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tv   American Voices With Alicia Menendez  MSNBC  November 19, 2022 3:00pm-4:00pm PST

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>> that does it for me. thanks for watching. i will see you back here tomorrow at 5 pm eastern for another live hour of politicsnation. american voices with alicia menendez starts right now on the msnbc. >> thank you so much, reverend sharpton and hello everyone. i'm alicia menendez. will former president donald trump face federal charges? that is the question we've come back to again and again. the attorney general is a special counsel determining the answer to that question. the doj's decision to appoint a special counsel? well, there is writing on the wall, that's according to trump's attorney general, bill barr. >> if the department of justice can show that these were indeed very sensitive documents, which
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i think they probably were, and also show that the president consciously was involved in misleading the department, deceiving the government, and playing games after he had received a subpoena for the documents, those are serious -- >> that's a serious -- >> i personally think that they probably have the basis for illegitimate indicting the president. i'm speculating, but giving wet it has gone on, they probably have the evidence that would check the box. they have the case. >> that is trump's own ag, and many legal experts agree. lawyer and former prosecutor tweeting quoting, if merrick garland didn't think there was a serious possibility the trump would be indicted, he wouldn't have appointed a special counsel. he didn't appoint jack smith to wind down these investigations. jack smith, federal prosecutor, has been investigating war crimes over seized. he's back in the u.s. to investigate two massive cases.
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the mar-a-lago investigation and those who organized the january 6th insurrection who were not on capitol grounds that day. trump and his supporters already scrambling to undermine the investigations and this new special counsel. congresswoman marjorie taylor greene calling for garland to be impeached and for republicans to block funding for the special counsel. trump has already found a mic to air his grievances. here is what he said last night. >> this horrendous abuse of power is the latest in a long series of witch hunts that started a long time ago. they feel like the investigation with the document hoax was dying or did her over, and the investigation into january six, in my very peaceful and patriotic speech, remember? >> peaceful and patriotic. you heard him. this all comes days after trump launched his bid for 2024. it's one of the biggest factors for why the attorney general
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appoint a special counsel in the first place. but it will cost the washington post warning, appointing a special counsel carries risks not least the possibility that the investigation could drag out or lose focus, potentially letting mr. trump off the hook. it will take tremendous focus to prevent that from happening. joining us now, msnbc contributor in new york times washington post bonded tylee savage, the author of power wars, the relentless rise of presidential authority and secrecy. also with us, new republic senior political correspondent and staff writer daniel strauss, and msnbc legal analyst barbara mcquade, former u.s. attorney, now hashtag sisters in law podcast. barbara, i want to start with you. take a listen to what was said an msnbc for viewers. i know you know this, barb. he drafted the special counsel rules at doj. take a listen. >> i disagree pretty strongly
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with a decision by attorney general garland to seek a special counsel. i don't think it's needed under the regulations and i think it risks delaying this investigation needlessly. >> five, you have treated tweeted they don't think this is necessary. but you do see some advantages. talk us through those. >> it's a discretionary call. reasonable minds can disagree. i think i shared neil's view that it wasn't necessary here but merrick garland thinks it was there. our advantages here. for one thing, if merrick garland should leave the department of justice perhaps at the end of this administration's special counsel gets to stay. so he can live on, even passed the administration. it also may very well be the case that it wasn't simply donald trump that triggered the appointment of the special counsel but maybe it's also members of congress. remember, they are supposed to lie low before an election. maybe they have got people like jim jordan or mo brooks in their crosshairs, and they're waiting to get past this moment before announcing that they
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were going to proceed. also, if merrick garland gets called to testify on capitol hill, now he can say look, this is all a matter with the special counsel. it's not something i am working on. and so let us focus on other things like voting rights and rights to reproductive health care and political violence. i bet those things are on my plate. that's what i want to talk about. i think here it allows him to do the day-to-day business for the department of justice, was just incredibly important, and have someone else who's very experienced, very respected, focus laser like on these two cases. >> barb i wonder what you make of the washington post argument that this could cause things to drag out, to stall out? >> i think it's a possibility, but i think that it is very different than, for example, what we saw in robert mueller's investigation where the investigation was launched when he got there and he had to start from scratch. here we've got teams of prosecutors and agents who have been working for many months already and all we are doing is
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introducing a new boss to oversee the high level decisions, the strategy decisions, the charging decisions. and so i think those teams can continue to operate the way they have. i'm sure there may be some delay. if there was any big strategic district shun that needs to be made the next week or so, no doubt they will give jack smith to get up to speed, given everything he needs to read, ask questions. it may delay things a bit but i think we'll get back on track fairly quickly. i don't think that's a very significant concern. >> charlie, you have written extensively about the new special counsel, jack smith. beyond this question, should garland have appointed a special counsel. it seems pretty clear why if he was gonna choose, why this was his pick. >> yeah, jack smith has been a prosecutor for 30 years, and he has extensive experience in dealing with cases that are under a political microscope. he ran for five years on public a public integrity section,
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part of the justice department, he was involved in getting rid of cases everyone who is watching in terms of certain members of congress who were suspected of corruption, but the facts just weren't there in the cases were lingering. he took heat for that. he was he brought cases in including some cases the government was not assured of winning. he won some but didn't win some. he won some and they were overturned by appeal by the supreme court. he is used to operating under intense scrutiny in a politically-charged environment where everyone is going to be constantly pointing the finger at him and coming out the other side. he's also a word crimes prosecutor. some of the most intense kinds of crimes and physical security issues imaginable in the world. so this is not someone who is a lightweight. this is not someone who is a neo-fight. and yeah, he's in his 50s. this is also not a robert
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mueller who is retired and perhaps not entirely the person he was 20 years or ten years before he was appointed special counsel. this was a guy who was in his prime. go ahead. >> i was gonna ask you, talk us through merrick garland's decision. he was specifically the timing. why now? >> look, we need to keep in mind in the before being attorney general, eric garland was a judge. and so he's going to move very cautiously, very expeditiously through this process. and we also know, and there's no surprise, that since this announcement, there has already been political scrutiny over mr. smith. and that is to be expected. that's kind of the point of why donald trump announced his latest campaign for president now. he wants to paint this as his favorite phrase, a witch hunt. and he wants to argue that all the political investigations against him, excuse me, all the
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legal investigations against him are politically motivated. that is why, that is the dance that both trump and the department of justice is doing right now, post midterm elections. >> barb, you hinted at this after the news broke yesterday, but i would like for you to lay out for, me for our viewers the likelihood of charges being brought here. if the doj had planned to just walk away from these cases, the ag wouldn't have appointed a special counsel. >> that's right. in fact the rules require them to make a basic inquiry before the special counsel to make it worth sure it's worthwhile. they will look at this for a few months. i think it's true that it's a special counsel who will make a charging decision end of the day, whether there is a case to be charged or not a case to be charged, and if so what those charges will be. but i think merrick garland is satisfied that there is sufficient evidence here that it is at least a close call and that they are going down a track where charges are at
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least possible if not probable. i think the other hand we have seen recently is the addition to the doj team of some very seasoned prosecutors who are trial lawyers. i think that also suggests that they are shoring up to go to battle. i think charges here seemed to me more likely than not. >> daniel, i think the response we have seen from the trump wing of the republican party pretty much what we expected. i don't think that there was any surprise here. but it would seem to me that smith's profile, if you're actually following the thread, following the facts, actually complicates the argument that they are trying to make. >> yeah. look, it's hard to argue that this is an unqualified or overly political pit for this position. this is someone with an extensive experience. as charlie said, he's in the prime of his career. that's not an accident here by merrick garland. again, this is someone who
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wants to, if he's going to investigate a former president, which is fairly untrue modern ground, he wants to make sure that there is no air for any kind of suspicion of political motivation behind this. it is going to be, over the next few months, and over the next presidential campaign, a lot of scrutiny over whether any doj investigation over donald trump is politically motivated. that's to be expected. but the fact that mr. smith here is a seasoned prosecutor and has this impressive resume, i think really shows the length that the doj is going to try to be careful as they conduct this. >> charlie, we were just at the beginning of this conversation. i wonder where you believe it's going to go next. >> this conversation? >> yes, this conversation. >> to a commercial. >> no, i mean, listen, the conversation today assured alike should garland, shouldn't
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he, who is this guy? but there is going to be our next round to this conversation about the speed at which this grow goes, the timeline. your sense of where that's headed? >> we've had a quiet spell. a bit of grand jury action happening behind this season's up to the midterm. but justice department is a decision tradition of not taking steps that could affect an election as has been discussed in the 16 days leading up to an election. we are past that. now i think there's going to be a new round of subpoenas. we're already seeing that kick out. there is gonna be a coming to a head in the mar-a-lago documents investigation about whether the trump appointed florida judges intervention to add a special master was illegitimate at any point in the 11th circuit in atlanta could pass judgment on that. there's already signs from trump appointees on that appeals court affecting the whole special master review was not lawful. if that goes out, if that goes
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away it will be a removal of what is been a major impairment in the justice departments investigation on the documents. we can see that very soon. and then this whole issue of to what extent trump as a former president can invoke executive privilege in a variety of context to keep the executive branch under his successor from gaining access for things related to his own white house is really starting to come to a head. i think we're going to see appeals court and also the supreme court fight over that, which probably will end up not in the way that mr. trump would like it to but could consume a little time in the near future before we get to that point. >> barb mcquade, thank you, charlie, and daniel you're sticking around for that clairvoyant commercial that charlie just referenced. coming up, right-wing media outlets are turning on trump after midterm losses. we will talk with angela carson on media matters on what it means. as conservatives take the house and demand concessions from
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kevin mccarthy, we are going to dig into a congress that can actually get done. and later, the clock is ticking for congress to codify same-sex marriage. new york congressman mondaire jones here in studio to explain why time is of the essence. first the big story we're tracking this hour at msnbc. richard? >> alicia, good day to you. north carolina police say a young girl died after being hit by a truck during a christmas parade. witnesses say a truck carrying a dance company float lost control and had the young performer. she then died of injuries. the driver faces several charges. historic snowfall in western new york state claimed at least two lives so fire. half a foot of snow reported in buffalo, closing roads, triggering driving bans and grounded flights. officials urge residents to stay inside. and wedding bells today at the white house. president biden's granddaughter naomi tied the knot and on the south lawn, 250 people are in attendance. the press was not allowed, so the only photos provided by the
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knew generation to lead the democratic caucus that is so deeply respect. i'm grateful that so many are willing and able to shoulder this awesome responsibility. >> speaker nancy pelosi looking to the future as democrats prepare for a new air on capitol hill. filling pelosi's shoes will not be an easy task. congressman hakeem jeffries announced his bid for the role. the first party leader who is black. as for republicans, soon taking the majority in the house, current minority leader kevin mccarthy is eyeing the speakership, which is far from a done deal. house freedom caucus, a far-right faction of house republicans, demanding mccarthy make a series of concessions before the caucus pledges
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support. so what should we expect from the coming chaos for house republicans? joining the panel, congressional reporter at politico, nick just how narrow is mccarthy's path here? >> well right now we are still waiting on an exact party control of the house, but it looks like mccarthy is only going to be able to lose a handful of votes at most, and when it comes down to january 3rd, when the house vote for the speaker, and right now this through four house republicans were a firm nose on him as speaker. so the question for mccarthy, is what is he going to have to do to make sure there aren't any more defections as the margin is going to be that tight, what sort of concessions is going to have to make to get them to? yes >> so talk to me about that specifically this concessions he's gonna need to make to the so-called freedom caucus. >> the freedom caucus is a laundry list of concessions that they would like made. chiefly among them is better committee assignments for their members and whether that's a question of where you put
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congresswoman marjorie taylor greene on the oversight committee if they want higher profile spots or more input on bills that they want or whether there is any pledges of investigations, for example, into president biden in his administration. >> daniel there's a comment and vanity fair, without saying we're likely enter into a two-year period of painful gridlock. republicans have indicated they can make it hard to perform even the most basic functions of current meant including passing spending bills, cooperating with president joe biden and other aspects of his legislative agenda. i wonder, danya, where that leads democrats. >> look, the relay elliott he is divided government, despite what americans often want, produces gridlock. i think that's gonna be the cases over the next two years. i talk to members of congress though who say right now they are hopeful. they plan to reach out to members across the aisle to
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find some common ground, but the outlook on what they can actually achieve or are willing to achieve in the next two years, especially during a presidential campaign season, it is pretty bleak. i just don't see very much. and let me just say one other point on this. one thing that leader mccarthy and top republicans have made clear is that their priority right now with a majority in the house is going to be investigations. it's not going to be making some kind of bipartisan a grand bargain. it's going to be looking into hunter biden. it's gonna be looking into trying to impeach the dhs secretary, mayorkas. it's going to be looking into the biden administration. it is not going to be cutting deals and compromising over the next 24 months. >> you sort of landed where i wanted to start. so i'm gonna ask you, there is divided government, and then there is a faction of the republican party that fundamentally doesn't believe in government, right? they don't even want to come to
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the floor and vote on things because they don't subscribe to this idea the government can be an effective tool for change, so instead what they want to do is focus on the on these investigations. i guess what i want to ask, is is there any fear on the part of any republican members that they know that's not what these midterms were about. they ran on inflation without any real plan to tackle inflation, they ran on crime without any real plan to tackle crime. if voters for voted for them realize that what they are doing is going to capitol hill and focusing on investigation in the next two years, so the next election, is there a political consequence for them? >> i don't think republican voters will be upset or for republican house does not cooperate with president biden on getting his legislative agenda through. they sent those people there to block biden's legislative agenda. but there are things that
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congress simply has to do to keep the government functioning. it has to periodically raise the debt limit so that treasury bonds don't go into default. it has to pass bob budget bills so the government doesn't shut down. the narrow majority in the house gives tremendous power to the freedom caucus, as we have been discussing, to block anything by simply withholding their votes unless mccarthy is willing to work with democrats, which republican speakers have sometimes been bailed out by doing. jon bader famously did that, a decade ago. but there's more pressure now not to do that. this could be a real train wreck. there's a lot of discussion among democrats right now about whether to preemptively raise the debt limit to get past the next elections on cycle, to get back that potential tool by more radical elements of the republican party who might threaten to crash the global economy if biden doesn't agree
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to get rid of obamacare or something like that before this congress lame duck session ends. but regardless they're gonna have to do something. i predict that we will have significant periods of government shutdown in the next two years as a result of what's coming. >> that is a bold prediction. charlie, i understand your point about our republican voters, their base may subscribe to that, my guess my question is, the voters that they would hope to peel off in a future election, whether or not that's going to appeal to them. nick i want to go to, you house with jim clyde burn, take a listen. >> i worked eyelid join working along nancy pelosi. but we're all in our 80s. we want to good future for a future in glenn children that we believe can be provided by this new generation of leadership. i want to be a part of helping them succeed. >> i'm sure you're hearing from democrats on capitol hill what i'm hearing, which is they feel
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is though the transition has made them look unified, organized. what do you expect the transition to look like in the coming months? >> the transition for the top three democratic positions at the very least looks like it will happen without much confrontation at all for months and months among democrats i had heard private speculation and all sorts of private maneuvering among democrats for potential bids for these top positions. in addition to the incoming leaders, jeffries, clark, and aguilar, congressman adam schiff in top position, congressman jayapal in the second ranking position. but democrats have mostly worked at it behind the scenes and are quietly moving to make sure there's really not much drama as they go further down to the leadership ticket. for example there's another congressman right now, congressman john goose, who was previously running for what is known the number three position
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among house democrat kratz. but this very quiet talks to move him to something else so that they don't have -- and this is senior democrats really breathing a sigh of relief that they can appear unified and can look at republicans with a degree of schadenfreude as they kind of annoying anoint their own leaders themselves. >> nick, daniel, charlie, thank you so much for being with. us next, to the max as it is of twitter staffers plunges the platforms future into uncertainty as it weighs whether to reinstate trump. media matters cork angela khorasan. plus the beginning of a long cold winter for the ukrainians. iranian weapons could very well bring misery. bring misery is overwhelming. but i never just found my way; i made it. and did all i could to prevent recurrence. verzenio reduces the risk of recurrence of hr-positive, her2-negative, node-positive, early breast cancer with a high chance of returning,... as determined by your doctor
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appointed special counsel for exactly one day, and already right wing media is on the attack. no surprise there.
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it is happenings large factions of the republican party start to distance themselves from trump. what is happening here? let's calm ask media matters angela carson. now fox news, other mainstream media outlets are wasting no time going after smith here. here is what aired on fox news last night. >> so who is the special counsel? his name is jack smith. he's a democrat, so he will probably hire a team of other democrat prosecutors to investigate the former republican president. mr. smith began his career in new york and worked for the clinton and obama administrations, and right now mr. smith is over in europe. >> that is some very selective polls from the resume there. and some very a selective omissions. your thoughts on the fact that they are shoes-ing to go after this and how they are trying to spin it. >> yeah, i would start by pointing out that we only sort of saw this and maybe have
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volume because most of their personalities either had the day off yesterday or pre-taped because they were all forced to make fox nation programming and friday so. that's the way out of making fox nation. they missed a window. i it's sort of a half volume but they did turn to the great one which is what they call this guy's -- , and honest he was the in the room with ronald reagan. his argument was that in some ways this is worse than mueller because what smith has experience doing is working -- with and in his mind the conspiracy here illustrates the win what democrats are going to try to do is expose donald trump as some sort of really big, not just criminal, but like a war criminal. so he actually found the credential itself was suspicious, because he had this storied history. and so that's a first attack. that's something you saw you in the past with mueller as well.
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this merit of about mueller was that it was a deep state sort of plot, they used to call it a soft coup all the time on fox news. that's what i think you're gonna see. you're gonna see them weave out this idea that it's less about smith and more about democrats efforts to finally finish the job here and get trump out of the way. >> talk to me, though, about this interesting moment we find ourselves in, angelo. on one hand the trying to undermine this move it on the other you have more and more of these outlets distancing themselves from trump. >> yeah. there's this weird tension. i would point out that the right-wing media has been in flux, including fox news, and they are not as reflectively pro trump's they had been, which was entirely in lockstep. but they are still more defensive and pro trump then they were. and in 2015. and for most of the early parts of 2016. they were actually aggressive
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attacks things being said against trump in 2016. that's not happening. it's like you said, it's the distancing. it's an important distinction. the one thing they have to do is cater to their utterances. the audiences aren't fully prepared to turn on trump. have other people rise up and so they're gonna have to walk a fine balancing act. that actually matters a lot. what makes them so potent is this repetition in the fact that they can leverage political power to reinforce the lies and narratives they tell people when it is diluted it's not as strong. it is going to be a lot of performative check off the boxes defending of trump. but i don't think they're gonna be devoting as much airtime to it. a very large portion of the -- show was dedicated to deede attacking garland and the special prosecutor. but i think it's going to be missed because it creates a space where others can step up,
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where maybe there can be meaningful challenges. but there's gonna be a lot more friction and food fights. we're just at the beginning of this. it's not as big of a deal as everybody is pointing out. fox is still very pro trump. big time. >> friction in food fights is gonna be a great name for the bookie right, angelo. i have a minute to ask you what's happening at twitter. elon musk putting up a twitter poll yesterday as to whether he should reactivate trump's twitter account. in the past half hour the trump campaign issued a statement urging supporters to vote yes. talk me through that. >> i think it is so important and smart that he did both of these topics that you need both of these topics together. they are linked. a big reason, when fox was anti trump in 2015 and 2016, the thing that he used to leapfrog fox news and finally break fox, it was to speak to the fox audience directly, was twitter. twitter was the vehicle for doing that. so this poll on twitter, this
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thing that mask is doing, including pandering to the right, getting into all the consequences of disinformation in the long run. but short run, of course trump once this. even though he doesn't actively use it the fact that he can have that account back and cross where his other posts are, that can give him the ability to inject things from the fringes, which is where he has been building power. don't forget how many voters he added to the polls in 2020 because he has been building power and what used to be the fringes. but that means he can speak directly to the fox audience. he'll use twitter as a cudgel to get the fox audience to hit back against fox to get them back in line. the answer to that first part, how much difference is they're going to be, in a way is a large part determined by what the outcome of this is. we all know where this is heading. fox's gonna let him back on and it's gonna be facebook's gonna
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turn around and reactivate his accounts as well. the algorithms will change, he'll be able to make much more money, and he'll be able to start organizing that audience again, at least to slow down and distancing that froth fox has been trying to do. >> angelo, always appreciate your ability to connect the dots. next, power back in ukraine, but supply problems persist. we talk about the long winter ahead. airing tomorrow at 10 pm eastern and bisson sea and streaming on peacock, do not miss split scream, documentary from trevor noah explaining all we got to this moment of polarization and disinformation in this country and all that media and social platforms played along the way. played along the way easy... even easier than those dances your grandkids love doing with you. ok, i got it. (laughs) start medicare shopping today with walgreens find rx coverage. ♪♪ plus, find low-cost copays.
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made drones to be manufactured on russian soil. if enacted, this agreement with further deepen the alliance between the two nations and increase russia stockpiled weapons and a knocked out much of ukraine's infrastructure. nbc news has not independently confirmed the close report. meanwhile, ukrainians are hard at work restoring infrastructure to the newly-liberated kherson. so the residents have been found without electricity, heat or running water for week since russia's retreat. new prime minister making a surprise visit to kyiv this saturday, present that president zelenskyy with a new defense and package worth 50 million point $4 million. for more, i want to bring in -- peter's lack of former senior defense attaché to russia, and author of the book swarming the volga, a u.s. army officers experiences in pre putin russia. always good to see you, i want to start off with this agreement between russia and iran. what could the influx of iranian drones mean in ukraine? >> yes, it just shows how iran
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has really, really been polled or has put itself now into i think a world that really sees the regime into iran for what it is. what iran is doing is supporting the putin regime who won the 24th of february, launched a monstrous aggression on ukraine and continues it. now, oregon's already been supplying shot he'd drones, both for observation and kamikaze drones. talked about iran providing short range ballistic missiles. this i believe and a long term, and iranian regime that is suffering from its own serious domestic challenges, god bless the iranian women, this is probably really bad move iran but yes, in the near term, it
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will help the russians but i believe only marginally because i think the ukrainians have already gotten the measure of it. they are going to get more air defense, they have been shooting down the show he drums in troves but it is disquieting that iran now would be in so openly. >> it comes as winter is almost happening in ukraine. residents being forced to weeks without electricity, heat and running water after the russian strikes. i want you to talk both about the hardships that ukrainians are going through right now and how that potentially complicates the contours of the ongoing engagement. >> yes absolutely. when there is colds in that part of the world. and the germans, the not sees experience that between 1941
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and 45. and their winter war. and the russians are renowned for being in no tough, adaptable in winter but guess what? so are the ukrainians. ukrainians are part of that soviet resistance 80 years ago and fought on that ground. it will be hardship for the ukrainian population. what we saw and i will use the word liberation. the liberation of kherson, it looks like the population is going to hang in there. there will be a lot of help coming. it will be a cold winter. but i think a huge x-factor in this, the troops on the ground. the cranium troops will be cold, they are going to be fighting in friendly ground. they will be able to get warmth in villages and settlements and away for the russians, it will be hostile. those russian soldiers many them under 21 years older so do
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not want to be there. and a soldier, infighting conditions in the winter, first they want to live. and to they want to find food and eat, three they want to stay warm. and so this makes it all a whole lot harder for russian forces that are already showing itself to have major issues in the field. we saw the melt away outside of kyiv, kharkiv. it will be i think very hard for russian troops on the ground, spread out along that long front. it'll be hard thing to do. >> i only have about a minute left, that they want to ask you given the picture that you have painted here, how important is it than that congress continue to approve a to ukraine, not be a swayed by republicans like kevin mccarthy who want to cut it off? >> to i believe for united states and our friends to cut
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off aid at this time, it would be so, so shortsighted. no, ukrainians have shown their fighting, they're fighting an existential war for survival. they are everything about, their struggle is sort of philosophically where we are to. and much of the free minded world. we have to continue, they have come this far. this is not the time to pull the rug out on ukrainians who are really, really putting up a hell of a fight. against again a complete, just aggression of the type that we don't stand for in this world. >> general, as always, thank you. next, congress takes a major step towards codifying -- congressman mondaire jones joins me on sent to what it means and what comes next. >>d what comes next. >> kevin! kevin! kevin? oh nice.
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[steve] we met online about 10 years ago. as i got older, my hearing was not so good so i got hearing aids. my vision was not as good as it used to be, got a change in prescription. but the this missing was my memory. i saw a prevagen commercial and i thought, "that makes sense." i just didn't have to work so hard to remember things. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. marriage interlock clearing a key hurdle in the senate. respective marriage at guarded bipartisan support with 12 republican senators voting in favor of it. the senate is expected to send the bill to the house after thanksgiving. time is of the essence of course, given republicans will take control of the house in january. senate majority leader chuck schumer says while yes, there is bipartisan support, there are lawmakers opening to stall the bills passage. >> while some may want to delay this process, make no mistake
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that there is no stopping this bill from final passage. the question of passage is not about if but when. >> jenny now democratic conversant mondaire jones of new york, he is the coach of the lgbtq of quality caucus. good to see you congressman. i think you can look at this question sort of two ways. you can either say how is it possible that in the year 2022, we are still talking about this as a question mark? or you can look at it and say wow, 12 republican senators were willing to come to the table on it, that is progress. how do you see the hall of? this >> as someone who spent most of his like never imagining a moment like this would happen, i take the optimistic view. there will always be people who are opposing progress in this country. it does not surprise me that there are some, unfortunately even a majority of republican senators who will vote against this common sense legislation. the respect for marriage act. my bill which arid land,
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they're simply allowed states to decide the question of marriage equality and require the federal government to recognize that. this is common sense and this is something that respects religious liberties but also, the dignity of so many people, including over 500,000 people and couples i should say in this country who are already married. >> you talked about respecting religious liberties, talk to us about some of the core ballots and protections that are there? >> i want to be very clear, this law does nothing to alter existing supreme court law on the ability of nonprofit and other religious organizations to not celebrate marriage equality. if that is what they want to, do than they can continue to do that. this is a piece of legislation that says the federal government must respect your marriage in new york for example, as well as in california. rather than deny the dignity of those already married couples and couples that will be married in the future and of
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those respected states. >> let's talk a bit about the politics of, this jennifer ribbon published an op-ed in the washington post, she writes outside deep red on clients republicans cannot maintain their anti same-sex marriage stands without marginalizing themselves. it is part of a slow recognition that their adoption of christian nationalists positions alienates a substantial portion of this. it is an unattainable position. >> it is untenable. there is a reason why republicans and the senate want to get this done before the gop takes control of the house of representatives in january of 2023. they want this to be an issue. that democrats like myself can run on. they know that because of their mass na shuns including that behavior mitch mcconnell over the past several years, which has resulted in a 63 far right majority on the supreme court. any day now because of justice clarence thomas and others, marries equality is going to be
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stripped away as a fundamental constitutional right. and then, the law will pivot to the states in terms of what the states allow. that is why we have to do weekend as the federal government to protect these rights. >> i don't need to tell you that this will be one of if not the hospice of legislation that you want as a congressman and i wonder given your leadership here, personally and sort of the significance of this potentially being the last thing that you bring over the finish line? >> i remember where i was in the summer of 2011. i was in new york city, i was a summer intern. and i was still clause the day, i was not comfortable being open about being gay. and as you know, i'm one of only nine openly gay members of the house of representatives. our member celebrating new york states enactment of marriage equality into law. not even feeling comfortable telling the folks who are my roommates at the time. i would not and celebrated on mario after crying tears of joy in my room. i cannot have imagined that
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about 11 or so years later, we would be enacting marriage equality. largely as the law of the line here in the united states. that i would have the pan along again with the chairman of the house judiciary committee injured now. they're it is been really special to be so effective as remember of congress. especially in this regard. >> congressman, thank you so much. we will of course be watching. next, attorney general garland appoints a special counsel to the mar-a-lago docks case in the january six insurrection. what it means for both cases and for this country? plus how florida has become the epicenter of republican politics, two former members of congress from that state join us to discuss. oi us to discuss. through, it's time for theraflu hot liquid medicine. powerful relief so you can restore and recover. theraflu hot beats cold. ever wonder why they call it the american dream... and not the american goal?
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menendez, ahead this hour a new special counsel. attorney general garland sites extraordinary circumstances for rules and what it all means for the investigations into the former president. but you trumpy allowed to run in the first place? congressman davison saline he says no, and is making that constitutional case for. it plaza florida man, that trump desantis showdown and how the sunshine state has become the temporary center of gop politics. and later, a new congress around the corner, daca advocates are running short on time after -- on what needs to be gone right now to protect streamers. this is american voices.


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