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tv   [untitled]    May 4, 2011 4:00pm-4:30pm EDT

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it's. whether or not you know when you're around like great we don't know bin laden was then shot and killed was not. so what exactly is the story behind osama bin laden's killing will explore the fog b.t.r. coming out of the white house and why officials may want to get on the same page about the deaf. ears who send more troops to the conflict every year as we spend more money on a cause like the insurgency grows in size cars rise government gets weaker and the violence gets worse so why exactly is the u.s. still in afghanistan especially now that osama bin ladin is out of the picture
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we're going to ask that. facebook is because. it's the most appalling foreign country in the face and. you heard it right he said facebook one big tool for u.s. intelligence while trying to expose the evidence behind us all just plain. good afternoon it's wednesday may fourth four pm here in washington d.c. i'm lauren lister in your watching our t.v. well a fog of war or you might call it the fog of p.r. the obama administration since announcing bin laden's death has flip flopped on the details quite a number of times first it was a firefight and an armed bin laden fought back listen to this he was engaged in a firefight with those that enter into the area of the house he was in and whether or not he. had quite frankly don't know well. later the white house knew and it was
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quite a different story they announced bin laden wasn't armed at all they gave a different account listen to this a woman rather bin laden's wife rushed the u.s. assaulter and was shot in the leg but not killed bin laden was then shot and killed he was not armed now more confusion a senior pakistani security official says bin laden's twelve year old daughter claims he was captured alive in his pockets donny hideout and then shot by u.s. special forces now if this proves true it gives credence to questions critics are raising of whether this killing with outside the law listen a judgment all the time with legal phrase for the forty minute event on sunday afternoon that resulted in the death of bin ladin it's called an extra judicial killings this means that a government killed someone who was not a soldier on a battlefield who did not pose an immediate threat to the freedom or security of any people that that government protects and the killing was not a punishment ordered by a judge after
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a trial every western country except israel and the united states has condemned the extra judicial killings as all western countries including israel in the us have laws that make this criminal now earlier artie's own adam kokesh that down for a one on one interview with republican presidential candidate ron paul and asked him about the confusion over the story about earlier comments that ron paul made that this confusion actually invites conspiracy theories that the government brings on themselves here's what he said. maybe maybe that's the sense that they wanted and they can pop up on the answers they hey look you know we trick you into believing this and have to tell you something else but i think maybe it's more because governments like secrecy. they're not you know whether it's the federal reserve or our foreign policy just think how many times we've gone to war by distortion of the evidence you know and lie our way into war whether it was a world war where there was vietnam war or you know going into iraq i mean they
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have to you know deceive us. and then when the people distrust the government then any question government is called a conspiracy theory you know and they do that to say that oh you're not because you're every there is every everything is a conspiracy but i think the best thing is you should only believe the conspiracies that are true. and you can watch adams full interview with congressman and presidential candidate ron paul tonight on his show adam vs the man that's at seven pm but first joining me now to talk about all the next white house messages is jason burma's he's a documentary filmmaker joining us now from new york to try to make sense of it all thanks so much for being with us now what do you think is going on with the white house and the administration's inconsistency is this a product of government spending or is this some kind of massive and coronated confusion. well number one i don't think we know all what happened here we don't
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know we actually we don't know it's been rather than that for years you know you've been reported dead several times we know that he was on kidney dialysis almost a decade ago we know people like don't you worry within the military that they had him in afghanistan we're not allowed to get him we know the book jawbreaker intends in two thousand and three the same exact thing happened so why now this is the list of the stuff that the obama administration to show that super obama has now gotten the both the man but unfortunately the wars of aggression will continue just a few weeks ago the white house announced he would not have this drawdown were promised in the event for a lesson so we're not getting out of iraq we're not going to out of an anecdote but obama and his administration if opposed as heroes for the tenth anniversary of nine eleven and who knows what other evidence are put out there the state are not going to put out photographs they may put out photographs later right now all we have is
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a somewhat shoddy video of a bloody mansion that seems to be taken over by the seals in the government original account remember in the original count obama something out of a start page movie where it was hurling it's right problem it was resisting by shooting at them and now we find out that you absolutely are and possibly shot in the head after being captured ok thank you don't buy at all that bin laden is dead you don't buy the d.n.a. evidence that the administration says that they have. well how can we by the d.n.a. evidence that the administration has we know that it wasn't there in the late seventy's and early eighty's was an open cia assets that were opposing against the soviets and working with the mujahideen times change i mean it was fine for someone else then back in two thousand and one and it wasn't the only god in afghanistan against the soviets so i think every time you could argue what would convince you when the photos convince you is that kind of what we debunked a conspiracy theory that ron paul says the white house invites with this confusion
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well the white house says that they have a live video feed so why can't the american public to get at least portions of that we haven't seen a video from this man in years and the videos that were put out aren't intended by many experts to be our right so again what can we believe from this criminal administration that did nothing to prosecute the war crimes of the previous administration that has done nothing to get us out of these wars of aggression and that will be continued in the middle east and south africa with this libya situation so no i won't buy the photographs in fact the press ran with it openly photo shopped photograph it was so bad i'm a graphic designer myself i do a lot of my own graphics if i were to see it would take a lot from photographic evidence especially when they say it's a mass of rooms in the head to prove that this is the wood and he could then see what it can would have video if you had convinced you. well a video of a dead body would prove. that it doesn't say that he you know was the sole person responsible for nine eleven let's let's not forget not
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a let's let's not get off topic here let's stay on topic let me ask you this but speaking of videos there was a video that was once used to paint a heroic story behind the rescue of jessica lynch turning iraq war it comes to mind here because back then the pentagon said she was taken prisoner how by vicious iraqi guards abused and then ultimately rescued valiantly by the u.s. but in reality later the story comes out the iraqi guards had fled there was no resistance there was no going and rescue do you see similar similarities here is this a jet death a lynch style fable in your eyes absolutely just people in the same exact things having one of those see that they have that story you know it was the front page of the new york post the washington post the washington times everybody was running with this all american one pretty girl who had saved her unit the road and now was being abused by these evil evil terrorists and it was it was absolutely
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ridiculous that you can brought in jerry bruckheimer to use her rescue in a hospital that had contracted to these earlier and said they had been treating her and just wanted to get her out so this was absolutely another one of those type of operations and i think we're going to see that comes to light in the next weeks and months and i think the story is going to change and change again just like the just the injuries and i would assume that following that logic you would also believe that the death of pat tillman which was first said that he was killed in a patriotic fight against the enemy but then it turns out he was killed by friendly fire was covered up by the military i would assume you agree that that's a similar this is a similar situation would that be fair. i would say so the only pets have a place for months and years just to get their story on the truth and again that was just a conspiracy theory he was he was shot by the evil taliban and al qaida not his own man it did end up being fracture side a lot of people don't understand that story or its significance but it shows that
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line culture in our military industrial complex and one thing i want to ask about because in both of those cases it did come out that the truth had been covered up or that the truth was not revealed at first it eventually came out and lies were told but it didn't really seem that anybody paid for those lies if the story of us some of bin laden continues to move further away from that dramatic tale that president obama told sunday night in his speech this is an international case this was an international terrorist number one in the eyes of the u.s. will the u.s. pay and suffer any consequences if more inconsistency is come out in this case. and remember this isn't just the united states of america that we have full backing for most of the european nations military support from other nations around the world this is bigger than just united states government and their actions this is
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about lobel ization and the globalists moving to take over the area of eurasia and put it under their full control ok let me ask you about this because we heard earlier calling this an extrajudicial killing already we've heard news that osama bin laden's daughter is saying her dad was essentially executed this kind of gives credence to an apology on his argument that this is an extrajudicial killing do you think that the white house and fumbling of the message kind of makes claims like hers more plausible more believable and ultimately undermine the u.s. account of things. well i think you're just going to get so many parents are you know it's going to be hard to get over the whole product of war but what i can say about this is that why haven't we had new trials why can't we bring them in alive and put them in front of you know a world court we did that with the nazis and that's why everybody's comparing osama to he was the next hitler we had to get him we had to kill him he didn't deserve a trial we have all those other struggles we put that in the public record we're
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not even going to do that with police chief and his cronies after they've been waterboarding hundreds of times and that's how they got the confessions out of you know they're going to be military tribunals also so why doesn't the public if it's the transparency what you've done it doesn't even seem that the public really gets to have a big say in anything other than kind of the official narrative i want to take a look at the backlash to some people that have come out with comments that don't follow kind of just the straight and narrow patriotic course in this case and one is that of a and f. l. player rashard mendenhall i do believe we have that he tweeted shortly after when of course we saw people celebrating bin laden's death in new york near the world trade center and at the white house he tweeted what kind of person celebrates death it's amazing how people can hate a man they have never even heard speak we've only heard one side of course talking about bin laden in that case and very quickly he had to come out and apologize he
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wrote a blog about it the steelers his team responded i mean that was a big p.r. move to kind of have this guy change course why is it that anybody that kind of veers from the accepted narrative is chastised the country is supposed to value free speach. we're actually that's not the case when you sense against the government and i was just utterly disgusted at about eleven thirty twelve o'clock that night when i was watching the live news and it was something like an extension of spring break outside the white house you had all these nineteen twenty twenty one year old kids running up to the camera going number one and chanting usa usa they don't know what happened on nine eleven they don't know where osama bin laden was or is or anything to do with the actual hope in the geo political relevance of what happened the possibility that it was a false flag attack and that's because we have dumbed down i pad instant gratification culture that is obsessed with dancing with the stars and
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american idol they've got to wake up they've got to get involved with what the government's doing may have to challenge official narratives they have to look at what's going on with this country now only with the wars in the middle east pit current economic situation all the sudden the dollar is going to stabilize because we've got the bogeyman well that'll last a week or possibly a month but then the same old unemployment and the same old housing prices is going to continue to work viscerally this country and are we going to still be chanting usa usa usa yeah we will because we are all but the media constantly part of superhero we wanted obama to be on the cover of the amazing spider-man and the rolling stone in the clouds like some god like figure on fortunately. days and i want to thank you that thank you for not watching american idol and for filling us in on what you think is behind this confusion coming out of the white house that was documentary filmmaker jason berman now while the united states a is touting the killing of osama bin laden is justice served and talk arises at
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a turning point in the war on terror as a result r.t. correspondent rain important i ask what difference this really will make in the war on the ground going on now in afghanistan take a look at nine. half years on the war in afghanistan has grown visibly worse while u.s. rhetoric surrounding it has consistently spun in circles we are making progress that is workers enabled us to make the progress that we have made i think it's possible that by the end of this year the war. since two thousand and three washington has repeatedly per cleaned turning points for a conflict that critics call our failing quagmire the reality is that things are still mean that things are worse than they were this time last year every year we send more troops every year as we spend more money and the insurgency grows and size karzai government gets weaker and the violence gets worse and nearly fifteen
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hundred u.s. soldiers and ten thousand afghan civilians have been killed in a war costing america two billion dollars per week meanwhile after sasson aiding a man it's been hunting since two thousand and one the united states has conducted an operation that killed osama bin laden i disconnect between what the us says and what the world sees may have deeper a defining moment in the war against al qaeda the war on terrorism by decapitating the head of the snake effectively you have this aging sickly old man who really hasn't done anything of real political significance for a long time and the great kind of triumph against evil was that the western leaders really kind of soften the trumpets at the moment. bush before him turned into this kind of symbol of evil following the nine eleven attacks he is actually a creation of the west then he is a real political will kind of terrorist threats in himself u.s.
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officials branded bin laden's killing as a success and strategic blow to al qaeda it is going to have i think very important reverberations throughout the area on the up. network in that area i think you're going to see them start eating themselves from within more and more this as some see the u.s. turning and spinning fiction into fact in afghanistan itself it's not going to have that much of a role we're fighting taliban we're fighting afghan taliban in afghanistan we're not fighting al qaeda you have a new generation of young radicals who have grown up watching these wars over the past ten years that are far more radical than their predecessors osama bin ladin claimed responsibility for the nine eleven attacks that killed nearly three thousand people in devastated new york city nearly ten years later his death is being reported as a victory for the u.s. while the war that america waged to get him still struggles to find
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a conclusion greenup or not artsy new york. and talk more about what the death of bin laden will and maybe should really need to the u.s. war strategy is derrick rose his political director at great foundation here thanks for being with us so what do you think the death of bin laden means should the u.s. troops pull out of afghanistan and abort mission i mean he's dead enemy number one this is a great excuse for them if they want to. well i think it definitely means that the last reasonable sounding rationale for the war in afghanistan is now evaporated i mean president obama said that his job one as far as security goes was attacking al qaeda and al qaida is largely driven out of afghanistan it was completely and bin laden is dead there's no reasonable rationale left for the afghanistan war and what matthew hoh said in your clip before is absolutely true every year the war in afghanistan continues to go worse from a strategic standpoint for the united states and so it lacked
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a rationale that was legitimate before bin laden was there was dead and now that he's gone there's no reason to keep troops there ok let's all of the three that the u.s. pulls out for the taliban or gain control you mentioned strategically this is just getting worse and worse they were going control the country are you ok with that. well i think the problem in afghanistan is that there's this idea that the taliban will just overrun the entire territory of afghanistan retake kabul it'll be just like it was the day before nine eleven what's what's lacking in afghanistan is a process that will bring the taliban into the political process so there could be a true representative government in afghanistan so it will need us as role to do that. well it's clear this is really to get out of the way the u.s. has been demanding that the taliban give up weapons give up by linsky vote here any of the tools at their disposal to wage the war before they'll increase in the peace talks and that frankly is calling for surrender before peace talks can ensue real negotiations take place while the conflict is ongoing and frankly the taliban's got
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no reason to lay down arms and join the peace process if their demands to surrender when they've been able to ramp up attacks every single year were girls the sort of us troops so what the u.s. needs to do is to start real talks right now that could lead to actual political reconciliation and that is their responsibility you believe to to negotiate with the taliban to focus on the well i think it's the i think it's the job to get out of the way right now they're just a minute. ok let's back up and let's back up because the united states after the soviet occupation of afghanistan when it was back in the mujahideen after the soviets retreated the u.s. got out of the way ever a kind of got out of the way civil war ensued the taliban came to power there wasn't a negotiation where the taliban and other elements of the government kind of put together some hunky dory peaceful solution i mean it led to what we thought today so how do you think i think you let it get out of the way it won't just be ethical war that leads to the same situation we saw back in two thousand and one. well i
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mean you think you have to reconsider what actually happened after the soviets were driven out of afghanistan i mean what the united states did to to incite that situation was to empower some of these super aggressive and so woman really conservative were lords of afghanistan and that really set the stage for what happened after it and in the ensuing decades and so what's necessary for us is to realise that what we're doing by backing the warlords in afghanistan that are associated with the karzai regime and karzai himself is repeating the sins of the past so what's necessary for us to do is to whine here out of the way the peace process in the way that we're demanding a surrender before negotiations can ensue and to make sure that we're not funding with guns and with with us taxpayer dollars elements within afghanistan that are going to lead to more repression as the what has the the initial political settlement seems ok but if the us effort out of the way is that there are bound to
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be more pressure than any thought about it and i went in a horrible regime for wanting not just one example why didn't that i be the price that the us pays for propelling out and if at the price the u.s. needs to pay what i think there's a false start college being set up there i mean it's not as if what's happening now if we continue with u.s. policy is that we're backing some sort of progressive regime in afghanistan that's not going to oppress women that's not going to reinstitute super conservative was in afghanistan what we need to do is be more careful with where our support in our backing goes in when i say get out of the way i'm not saying that we just completely disengage from any sort of involvement in the future of afghanistan we have responsibility to play as constructive role as possible as far as helping the rich political settlements being enablers for those processes being able to help in humanitarian ways but the idea that one hundred thousand plus troops military occupation of afghanistan is going to get us towards a more peaceful and secure afghanistan i think the facts have proven is just not true ok let me get that footers
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a little bit and talk about just one more question what. death of osama bin laden means as far as maybe just twitching gareth i just asked that senator kerry yesterday what this means and he says you know we have to look at how to kind of alter based on al-qaeda altering its calculations and altering what this means in that u.s. war on terror so what is the u.s. do now focus its efforts more on somalia or yemen or places where it knows or believes that al qaeda is training well i think the most fundamental thing that the u.s. has to do is to reconsider a strategic framework for dealing with the kind of which right now is to attack and occupy a country so we can fight a counterinsurgency campaign and try to divide them from the people i mean it's also drone attacks thank countries like pakistan and yemen sure and that has had an enormously destabilizing impact on pakistan as well so i think you know when you look we've been telling this story for a while now that we think afghanistan today and there's a research body of research done by the rand corporation that shows what in sterile scripts what the ins insurgencies and terrorist groups is usually not military
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operations it's more law enforcement techniques it's counterterrorism operations but it's not just military first strategy where you send hundreds of thousands of troops into a country so we need to work with partners across the globe to do things like seize the financial assets of terrorists to use law enforcement techniques that have been proven to work but this idea that we're going to roll in the u.s. military everywhere we see the potential for al qaeda cells being deployed is just it's it's too expensive and it's counterproductive it's not right i want to thank you so much that was there a crow political director of the brave new foundation with that insight now from the fog of war to the fog of facebook yes facebook i know everybody seems to be on it and found facebook has been used to inspire the people's revolutions we've seen in places like the middle east but when asked about that no one on one interview with our teeny wiki leaks founder julian a thought responded saying facebook is being used for foremost something far more sinister with what he said. facebook in particular is the most
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appalling spying machine this is a big event and here we have the world's most comprehensive database about people their relationships in the names and addresses their locations their communications with each other the religions all sitting in the united states all accessible to the u.s. intelligence facebook google yahoo all these amazing was. have to feed into senses for u.s. intelligence those comments went all over to the governor and picked up on what he said the joining me to discuss them and the government's role was social media and a songes argument really has weight is declan mccullagh he's correspondent with that news thanks so much for being with us now you heard what songe said he accused that u.s.
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intelligence essential a has an interface that it can use to access facebook now facebook came out denied this what the evidence suggests. right sounds i mean i think is that the julian is probably right thing that this is the most appalling spy machine ever invented is the way it was because if war was fairly post anything good the with pride of a decade ago and he also points out the rest of the data sitting in the us that said there's no other than what he says is true i mean if he had a document where they were raised up and until that happens i'm not sure why we should lend this any credence in fact we have evidence of that and i covered this but it's definitely for seeing that facebook post office state of virginia is the man for user account data who hasa doing mostly one litter box of the o.j. back i'll go with the really fit town imagine that that's still an ongoing battles always pocket religion one so i think that he might be misinformed or maybe
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thinking of something that what it was doing and how we do know that britain has something called an l a t i. wrong for summation to act as house information that is phone calls made and things like that and we don't know under what circumstances law enforcement can actually ask the many silly and thought specter says that maybe baseball can ya know. ok let me ask you this because in facebook's response to r.t. they said that it is true that many requests are sent to facebook to release information just that they're not processed automatically so what is the process do you believe according to your evidence is that a subpoena process that u.s. intelligence or this is actually a big fight right now in facebook provides the equivalent of e-mail right you can send someone a private message and there's a fight over whether you need a search warrant or that i'm going to face some probable cause the very traditional
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date of this is the fact of the bill of rights in the fourth amendment or whether some lesser standard is required there's still it depends on what law to count data you're trying to get if you're trying to get e-mail versus whether you're just trying to get to the ip address of the last of the computer that someone used to check the facebook accounts so is the first one general go in the room this is a court or process and just facebook and facebook has been decent about this nothing is perfect but just that we saw them fight the state of virginia and so facebook gives us the piano when assessor foreigners regard the local spot but they will ultimately it doesn't require a subpoena and order to do that because we hear a lot about the government trying to bring down fourth amendment rights and that's why it's not in line and subpoenas i mean. facebook is looking to us and i have to follow u.s. law and in the end if they get
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a search warrant they as any company will it will turn over the information if the legal standards are still i mean this is the you can imagine what i'm actually defending the obama years of this are ready for talking with serious offenses and is baffling offenses for instance that it was that are investigated by the f.b.i. that were be very useful to do this but ok i really like that but i just i want to make my got to want to find out i'm so. sorry to interrupt you but i want to ask you that is a u.s. based company that's something i wanted to ask about so that only u.s. intelligence had access to these records are other countries able to get access in cases like you're talking about where they need it for you know alleged criminals or right the way to generally works is that they do through the u.s. department of justice will be contacted by a foreign law enforcement agency and if these leads that this is they're actually been looking into investigating a serious crime as opposed to you know some of it and so.


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