4.99 a month. call 1-888-246-2612 or visit homeserve.com. >> thank you so much for letting us into your homes. we're grateful to beat with ari melber starts right now. hi, ari. i owe you 15 seconds. >> i'll take the. >> 15 seconds. >> some other day. >> i'll tell you. >> we have doctor. >> oz on later tonight. >> so we're going to get into.

>> medicare. >> medicaid. >> a lot of. >> important policy issues there. >> and anytime you can take 15 or. >> more. >> nicole. >> same same to you. have a great show. >> thank you so much. >> our thanks. >> nicolle wallace, welcome to the. >> ari melber. as mentioned, we have a big show coming up. but we begin. right now with. >> something striking. >> a revolt. >> over president. >> trump's, quote, corruption. >> tour of the. >> middle east. that's what people. >> are calling it. including longtime republican. allies of donald trump. >> so this is where we start on. >> the right, the national review, one of the most conservative magazines. >> out there, says it's. >> a plain. >> old grift. >> it's a. >> poison plain. >> and welcome to. >> the swamp. >> now, under. >> new management. >> that's a. >> taste of what you might call. >> the intellectual. >> side of conservative. >> politics right now. writers. editors at a place. >> known for supporting the. >> maga agenda on many issues. >> including crackdowns on immigration, saying. >> enough is. >> enough when it comes. to this. >> kind of what they call grift. >> trump is. >> making his first foreign trip of this.

>> second term, but it's being. overshadowed by his plane debacle. indeed, for some, it's. hard to. watch him dismount from the. >> us made air force. >> one. >> without thinking of his. >> plan to personally. pocket a. >> foreign created air force one. >> if that plan continues. >> to get. >> off the ground. this was him landing in saudi arabia. >> separately. >> the trump family. >> organization continues to pursue. billions of dollars in real estate and associated deals in that country and region. he's greeted by. >> their leader there. >> but the outrage is dwarfing the trip because leading into the trip first. >> with journalistic reporting. >> and then with the president. confirming it. so there's no debate, no contested story here. the news has broken that trump wants to take a $400 million. >> luxury jumbo. >> jet from a. >> foreign country. >> of qatar. >> you're seeing some of the. >> inside luxurious accommodations. here. as it stands. >> this would be then further. updated and. retrofitted as an american. >> air force one. qatar is where

he's headed tomorrow. conservatives. independents and certainly opposition party. democrats all. >> seem to. >> agree on this story of the trump era that this. >> is a. >> kind of brazen profiteering. >> here's murdoch's. >> wall street. >> journal, of course, the sister outlet to fox news, quote, trump sends. >> message to the world. he's open. >> for business over. >> the new york times. >> corruption concerns. >> the washington post. reporting on the private. business conflict, conflicts, i should say. >> or if. >> you want a more tabloid flavor, the new york post, which many people. >> still read. >> if you're in new york in a tabloid. broadsheet or online. >> cutter's place, i should say cutter's palace in. the sky, not a free gift. and they say trump shouldn't accept it as one. that is a. >> baseline and obvious point. everybody knows this. in normal. >> life, if somebody wants. >> to buy you a drink or a dinner. >> sure. >> if they want to buy. you too. >> large a gift out of nowhere and. >> you're not. >> friends. >> it's suspicious. in business,

if the gift is really large and they want. >> things from. >> you, it can be called a kickback. >> it's unseemly. >> it's a conflict. and in many regulated businesses in the united states, it can become an ethics concern, a firable offense, and in some cases, illegal. now, republicans are not standing with trump on this one. nikki haley. >> says. >> if it were biden, we'd be furious. and with your own ears, you can hear republican senators weighing in. >> it's a nice gesture, but i think maybe the thing to do is to say, hey, we appreciate it, but there's. >> a lot of other things you could help us out with. >> there doesn't. >> seem to be right. >> and i think. >> it's not going to pass the smell test. >> well. >> what i'm. >> concern is. >> the safety. >> of the president. i mean, qatar is not. >> in my opinion, a great ally. >> oh. >> well, they better sweep that. >> plane from. front to back. >> air force one is a symbol of america. when it lands or flies, it is america flying and

landing. and i want to make sure that this whole thing is kosher. time will tell. >> well, listen, i'm. >> not. >> a fan of qatar. i think. >> they have a really. >> disturbing pattern of. >> funding. >> theocratic lunatics who want to murder us. i also think that the plane. >> poses significant espionage. >> and surveillance problems. >> so? >> so we'll see how. >> this. >> issue plays out. but, but but i. >> certainly have. >> concerns that. >> senator ted cruz, who has supported donald. >> trump's maga agenda. >> for years, he's apologized for. >> donald trump. but if you're saying, wow, did he change his mind? >> has he learned. >> that there are. >> issues. >> with donald trump? this one raising. basic competence about national. >> security, as he said. >> the espionage concern, which again, goes. >> back to the alleged. >> corruption concern, maybe protecting the united. >> states security, intelligence and. interests comes. second to just pocketing. $400 million, because. >> remember, the brazen plan. >> would be the plane would be used and then go back to trump's

personal use post-presidency through his library. if this happens, if he gets away. >> with it. but ted cruz. >> is. >> actually returning. >> to where he started. >> which is why when you. >> watch some of these stories in the news and you say. >> am i bananas? >> are they bananas? is this okay? a lot of these folks, including conservatives, had all. the same conce donald trump. i'm quoting. >> them as a news anchor. >> they had concerns about what they called. donald trump's dishonesty or lies or alleged possible corruption issues. and they had all of those concerns before trump amassed the power he has today over the republican party. so it is back in the news tonight to consider what ted cruz. warned about donald trump before he was ever elected. >> donald. >> you're a sniveling coward. it is no surprise that donald is throwing yet another temper tantrum. or, if you like, yet another trumper tantrum. >> this man. >> is a pathological liar.

>> the man. >> cannot tell the truth. >> top senate democrat. >> chuck. >> schumer, on the other side of the aisle says it's naked corruption. demanding testimony. >> from trump's attorney general and vowing. >> to block and interfere with justice. department nominees. as long as this scandal stays alive and the president remains committed on pocketing this gift. if you're wondering about how the law works, i can tell you just briefly, most officials would be flatly barred from this. so if a cabinet level official was trying to pocket the plane or this much. money or any member of congress, it'd be dead on arrival and you can block it in court, etc. as you may recall from the first. >> term. >> there is a far wider berth for the president of united states, but no other president has ever tried to push it like this. today, president trump said saudi arabia will invest $1 trillion in america. the times reports that economists say the number, which would be equivalent to the size of saudi arabia's entire. >> gross domestic. >> product, is not realistic.

now, trump has also teamed up with saudi developer for this 47 story tower in that nation. this could run hundreds of millions of dollars. it is a reminder that even if donald trump has some wealth, and even if his family has some wealth, and even if he's profited a lot recently off crypto, there is a kind of ongoing desire to take time and energy through the trump organization to build and profit off all this stuff that he is doing, like elon musk, more than just the public interest job inside the federal government. trump goes to qatar next. his family has a $5 billion golf club that they're developing there. >> the numbers. >> could ebb and flow but that's the kind of goal. it's a luxury plane level destination for sure. and then trump heads to uae, where his also did a deal for $1 billion tower and hotel for the trump organization. there's also a planned trump hotel there in oman. trump has an ongoing relationship with the saudi backed golf tournament, which again uses government money that

is quite common in that region. but the question is where does that money head? if, like the jet, we are seeing a veritable map of self-dealing as the us government interests your safety and security around the world, our soldiers, etc. is somehow mixed or even comes second to all of these business dealings. this is a level of profiteering that is unheard of in the modern presidency. but the luxury plane portion, with the photos and the blatant. >> plan not. >> to wait and see or will decide later, but to announce that he wants to keep it forever. meaning he wants the $400 million from qatar. he wants to enjoy it now in the white house. but as long as he and his family go on forward, they would keep that lavish, almost half billion dollar benefit that seems to have tipped over the scales. we are seeing this, as i showed you across party, across politics and of course out there in late night. >> but hey, it's a jet from qatar. you can trust them.

they're not suspect like. canada or. >> working to undermine. >> us like all. >> of. >> our other. >> democratic allies. >> in europe. >> of course, with. >> a gift. >> it's not the money. >> it's the thought. >> that counts. >> that thought. let's bribe the president. >> we have. >> two special guests on a story that has developed very different from some of the other scandals. the second term, a bipartisan fury, which now has trump and his allies wondering whether they like a tariff, should back off this plan. we'll should back off this plan. we'll be r (vo) with usps ground advantage, it's like you're with us every step of the way. ♪ (man) right on time! (vo) stay in the know. from your dock... to their door. gardening. if i spend a day in my garden nurturing the earth, i feel like i've accomplished something very, very good in life. and that's really what gardening is all about.

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and save your relationship with nature. flonase will attract. >> very serious. questions if and when it happens. >> more and more republicans saying this is a bridge too far as $400 million hangs in the balance. i'm joined by maya wiley, who is a s.d.n.y civil prosecutor, president and ceo of the leadership conference on civil rights, and andrew moran is a staff writer for the new yorker. his latest article, is it happening here, takes a deep look at the united states as a place where more and more autocratic crackdowns are succeeding under the trump administration. a deeply reported piece. welcome to both of you. thank you. maya, this obviously is unacceptable by any normal standard to have a president profiteering this way from a foreign country. but as we just saw quite quickly, it's gotten a different level of

revolt than other potentially equally concerning things. what do you see happening here? >> well. >> $400 million airplane as a gift. it's never happened in the history of. >> our country. >> i mean, it's one thing for richard. >> nixon to. >> say. >> have some pandas, you know, get some pandas from. >> that's a. >> gift because. >> it's a gift to the american people. it's not a gift to personally enrich a president. and the only way you can read that, the only way and even the new york post, which is a murdoch. >> paper. >> said it's not free. it's not free. this is this is in order to curry favor. it's to put. >> a president. >> in. >> the. >> proverbial pocket, a. >> $400,000 plane. >> now, he says he's. >> going to give it back. >> but we know what. whether what, whatever he is doing, one of the things he has constantly signaled. to people, you do. >> right by me. i will. >> do right by you. >> andrew, you've been writing

about this. and when you look at the pushback or a revolt to autocratic efforts, there's no one formula. you don't know what is going to bring out people's ire. and we live in a world where a lot of folks have different versions of events. i showed some of the conservative reaction because that's going to reach people who might tune out other things. do you have a theory yet? i know at the new yorker you guys get a longer time to think through your pieces. but in this new story, why this one seems to be breaking through. >> yeah, give me six months and i'll. >> let you know. no. >> i. >> i started. >> this piece by going to hungary and looking at that in terms of. analogies here. and one thing that you heard, you know, the viktor orban playbook in trump's first term, you would hear people saying, well, we haven't necessarily gone that far yet. it's not that overt yet. now with stuff like the plane or with things like sort of disappearing people without due process. what i'm hearing from a lot of people in hungary is, whoa. >> whoa, whoa. >> we would never do that in

hungary. that's that's way beyond the hungarian playbook. that's like out of, you know, duterte or playbook. so to your point, there's no one formula. in some ways, we're still way ahead of a place like hungary or turkey in terms of the free and independent media, in terms of so far, the independence of the judiciary, but in other ways, like flagrant corruption like this, or like disappearing certain people on green cards, we've sort of galloped past the playbooks that we've seen. >> yeah. and you hear this word in politics that was indefensible. but of course, much can be defended, especially by people who have no baseline of honesty or good faith. does this, however, feel to you as truly indefensible in the sense that republicans who have stood by other terrible things, right? child separation policy or things that we could discuss not in ideology but in humanity, but something about the physicality of the actual jet and the and this isn't canada, with all due

respect to qatar. and that whole bit of it makes it indefensible for even even the party that supports minimizing and pardoning. jan six. yeah. >> and also, you never can really know what's going to break through until you see what breaks through in a bipartisan way. i mean, you know, orban, like many autocrats, has a lot of wealth, but he keeps it hidden. but in this current election, some of that has broken through. the rumors that he has a menagerie of private animals have become a major campaign issue. and also, i think it's important to say that popular sentiment still matters. politics still matters. even if you say this is like an authoritarian regime, it doesn't mean that outcries don't matter. they can have an enormous effect, and leaders still have to pay attention to what outrages people, for sure. >> yeah, and maya, national security means different things to different people. we've had huge, almost realigning debates about it. there was a time when republicans were big on a muscular or invasion policy in the mideast. trump interestingly, went against that and said, actually, we've been we've been out there too much.

but the baseline idea that anyone charged with the security of the united states would put us in this kind of debt and this kind of confusion and risk over you don't know what the spy services are going to do. you don't know what they might weave in to the deepest bowels of the plane that you don't pick up. and so we heard ted cruz say, and i have no reason to doubt him. he said, it's an espionage concern to which many people would say, duh. >> we're talking. >> about donald trump. >> trump won. he was already believing putin over. our own experts and our own spooks, quite frankly. i mean, he was literally having a. >> quiet meeting with. >> putin, not letting the this is not the national security president. but i think going back to your earlier exchange. with andrew, it's like, not only is this a national security issue, of course, it's a national security issue. of course it is. but it's also this is the president. >> supposed to make. >> america great again? >> yeah. >> who himself talks about how.

>> wealthy he. >> is, but we can't afford a plane for him. >> so we got to get one from qatar. >> by the way, his own. attorney general, apparently, or at least reportedly signed the. memo approving this, and she was a. lobbyist for qatar. and at the same time, this is the same. administration that made it easier to. >> lobby on behalf. >> of foreign governments and not reported. so i'm. >> just saying. >> why are we surprised? and the other thing i will say is that tipping point is it is impossible to understand. >> why he needs that plane. why does he need the plane? >> i don't know. >> so i'm sorry to the common person. at a time when we're seeing americans struggling right now because this government has decided you, who cannot afford your student loans, have to suddenly. now choose between your rent and your and buying food or. getting your social security and wages garnished, where. >> we're talking about whether. >> or not people are going to get medicaid so they can see a

doctor when they're sick, where we're talking about where the kids. >> are going to get. >> their special needs, needs met in schools. and all of that was under. >> the quote unquote. >> waste, fraud and abuse. but a wealthy, wealthy, wealthy man who's got a government. >> that will. >> put him on a plane. >> that he doesn't. have to pay. >> for, has to take a $400 million. airplane from qatar. >> yeah. >> yeah, it's almost, in that sense, inexplicable by any valid rationale. and so you end up down these other roads, all of which are concerning to people who look up and say, and the markets and the turbulence doesn't help americans say, wait, we're not getting the prosperity we wanted. we're getting lectured about cutting back. we're getting told we have too many dolls, but you need a free plane that you're going to use indefinitely, perhaps. meanwhile, andrew morantz, thanks both of you for joining me. we have a big show tonight, scrutiny on these new refugees that donald trump wants to recognize inside the united states. we're also covering developments out of the sean combs trial. there was pretty

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>> come on. >> come on. ♪♪ grandma! ♪♪ still taking yours? everyday! made to care for you, every day. nature made, the #1 pharmacist recommended vitamin and supplement brand. you think those phone guys will ever figure out how to keep nature made, the #1 pharmacist recommended 5g home internet from slowing down during peak hours? their customers have to share a wireless signal with everyone in their area. oooh. -you know, it's kinda like when you bring a really big cake for your birthday, and then there is only a piece left for the birthday girl.

well, wish her a happy birthday. happy birthday... -it's... ...to her. -no, it's me. have your cake and eat it, too. don't settle for t-mobile or verizon 5g home internet. get super fast xfinity internet you don't have to share. forty's going to be my year. imprint certain at four imprint com. >> for. >> imprint. >> for certain. >> i commit. >> to doing. >> whatever i can. >> working tirelessly. >> to ensure that cms provides americans with access to. >> superb care. >> especially americans. >> who are most vulnerable. that was doctor mehmet oz speaking at his confirmation hearing for becoming the administrator of the centers for medicare and medicaid services. the agency oversees health care for about 38% of americans through those two big services. your first time on the beat. thanks for joining me. >> glad to be here, ari. >> absolutely. the president has a new order right in your domain

seeking to lower drug prices. it basically says that there's going to be this deadline. and if there's not compliance, then they can, of course, down the road it says change what the us government will pay. tell us how this works and what percent in a drop in prices would you consider success? >> well, we had a chart on the days when we were talking about the executive order, and the president spoke very clearly to the reality that he wants equalization, and by that he meant dealing with the inherent unfairness of a system where america invests in the r&d of so many of these wonderful products. and i want to commend people in the pharmaceutical industry for coming up with fantastic solutions. is that a doctor? i've benefited from using these for my own patients, but. >> there's something. >> wrong. when you're paying two, three, even four times more for the exact same products in. >> this country than. >> in europe. and so. that chart. next to me on in in the oval next to the oval office

revealed. those numbers. so when you ask me how much we want to reduce the numbers, we want to take those numbers down to. >> what the. >> europeans and other developed countries are paying. >> i think that's something people can relate to. in fact, past administrations have talked about it. but as you know, we have this free market system here, so you can't just tell drug, you know, drug companies what to do. i want to read to you from jp morgan. this is how they analyze the plan. they say you have to overcome legal challenges from drug makers. this would go better with congressional approval. and so one question here is if this is important, why not do it through the force of law rather than an order? that kind of sounds like just a suggestion or policy. >> well, for the first 30. >> days. >> we want to. >> actually talk to manufacturers and see where they are. >> and i'll share. >> this. >> with you. >> there have been. >> five companies that have already approached cms, and they recognize that. >> it's not right. >> that it's not fair. >> they were. paying that much more. >> in this country. and that's my main focus is on the. american people. >> and i think that if.

>> you're sitting at home right now and you're wondering the same thing most americans are, which is why is no. >> one stepped up ahead. >> of time, it's. >> because it's tough. >> to do this. there's a lot of strong special interests, lobbyists. they're going to push back hard. there's a lot of money that's. >> at stake here. but i. >> think inherently when the companies that. >> that are we're talking. >> about the pharmaceutical. >> industry. companies recognize that there's something. >> unfair. >> they probably want to. >> address it as well. >> and here's a number. >> that. >> might strike, you know, i think. pretty motivate most. >> of us. >> two thirds of. >> bankruptcies in. >> america are caused. >> by. illnesses and associated. >> medical debt. and a third of the time when. >> i prescribe medications. >> i referred to a patient. they can't fill the. >> prescription, they can't afford it. so we have some of the best. >> care in the world. >> we're paying a ton of money, twice as. >> much. >> as any other company per capita. but we're not getting our money's worth. >> and i think that's the issue we want to address. so let's. >> have pharma industry for the. >> next 30. >> days, step up and. >> see who wants to be involved. >> and then. >> we do have lever arms. >> we have obviously the president lobbying both congress. but also for public opinion. it means a lot to

industries. if the average american on the street thinks ill of them. we also. >> have the lever. >> arms within my. >> agency. >> cms, to be able to do innovation models where we can begin to. play with different. parts of the population and see how these most. >> favored nation. >> pricing might. affect people's behavior. but our primary goal is to help people who are suffering, who are angry about. >> the fact. >> they can't afford their medications, or. >> they're in bankruptcy. >> or distress of bankruptcy because the health care. >> system is so expensive. >> can you name any of those companies that you said reached out? >> i'm not going. >> to name. >> them. >> because it's all. >> confidential right now. >> but you could. >> probably predict. what the companies that are. >> coming to us, there are big companies. >> we know. >> some of. >> the big thing. >> yeah, we know some of the big drugmakers on on the medicaid tax issue. this is interesting. the administration now including your department, wants to sort of change how some of these state taxes work, which is actually something that obama and other democrats have have supported in some form. we'll put this up here targeting this loophole. basically, the state

tax hospitals and returned dollars to them as higher payments, which is sort of a way to get money out of the feds. the times notes that the feds have repeatedly attempted and failed to roll back those kind of taxes. that's under both parties. obama proposed those limits. congress declined at the time. so i guess my question is, why do you and president trump agree with president obama there? and how would this work? is this something that could actually happen? >> well. >> president biden also had similar sentiments about these provider taxes. so we have a rule that just got released that's out for public comment, that's going to address some of the managed care organizations. >> in. >> medicaid, very specifically because that was a loophole that was. >> being used by states. but here's the basic problem. >> it's money laundering. and it happens because we have a disalignment, a mal alignment between what the federal. >> government is trying. >> to do and what state governors are trying to do. and so when we're not on the same team, trying to help those of us who are most vulnerable in these

states, you start to have little gimmicks played. and these gimmicks. go back and forth. >> because i understand the talking point. money laundering, of course, 49 states do this, republican and democrat. i don't know that you really want to say all these state officials, republicans, governors are all literally money laundering, but what they're doing is trying to get money out of the feds, right, for state health care. and so you could fix this so it's less gimmicky. but then the question becomes, are those states still going to get health care funding, or do they all then end up holding the back. >> oh, you want to give states the money they need to take care of the people. that are domiciled there, but you want those states to be responsible as well. and right now there are many instances where states for medicaid, again, medicaid is money that given to the most vulnerable people who are living at or below the poverty level, but the insurance monies that are paid for the care of those people is higher than medicare, which is the system that's out there for elderly americans, folks who've been paying into the system. it was. never designed to be that way. and we actually have rules that have

been put out there saying, you cannot pay more for medicaid patients than commercial insurance. how is that even possible? so we have a problem between the able bodied people on medicaid and the folks that it was originally designed for. even that discrepancy is causing issues. and yes, you're. absolutely right, ari. a governor is going to why is he look for opportunities to shift the money to get as much as they can into their coffers? yeah, they're trying to get something, but we want to actually pay for. exactly what's needed. try to do it in a way that's very transparent, because if you have darkness and opacity and a process, i guarantee you the money is not all going where it's supposed to go. i'm sure. >> there are hospitals. >> getting money they don't deserve, and other institutions are suffering like some of these federally qualified health clinics who aren't getting enough money to do primary care in areas of. >> the. >> states that are being left behind. >> yeah. so that's sort of a reform issue. then you have this new republican budget, which affects everything you're overseeing. and the headlines here are major cuts. like we're going to put this up on the screen here to give people sort

of what the billions level is. but you're talking about the 600 billion over a decade long plan. and most importantly, cbo scored this actually just today. 7 million people could be basically forced off insurance and take a look at, say, a maga republican like josh hawley. he is looking at this right now and saying that slashing health insurance for the working poor is, he says, morally wrong and politically suicidal. he says the trump coalition, which of course, you're a part of, he just appointed you, was not pulling the lever for medicaid cuts. is this plan fair or is it immoral, as hawley says, does it go too far? does it risk you overseeing a system that if the republicans get their way, you're going to be pushing a lot of people off health insurance right now? >> all right. let's let's. get the fundamentals straight on this. in every scenario that i have seen, we are increasing payments on medicaid. we're just not increasing it as much as it

could be increased under other scenarios. when you talk about people being uninsured, that's a major. focus of mine. now these numbers are all over the place, but let's just put some high level. >> i'll let. >> you finish. but those are nonpartisan congressional budget office numbers that i, that i quoted. >> there are and there are other numbers that are coming out as well. but i'll just give you just a little thought experiment. there are roughly 14 to 15 million able bodied individuals who are getting medicaid under the expanded population, and they're the ones where there's a work requirement. in other words, the house is saying, you have to prove that you're. trying to work or take care of a family member or volunteer or get educated, do something even for a few hours a week to show you're trying to help yourself that you have some agency for the future. if you're not willing to do that, just that little bit of effort. should you keep your insurance? if you're on the snap programs, food stamps, you're required to show an effort to work or to take care of family or get educated. volunteer, do something to participate in society. that's

an 80 over 20 polling opportunity. the vast. >> majority of. >> people watching the show right now. >> but the counter doctor would be, how are communities better off if those folks, whatever problems they're facing, are then uninsured and go through something i know you've talked about in your career, which is how much costlier it is to deal with it after the fact when problems are building because they're off insurance. so i guess help it make sense. why would it be better to have those people completely off insurance? >> oh, i want everyone uninsured. remember, most people when they're offered the opportunity of free insurance if they just show up for a job or even apply for a job, they're going to try to get a job. a few people don't. the question and that's why i'm curious about these numbers. why would you not take that offer if you're sitting at home watching our show right now, you know, folks are out there trying to figure out whether they're for or against this. if i told you that a member of your family, all they had to do was call up and try to get a job, and they get to keep their health insurance and they won't even do that. is that really fair to the american taxpayer? there's another part of this, ari. we don't have enough providers. we have

expanded medicaid so widely now, given it to so many people that the folks who it was originally designed for, the young. the old folks who were living in the shadows of life, as hubert humphrey said, you know, who were having disabilities and therefore have a difficult time to. try to have a full time job. they're not able to get care because so many other people are crowding into the system. so having insurance is not the same thing as having health care. >> yep. i hear you on all that. i got one more big issue to hit with you before. before we run out of time. and that is you look at, of course, this measles outbreak. you look at the vaccine discussion in america. i want to show, as you know, you oversee these programs. medicaid now is part of providing about half of childhood vaccines nationwide. we can put some of them up to remind folks. so that's ongoing. here's what rfk is saying. >> it used to be when you and i. >> were kids. >> everybody got measles. and measles gave you protection, a lifetime protection. against measles infection. the vaccine doesn't do that.

>> vaccine is effective for some. >> people, for life, but many people it wanes. there are adverse events from the vaccine. it does cause the deaths every year. >> this is what he's claiming in public and on the air. of course, you work for a program that he ultimately oversees as head of health and human services. i just want to remind everyone and then get your response. the american medical association says no, the measles vaccine works and children should get it as soon as possible. it's the best defense against measles infection, is what rfk is saying in public, interfering with what you and medicaid are doing and providing the vaccine. and what would you say families should do? >> well, secretary kennedy is standing up for choice. he's saying you have the option. i would very, very specific on this issue that cms will pay for the vaccines that you wish to have for your family, and that's that's a that's stated. it's your choice. you do what you think is best. most families do

vaccinate their kids, do your homework, not just on vaccines, but all the other things having to. >> do. >> with families. >> do it. >> and that's and you think that's a good idea? >> i think we i think it's a good idea, but it's up to every family depending on what other issues are happening in their lives. and this is what secretary kennedy has been exceedingly clear on. and he's broughton wrote op eds on this. he's done multiple media interviews to that same effect. he has his concerns about vaccines, but he wants you to have your choice. and my job is to make sure that when possible, we pay to make sure you have those options. >> doctor oz, we got through a lot of policy. i will say that it's your first time on the beat. i hope you come back. administrator for medicare and medicaid with a lot on your plate. thank you sir. >> god bless. >> appreciate it. we have a lot more in the program, including reports out of the sean diddy combs trial today. but next we look at malcolm x's lessons for look at malcolm x's lessons for resistance today did they just hop from a baseball game to a show on max... without leaving directv? it's like all their apps and channels... are connected.

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has resisted using refugee status to protect most people trying to come into this country, now says that they will use that protection for a white ethnic minority that used to govern in south africa, the afrikaners. this was during apartheid, and this has begun this week. in fact, it happened on monday, the same day the trump administration canceled a refugee status for afghans who are already here. and there is, of course, a complex history with our role in why there are

so many afghan refugees. trump also cracked down on new refugees on his first day in office. but this order comes with the u.s. prioritizing what they're calling the resettling of those white south africans because they are, quote, victims of unjust racial discrimination. the times reporting on the administration's view of that while south africa's president says that's totally false, a top trump official explained that these afrikaners were also able to be an exception to this usual crackdown on refugee admittance. because these individuals and i'm quoting, could be, quote, assimilated easily. we are joined right now by mark whitaker, a veteran journalist author with a new book, the afterlife of malcolm x an outcast turned icon's enduring impact on america. and we will get into that. but first, this is really something this week. your response? >> well, you know. >> there are all. >> these provisions. >> that we've had. >> historically to protect. >> minorities. >> right. >> that. >> are now being turned against

them. >> and then used allegedly to protect the. >> new persecuted. >> class, which turns out are. >> white males, not only in america. but it turns out in. >> south africa as well. >> does it say something about how the language and the hopes of racial justice movements have permeated so widely that groups like the afrikaner or, as you said, white males would rather say they need their own history month or they need to face their own protection, rather than admitting that they're part of some oppressor group. >> yeah, yeah. >> well, everybody. >> is now competing to be the victim, right? and, you know, i'm not even sure that a lot of white south africans were asking for this. i think this. is actually. >> more sort. >> of another dog whistle. >> yeah. >> about what's going on in this country. and. >> you know. >> trump's idea that somehow. >> you know, the people who are really. >> being discriminated. against in america. >> are white male christians.

>> yeah. and riding that backlash, we saw a backlash to the obama diversity coalition. we saw reagan backlash to the warren court and the civil rights efforts. which brings us to your book and malcolm x. you explore his impact on politics, on how to resist on culture, civil rights, including the legacy, even after his tragic assassination. i want to play a little bit of malcolm x speaking in 1962. >> let us remember. >> that we. >> are not brutalized because. we're baptists. we're not brutalized because we're methodist. >> we're not. >> brutalized because we're muslims. we're not brutalized because we're catholics. we're brutalized because we are black people in america. right? >> you write about the supposed reputation, about condoning violence and then being invoked at the democratic convention in the summer of 2024, delegates from malcolm's home state of nebraska wore t shirts

emblazoned with his image and proclaimed him one of their native icons. one of the tragedies with all such figures is that violence prevented them from living out their lives, and we don't know how they would have grown and what else would happen. but what are you learning and teaching us in this book? >> well. >> the interesting. >> thing about malcolm x. >> is that when he was assassinated in 1965. he was still seen by most americans, including a lot of black americans. >> as. >> a. >> sort of a. scary fringe figure. >> right now, he's put alongside martin luther king jr. >> as one of the great. figures of, of. >> of modern, not just black history, but american history. right. so why did that. >> why did that happen? well, i tell the story of. his afterlife, the 60 years. >> and how. >> he's become even more of an icon and a symbol. and i think. >> there are a few reasons. >> for that. one is. >> he had a very. >> hard headed. analysis of. >> conditions in america that i think, unfortunately. has turned out generation after generation, to be more borne out. >> than perhaps.

>> the more hopeful. dream of doctor king. >> right? second, malcolm, as someone who came up from the streets, had been a street hustler, been in prison. converted to the nation of islam and. >> so forth. >> you know, i think could relate to people. >> of all classes. >> in the south and the north. >> and so forth. >> in a way that king and some of the other civil rights. leaders couldn't. >> but what you. >> saw in that clip, i think most of all, is he had these unbelievable superpowers of communication. yeah. you know, he could just get cut. >> right to the heart of. >> things and. >> phrases that people remember. >> to this day by any means necessary. democracy is hypocrisy. history is not hatred. >> and briefly, violence is wrong. yes, murder is wrong. i can say that as an attorney and a human being. but the way malcolm x said, people had a right to weapons, to defend themselves, to prevent violence is what many white americans have said in the second amendment movement throughout. >> yeah, completely. and that's

and really, that's what he emphasized by any means necessary, which the press at the time. suggested was, you know, sort of suggesting armed revolution or something. it was really about self-defense. and when you think about what black people, black folks were up against then in the south, against the ku klux klan. and to this day in many communities dealing with the police and so forth, it's still a message that resonates. >> yeah. and we have a gun violence problem in this country. yeah. but for marginalized communities and people under the threat of both their peers and the government, we know a weapon can also be an equalizer and a preventative measure. and so, again, that complex history goes with the double standards of race as well. we wanted to get you in even on a busy news day. the book is the afterlife of malcolm x. i'll tell everyone wherever you get your books, you can get that new mark whitaker book. it's an important one. thanks for joining us. up next, we do have the breakdown of that key witness taking the stand in the witness taking the stand in the sean mopping is hard work, but then i tried the swiffer powermop. it has a built-in solution

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details combs parties, which have been referred to as, quote, free coughs, and described what are now allegations he is legally presumed innocent, but she gave her testimony about what are serious allegations coercion for her to have sex with other individuals. she testified that in those moments, she felt she had no choice. i didn't know what no could turn into, she said. and that brings us to how prosecutors are using very damning video. we discussed this with an expert last night. combs is on trial for sex trafficking, racketeering and serious crimes. there's also video of domestic violence. but that footage of that obvious, clear violence is part of the element of the crime. the prosecutors say they're going to be able to prove here. a warning the security camera footage video is graphic. this is from a hotel hallway. it was shot in 2016. combs is seen very clearly

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♪ i feel sometimes if, that i'm, that i'm not listened to. i feel that, uhh, i'm not getting the attention that i need and it's a lot built up in my chest. i would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me. and, and lead me towards success. answers quickly. otter, the ai meeting agent. >> there is a lot of political tension. our final thought tonight comes from rapper bun b, who spoke to me on a panel about holding your peace even during chaos. >> the idea that this world is ugly is being sold to you by ugly people who want to keep you

down. they want to keep you depressed. they want to keep you unengaged. they do not want you to be energized. nothing could be more beautiful than los angeles, the place where i'm at. excuse me. you cut on the right song right up the pch. that's almost a perfect day. >> but what. >> happens in the midst of that? you're not online. in order to get in the car and drive and enjoy the world. in order to look up at the sky, you can't look down at the phone, right? and the more you look in that phone, the more you're informed by other people's worldview. we are okay. >> do you agree? let us know at ari melber or ari melber.com to connect with us online. that's our final thought. that does it for us, our friends at the weeknight takeover. hi, alicia. >> hi, ari. >> and good. >> evening to you at home. >> welcome to the weeknight. >> i'm alicia menendez with symone sanders townsend and michael steele ahead. trump's major middle east trip marked by major conflicts. even republicans are crying foul. then house democrats fighting