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tv   MTP Daily  MSNBC  May 12, 2022 10:00am-11:00am PDT

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it's thursday. pain at the pump, rising food costs, inflation about a present, market turmoil, and recession fears kid we're entering some uncharted economic waters on the most important issue to voters. plus, day 78 of the war in ukraine, still with no end at site, at russia threatened retaliatory action if finland joints nato. zelenskyy plans to make battleground gains in the north. what democrats plan to do next attack on the abortion issue with the bill to codify roe v. wade failing in the
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senate. i will speak to one of the co- authors of that legislation, still ahead. welcome to "meet the press daily." i'm chuck bass, back from our midterm trip to pennsylvania. we're going to begin today's program with the single most important issue for voters, obviously the economy. it's rapidly entering some uncharted waters. with costs continue to rise, gas prices at an all-time high, a hot war in eastern europe, and a whole lot of market uncertainty as policymakers try to quote on demand without tipping the u.s. into a painful recession feared the issue brings with it enormous political fallout here at home here that's obvious. it could rattled the west solidarity account to russia abroad. that is of concern. it's why we start the show today with this question.
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what the heck is going on with this economy, what should our leaders be doing about it, and how fearful should we be we don't know what bottom looks like it? let's start with the numbers. it's no surprise to anyone who's been at a gas station or grocery store you are paying more for essentials, meat, eggs, fuel. does rising costs are inescapable to anyone right now in america. aaa said the average price of a gallon of gas right now in the united states is $4.42 for regular, $5.56 for diesel. both the record highs. northeastern pennsylvania, diesel is 6.50. it is all up 40 and 50%, $0.56 here it it puts a pinch on everything. adding to the pain out there, there is a severe baby formula short hitting the country right now with shelves and see in store spirit that is more about how those companies manage their supply, more so than it is anything else, but it only adds to the consternation people feel right now about the economy. they are expected to announce some action on the baby formula supply emergency later today. president biden said earlier this week inflation is his top
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domestic priority, but what does that mean? the administration points to action that has been taken like tapping the strategic petroleum reserve and expanding the use of ethanol and fuel as a way to try to ease some pricing. the reality is so many of the forces fueling this issue are beyond the white house's control, and biden's top economic adviser suggested a lot of this price pain could be around for a while. >> what do you think the cpi is a year from now? >> well, that is a tough call. there's a lot of uncertainty, but forecasters really do expect that prices will moderate over the coming year, so i expect it to be lower, but it's not necessarily going to be linear here we can't just focus month-to-month, and we understand there are headwinds, but i think it will be lower than it is today. >> what make the current situations are unique right now is all of us concerned uncertainty is coming amid strong job growth and low unemployment. that is what makes us so we could wall street like to look for green shoots, but even they
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are not finding much, or they don't like the green shoots stacy, as economists, employers, workers, consumer policymakers try to figure out what happens next, and at present i told donors last night, inflation is going to scare the living hell out of everybody. i don't know if it is going to scare. i would argue it is scaring tiered we got a pair of economists with us joining the onset . betsey stevenson, former labor department chief economist to president obama, now a professor at university of michigan. again, you know, this is not about covering markets. this is about the data lives people are living here here in georgia, there's not a lot of public transportation to mitigate fuel costs. what are you seeing in here? >> people are frustrated. people are worried. we have been through three
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different counties. all of them, politically important and very different politically. when we asked people who or what they think is to blame for the prices that they are seeing at the gas pump and also in the grocery store, they gave various answers to that question, but everyone we spoke to, they said the prices they are seeing right now, especially at gas stations like this one, they say it's ridiculous, and for some of them, it is upending her budget. listen. >> you have an option other than driving? talking i do not. it's my only transportation, and i've got little ones, so i feel like all my money is going towards gas at this point. >> how much of your salary doesn't end up cutting? >> i've got everything going in with this, so it's kind of hitting me. >> i work at the clinic down the road, and a lot of patients have complained about it, how
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people have had to cancel their appointments because they can't afford gas to come get to their appointments. >> reporter: i am a georgia girl. i grew up in atlanta. my parents live a little over an hour away from here in the more rural part of the state, and there was a lot of doctors where they live when they need to go to the doctors, they have to come here to gainesville, an hour and 15 minute drive each way. that's not an uncommon story, and rural communities around here, they've seen a lot of jobs go over the years . you people are having to look for the for work, having to drive more to get to work, and you touched on it. that not a lot of public transportation options here to there is some in atlanta, but it's not that great there. they are looking at what they have to pay to fill up their car to get to and from work, run basic errands, take their kids to school, and they are looking at their paycheck, and they say they really feel like they are having trouble affording the basic necessities
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. it is costing them so much money just to get to work. this is a real pain for a lot of people here in the big cities and suburbs, and especially in rural parts of georgia, chuck? oh allison, i'm so glad you shared exactly how a lot of people outside the appellate court. i'm concert people that mostly live in new york or the d.c. area just don't appreciate how regressive rising fuel -- regressive tax rising fuel has. allison, terrific on the ground, people focus reporting could let me bring in my two economists in two the set. you were on satellite comes i will let you go first, betsey stevenson paid this is the conundrum, that rising fuel prices hit basically those with the fewest, the lowest savings the most, and it hits them the
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hardest hit it's working people who may have to drive to two jobs, working people that have to drive farther. this is what, i think, makes this feel like such a, a rough period of time we're entering. >> people are definitely frustrated from rising gas prices, and they see it every single day as they go to the pump and fill up, so i know this is hitting everybody in their wallets that's making them unhappy, scared, and forcing them to cut back in other areas. i do think it's worth pointing out that the inflation we're facing more broadly is not being driven by rising fuel prices, not being driven by this rise in gas prices, and unfortunately, what's happening at the pump has every bit do with the invasion of ukraine . that i think the broader concerns about the economy is the inflation we're seeing in other places , and whether we
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are seeing any kind of, you know, any kind of pullback. we see obviously rent is going up, rents are going up because the value of people's homes are coming up here they are going to charge more in rent, and that's going to continue to filter these numbers as people find new leases. one of the reasons why inflation is so awful is because it's very uneven. it hits some people harder than others but if you own your house, inflation is not getting to you as much because you're not paying high rent. if you just signed a new lease, inflation put a damper on what you could spend. just like if you are someone who drive two hours to work every day back and forth, inflation is hitting you a lot hotter than somebody who can walk down the road to work. >> and this gets to the class divisiveness, basically those who can afford to live close, and this is what i go to this washington/new york nexus here. i think this is uniquely out of touch a situation here for the appellate court. >> and it's way worse than the numbers would suggest. if you look at the food, energy, and housing , what you think is the essentials, like 50% of a typical family budget? the inflation rate since the president took office is 19.8%
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. that is huge, and that is what people are going through every day, all across this country, and obviously they are scared they are wondering what's going to happen next. >> here's my question to both of you, and doug, i will start with you. at some point, that the business pullback? i think the next thing that we expect is, okay, inflation means business will pull back some investment. i usually translate into hiring fewer people, so as it turns out we have an incredibly strong labor market, low unemployment. >> 1.7 job openings for everybody out there looking. that is the flipside of the same coin as having inflationary pressures to the economy is running so hot in the labor market is so hot, generation of inflation pressures. we've got that. there's a big stimulus in a hot economy. so, can't do that. the key thing is jerome powell.
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his job is to tamp out on the red-hot economy. that means slowing down the labor market. that means slowing down the housing market, but it also means we are relieving inflationary pressures. he's got no good choices. you got inflation or slow things down a bit, and he's trying to do the latter in a way does not put us into recession. >> betsey, how do we avoid recession? >> you about recession by making sure that the president does not act too quickly, does not slam on the brakes. when you think about what needs to happen, we need more people to apply for jobs here in the problem that comes with high inflation is we can't survive without the services people want. as a result, prices are getting pushed up.
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pulling away the support they were giving families, reducing demand. they want to be able to buy, you know? they want to be able to buy gas. they don't want for everybody to pull back on buying gas, but at the end of the day, that is what the feds are going to try to do. inflation rate tries to convince people to buy fewer cars and fewer cars means that it is slower rate of increased cars, slowing the demand for gas. that is the process, and the question will be how quickly it happens versus how slowly whether or not they can realize we slowed it down. i think the real uncertainty is there is problems all around the globe, and they are having to steer through really turbulent times in what's happening in europe. >> the two of you are not
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diplomats. the fuel issue could be solved by saudi arabia, but that is a whole other ball of wax i don't want to get you. doug, you want to jump in? up to the theme of our comments, and absence of a mistake, we're not going to have a recession could the recession >> is way too big right now. >> tell me what bottom looks like here, and what are we seeing? is the market -- drop a little bit of the crypto thing and a bit of a bubble issue on top of inflation? >> lesson number one. market has been terrible recently. why? it was probably too high to begin with. a lot of cash flow into the financial markets. the fed printed $5 trillion in the pandemic, put it in the financial market, and because we sent out checks, crypto is cool, and now that's going
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away. rates are going up, and they are turning back to reality. i'm not worried about the stock market. it always moves first. anticipate what's going to happen down the line. it's readjusting to the new reality. i think the economy itself will grow this year, solidly next year and the absence of something we don't know about. there are only three names to worry about, powell, and we pray he does a good job and land softly, putin, and xi jinping. the underappreciated part is that. >> betsey, talk to the 60 something-year-old that was contemplating retirement, and they're looking at their 401(k) going, "jesus, i guess not this year." >> well, i think i would say take a longer-term look at it because boy, you're probably in a better position today than you thought you were going to be five years ago. >> okay. >> let's try to take a glass
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half full instead of glass half empty look at this, but that is what i would say to them. what would you reply my plan b a couple years ago because you have not lost everything. it's just not where you thought it was going to be a couple months ago or six months ago. i think the other thing to think about is look at the other assets you own pud on a house, because the house price went up a lot. your portfolio is not doing as bad as you think it's doing. i think if you are 60 years old, you're probably on track to retire when you want to, which hopefully is not too soon because they want to see labor participation of people in the early 60s and you've got a lot of living left to do, and i hope you are real successful in your job at least another five years, if not longer. >> doug, i want to bring up the baby formula issue because that appears to be more of an issue of the just in time supply- chain approach to economies. i think this is a question i wonder, does the pandemic make a bunch of industries rethink how they do this, and maybe
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would formula love is an argument that the government says you've got to have -- this is not something we can have sort of go up and down, based on, you know, one disruptions growing up everything. >> point number one is i think a party rethought a lot of this just in time, particularly across global supply chain, and that the business risk that cost them a lot of money. they have every incentive to fix it themselves. certainly with the baby formula, that is an outage from an important supplier, and there is no inventory. >> no inventory's approach. >> they find out that the business requires it. >> and betsey stevenson, appreciate it. i got breaking news to get to on capitol hill because january 6 committee is out. they have been investigating the interaction pd issued subpoenas to five sitting members of congress, including
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the house republican leader, kevin mccarthy. this sets up quite the legal showdown here comes a let's bring in callowhill correspondent ali vitali. so, ali, there's been a debate four months in the january 6 committee. whether or not to issue formal subpoenas to sitting members of congress. it's not clear they will ever be able to make them stick, but here we are. >> reporter: chairman thompson said in the past he does not know if they are actually able to do this, but nevertheless, the committee, decided after several months of deliberation here, to subpoena five house republican lawmakers , including the top republican, kevin mccarthy. ucd's other members on the screen, scott perry, jim jordan, all allies of former president donald trump, and in the press release we got from chairman bennie thompson, he says these colleagues have god relevant information to our investigation since the attack on january 6 she goes on to say before we hold hearings next
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month, we wish to provide members the opportunity to discuss these matters voluntary. they issued letters asking all these lawmakers to come before them and cooperate. all of them have said no to some of them in the case of mo brooks have preemptively said they would say and fight the subpoena, so we're about to get into that legal period. thompson goes on to say that they urged their colleagues to comply with the law, do their patriotic duty, and cooperate with our investigations as other hundreds of witnesses have done, and i thought it was striking to these letters are in some cases pretty , but the want to mccarthys avenue, " we're left with no choice but to issue a subpoena, and also that shores up a legal battle, the first time this committee has issued subpoenas to their colleagues , and a rare move here and we can't think of anything in recent memory of another time the house committee has subpoenaed house lawmakers, but here we are. >> ali, this feels like a bit of surrendering in this respect here there is no other way
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they think they're going to get cooperation, so they figure, "let's try to subpoena route," because i feel like everybody explained to me that they thought the subpoena route was actually delayed their ability to do the investigation and perhaps run out the clock if control of the house of representatives changes. so is this an acknowledgment that there is really -- they know they're not going to get cooperation, so they're doors going to make this hurt? it's acknowledgment they need to do that because they've got nowhere left to go if they want cooperation here. perhaps the headline of the subpoena, the fact that this is the unprecedented or with very few precedents in this body, i think that is the point here. >> reporter: you and i both know they are up against the clock on the mid-times. if republicans were to retake the house, this committee goes away . as soon as things reach
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the court, they tend to slow down or grind to a halt could think of all the criminal contempt referrals waiting to be picked up by doj. once things get to the court, that's when the process gets gummy, really slow, and i think the committee was well aware of that. >> reporter: is going to say do they have any sort of plan to expedite and ease court, these court hearings? >> reporter: we just got this release, so if it is in there and i missed it in my first quick scan of this letter, then i have not seen it, but at the same time, you've got to imagine that's where their heads are at the committee. they are four weeks away from the first round the public hearings. this is something chairman thompson preview to what, that they would be issuing letters in some cases duties lawmakers to the question of subpoena has been up in the air, but there are other letters we're waiting for them to issue to. chairman thompson told me a few weeks ago they wanted to talk to republican senators. we have not seen those letters yet either, so while they are still trying to make this the most compelling case to get these people to testify, now issuing subpoenas, there is still other things we're waiting for them to put out there because they told us
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those are avenues they want to explore. again, four weeks until that first public hearing. they wanted to have their fact- finding done before then , now that we are entering the legal arena, that's particularly hard. >> there are three republican senators. mike lee and obviously, lindsey graham. we know they've had conversations, so there is at least three. ali vitali on capitol hill, thank you and we'll keep an eye on the story as it develops and as we figure out the legal fight and what that looks like . it's going to be up ahead. internationally, russia is threatening retaliation as finland gets ever closer to joining nato without delay, and zelenskyy claims the battleground gains in ukraine, while russia makes gains of its own and is out. we will get the latest on the fight in eastern europe next president biden hose the leadership summit without southeast asian nations at the white house, as tensions intensify in the asia-pacific region with china and the question about taiwan. we're going to take you inside something that's never been on camera.
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it is a full day wargame get imagine how the united states would react to a war with china. you're watching "meet the press daily." the the press daily." this is where i want to be. call your doctor about sudden behavior changes or suicidal thoughts. antidepressants can increase these in children and young adults. elderly dementia patients have increased risk of death or stroke. report fever, confusion, stiff or uncontrollable muscle movements, which may be life threatening or permanent. these aren't all the serious side effects. now i'm back where i belong. ask your doctor if latuda is right for you. pay as little as zero dollars for your first prescription.
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welcome back. the war in ukraine enters its 12 week. we're seeing signs of russia's military may be weakening in some places, just as nato appears to strike them. finland leaders announced today their country which is an 800 mile border with russia plans on joining nato without delay. sweden, signaling it plans on joining the alliance as well. finland now poses a threat to russia and is vowing to retaliate, although it's not clear how that would happen. been threatening retaliation ever since finland open the door to nato, and finland get all of this comes as ukase defense ministry tells ukrainian forces have reclaimed some of the areas north of kharkiv with russian forces retreating east.
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russian forces aren't even making significant progress in their offensive in eastern ukraine, but despite the six- packs, officials and mariupol say russia continues to attack the steel plant where the remaining troops in the steel plant remain holed up. courtney, i want to sort of -- am a bit confused on the status of russia's forces. i understand on one hand there is some success in reclaiming parts of the north, but russia has been in retreat to the south and east, and it appears that they actually are making, it is slow, but they are making gains here and perhaps, we're trying to keep up life by talking about the north. is that what's going on? >> there are some areas they are making progress. is a little city in the east . they have taken that in the last 48, 72 hours. they are pushing, as you said, very slowly. kharkiv is getting a lot of attention because that is a city that was under dramatic
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assault for weeks and weeks and weeks. and what's critical here is ukraine has been able to push the russians far enough back that for most parts of the city, they are now outside of artillery range. artillery has been the big weapon we have seen in the east recently. largely because the russians can't fly. it is a contested airspace p but being outside of artillery range makes that city much safer, and it is significant for them, but if you look at the map we're showing right now, there was a town called izyum that you see there. that is an area where the russians were trying to have three lines of assault out of there. that is where they have made a little bit of progress. again, it's very slow. it's definitely much slower than the russians i believed to have thought they would be able to push forward toward the baton area, but it's not insignificant. if you consider the russians really are and as for months and months and months now, you know, they could make some actual progress toward the donbas. >> a constant concern that is
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underneath this war has always been poking putin . is always been concerned, be careful poking him too much whether it's president biden saying he had to go, things like this. there is no bigger poke at putin and finland joining nato. to me, this is and just forget anything else. how seriously is the pentagon taking some of these threats now coming from russia? >> as of now, was, the two big things they are watching they are most concerned about it the use of some sort of tactical nuclear weapon, as is now, they don't have indications russia is planning that. >>, but they are saying and asked if >>. they talk about it, but they are not seeing movement of any capabilities into the region that is something they are watching very closely. still no indications they are planning a. i think the biggest concern is any chance that putin may decide to branch outside of ukraine's borders. according to officials i'm speaking with, there are still no indications they want to do that. secretary austin said they don't think they want to go to war with nato. >> military capability take on finland military.
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>> finland and sweden, they are relatively small militaries, considering other nato members, but they are very adept, and they are strong and well trained, and they have been training with nato partners a long time. >> this will be an easy transition. >> they will fold right in. they have strong able capabilities and strong air capabilities. >> what should the finns be worried about, cyber attacks? is that the kind of realistic ways russia is probably going to try to retaliate? >> cypress the big one, more information operations. it is not -- it is the kind of thing -- and look, they are on the border. they know, they know what they are going to be facing. they will be ready. it's a kind of threats they have been facing from russia for years now anyway. i don't have any sense, according to officials i'm
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speaking with, they are worried about this sort of tipping some sort of a tripwire. it's going to make russia lashed out, but the reality is putin has got to be pretty upset by this. >> this is the biggest expansion of nato that -- since the initial expansion. >> and the symbolism of finland joining? >> of all countries, it's unbelievable. coming up, wargame, serious ones. how the u.s. is gaming out its role in a conflict with china, and why the strategy is a lot more complex with higher stakes potentially than what we are seeing in ukraine . you are watching "meet the press daily." the press daily."
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welcome back. the white house continues its focus on providing ukraine would support it needs in its war against russia. president biden will turn its attention to another region today with his own security concerns it is southeast asia. resident will host southeast asian leaders at the white house at the u.s. seeks to assure our allies in that region that it is committed to their security amid a looming threat from china. the timing of this meeting happens to come as our latest episode of "meet the press reports" takes you somewhere never seen on camera, full wargame exercise that imagines how america would react to a chinese attempt at essentially invading and taking taiwan. here is a sneak peak. >> as you can see on the map, it's a very large concentration of chinese people liberation army forces and potential ports of demarcation for an invasion.
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>> we want to focus on a last- ditch effort to deter to send the strongest possible message to beijing privately and publicly that there will be severe cost if they actually go through with this. >>'s china has seen our reaction to ukraine, and we want to make sure that we're surprising them with how we react here here >> hit the americans as hard as they can in eastern ihl, keep them out of the fight in taiwan. >> we start forcefully with the missile bombardment in taiwan. >> all right, stacy, high-level here. what just happened with and move one? >> china invaded taiwan. and began attacking taiwan's outlying island and the mainland, then followed it with a large air and missile strike on taiwan and on u.s. bases in japan and on u.s. bases in guam
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and the northern marianne is, and we're responding to that with the united states following up with bomber attacks on u.s. ships, chinese ships and ports, and there was an air battle over taiwan where american aircraft flying from the philippines came in and engaged in combat with chinese aircraft that were trying to bomb taiwan. >> after move one, can you assess which team is winning? >> i think it is a stalemate right now. china has strategically blotted by pulling japan in, and the united states is still well- positioned to defend, but china also has a lot of its assets left and has a lot of power that it can apply. >> joining me now onset is my colleague, nbc news correspondent carol lee. the man who helped us put together this, this partnership
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with cnas . carol, take us into the years 2027. is a pretext that got us to the point where china and the united states ended up engaging . a >> exactly, and chuck, the thing so striking about the wargame is how significantly it escalated so quickly. >>, this is over a seven-day period. >> the way each team decided to approach . as you heard talking about deterrence and sending the strongest message possible. none of that worked with ukraine and russia and also did not work here, and the parallels that are there between the battle in ukraine and the wargame on taiwan are really striking, and so i think it was a really interesting exercise in the sense that it showed that it would be a stalemate. how easily could the u.s. get drawn into something like this, direct conflict with china, and just in the region, you talk about
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world war iii , so that was fascinating. >> it was. admiral, the big lesson i took out of it and the lesson and if we had two members of congress, both in the armed services, both veterans, so they really understood the concept, but they were struck and i was struck by, boy, this would be a lot harder than rearming ukraine. this is a lot harder when you don't have a nato. and nato in asia. that was the big take away i had from this. what did you learn from these exercises over the years? >> i've done many of them, chuck. this is something the u.s. flush into pacific command does constantly, always updating, and carol lee is exactly right. currently drawing the lessons out of the ukrainian conflict. two points really jumped out at me. one is the technical level of this, in that you're going to see as opposed to ukraine.
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in other words, this will be maritime, air on air. it's going to be cyber going in the background, which is certainly part of the conflict, so it's going to be a very technological play. and then secondly, chuck, it's leadership it's going to matter here, that is a hard one to assess. just as we blew it on afghanistan, taking the afghans in the fight and blew it on ukraine, thinking the ukrainians were going to fold, we've got to get this one right, so i think a subtext for me that i am looking at is what is the fighting spirit and will of the taiwanese? that is going to be the determinant here. >> if i were to say that the biggest question i have in my head through this whole exercise is -- and the hardest part of this exercise is putting ourselves into the
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chinese ring, okay? the strategic mind-set of the chinese. look, this was a highly experienced chinese experts that we had running the red team. ultimately, you know, there is still a western bias that is in any western educated person's head here, and i think that is the hard part. we assume that china would be, "okay, this is how we're going to keep the pan out," and it's like all that did was draw japan in. i imagine that's the hardest part here. what is in xi jinping's head, what we know about the chinese military? >> let's start with presidents xi himself. he is a patient figure, and that is also of a piece with china in general. as opposed to that kind of impulsive activity that you see out of vladimir putin, the chinese are patient, and sun zhu is the greatest military strategist, and pulling out his very slim but brilliant volume,
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"the art of war, is well worth doing for anybody who wants to understand the mind of the chinese military. what i will say, chuck, is if you dive in, it is all about deception. the best battle is the one you never actually fight because you surprised your enemy, but sun tzu also says -- and it's worth knowing this. fight. that is something that has shot through china thinking about military. i thought the first move, as you gave us a snapshot there, made a lot of sense with the one exception . my eyebrows went up significantly with china immediately striking those bases, instantly drawing the united states into war. i think they might take a more patient approach , but if you want to kick off a wargame and move it fast, there's nothing like a strike. >> the one other thing, carol, i came away with here is with
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water, it's harder. that 19 miles may only be 90 miles, but that's a big difference. there is something else here, and i'm curious if you got this in any of your reporting. both gallagher and cheryl seem to indicate, "hey, we'd like to be more involved in things like this." this seems to be an exercise that a lot of times the pentagon will do these exercises and will report to congress what they need, and it's like no. it's a lot easier to understand what you need here. it was a sense of maybe the pentagon has been going about this all wrong maybe they need to loop members in on how this works. >> open it up. a lot of what they do is going to depend on whether or not they have support for congress. you heard the director of national intelligence this week, saying china wants to take taiwan or and trying to do it by coercion, but they are to determine to do it by force if they needed to, so, part of what the inclusions were in the wargame is the should we be
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arming heine in a different way? should we be involved? those are things you have to deal with congress , so bringing them in could be a little bit something else. >> president biden is with some southeast asian leaders. here's one of the big practical takeaways. yes, we have guam, japan, a base now in australia. i was there for the opening up and when president obama went there, and you realize how important that was. strategically, what allies would you like to see the united states have in southeast asia that could help protect taiwan? >> i'm going to add one who is a strong ally, and i think we can depend on, that is of course singapore, as was indicated, japan is very strong, and south korea is very strong. if you really look around the circuit, we're missing one slot, and it's the philippine islands, and don't forget we had wonderful bases there. we fought hard there in world war ii. we had subic a, clark air force base. that, in many way was the centerpiece of our western pacific strategy , so if we
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could possibly get them back on board, we got a very rough run, but they just had an election year that would be the one i would like to add. final thoughts, chuck? vietnam is no friend of china. >> no. >> that is another distinct policy. tamron bay is one of the best natural harbors on the south china sea, so there is two to work on, i would say. >> i guess, look. people in the 1940s probably did not expect that to be so close of allies to japan. people would probably be shocked if we started pacing in vietnam. admiral, carol lee, thank you both. really proud of this episode, folks, and jim, you are terrific in making this happen as well. be sure to check the entire episode of "meet the press reports." that is on nbc news now.
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nbc news is home for news, and will be available tomorrow on demand in peacock it a symbolic abortion bill failed in the senate. what did democrats do? you're watching "meet the press daily." press daily." my memory has gotten better and it's like the puzzle pieces have all been [click] put together. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. you're pretty particular about keeping a healthy body. what goes on it. usually. and in it. mostly. here to meet those high standards is the walgreens health and wellness brand. over 2000 high quality products. rigorously tested by us. real world tested by you. and delivered to your door in as little as one hour. mount everest, the tallest mountain on the face of the earth. keep dreaming.
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welcome back it has been a busy day on capitol hill, as we broke a few moments ago. at january 6 committee has subpoenaed five members of the republican party, including kevin mccarthy . comes of the committee says all those members declined voluntary cooperation with the committee. amid calls from their base to protect abortion rights, democrats failed to secure votes necessary to advance a bill that would ensure more abortion rights nationwide . it would've injured abortion beyond what's protected by roe v. wade right now, invalidating some state regulations on abortion before 24 weeks. of both failed , 40 i-51, as democratic senator joe manchin georgia republicans against the bill. democrats failed to convince two self-proclaimed pro-choice
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republicans to vote in its favor as well. markowski said the bill out of proportion too late for her comfort, think the legislation went callmack well beyond the precedent established in roe and casey. she urged lawmakers to vote for another bill she put forward that would codify roe. democrats knew this bill would not ever get 60 votes no matter which one they put on the floor instead, they're going to try to use it as a marker for where lawmakers stand on abortion had a midterms, but voters across the country are expecting action . so, what do you do now? joined by democratic senator from wisconsin, kami baldwin, and senator, given the state you come from and the immediate impact, the and that's what roe would have come i can't think of a better person to talk to right now. first, i want to talk about the decision. it seems as if we knew yesterday was a messaging bill., and there are two strategies one can take. when you look at the final result, was it better to show that democrats were divided, what if it been better to show the republicans were divided on
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this issue? >> i would contend this is a very substantive bill. it was around for a long time prior to this leaked decision. in fact, i teamed up with senator blumenthal to introduce it for several previous sessions because we saw all the states acting,
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reorganized. so we fight, we educate the impact, the supreme court decision will have on women and then we organize for the elections. >> do you accept the premise, though, that you politically might have been able to show the republicans as more extreme on this issue if you put a bill that allowed for some of the limitations that roe has allowed for and yet they still wouldn't support it. do you accept the premise that it would have painted them into a deeper corner? >> you know, i really dispute their characterization in going beyond roe v. wade. what has happened is the states have limited and limited and restricted and imposed obstacles. these proposals that have come to pass have severely limited a
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woman's right to choose. and they wouldn't stand up against this anticipated supreme court case. when we want to talk about what's extreme, denying a teen who has been raped the access to abortion care, denying a victim of incest abortion care, denying a woman whose life or health has been placed in jeopardy because of, say, an ectopic pregnancy or something like that the chance to live, that's extreme. >> let me ask you about wisconsin specifically and i can't help but get you to react to your senate colleague that also represents the state. this is what he said hey cording to "the wall street journal." "it might be a little messy for
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people but abortion is not going away, said driving across state lines would not be an issue. so if you're in wisconsin, just drive into illinois. is that a real solution? >> well, first of all, let me tell you what the law would be in wisconsin if roe v. wade is overturned. in wisconsin we have a law on the books, it was passed in 1894 -- i'm sorry, 1849, one year after wisconsin's statehood. that's where we'd be -- that would be the status of our law in wisconsin. >> by the way, at a time when women weren't even allowed to vote in the state of wisconsin. it might be worth bringing that up. >> women were property. they didn't have independent rights of all sorts, let alone voting. we've advanced quite a bit since 1849. and i have to say that the idea
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that women don't have the same rights from state to state is ridiculous. but i would also say to voters that if our current senator johnson wants to send women to illinois, we ought to send him packing this november. >> let me ask you about what can be done in wisconsin. i mean, it's the most polarized state in the nation, and i look at a -- i look at this -- it feels at if there will be nothing and there will be no protection, nothing at all. i mean, is there any sort of plan e, plan f here in the near term? because you guys are sort of stalemated in the federal level. it just feels like this is going to be draconian in wisconsin. >> i fear that it will. i really do. i will say that while our
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political situation in wisconsin is overwhelmingly republican legislature but a democratic governor who can and has vetoed anti-choice measures that have gotten through the state legislature, with what -- what i will say is the general public, the people in wisconsin are quite in tandem with the rest of the nation in terms of views about whether or not roe v. wade should be overturned. a significant majority believe that roe v. wade should remain in tact and a small minority believes that it should be overturned outright. >> is there any constitutional amendment, you know, the state of michigan at least can put that on the ballot and they have a shot at getting something enshrined in their state constitution. any path like that? because, look, your legislature is gerrymandered in one
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direction and you have the democratic governor that can sort of stalemate things. is there a third path at all in wisconsin? >> the legislature has to pass in two separate sessions a bill to amend our state constitution and it goes to the voters of the state at the first election thereafter or an election thereafter. >> that's a long process. yeah. >> so what i will say is go to the ballot box, everybody who is concerned about this and a whole series of other issues where we have seen republicans siding, you know, with -- well, siding with the idea of repealing a constitutional right, the first time in our nation's history and setting in the united states tens of millions of women back. we need to vote. >> senator tammy baldwin, democrat from wisconsin, i really appreciate you coming on and sharing your perspective
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with us. i'm closing in on my hour. i appreciate all of you being with us. msnbc's coverage will continue with katy tur after the break. msnbc's coverage will continue with katy tur after the break. i. the big ones. the ones that really matter. balance your investment mix, stay on track, and make changes... all for free. the little stuff? we'll figure it out... turning a feeling into a roadmap...for free? that's the planning effect from fidelity. (woman) oh. oh! hi there. you're jonathan, right?o the 995 plan!.for free? yes, from colonial penn. your 995 plan fits my budget just right. excuse me? aren't you jonathan from tv, that 995 plan? yes, from colonial penn. i love your lifetime rate lock. that's what sold me. she thinks you're jonathan, with the 995 plan.
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i fought for freedom abroad. i'm not going to allow anyone to take away women's rights here at home. abortion is effectively banned in texas, and at least seven other states only have a single abortion provider. we need leaders in congress who will stand up to extremist politicians, and protect our right to choose everywhere. and i will fight for pay equity, too. i'm emily beach, and i approve this message because nothing is more important than standing up for- - [all] our rights. right now.
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good to be with you. i'm katy tur. breaking news out of washington as we commonly air. the january 6th select committee has issued five new subpoenas, this time to members of congress. house minority leader kevin mccarthy and four other republicans, scott


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