tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC July 8, 2022 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT
few things. i am not boris johnson's cat. like all prime minister, z's only a temporary resident of downing street. olivia permanently, when he finally goes i stay. yes it's all very embarrassing but it will be over soon. that's why larry the cat one who won the week. thank you very much. starts now. tonight i'm all in. donald trump's white house counsel sits for a marathon interview with the january 6th committee. tonight, what we're learning about what's happening behind those doors and long strange trip of patsy baloney. >> the president has done absolutely nothing wrong. >> pat cipollone said this is a murder suicide pact. >> then, new reporting on potential new witnesses that could extend the investigation to august. and what we know about the next hearing about jamie raskin calls the convergence of
interest to, to violent domestic it insurgent groups. >> proud boys stand back and stand by. >> plus why joe biden's executive order on abortion today could have a retractable effect at the supreme court overturned roe, and why an earth is trump tv trying to take out another trump candidate for office? >> is it true for that jury lake wasn't she an obama appointee? >> she donated first obama, she endorsed obama. >> all in starts right now. >> good evening from new york, i'm chris hayes. don't pat supplement, donald trump's white house counsel just wrapped up seven hours of testimony to the january six committee. that interview took place on capitol hill behind closed doors. it was recorded of course on video. they said pat cipollone was cooperating revealed new information that we will hear in upcoming hearings.
>> mr. cipollone did appear voluntarily and as are the whole variety of questions. he did not contradict the testimony of other witnesses, and i think we did learn a few things which we will be rolling out in the weeks to come. i think it was a grueling day for all involved. mr. cipollone and the staff and the members, but it was well worth it. >> now, new reporting suggests the committee continues to collect more evidence and that more republican witnesses have been coming forward. they may extend those hearings beyond next week. this interview with mr. cipollone as the committee's greatest breakthrough yet. is a key witness as we know from these hearings, repeatedly tried to stop donald trump for going through with the coup. he had the potential to be the john dean of the investigation, because john dean himself,
president nixon's white house counsel, was the one who openly watergate investigation in 1973. he had urged cipollini to speak out. it is really an amazing turn of events that pat cipollone is now in this position. donald trump hired cipollone at the end of 2018 and that was to replace his first white house counsel don mcgahn. trump became dissatisfied with mcgahn after he tried to prevent the vice president -- mccarrick went on to cooperate extensively with the special counsel robert mueller's investigation. for his next white house counsel, he wanted a true loyalist, a true soldier. he chose cipollone, a right-wing roman catholic -- for a time cipollone played the part. he was trump's lead attorney in trump's first impeachment trial which you will remember was about the ex presidents attempt to corruptly misuse his power for his own political benefit.
he solicited foreign help with the threat of extortion essentially to interfere in a free and fair election. and the democrats argued at the time, this is not someone who could be trusted with the powers of government, because trump refused to play by the basic rules of democracy. here is to fundamentally at a core level except free and fair elections. in fact, he wanted to prevent them from happening. >> can we be confident that he will not continue to try to cheat in that election? can we be confident that americans and not foreign powers will get to decide and not the president motion any further foreign interference in our democratic affairs. and a short, plain sad incontestable answer is no, you can't. you can't trust this president to do the right thing, not for one minute, not for one election, not for the sake of our country. you just can't.
he will not change them and you know it. >> -- but pat cipollone in his role as defender of the president countered that it was the democrats actually who are the ones watching democracy by try to impeach donald trump. >> what they are trying to ask you to do is to throw out a successful president on the eve of an election with no basis and in violation of the constitution. it would dangerously change our country and we can -- weaken forever all our democratic institutions. the election is only months away. the american people are entitled to choose their president. overturning the last election and massively interfering with the upcoming one would cause serious and lasting damage to the people of the united states and the country. >> so adam schiff says donald
trump is a clear and present danger to american democracy, pat cipollone counters no, no no. impeaching donald trump is a clear and present danger to american democracy. >> well we know who turned out to be right dinwiddie? donald trump was a thrill threat to democracy in pat cipollone finally realized he was on the wrong side to. as he watched in realtime as the ex president attempted to and american democracies we know, to use the power of his office to cause a coup, to cause the first not ever peaceful transfer of power. cipollone was there in the white house as the first president in u.s. history tried to prevent that peaceful transfer of power by inciting a violent insurrection. and to be clear, and to his credit, the conservative trump loyalist the one who stood up to the first impeachment trial and preached democracy, tried his best as far as we know to stop the coup. when it really counted it appear the pat cipollone did
nearly everything he could except for speaking out publicly to stop it. for the past six committee hearings, we heard how cipollone pushback on trump efforts to use the department of justice to further his claims of electric flight fraud. here's describing cipollone's reaction when he tried to promote loyalist jeffrey clark falsely declaring that the doj had found evidence of fraud. >> i think mister president, i have been through with you for attorney generals into acting attorney generals but i couldn't be part of this. the story is not gonna be that the department of justice has found massive corruption that would change the results of the election, it's gonna be the disaster of jeff clark, and i think at that point, pat cipollone says the as this is marie's murder suicide pact this letter. >> cipollone also pushed back against trump's lawyer john eastman miscued memo laying out the scheme for mike pence to essentially unilaterally overturn the election on
january six. >> what was communicated to me was that pits pat cipollone his idea was 90 and one point it confronted easement with the same sentiment. >> and last week cassidy hutchinson told the house committee that cipollone warned them of the possible tribes trump could commit if he led them to the capitol generous. ex >> i saw him that morning mr. cipollone said something to the effect that please make sure that we don't go up to the capitol cassidy, keep in touch with me, we are going to get charged with every crime imaginable if we make that movement happen. >> do you remember which crimes mr. cipollone was concerned with? >> in the days leading up to the six, we had conversations about potentially obstructing justice or defrauding the electoral count. >> hutchinson also lead to the
committee would pass cipollone told her boss, mark meadows. after the secret service stopped trump from going to the capitol, and the mob and made it their on their own. >> i remember pat saying to him something to the effect that the rioters have gotten to the capital, we need to talk to the president now. and mark said he doesn't want to do anything about it, and pat said something to the effect that and very clearly -- said something to the effect of mark, something needs to be done or the people are gonna die and the blood's gonna be in your effing hands. >> people are gonna die and keep the blood will be in your effing. has really was right. about that with the script over and over and over again. conservative roth loyalist who worked for trump realize he's a sociopath and then comes around and tells the story. the question that remains tonight after hours of
testimonies did pat cipollone really come clean? once again, i'm joined by david rohde, executive editor of -- where he's been reporting of the january 6th investigation. david, welcome. we don't know what happened inside that room. all we have is what jill lofgren said. you've been reporting on this. what conclusions can we draw provisionally from today's testimony? >> i think provisionally this is an extremely bad day for john eastman, willie juliano rudy giuliani, sydney powell, jeff clark and the republican members of congress who requested pardons for from president trump. all those people are not covered by executive privilege and according to what representative lofgren said, cipollone seems to have corroborated the account of other witnesses interactions, the absurdity of eastman's arguments, the murder suicide-backed involving jeff clark taking over the doj. look, obviously the big question is donald trump. my sense is that there were
repeated breaks today. there were two or three of them or cipollone left the interview and then went into a separate room to confer with his lawyers. so i think there is a chance that he invoked and executive privilege and wanted did not want to talk about a statement to donald trump. >> the question of privilege has loomed over all this. your point is worth highlighting again. that's communications he has with the president, not with john eastman. as well as those other people. presumably we have seen this time and time again, we saw the lawyer for mike pence and others. there's a little bit of an ax to grind for the people who are on team anti coup on team coup that is happening in that white house? >> yes, and they did. they fought hard and did a nice job of that narrative on
cipollone. there were lawyers close to bill barr, they did feel that trump, the impeachments were unfair, the mueller investigation was outrageous, and i really believe that, but all of them were stunned about what he did between election november and january six. i'll say again, we talked about this chris, john dean testified about crimes committed by the president. john dean tweeted this afternoon that basically cipollone's legal advice to the president can remain confidential but there are other facts. dean found a way to testify about witnessing the president committing crimes in the oval office, so possibly pat cipollone did today as well. but we just won't know. the next hearing is tuesday that looks like another blockbuster hearing. >> the point is that i think there's an interesting point as well. the importance of cipollone for
establishing if there was gonna be prosecution of anyone, and it does look like there is a significant criminal exposure of jeffrey clark and john eastman. cipollone is a key witness for that independent of what he tells the committee because of precisely his level of knowledge. that's another possibility the looms over all of us as well? >> yes, that's another effort about pressuring other witnesses to turn on trump, pressuring eastman. wholesome mark meadows as well. cassidy had describe some heated exchange between meadows and cipollone. don't think all of his conversations -- and if there's someone who could turn and should turn for his own legal feature, that would be mark meadows. again, even if cipollone keeps something's private about trump, he puts pressure on a whole host of other witnesses who were talking to the president
as well. >> this question of privilege hangs over a lot of us. it's a little amorphous to me to be honest. it's amorphous for legal practitioners which is why i think we haven't seen the department of justice indict mark meadows for example. meadows is claiming some privilege. he has a more plausible claim to that or version of that than someone like seemed steve bannon. is there from the post today trump considers waving climate executive privilege for steve bannon. i would say the former president is now willing to give up that claim if biden can't reach an agreement of the terms in appearance of the panel. the letter was described three people familiar with, who spoke on condition of an a minute nobody. >> that does seem odd but maybe steve bannon doesn't want to go to trial in jail after all. >> it could be. it could also be donald trump sort of unleashing one of his attack dogs at the committee,
one of trump's frustration has been there's no republican voices, no voice is defending him there. so, he sends bannon. but i'm not sure bannon would fare that well against this committee. frankly, liz cheney has been a very [inaudible] effective question of the members of the committee. i question the strategy. he should be using every ounce of executive privilege that he can. so, i'm not clear -- i don't think this would exactly work. you are right. it's a very funny or strange privilege. the idea that a president should be able to have private conversations with his closest aides about policy decisions -- i don't think that that should extend to crimes. >> i will note, just as a side note, that executive privilege, which appear is very early in the tradition of american jurisprudence -- i think there's a case that establishes sit with george washington himself. it appears nowhere in the constitution. it appears as much as abortion rights, and yet courts appear to take a quite quickly seriously, including this. one david rohde, thank you very much. >> thank you, chris.
>> so, what is next for the january six committee now that they've got cipollone on the record? what we know about what is happening in the hearings happening next week, coming up. what we know about what is what we know about what is happening in the happening next week, coming up when moderate to severe ulcerative colitis persists... put it in check with rinvoq, a once-daily pill. when uc got unpredictable,... i got rapid symptom relief with rinvoq. check. when uc held me back... i got lasting, steroid-free remission with rinvoq. check. the colon lining. check. rapid symptom relief. lasting, steroid-free remission.
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conspiracy for members of both groups. they have also been multiple reports of another yet unconfirmed hearing scheduled for next thursday. those reports initially indicated that that hearing -- the thursday one -- would and the public hearing portion of the committee investigation. but as the washington post reported today, the committee, quote, may continue to hold hearings beyond next week as more republicans come forward and are expected to continue coming forward. alan feuer covers extremism and political violence for the new york times where he worked on the papers excellent instigations into the proud boys activity during the insurrection. and he joins me now. alan feuer, it's great to have you. i must say, your reporting on this has been very clarifying, for those of us following this closely, just about the degree to which so much of the violence that happened on that day really starts with these groups. it's precipitated by them, is initiated by them and then people sort of follow behind. tell us a little bit about just generally what your reporting found about that? >> sure.
so, this video that i helped do with the fantastic people at the times visual investigations team and -- you know, using a lot of open source intelligence from a lot of other online researchers -- had a central finding, which was that the proud boys, on january six, were tactically maneuvering on the ground to instigate violence and advances and breaches of the building and then kind of receding into the background, so as to let the crowd around them fill the space and almost disguise their tracks, in a way. so, it's sort of a fascinating -- you know, like, operational move that they did, over and over and again during the capitol attack. >> and i think for me and this was true for your reporting and also the presentations that we saw in that first hearing, that
that's one of the biggest capitol differences between how it looked in realtime and what we kind of know capitol now, which is that in realtime it looked like a spontaneous eruption of rage, and the next thing you know they are in the building. and when you look at what's actually happened on the ground, it is quite specific and quite planned and they are doing a lot of it. >> sure. so, there's a couple of thought about that -- one, the proud boys, before january 6th, in the run up to what happened at the capitol purposely made the decision not to wear their traditional black and yellow uniforms. they made a decision instead to go incognito as their leaders called it, and that had the effect of discussing how many proud boys were actually involved in key moments of the breach. and in key advances of the storming of the building. and so that really was only apparent -- you know, it couldn't be seen
necessarily in the moment. it took the fullness of time and the slow, grinding release of thousands of hours of a video from that day, whether it had been video from peoples cell phones, that they took themselves are posted online, or it was cctv -- surveillance footage -- from the capital infrastructure. or even body camera footage from the police officers that day. it took time to get it, analyze it, synthesized it and kind of figure out what actually happened on the ground. >> the hearing on tuesday where, we understand, is about precisely this, the oath keepers as well. stewart rhodes, who is facing trial for seditious conspiracy, said he wants to speak live before the committee, which i doubt will happen, given the fact that he is under federal criminal investigation. that would be a massive mistake. what would you be looking for on tuesday -- one of the sort of unanswered questions or evidence that you are going to be looking to as someone who has reported deeply on this? >> so, there is a couple of
things. one, i think it's just important to mark the moment that tuesday's hearing will bring us to what you can think of as the main event, right? the actual mob violence on the ground of january 6th. up until now, we had a flavor of that in the first hearing. but we have really spent a lot of time in these hearings leading up to tuesday in the back rooms, in the office suites, in the people with the suits and the ties, and what we are going to find out on tuesday that we are going to be dealing with people in the booths, not the suits. and i am looking for a couple of things. we are probably going to hear a significant amount about proud boys who went into the committee and gave recorded interviews. there have been several. we will likely hear clips of their interviews, including from the former chairman of the group, and we cato rio, and we
are also likely to hear the committee try to tie groups like the proud boys and the oath keepers to people in former president trump's inner circle -- folks like roger stone, his longtime political adviser, and possibly even mike flynn, his one-time national security adviser. and so what we are probably going to hear is the way in which january 6th didn't start on january 6th. it really started in right after the election -- everybody kind of elides over the fact that there were two massive pro trump and election fraud rallies in washington that preceded january 6th. when was on november 14th, 2020, the other was on december 12th. and so we are also likely to hear how the proud boys, the oath keepers, and, i think, another right wing paramilitary
group called the first amendment pretoria in played roles in those three events all oftentimes as participants, speakers but also as security guards and bodyguards. so, i think we are going to hear a bit about all of that on tuesday. >> right. alan feuer, who will be covering that hearing, thank you very much. >> thanks, chris. >> coming up, a republican candidate so bad even fox news doesn't think she should run for office. that's next. run for office that's next.
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call the barnes firm now to find out. yoyou ght t beurprpris basically kind of propaganda arm for republican senate campaigns in mitch mcconnell's political arm. and they know when they have a uniquely bad candidate on their hand, someone who so extreme that should they win the primaries, they would greatly endangered republican chances of winning the election. so fox news is job is to take out that candidate. for example, we saw sean hannity do it to far-right candidate kathy barnett in the pennsylvania senate primary. segment after segment about how kathy barnett hasn't been vetted. steer clear over, please don't vote for her. and now carrie lake of arizona is the latest in this fight.
she is trying to be the states next governor, and has been endorsed by donald trump. she insists the 2020 election was rigged and stolen from trump, and even more unnerving, she says she would not have certified the 2020 results if she were governor. imagine if she were governor in 2024. in april of this year, nearly a year and a half after the election, lake said decertify wisconsin now. and arizona! of course donald trump eats it up, it plays well with the maga base. but it creates an uphill climb in a state where the state's purple. so they made sure to bring up her past support of drag queens. >> the washington post as a story today that says arizona gop candidate who can criticize drag queens was once a fan according to drag. when this is the quote. arizona gop gubernatorial candidate carry like ten of the
shows a dry cleaner trustees more than 20 years. >> are you now or have you ever been a fan of drag queens? last night, laura ingraham had lakes opponent on, clearly the fox news preferred candidate. supporters in the background as one to tack carry lake. >> is it to the carry lake was an obama supporter? i keep thinking of that can't be true because president trump endorsed her and i don't know. she could be the greatest person ever, i don't know her, she said a lot of conservative things now, but did she support obama? >> she did. she donated to obama, she knocked doors for obama -- >> black? >> her whole political career is being quite a interesting, from democrat, two republican, two democrats who. >> it is a riot to watch them
kind of leader audience to the water. come with me, when we think about this carry? lake ingram only asked that question once. so i can think with the actual state of play in arizona is where the republican nominee will likely have a good chance of being the next governor. here's a columnist for the arizona republican says quote, current taylor robson versus kerry lake is now become doug doocy versus donald trump. laura, did you see endorsement got my attention this. race could give us a little bit of background about carry lake and her opponent as well? in terms of their backgrounds and sensuality and republican party politics there? >> all we have to know about carey lake is that she is donald trump and stilettos, swinging around a sledgehammer whatever she can hit. it is a campaign infused by anger. it is a trump loyalist, she has been endorsed by trump.
there is nothing that she can do that would change that. there's about 35% of the states likely republican voters who will be in her cap. enter stage left his current taylor rhodes, who is traditional old line republican candidate. she comes from a long line of republican candidates in the state. she is trying her best not to appear as a traditional. a campaign blanche is every time you use the word establishment, that's really what she is. she is their best hope to become the next governor of arizona for the republicans. >> do you think terry lake would be a liability in a general election in arizona? >> oh yeah. what you do in an arizona election as you go far, far to the right if you are a republican primary then he come to the center. carrie lake is left no room to
do that. i saw a recent poll that said 38% of the state's republican primary voters have an unfavorable opinion of her. so the very same time, when she should be trying to expand her base and bring more people into her side in a deadlocked race, what does she do this week? she put her the campaign added shoulder at the border. i don't know, it came off as unhinged. does unhinged to help you get votes at this point from undecided republican primary voters? i don't think so. >> clearly, both fox news and doug doocy and made the same calculation. to see endorsing karen taylor robson just a few days ago. i do wonder what donald trump's level of engagement in the races, how much his endorsement matters. it does seem like it's gonna be a pretty close race with it to as the front runners. >> donald trump has never gotten over doug doocy certifying in the 2020 election. this whole phenomenon was about
the 2020 election, he can just move on. in fact, this week after doug doocy announced his -- curly one on one radio show and immediately started with -- well if you know if i lose this election, it probably means the election is stolen. have we seen this movie before? i think that even though donald trump is wildly popular in the state. we had three out of four republican voters will say their london, the not all following him anymore. so about a third of the voters are within, but a third of the voters are gonna go more traditional. the question is one of the other third going to do. i don't see carrie lake really helping herself much in that regard, which of course makes the duck to see crowd very happy because it's there really only chance to maintain control of the governor's office is to get carey taylor robson to be their nominee. >> i watched that clip in the
debate where terry lake sort of challenge turn taylor robson about the election saying i think it was stolen, and it's a legitimate. biden's illegitimate ranger had if you think that. and she did not. my sense is that on this fundamental question on the legitimacy of democracy in america, she is on the side -- the correct side that joe biden won the election. >> but she can't really say it because if you say you may lose a few votes and a close election what can you do? so instead she says i don't think the election was fair. certain voices were repressed, in the media wasn't fair, and the judges -- blah blah blah. that didn't really matter with the judge is doing anything, what they did to help republican voters. i think it's simply what she has to do -- he may not be a far right
person go on tv type of thing they have to play one in the primary election to get votes. so you will see her two colors come out in a general election. >> that's interesting. still not encouraging that she can't just say the obvious truth where we are in 2022. laura roberts always -- >> it's arizona >> insights into arizona politics. appreciate it. all right two weeks after the supreme court overturned roe v. wade, president biden finally takes action. the willis plan actually protect abortion activists all that's coming up. plan actually protect or... his nose. i'm jonathan lawson here to tell you about life insuranceabortion through the colonial penn program. if you're age 50 to 85, and looking to buy life insurance
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cure it. in only 8 weeks. see hep c gone with mavyret. ask your doctor about mavyret. abbvie could help you save. combatting climate change is perhaps the biggest civilizational change in our lifetime. certain of our lifetime perhaps of all humankind. it's really difficult getting from where we are now our current state to the carbon free future by when we have two which is 15 or 20 years, it is hard in 1 million ways. but there is some low hanging fruit, some basic things we can do. don't go backwards, don't go out of your way to increase carbon emissions. fairly straightforward, and yet we can't seem to do that, either in countries abroad are here at home. in germany, they made the awful decision to begin scaling back nuclear power and response to the fukushima nuclear disaster in japan which happening a
decade ago. >> in 2011, 17 nuclear power plants were still on the grid. now only three remain active. they are supposed to close down by the end of the year but the war in ukraine and surging energy prices could affect the timeline. but the german chancellor made it clear that there won't be any changes to the nuclear shutdown. >> full speed ahead. nuclear energy makes up a tiny fraction of germany's overall power supply, but every move that counts when you're dealing with a potential energy crisis, and a response to the war in either ukraine. while it is far from perfect, nuclear energy is a crucial tool and reducing our inner dependence on fossil fuels. instead get this, his country is turning to coal to bolster its supply. >> germany which was pushing for a faster exit from coal to fight emissions now says it is needed. the economy mister said in a statement, that is painful but
it is a sheer necessity in a situation to reduce gas consumption. >> today, germany's parliament formally voted to open a shuttered call plant. cole, one of the worst things on earth. nuclear energy is not the ideal fuel, but the decision to start burning more coal is objectively a nightmare for from a climate scenario. at least germany and other european countries prefers to care about carbon emissions. here at home, the right-wing is fully mask off about using a government policy to take a crowbar to kneecap the little clean energy infrastructure we do have. get this. in north carolina, republicans recently introduced a bill to supply $50,000 of government money to destroy free public electric vehicle charging stations. the bill says, public charging stations cannot exist unless the state also includes free gas for combustion engines, which obviously is not going to
happen, because there's a clear difference between the infrastructure required for gas and electoral cup cars. putting a gas is an enormous amount of infrastructure, and installing electrical charger is not. it doesn't stop there. the proposed legislation would also require businesses with electrical charging stations like restaurants to include items on the bill telling customers how much taxes are going towards the operating of the charges. that's preposterous. republicans in love insane burns and design. these two stories together a pretty depressing, but the glass is half full in this respect. we know the easiest thing we can do, easiest way to start fighting climate change, it's actively institute policies that would make things worse. a titute policie that would make things worse
some of the states don't allow for exceptions for rape or incest. this isn't some imagined horror. it's already happening. just last week it was reported that a ten year old girl was a rape victim. ten years old! just imagine being that little girl. ten years old! does anyone believe that it's a highest majority view that that should not be able to be dealt with?
or in any other state in the nation? ten year old girl should be forced to give birth to her rapist a child? i can tell you what i do. i can't think of anything that is much more extreme. >> two weeks after the supreme court took away the constitutional right to abortion, president biden signed an executive order to protect access to reproductive care while acknowledging that only congress can restore the rights. the executive order insurers and emergency military care with pregnancy loss, and seeks access to contraception's and medication for abortion for people living those states that want to ban abortion and already have. biden can do that because the federal government has supremacy on the constitution. federal law takes precedence over state law, and the federal government in our system is the final arbiter arbitrator in the system. the fact that drugs are used in
abortion or used by telehealth can be distributed is a huge deal for women in those states. because a country says that cdc data says that over 42% of abortions are induced by medication. it sets up a fundamental showdown however of abortion access which we will see unfold in the court. this woman served in the biden administration last year she joins us now. it's good to have you on many. first of all take us through the significance of the actual executive orders. i don't think there's that much the government in the executive can do unilaterally. what do these orders do? will it make a difference? >> you know, i think the biggest thing that executive order can do is set the values, the tone and the pulpit to direct the government through a crisis. that's what we saw president
biden do with many other issues in his first year and it's it's critical that he did this now. i think we understand the frustration that this couldn't happen faster, but now we are here, and he's been very, very clear and unequivocal the really making sure the attorney general, health and human services, even the ftc which i find remarkable and really, wonderful frankly are deeply engaged and providing access, ensuring privacy rights and many more goals with its executive order. i think this 30-day period that we're gonna have for the secretary of hhs to propagate a report and be really clear about what they're gonna do, perhaps a public health emergency, which many of us have been clearing calling for, is an important time for us to watch and advocate for. >> there was reporting today that they considered a public health emergency and dropped it. what would that do if that were to be declared? >> a public health emergency,
we've seen it with covid, but there are a couple of things that could happen. one, i've seen the reporting that it was dismissed, however we heard in the white house briefing that is not off the table. we are continuing to push for that to be an option. when the secretary of hhs does's 30-day review and puts out his report, they can in fact decide they want to have public health emergency declared. that could in the course of that declaration and that review, they could for example say, access to abortion is critical to public health. they could do that, and then that would set up for the fight -- it will be an important step to clarify, but the fda's rule in this work. >> that's the question for me now. because i don't actually understand this. we have a federal system that says drugs are safe and effective the fda.
merrick garland issued a statement basically saying that the fda is the authority here on medical abortion. i don't know what the status is if you are in louisiana. can you get a telehealth appointment and get the drugs mailed to you? in mississippi, or north or south dakota, or ohio. what is the status and who will resolve all that? >> i think you just nailed. there is no clear status. so the states are banning abortion, banning access, there's an assumption that also covers medical abortion, and it's all those clarification from the federal government, and in this case the fda, this will be an unanswered question that will create a lot of chaos to access. right now clinics in telemedicine facilities are advising patients to go across the border to get their telemedicine legally in another state. organizations are doing creative ways around state bands and state laws, a lot of
this -- the enforcement mechanism for how states are gonna prevent folks from having access to telemedicine and abortion right now is really murky, is really unclear, and this is why what the president did today asking hhs to dig into this, and what advocates are asking for for the public health emergency could help clear up a lot of the stuff. as you said, it will likely end up in the courts. >> all of this is going to be intensely litigated obviously. we are in for that. when you think about the president's message today about basically electing two more democratic senators and we will kind of get back row. that was kind of the pitch? >> we are in agreement that voting in this election will be critical. i would like to see this house and the senate given another shot at the self when self protection act. the house passed it last year, the senate came up 49 votes,
when will short. but since the dobbs decision, we've heard senator collins, because, even joe manchin indicate an interest in high-fiving roe, none of them are talking about whether they would eliminate the filibuster. i think we have to fight and push hard. if they won't, then yes we, have to elect two more senators. >> many time russia thank you for your time tonight. that's all for us on this friday night. and enes bc prime starts right now. thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. since the january 6th hearings began, there is been one witness that the investigation has gone out of its way again and again to publicly call to testify. >> our committee is sure that donald trump does not want mr. cipollone to testify here. indeed, our evidence shows that mr. cipollone and his office tried to do what was right. they tried to stop a number of president trump's plans for