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tv   The Reid Out  MSNBC  July 25, 2022 4:00pm-5:00pm PDT

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we had a social justice summit in new york so do g to our pages on twitter, facebook and instagram. we've got updates. we talked about prison reform. i'll say briefly i meet "beat" viewers who said they heard about it on the show. that's great. you can always interact with me directly that's the best way to find me online. that does it for us. i'll see you tomorrow at 6:00 p.m. eastern. "the reidout" is up next. jason johnson is up next for joy. ♪♪ tonight on "the reidout" -- >> he also has crossed out i want to be very clear. you do not represent me. you do not represent our movement. do you know why he crossed that language out of the statement? >> i don't. >> january 6th committee drops a new tape of some previously unseen video, and it reveals what trump could not bring himself to say after the terrorist attack on the capitol.
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also tonight, the world health organization is now calling monkeypox a global health emergency and vice president kamala harris is in indiana urging democrats to fight back as the legislature begins a special session to take away reproductive rights. good evening. i'm jason johnson in tonight for joy reid. we won't see the january 6th committee again until fall in september. there's another shocking preview of why the enpresident was dogmatically opposed to speaking to his supporters who were ransacking the capitol. in the previously unseen video seen today by committee member elaine luria we see testimony from the closest aides and confidant the days after the attack. it's other that president trump refused recommendations that he
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repudiate in the strongest terms those who lay siege to the capitol. >> i thought we should give a statement on the 7th, and obviously move forward on transition. >> i sat with her and i spoke to miller about trying to put together some draft remarks for jan 7 that we were going to present to the president. >> in my view, he needed to express very clearly that the people who made the violent acts, went into the capitol and did what they did and should be prosecuted and should be arrested. >> it looks like here that he crossed out that he was directing the department of justice to ensure all law breakers are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. we must send a clear message, not with mercy but with justice. legal consequences must be swift and firm. do you know why he wanted that crossed out? >> i don't know. >> the former president who relished the events of january
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6th. her was thrilled by this attack, was seemingly so opposed to criticism of the day, and the day's activities that his son-in-law had tone list the help of trump's body man john mcatee to persuade the former president to actually address the nation. >> he knew since i'm always with him, hey, if he asked your opinion, you know, try to nudge this along. this will help everything cool down so that's what i did. >> nunge it along in what way? what does that mean? >> to make sure that he delivers this speech or whatever it was. >> was implication was that the president was in some ways reluctant to give that speech? >> yeah. >> okay. what do you base that on? >> the fact that somebody has to tell me to nudge it along. >> somebody had to tell him to stop terrorists. over the weekend vice chair liz cheney appeared on fox news, an audience that hasn't seen much of the committee's evidence. >> this was a fundamental assault and attack on our democracy.
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you know, we had a president who sent a mob that he knew was armed to the capitol to attack and invade while we were counting electoral votes, delayed the count of those votes, and while the attack was under way, it was unquestionable that he did not tell them to go home for hours, and investigating that attack and what led to it and -- and what we need to do legislatively to make sure it never happens again is our fundamental -- our fundamental responsibility. >> i'm sure the audience was shocked. while the committee is set to review new avenues of their investigation, they have yet to secure some key interviews. also appearing on cnn representative cheney said the committee was weighing a subpoena for ginni thomas, wife of supreme court justice clarence thomas as thomas has been a vocal proponent of overturning the election and had communicated with trump's former chief of staff mark meadows and john eastman, author of the infamous and unconstitutional memo that with a used as a
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predicate to overturn the election. miss thomas originally told "the daily caller" she was eager to speak with the committee and clear up misconceptions and now her lawyer is sending a different message demanding, quote, better justification for her voluntary appearance. committee is still negotiating with her. meanwhile, the committee is striking out with president trump's former secret service detail. earlier this month trump's top secret service agents tried to undermine former white house aide cassidy hutchinson after she relayed a story about how an unhinged former president lashing out at agents because they wouldn't let him join the ists on capitol hill. those two guys, tony ornato and bobby engel have hired personal lawyers and have yet to cooperate with the committee regarding follow-up interviews. this is a lot. joining me now is professor at the university of school of lawyer andable la fayad, opinion
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writer for "boston globe." thank you all so much. i am a hand-rubbing meme tonight. joyce, i'm going to start with you. i think one of the most important things that we're hearing about right now is the two secret service agents who have lawyered up, okay? in the history of i guess investigations and secret service hearings, how serious is it that secret service agents are afraid to testify to a committee that doesn't really have enforcement power but they nevertheless still feel the need to get lawyers? >> so all pump the brakes on that just a little bit, jason, to this extent. a a criminal investigation by the ig has been announced. it makes good sense for anyone who is within the ambit of that investigation to have legal counsel representing them. what's a little bit unusual is the notion that they have hired private counsel. typical they might go to the
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agents' association which keeps lawyers on retainers and use some of those essentially inhouse folks. this certainly signals a level of concern, and that's what's so shocking here, the notion that secret service agents who are typically held in very high regard, who are very clear that they serve of the presidency of the united states, not the current incumbent of that office, that they would be wrapped up and embroiled in a political scandal of any hue is really unprecedented in the agency's history. >> and yet it doesn't strike me as that shocking. i don't see how an attempted coup could happen if you didn't have some of the palace guard involved. with that in mind, abdullah, you have a great op-ed in the "boston globe" where you're talking about why and how merrick garland must hold trump accountable and must put him on trial. just tell us a little bit about your sort of main point with the editorial board here. what are you guys really pushing
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for? >> well, thanks for the question, jason, and thanks for having me on. you know, this was a case that we laid out last year at first. we called to prosecute -- we called for the prosecution of donald trump back in june of 2021, but after the january 6th committee first aired its public hearings, we wanted to reiterate the call because now it's undeniable that trump is clearly responsible for the events that ultimately transpired on january 6th, and there are many arguments and reasonable ones for why you might not want to do this, but ultimately we have to think about what messages we're sending to future administrations if we don't hold the trump administration accountable for trying to overthrow the u.s. government. i mean, donald trump tried to forment a coup in america, and he failed, but if he -- if he doesn't face any consequences for his actions, well, that
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tells any future holder of the office that you can try to overthrow the government, and if you fail you won't face any consequences. >> and here's the thing. if you talk to security experts, they haven't failed because unless you jail the people who try to overthrow the government, they keep at it. they not failed until they are jailed or punished or in some shape or form prevented from engaging in that activity again. with that in mind, joyce, i want to play you some sound. you know, we're not the only people who have been critical of merrick garland and have made the argument that he needs to be doing something, that he needs to bare minimum instill some confidence in the public. i'm going to play some sound and get your thoughts on the other side. >> we've not decided yet as a committee whether we'll make criminal referrals, but that's absolutely something we're looking at. >> i'm sure at hell hope that they have a criminal investigation into donald trump. merrick garland said he's listening and if he's watching today he doesn't need to wait on us. he has plenty to keep moving
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forward. >> i hope they are moving forward. i think there's evidence of crimes, and i think it goes all the way up to donald trump. >> mueller said that he believed that the president could be prosecuted, that the former president donald trump could be prosecuted. you have members of the committee who hope merrick garland are doing something. i've long since given up that merrick garland is operating on any sort of timeline that would actually comfort me or most people who are concerned in america, but, joyce, i am curious, do you think it matters that there's now a constant drum beat, like maybe three or four months ago the merrick garland committee was not, and now they are saying catch up, dude. >> the problem with how doj operates, at least from my perspective no longer being a doj employee and being a member of the public, is that it's just opaque of the you don't really
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have any idea what's going on behind the curtain, and i'll just share with you, jason, that i can recall cases where we had the public wondering what was going on, why the u.s. attorney's office wasn't taking steps to indict someone when we were on one occasion just days away from handing down an indictment. that's the level of just complete opacity that doj is used to operating with. that's not comforting for any of us. what we're finally seeing, and we don't know the reasons, you and i discussed i had deep concerns when merrick garland was in office that we weren't seeing the signs i expected to see if there was some sort of investigation going on into those most responsible for january 6th. we didn't see, for instance, signs of people being brought in front of the grand jury. well, today we learned that just last friday mark short, mike pence's chief of staff, testified under a subpoena in the grand jury that doj is running in the district of columbia. that's a positive sign and a good step forward.
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>> and we hope, again, that this eventually leads to orange jumpsuits. speaking of orange, we have some sound, i want to play this to you, abdullah. it's the current president talking very harshly about the former president in a way we don't often hear. i want to get your thoughts on that on the other side. >> on january 6th we relied on law enforcement to save our democracy. we saw what happened. the capitol police, the d.c. metropolitan police, other law enforcement agencies were attacked and assaulted before our very eyes, speared, sprayed, stomped on, brutalized, and lives were lost, and for three hours the defeated former president of the united states watched it all happen as he sat in the comfort of a pride dining room next to the oval office. the police were heroes that day. donald trump lacked the courage to act. the brave women and men in blue
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all across this nation should never forget that. you can't be pro-insurrection and pro-cop. you can't be pro-insurrection and pro-democracy. you can't be pro-insurrection and pro-american. >> and larks pretty strong words from our president who is still sort of recovering. do you think this matters, and who do you think this message is to, because if you're a conservative police officer, they have already, you know, they have discounted the people who were defending our nation. they called them storm troopers. if you're an insurrectionist, you're still hiding or hoping merrick garland doesn't get you. who do you think this message was to by president biden? >> yeah, i mean, that's a great question, and it's a great step by joe biden to actually start addressing trump's actions directly over what he did on january 6th. i think, you know, he might be signaling, you know, his frustration maybe with the slow moving pace of the justice department, but it's important for him to stay away from
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intervening in that investigation no matter what, but i think ultimately the audience is the american public. people ought to know, you know, just how reluctant trump was to send help to congress, and i mean earlier at the top of this show you were -- you were showing how trump was, you know, reluctant to even call out the insurrectionists the day after it happened, and, you know, i think that shows that he actually supported their actions. i mean, just watching those outtakes of the speech that he gave, you know, i think it -- it not only shows that he didn't have any remorse, but it shows that he actually wanted the insurrection to succeed. i mean, he couldn't bring himself to say that the election was over the day after. you have to think about that, you know. five people died. the capitol was ransacked, you know, and lawmakers had their lives put at risk, including his own vice president's, and he still didn't want to admit
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defeat, you know. so ultimately people need to know that all of this points to a president that was really hoping for a coup to be successful in america. >> i can go on and about this because to me in a way it's very obvious that we knew he always wanted to do it, but i think there are some corners of america who still need to understand how dangerous this is, that the former president wanted this to continue. thanks so much. officials sound alarm about monkeypox, but is it too late to contain? we'll have more on "the reidout" after this. late to ♪♪ "shake your thang" by salt n pepa contain? we'll have more on "the reidout"
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monkeypox, that's right, monkeypox is on the rise in the united states with fearly 3,000 confirmed cases, including two children. the world health organization has declared monkeypox an international public health emergency. this is the same designation used in the past for covid-19, ebola, zika and polio. with nearly 16,000 cases reported worldwide and counting health experts are cautioning against complacency. the biden administration,
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meanwhile, is facing mounting pressure with top ranking members of the house and senate demanding answers on how it plans to handle the outbreak. joining me now is dr. peter hotez, co-director of the center for vaccine development at texas children's hospital and dean of the national school of tropical medicine at baylor college of medicine. thanks so much for joining us this evening. i'll start with you. i'm old enough to remember elam. lots of people were afraid there. weren't that many cases in the united states. 16,000 cases so far that we're hearing about monkeypox. how worried should we be? should we be concerned about public bath roms? should we be wearing gloves again at the gas station? what is the level of alarm that people should have right now about monkeypox? >> well, you know, jason, it's somewhere in between, so my concern is the trajectory of the numbers, so we're -- as you point out, we're about 3,000 cases in the united states.
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it's almost certainly as it always an underreporting so there may be several times more than that. also in europe, especially portugal and spain and the uk the numbers are going up, so it's the trajectory of cases, that's my first concern, and the second concern is that while it's right now mostly restricted to high-risk behaviors, certain populations, eventually, as we know from other infectious diseases, it's going to generalize, and once it gets into the animal population in the u.s. it could potentially become a permanent fixture, so i think right now what we're seeing is all hands on deck to contain this and prevent it from continuing to spread across europe, across the united states through a coordinated program of vaccinations and antiviral treatments and diagnostics, and it's really going to be a race whether we can scale this fast enough to prevent this from getting out of hand. >> so one of the things that i thought and that was not
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original having this thought is that a lot of the hesitancy in the out and out resistance to met gating measures for covid were because of the fact that it wasn't, you know, the spanish flu in 1919. people weren't bleeding out of their eyes and dying in the middle of dipper, right? but monkeypox leaves a visual effect, right you? can't hide -- you can't still go to the grocery store and pretend that you don't have monkeypox. do you think that because it is a disease that leaves a visual marker on your fair, on your body, that that could help raise the alarm and lead to people taking it more seriously than they were covid, at least initially? >> yeah. i think it's two things, jayce o. it's not only the visual effect of the rash but also the fact the excruciating pain. the "new yorker" yesterday, for instance, ran a very, you know, disturbing but really eloquent description of what it's like to have those painful lesions in
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the perirectal area, in the mouth. it's an extremely excruciating disease and in some cases it's even required hospitalizations. the only silver lining is there haven't been deaths so far so of the 15,000 to 20,000 cases globally, there's been no recorded deaths. we were worried because the strain coming out of west africa has been reported to be about 1% deaths, but if this gets into the vulnerable populations, including the pediatric populations, hiv-positive populations which it's already starting to, if it gets into pregnant women, older americans, then you are going to start seeing more deaths, and i think that's what we want to avoid is a picture of a child with extensive lesions. that's going to create some sense of panic, and that's why we've got to move very quickly to accelerate the vaccine doses, so the biden administration is, working hard on this. they are hoping to have 300,000 vaccine doses in the coming
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weeks. it's still not going to be enough. even the 1.6 million vaccine doses they project coming in from europe, from the company that produces it may not be enough so that's why i call it race, a race in terms of vaccines, having the antiviral drugs because they have to be released for emergency use authorization and the diagnostic testing, so there's a lot of stress and a lot of pressure on a biden administration that's already, as you can imagine, pretty stressed out from covid-19, so having -- being able to walk and chew gum at the same time at a very, very high level under extraordinary stress, i have great empathy for the leadership of the biden administration on this because it's obviously going to be very tough. >> speaking of races and empathy, one of the concerns of a lot of public officials -- public health officials is, look, central and southern africa have been dealing with
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monkeypox for a long time but for some reap nobody seemed to care until it got into western europe, right, and we've seen this in the past. if a quote, unquote sort of oppressed or marginalized population is the beginning of where a pandemic begins, then nobody really cares until it hits people that, quote, unquote the public cares about. what kind of role do you think that could play in how the biden moves forward because it is seems to me as much as coming up with vaccines for america, they should be probably sending vaccines abroad to get to the patient zero to keep it from spreading to the rest of the plan >> two things. i mean, you heard today from the white house how there was some boasting about how the u.s. now has more monkeypox vaccines doses than any other country. i say that as a two-edge sword. we don't want to repeat the hoarding issues that plagued the covid-19 sponches. look, this is why we set up or national school of tropical medicine at baylor college of medicine and texas children's hospital in houston more than a
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decade ago because we realized that the spread of these tropical infections is accelerating because of political instability and urbanization and deforestation and now climate change, and so this is a new normal for the cup truckers and we have to be able to manage it and recognize that pandemic preparedness is going to be every bit as important as military responses and all the things that we also do to protect our homeland security. >> fortunately an owe pock limitic future that hopefully we can prevent with good behavior. dr. peter hotez, thanks so much for joining us on on "the reidout." >> indiana begins a special legislative session on taking away women's reproductive rights and vice president kamala harris is there to fight back. more on that coming up on "the reidout." there to fighother
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♪♪ indiana can add its name to the states to the overturning of "roe v. wade." today lawmakers gathered for a special session not to focus on poverty but to focus on senate bill 1 with a stated objective. if this succeeds which is likely because republicans control the legislature and the governor's
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office the law will take effect on september 1st. over the last couple of weeks indiana has come into the national spotlight in the conversation about reproductive rights after a ten-year-old rape victim traveled to that state from ohio to get an abortion. earlier today the man who confessed to that rape of a ten-year-old was arraigned in court pleading not guilty to those charges. vice president kamala harris who has been traveling all around the country spoke on this at a roundtable today in indianapolis. >> i am a former prosecutor. i specialized in crimes against women and children. i specialized in child sexual assault cases. the idea that in some states after a child or a woman or a man but in particular on this case of abortion, a woman or a child would have endured such an act of violence and then to
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suggest that she would not have the autonomy and authority to make a decision about what happens to her body is outrageous. >> meanwhile on the republican side, the fight against abortion rights has reached a new low. no, seriously, a new low. take a listen to the disgusting remarks made this weekend by republican congressman from florida matt gaetz. >> have you watched these pro-abortion, pro-murder rallies? the people are just disgusting. like why is it that the women with the least likelihood of getting pregnant are the ones most worried about having abortions? nobody wants to impregnate you if you look like a thumb. >> oh, mr. gaetz. to these republicans, it has nothing to do with violence or
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health care or the right to make decisions about someone's own body. instead to them it's all about sex. that's the case of gaetz, and that has real life consequences for people who live in their districts. more on that after this break. r districts. more on that after this break. welcome to allstate where the safer you drive, the more you save like rachel here how am i looking? looking good! the most cautious driver we got am i there? no keep going how's that? i'll say when now? is that good? lots of cars have backup cameras now you know those are for amateurs
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>> we need to be the party of nationalism, and i'm a christian and i say it proudly. we should be christian nationalists. >> matt gaetz is allowed at conferences where teenagers are there. those weren't statements from your embarrassing uncle on facebook. i don't really have those. those are statement from two members of the government's highest legislative body during a national republican party conference this weekend, turning point. now the reason we show you isn't to prove that the trump kroepies rex extremists. we already know that. they are terrible people, but to show you how the things they say actually have real consequences for those who live in their districts and are subjected to the policies that come from this absolutely evil way of thinking to. talk about that joining me now is we have michelle goldberg, "new york times" columnist and msnbc and sir michael singleton, host of the show "screen share." look, i will start with you, michelle. i'm not a fan of just outrage, right? you can show me all the terrorists on tv, all
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republicans saying terrible things. it's not new. they have been doing this for most of my lifetime, but what i do think is important is to say that, hey, these people have policy influence, so on that end do you think that the sort of moderates and the independents in this country, do you think they are really aware of the fact that this isn't just hyperbole now, that republicans are in position to take some of their craziest fantasies and make them law, or is it still something that most people still kind of ignore? >> i think it's happened in some sense, you know, how do you go -- what's the old saying about how do you go broke slowly -- gradually rather than suddenly? this has been happening for a long time. the subtitle of my first book which came out in 2006 was "the rise of christian nationalism" and when i was talking about this movement and the danger that it might gain political power, one of the biggest criticisms is that you're being hyperbolic or that you're being fearmongering. now we see people who have this ideology, that their version of
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a kind of malicious muscular christianity should be imposed on the rest of us. we see those people with real power, so that is the direct line between the ohio abortion story that we've been talking about or the stories that we're hearing from all over the country of women being denied treatment for miskarmgs, for ectopic pregnancies, you know, for pregnancies that have no chance of viability. we're seeing already i think that the consequences of this christian nationalist politic is having an effect on people who maybe never really thought that the abortion debate was germane to their lives. >> i want to ask you about this. i know plenty of people who are pro-life, but they are not happy with the supreme court decision. i know people who are pro-life and conservative christians who don't necessarily like the idea of gay marriages and lbgtq
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marmgs being invalidated. do you think those people are a large enough demographic in america or a concerned enough demographic in america that they can be targeted, or have they already sort of picked a side in the two sort of policy battles and it doesn't make any sense trying to microtarget them anymore? >> i guess if you were to ask are those individuals worth being targeted if they typically vote republican, i'm not sure, dr. johnson, if i would say yes to that question. you're a political scientist and know this very well. those individuals, although they may not subscribe to those things, they will find other reasons to continue to typically vote republican, to continue to associate with the conservative movement or party if you will. now when it turns to independent swing voters i think there's potential to target those individuals because those folks aren't holistically tethered to one side or another. they may have a prefrps for some conservative things such as the
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economy, capitalism. maybe they are strong militarily but socially they are like i think some of these folks go far. i'm open to a different argument. certainly there are individuals who are independent or swing voters who lean left who democrats have to figure out a way to turn those individuals out so i would certainly say it's worth looking at where those voters are, what energizes them and what their interests are and crafting a message to target them specifically around those issues saying we know you care about these things but do you want to empower this with all the negativity? i think those voters would be tone that measure. >> they may not be full at the timers sort of in the us sense but most of them still vote red even if they are not wearing orange jumpsuits. >> michelle, that in-mile-per-hour. i wanted to point out something about emgreene's commentary. it's very interesting to me, and this is also where i think vice president harris is sort of traveling around the country going to 1 will hundred different places over the course of the year makes a difference. you do have people in these districts who do not agree with these policies.
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marjorie taylor greene is like, hey, i'm a proud white nationalist, but you look at the data about her district. her district is 75% white but it's 12% his panic, 9% african american, 1% asian and 3% who say they are of two races or more. i mean, there are people in these districts who do not like the fact that they are getting swept along in this white nationalist movement, not just from a numbers perspective but even from a political agitation perspective. can those people be activated. there's got to be people in parts of can says and texas and ohio saying, look, if we had help with some money we'd overthrow these maniacs because we're not happy with the policies they are throwing down our throats. >> marjorie taylor greene identifies herself as a christian nationalist which is obviously a mostly white movement adjacent to white nationalist, but there are also certainly hispanics who are sympathetic to that movement, you know, and we see to some
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extent groups besides white men trending towards the republican party because of social issues. i guess the question is when there's a widespread recognition that this party has become so cruel, so far out of the mainstream, so extremist and untethered from most people's ordinary experiences that there's some sort of revolt. unfortunately, though, because of gerrymandering and because of the various countermajoritarian elements of our system, you know, just having a majority say this is not who we are is not enough. these districts are made in many cases to protect, if not to protect emgreene, but to insulate a lot of these republicans from accountability. i think that what we're seeing now is the way a party behaves when it knows that it's somewhat protected from democratic accountability. >> shermichael, speaking of lack of democratic functioning in our government, the senate has probably been the big focus this
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year. the democrats are concerned about the republican organizations, concerned about no longer being a party. one of the races that was totally off the race was j.d. vance and tim ryan. many thought j.d. vance would cruise to a victory. now it looks like he's in trouble. you've got a situation that not only do you have republicans saying this guy is running the worst campaign in the year and we need to deal with john kasich, he's being out-raised by tim ryan by a significant amount of money. i guess the question is there a possibility that republicans have overplayed their hand with some of these astroturf phony candidates and they may lose seats that they shouldn't lose this fall despite the fact that they have gerrymandered district and engaged in amazing voter suppression? >> i mean, i guess anything is possible to answer that question. what's interesting to me is the transformation of j.d. vance. let's keep in mind you're not talking about this years ago. this is a guy who wrote the great book, right, describing
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the trump voters that we talk about so frequently today, the gentleman who was on cnn frequently, was on msnbc frequently, typically brought on as the quasi-expert, if you will, on who these people are, why they think the way they do, their grievance and why they are so tethered to trump now has done a 360 and then you have on the other side tim ripe, by all accounts a moderate democrat who i actually think can speak to some of those middle of the road republicans who may be a bit disgruntled and who may be ready to move on from donald trump an don't want mini trumps representing their state and to the point that you raise the question can you bring along those desperate coalition groups, i think in order to beat someone like him who may be best positioned for republicans, at least looking at early generic polling, you have to turn those people out, doc. you can't afford not to have black voirts out or asian voters out, hispanic vote first they are there. all of those numbers count, because if you build that solid enough coalition mathematically again, doc, you're a political
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scientist, you know this. democrats have the advantage. the question is can you pull all of those districts together? if you can, you can win. >> you can still win. michelle goerldberg and shermichael singleton, thanks so much for joining me. >> thanks, doc. >> up next, i'm just back from san diego comic-con where organizers paid special tribute to the late congressman john lewis and the stirring graphic novels he inspired. all of my fun, all of your fom zo about to happen when we're back in a second. of your fom - as someone with hearing lo ab of your fom zo back in a second of the featurese , and none of the hassle. lively offers bluetooth, fda regulated hearing aids delivered to your door for thousands less
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so save money shopping back to school on amazon. while they... 0oh... uh... figure their stuff out. >> it was a huge weekend for me,
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and the rest of the south proclaimed nerd and blurred community. shout out for -- all the stanford and the rest. after two years of covid caution, san diego comic-con was back. they're amazing parties, screenings, and panels, then you black panther to trailer dropped. i was very pleased. the animated green lantern debuted it. and the comics were handed out. what many forget, the, that even with the movies and celebrities, the core of comic-con it still comics, and that includes graphic novels. longer narratives in one book, unlike sort of serialized comic books. in 1967, civil rights icon julian bond with his opposition to the vietnam war in comic book form, with illustrations by t.j. lewis. a 9/11 committee report was also given its own graphic adoption in 2006. and who could forget moss,
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pulitzer surprise winning depiction of the horrors of holocaust. john lewis understood the power of the graphic novel very well. he coauthored, the march trilogy, about his experiences during the civil rights movement. and the sequel to the series is run. its first volume, just finished, as lewis died in 2020. lewis himself attended several comic-con's to promote his graphic novels, leading children on a children's march in 2015. louis attended his final comic-con in 2017. this weekend, i attended a panel featuring loses grandfather, john lewis, and a children's march with voter restriction was held in his honor at the end. for more, i'm joined by andrew aiden, former adviser to late congressman john lewis and coauthor of lewis's last graphic novel, run book one. the march trilogy as well. thank you so much for joining me this evening. >> thank you so much for having me, jason. good to be with you.
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>> so i just want to point out. i was at the panel. i thought it was fantastic since, it was so moving. just tell us a little bit about why john lewis? what caused this at the convention, why did john lewis, what his story told as a graphic novel? there will be movies about him. there will be documentaries. there are special. but why do you want this particular arc from to express the story as well? >> first, comics and graphic novels have a long history and civil rights movement. as you mentioned, vietnam comic from 1967. the freedom organization produced comics in 1966. mark luther king junior himself admitted a comic book in 1957 called martin luther king in the montgomery story. but more than anything, comic books are the future. sequential narratives are the melon which of this generation because they grew up on the internet. and if you want to reach, them you have to do it in their language, and the beauty of comics and graphic novels but
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too is that there is no age limit. and anyone from 8 to 80, or young people, or people who are not so young, we can all read them. and we digest this information. so much more efficiently, and so much more quickly than it allows us to reach as many, the broadest possible audience. >> so, andrew, this is one of the things that i found really interesting also, when i was sitting there, and watching the panel, and having gone through march, and run the one. you see that it is sharing history in ways that your regular textbooks don't reach. we are now at a time in our country, and even particularly in georgia where you have republicans and white nationalists pushing against the spectacle race theory. they are pushing, you know, pessimistic loss against divisive concept. john lewis is a national hero. he's a georgia hero. do you think that it would be possible to get march and run into schools? in georgia right now? given that they have passed laws with critical race theory. with this be considered critical race theory if you
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tried to explain it to school children? >> i mean, they can make up whatever definition they, want to critical race theory, but this is about touching the truth and teaching history. and march is one of the most widely thought graphic novels in america. and run it's finding its place. people forget that before we produced march, there was something called the nine word bump. it was a term coined by the southern poverty law center. and it says, eventually, vast majority of students were graduating from high school, only knowing nine words about the civil rights movement. rosa parks, martin luther king, i have a dream, and that's it. but in a single decade, march was able to fix that problem, and now, we have the civil rights movement taught, not just in history class, and not just in social studies class, but in english classes, and literature classes. because as march book three was the first graphic novel to win a national award, and one more, literally awards from the american library succession than any other book in its
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history. and now, run winning and eisenhower award on friday night, it's continuing this tradition. but and part of the reason that they have made up all of these problems whether it's critical race theory or whatever they want to call it in education, it's because these books are working. they are reaching students. i remember talking to congressman lewis, after he saw the black lives matter lettering but painted in front of the white house. and he said, it looks like the cover of march book three. and then, as he watched these students protest and rise up in response to the murder of george floyd and breonna taylor, he called them to the march generation. for a decade now, we have been teaching the civil rights movement in school through comic books, and it's been working. but i think that is the reason why you see so much being made now about, like, how we teach students, how we teach history in our classrooms. >> you know, i gotta point out to the audience, in case you think that this is still about 20 bucks, the most bent book in
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america last year was gender clear. so, clearly, comic books are having an impact, that's why the right after them. andrew aydin, thank you so much for joining me this evening. >> so good to see you. i will come back again. >> definitely. that's tonight's reidout. all in with chris hayes starts right now. definitely. that's tonight's>> tonight on a- >> we do not represent our movement. we do not represent our country, and if you broke the law, can't say that. >> new evidence about trump and january 7th. >> you know why he crossed that language out of the statement? >> i don't know. >> tonight, committee member elaine luria on the former presidents refusal to condemn the rioters of the capitol. plus, how mike pence's right-hand man just testified to a grand jury. how merrick garland is feeling the pressure, and how the republican party i


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