the pink agenda to raise
money for breast cancer awareness, you speak so briefly and eloquently in this book. why did you want to sit down and have it in the pages here? >> thank you, you are right, unfortunately, i know grief well. i will never forget the day my mother had a seizure, collapsed, died with me and my family by her side in my child shood home. over a decade later, my husband and i lost a pregnancy. each time these happened i felt lost and a lot of shame for having all of these feelings about grief and about loss. and i wrote this book because i don't want other people to do that to themselves. i want people to know if you lost someone you love and are you struggling and it's been days, weeks, months, years even, that's okay. you know, grief is a formal part
of life. it is an experience of constant recalibration and accommodations that you make for the people you love who are no longer hoo? >> grief is such a journey. people deal with, you know, the different road bumps along the way. you know, in their own ways as they can. you know, deal with it. way have felt so bad about the american standards that lost loved ones to coronavirus. it's so politically contentious. psychiatrists call it complicated grief. you lose someone in a car doesn't. it's a circumstances out of the ordinary. >> yes. >> so what do you advise for those who are experiencing that kind of complicated grief? >> yeah, i think anyone that lost someone, whether from covid or something else, their grief
is complicated by the fact that they didn't having a says to the traditional rituals. so my advice to them is to figure out what you need to do to honor your loss and to live with it. you know, maybe you access therapy now because you couldn't do in-person therapy during the pandemic at its worse. perhaps it's figuring out how to bring your person along no matter what and really acknowledging and owning and holding space for your feelings. because they are complicated and it is really hard. >> you make a good point how so many of us were deprived to have a funeral or a gathering for other once. another xhont sentiment is people say surely they are overwhelmed by the sheer number of deaths they feel whether their loved one has been reduced to a statistic.
people are par are leads by the sheer volume of them. what do you say to them? >> there is a response called psyching numbing. as tragedy increases, the viet nam increases, our ability, our brain's capacity to respond and engage, we start to shut down. it's a self protection mechanism. so i think for anyone who is feeling overwhelmed in this moment by the grief either because you are trying to support someone or you lost someone, yourself. take it one step at a time but recognize that there are there are thousands of people, 200,000 have lost primary care givers. we have to figure out how to hold space for their pain. how to to give them room to acknowledge and honor their losses. this is a moment for to us stop
such a brief aadverse culture and figure out how to walk through this together. that doesn't mine can't enjoy your spring break with kid and continuing taking an education for a healthier, safer time than now. it means you need to be mindful and act with empathy and compassion to pretty much everyone you encounter with these days. you have no idea what to deal with. >> congratulations on the book. grief is so powerful. you write that it's a reality. we have to live with it. is there anyway we can use it? is there anyway we can use grief in a way that is ultimately positive or that allows us to move on? >> yeah so i think the answer is yes. so thank you for that question. i think there are two things that i have been able to do with my grief that actually do bring me a lot of joy. you know, one, my grief and
everything i experienced through my mother's illness and her death and the losses i have experienced sense, they set me up to look at life differently. i have a lot of gratitude. i have a lot of joy when things are really positive and going well and i think it's given me a sense of perspective on just how fortunate i am to still be here, frankly. and then the other thing i will say is, the healthiest way to live with loss is to find a way that works for you to bring your person into the present. you know, my mom, every sunday, she would make us pancakes before church and i decided to kick off our pancakes and my seven-year-old got pancakes for the first time. i teared up a little. it was sad, but it was really joyful and positive and happy. i think i am able to access that joy because i am honest about pain. >> renee, marissa renee lee, i
am glad you brought up bennett. he is one of the cutest babies ever brought into this world. i'm glad it's come full circle on you. congratulations to this book for a time when country nazi it, the new book is "grief is love." it is a must read. >> coming up, we head back to eastern europe. the u.s. ambassador to poland mark brezinski joins us from warsaw as that country is now home to millions of ukrainian refugees. also ahead, a man that's no stranger to calling out vladimir putin, russian chess grand master and political activist, garry casparov.
we have a look at the subway shooter. plus, democratic voters are defecting to the state's gop. steve kornacki will be breaking down the shifting demographics in u.s. elections. we are back in one minute. . elen we are back in one minute. if you want to stay out of jail, you need to go good. this is a chance to find a better life for you and your friends. help grandma cross the street. yeah. he's gonna blow it. you think i can't do this? ow! where do you find the perfect developer? well, we found her in prague between the ideal cup of coffee and a museum-quality chronology of the personal computer. ...but you can find her, and millions of other talented pros, right now on upwork.
we move into our third day, we have jonathan lemire, elise jordan and david ignacious are still with us and white house political cochief, and we start with fast-moving developments from eastern europe. russia is vowing to increase attacks on kiev just hours after it's lost its crucial warship in the black sea. this as the battle rains on for the beseenld city of mar poll. joining us live from the ukrainian exam, mollie hunter. what's the latest? >> reporter: mika, good morning to you. you just mentioned the increased threats of muffle threats here in the capital. we are at a market. i haven't seen any kind of fresh vegetables in the last few weeks. this market has been packed. people here are adjusting to what they are calling the new formal.
overnight, a major blow. the flagship russian warship in the black sea sank as it was towed in stormy weather to ports. ukrainian officials say it was hit by missiles. the russian ministry of defense says a fire broke out on board and everyone was evacuated. moscow is likely reviewing it posture this morning. when we were in the port city of odesa two weeks ago, the highest naval officer offered a prophetic position. we will sink them, he says, it will be fish eating season, our fish will grow fast. the donbas region from the east and south, ukrainian officials say 2500 were evacuated. in par poll, 289 made it out thursday. a new grim face, city officials say russian troops there have started digging up graves.
>> 95% of all the building, 95% destroyed. >> reporter: speaking to the bbc overnight, president zelenskyy putting pressure on his european neighbors saying, i don't understand how you can make money out of blood. but here in kiev, the support for the sink so widespread people lining up to buy stamps with the chip i ship's image. an important event happening yesterday, we will be able to remember these event and show these to our children and grandchildren. now including that for joe's benefit, i remember how much you enjoyed that the first time around. yet another blow, ukrainian officials are estimating 20,000 russian troops have died. meek car, back to you. >> nbc news' mollie hunter, thank you very much. these fierce battles in ukraine are causing the type of humanitarian crisis we haven't seen since second world war. millions of people are fleeing
the war zone a. vast majority of them crossing the border into neighboring po lap. it is thrusting that country to the forefront of the country. poland send more than twice the number of ukrainians compared with other nations, according to u.n. agency. the country embraced migrants, the system is starting to bend over the weight of the ep flux of people and more still coming. in a show of solidarity, vice president kamala harris flew to europe last month to double down on the u.s. commitment to alliances with nato and poland. president biden also made the trip to poland promiseing to allow at least 100,000 ukrainian refugees into america. it's a drop in the bucket, though, at this point. u.s. ambassador to poland, mark brezinski has met with polish officials to discuss their needs as the refugee crisis stretches into its second month and
ambassador brezinski joins us now. since mark is playing an active role here and there is and is also my brother, i'm going to serve as a viewer in this segment and watch you and say hello, mark. i'm financial to hand first question to, hey, mark. i will hand first question to david ig patience. david. >> reporter: mr. ambassador, good to see you again. i want to ask you -- >> good to see you, david. >> describe for our viewers the stress that you are seeing on poland because of the enormous inflow of refugees and a second question, we have been talking all morning about whether the west should do more to help ukraine as it faces these russian attacks? what are you hearing in poland about weather pols feel more should be done? >> good morning to you, david, thank you for having me. i am speaking to you from a
country poland. 10% of its population today is ukrainian refugees. 4 million ukrainian refugees have been brought into this country and the national policy of poland is to place every single one of those refugees into someone's home. and so the system is both embrace these refugees. it has california it is also beginning to weigh down the system the hospitals, the schools are feeling the pressure of half a million new students as we go into the spring semester. most of the reasons have been placed in poland's four largest cities. and now the government wants to place the reasonables that are continuing to come in, in the rural areas and many of those refugees would much prefer to be in the cities. so there are logistical systemic things that the government here
is wrestling where just as one million more refugees wait across the border in ukraine to come in as the next wave, based on whether hostilities continue in ukraine or not. it looks like they will continue. >> mr. ambassador, if i can come back to my second question what do you hear on the question of whether more could be done to help ukraine fight back this next wave of russian attacks, do pols support that? do they talk much about the danger poland, itself, can get drawn into this war? >> well, both of those are true. there is no question public opinion shows this is 1939 again for poland, whereby a foreign oppressor has attacked the people of central europe and brutally slain many of them and
what you see with the young people, particularly rushing to the ukrainian-poland border, arriving in the middle of the night to take say a family or another ukrainian family. this is their moment to stand up like they had hoped the country would have been able to done when nazis invaded poland in 1939 so there is a tremendous desire here. not j you to empractice tess refugees but to do more in ukraine. and it's also the case, david, that there are things that could be done that could make things a lot worse and so, alliance, nato alines, unity and consensus has been a very important part of the pushback against russia and, thankfully, that unity is working. tactically, there are no question.
there are difference of opinion. i am so grateful that president joe biden and vice president kamala harris came here to poland and made clear that the americans will protect every inch of nato territory. i can tell you when i go on polish television. i simply say -- [ speaking foreign language ] poland is spa safe, poland is secure. because it is in nato and backed by the u.s. it is an important lowering of an anxiety page that we, the person people, are giving the pols and in so doing they feel more comfortable going to the border, not shutting that border down but opening it completely to bring in every possible refugee that comes across the board per. that's an important shift in terms of the ways refugee flows have been met with in the history of this part of the world. >> good morning, ambassador brezinski, it has been extraordinary naer to watch the
work of the polish people and yourself included as ambassador there to take in nearly 3 million refugees are. >> thank you. >> it's an amazing thing to watch. there was a poland poll that 70% had well cold them into their homes and schools and churches. it's put ac strain, perhaps reach ac capacity, which raises the question of what the united states is prepared to do. what are some of the steps being taken to expedite the movement of some ukrainian refugee who's may want to come to the united states to get them safe will i to this country? >> well, willie, thank you for saying what you said. i do want to point out the historyic nature of what's happening here. poland is a land where terrible crimes occurred in history. this is the land where the holocaust occurred. this is a land of communist occupation, of nazi atrocities. what you have are the children
of former victims going to the border embracing victims. it is an incredible human interest story. in terms of the refugees from poland and beyond, the fact is most of the reasonables that have come to poland want to stay in poland. the language is similar, polish-ukrainian and russian languages are all slavic languages, there are a lot of similarity, the food is similar. poland is close to ukraine so there is a proximity that allows the refugees to hope they can return home and to start rebuilding. i think that's an important reason why most are staying here and not going on to spain or france or to italy and elsewhere. that said, president biden did announce that the u.s. will admit 100,000 ukrainians through the u.s. refugee program, through humanitarian parole or visas. i think different countries have made different announcements leak this, boris johnson has
announced 200,000 will be invited to great britain, particularly those who have ukrainian families in britain. all this contributes. there is no question that i am here in warsaw, po all around, if i went out in the street with your camera crew here, you would see ukrainians at the local 711 here they are providing special kind of remittances and offerings to ukrainian refugees. the schools are packed. i am close to the warsaw stadium. many refugees as a stomping point are put in the stadium here where there are beds, hospital centers, dentistry, registration areas, so they assimilate quickly into warsaw, into poland before they go too the homes of people some it's been a logistically magical moment for all of this to have happened. i will flag for you, willie, that i think that the u.s.
intelligence community, which often is criticized for getting things wrong this time got it completely right and under president biden's leadership began warning the central europeans in the baltic states this was coming down the pike. at first the reaction in central europe was a little like the .who cried washington. people were saying russia is not financial to invade ukraine, they bone e won't be doing that. it happened. i think the warnings allowed everyone, the pols, also the americans and other to go to the aid border crossings, develop a scientific understanding of what will happen there and deploy accordingly. we, of course, have 10,500 u.s. troops, including the 82nd airborne in country right now. >> we have the u.s. editor at the financial times, ed luce. he has a question. >> good to see you, ambassador. let me change the topic
slightly. there are reports, there is footage of russian trucks, demolition trucks moving into the county memorial near smolisk. where 22,000 presidents of war were murdered by the soviets in the early stages of the second world war. but this was something they blamed on nazi germany for 50 years until your father brigadier brezinski in 1989 visited with mikhail gorbachev's position, visited and changed the sign around and said this was a soviet acrossty. it now looks like putin is threatening to demolish the memorial to these 22,000 murdered polish officers and in
retaliation for alleged dismantling of soviet monuments in poland. my question to you is, this is obviously horrifically symbolic potential act that vladimir putin is threatening. is this something that you have confirmed? is this something that the polish government are reacting to? and what are your views on this? >>. >> well, that is an incredibly inciteful historic point you are make, ed, because the katin massacre where the top polish officers were taken and executed by the societies is incredibly resonating in poland at this time. this in the polish mind set was one of the worst crimes that was committed during world war ii. pictures from bucha, the pictures from the other areas in ukraine where victims have been
found shot in the head with their hands tied behind their back is exactly as people pick what happened at katin. what happened there was soviet soldiers shot in the head, polish officers who had their hands tied behind their back and it is to them again reminiscent of world war ii. which is why you see here a national outreach to do something. anything. i have been -- last week, the u.s. embassy held a conference in which we tried to inch ngos like the polish red cross and humanitarian assistants. these are my heroes. they do the medical work. hand out the clothes, help the children standing three days at the board tore match them with polish companies, european companies and american companies and i was so proud to bear witness to the american
companies doing whatever they need to do to support ngos here in lifting up the people who are arriving across the borders. but what is driving the commitment to do something is that again this is 1939 in the minds of the polish people, in which they are resisting an invasion of a cruel foreign attacker and it's exhibit a of what i am talking about, ed. >> just to follow up, ambassador, kaylee, if these reports are confirmed that katin is being targeted for possible demolition, this, of course, being probably the largest daughter of prisoners of war single slaughter in history. as you put it deeply pain. important moment in polish
history. if, indeed, these reports were confirmed. is this a sign that russia is potentially widening and extending the war beyond ukraine into poland? >> these are all very worrying signs. even the report out of the washington post of the russians threatening the americans if they provide support to those brave ukrainians resisting the attack from russia in ukraine the reaction by russian authorities to the prospect of sweden and finland joining nato these are alterfying signs that putin plans to make this a conflict in ukraine, but a regional conflict. i am sure putin knows there are different ways to destabilize a country. you don't have to use missiles,
jet missiles to redisable i stabilize a country. you can flood make the countries with refugees. he sees the consequences of his actions, the uprooting of millions of ukrainians forcing them to flee. he knows the consequence of what that happens to neighboring economies and to neighboring societies. so he is testing this entire region. i am also here to bear witness to you that the pols have been stepping up in a way that i think would make everyone proud. i particularly want to salute those polish-american families and ukrainian-american families who have been sending care packages, making contributions online n. 1980 when marshall law was declared in poland, they sent care packages by maim. today americans are sending contribution and support online. every bit counts. we need your help over here.
>> mr. ambassador, good morning, jonathan lemire. no question, the west, europe, the united states, they are in lockstep, impressive to many in terms of standing up to russia's aggression. there is a sense the war is about to move into a new phase, a long protracted phase, that could be months into years of fighting in the east. you talk to us about how that will challenge the unity of the alliance and can europe stay as in lockstep with the united states when they, in particular, will bear the economic brunt and potentially stare at a recession. maybe a big one if the pipeline for russian energy goes away? >> well, there is no question that attrition is probably on the mind of putin, that he has resolve to try to see through what he is doing in ukraine and so, therefore, all the contingencies we are planning for in poland are long term.
this will not be ended any time soon. what also is the unity shown here. i have been to the border umpteen times here, the border of poland and ukraine, at the g2 arena, where the 82nd airborne is, we have a meeting every day, local mayors and regional and national authorities meet with the u.s. military, but also governments from around the world and it's been awesome to see the brits, the swiss, but also the japanese, new zealand and others, australia, at the table. people from far away showing that what's happening in ukraine is not just a ukrainian problem or not just a polish problem, it's an international problem and it's important for everyone to joan. a donors conference was recently
held, more will be held. this is absolutely a financial challenge. millions of euro are being spent every day here in polaened to pay, to pay for the care of the arriving refugees and it no question will test the capacity of this country and contingency plan here now has a long-term context to it. >> wow, mark, thank you. i know when i dropped you off in poland i believe wheels up january 20th and i left you there, it was, it seems like a nice post and then the world changed in a blink of an eye. u.s. ambassador to poland mark brezinski, thank you very much for being on. >> thank you for all. that it's so appreciated. >> take care. ed luce, give us a sense of everything we are seeing on this good friday where we are in this
incredible invasion of ukraine this war? we've had some huge embarrassments for vladimir putin this week culminating in the sinking of his battleship which was named of mass co-. his buddy, crony, one of his friend in custody, ukrainians are holding the military is struggling and yet they will double down. the atrocities will continue. we know this putin is warning if nato and the west fuel the fire to use his words. what do you make of all this? >> i know this has been an extraordinary significance of the sinking of the moskova. the russians deeply humiliated by this. their most important cruiser in the black sea. which as you know is now sealed off. it's basically a lake because
they can't, he's closed off the access to the med strain trainian and the most important ship has been sunk. the russians say that this was an accident and it was detonated by a fire. the ukrainians say and it's been confirmed it was a missile that struck it and sunk it. the russians are retaliating. even though they say it was an accident. so this humiliation cannot be overstated. it's something the russians will want to avenge. that sort of leads me to the main point in answer to your question about phase 2 of this war, the battle in the east in the donbas, we are waiting, ukrainians are preparing for massive assaults, all kind of
elements and supplies amassed brought over that border. this is going to be a huge battle and i think it will decide the future of this war. >> all right. ed luce of the until times, thank you so much. david ig patience, you just got back to traveling to iraq and syria with simcom commander. you have a piece out, the battle against isis, yesterday's war, still smolders -- and could erupt. tell us what you learned. >> mika, i learned two things traveling with the new xander. the first is that the threat to u.s. forces and our interests in the middle east continue even as our attention is focused properly on ukraine. we visited al-assad airbase in the west of iraq where just last
friday u.s. forces shot down an iranian drone, carrying shrapnel that if it had gotten into the perimeter could have wounded many americans. fortunately, it was shot down. that's the thing that happens too often. the second thing i saw in both iraq and syria as you see on any trip with the military is just how competent and well trained our military forces around the world are, striking when we are seeing reports of russian military forces in ukraine performing so badly that to look at the very obvious differences in terms of logistics, in terms of command and control, most important i think the impression lacked in ukraine is having a solid core of non-commissioned officers, the sergeants, the e-5s, e-6s who do so much.
the russian don't have that middle level in their military. i was able to see that with general corolla. it was an interesting trip. a lot of dangers out there. but some good people to deal with them. >> of course, you can find david's piece in the washington post. david ignacious, thank you for coming on. much more ahead, the war in ukraine. we will go back live at the top of the next hour. an outspoken critic of vladimir putin carry kasparov. plus ba we are learning about man prosecutors say carried out a pre-meditated and carefully planned attack on the new york subway this week. also ahead, a look at the desperate conditions three weeks into another covid lockdown in shanghai, where 25 million
welcome back to "morning joe." we are learning more this morning about the man accused of opening fire on a crowded new york city subway train on tuesday. correspondent jesse kirsch has details. >> reporter: just one day after his arrest ended a nearly 30-hour manhunt, the alleged subway gunman making his first court appearance. frank james was denied bail. his lawyer didn't object. he sat if prison clothes as a federal judge says he is accused of committing a terrific act
against a mass transit system. asked if he understood, he replied yes. they said he was a flight risk and presented a serious rick of danger to the community. prosecutors calling the rampage premeditated and carefully planned. the suspect's attorney is asking the public to be open mined about a pan accused of shooting ten people. >> mr. james saw his photograph on the news him he called crime stoppers to help. >> reporter: but a senior law enforcement official tells nbc police were already closeing in after nypd spotted this tweet around 10:30 a.m. wednesday. >> you are walking around the east village, what made you say, that's frank james? >> there was so much movement around me everywhere, cars, people, there was so much movement and there was one still guy just sitting on a bench, resting, not drink, not eating
anything. >> reporter: in a "today" exclusive, jack griffin says he snapped them wednesday morning on a field trip. >> you were close enough for him to hear that? >> yes, i was. >> he says that shutter noise alerted james, who began away as he pretended to capture his friend before posting and contacting police. >> i am super proud of that. there are so many items. i'm happy again he's off the streets. >> nbc news' jesse kirsch reporting. coming up, growing anger how the chinese government is handling an outbreak. what it could mean on grip on power. that story is next on "morning joe." that story is next on "morning joe.
china is trying to clamp down on simmering tension in shanghai over how that country is handling an outbreak of covid-19. nbc news' janice mackey frayer reports. >> reporter: this morning, desperation and defiance in shanghai. these videos verified by news agency associate press showing outright clashes. police in white medical suits appearing to wrestle with residents who were ordered to surrender their homes so they can be turned into covid isolation sites. one woman on the ground shouting, i beg you, please! others being dragged away. the videos went viral on social media here before being pulled down by sensors. with the lockdown in its third week. most of shanghai's 25 million people remain confined,
struggling to find food. she and her neighbors built up their own supply chain to get everything from flour to medicine for 1,500 people? hopefully, it's not going to be too long for people in lockdown that shouldn't be anymore. >> reporter: thousands of asymptomatic cases are stuck at mass quarantine center, some of the building leaking under heavy rain. still china's president xi gin pepg says zero covid won't be relaxed with puppishment for those that brake the rules. they said families forced to move were compensated. but the videos along with others appearing to show protests are a rare window into growing anxiety here. with the omicron variant spreading fast and no end to the lockdown in sight. >> that was nbc news' janice mackey frayer reporting. coming up, our next guest has been warning about vladimir
putin long before the invasion of ukraine. we are joined by human right advocate garry kasparov on what he calls the global war of freedom against tyranny. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." much more "morning joe. into some of his old hobbies. and now he's taking trulicity, and it looks like he's gotten into some new healthier habits, too. what changes are you making for your type 2 diabetes? maybe it's time to try trulicity. it's proven to help lower a1c. it can help you lose up to 10 pounds. and it's only taken once a week, so it can fit into your busy life. trulicity is for type 2 diabetes. it isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. it's not approved for use in children. don't take trulicity if you're allergic to it, you or your family have medullary thyroid cancer, or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. stop trulicity and call your doctor right away if you have an allergic reaction, a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, changes in vision, or diabetic retinopathy.
serious side effects may include pancreatitis. taking trulicity with sulfonylurea or insulin raises low blood sugar risk. side effects include nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, which can lead to dehydration, and may worsen kidney problems. the choices you make can help control your a1c. ask your doctor about once-weekly trulicity.
joining us now the vice chair of the biden administration, valley biden owens, she is the first to run a biden campaign. the memoir, i grew up bind you bring us into the family with this book him you feel like you get a sense of what it's like to grow up biden and how life was sort of like a butcher car ride. so many ups and downs and bumps
along way. but it's such a story of siblings having each other's backs. there are so many incredible stories of challenge in this book. >> well, i'm a story-teller. and the book is about the magic of family and know when i was writing it, there are so many people, ord fare families like middle class american families, like ours, growing up in the mid-20th century. and even though there are separate stories for each family, there are common threads that come together to mesh and mack the fab pediatric of family. that's commitment and loyalty and love, it's heart break, it's disappointment, it's loss. all of these threads show that we have so much in common and i
hope that when somebody picks up the book that he or she will see themselves in the book or see, oh, that's my uncle or gosh i remember something like that. and that will bring a smile to their face and also i want to express, it's my writing and it's about how much joy and love it was for me growing up biden. so the book is a lot about connections. we all share a whole lot more than we realize. >> there are a lot of stories in here. i hear your voice in the book, stories of sibling sacrifice and we really as a reader learn so much more about ilya and amy and that chapter of the president's life than we ever have, the horrific accident that took president biden's wife and baby and seeker moments as you and
your brother left the capitol and flew home upon hearing the news. but what's so incredible is how the family just stepped up, moved in, did whatever it took the get through and i mean, i'm financial to cry if we talk about it, but even jimmy and the christmas tree, it's like siblings stepping up. it's like showing the depths of a bond between brother and sisters in a way that we haven't seen before. >> well, meek car, when we grew up, my mom and dad instilled in us that there was family and there is family and there was family. and we were raised with three pillars that family, faith, and a responsibility to take care of each other and then take care of each other and that extended into the greater community at large. so we, there is a saying in the
family that if you have to ask, it's too late. so, when you're close and you know what i'm talking about with your brother, when are you close, you know, you take pride and pleasure and joy in all of the good things, but if you do that, then you have to take the bad things that come along, too, because there's no accounting for what life dishes out to you. there's just accounting for how you deal with it. i did something when i moved in after the horrific accident with -- when emilia and the baby were killed, i did something that my brothers would have done for me in a heartbeat had it been switched. i moved in and i told my brother, i said, look, i'm coming, i'll help you with the boys, and i'll stay until it's time to go. and even though it was a really
horrible time, it was also a joyful time, a wondrous time of healing and of all, you know, coming together and making it through, moving forward. like my dad said, it's not how often you get knocked down, it's how quickly you get back up. and that's what we learned, to be resilient and to keep moving forward. as my mother would say, with the help of god and the good will of the neighbors, we just keep moving. >> tell our friends that are watching right now about jimmy and the christmas tree. >> november 7th where joe's elected, the youngest senator at the time, we thought the world is his oyster, he's the bright hope of the democratic party, he's a handsome young man, a beautiful wife, three young children. six weeks later, december 18th, our world turned upside down,
the doctor broad sides emilia and the three children in the car, emilia and the baby were killed and beau and hunt were in the hospital for some time. they had serious injuries. this was december 18th, and it became clear because of the injuries with the boys that they were going to be in the hospital for several weeks till christmas came. the boys are 2 and 3 at this point. they turn 3d and 4 in february. and we wanted a christmas tree. so jimmy biden went to the equivalent of macy's at home and there was a display tree with all the tinsel and the ornaments on it and this is december 23rd, and jimmy said to clerk, i want to buy that tree, and the clerk said, sir, you can't buy our tree.
that's our display tree. jimmy said, i am going to buy that expletive tree. and he bought the tree or left the store with the tree. and he came in to st. francis hospital, revolving doors in the hospital, and he's dragging this christmas tree and there's tinsel, you know, spread all over, and the nurses and the administration said, sir, sir, you can't bring that tree in -- you can't bring a tree into the hospital. and, you know, the boys had just got out of intensive care. and my brother said, watch me. and the nurses realized, god love them, that it was for the little biden boys. and everybody kind of turned and said and watched as jimmy took the tree up in the room and set it. and that was on december 23rd.
that was the only light that we saw in our room. >> you also go into how not only emilia was beautiful, just absolutely gorgeous on the outside but also how beautiful she was on the inside, how, despite her beauty and her gifts as a person, she always tried to make other people comfortable, and you considered her to be your partner, your sister. >> yes. >> tell us about that. >> well, first of all, she was -- she was a role model for me. you know, my brother and i had a very close relationship as i do with my other brothers also. and so this young woman coming into this relationship with a brother who could be not just
and then my sister can do this and my sister is this, you know, joe gets very excited about anybody that he loves, and, you know, it's the best thing in the whole world. and what emilia did wisely is to embrace it. she said basically, if joe loves valerie this much, i'm going to love valerie this much. and we became friends. and i watched her. i knew -- she was that much older than i, and i watched her in awe, really, of how she handled me, the kid sister, you know, who was the tag-along, and now is no longer number one, amelia is number one. and she brought me in and held me close, and we have one thing that was common, we both loved my brother and we wanted to have a close relationship. and i said to myself that
whenever my other brothers, jimmy or frankie, were they ever to get married, i wanted to treat my future sister-in-laws the same way, with the same grace and respect and love that melia treated me. so she trained me to know how to embrace and love jill and sara as much as as i do. >> dr. jill biden, the president's partner in life now, and she works full-time, community college professor, even in the white house. it seems like joe surrounds himself and is not afraid to surround himself with strong women. from reading this book, it sounds like that starts with you. >> well, it starts with mom. you know, mom is -- my brothers -- i tease. i call my mother the rose of
shannon. she was beautiful but, you know, she had thorns. and the boys said oh, you know, mom, she's grace incarnate and beauty and the blessed mother and everything. i said, come on guys, she's mom. she's a wonderful woman and she's tough. >> the new memoir is "growing up biden." valerie biden owens, who we have in common the fact we bring up our big brothers and still do it. but thank you so much for sharing so many incredible family stories with us. >> i hope you enjoy them. thanks for having us. >> thanks, value. "morning joe" is back in a moment.
we are rolling right into the fourth hour of "morning joe," right now, top of the hour, 9:00 on the east coast, 6:00 a.m. on the west coast. this morning, powerful explosions were once again heard in the ukrainian capital of kyiv as russia claims it hit a missile plant on the outskirts of the city. after a period of relative calm, russia is promising to ramp up missile attacks in the capital in response to what it claims are ukrainian attacks on b russian territory. lol