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tv   The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle  MSNBC  June 1, 2022 11:00pm-12:00am PDT

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leets. tonight, as victims of gun best of all, prop a won't raise your taxes. vote yes on prop a for fast, safe, reliable transit. violence are later rest in texas, yet another mass shooting in this country claims even more lives. can lawmakers meet somewhere in the middle and finally do something on gun safety? then, republican operatives caught on tape outlining a strategy to challenge free and fair elections in democratic districts. can you really be sure your vote will count? plus, the divided verdict in the johnny depp amber heard trial, and what it all means in the metoo era, way beyond the headlines. as the 11th hour gets underway on this wednesday night.
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♪ ♪ ♪ good evening once again, i'm stephanie ruhle, and for the eighth consecutive night we start this evening's broadcast covering a, shooting another one. in a nation still reeling from massacres in buffalo and texas, it is happened yet again. this time on a hospital campus in tulsa, oklahoma. authorities say the suspect carried a rifle and a handgun into a medical building next to the hospital, and opened fire. >> the officers that did arrive, were hearing shots in the building, and that's what directed them to the second floor. right now we have four civilians that are dead, we have one shooter that is dead, and right now we believe that is self inflicted. officers have not been
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interviewed, but we are certain that say south inflicted gunshot wound on his part. >> this latest bloodshed comes after the school shooting in uvalde, texas, where 19 children and two teachers were brutally killed last tuesday, newly-obtained video shows that attack unfolding. we can see officers moving towards the school, as terrified children try to escape. we are also learning new details from uvalde's mayor, who said he heard a negotiator trying to reach the gunman on the phone. >> the only person i had in communication with the negotiator, was trying to get their shooter on the phone and so forth as i was in the room. they tried every number they could find. the moment he went in that classroom, they started calling for him. >> his main goal was to try to get this person on the phone. >> the mayor also says he does not think the negotiator knew that there were children inside the school desperately calling 9-1-1 at that time. and there are still many, many questions surrounding the
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uvalde school district police chief. pete arradando, he's now been criticized for waiting too long to send in officers, he denied that report today. >> just so everybody knows we've been contact with pbs every day, just so you know. >> they said you are not talking. >> they say you're not cooperating -- what is your reaction to that. >> meanwhile, in washington, house democrats are pushing ahead with gun safety legislation, the judiciary committee expected to vote on a new measure tomorrow. nbc news reporting a bipartisan group of nine senators has reached what they're calling a framework for a new gun measure. earlier this evening, one of the senators described that process. >> i have never seen more republicans at the table, willing to talk about changes
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in our gun laws and it is due today. we're talking about a comprehensive package that will allow republicans to take that step forward, and learn that in fact there is getting political gain to be had to attaching yourself to the 90% of your constituents that want us to do something about gun violence. >> all right, then, with that, let's bring in our lead panel this evening. jeff bennett, chief washington correspondent for pbs news h our, an msnbc political contributor. matthew watkins, managing editor for the texas tribune, and barbara mcquade, veteran federal prosecutor, and former u.s. attorney for the eastern dish straight to michigan. she worked with the department of justice during the biden transition, and she's now a professor at university of michigan school of law. barb, let's start with what just happened in tulsa. where does the investigation go from here. >> you know in these early stages, i think some of the things that people want to do is try to identify whether the
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shooter is acting alone what motivated him, and other issues whether it's a mental health issue, how he got his gun, and any other things that could explain how we got from there to another round of these deaths. you know, stephanie, we can always try to solve these ivs crimes when it a time. it's like plucking the babies out of the rivers are coming downstream. it seems to me like the better approach all these things, it's figure out who's throwing the babies in the stream in the first place, and stopping them, i'm sure they'll do what they do in all these cases, they will investigate and try to hold people accountable who can be held accountable, but until we get a handle on prevention, i think we're just going to continue to see the same headlines again and again. >> we're actually starting to see that happen, possibly in washington, jeff. when i hear that there is this framework on new legislation, i'm sort of amazed by it. but i want to share what we heard last night from a former gop congressman, his assessment of this bipartisanship. >> mitch mcconnell knows that
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republicans are out of step with most americans on this issue, and we know that mitch mcconnell cares about one thing, winning elections, and that's why he's pushing cornyn and other republican senators, cut a deal with democrats let's do something meaningful here, take this issue off the table ahead of the november elections. >> do you think that's what we're seeing here? many people are saying, this is just mitch mcconnell, just talk talk talk, the running the clock and nothing will happen. or will something? can republicans finally be coming to the table and can violence? >> i think that's a fair assessment, and whatever measure that this ultimately ends up, with mitch mcconnell's gonna have to give his blessing in term in order to get the bill to get the 60 votes and needs, to get beyond the filibuster, and ultimately end up at the presidents desk.
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when you hear chris murphy, who by the way came to congress representing the sandy hook community, when you talk about how democrats and republicans are working together on this framework. one of the reasons they have been successful so far, steph, is because this is a very narrow set of measures -- they're not talking about raising the age to move -- expanding background checks. they're talking about creating incentive program for states to implement red flag was laws, so that law enforcement can confiscate weapons from anyone who might we pose a threat to himself or others, any of republicans in that group who are talking about ways to add more funding to mental health services, and to boost school security, which you often hear republicans talk about after mass shootings because they'd rather talk about that then focus on direct gun control measures and interim themselves i. think there's a concern and granted we don't know what's gonna happen from this legislation there is a concern that any compromise bills can be so watered down,, to the point of potentially been ineffective well giving republicans a room to run in this election year and say hey
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look we sort of found our way and we supported this common sense gun package, in the event that this would not be the kind of thing that would stop another mass shooting. >> gun safety advocates, i think him in. matthew, i want to go back to you've all day, because there is still so many unanswered questions about this shooting. at this point, what is the states, response what is governor abbott doing? >> well governor abbott came out today asking the leaders of the texas house and the texas senate to put together a special committee to look for solutions, to keep texans safe, that included gun legislation, although it seems as though abbott and other top republicans have taken real gun control measures off the table, coming into this, and on the other hand we just continue to see kind of mixed messages, walking back of prior statements about what actually happened on that day, and
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what's going on in the investigation. you mentioned of course, the crisis negotiator at the top of the show. we also heard recently about details where state officials had said that a teacher had propped a back door open to the school, it turned out to not be true. the door was propped open, but it was then close before the gunman entered, the door just in luck. >> matt, i have to ask you about this police, chief these cars despite this massive controversy surrounding him, he was sworn in as a city council member monday night, in an event that was supposed to be, public but of course given all of this, it was closed. how are texans viewing this? >> that's right i think there's a lot of confusion around this chief, altogether. you know, still a lot of unanswered questions about why he didn't, you know, ordered police officers to go into the school himself. he was elected before the shooting occurred on may 7th, in a pretty small election, there were less than 200 votes for that seat in which he was running.
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they basically decided to forgo a public ceremony. of course, those kind of a lot of raw motions around, this understandably so. but he is now a member of the city council, and he will likely be at a city council meeting when they meet for the first time later this month. >> barb we know that the doj is now investigating the police response. do you think that's why we're hearing so little from the chief. ? >> it it could be, i think that there are is very literal for her to gain by speaking, and great risk if he does so. we typically expect our leaders to be transparent in these situations, and share with us everything we know. he also have some legal exposure, or potentially criminal exposure, more likely civil exposure. i suppose if i was her lawyer, i'd advise him that at the moment her legal troubles are much better than any other pr issues, is probably best to keep your mouth shut at the moment. >> matt, how much of an impact
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this gun safety going to have on the upcoming governor's race. beto o'rourke now coming in hard after the governor, where do texans actually come out on this? >> well, if you look at the polls, most voters support some type of measures, limiting access to military style rifles, the air, fifteens the ak-47s, things like that. but of course, it's complicated, because most of the statewide elected officials are more concerned about their kind of right flank in the general election, but o'rourke ran close in 2018 when he ran for u.s. senate, but this is a different year. i think the republicans are looking very confident. governor greg abbott does not seem concerned about the county issue being brought against him very much, in fact he was kind of wielding it against beto o'rourke, for his comment when he was running for president, saying he wanted to take away peoples ar-15s. we'll see, right now it looks like abbott feels comfortable
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saying, we're not gonna put new restrictions on guns. >> jeff, house democrats are about to pass yet another gun safety measure. really good effort, they're getting a lot of support for, it however, it is meaningless unless the senate gets on board. why not wait and see with the senate's next move is? >> because, house democrats have already passed two pieces of legislation that basically never made it across the threshold of the senate chamber, so you're right, congress is moving up three parallel tracks. you've got the bipartisan senate group that we talked about, how speaker nancy pelosi said today that the house is going to consider legislation to ban ar assault style weapons, very soon and then you have the house judiciary committee tomorrow marking up, or considering this mega bill, it's a piece of legislation that rolls in eight pieces, eight separate pieces of gun legislation that do everything from making a felony, to traffic, guns and traffic some new felony for that. another felony for selling or
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transferring a high capacity magazine, it increases the age of purchase from 18 to 21. a number of things. to your point, it's going nowhere in this 50/50 senate, and i think americans can be rightly cynical that here, again, there could be a number of mass shootings, and congress could do nothing. after columbine, congress talked for months about expanding background checks. did nothing. after newtown, same deal, talk for weeks and months about expanding background checks. ultimately, arrived nowhere. after las vegas, a gunman shot more than 50 people. shot and killed more than 50, people injured another 700 people, we often forget about those who are injured. congress, again, talked about banning bump, stops did, nothing that had to be done through executive action. after parkland, marco rubio, republican, introduced a red flag law. steph, that bill was introduced on the senate floor twice, and never got a vote. now, here we are, after buffalo,
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after uvalde,, after tulsa. and you have members of congress, basically open hoping that they are gonna be able to get their act together and do something, because of republican obstruction, the way that that has been over the next two or three decades. we will see what comes of it. >> then, what about executive action, does this white house have a game plan? we know the president is unhappy with his sinking poll numbers, he's dealing with all sorts of issues. couldn't this be something that he can step in and say, step up and say well, i'm gonna make a difference. >> having covered president biden for as long as i have, he does not insert himself into conversations where he does not think he can be helpful. and right now, he believes, i am told is based on my reporting, that this bipartisan senate group, that this is the best shot right now to have some enduring legislation, whether not as comprehensive, enough whether not it has the sort of teeth the gun safety of other kids want, that this is the thing the probably has the best chance. for him, to sort of step into
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this process, it can really throw the whole thing off the rails, because it all becomes about president biden and partisanship. right now the goal, and they're not doing this forever, the senate comes back on june 6th, and chris murphy senator murphy has said that he is not gonna give republicans all day and all night to work on this. if he gets the sense that they're not serious then they will sort of move ahead on their own. but again, there are the votes for democrats to move on their, own so that will ultimately be another show vote for democrats to do a lot of posturing and messaging, but ultimately aren't successful because of republican inaction, republican obstruction. >> how about this novel idea? public safety need not be partisan. crazy. jeff bennett, matt watkins, barbara mcquade, thank you so much for starting us off tonight. coming up, you have got to stay exactly where you are and hear about this new republican plan to contest elections in guess where, swing states. republicans are getting ready
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to fight the, the question is are democrats ready to fight back? later, a huge win for johnny depp. why the outcome is so much more than a celebrity trial. the 11th hour just getting underway on a tuesday night. check out today. angi... and done. it's time for our memorial day sale on the sleep number 360 smart bed. it senses your movement and automatically adjusts so you both stay comfortable and can help you get almost 30 minutes more restful sleep per night. save $1,000 on the sleep number 360 special edition smart bed, it is said to be a republican queen now only $1,999. only for a limited time.
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attorney's office to pursue justice for everyone. but like so many of my colleagues, i resigned in protest because chesa boudin interfered in every single case and failed to do his job. the office is absolutely
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in disarray right now. chesa dissolved my unit prosecuting car break-ins. now criminals flock to san francisco because there are no consequences. we can't wait. recall chesa boudin now. plan to challenge elections in mostly democratic places. using a so-called army of poll
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workers, according to tapes obtained by politico, the rnc strategy is calling for installing, quote, trained recruits as regular poll workers and put them in direct contact with party attorneys. party chairwoman ronna mcdaniel, is pushing back on this reporting saying, quote, the rnc doesn't conduct poll worker training, we just facilitate. let's find out what this all means. joining me now, let's dive in, michael steele, former chairman of the republican national committee, and former lieutenant governor of maryland and kirk bardella, adviser to the dnc and dccc also contributed to the l. a. times in usa today. he won services and senior adviser and spokes person for the house oversight committee republicans. michael, let's start right there. ronna mcdaniel, she's arguing, we don't train poll workers, we just facilitate, and democrats, they've had poll workers for years. are you buying when she selling? >> i'm not buying any of that because i can tell you, as a former county chairmen, a state
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chairman, and national chairman, she's read on one thing, the parties typically do not train poll workers. you have to understand the difference between a poll worker and a poll watcher. poll workers are hired by the county state elections board, typically, or the state election board. they work for them, they don't work for the parties. they are paid by county and state officials out of their budget. they are very specific duties and responsibilities. the parties go out and find poll watchers. they're the ones who will walk in the room, representing their particular political interest, making sure that there is no shenanigans going on, and can challenge the election. when she's saying, we're not training poll workers, yeah, but what you're doing is, we are taking poll watchers and your putting them in the poll worker slot.
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a lot of these folks, the 850 that we read out of michigan, those folks are largely qanon, election deniers, folks who think the election was corrupted who are now going to be trained as poll workers, sitting there, having their hands on the ballots, taking in the information from the voters. when there is a challenge, they can reinforce that challenge -- noted in her point, her piece, rather -- excellent piece, this is the gum of the works. to create the chaos within the system at that polling place to put those ballots aside, so they can be addressed, hopefully thrown out later on. this is a very tactful and strategic effort to be on the ground. the party is never focused, in this area, before 2010, believe it or not. -- hide such shenanigans. we went out and got the workers, that worked, got those to the
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county, to care that, we got the poll watchers that we needed. you didn't hear any claims of fraud and conniving but it's a different environment now. democrats, y'all better buddha baby, it's coming. >> what does that look like? if you are in the dnc, and you read this reporting, why would you do, michael? >> i'd be having all kinds of meetings across the state, the country, with all of my state party chairs to understand exactly what their strategies are, on the ground. what do you have in place? what the republicans complain about, in a place like michigan, they were outnumbered. there were 5000 -- 5400 democrat poll workers, 270. that's on the party, to help facilitate and get people interested. the parties never really done that, or they fallen off from
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that. that's on them. the democrats have been very good about that over the years. i know, firsthand, in maryland, how well organized they have been in the past. so, as a county state chairmen, i had to step my game. i had to go out and meet them where they were and go out and find the workers that we could then shuttle off to the election board, y'all take care of them, and then we also get our poll watchers to be there on election day to make sure our folks were well represented. they need to drill down on their operations right now. >> speaking of michigan, i want to share a bit of a recording of the rnc's election integrity director in the state of michigan. listen to this. >> truly, is going to be an army -- we're going to have lawyers that work early to build relationships with different judges, so that when that happens, we're going to have lawyers that have relationships with police chiefs in the different areas, with the police officers and even areas. when that happens, those prefixes think relationships
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already established. -- >> what we're hearing is a deliberate, systemic organized effort of the republican party to target democrat precincts, communities of color and put a plan in place to influence and impact their ability to turn out and vote, and participate in the democratic process. this is black and white here. -- ronna mcdaniel is nothing more than a dishonest smear merchant she knows exactly with the parties doing. this is with steve bannon in the very political piece is referring to is the precinct plan. it's systemic. it's, at the heart of the -- national committee and they're one and only goal and purpose is to disenfranchise voters. to make sure that what happens in 2022 and beyond is not what we had in 2020, which is a free and fair election. they're installing people who
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believe in the big lie, people who want to throw out democracy, they're installed in positions where they could contest ballots, challenge voters, create chaos and create havoc on a democratic process. they will say, look, there's all these complaints in this precinct, this election isn't valid, these vote shouldn't be counted, this is not legitimate. it's a re-run of what we saw in 2020, but this time, they've had the time, preparation, manpower, resources to install the big lie into the entire apparatus of republican parties, at the state, local, national level. it can be -- democrats do not measure up to this. if they do not see this is a red flag warning, that this is a regular time, that 2020 could be the last free and fair election -- >> speaking of democrats, axios is reporting if republicans take back the house in november, you better expect a whole lot of investigations into the
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biden administration. this could be benghazi on steroids. given that, should democrats be getting a lot more aggressive now? especially on things like tightening up the rules on oversight and ethics. things they complained about over and over when trump was in the white house, saying that they were going to change things when they were in charge. michael? >> they should've been tight over a year ago. this is political malfeasance in my view. people have been saying forever and a day, what's at stake, and what this looks like. what we're talking about right now, folks, is a preview. this is a 2020 preview, the beta version of what's going to happen in 2024. so, the reality of it is, this is the critical part of why the other pieces are so important. but they get the police on board, right? they get the police so that they know what's going on at the voting booth, so when they're called, they know what's going on, so there and on the game.
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then they get the lawyers, who are also in play and place, who then have already lined up the judges, who are in play and place. you go through that chain, unlike what we saw in 2020, where judges -- 60 of them, many of them, who were trump appointed judges said, no way in hell there is no fraud here, get out of here. there -- this is a grotesque form of -- weather trying to get the judges, lawyers and police in place beforehand. this is all a run up to 2024, folks, you better pay attention because it's coming live in large. >> a message from michael steele and kurt -- hague, democrats, tighten up your game. gentlemen, thank you both. coming up, amber heard calls it a setback for all women. johnny depp calls it speaking the truth. we're gonna break down today's defamation trial verdict and why it was much broader than a celebrity trial. the implications are huge. when the 11th hour continues.
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do you find that mr. depp has proven all the elements of defamation? answer, yes. do you find that mr. depp has proven, by clear and convincing evidence, that misheard acted with malice? answer, yes. >> hours ago, the jury in the johnny depp and amber heard emmett defamation trial announced its verdict, ruling in favor of johnny depp. herd was not liable for defamation against depp, and ordered to pay $15 million in damage. but because of virginia's cap on punitive damages, depp will get close to 10 million bucks. he was also found liable for
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defamation against heard, but the damages were considerably smaller. >> i against john c depp the second, we the jury a ward compensatory damages and the amount of $200 million -- katie fang pointed out, this trial turned into a circus, in part because of the celebrity status of heard and depp, the verdict will have real world consequences for survivors. katie fang joins us tonight, msnbc host in political contributor, and liz, chang author and msnbc economist. she co-host the amazing man enough podcast. katie, let's start right there with your quote. real world consequences for survivors. what do you mean? >> well, the concept is that normally in a defamation case,
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it's just a high burden when you're dealing with public figures. we definitely had to celebrity figures that we're at war in court in this particular case. but, they are both claiming to be survivors of domestic violence. they're both claiming to be survivors of a particularly violent, emotionally, and physically abusive, tumultuous relationship. and, we now have an outcome that we've seen today, with not only the damages amounts that we're overdue by the jury in this case, which frankly, stephanie, we're a little bit odd. the fact that originally the jury came out with a verdict forum that was empty with amount of the damages, which really makes you wonder if they contemplated the amount of damages, because they came back quickly later on. when you have an outlet with the amount of damages, and you think of the fact that actual malice was found by the jury. the fact that a public figure was able to prove, that on the other side, the other side acted with the knowledge that what they were saying was false. well, now, has that basically created a burden that has been lowered for people who are otherwise not going to be public figures? and you also have an attorney, frankly, who is found to be liable for doing something on behalf of the client. so there is a lot of ramifications that are coming from this particular verdict, today. >> lives, even before the verdict was announced. monica lewinsky was thinking beyond the trial, she wrote a really compelling piece for vanity fair. in, it she writes, it's the larger implications for our culture that concern me the
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most. the waves we have stoke the flames of misogyny and separately, the celebrity circus. i mean, it's especially telling for monica lewinsky, someone who truly knows both of those issues, to write this. how seriously should we take her concerns? >> we should take them very seriously. so much of this trial has felt like it's a peephole into the private lives of wealthy, and sort of out of touch celebrities. but it's really been much more of a mirror, it's reflected ourselves back at ourselves. we've been able to see where we are at as a society, a society that is not just interested, but actually enjoys the humiliation of a woman, and the way that we've seen it just happen on the internet but even across conversations, and the way that it's been portrayed in the media, is very worrisome. the math just doesn't add up
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for people to take this on as their main huge issue. women have a much higher likelihood of being a victim of domestic violence than an innocent man being accused of something he did not do. it's not to say that it ever happens, but it is very rare. and so there's backlash overseeing, right, there's backlashes not because women are equal, it's because they are dangerously close to being equal, and that scares a lot of people. and so, they are latching on to this case in a way that, really, again, reveals where we are at when it comes to all of these issues. yes, the me too movement has been immensely and enormously impactful for women's rights. but, we are still not there yet. >> this has been a brutal six years, six weeks for the two of them. katie, is it fair to say -- during this trial, amber heard has been silenced? because both parties literally just heather day in court. >> i don't think it's a fair
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statement to say that amber heard was silenced in anyway, and recall also, stephanie, there is a similar lawsuit brought by johnny depp in the united kingdom where he lost. where he sued the sun tabloid for the same concept, and a judge in that case said, no, i found 12 separate instances of domestic battery committed by you, johnny depp, the differences you have it in front of it jury, the court of public opinion basically crucified amber heard before this case was even brought to the jury to decide. and that's a critical kind of take away from this case as well, the fact that, according to liz, its people entered into this very sort of relationship that existed between john adept and amber heard, allowed a lot of the court of opinion to weigh in. i also want to stake very quickly, stephanie, this op-ed was an op-ed. so, another kind of legal ramification is that you can have legal exposure when you write an opinion article in a paper. because normally, that's protected first amendment free speech. so now we are creating this president now that you can go out and make this comment about another public figure, they're gonna have legal exposure, and that's a very slippery slope. >> liz, this, trial is fair to, say has taken on a life of its own. how did johnny depp, now become sort of the face of this reactionary political movement? >> yeah, i mean there is reports that, you know, those
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conservative outlets like the daily wire that have been pushing the anti amber heard hashtag. today, the gop judiciary committee for some reason tweeted again johnny devin pirates of the caribbean be in this amazing sort of glamorized man. it's very troubling. the pleasure with which we are humiliating amber heard, is just as troubling as the cameras asian of johnny depp in the story. again, it's revealing this misogyny, this deep-seated misogyny in our society. i really have to agree with katie, defamation trials are a
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weapon that could be levied against survivors of abuse more often. we know that marilyn manson, whose friends with johnny depp, is pursuing that with his ex beyoncé. she is accusing him of abusing -- he's been accused of abused by several other women. considering worrisome to be entering this kind of territory.
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it's these critical ramifications, people are projecting these things on to the trial was just aren't fair. i read a lot but a lot of things, i read about abortion, i've never had as many emails as i've received about this very topic. i've heard from men who have been abusive, i've heard from women who were survivors. i've heard from people who say she's hurting survivors, there's a lot of things out, there it's time for us to have that complex conversation about domestic violence, i was hoping that's with this trial would mean. >> that's what we're, doing we are talking, liz, blank katie fang, you both make us smarter every time you are here. coming up, how russia is responding to the news that the u.s. is sending long-range missiles to the ukraine, will ask ambassador michael mcfaul if this is enough to stop putin from gaining ground, when the 11th hour continues.
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pouring oil on the fire, by sending advance rocket systems to ukraine. the pentagon announced a new 700 dollar million dollar weapons package to kyiv, including precision guided rockets that can travel more than 40 miles. with us tonight to discuss, michael mcfaul. former u.s. ambassador to russia, and msnbc international affairs analyst. he wrote the must read book
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from cold were hot piece, an american ambassador in putin's russia. ambassador, a senior ukrainian official told nbc news, he is still worried, even with this new aid, do you think he should be, or does he have to say that? >> great question. and i dont have a great answer. here's what i would say. they've been having a debate, the ukrainians have won -- at what you just described, they're called hammers, and 1:42's. these are long range rocket systems, guided rockets, that will now, after this delivery, we'll go much farther than what the ukrainians have, 70 kilometers. the ukrainians wanted the rockets that will go farther, 300 kilometers. whether you're satisfied or not, the ukrainians are publicly asking for more, the way i would describe it is this, they've gone much farther than before, and not as far as the ukrainians would like. >> they have to keep asking for
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more. if they say thanks, we're all set, we are surely going to stop. what is it going to take though? is it this last shipment is going to make a difference? what will stop russia from gaining ground in the east? >> again, i don't know. we're probably going to be talking about this for a long time, weeks if not months. there's a major war underway in donbas, it's mostly artillery, and these kinds of rockets were talking about. they're firing back and forth. dozens of people are dying on each, side every single day. russia makes incremental gains in one part of the front, and then ukraine makes a counteroffensive on another part of the front. we're going to learn the names of these little cities that will sometimes be taken by russians, and a counter offensive with the ukrainians. i don't know the long run, who wins that war. >> your latest column in the washington post is pretty interesting, you're calling for the west to help those in
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russia, who are opposed to the war. why is that important, a, and be, let's get real, is there any shot you're going to see widespread support in the west to help russians? people are growing weary of high gas prices here, and that is to help ukraine. >> two things i would say. number one, yes, there are tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of russians that don't support this war. they just don't want to go to jail for 15 years. remember, that's the cost. even saying the word war in russia today, that could get you 15 years in jail. number two, there's also tens of thousands of russians that have left russia. they're in places like armenia, kazakhstan, israel, cypress. stuck in places they don't want to be and don't have visas to work their. those are russians we should help to. they're the ones who said, i
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can't bear to support this war, and they fled. now, i think we should help them to make a better life outside of the country, and, stephanie, many of those people are journalists. they're the people that ultimately, in the long, hall would begin to report from the outside, get news into russia, that most russians can read right now about what's actually happening in ukraine. >> and out of town, but i have to ask, if merely saying the word war could land you in jail for 15 years, why on earth do so many russians support putin? wouldn't they just take that fact as enough to be not smelling right? >> a lot of russians don't support putin, and we don't know it. if you're going to go to jail for 15 years for saying that, you're probably not telling -- would you really think about putin. you probably don't know what they really think. one day, we finally will. >> now that is a compelling answer. you will have is thinking about that tonight. ambassador, michael mcfaul, thank you for joining us.
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>> thanks for having me. >> coming up, the stunning reality check on decades of school shootings in america when the 11th hour continues.
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the last thing before we go tonight, this is not a movie. the production company, 11 films, is out the powerful new video, asking us to wake up to the horrible reality of school shootings in america. watch this. >> i'm done. okay?
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i've had it. they filled her kids again. how many more times? >> i'd hoped, when i became president, i would not have to do this. again. to lose a child is like having a piece of your soul ripped away. >> every time i think about those kids, it gets me mad. >> there's a hollowness in your chest, you feel like you're being sucked into it. >> how my gonna plan a funeral? what kind of casket? i have to read a eulogy. all i did was send them to school. >> 90% are living under the tyranny of 10%. >> sit down.
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you're out of line. >> they seem angry or at beto or cork, then they were at the massacre of 19 children and to fourth grade teachers! >> i'm trying to figure out at one point in time this became so normalized. >> the ar-15 shreds the human body. just think about that. think about what that would do to a little ten year old body. >> what in god's name do you need is salt weapons for except to kill someone? and >> you read their age. ten, ten, ten. >> i have a fourth grader and, she put her hands in her friends blood and then smeared it all over her body, to make it look like she was dead. >> what's are we doing? >> we were all hiding behind the stage. >> what are we doing?
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>> why only in america? it's just an american problem sir. >> people were getting shot all around me. >> when are we going to do something? >> yeah, i was bullied in school to, i never shot of my classmates. >> so honestly, to hell with anybody who says don't politicize this. >> this is about semiautomatic weapons and military weapons that are killing our children's in schools. >> a plea for meaningful gun reform from 11 films, takes us off the air tonight. on that note, i wish you all a
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good night and from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late with us. i'll see you at the end of tomorrow. tonight on all in, the obscene blame game in uvalde, the valves again. -- >> when we, enter the doors propped open by a teacher. >> when law enforcement got a wrong by blaming a teacher, and why this investigation remains chaotic. then. >> we are trying to recruit, truly is going to be an army. shocking new reporting on the republican plan for election day chaos, in a key


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